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Microsoft Office coming to Apple's iOS, Google's Android after March 2013 - report

post #1 of 68
Thread Starter 
A Microsoft product manager in the Czech Republic has reportedly indicated that native versions of Office for iOS and Android will arrive next year [updated]

Microsoft's Petr Bobek told IHNED (via The Verge) that his company's market leading productivity suite will make its way to Apple's devices, as well as those running Google Android, sometime after March of 2013. The details came from a press release issued by Microsoft's Czech Republic Team.

"In addition to Windows, Office will also be available on other operating systems: Windows Phone, Windows RT, Mac OS, Android, iOS and Symbian," the company's statement said.

The press release separately noted that a new version of Office Web Apps will also be available. In a statement, Microsoft's U.S. arm noted that the company previously indicated Office Mobile will be available on iOS and Android, in addition to Windows Phone.

Office


Rumors of a version of Microsoft Office for iPad have swirled for the past year, and tablet publication The Daily even showed a screenshot of the rumored application. One report from late May pegged a specific release date for Office for iPad: Nov. 10, 2012.

However, Wednesday's statements from Microsoft's Czech team would suggest that date will not be met, with a launch instead coming in early 2013.

AppleInsider also learned earlier this year that Microsoft was working on a new native iOS application for Outlook Web App, called "OWA Mobile Client for iOS," that will offer compatibility with Exchange 2012 mailboxes. It, along with a new version of the Lync application for iOS, will reportedly feature Microsoft's Metro interface, just like Office for iPad is expected to do.

Rumors have said that Office for iPad will allow users to create and edit Word, Excel and PowerPoint files. Dedicated Outlook functionality is not expected to be included in Office for iPad.

While earlier reports focused on Office support for the iPad, the mention of iOS in the overseas Microsoft press release suggests that the productivity suite could also be coming to Apple's iPhone and iPod touch. Apple's own iWork suite, including Pages, Numbers and Keynote, offers universal support across portable iOS devices.
post #2 of 68

i am stunned by this, but I guess it makes sense -- the MS Office division isn't going to go down with the Windows 8 ship.

post #3 of 68
Actually, it is impossible for Office to be on iOS. Unless I missed the change, suites of apps are specifically disallowed.

What they probably mean to say (and what the blogs should *correct* instead of just mouthing Microsoft's marketing), is that Office will be "accessible" from iOS. Until we get specific evidence to the contrary, the obvious assumption here is that we are talking about iOS subscriptions to Office 360 (web Office).
post #4 of 68
They had no choice.. LibreOffice is coming to IOS, too...
post #5 of 68
If I were a MS shareholder, I would be furious. Apple has shipped three generations of iPad which quickly dominated the industry. Microsoft is losing market share year after year. They are a software company and make one of the most revered productivity suites available. Apple showed them the way with Pages, Numbers and Keynote with the iPad 2 and yet Mocrosoft may not even have their software available until well after the 4th generation iPad is released. Meanwhile, they are going to go head-to-head with Apple as a hardware manufacturer!? Microsoft missed the boat here, much like Blackberry missed the boat sacrificing their market dominance, and are now all but doomed. Now MS is playing catchup, having lost the smartphone market, the tablet market, and possibly the mobile office productivity market.
post #6 of 68
Good luck with that Microsoft. Both the hardware and the software. I mean that sincerely. I want there to be decent performing attempts by other companies so folks will stop saying its just that there is no one else and the iPad etc actually suck and so on

And those saying that you can't have a suite in the App Store are a tad wrong. You can, you just can't having pricing that is x for each price but y for all three. Unless you do it as some kind IAP which wouldn't really work of Office.

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post #7 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Actually, it is impossible for Office to be on iOS. Unless I missed the change, suites of apps are specifically disallowed.
What they probably mean to say (and what the blogs should *correct* instead of just mouthing Microsoft's marketing), is that Office will be "accessible" from iOS. Until we get specific evidence to the contrary, the obvious assumption here is that we are talking about iOS subscriptions to Office 360 (web Office).

 

 

Except they specifically say office web apps will be available separately.

 

Suites of apps are disallowed, but Microsoft can easily work around it by either

  1. Splitting Word/Excel/Powerpoint, like Apple does with iWork and iLife for iOS.
  2. Selling *one* app called "Office" that can edit all three types of documents, so long as it doesn't present itself as three "sub-apps"

 

Judging by the screenshot, it looks like they're going for the second.  It's a new document screen asking which type of document should be created.  I would assume otherwise (ie in terms of opening and changing between open documents) it'll present itself as a single app.

post #8 of 68

First of all, Microsoft is terrified of the post-PC worldview, and they're going to fight it by stuffing Windows into a tablet and calling it "tablets are peecees too." So it's surprising that they would do this. It sounds like they're hedging their bets on "what if peecee tablets tank?"

