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Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic offline use for a wide area - Page 2

post #41 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

My 4S maintained the Maps even after hard reset.

 

Airplane Mode shuts down the GPS. http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1355?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US

 

The GPS works with Data and the connection to the carrier are shut off.

Yes - thats how I understand it...

the headline is wrong, not just misleading

post #42 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Right_said_fred View Post

....for offline browsing and GPS navigation under Airplane Mode....
As soon as I am in airplane mode GPS is unavailable, what am I doing wrong?...

Same thing happens to me.  But after I read post #27 I manually turned cellular and wifi off.  Wonders of wonders GPS works.

post #43 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

Oh no heaven forbid we hear some thing positive about Apple Maps in iOS6.  OMG help me I was never lost and can be found.

 

I once was lost but now am found,
Was blind, but now I see.

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post #44 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by el3ktro View Post

I can't reproduce this. I just looked at Melbourne, Australia on Apple Maps on my iPhone. A city that I've never looked at before in maps. I let Maps sit at the default zoom level on Melbourne and waited several minutes, then turned on flight mode. I wasn't able to zoom into Melbourne (maps got blurry) and I was only able to see a little bit more than the original rectangle around Melbourne when zooming out.

Yeah I just tried it and I get nothing but blurry pixels too. 

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post #45 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjwal View Post

Same thing happens to me.  But after I read post #27 I manually turned cellular and wifi off.  Wonders of wonders GPS works.

agreed - very poor (incorrect) wording in the article - GPS will NOT work under airplane mode - in fact when you turn cellular OFF (in settings - general) it ONLY turns off cellular data - 

i hope no-one else wasted time wondering if something new existed under IOS6 that kept GPS on even in airplane mode

post #46 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Right_said_fred View Post

Yes - thats how I understand it...

the headline is wrong, not just misleading

 

Given that the headline doesn't say, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic airplane mode use with GPS for a wide area," but says, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic offline use for a wide area." it would seem that the only thing wrong or misleading is your characterization of it.

post #47 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

Given that the headline doesn't say, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic airplane mode use with GPS for a wide area," but says, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic offline use for a wide area." it would seem that the only thing wrong or misleading is your characterization of it.

 

The misleading part comes later in the text:

 

"Vector maps in iOS 6 are so efficient that Apple can cache a very large surrounding area for offline browsing and GPS navigation under Airplane Mode or when traveling outside of data coverage."

post #48 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit_Coach View Post

 

The misleading part comes later in the text:

 

"Vector maps in iOS 6 are so efficient that Apple can cache a very large surrounding area for offline browsing and GPS navigation under Airplane Mode or when traveling outside of data coverage."

 

So you agree he was wrong and misleading in his comment regarding the title. Thanks.

post #49 of 174

the bold part (at least it was when the article was new - is WRONG - there is no GPS when in airplane mode. OK thats what I said - the article has a rather large ERROR in its predicate OK OK? maybe - the article could get FIXED?

post #50 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

Given that the headline doesn't say, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic airplane mode use with GPS for a wide area," but says, "Apple's new iOS 6 Maps support automatic offline use for a wide area." it would seem that the only thing wrong or misleading is your characterization of it.

no its not my charaterization - its just wrong - like you its wrong

post #51 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

So you agree he was wrong and misleading in his comment regarding the title. Thanks.

Yep!

 

Got me there.

post #52 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

The problem is there are more Apple Haters than lovers.  There are mega corps who want to see Apple fail.  This was a successful campaign.  Kinda like politics but worst.  At least in politics there are some boundaries.  But in the tech world there is no mercy.  Especially when you have 10s of millions even 100 million on legal teams and strategists to hurt the other guy.  If Steve Jobs was still alive he would have brought this stupid map issue to its knees and any one who caused or made it a problem would have trembled at the mere thought of facing the man.  This too will pass and Maps will be a mega app for the iPhone and iPad.

