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Like Apple, HTC begins reducing dependence on Samsung for smartphone parts

post #1 of 54
Thread Starter 
HTC has switched orders for key components in its smartphones away from Samsung, in a move that echoes Apple's efforts to reduce reliance on a major competitor.

HTC has placed orders for CMOS image sensors with OmniVision and Sony, while part of its supply of AMOLED panels now comes from AU Optronics, DigiTimes reported on Tuesday. Those parts were said to have previously been supplied by Samsung.

Both Apple and HTC have apparently shown interest in moving away from Samsung, as Samsung is one of the world's largest smartphone builders in addition to a key supplier of important electronics components.

HTC is said to be concerned about yield rates and production volume of AMOLED displays from AU Optronics. As a result, HTC still purchases a portion of its displays from Samsung to ensure it will be able to stay at production capacity.

Teardown A6


Last month, it was said that Samsung was dropped as a NAND flash memory supplier for Apple's first batch of iPhone 5 units. Evidence to support that was found by iFixit, which discovered in its iPhone 5 teardown that the system-on-a-chip in their unit featured memory from Elpida.

Apple remains one of Samsung's largest and most important customers, and the South Korean electronics maker indicated in August that it intends to apply a "strict internal firewall" to protect its parts deals with Apple. Samsung's handset business and components operations are run separately in hopes of quieting concerns that conflicts of interest could arise.

Samsung continues to build the custom processors that power Apple's devices at its chip plant in Austin, Tex. That includes the new A6 chip that powers the iPhone 5.
post #2 of 54
And so it begins...
post #3 of 54

Maybe Samsung decided that HTC's dwindling orders were not worth their time any more and HTC found that they could get a better deal elsewhere for the amount that they are ordering.

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post #4 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpnorton82 View Post

And so it begins...

Good riddance to both Samsung and HTC.

 

Samsung is as low as it can get at the food chain, they are the "peasants" of the tech industry, however they try to use that (and fandroids too) to create and image of power. For example, since they manufacture pretty much everything, fandroids and stupid people in general seem them as true builders and responsible for idevices, computers, tvs, etc.. And so they think that samsung saves the best for themselves.

 

The industry is teaching them a lesson, even if there is enough stupid people to buy their gadgets and make them billions of dollars.

post #5 of 54

Pedromartins

 

Read your post back to yourself, I am an Apple fan but your post is just ridiculous!

post #6 of 54
@pedromartins : I'd love to be a peasant earning mere billions of dollars. I'd love to have so little power that I'm "manufacturing pretty much everything".

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #7 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightknight View Post

@pedromartins : I'd love to be a peasant earning mere billions of dollars. I'd love to have so little power that I'm "manufacturing pretty much everything".

Yes, they're earning lots of money now. But when you add the billion dollars (or more) that they have to pay Apple to the loss of billions of dollars of business due to their craven intellectual property theft, this entire program to slavishly copy Apple's products is costing them quite a bit.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #8 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Yes, they're earning lots of money now. But when you add the billion dollars (or more) that they have to pay Apple to the loss of billions of dollars of business due to their craven intellectual property theft, this entire program to slavishly copy Apple's products is costing them quite a bit.

 

They just posted $7.3 billion profit last quarter on smartphone business alone. The fine is costing them more than they would like to, but their tactics have still worked out quite well.

post #9 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mausz View Post

 

They just posted $7.3 billion profit last quarter on smartphone business alone. The fine is costing them more than they would like to, but their tactics have still worked out quite well.

 

 

Which simply confirms Apple's concerns and legitimizes their litigation against Samsung and other thieves. A competitor is running amok, making billions, with Apple's IP.

 

I want you to keep posting about how Samsung's practice of IP theft is making them obscene amounts of money. You're one of the best spokespeople Apple has ever had. Well done!

post #10 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Yes, they're earning lots of money now. But when you add the billion dollars (or more) that they have to pay Apple to the loss of billions of dollars of business due to their craven intellectual property theft, this entire program to slavishly copy Apple's products is costing them quite a bit.

And how much money are the others that didn't copy make? Even with the the billion(s) they have to give Apple, they're still ahead of the game. I don't agree nor condone copying but I understand why they did it.
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"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #11 of 54
Originally Posted by mausz View Post
They just posted $7.3 billion profit last quarter on smartphone business alone. The fine is costing them more than they would like to, but their tactics have still worked out quite well.

