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Apple says Samsung being investigated by DoJ over FRAND patent misuse

post #1 of 30
Thread Starter 
In a filing with the U.S. International Trade Commission on Monday, Apple said that the Department of Justice has opened an investigation into whether Samsung misused standards-essential patents as weapons against rival handset makers.

First discovered by FOSS Patents' Florian Mueller, Apple's filing regarding a "statement on public interest considerations" was part of a separate ITC complaint made public on Tuesday.

From Apple's ITC filing:

Regulators likewise have continued to scrutinize these problems, including in the specific context of Samsung?s conduct: the Department of Justice has opened an investigation into the manner in which Samsung has used?or misused?its declared-essential patents, as has the European Commission.


As noted by Apple, the European Commission is looking into Samsung's alleged abuse of so-called FRAND patents, with the antitrust regulation body's investigation having started in January. In addition, South Korea's Fair Trade Commission is also probing the company's use of declared-essential patents, a move seen as "courageous" as Samsung has substantial clout in its home country.

Apple mentioned the DoJ investigation in its ITC filing in defense of Samsung's request for an import ban against a number of products, specifically the iPhone, iPad and iPod.



Alongside Apple's filing, Samsung also entered a public interest statement arguing that because Apple refused the a FRAND licensing offer of 2.4 percent, the company's products should be banned. According to Mueller, 2.4 percent is not an inconsequential number as Samsung owns a huge share of UMTS-essential patents.

"At first sight, 2.4% may look like a small amount, but if one extrapolates the figure based on Samsung's share of UMTS-essential patents, it becomes clear that no one could make any money selling wireless devices if every SEP holder made similar demands," Mueller said.

It was reported on Wednesday that an initial determination by ITC Judge Thomas Pender found Samsung in violation of three Apple utility patents and one design patent. The decision, which stems from Apple complaint dating back to July 2011, may result in an import ban of infringing Samsung products if the six-member Commission concurs with the Judge Pender's assessment.
post #2 of 30
This might just get awesome. Stay tuned.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #3 of 30

"You can't trust the Department of Justice! They're based in the US, just like Apple!"

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #4 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

"You can't trust the Department of Justice! They're based in the US, just like Apple!"

"And they've been paid off by...dare I say it: AMERICANS!"
"I used to be disgusted, but now I try to be amused."
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"I used to be disgusted, but now I try to be amused."
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post #5 of 30
I've had about enough of this anti-american sentiment. Its not one dude, on Apples payroll, that just rubber stamps whatever Apple wants. These things go through groups of people, and if there is a violation, than it goes to a jury of peers. Calling the american company unjust when the other party is Korean, is a joke. How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing someone? How many knock off items are Korean? Give me a break.
post #6 of 30

but you can trust samsung who just ripped everyone off ..

post #7 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

"You can't trust the Department of Justice! They're based in the US, just like Apple!"

"And they've been paid off by...dare I say it: AMERICANS!"

Yeah, the whole electronic books price fixing thing is just a deceptive ploy to hide the fact they are in Apple's pocket.1tongue.gif
post #8 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by whoda View Post

I've had about enough of this anti-american sentiment. Its not one dude, on Apples payroll, that just rubber stamps whatever Apple wants. These things go through groups of people, and if there is a violation, than it goes to a jury of peers. Calling the american company unjust when the other party is Korean, is a joke. How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing someone? How many knock off items are Korean? Give me a break.


I think the OP forgot to add   /s.

His post was in quotes... perhaps a line from a foreign friend?

post #9 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by whoda View Post

I've had about enough of this anti-american sentiment. Its not one dude, on Apples payroll, that just rubber stamps whatever Apple wants. These things go through groups of people, and if there is a violation, than it goes to a jury of peers. Calling the american company unjust when the other party is Korean, is a joke. How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing someone? How many knock off items are Korean? Give me a break.

 

what anti-American sentiment?  (can you spell "projection"?)   

 

I don't know..  How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing US officials?  Let me also ask, while at it, do you know how many former VP's or other politically influential figures / officers serve on board of directors of  Samsung?

post #10 of 30

If Samsung wants the DOJ to drop the case, all Samsung has to do is dress up like a couple of Black Panthers, then voila, case dismissed.

 

As for the DOJ, I am still waiting on my poker money, and I expect to see it before 2013, so get to work and do your jobs.

post #11 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

"You can't trust the Department of Justice! They're based in the US, just like Apple!"

 

I'm not sure that is really true. 

post #12 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleBuff View Post

 

I'm not sure that is really true. 

Of course it's not true.

 

He was imitating a moronic Fandroid, because that's exactly the type of comments that they make, hence the quotes.

post #13 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathillien View Post

BTW. Who the f...rack needs bounce back?
 

 

I do.

 

It's all of the small touches and attention to detail that separates a superior product (Apple) from a mediocre product (Everybody else).


Edited by Apple ][ - 10/24/12 at 6:06pm
post #14 of 30

I keep getting misinterpreted like that. Maybe I should stop using quotes. 

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #15 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by tooltalk View Post

 

what anti-American sentiment?  (can you spell "projection"?)   

 

I don't know..  How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing US officials?  Let me also ask, while at it, do you know how many former VP's or other politically influential figures / officers serve on board of directors of  Samsung?