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #9 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128 View Post

If I were a MS shareholder, I would be furious. Apple has shipped three generations of iPad which quickly dominated the industry. Microsoft is losing market share year after year. They are a software company and make one of the most revered productivity suites available. Apple showed them the way with Pages, Numbers and Keynote with the iPad 2 and yet Mocrosoft may not even have their software available until well after the 4th generation iPad is released. Meanwhile, they are going to go head-to-head with Apple as a hardware manufacturer!? Microsoft missed the boat here, much like Blackberry missed the boat sacrificing their market dominance, and are now all but doomed. Now MS is playing catchup, having lost the smartphone market, the tablet market, and possibly the mobile office productivity market.

Great point. Remember when Bill Gates' MS acted as a partner with Apple, albeit reluctantly at times, and saw Mac users as potential customers for their software products? Ballmer has done nothing but try and compete in every product arena, failing miserably, and along the way forgetting that every Mac user and every iOS user is a potential customer for MS products. Why he has survived this long is a mystery.

post #10 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Actually, it is impossible for Office to be on iOS. Unless I missed the change, suites of apps are specifically disallowed.

 

QuickOffice Pro HD is in the app store and offers a suite of office programs in one app.

post #11 of 68

I use MS Office 2010 on Windows at work and I think it's pretty awful. PowerPoint now regularly crashes. Just by clicking on a slide in an open document, BAM! PowerPoint auto-restarts and auto-recovers the unsaved edits, but Jesus, what a POS. I've had it happen repeatedly, as in: crash, restart, crash restart, crash, restart all within the span of a few minutes. So with Microsoft, you don't just use their applications, you gotta be your own IT department and figure out what Windows Update patch crippled Office.

 

Outlook is another POS that frequently stops working, hangs, or stops responding.

Excel is pretty good, not particularly innovative, but it's had the fewest crashes.

Word is OK, but crashes more than I would like.

Hate the Office Ribbon interface. I give MS points for trying to unify the old cluttered dozens-of-toolbars UI, but Ribbon is just a toolbar and menu with a different name. That's not innovation.

 

I have no interest in helping Microsoft extend their Office hegemony into the post-PC universe.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #12 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluefish86 View Post

 

 

Except they specifically say office web apps will be available separately.

 

Suites of apps are disallowed, but Microsoft can easily work around it by either

  1. Splitting Word/Excel/Powerpoint, like Apple does with iWork and iLife for iOS.
  2. Selling *one* app called "Office" that can edit all three types of documents, so long as it doesn't present itself as three "sub-apps"

 

Judging by the screenshot, it looks like they're going for the second.  It's a new document screen asking which type of document should be created.  I would assume otherwise (ie in terms of opening and changing between open documents) it'll present itself as a single app.

 

All true in terms of possibilities but I still think the likelihood is:  

 

3.  Office "app" that acts as portal to Office 360 on the web.  

 

My reasoning is that same screenshot seems to leave out option number 1.  Also, Word itself is a nightmarish hodge-podge of hundreds of commands and details and it would be a herculean task for Microsoft to port to iOS.  They would essentially have to remake it from the ground up.  Excel is the same, as is Powerpoint.  These represent three separate, and absolutely HUGE endeavours.  Making a single "Office" app that contains all those things from all three apps together, all wrapped up in a simple, easy to use iOS app, is basically unworkable IMO.  

Furthermore, the kind of reworking necessary is such an involved task that it would make much more sense for them to do it for their platform first and then iOS second.  Why sink all those resources (likely a multi-year project involving large numbers of people), into something for a competing platform?  Especially when your own platform is still nascent and would sorely need the boost such a set of apps could provide? 

 

The fact that they don't have a "Metro" version of Office (and probably can't even make one yet), is the very reason they are going with the goofy "Windows RT" strategy.  If they don't have a "Metro" Office, I don't believe they have an iOS one either.  

post #13 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

I use MS Office 2010 on Windows at work and I think it's pretty awful. PowerPoint now regularly crashes. Just by clicking on a slide in an open document, BAM! PowerPoint auto-restarts and auto-recovers the unsaved edits, but Jesus, what a POS. I've had it happen repeatedly, as in: crash, restart, crash restart, crash, restart all within the span of a few minutes. So with Microsoft, you don't just use their applications, you gotta be your own IT department and figure out what Windows Update patch crippled Office.

 

Outlook is another POS that frequently stops working, hangs, or stops responding.