 

Hum de dum… legal precedents for future lawsuits worldwide… hum doo doo… 

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #12 of 54

Is anyone surprised.  Samsung is not just a competitor, but is at the top of the food supply chain.  The more you depend on them, the stronger you make them and the weaker your position becomes.

 

Why keep feeding the Giant, so he can only step on you more.  

post #13 of 54
This isn't SamsungInsider so why would I care that HTC is making a logical move to not depend on a competitor?

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John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #14 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Hum de dum… legal precedents for future lawsuits worldwide… hum doo doo… 

You think a decision in an American court (that is still under appeal) can be used as a precedent in other countries?  Good luck with that.

post #15 of 54
Originally Posted by reefoid View Post
You think a decision in an American court (that is still under appeal) can be used as a precedent in other countries?  Good luck with that.

 

Does truth stop being truth when you go somewhere else? Why couldn't it be taken into account? 

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #16 of 54

deleted


Edited by MacRulez - 1/22/13 at 7:03am
post #17 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

This isn't SamsungInsider so why would I care that HTC is making a logical move to not depend on a competitor?

 

You cared enough to click on the article title, read it, and make a post.

post #18 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

... the South Korean electronics maker indicated in August that it intends to apply a "strict internal firewall" to protect its parts deals with Apple.

But how will it innovate?

post #19 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

But how will it innovate?

Holes in the firewall?
post #20 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mausz View Post

 

They just posted $7.3 billion profit last quarter on smartphone business alone. The fine is costing them more than they would like to, but their tactics have still worked out quite well.

I love how you use the word tactics to describe what is actually stealing stealing. So I guess, in your world, Bernie Madoff was only guilty of using the wrong tactics .... lovely, just friggin' lovely.

See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #21 of 54
I'm not a fan of Samsung and I have said elsewhere that I will not buy another Samsung product as I've lost a lot of respect for them since they started "attacking" Apple customers in their ad's.

I like that companies are starting to distance themselves from Samsung.

Sooner they are out on their ear the better 1smile.gif

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post #22 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by reefoid View Post

You think a decision in an American court (that is still under appeal) can be used as a precedent in other countries?  Good luck with that.
Tell that to Motorola who had their German case against Microsoft delayed until the court in the US finishes dealing with the FRAND issues.

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post #23 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07 View Post


Holes in the firewall?

Oh yes of course. What was I thinking?

post #24 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpnorton82 View Post

And so it begins...

 

HTC made the same announcement a couple of years back - when Samsung wasn't able to keep up with HTC's demand, largely due to the increasing internal demand from Samsung mobile division.  I thought HTC switched from Samsung's AMOLED to SONY's TFT LCDs.

 

I'm not too surprised that HTC switched back to Samsung (from Sony), especially considering Samsung's large share of AMOLE manufactured worldwide, 95+%. Almost everyone in AMOLED business has manufacturing/yield problems (except Samsung), so HTC will have to come back to Samsung at one point.  AU Optics?

post #25 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratbert View Post

Pedromartins

 

Read your post back to yourself, I am an Apple fan but your post is just ridiculous!

No.. they manufacture components. what about engineering and design? they engineer the basic stuff and manufacture it because they do it cheaply, but when true innovation at consumer level comes to the equation (software, customization at processor level (after the basic arquitecture), ergonomics, design, built quality.. you know, the things that make a great product great..) Samsung is disgusting at that level.

 

their flagship phone is made of cheap plastic, shitty oversatured screen, shitty software, shitty propaganda. Well, it's a shitty phone for that price tag. So, Samsung is a shitty company overall, mainly because they are a bunch of criminals and because any complete product that comes 100per cent from them is "shit".

 

their salvation? stupid people and their manufacture business.

 

5 billion in profit last quarter.. thanks to stupid people and thieves.

post #26 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

I love how you use the word tactics to describe what is actually stealing stealing. So I guess, in your world, Bernie Madoff was only guilty of using the wrong tactics .... lovely, just friggin' lovely.

Sure, stealing is a valid 'tactic' in terms of the meaning of the word. There is no moral value attached to the term itself. Stealing can be a brilliant and efficient tactic to achieve a set goal, no matter how despicable or immoral in your's, or society's view.