I disagree. I don't believe there are MORE haters than people who LOVE Apple, the difference IMO is that the people who hate are much more vocal and seem to care waaaay too much about it. I love Apple... have for decades, but I could care less about the competition. I don't go to Android forums, I don't "preach" to my android friends how much better my product is... personally I dont care about the others that much.

post #53 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjwal View Post

Same thing happens to me.  But after I read post #27 I manually turned cellular and wifi off.  Wonders of wonders GPS works.

The GPS on the iPhone has been that way since day one.

 

As soon as TomTom came out, I bought the US/Can App and have been using it as soon as I cross the border (at which time, I turn off Roaming).

 

Works beautifully and better yet, our whole family of four share the App bought on one Apple iTunes account. I also have the TomTom car kit which I take along when I am renting a car out of country. And with an extension, I connect to my iPad for an even larger screen as well as the additional GPS built into the car kit. Can't beat the price all way around. 

post #54 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Actually, it's not a conspiracy theory at all. Google orchestrating a PR campaign that involves manipulating the media and financing an army of astroturfers doesn't constitute a conspiracy, at least not the last time I checked the definition. It simply constitutes one company's, Google's, plan to attempt to sour the public on competitors products. This isn't uncommon at all, but Google does do it very well, just as Microsoft did for year before them, before they became irrelevant.

 

 

This all sounds highly implausible. If Google had an army of astroturfers, you'd expect at least one to go rogue and tell the press. That's how Microsoft and other companies got found out.
 
You have zero evidence to back this up as far as I can tell. 
post #55 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

So essentially Apple is far ahead of any other competitors when it comes to the future of mobile mapping which is vector maps.


Then you are far behind in the world of tech.

Google has had vector maps for at least two years on android.

Typical "Apple did it first" when you know nothing about the subject.

 

http://googlesystem.blogspot.fr/2010/12/vector-based-google-maps-for-android.html

 

2010

Vector maps

Offline caching

 

Cache has been automatic on android for months.

http://notesofgenius.com/google-maps-offline-android/

 

Really in this case, Apple didn't invent a thing.

post #56 of 174

These articles prove that for areas where the data exists and is accurate, iOS 6 maps are competitive, and will likely evolve into the category leader.  

 

It still doesn't change the fact however, that all you Americans doing your web reports and blogs about maps are looking at things through the wrong end of a telescope.  With few exceptions, when you step across the US border ... almost all the data is pure shit.

 

Fact:  Maps won't really be usable by the rest of the world for at least a year or two. 

(just as Siri is only just getting basic functionality outside of the US a full year after it's debut)  

 

My advice to the privileged Americans, is to stop expecting the rest of the world to agree with you that maps is great, because it just isn't and won't be for a long, long, time.  This is not some minor hiccup.  In most cases, it's the loss of almost all navigation ability for a period of years for iOS users who don't happen to be Americans. 

post #57 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

...any intelligent person will realize that Apple Maps was the embodiment of skating to where the puck's going to be.

Except the data and the imagery is were the puck used to be about 5 years ago.

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post #58 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Yeah I just tried it and I get nothing but blurry pixels too. 

 

"blurry" suggest you're talking about the satellite data, not the map per se.  

 

Daniel isn't suggesting that the PNGs or JPGs are all cached too is he?  I'm pretty sure that would be inaccurate. 

post #59 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

 

 

This all sounds highly implausible. If Google had an army of astroturfers, you'd expect at least one to go rogue and tell the press. That's how Microsoft and other companies got found out.
 
You have zero evidence to back this up as far as I can tell. 

 

Well, it's good to see you admit that this can be standard practice with some companies. But, if the army of astroturfers is spread around in various 2nd and 3rd-world countries -- and it's ridiculously easy to make it appear they are using IPs in this country, or anywhere, for that matter -- exactly what press would they go to? Or, maybe these are just those rogue contractors Google is always having trouble with, like the "Indian contractors" who pulled the Kenyan scam. Funny, none of them went to the press, did they?

post #60 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

These articles prove that for areas where the data exists and is accurate, iOS 6 maps are competitive, and will likely evolve into the category leader.  