Excel is pretty good, not particularly innovative, but it's had the fewest crashes.

Word is OK, but crashes more than I would like.

Hate the Office Ribbon interface. I give MS points for trying to unify the old cluttered dozens-of-toolbars UI, but Ribbon is just a toolbar and menu with a different name. That's not innovation.

 

I have no interest in helping Microsoft extend their Office hegemony into the post-PC universe.

 

I agree with most of your points.  I switched to Pages about two or three years ago when it first (IMO of course) became a useable and indeed better alternative to Word and haven't looked back since.  

 

To be honest though, I must admit the compatibility of Word with other people is still something I miss.  I don't exchange documents a lot, but when you do it's usually a problem because usually the other person has Word.  It's not a big problem but it's there.  

 

As much as I like Pages, the development on it is slow at best and it's infuriating how few resources Apple puts towards it.  It could be fantastic but instead it's just "okay."  I'd like to see Apple actually try and make a better word processor than Word, and beat it in every way so that the choice was clearer for new users.  

 

To be totally honest, if Microsoft *did* come out with Word for iOS and it was actually designed even as moderately well as Pages is, I would likely switch back, and I'm a hard core Pages user at this point and a writer of thousands of words a day.  I'm reasonably certain this will never happen though as the basic design for Word was set in stone years ago and they've just been moving the icons around ever since.  

 

I honestly don't think Microsoft has the software chops to actually design a good program from scratch anymore. let alone one for post PC devices.  The real designers have all left the building years ago, and almost all their new interesting stuff was done by some outside company they subsequently bought out. 

post #14 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Actually, it is impossible for Office to be on iOS. Unless I missed the change, suites of apps are specifically disallowed.
What they probably mean to say (and what the blogs should *correct* instead of just mouthing Microsoft's marketing), is that Office will be "accessible" from iOS. Until we get specific evidence to the contrary, the obvious assumption here is that we are talking about iOS subscriptions to Office 360 (web Office).

There are ways around this. Office could come as one app, with tappable buttons for the other portions. Besides, what is meant by suites of apps? I have several apps that qualify as suites. You have a main menu, and from that you select which app in the suite you want. You can purchase more apps for the suite as you need.

I'm sure the developer could assign common memory storage for the suite so that figures from a spreadsheet could be used in a word processor or presentation app. Apple chose to not do it that way so that they could sell the suite one at a time. Microsoft may choose differently.

Look up AudioTools for one. That definitely qualifies as a suite.
post #15 of 68
I look forward to updating my work Excel files on my iPad.
And Word docs too.
This will sell more iPads.
post #16 of 68

PowerPoint for iOS (iPod touch - iPhone - iPad) is the ultimate presentation tool in your pocket! If it is fully compatible with PowerPoint for Mac and Windows.

post #17 of 68
But this is a big conundrum for Microsoft. It's been stated before. But if Office is available for iOS, unless it's cut down so much as to be just a fraction of the normal suite, it will cut into Microsoft's tablet sales. After all, there's nothing about Microsoft's new tablets that isn't already there for the iPad. Keyboards included. Except for a trackpad, of course.

I have read that up to 50% of all iPad sales are to business. While I don't know what they are all used for, some of the biggest companies and government departments are using them instead of notebooks. I would have to assume that means some word processing, etc.

If so, it seems as though business may be finding that for much use, Office isn't needed. If that goes on for too long, the grip Office has will be loosened.

The problem Microsoft has, and it's a rock and a hard place, is whether to bow to the inevitable, and produce it for iPads, and other tablets, or hope that Win 8 tablets will sell because of a monopoly on the ability to host office.

Perhaps they're waiting until March to be able to access the initial success of these new tablets, both x86, and ARM RT.
post #18 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

But this is a big conundrum for Microsoft. It's been stated before. But if Office is available for iOS, unless it's cut down so much as to be just a fraction of the normal suite, it will cut into Microsoft's tablet sales. After all, there's nothing about Microsoft's new tablets that isn't already there for the iPad. Keyboards included. Except for a trackpad, of course.

 

If this rumor turns out to actually be true, Microsoft's tablet and phone sales are DOA. The only possible way they can get a foothold in the tablet market at this point is to leverage Office as a unique "advantage" on the platform. It's not a guaranty or success, but it's really their only chance right now. Throwing that away by producing versions for other mobile platforms, would be giving up the fight for Win 8 tablets and phones before it even starts.

post #19 of 68
Originally Posted by melgross View Post
But if Office is available for iOS, unless it's cut down so much as to be just a fraction of the normal suite, it will cut into Microsoft's tablet sales. After all, there's nothing about Microsoft's new tablets that isn't already there for the iPad. Keyboards included. Except for a trackpad, of course.

