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Phil Schiller says Apple does with its Macs what PC makers are 'afraid' to do - Page 4

post #121 of 232
Apple has great points, flash memory is the future, and disk drives are losing customers. Apple still needs a external DVD drive sold, however they need to up it to blue ray, change it to thunderbolt and get max speed, giving customers a advantage to a Mac even if they are major disk players(prefuralibly a rewritable blue ray). Giving customers like me to switch to Mac. I still might without, just price is a lot higher than a average windows. (Family 2 iPhones 4. One windows laptop. One windows desktop. One 5-6 year old Nokia phone. One wii.)
post #122 of 232
Originally Posted by Curtis Hannah View Post
…they need to up it to blue ray…

 

For what reason?

 

…change it to thunderbolt and get max speed…

 

Can Blu-ray even saturate a USB 3 port?

 

…giving customers a advantage to a Mac even if they are major disk players(prefuralibly a rewritable blue ray).

 

The OS still does not and will never support the playback of commercial Blu-ray video discs. Just buy a Blu-ray drive, plug it in, and rip your discs now. Apple doesn't have to make you a drive for that. Heck, I've ripped HD DVDs on my Mac Pro. At least those are recognized as such by the OS!

 

I still might without, just price is a lot higher than a average windows.

 

Nope. Not over its lifetime, it's not.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #123 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

This is good advice: never listen to rain for any reason.

 

 

"Listen to the rhythm of the falling rain

 

Telling me just what a fool I've been...."

 

God, I'm old!

post #124 of 232
Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post
"Listen to the rhythm of the falling rain

 

Telling me just what a fool I've been...."

 

Far too long since I've heard that. Kudos.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #125 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Far too long since I've heard that. Kudos.

 

I never understood when Almost Live was lobbying to make Louie, Louie the Washington state song, they didn't pick Rhythm of the Rain instead. Or maybe Goodtime Charlie's Got the Blues—much more locally appropriate, if you ask me.

post #126 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curtis Hannah View Post

Apple has great points, flash memory is the future, and disk drives are losing customers. Apple still needs a external DVD drive sold, however they need to up it to blue ray, change it to thunderbolt and get max speed, giving customers a advantage to a Mac even if they are major disk players(prefuralibly a rewritable blue ray). Giving customers like me to switch to Mac. I still might without, just price is a lot higher than a average windows. (Family 2 iPhones 4. One windows laptop. One windows desktop. One 5-6 year old Nokia phone. One wii.)

Apple is one of the few companies that looks at the computer as a whole solution, meaning that they don't expect the customer to "figure it out for themselves." I'll give you a real life example. When you insert a DVD into a PC running a clean copy of Windows XP, Windows Media Player would launch and tell you that Windows doesn't ship with a codec for playing back DVD video, and link you to some web page where you can purchase and download a compatible codec online. Of course, some PC OEMs would include a free copy of, say, CyberDVD or PowerDVD which included the codec, but it wasn't from Microsoft, so the customer was responsible for registering and updating yet another piece of software that wasn't part of the OS. And if you wanted to burn DVDs from Windows XP, that was another piece of software you had to buy. Today, of course, Windows 7 can play video DVDs and burn DVDs out of the box, but it wasn't that way for many years.

Apple, in contrast, always included DVD video playback and DVD burning (and even DVD video authoring) software with every Mac that was equipped with a DVD drive. It was part of Mac OS X, so it was updated by Apple and you didn't have to register or download a separate application, and then worry about it breaking if you ever updated the OS someday.

In a way, this is how Apple has always operated: when you buy an Apple product, they've completely thought through how the customer is going to use it. They thought through, for example, what will happen if you insert a DVD video disc into your new iMac. It isn't like Windows XP where Microsoft didn't license the codecs needed to play DVD video and expected the customer to fix the problem, or the OEM to include the needed software. I was floored the first time I saw that on Windows XP, and it started me on the road to becoming an Apple convert.

