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Sales of Google's Nexus 7 tablet approach 1 million per month - Page 2

post #41 of 113
and you believe anything Google says you are a I%@$#$, Google is the FOX news of the hi tech industry
post #42 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post

and you believe anything Google says you are a I%@$#$, Google is the FOX news of the hi tech industry

Google isn't announcing how many they've sold. The quotes are coming from someone at ASUS according to the story.

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post #43 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post


Well when all you have going for you is market share of course that's your mantra. When you can't compete on quality, ease of use, customer satisfaction, developer interest, profit margins, etc. the number of widgets pumped out the factory door becomes your goal.
Amazon sells the Kindles at a loss supposedly and they reported a loss in their financial results. Google and Amazon's business models are to sell the "printer" at a loss and make money on the "ink." Hey, it worked for HP for awhile didn't it.? Apple's model is the exact opposite.
So yes, as long as Apple is selling product at a pace it can barely keep up with we fans should be pleased and not worry about market share. The tech world, however, lives and dies by market share. Selling more means it's the better product in their eyes, even if you lose money in the process.


Well, Amazon did lose money last quarter!

post #44 of 113
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Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

 

 

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I fixed that for ya...

 

 

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post #45 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger View Post

 

It is also interesting that Android enjoys a larger sales advantage in Europe, where the vaunted Apple ecosystem is far stronger.

 

Europe tends to be more price sensitive.

post #46 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Apple is undergoing some very clear shake ups and while they used to blow away their own conservative estimates and even the whisper numbers Wall Street could mutter, now they are barely meeting their own estimates.

 

 

 

Apple is already largely ceding majority marketshare to Android. Then the talk was that while a consortium of Android manufacturers was outselling Apple, Apple was still shipping more than every individual company. Now Samsung is outshipping Apple. Apple still has a strong hold in the countries where purchases are subsidized with expensive post-paid contracts. In areas of the world where this isn't true Apple is losing share.

 

Android competitors started off behind. Then they reached parity on hardware. Then they started to exceed Apple but we didn't mind waiting a few extra months to see what Apple would come up with next. We are now at a stage where Apple has just released all their pent up products and Google unleashes products that match or best Apple six days later. This isn't Spring as it has been the last couple years and we will wait until September (after first wondering what happened to July releases) to see what Apple will do to match the competition. Apple threw their best out there and it isn't going to be good enough.

 

Does this mean Apple dies? No. Does it mean Apple will automatically lose? No. Does it mean Apple won't sell anything? No.

 

A million units at $200-250 a unit is over $2 billion of revenue a month. Since when the hell did we start turning up our noses and ignoring competition only generating $2 billion in sales a month? Also it is only one competitor. Apple has to beat a dozen of them. Are we going to hear the same tired refrains? Yes but none of them ship more than Apple. Apple has majority share. Then Apple has minority majority share. Then finally Apple has a very large share and takes better profits. Then......

 

We shouldn't want until those final outcomes. Apple needs to step it up.

 

Google just refreshed this line. A 32 gig model WITH cellular radio is $30 cheaper than the baseline iPad mini. I understand Apple products are premium but the reality is the iPad line is more vunerable because there are no cell providers helping hid the true cost with confusing subsidized contracts. There are no cell companies stealing the price difference as profits. Right now as an example, a Samsung Galaxy S3 basically looks no different in cost to an iPhone 5 to U.S. consumers because the major cell providers charge $199 for each and sign both customers to 2 year contracts. They just pay Samsung less and keep more for themselves in profits or they may even be using those cheaper phones to help subsidize what they have to pay Apple for the iPhone.

 

The point is the contracts are a form of hidden credit and distort the prices within the market. When those distortions sort out, Apple could be hurting. Likewise since there is no subsidy model for the iPad, Apple could have a much harder time and cede marketshare that much faster.

Apple doesn't care too much about market share. It still has the lion's share on the profit pie. The no subsidy issue really caused problems for the iPad, they only sold 100 MM of them.

post #47 of 113

"Massive company sells cheap technological item, people buy it" - Not a story.

 

"Massive company sells cheap technological item, less than 1 million people buy it" - embarrassing story for whoever that company might be.

post #48 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

I'm a little sick of reading the same circular rationalizations around here about why Apple doesn't have to respond or worry about any other forces or competitors in the market.

Who made that statement?

I've never seen anyone say that Apple doesn't have to worry about or respond to other forces or competitors in the market. Please cite some examples.