 

Microsoft's a software company, and I think they should just take that to the extreme. Only make software. Not OS'. Get their money that way, the way they should have always done it, and let Apple take care of selling computers and OS'.

post #20 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

If this rumor turns out to actually be true, Microsoft's tablet and phone sales are DOA. The only possible way they can get a foothold in the tablet market at this point is to leverage Office as a unique "advantage" on the platform. It's not a guaranty or success, but it's really their only chance right now. Throwing that away by producing versions for other mobile platforms, would be giving up the fight for Win 8 tablets and phones before it even starts.

That's why it's a conundrum for them. On the one hand, they're being advised, publicly, to put in on the iPad, while on the other hand, it xlu,d damage, or destroy Windows tablet sales for everyone.

It's not an easy decision. Office is more important, in a number of ways, to Microsoft than even Windows.
post #21 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Microsoft's a software company, and I think they should just take that to the extreme. Only make software. Not OS'. Get their money that way, the way they should have always done it, and let Apple take care of selling computers and OS'.

Depending g on the reception to these tablets, and even Win Phone 8 overall, they may have to do this.
post #22 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

But this is a big conundrum for Microsoft. It's been stated before. But if Office is available for iOS, unless it's cut down so much as to be just a fraction of the normal suite, it will cut into Microsoft's tablet sales. After all, there's nothing about Microsoft's new tablets that isn't already there for the iPad. Keyboards included. Except for a trackpad, of course.

I have read that up to 50% of all iPad sales are to business. While I don't know what they are all used for, some of the biggest companies and government departments are using them instead of notebooks. I would have to assume that means some word processing, etc.

If so, it seems as though business may be finding that for much use, Office isn't needed. If that goes on for too long, the grip Office has will be loosened.

The problem Microsoft has, and it's a rock and a hard place, is whether to bow to the inevitable, and produce it for iPads, and other tablets, or hope that Win 8 tablets will sell because of a monopoly on the ability to host office.

Perhaps they're waiting until March to be able to access the initial success of these new tablets, both x86, and ARM RT.

For over a year I had been saying that MS should bring Office to the iPad -- that MS needed to get its feet wet (gain experience) with post-PC devices -- limited resources and the [relatively] stark "in your face" (single window) UI. I thought that this would also help sales of iPads into businesses where Office compatibility was needed.

Now, I'm not so sure! According to reviews I've read, by Peter Bright, Office running on a tablet is not a successful implementation, nor a satisfactory experience. It seems that Microsoft has put a touch interface on the highest levels of the Office apps but the UI quickly degrades when you go deeper into the apps... To the point of being unusable.

So, brilliantly, MS comes up with a strategy of furnishing tablets with keyboards… There are a few Metro touch widgets, but the bread-and-butter apps: i.e. Office -- are unusable without a keyboard and trackpad.

This is just the way Windows and Office have been running on tablets for the last 10 years! It was unusable then, and I suspect it will be just as unusable today.

So why bring this "disaster in the wings" to the iPad?

You might answer: "Because business needs compatibility with the office apps running on their computers. "

But what do you gain if the app (tablet Office) providing compatibility -- is unusable?

Wouldn't you be better off with the designed-for-iPad iWork apps -- and put up with some format and feature compatibilities with Office running on a computer?

iWork running on an iPad will, likely, never be 100 percent compatible with office running on a computer...

But, according to Peter Bright, Office running on Windows RT will never be 100 percent compatible either!
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post #23 of 68
Originally Posted by melgross View Post
Depending g on the reception to these tablets, and even Win Phone 8 overall, they may have to do this.

 

Hey, Ballmer himself said that 8 might be their last consumer OS if it doesn't sell well*. And it's not gonna sell well! So there's that facet killed off, potentially. But I also think he meant desktop. I'll bet (and I approve of) them continuing work with Windows Phone 8 in the phone and partial tablet space. We need an honest competitor to iOS.

 

… Wow. Microsoft being responsible for the honest competitor to an Apple product. How far Google has made the world fall…

 

*Now, here I'm running on something I read about 8 early on, meaning over 20 minutes ago. Since that's the case, I'm not sure it's exactly what I read, so if I'm wrong, correct me. 

post #24 of 68

This is great news. I will be buy Office for iPad the day it comes out. The Apple office apps are good, especially Keynote & Pages, but Numbers is just not good enough for a lot of people. It's a very simplified version of Excel. I think that this is a pretty big deal & will result in a lot of sales for Microsoft. What company that is using iPads wouldn't equip their sales people (or whoever they are giving the iPads to) with mobile versions of office? This will be great for Microsoft on the softwre side & great for Apple on the hardware side. 

post #25 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkral View Post

This is great news. I will be buy Office for iPad the day it comes out. The Apple office apps are good, especially Keynote & Pages, but Numbers is just not good enough for a lot of people. It's a very simplified version of Excel. I think that this is a pretty big deal & will result in a lot of sales for Microsoft. What company that is using iPads wouldn't equip their sales people (or whoever they are giving the iPads to) with mobile versions of office? This will be great for Microsoft on the softwre side & great for Apple on the hardware side. 