 

Bernie Madoff was guilty of stealing, but he made a big mistake tactically if his aim was to get rich quick and reap the rewards thereof into retirement.

post #27 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Does truth stop being truth when you go somewhere else? Why couldn't it be taken into account? 

 

If laws are different, yes.  The recent UK ruling proved that. And there have been at least two judges that I'm aware of (one in the UK, one in Australia) who have said that court cases in other countries would have no bearing on their decisions.  Seriously, America is not the world's authority when it comes to justice.  The rest of the world (FYI, that's everywhere beyond US borders) have pretty established court systems (you know, like here in the UK).  Also, can I point out this case is still ongoing and under appeal.  In another thread you lambasted someone for bringing up the UK case as it was "under appeal".  Maybe you should apply the same rules to yourself.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post


Tell that to Motorola who had their German case against Microsoft delayed until the court in the US finishes dealing with the FRAND issues.

 

FRAND cases are different as they are global.  The case TS was talking about is specific to the US.

post #28 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Yes, they're earning lots of money now. But when you add the billion dollars (or more) that they have to pay Apple to the loss of billions of dollars of business due to their craven intellectual property theft, this entire program to slavishly copy Apple's products is costing them quite a bit.

 

Well, not really.. IMO, losing money to patent trolls (*cough*) is not intellectual property theft.  And it remains to be seen whether Mr. Hogan's verdict will be upheld in the court of appeals (or whether it be declared a mistrial/retrial this December).  Samsung doesn't have to pay anything for at least another 2-3 years.

 

Given Samsung's mobile 100+% growth in revenue, units old, (90+% or $3B+ more yoy) profit, I think Samsung could easily afford to give away a couple of billions every quarter.


Edited by tooltalk - 10/9/12 at 9:20am
post #29 of 54

Apple should partner with Sony for their components.  Sony is a good company and they don't present much of a threat to Apple, like Samsuck does.  Apple, invest in Sony NOW.
 

post #30 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Hum de dum… legal precedents for future lawsuits worldwide… hum doo doo… 


If anyone thinks that the lawsuit they lost and the penalty they incurred outweighs all the positives they gained from copying Apple is fooling themselves.  Back when there was a huge gap between iPhone and Android phones as far as superiority goes and the iPhone was not available to all customers, especially Verizon loyalist, Samsung gave them the closest experience to an iPhone that aping could get.  The tactic obviously worked and now Samsung has a loyal fan base, although at a much smaller scale, just as Apple does.  They obviously won the crowded competition known as Android phone manufacturing with the 2 week cycle phone releases from all the manufacturers in all kinds of flavors.  It's got to the point that the next Galaxy S phone can be made of paper machet and those fandroids will call it innovative and far superior to the clunky aluminum and glass body of the iPhone 5 and how durability is old school.

Need proof, go look up an article of the new innovative Samsung Galaxy s3 doo doo brown color cheap plastic body coming to Verizon and all you will read in the posts is how iPhone is so behind the times and sucks because it only comes in black and white. 

Samsung made a risky and calculated move and it worked.  No doubt there reputation with other companies has been tarnished and probably has been for a long time prior to this lawsuit as them copying other manufacturers isn't new.  It's just now in the spotlight and will cause a movement as we are seeing, but for how long is anyone's guess as they are obviously a power house in manufacturing parts in high yield.  The tradeoff I'd say is the loyal fan base that will no doubt trickle into other divisions of Samsung as they don't only make phones and TV's. 

I just don't think Samsung will be hurt much by this or go away anytime soon until the day they surpass Apple and will than become the Company everyone loves to hate just because of being on top as Apple is now learning to deal with.  not saying Samsung will reach that height but anything is possible. 

post #31 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post
...... Stealing can be a brilliant and efficient tactic to achieve a set goal, no matter how despicable or immoral in your's, or society's view......

 

 

Describing an immoral tactic as brilliant, just because the language makes it technically correct, is a sure sign of the character of the speaker, IMHO.

See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #32 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

Describing an immoral tactic as brilliant, just because the language makes it technically correct, is a sure sign of the character of the speaker, IMHO.

Why? I am neither immoral nor dishonest, but I can see brilliance in 'immoral' and dishonest tactics just as I can see it in honest and 'moral' tactics. I may not approve of the former but that is beside the point. For you to see that a a sign that my character is questionable is ignorant and stupid, to be honest.

post #33 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Why? I am neither immoral nor dishonest, but I can see brilliance in 'immoral' and dishonest tactics just as I can see it in honest and 'moral' tactics. I may not approve of the former but that is beside the point. For you to see that a a sign that my character is questionable is ignorant and stupid, to be honest.