So Apple is not going to give you the option of a Blu-Ray burner without including full OS support, and if they do that, they are putting their implicit support behind Blu-Ray, and in effect, telling customers, "this is how you will watch HD videos on your computer." Except for the fact that Apple doesn't see that as the future of HD video. And neither does Microsoft (there's not going to be a Blu-Ray Xbox, HD content will stream from Xbox Live). Or Netflix, or Hulu. Everyone is saying, streaming is the future. Even Sony gets it: they've launched HD video streaming over PSN, and dropped the optical drive altogether from the PS Vita. Surface Pro lacks an optical drive, so much for the myth of "you need an optical drive to be Pro."

At first, I thought this was risky, since everyone assumed that Blu-Ray was the anointed HD successor to the DVD format (HD-DVD gave its life for that to happen). But now with AppleTV and all movie titles available from iTunes Store, and the ability to stream HD from any modern Apple-logo device or computer, I can see where Apple was going when they withheld Blu-Ray support. That vision is finally here.

You can use Blu-Ray burners with Macs, just as you can with PCs, but it up to you to acquire the needed software, depending on what you plan to use it for. But don't wait for Apple to sell you one.
Edited by Suddenly Newton - 10/26/12 at 10:37pm

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #127 of 232

It's not often that Apple chucks out what we all consider to be an important and integral part of the system and more often than not, it has been right in doing so. It would be years before some of these computers follow Apple but right this moment, Apple's gonna take a lot of heat for the decision. Amazing guts.

post #128 of 232

I respect Apple for not just talking the talk, like all these other companies do, but walking the walk, and actually executing on their convictions. In retrospect it may always seem 'obvious' but in fact its almost always an extremely gutsy move with some inherent risks. Until recently I've been hearing that Apple would 'never' drop the optical drive on the iMac, that it would be 'insane' because its a desktop machine, and consumers simply wouldnt be ready for that. But Apple does things all the way, and if they believe in something, and a certain philosophy, they'll propagate it throughout their entire product line- see flash storage, elimination of optical drives, unibody construction, soldered batteries/RAM, laminated panels, etc. And its absolutely the right thing to do, even if theres the inevitable hand wringing, bitching, and end of the world whining when it actually happens. A few months later, people look back and realize it was a no brainer. The only consistent part is that Apple is always the only one with the guts to first popularize these obvious-after-the-fact decisions and to set the industry on a certain course. The new iMac proves they will have that strong no compromise conviction and ability to execute. SJ would be proud. 

post #129 of 232

I'm not crazy about the idea of removing the Superdrive from the iMac. In laptops it made a lot of sense—and really, how often do you actually need to burn discs when you're out and about? And if you do, is a tiny external drive like Apple's (or some of the cheaper ones) that much of a burden to take along? You're presumably taking a stack of discs....

 

In a desktop I don't see the necessity to leave it out, but on the other hand, it's probably the most unreliable part of the machine, and an external can be much more easily replaced. I'll go through spells of burning dozens of discs and then go weeks or months without using the drive, so taking it off and putting it in the drawer is actually a pretty good solution—especially since the iMac's drive is so awkwardly placed.

 

What bothers me about the decision is the mindset it displays—that they believe the techno-hipsters who think "DVDs are dead". The gadget freaks who post on tech blogs may think so, but there's a real world out there that doesn't agree. This download-only dreamworld may be practical on the Cupertino campus and a few other places, but it will be not years, but decades—and by using the plural I don't mean just two—before a large majority of people in this country have the kind of internet service to make it universal. If it ever happens—I've got my doubts.

 

Yes, DVD sales are down. Many people used to just buy a movie rather than wait around on one foot for it to show up on pay-per-view or On-Demand—and a lot more people would prefer to do without high-tier cable and just buy the rare thing they really wanted to see. That market is gone.

 

CD sales are down. A whole generation of people have had their ears corrupted to the point where they're willing to pay money (!) for 128 or 256 kbps noise—but that's not everybody. There are a few of us who can still hear.

 

Blu-Ray hasn't achieved the volume DVDs did, and it never will. But there are millions of us who've waited all our lives to be able to watch movies in our homes at better quality than any theater. We may be a small percentage, but there are a large number of us just the same. These markets may shrink, but they're not going away completely for a long time.