 

It still doesn't change the fact however, that all you Americans doing your web reports and blogs about maps are looking at things through the wrong end of a telescope.  With few exceptions, when you step across the US border ... almost all the data is pure shit.

I live in switzerland which is, in case you don't know, a few steps plus a few strokes through water outside the US border. And at least the few places I checked are quite accurate.

Some POI's are a little off maybe 10-30 meters. But that's OK as long as they keep improving.

post #61 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Except the data and the imagery is were the puck used to be about 5 years ago.


Just like Street View.

na na na na na...
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na na na na na...
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post #62 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Except the data and the imagery is were the puck used to be about 5 years ago.

 

According to some evidence we've seen in this very thread, Google's data and imagery are also where the puck was 5 years ago. Unless you can actually produce some valid evidence that objectively supports that Google's data and imagery actually are better than Apple's, and quantifies how much better (or worse), overall, you have to simply admit that you are parroting unsubstantiated assertions.

 

You should also keep in mind that The Great One didn't always have the puck in his possession, often up until the last moment before he scored.

post #63 of 174

I never liked street view, it was way too slow at moving down the street to see the necessary details. I would say it was more of a neat thing than useful. 

post #64 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Speaking of the GPS on the iPhone. Once your route is loaded it will still follow your location via the GPS and update the map and TbT at the appropriate times. I tested this with Verizon on LTE, hence no SV&D, and it worked great so those wondering about not being able to not use Maps while on the phone need not worry. Of course, the one caveat is that you can't deviate from your path too much because only the route and some surrounding areas will be cached.

 

Phew! This is good news. I was just about to ask. Thanks!
 
 
 
post #65 of 174

There's no need to look far, just look at any non-american city that's not of the few in flyover.

You'll get :

- black and white or/and pixellated or/and blurry stripes

- clouds

- undersaturated images

 

Try looking for Kyoto.

post #66 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Yeah I just tried it and I get nothing but blurry pixels too. 

 

"blurry" suggest you're talking about the satellite data, not the map per se.  

 

Daniel isn't suggesting that the PNGs or JPGs are all cached too is he?  I'm pretty sure that would be inaccurate. 

No it is not the imagery. I loaded a street map of SoCal and panned around zoomed in and out and then turned on Airplane mode like the previous poster. Then when I tried to view the STREET MAP of a near by area I got nothing but empty squares. If I zoomed out I saw a map of the continent but when zooming in the blurry pixels were the only representation available. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong but I was unable to view any detail "down to Peru" as the article stated - in fact I could not even see San Diego which is only 75 miles from here.

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post #67 of 174
Apple could make Maps in iOS 6 much better if they made it possible for iPhones to share GPS data with non-GPS-equipped iPads via Bluetooth.
post #68 of 174
Originally Posted by Inkling View Post
Apple could make Maps in iOS 6 much better if they made it possible for iPhones to share GPS data with non-GPS-equipped iPads via Bluetooth.

 

Doesn't Personal Hotspot do that?

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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post #69 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Except the data and the imagery is were the puck used to be about 5 years ago.

 

According to some evidence we've seen in this very thread, Google's data and imagery are also where the puck was 5 years ago. Unless you can actually produce some valid evidence that objectively supports that Google's data and imagery actually are better than Apple's, and quantifies how much better (or worse), overall, you have to simply admit that you are parroting unsubstantiated assertions.

 

You should also keep in mind that The Great One didn't always have the puck in his possession, often up until the last moment before he scored.

My comments are based on my own observation of the maps in my own neighborhoods. Although I made no reference to Google now that you bring it up, their imagery data is substantially higher resolution and years more current than the Apple versions. If you would like, I can PM to you the GPS coordinates of the areas I'm referring to so that you can make your own evaluation.

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post #70 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

My comments are based on my own observation of the maps in my own neighborhoods. Although I made no reference to Google now that you bring it up, their imagery data is substantially higher resolution and years more current than the Apple versions. If you would like, I can PM to you the GPS coordinates of the areas I'm referring to so that you can make your own evaluation.