 

You may not get what you think you are you are getting... or need!

 

 

Web surf for "peter bright office windows rt" and read what an MS proponent thinks...

 

Quote:

Having the real Office applications and their perfect support for Office documents is valuable—but this needs to be married to simpler interfaces that are engineered around reading and light editing, and that remove entire features and user interfaces that are too complex for finger usage.

As things stand, far from being a valuable feature of Windows RT, the Office 2013 applications threaten to make it worse.

 

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/07/why-bother-the-sad-state-of-office-2013-touch-support/

 

and this

Quote:
Windows RT tablets are expected to ship at the end of October with a Preview version of Office 2013 RT, but users will be able to upgrade to a final version in early 2013. Nonetheless, Office Home and Student 2013 RT won’t come with some staple features, including macros, third-party add-ins or VBA (visual basic for applications) support. And Microsoft will reportedly remove other smaller features as well.
 
If the report proves true, Microsoft’s decision could hurt the deployment of Windows RT tablets in enterprise situations, where users depend on full-featured Office functions. And if Microsoft needs to remove much more from Office RT, leaving it relatively bare-bones, it might also affect whether everyday consumers purchase Windows RT devices, including Surface. Office currently costs as much as $120 to install on a single PC, so having a full version of the suite on Windows RT has been a big selling point of the Windows RT platform.
 

 

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/08/surface-pre-launch-woes-stripped-down-office-2013-and-oem-warnings/


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 10/10/12 at 11:40am
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post #26 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

If this rumor turns out to actually be true, Microsoft's tablet and phone sales are DOA. The only possible way they can get a foothold in the tablet market at this point is to leverage Office as a unique "advantage" on the platform. It's not a guaranty or success, but it's really their only chance right now. Throwing that away by producing versions for other mobile platforms, would be giving up the fight for Win 8 tablets and phones before it even starts.

 

Even Microsoft isn't betting that heavy on Office RT with the ARM processor

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post #27 of 68
When I first read the article I thought it was saying someone at the Czech division was making this claim. Then I said to myself 'it's just bad writing and it was the division manager who happened to be in the Czech Republic at the time'

Nope, turns out I read it right. His claim has been denied by the US office, saying there are no such plans for such a release.

IF they got Office for iOS out by March they might have done okay. Especially if it was school friendly. But they are quickly approaching the land of way way too late to bother on this front.

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post #28 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

For over a year I had been saying that MS should bring Office to the iPad -- that MS needed to get its feet wet (gain experience) with post-PC devices -- limited resources and the [relatively] stark "in your face" (single window) UI. I thought that this would also help sales of iPads into businesses where Office compatibility was needed.
Now, I'm not so sure! According to reviews I've read, by Peter Bright, Office running on a tablet is not a successful implementation, nor a satisfactory experience. It seems that Microsoft has put a touch interface on the highest levels of the Office apps but the UI quickly degrades when you go deeper into the apps... To the point of being unusable.
So, brilliantly, MS comes up with a strategy of furnishing tablets with keyboards… There are a few Metro touch widgets, but the bread-and-butter apps: i.e. Office -- are unusable without a keyboard and trackpad.
This is just the way Windows and Office have been running on tablets for the last 10 years! It was unusable then, and I suspect it will be just as unusable today.
So why bring this "disaster in the wings" to the iPad?
You might answer: "Because business needs compatibility with the office apps running on their computers. "
But what do you gain if the app (tablet Office) providing compatibility -- is unusable?
Wouldn't you be better off with the designed-for-iPad iWork apps -- and put up with some format and feature compatibilities with Office running on a computer?
iWork running on an iPad will, likely, never be 100 percent compatible with office running on a computer...
But, according to Peter Bright, Office running on Windows RT will never be 100 percent compatible either!

On their own equipment, Office is running in the Desktop. This is even true with ARM RT tablets, though there is no real Desktop there. If they did this for the iPad, I would have to assume they wouldn't, because they couldn't, do it that way. Apples guidelines must be observed.
post #29 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Hey, Ballmer himself said that 8 might be their last consumer OS if it doesn't sell well*. And it's not gonna sell well! So there's that facet killed off, potentially. But I also think he meant desktop. I'll bet (and I approve of) them continuing work with Windows Phone 8 in the phone and partial tablet space. We need an honest competitor to iOS.