 

When thumb drives are cheap enough that you can get say 4 GB of capacity for 25¢ or 30¢, then we can revisit the matter but until then, optical discs rule outside the techno-echo-chamber.

 

That being said, Apple did not suddenly abandon disc drives—they sell disc drives. You can still do anything you could before, and if your drive craps out you don't have to take your computer apart to replace it. To be honest, what's going to sell me a new iMac is the screen—laminating the LCD to the glass is what makes the huge difference. Never mind "Retina" resolution—I challenge anybody to resolve the pixels on an iMac at the distance you ordinarily sit at—and the display is what you interact with. A tiny increment in performance is not going to make any difference to me—if you're a video editor or something, that's different.

 

As for abandoning HDDs—that's another story. Flash memory has its applications, obviously in mobile devices, but I'm leery of the idea of a device with no moving parts that nevertheless promises to "wear out" after a certain number of uses. WTF? HDDs never "wear out". They can fail—but be honest, that's pretty damn rare these days. Maybe I'm a Luddite, but I don't know if I'm ready to trust flash for the real storage in my actual computer. And oh, yeah—the flash memory you want to trust over optical discs to distribute content? In addition to costing 20-40 times as much as DVD-Rs per GB—the flash in thumb drives is of enormously lower quality than that used in SSDs. So there's that....

post #130 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

I respect Apple for not just talking the talk, like all these other companies do, but walking the walk, and actually executing on their convictions. In retrospect it may always seem 'obvious' but in fact its almost always an extremely gutsy move with some inherent risks. Until recently I've been hearing that Apple would 'never' drop the optical drive on the iMac, that it would be 'insane' because its a desktop machine, and consumers simply wouldnt be ready for that. But Apple does things all the way, and if they believe in something, and a certain philosophy, they'll propagate it throughout their entire product line- see flash storage, elimination of optical drives, unibody construction, soldered batteries/RAM, laminated panels, etc. And its absolutely the right thing to do, even if theres the inevitable hand wringing, bitching, and end of the world whining when it actually happens. A few months later, people look back and realize it was a no brainer. The only consistent part is that Apple is always the only one with the guts to first popularize these obvious-after-the-fact decisions and to set the industry on a certain course. The new iMac proves they will have that strong no compromise conviction and ability to execute. SJ would be proud. 

 

I bolded the part I want to discuss. After my last post you may think I'm a total stick-in-the-mud, but I absolutely agree with this part. The unibody construction was to eliminate all the broken connections due to case flex in laptops. Connections are the root of all evil. Soldered connections are bad enough, but the kind that dirt and corrosion can get into, like replaceable memory, need to be eliminated tout suite. Battery doors and swappable batteries—just another failure waiting to happen. Apple won't be happy until they can make a computer one solid lump—and I agree with them. Of course, they're the only ones whose laptops are expected to last longer than a couple of years anyway, so they have to meet a different standard.

 

 

They've been on this rigidity campaign for a while now. Remember when the unibody case was ready, but the lithium-polymer battery for it wasn't, so they had to sell MacBooks for a whole year with the unibody but the old cans-in-a-box battery? They had to sacrifice something—they picked the firewire port and listened to a year of bitching rather than delay the debut of the new rigid case. They're serious about this—if people want a kit computer, well, they're going to have to look elsewhere....

post #131 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Nope. Not over its lifetime, it's not.

 

It can be. I don't know if there still are, but there used to be decent quality Windows boxes out there. My total cost of ownership was quite a bit lower on my last hot-rod Sony than on any of the three MacBook Pros I've owned since, and I would still describe the ownership experience, aside from Windows just not being quite as elegant to use, as "comparable."

post #132 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

The new iMac proves they will have that strong no compromise conviction and ability to execute. SJ would be proud. 

 

"No compromise?!" How about making the chassis so thin that there's no room for a high capacity drive? Or cramming stuff in so tight that it can no longer dissipate heat effectively enough to allow for even a high speed version of the mini drive? Those not only meet the accepted definition of "compromise," they also do a lot more than just hint at "Form over function."

post #133 of 232

Yes and no.  Apple does some things other companies don't, and there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not because other companies are necessarily 'afraid' to do the same.  To the contrary, this is evidence that Apple still clearly doesn't understand the enterprise.  Eliminating 'legacy' parts in computers may be fine for consumers, but businesses still need to purchase systems that are compatible with decades-old technology.