 

That's exactly the point. Your comments are simply subjective anecdotes. Without an objective comparison, like this,

 

http://vore.cc/post/32503374905/old-maps-vs-new-maps

 

your comments are meaningless.

post #71 of 174
The successful implementation of Apple Maps relied on a quick and massive move away from the original Maps App, a turn-around made possible by a causal drift from iOS5 to iOS6...itself sparked by the mythical iPhone5 highly anticipated introduction. A precious window of opportunity was opening up to endow Siri with a native pair of legs, a set of original wheels, and compasses...moral and physical...for equally good measures.

It' s a simple, but heart-wrenching trade-off. You give yourself a fighting chance for your medium and long term competitiveness-enhancing endeavor to succeed, ...at the costs of short-term competitiveness and a spun-off dent in your reputation. As much as I value ethical practices above all, medium-term...AI-based-platform survivability, ...and relative evolution, trump humility and Apple's ethical orthodoxy. In this particular, and isolated instance.

You give up some of your moral ascendancy, ...and all of Google's serendipitous roadmap, for a future groundswell of well-oriented handclaps. For Apple to have been prematurely voluble and transparent would have slowed to a crawl, and thus gravely imperiled, usage-centric, Maps/Siri-platform development...

...and Google...consorts...and proxies reacted as drug-dealers do when you cut their go-to market...by their better half.
post #72 of 174
@LtC.data -
I don't think it matters. vector based maps are pretty small.. couple hundred K per tile.
your phone has to be pretty desperate to have to reclaim a couple megs.

additionally, ios returns resources after non use (the oldest data in RAM).. so as long as you keep using maps (after a little game playing), it should hold on to the data. the app on the farthest right (keep swiping) of the multi-task bar will be the first to give up the ghost.

I added the google maps web shortcut to my home screen. it asked me if I wanted to give the "app" 50MB of storage. Apple may use this mechanic and not even ask (since it's not 3rd party)
post #73 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClemyNX View Post

There's no need to look far, just look at any non-american city that's not of the few in flyover.

You'll get :

- black and white or/and pixellated or/and blurry stripes

- clouds

- undersaturated images

 

Try looking for Kyoto.

Try Beijing, China on GoogleMaps.

post #74 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

The flack maps has gotten is despicable and insane, and has really made me lose faith in humanity. What a bunch of whiny, entitled, spoiled brats we've become. There are so many incredibly impressive things about this product, and what Apple has managed to accomplish at LAUNCH is positive insane. I can't believe flyover is now mocked and defined as 'garbage' and 'crap' because of people desperately looking for the worst looking stuff at the worst angles, ignoring the fact that 99% of the time it looks stunning. I've browsed 20 cities in 3D and my mind gets numb trying to imagine the level of work that must have taken, as well as the technical ability, algorithms, etc to make the 3D look near photo realistic. We're talking entire cities rendered, with residential areas, not just the core downtown. The cartography is gorgeous. Vector maps cache brilliantly and are incredibly well designed. Turn by turn has been flawless in my experience. Yes, there's missing/wrong data which there inevitably will be. But the fact that Apple hasn't gotten a shred of credit for the package, which in many ways is superior to Google maps (design of cartography, flyover, turn by turn interface, caching, iconography, etc) from a company that has never been in the mapping business, is just depressing.

 

Yeah, lets bitch and mock imperfections when an entire city is being rendered in 3D, while the competition is using flat jpegs, thats not petty or anything. Just imagine the bandwidth costs Apple is incurring for this compared to flat tiles. Its insanely ambitious. 

 

Times [and maps], they are a-changin'....