Al Gore? 'Politically influential'? On what planet? And, who else on the Board did you have in mind?

 

Groan.......

post #16 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

If Samsung wants the DOJ to drop the case, all Samsung has to do is dress up like a couple of Black Panthers, then voila, case dismissed.

I don't follow -- care to elaborate?

post #17 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleBuff View Post

 

I'm not sure that is really true. 

You should perhaps read a bit more.....

post #18 of 30
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathillien View Post

 

Who the f...rack needs bounce back?

Samsung, apparently? 1rolleyes.gif

post #19 of 30
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
Al Gore? 'Politically influential'? On what planet? And, who else on the Board did you have in mind?

 

Groan.......

 

I dunno, I thought it was funny that he believed he had a point.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #20 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I don't follow -- care to elaborate?

It's a political joke regarding a certain incident that occurred. Rather than go into detail about it here, I've sent you a wiki link, I'd be surprised if you have never heard about it.

post #21 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathillien View Post

It's just a defensive move by Apple. Will it pay off? Who knows.
It's just strange how some patents fall into FRAND but not rounded angles or bounce back for that matter.
BTW. Who the f...rack needs bounce back?
 

I imagine there are no design patents and very few utility/SW patents relating directly to user experience that can in any way be deemed "standards essential."

Thus it's very unlikely they would be licensed under FRAND terms.


Edited by DESuserIGN - 10/24/12 at 8:11pm
post #22 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

"You can't trust the Department of Justice! They're based in the US, just like Apple!"


Get off our site...Take your Korean TVs and electronics with you.  We don't need them in the US.  If you don't want Apple products, don't buy it.

post #23 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsdofny View Post


Get off our site

"Our site"?

That's not how Steve Jobs would have handled it...

post #24 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by tooltalk View Post

 

what anti-American sentiment?  (can you spell "projection"?)   

 

I don't know..  How many times has Samsung gotten in trouble for bribing US officials?  Let me also ask, while at it, do you know how many former VP's or other politically influential figures / officers serve on board of directors of  Samsung?

and do you know that samsung is (AFAIK) the most corrupt company of the world?

post #25 of 30
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post
"Our site"?

That's not how Steve Jobs would have handled it...

 

"My site." 

 

Because, you know, he took credit for everything¡ lol.gif

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #26 of 30

So quiet in this thread and the other ITC/Samsung thread.

 

I guess some news just can't be spun by the haters so they steer clear.

Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

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Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

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post #27 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathillien View Post

It's just strange how some patents fall into FRAND but not rounded angles or bounce back for that matter.

 

 

Samsung has those FRAND patents cause they agreed to them being FRAND. What everyone gets is one standard instead of dozens and samsung gets royalties that are fair to the buyer.

 

This story is a non issue anyways, an ITC judge already said Samsung is not misusing or abusing any of their FRAND patents (ITC Administrative Law Judge Rejects Apple's FRAND Arguments Against Samsung http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20121007194355579 )

 

A summary of the link is the following:

1) Samsung is allowed to use FRAND patents to block the sale of Apple products.

2) Samsung's offer was not expensive or high.

3) The patents are valid even tho Apple bought some chips from Intel (were Intel and Samsung have a cross license deal) The ITC judge goes on to say the jury in the court case in san jose were idiots cause the jury said (a) no payments are needed for those patents cause of the Intel-Samsung deal but then also say (b) 'What patents?", Apple isnt using any of Samsung's patents.

post #28 of 30
^ Look, we have a new troll. First off, that ruling you linked is only about one specific aspect of a case and does not mean Samsung is cleared of ALL FRAND abuses going on, despite your (and Groklaw's) pathetic attempts to imply such.

The FTC isn't going to want to hear about this case as it doesn't apply. They're investigating other cases. Just like the EU is.

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Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

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post #29 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsdofny View Post


Get off our site...Take your Korean TVs and electronics with you.  We don't need them in the US.  If you don't want Apple products, don't buy it.

 

 

If you dont like Korean TV's and "dont buy it".

 

You've just contradicted your own statements.

 

How crazy is that?

 

 

 

The issue at hand: Seems like  you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

^ Look, we have a new troll. First off, that ruling you linked is only about one specific aspect of a case and does not mean Samsung is cleared of ALL FRAND abuses going on, despite your (and Groklaw's) pathetic attempts to imply such.

 

Because you know more about patent laws than the patent lawyers themselves.

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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post #30 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Of course it's not true.

 

He was imitating a moronic Fandroid, because that's exactly the type of comments that they make, hence the quotes.

 

If you look at what is posted on here, the site doesn't get a lot of Android fans. I'm not sure how many are really that hard core about it anyway. The site mainly sees people with some kind of interest in Apple, even if they only like or take interest in a portion of Apple's overall product line. Tallest is a bit extreme in that he interjects idiotic arguments on the part of a theoretical Android fanatic, yet I don't think we need those kinds of comments. He could at least make up a real counter point argument rather than something so half baked. If someone genuinely posted such a thing, it would be obvious that they have no real interest in the thing they're commenting on. Otherwise they would have paid enough attention to the product to offer actual insight on what they dislike about it. Just my thoughts...

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