 

As an IT Admin, it is now becoming almost impossible to integrate Macs into my organization.  Apple apparently doesn't understand that there are thousands, if not millions of systems out there that are NOT connected to the internet.  It is not possible for us to buy and deploy new operating systems using the "Mac App Store".  That distribution method has pretty much put the last nail in the coffin for our use of Macs in our enterprise.  We have to deploy updates using good "old fashioned" optical media, or even USB sticks.  

 

Unfortunately Apple has pretty much cut off any system not connected to the internet.  For example, we recently bought a Mac mini server.  The machine is not/will not be connected to the internet. The machine does not come with any restore media (adopting a stupid, foolish PC industry trick).  I would not normally mind since I can provide my own USB stick ($10 extra), however, the OS and Software images are not included on the hard drive either.  To make a long story short, I needed to reconfigure and re-image the drive(s), but since there is no way to create a bootable installer image even with my own media, I had to go to the Mac App Store on a different machine and purchase another copy of the OS ($20 extra) and make an image from that.  (Before anyone mentions the "restore partition" you should be aware that it does not contain the full OS or Software images - it's only a subset - totally insufficient to re-image a new or reconfigured drive).  

 

To add insult to injury, I also need to update the "Server" App that makes the machine a "Server".  Since the machine will not be connected to the internet, and the only way to update the Server App is through the Mac App Store, I copied the Server App to a USB stick that I took to a Mac that is connected to the internet, but the App Store refuses to update it!  So now the only way to update the Server App is to buy another copy from the Mac App Store ($20 more)!!  That's pretty piss-poor Apple.  It's not just the extra money, it the annoyance, inconvenience, and extra time required, not to mention the stress of trying to figure out why the hell "it just works" isn't working at all.  Needless to say, this will be the last Mac "Server" our organization will ever be buying.  Apple's "foresight" has just cost them future business.

post #134 of 232
The problem with that is at the business level. A lot of business software is still optical media only. Apple is slowly refusing to deal with businesses . So they have the luxury of removing optical drives.
post #135 of 232

I can't believe there are IT departments still using optical disks to distribute anything.  I don't think I have seen an optical disk at work in the last ten years. Even if work computers are cut off from the internet (don't see much of that anymore either), surely they are on an internal network and software/updates proceed form a central IT server? We have both Linux/Windows machines at work and all software/updates are pushed to us from IT over the network.

 

These days home or work often there are multiple computers networked together. Can't macs also mount an Optical drive over the network that is in another computer? So even if you do occasionally need Optical, you don't need every computer to have it. Just one.

 

I am really struggling to believe there is much need for an optical drive today and home or at work. A further if there is, you can mount the optical drive in another computer, which there must be plenty if the need was so pressing.

post #136 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple v. Samsung View Post

I have to disagree with him on one front. Although I do not use it all the time I love my blu-ray drive (I use the old PS3 more). Watching movies in HD while I am working is sweet (I prefer blu-ray because they normally have better quality, and are cheaper and trade-able). I do like to burn dvds for my grandmother with my 
niece
 and nephew. For some many disc drive is two important to trade away like the millions who live in areas with crappy internet connections.

I think Apple has made the iMac less valuable to students. Students still use their computers to do things like burn CDs, DVDs, and watch movies. I still use my Macbook to do these things.

With that said, Apple was never going to put a Blue Ray drive in the Mac because the licensing restrictions essentially required one to lock down the whole system with restrictive DRM. The DRM effected performance even when the Blue Ray drive wasn't operating. There were several well written articles by well respected experts explaining how Windows was taking a performance hit over incorporating Blue Ray. Jobs explained the issue briefly himself saying Apple didn't like the licensing requirements.
post #137 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981 View Post

The problem with that is at the business level. A lot of business software is still optical media only. Apple is slowly refusing to deal with businesses . So they have the luxury of removing optical drives.