… Wow. Microsoft being responsible for the honest competitor to an Apple product. How far Google has made the world fall…

*Now, here I'm running on something I read about 8 early on, meaning over 20 minutes ago. Since that's the case, I'm not sure it's exactly what I read, so if I'm wrong, correct me. 

We know the Desktop is being depreciated, because Microsoft has said so. The Modern UI (MUI) will be the UI for the future, along with the programming model, which is actually pretty good. But that dang UI is where people are hung up. Right now, I've been running the previews, and spend most of my time in the Desktop. But when that goes away, unless Microsoft makes the MUI much more sophisticated, they will lose their commercial and professional base. Those users require the complexity of "standard" Windows, just as some users here have already been complaining about the iOSification of OS X.

Because, at this point in time, whenever you need to do anything past the more basic operations, you need the Desktop to do it. The MUI is the new Start button, except that it's the entire screen.

I also see a lot of confusion between the "Pro" Win 8 and RT. they look exactly the same right now. So if you have two tablets side by side running the UI, you can't tell them apart. Only when you pick them up and feel the extra half pound or so and extra thickness of the Pro tablets can you tell they are different. But, even then, as we see with different notebooks, they are all different sizes and weights, but run the same Windows OS, so even those differences don't tell us much. The price will say something, but even there, for most uninformed consumers (and aren't most consumers, almost by definition, uninformed?) that won't tell them anything either. They will just buy the cheaper machine.

The fun will start once they get them home.
post #30 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkral View Post

This is great news. I will be buy Office for iPad the day it comes out. The Apple office apps are good, especially Keynote & Pages, but Numbers is just not good enough for a lot of people. It's a very simplified version of Excel. I think that this is a pretty big deal & will result in a lot of sales for Microsoft. What company that is using iPads wouldn't equip their sales people (or whoever they are giving the iPads to) with mobile versions of office? This will be great for Microsoft on the softwre side & great for Apple on the hardware side. 

I agree. Despite those here who think anything Microsoft is a waste of time, Office really is a pretty important piece of software. But they had better do this soon. March is fine. But a lot of users are finding that they don't need office on their tablets because of the apps that give compatability in some way. If they wait too long, those users will find that maybe they don't need Office at all.

After all, most word processing, spreadsheet work, and presentations can be done with Apple's apps now. Remember the old saying about Office, 80% of the users only use 20% of the features. If Apple, or some other company can get those 20% nailed, then those 80% won't need Office (assuming, of course, that they all need that same 20%). So to cover most people, all it really needs is perhaps 30% of the features.

So Office will be great, but not if they wait too long.
post #31 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

You may not get what you think you are you are getting... or need!


Web surf for "peter bright office windows rt" and read what an MS proponent thinks...


http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/07/why-bother-the-sad-state-of-office-2013-touch-support/

and this




http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/08/surface-pre-launch-woes-stripped-down-office-2013-and-oem-warnings/

Don't forget that none of those features ever made it to the Mac version of Office anyway, but still, Office is very popular with Mac users, especially in the corporate environment.
post #32 of 68
Originally Posted by melgross View Post
The Modern UI (MUI) will be the UI for the future, along with the programming model, which is actually pretty good. But that dang UI is where people are hung up. But when that goes away, unless Microsoft makes the MUI much more sophisticated, they will lose their commercial and professional base. Those users require the complexity of "standard" Windows, just as some users here have already been complaining about the iOSification of OS X. The price will say something, but even there, for most uninformed consumers (and aren't most consumers, almost by definition, uninformed?) that won't tell them anything either. They will just buy the cheaper machine.
The fun will start once they get them home.

 

"Metro" was such a funnier better name. Calling it "modern" immediately dates it. 

 

The future doesn't look very bright for Microsoft, should this be the case. They're killing off the old without preparing for the new. 