What I have seen (numerous times) is a statement that Apple is not PRIMARILY driven by copying every move that the competition makes. If a competitor does something smart, Apple is more than willing to consider it. If the market goes in a certain direction, Apple responds (witness the iPad Mini and larger iPhone, for example). Apple has been primarily leading the market for the past decade rather than following it - but that's not the same as your claim that anyone is suggesting that they can totally ignore the market.
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post #49 of 113
I have several thoughts about this news. First, I am amazed that Apple competing companies are willing to make such low margin products in order to make sales. Because the margin is so low are they paying the workers as much as Apple contractor Foxconn or even lower? Second, these manufacturers create jobs for doing this. Lastly, if we keep the history of Apple competition with PC manufacturers in mind. Apple should not be misled by this competition. Apple's failure in PC is not due to competition. It is due to Apple not able to sell Macs to people that are able to afford Macs. iPhones and iPads are better than the Android devices. It has established very good sales channels after Steve Jobs returned. Apple only need to keep its devices better.
post #50 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

I'm a little sick of reading the same circular rationalizations around here about why Apple doesn't have to respond or worry about any other forces or competitors in the market.

 

 

Oh, but Apple does respond. Apple's response does not, however, fall into the trap of merely being spec- or low price-oneupmanship. Apple defines itself by delivering a better product, not more megahertzes for less cash. So Apple chases the customer instead of chasing the competition. They balance the need for profits with the need for market share. But don't construe that as "not responding or worrying about other competitors in the market."

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post #51 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac-user View Post

sold products or shipped into the channels?


Agree. Remember all the Samsung numbers that were reported as sold? The number reported during the court trial were much much lower.

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post #52 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

A million units at $200-250 a unit is over $2 billion of revenue a month. Since when the hell did we start turning up our noses and ignoring competition only generating $2 billion in sales a month? Also it is only one competitor. Apple has to beat a dozen of them. Are we going to hear the same tired refrains? Yes but none of them ship more than Apple. Apple has majority share. Then Apple has minority majority share. Then finally Apple has a very large share and takes better profits. Then......

 

How does a million units at $200-250 a unit result in over $2 billion of revenue a month? Sounds like a little over $200 million a month which really is not all that much to Apple. But nice try ... 

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post #53 of 113

So wait... As we approach the Holidays, sales of other tablets are increasing!? Well, duh! Did these people forget how well the Kindle Fire sold over the Holidays and then saw a dramatic decrease (fell off a cliff) of sales in the following quarter?

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post #54 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowdog65 View Post

Quote:

 

Not for long. I bet the Mini takes a huge bite out of this (and every other tablet sales).

 

Any guess on Mini first week sales? 5 Million?

 

I somewhat agree on this. There were reports that sales of the Nexus and Fire jumped immediately after Apple introduced the iPad mini. Of course this spike will level out as I'm sure most of those sales went to cheapskates who were only interested in the mini if it was priced as cheap as the others.

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post #55 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

I think people get this wrong.  Android tablets are comparing themselves to the ipad, but the real threat is the windows tablets. 

Apple fans are going to continu to buy into Apple because Apple has an extremely high retention ratio, but the Android and Windows buyers are all the same. If windows surface takes off, Android is going to be the one suffering from it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

I was thinking the same thing. Plus how many were returned.
Interesting that 2.5-3 million in 3 months is of note for this device when Apple probably did that in ship to home preorders.
I would love to see a device what really competes with the iPads because that has benefits for Apple but yet again this doesn't seem like it did it. Not even close

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

The comparisons, be it by themselves or the media, are because the iPad is seen as the target.
But I have to agree with you that at least for the month no one item has a snowballs change in hades and they should be trying to be the best 'other' in the market before going after the currently untouchable winner

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Well when all you have going for you is market share of course that's your mantra. When you can't compete on quality, ease of use, customer satisfaction, developer interest, profit margins, etc. the number of widgets pumped out the factory door becomes your goal.
Amazon sells the Kindles at a loss supposedly and they reported a loss in their financial results. Google and Amazon's business models are to sell the "printer" at a loss and make money on the "ink." Hey, it worked for HP for awhile didn't it.? Apple's model is the exact opposite.
So yes, as long as Apple is selling product at a pace it can barely keep up with we fans should be pleased and not worry about market share. The tech world, however, lives and dies by market share. Selling more means it's the better product in their eyes, even if you lose money in the process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Who made that statement?
I've never seen anyone say that Apple doesn't have to worry about or respond to other forces or competitors in the market. Please cite some examples.
What I have seen (numerous times) is a statement that Apple is not PRIMARILY driven by copying every move that the competition makes. If a competitor does something smart, Apple is more than willing to consider it. If the market goes in a certain direction, Apple responds (witness the iPad Mini and larger iPhone, for example). Apple has been primarily leading the market for the past decade rather than following it - but that's not the same as your claim that anyone is suggesting that they can totally ignore the market.