This is true. I am an attorney. I have software that is Windows only, which I run through Parallels. The company whose software I need sent me the new version of the software on a CD. CDs and DVDs for some small software companies are more cost effective. If costs them less to send a CD or DVD then it does to host the infrastructure to make the software available online. Moreover, businesses often times host a plethora of different machines ranging in age and are slow to adapt to IT changes.

I really like how Apple is not afraid to get rid of legacy technology. I, however, am not sure I always agree with Apple what is legacy hardware. Along with myself, I still have friends that burn CDs. I remember when Apple did away with Firewire on some of its Macs about two years BEFORE Thunderbolt was announced. It is true a lot of people weren't using Firewire, but for people who have been using Macs for a long time Firewire was wonderful. I often times used it to impress PC friends. Being able to boot a Mac up in Target Disk Mode was indispensable to fixing many problems. It was also great for cloning an old Mac to a New Mac. USB came no where close in terms of ability and speed. I haven't tried Thunderbolt. I hope it has the same capabilities as Firewire.

What also drives me crazy about Apple is its refusal to put in options. It released Safari 4 as a public beta with tabs on top. Jobs touted it as great on stage. I agreed. According to polls half the community loved it, half hated it. When Apple pulled the beta, it removed tabs from on top. The right move would have been to leave tabs on top, but give an option to switch to the old way. You could do that in the beta using the terminal. When the final version shipped, however, Apple also removed the ability to make changes in the terminal. I was so mad at Apple, I switched to Chrome for about a year. I suspect Apple lost a few others to Chrome over that.
Edited by TBell - 10/27/12 at 7:38am
post #138 of 232
Originally Posted by TBell View Post
Students still use their computers to do things like burn CDs, DVDs, and watch movies.

 

Been to college recently? This really isn't the case.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #139 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Been to college recently? This really isn't the case.

Yes, actually I am taking classes currently. I love going to school, and probably will die taking classes. I can only speak from my perspective, but I know plenty of people who still buy and share music on CDs. Of course they listen to it on their iPods or iPhones. I also will time shift my DVD rentals. I also have friends who are film makers who frequently use the Macs DVD burning capabilities. Come to think of it my photographer friend uses the CD burner to give folks a hard copy of photos she has taken.
post #140 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post


Yes, actually I am taking classes currently. I love going to school, and probably will die taking classes. I can only speak from my perspective, but I know plenty of people who still buy and share music on CDs. Of course they listen to it on their iPods or iPhones. I also will time shift my DVD rentals. I also have friends who are film makers who frequently use the Macs DVD burning capabilities. Come to think of it my photographer friend uses the CD burner to give folks a hard copy of photos she has taken.


I have put my kids through high school and now college. Only twice have I had to buy CDs for them, and that was a few years ago. The scenario you describe is a shrinking minority. Apple does not give 2 seconds of thinking to such a market sector.

post #141 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post

You know how the optical disk drive got eliminated? It wasn't just a wild idea. It was a series of small indignities, one after another that did it in.

 

700

 

LOL. People in the year 2021 will look at that photo and think: shiny plastic disks were sooo early 2000s, now they're in landfills. Back then, computers were these big boxes on desktops with keyboards, mice, and boxy CRT monitors, like in those old movies from the era. The people loaded media and software from these shiny plastic disks onto their brand new Packard-Bell PCs...

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #142 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

"Even if the market was going there, we weren't going to chase everybody downhill,"


That attitude keeps them at the top of all technology companies in the world.

Yep. They create for the common market but in a way that it can be expanded for other needs. Plugins for Aperture, Final Cut, external optical drives etc. you need it, get it. But the majority don't so why make them pay for something they won't use.

Unlike PCs, that try to be everything for everyone. What's the saying, jack of all trades but master of none.

Steve etc were smart enough to see that a tablet doesn't work as a full computer for several reasons so they didn't try. Microsoft may be about to learn this lesson in a very very hard way

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #143 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary54 View Post

Count how many times in a year when you actually use the ODD.