 

My only concern is that Apple won't be able to keep up with the manufacturing demand for new Macs.

post #33 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

For over a year I had been saying that MS should bring Office to the iPad -- that MS needed to get its feet wet (gain experience) with post-PC devices -- limited resources and the [relatively] stark "in your face" (single window) UI. I thought that this would also help sales of iPads into businesses where Office compatibility was needed.
Now, I'm not so sure! According to reviews I've read, by Peter Bright, Office running on a tablet is not a successful implementation, nor a satisfactory experience. It seems that Microsoft has put a touch interface on the highest levels of the Office apps but the UI quickly degrades when you go deeper into the apps... To the point of being unusable.
So, brilliantly, MS comes up with a strategy of furnishing tablets with keyboards… There are a few Metro touch widgets, but the bread-and-butter apps: i.e. Office -- are unusable without a keyboard and trackpad.
This is just the way Windows and Office have been running on tablets for the last 10 years! It was unusable then, and I suspect it will be just as unusable today.
So why bring this "disaster in the wings" to the iPad?
You might answer: "Because business needs compatibility with the office apps running on their computers. "
But what do you gain if the app (tablet Office) providing compatibility -- is unusable?
Wouldn't you be better off with the designed-for-iPad iWork apps -- and put up with some format and feature compatibilities with Office running on a computer?
iWork running on an iPad will, likely, never be 100 percent compatible with office running on a computer...
But, according to Peter Bright, Office running on Windows RT will never be 100 percent compatible either!

On their own equipment, Office is running in the Desktop. This is even true with ARM RT tablets, though there is no real Desktop there. If they did this for the iPad, I would have to assume they wouldn't, because they couldn't, do it that way. Apples guidelines must be observed.

 

Excellent point!   I hadn't even considered that!  So, it isn't only Touch UI issues and missing features like maros -- inaccessable OS features like the File System, Document Sharing, etc. could be insurmountable hurdles to successful implementation on iDevices and possibly Android devices.

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post #34 of 68
post #35 of 68
Originally Posted by melgross View Post
read the updates at the bottom of the article:
http://www.macrumors.com/2012/10/10/microsofts-czech-unit-reportedly-confirms-office-for-ios-coming-in-march-2013/

 

They just really don't like getting their users' hopes up about Office, do they? Second time they've denied it. lol.gif

 

HOLY FREAKING COW THE EMOTICONS WORK.1mad.gif1devil.gif1cool.gifirked.gif1embarassed.gif1hmm.gif1confused.gif1wink.gif1smile.gif1tongue.gif1smoking.gif1rolleyes.gif1biggrin.gif1frown.gif1oyvey.gif1eek.gif1bugeye.gif

 

Eh, I've already moved to emoji.

post #36 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Excellent point!   I hadn't even considered that!  So, it isn't only Touch UI issues and missing features like maros -- inaccessable OS features like the File System, Document Sharing, etc. could be insurmountable hurdles to successful implementation on iDevices and possibly Android devices.

There's an issue that I keep bringing up in various sites that is mostly being ignored.

The Desktop for Win 8 isn't that much different from the Desktop in Win 7, or anything before, other than for the flattening (and amazingly boring, and cheap looking) of all UI elements in Win 8. Otherwise, except for the removal of the start button to the MUI, it's pretty much the same.

Now, for those who used them, or just remember what was written about them, those 13-15.4" convertables that were being sold as Windows tablets for all those years weren't very popular because of three things. One was the price, as they were expensive. More than a standard laptop. Two was because they were big and heavy. Hard to use a "tablet" that weighs 3.5-7 pounds on your arm.

And three was the real biggie! It's almost Impossible to use windows, and its software, with a stylus on a "small" 13-15.4" screen. Note those sizes.

So now what have they come up with? 10.6-11.6" screens! Hey! How are these going to be easier to use? Well, they obviously won't be. So every "tablet" will either come with a keyboard, or will have one available from the manufacturer. You pretty much HAVE to use a keyboard and touchpad with the Desktop. No choice, really. It's almost impossible to go about in any other way.

Anyone here want to use OS X on a 10" screen with your finger, or a stylus? They also need more screen accuracy, to use that stylus with the tiny touch points there are, so a lot of these things will have a resistive layer as well as a capacitive layer. Not because its a great feature the iPad doesn't have, but the extra accuracy of a resistive screen is a requirement.

People will just love all of this, I think.
post #37 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Srice View Post

i am stunned by this, but I guess it makes sense -- the MS Office division isn't going to go down with the Windows 8 ship.

Windows 8 is a joke.  I would never recommend it to any person.  Microsloft Orifice (office tee hee) though?  Yes I would recommend that product.  I have run Winders 8.  Not my first choice for productivity.  Winders 8 is like changing the way a car steers.  Microsoft basically said we will make the car turn right then you turn the steering wheel left.

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post #38 of 68
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post
Winders 8 is like changing the way a car steers.  Microsoft basically said we will make the car turn right then you turn the steering wheel left.