[Okay, I'll bite. Godwin's Law to the rescue!]

 

By your reasoning, Hitler was absolutely brilliant and we should just ignore his tactics.

post #34 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevt View Post

 

You cared enough to click on the article title, read it, and make a post.

 

And you cared enough to say the obvious. I'm moved.

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post #35 of 54

It's actually quite startling that HTC is depending on Samsung, their direct competitor, that is cleaning the entire Android marketplace with its competition.  

 

From what I understand Samsung is making huge profits and has the largest and growing Android marketshare, by far, and HTC is making a small profit and watching its Android marketshare drain away (like it already has for Motorola and other Android OEM's).

 

 

HTC, like Apple, should have gotten off the Samsung super-conglomerate support system long ago.

post #36 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by reefoid View Post

If laws are different, yes.  The recent UK ruling proved that. And there have been at least two judges that I'm aware of (one in the UK, one in Australia) who have said that court cases in other countries would have no bearing on their decisions.  Seriously, America is not the world's authority when it comes to justice.  The rest of the world (FYI, that's everywhere beyond US borders) have pretty established court systems (you know, like here in the UK).  Also, can I point out this case is still ongoing and under appeal.  In another thread you lambasted someone for bringing up the UK case as it was "under appeal".  Maybe you should apply the same rules to yourself.

America aside, it is up to the discretion and wisdom of the judge as to whether he/she believes ongoing or foreign cases have any bearing. Despite our "established court system" in the UK, previous case rulings establish that particular judge as rather odd. Never mind the easily-appealed ruling. IMO it would be wise to look at precedents from all over the world when it comes to rather rare cases like these.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

[Okay, I'll bite. Godwin's Law to the rescue!]

By your reasoning, Hitler was absolutely brilliant and we should just ignore his tactics.

Oh shit. Thread over!
post #37 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Why? I am neither immoral nor dishonest, but I can see brilliance in 'immoral' and dishonest tactics just as I can see it in honest and 'moral' tactics. I may not approve of the former but that is beside the point. For you to see that a a sign that my character is questionable is ignorant and stupid, to be honest.

Let's try to explain it this way .... the word "brilliance" is normally used in a positive manner. Stealing is not a positive behaviour, imo. To hang your hat on a technicality, just to support your argument is like a lawyer who gets a scumbag serial killer off on a technicality and then walks out of the courtroom, proud as a peacock because he won, never caring about the morality of his deeds .... again, actions speak louder than words and your use of the word "brilliance" speaks volumes to me, if not to you. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #38 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

[Okay, I'll bite. Godwin's Law to the rescue!]

 

By your reasoning, Hitler was absolutely brilliant and we should just ignore his tactics.

Huh... ? That doesn't make sense. Maybe I phrased it badly in that I suggested tactics can be honest or dishonest. Hitler may have been tactically brilliant but were I to argue that (which I am not), it would not mean I approved of his actions or thinking. If lying is part of your tactics you will be a liar, but possibly also a brilliant tactician. Hitler was commonly regarded as a brilliant orator, but that does not imply approval of the content of his speeches. 

post #39 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

Let's try to explain it this way .... the word "brilliance" is normally used in a positive manner. Stealing is not a positive behaviour, imo. To hang your hat on a technicality, just to support your argument is like a lawyer who gets a scumbag serial killer off on a technicality and then walks out of the courtroom, proud as a peacock because he won, never caring about the morality of his deeds .... again, actions speak louder than words and your use of the word "brilliance" speaks volumes to me, if not to you. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

But Houdini was a 'brilliant' escape artist, were he not? If he was a criminal who spectacularly escaped from his captors in order to commit more crimes, would that make him a less 'brilliant' escapologist? It is nothing like your lawyer example. I may be a 'brilliant' conman. What would you call me? A despicable conman? But that is entirely different. Maybe I am a despicable yet brilliant conman, but once we have agreed that I am despicable it is surely OK to discuss the brilliance of my 'conman-ship'? 

post #40 of 54

I wonder.  If Apple started to make it's own A6 A5 chi cps could it do so and still make profit?  Also could they manufacture the chips int he US?  That would eliminate Samsung from the equation.

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