Maybe ten times. What blu rays I have I use with a standalone player and a 60 inch TV. For backups etc I use a hard drive or a thumb drive for sharing.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #144 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylersdad View Post

Because that's what I have.

That you don't want to change is your issue, not Apples. If they catered to everyone like you we'd still have 5&1/4 drives in machines

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #145 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralphbu View Post

This doesn't explain the Mac Pro. Sure you can do a lot of things with 7" screens, but for some reason back in 1988 Apple saw the wisdom of making computers that could handle more screen size. Now all of a sudden Apple thinks a modern computer should not allow more than two screens? Good grief, all they have to do is put USB and thunderbolt in the Mac Pro and problem solved. Sure, go ahead, do something different, who cares what, but do something! What rationale could there be for abandoning the market for multiple screen flexible setups altogether?
Nobody is going to buy a computer these days without thunderbolt or USB3, certainly not a Mac Pro. What are they thinking?

 

How do they think that?  The new Retina MBP (I believe both 15 and 13") is capable of running 2 monitors via TB and another from HDMI.  Look 3 monitors!  If they can manage 3 monitors on a MBP, I don't think the new Mac Pro next year will be lacking that ability

post #146 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylersdad View Post

I carry backups, not the originals.

But you are still carrying something extra. So the argument that you don't want to carry something extra falls apart because you are still carrying something extras with those discs

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #147 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by encino View Post

"Phil Schiller says Apple does with its Macs what PC makers are 'afraid' to do"

Glue the computer's memory to the board making it harder for owners to upgrade their computers themselves?

How many folks really need to be able to do such upgrades.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #148 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralphbu View Post

Good grief, all they have to do is put USB and thunderbolt in the Mac Pro and problem solved.

Hardly. If it doesn't have 200 GB of better than lightening fast RAM, a processor so latest and greatest that it won't be invented for another decade and graphics better than NASA etc have in a pretty box that makes no noise, never gets warm much less hot and costs less than $1000 it's over priced trash.

So what that 99.9% of folks making such demands will never use more than 1/10th of the machines power and will never actually so any upgrades. They just want it to want it

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #149 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

[...] So what that 99.9% of folks making such demands will never use more than 1/10th of the machines power and will never actually so any upgrades. They just want it to want it

 

We've upgraded our Pro multiple times. Bigger drives as they became available. More RAM when it got cheap and we started doing more video intensive work. At one point we were looking at swapping out the video card, and we've added and/or upgraded peripheral I/O PCI cards twice. I don't know why you think people don't actually do upgrades. That flexibility is part of the reason we bought that kind of machine in the first place. Perhaps you don't/wouldn't, but that isn't reason to assume others don't.

post #150 of 232
Yes, it's true. Apple does with it's Macs that PC makers are afraid to do. WAIT FOREVER TO UPDATE THEM.
post #151 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

Why force everyone to buy an internal disc, whether they want one or not .......  when you can easily give 100% of the consumers the choice .... with an external one. So just wtf are you complaining about?

Because it's no cheaper so essentially you weren't buying an internal disc, you got it for free.

So on that basis we see the flip side of your argument. Why force everyone to not have an internal disc, whether they want one or not.

post #152 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Can Blu-ray even saturate a USB 3 port?

 

No.  12x Blu-Ray tops out at 432Mbit.  USB 2 tops out at 480.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v View Post

 

"No compromise?!" How about making the chassis so thin that there's no room for a high capacity drive? Or cramming stuff in so tight that it can no longer dissipate heat effectively enough to allow for even a high speed version of the mini drive? Those not only meet the accepted definition of "compromise," they also do a lot more than just hint at "Form over function."

 

http://www.apple.com/imac/specs/

 

So am I imagining those 3TB drives you can stick in the iMac? 3TB, 1TB Fusion or 3TB Fusion.  Sounds like decent options to me.  I have 4 2TB drives in an OWC external for 6TB of extra storage (yay raid 0+parity) and part of that is set aside for my Time Machine backups.  Apple sells externals strictly for that purpose w/Time Capsules.  If you aren't using the possibilities to their fullest, yeah ya might be worried about data loss.  About the only problem I'm looking at is lightning killing everything at once. 