 

Darn Microsofties, copying Apple again! Everyone knows Cupertino has a monopoly on "natural ________"! lol.gif

post #39 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


There are ways around this. Office could come as one app, with tappable buttons for the other portions. Besides, what is meant by suites of apps? I have several apps that qualify as suites. You have a main menu, and from that you select which app in the suite you want. You can purchase more apps for the suite as you need.
I'm sure the developer could assign common memory storage for the suite so that figures from a spreadsheet could be used in a word processor or presentation app. Apple chose to not do it that way so that they could sell the suite one at a time. Microsoft may choose differently.
Look up AudioTools for one. That definitely qualifies as a suite.

 

Yeah, it comes down to "what is a suite?" of course, and depending on how you define it, a "suite" could certainly be fudged into iOS.  It would likely not be workable with something as complex as Office is though and would require a rewrite of all the base apps anyway.  I am 99% certain that at some point in the process of boiling down all that complexity, that someone would see the simpler, clearer solution of doing separate apps like Apple has instead.  

 

Technically apps can now talk to each other and send things to each other also so the original "ban" on suites of inter-related apps is not quite moot but getting there.  

 

I just don't see Microsoft doing this at all though.  It makes no sense for them to make a "proper" touch-enabled Word app for iOS until they can make one for Metro and everything they have shown so far indicates that they are having no luck at all in doing that.   Their phone software is capable, and their existing iOS apps are "ok" but there is no excitement there.  As I said, I seriously doubt they have the talent to make a "post-PC" Office at all.   

 

Microsoft hasn't made anything (software wise), that would make anyone go "wow" for decades now IMO.  They still get the press when they make their announcements, but it's just been one PoS after another since almost Windows XP days.  


Edited by Gazoobee - 10/10/12 at 1:13pm
post #40 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkral View Post

This is great news. I will be buy Office for iPad the day it comes out. The Apple office apps are good, especially Keynote & Pages, but Numbers is just not good enough for a lot of people. It's a very simplified version of Excel. I think that this is a pretty big deal & will result in a lot of sales for Microsoft. What company that is using iPads wouldn't equip their sales people (or whoever they are giving the iPads to) with mobile versions of office? This will be great for Microsoft on the softwre side & great for Apple on the hardware side. 

I agree. Despite those here who think anything Microsoft is a waste of time, Office really is a pretty important piece of software. But they had better do this soon. March is fine. But a lot of users are finding that they don't need office on their tablets because of the apps that give compatability in some way. If they wait too long, those users will find that maybe they don't need Office at all.

After all, most word processing, spreadsheet work, and presentations can be done with Apple's apps now. Remember the old saying about Office, 80% of the users only use 20% of the features. If Apple, or some other company can get those 20% nailed, then those 80% won't need Office (assuming, of course, that they all need that same 20%). So to cover most people, all it really needs is perhaps 30% of the features.

So Office will be great, but not if they wait too long.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

You may not get what you think you are you are getting... or need!


Web surf for "peter bright office windows rt" and read what an MS proponent thinks...


http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/07/why-bother-the-sad-state-of-office-2013-touch-support/

and this




http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/08/surface-pre-launch-woes-stripped-down-office-2013-and-oem-warnings/

Don't forget that none of those features ever made it to the Mac version of Office anyway, but still, Office is very popular with Mac users, especially in the corporate environmen

 

 

I am sure you remember when Word and Excel were introduced on the Original Mac in the mid 1980s -- each app came on a 400  KB  (yes, folks that is 400 thousand Bytes) microfloppy disk

 

Both were well-designed, powerful and efficient apps that set the standard for their time...

 

Excel, especially, in the hands of an expert, could make the computer sing (and dance)...  In those days it was pretty easy to become an expert!

 

 

I no-longer use either Word or Excel -- nor do I have dealings with the "power users" who exploit the more esoteric features of these apps.

 

I suspect that your 80-20 assessment is correct!  I guess my questions are:

  • what real * capabilities has MS added to the basic apps from 1980s?
  • which of these are capabilities are needed in a Touch Tablet interface?
  • can they be implemented without destroying the advantages of the Touch Tablet user UX?

 

* I don't consider nice-to-have feature creep and half/full-screen toolbars as capabilities.

 

Your point: that the Mac implementation of Office lacked many features of the Windows implementation... but was still an important product -- is a valid point!  

 

It is also likely that iWork on the Mac and the iPad can satisfy many of the needs of Mac Office users.

 

And, Apple could/should identify and implement the most-needed features in iWork for OS X and iOS.  I suspect that Apple has already done this and was/is holding off to "encourage" MS to improve the Mac versions and release iPad versions.

 

Finally, do you think that MS can provide  workable-enough versions of these apps on the iPad... by March 2013?

 

From what I read, and have seen, I do not think they can -- it may already be too late!

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