 

 

Google Maps iOS  5 (no street view available)

 

 

 

 

Apple Maps iOS  6 (no street view necessary)

 

 

 

 

Google Maps iOS  5 (nearest street view of front)

 

 

 

 
Apple Maps iOS  (360 degree view)
 
 

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #75 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

The flack maps has gotten is despicable and insane, and has really made me lose faith in humanity. What a bunch of whiny, entitled, spoiled brats we've become. There are so many incredibly impressive things about this product, and what Apple has managed to accomplish at LAUNCH is positive insane. I can't believe flyover is now mocked and defined as 'garbage' and 'crap' because of people desperately looking for the worst looking stuff at the worst angles, ignoring the fact that 99% of the time it looks stunning. I've browsed 20 cities in 3D and my mind gets numb trying to imagine the level of work that must have taken, as well as the technical ability, algorithms, etc to make the 3D look near photo realistic. We're talking entire cities rendered, with residential areas, not just the core downtown. The cartography is gorgeous. Vector maps cache brilliantly and are incredibly well designed. Turn by turn has been flawless in my experience. Yes, there's missing/wrong data which there inevitably will be. But the fact that Apple hasn't gotten a shred of credit for the package, which in many ways is superior to Google maps (design of cartography, flyover, turn by turn interface, caching, iconography, etc) from a company that has never been in the mapping business, is just depressing.

 

Yeah, lets bitch and mock imperfections when an entire city is being rendered in 3D, while the competition is using flat jpegs, thats not petty or anything. Just imagine the bandwidth costs Apple is incurring for this compared to flat tiles. Its insanely ambitious. 

The problem is there are more Apple Haters than lovers.  There are mega corps who want to see Apple fail.  This was a successful campaign.  Kinda like politics but worst.  At least in politics there are some boundaries.  But in the tech world there is no mercy.  Especially when you have 10s of millions even 100 million on legal teams and strategists to hurt the other guy.  If Steve Jobs was still alive he would have brought this stupid map issue to its knees and any one who caused or made it a problem would have trembled at the mere thought of facing the man.  This too will pass and Maps will be a mega app for the iPhone and iPad.

 

 

Likely, Apple Maps was initiated by Steve!

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #76 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

Well, it's good to see you admit that this can be standard practice with some companies. But, if the army of astroturfers is spread around in various 2nd and 3rd-world countries -- and it's ridiculously easy to make it appear they are using IPs in this country, or anywhere, for that matter -- exactly what press would they go to? Or, maybe these are just those rogue contractors Google is always having trouble with, like the "Indian contractors" who pulled the Kenyan scam. Funny, none of them went to the press, did they?

 

Just to be clear - you have no evidence to back up your claims then?

post #77 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

My comments are based on my own observation of the maps in my own neighborhoods. Although I made no reference to Google now that you bring it up, their imagery data is substantially higher resolution and years more current than the Apple versions. If you would like, I can PM to you the GPS coordinates of the areas I'm referring to so that you can make your own evaluation.

 

That's exactly the point. Your comments are simply subjective anecdotes. 

 

What exactly is subjective about the picture of my house being much older and much lower resolution than Google Maps version. It may be an isolated data point but certainly not subjective. I also have two other data points, being my office location and my home in Central America. So I could say that Apple Maps is inferior in 3 out of 3 locations that I am familiar with.

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post #78 of 174

That's very grey.

 

Still not as ugly as Kyoto though.
 

post #79 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by el3ktro View Post

I can't reproduce this. I just looked at Melbourne, Australia on Apple Maps on my iPhone. A city that I've never looked at before in maps. I let Maps sit at the default zoom level on Melbourne and waited several minutes, then turned on flight mode. I wasn't able to zoom into Melbourne (maps got blurry) and I was only able to see a little bit more than the original rectangle around Melbourne when zooming out.

Yeah I just tried it and I get nothing but blurry pixels too. 

 

I tried on my iPad 2 and it works fine -- even got some 3D.

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post #80 of 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

 

What exactly is subjective about the picture of my house being much older and much lower resolution than Google Maps version. ...

 

Your extrapolation from that to the conclusion that, overall, Google Maps is better. There's not objective evidence to support that. In fact, much of the objective evidence I've seen show either a mixed result or the contrary.

 

As I pointed out, there are other anecdotal reports in this thread that show Google Maps often sucks, too. So, what's the valid conclusion based on anecdotal reports?

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