 

 

The G4 Cube was being talked about on the prior pages and I just wanted to mention that the Cube is what really jumped out at me and said Apple could pull off some amazing stuff.  Price it $200 lower at launch and maybe that model would have lasted.  Part of me still wants one :)

post #153 of 232
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post
No.  12x Blu-Ray tops out at 432Mbit.

 

Wow. Barely surpasses FireWire 400. And why would anyone on Earth want to use this, again?

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #154 of 232

It's true, they take risks and usually it works out for them. They wait until the right moment though, when there's other options that are affordable, e.g. other options for optical drive: cloud services, usb thumbdrive, sd cards, ad hoc network, external optical drive.

post #155 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

So am I imagining those 3TB drives you can stick in the iMac?

 

If you're talking about the 21" yes. The entry model is available ONLY with a 5400 RPM drive. The next one at least offers Fusion, but it's still capped at 1GB.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

I have 4 2TB drives in an OWC external for 6TB of extra storage (yay raid 0+parity) and part of that is set aside for my Time Machine backups.

 

I know what you mean and don't disagree, but what that also says is that with current Macs is that you have to buy the computer *AND* buy external storage to compensate for the flawed internals.

post #156 of 232

Convergence means all media and apps are becoming executable and streamed and securely backed up on-line, this means in future you only need an IO screen of relevant active resolution to run just about anything this interface world will have to offer live on demand pretty much anywhere anytime.

New computer technology is developed to be compatible with whats coming next and drive new media formats to provide the infrastructure to accommodate and perfect the requirements of the paying customers,  the newest generation downloads pay-per-view media and pay-per-song and purchases books and apps on-line, the disc market is reducing at a ever increasing rate and TV and the hifi market are moving to pay-per-viewing/listening over isp, and quality is becoming far less of a question than have you really looked at whats on offer lately.

 

From my prospective Apple seem to have their finger well and truly on the pulse and the drive is on to increase download speeds to accommodate even the latest 4k streaming with surround 192k sound live on demand, including next generation gaming, my job will be to make my work directly available for this on-line market as that is where I will market and make my living from in future, certainly not by living in the past that's a dead cirt..

I hope Apple will also be as innovative with their upcoming Mac-Pro renovation too, a speedy pro-server supporting several collaborative studio iMacs would be quite ideal for the professional market providing the online media.

post #157 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v View Post

 

If you're talking about the 21" yes. The entry model is available ONLY with a 5400 RPM drive. The next one at least offers Fusion, but it's still capped at 1GB.

 

 

 

I know what you mean and don't disagree, but what that also says is that with current Macs is that you have to buy the computer *AND* buy external storage to compensate for the flawed internals.

 

Yes the entry model only has the low end.  You made it sound like there were no options for higher drives and there are.  I had 2 of the drives left over from my old PC before its mobo friend.  I intentionally replaced my system w/a Mini, knowing about the lack of expandability, figuring I would do external drives later.  Would have been the same if I bought a laptop.  I don't see it as an issue.

post #158 of 232

I'm glad they're only using 5400rpm drives. With the optical drive gone and a 5400rpm drive it should be almost silent.

post #159 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I'm glad they're only using 5400rpm drives. With the optical drive gone and a 5400rpm drive it should be almost silent.

 

Or trade up to a Fusion drive and the stuff you use most will be on the silent SSD part.  Everything else like music will be on the normal portion and honestly, w/other random house noises like the heat running, I never hear my normal drives.  Those 4 drives in my external are all 5400rpm.  Of course, I think they're all 32MB cache too heh.

post #160 of 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanMc View Post

[...] this means in future you only need an IO screen of relevant active resolution to run just about anything this interface world will have to offer live on demand pretty much anywhere anytime.

 

I don't know that I'm looking forward to trying to run an After Effects session online. The requirements of the minority Pro community dramatically exceed those of the majority consumer community. What's good enough for the living room is NOT necessarily sufficient for content creation and creative. THAT'S why pros are annoyed by the dumbing down of the Mac line.

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