You must not have read this thread...or any other thread that talks about Apple's competitors.
post #56 of 113

Anyone can ship 1 million units...how many were sold..

post #57 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Apple doesn't care too much about market share. It still has the lion's share on the profit pie. The no subsidy issue really caused problems for the iPad, they only sold 100 MM of them.

 

Thanks for being the example.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

I'm a little sick of reading the same circular rationalizations around here about why Apple doesn't have to respond or worry about any other forces or competitors in the market.

Who made that statement?

I've never seen anyone say that Apple doesn't have to worry about or respond to other forces or competitors in the market. Please cite some examples.

What I have seen (numerous times) is a statement that Apple is not PRIMARILY driven by copying every move that the competition makes. If a competitor does something smart, Apple is more than willing to consider it. If the market goes in a certain direction, Apple responds (witness the iPad Mini and larger iPhone, for example). Apple has been primarily leading the market for the past decade rather than following it - but that's not the same as your claim that anyone is suggesting that they can totally ignore the market.

 

See above. No one has said Apple has to copy. Apple DOES have to respond though. No one is above that. I wouldn't say Apple has been leading the last two years. I would say they started at parity at that point and 12 months later had fallen behind but people didn't mind waiting. Now two years later, they are clearly behind. The stock just plunged below $600. They've just tossed out a couple of execs. People cannot cite past success and simply suggest that the future will be the same trend.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by baeder View Post

How does a million units at $200-250 a unit result in over $2 billion of revenue a month? Sounds like a little over $200 million a month which really is not all that much to Apple. But nice try ... 

 

I had a brain fart. I was reading an article where Android had 40% of the tablet market and Apple now has 60%. I was talking aobut the dozen competitors and something got jumped. Sorry and good catch.

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post #58 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanl View Post
 Either way complaining about shipped vs sold doesn't get you very far.

It's not about "complaining", it's about significance and relevance...neither of which can be clearly defined unless one knows how many were SOLD.  But yes, if assumptions like sell through or % returned can be made, then you at least have a basis.

post #59 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

I wouldn't say Apple has been leading the last two years. I would say they started at parity at that point and 12 months later had fallen behind but people didn't mind waiting. Now two years later, they are clearly behind. The stock just plunged below $600. They've just tossed out a couple of execs. People cannot cite past success and simply suggest that the future will be the same trend.

 

Leadership in what sense, exactly?

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post #60 of 113

I call b.s.  Though I'm sure it's selling well, anyone can say they're selling a million of this or a million of that if no one's checking and if they don't actually publish numbers.  Me, I have over a million friends!  I just don't feel like naming them all, however.  See how that works?

post #61 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplication View Post

Pricing the ipad mini lower would not make any difference at this time.  When you sell all you can make just as quickly as you make them, why price it cheaper?  You aren't going to sell any more because there aren't any more to sell.


Well, yes and no.

If Apple chose different build quality or different materials (i.e. cheaper build at $249 price point), then rate of manufacturing could have definitely increased.

 

Related to this, I contend that there are current supply chain and QC issues which makes it difficult to increase manufacturing, making it even less possible to reduce price point to the $299 "sweet spot".  Many have refuted this sweet spot saying it's against Apple culture to build to a specific price point, but I stand by it (this time)...Apple just couldn't make it happen.

 

But yah, I totally agree that supply/demand largely dictates and with the current product, the $329 price is justified.

post #62 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Thanks for being the example.

How does "Apple doesn't care too much about market share. It still has the lion's share on the profit pie. The no subsidy issue really caused problems for the iPad, they only sold 100 MM of them." support your claim that Apple thinks it can ignore the market and doesn't have to respond? It doesn't. In fact, Apple's huge profit share suggests that they're very precisely in tune with the portion of the market that they want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

See above. No one has said Apple has to copy. Apple DOES have to respond though. No one is above that. I wouldn't say Apple has been leading the last two years. I would say they started at parity at that point and 12 months later had fallen behind but people didn't mind waiting. Now two years later, they are clearly behind. The stock just plunged below $600. They've just tossed out a couple of execs. People cannot cite past success and simply suggest that the future will be the same trend.

Since your quote above doesn't say anything like that, I'm still waiting for you to show where anyone said that Apple doesn't worry about the market or doesn't have to respond to the market. In reality, they clearly HAVE responded to the market (larger iPhone, smaller iPad, etc). Your argument is completely false.
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post #63 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


How does "Apple doesn't care too much about market share. It still has the lion's share on the profit pie. The no subsidy issue really caused problems for the iPad, they only sold 100 MM of them." support your claim that Apple thinks it can ignore the market and doesn't have to respond? It doesn't. In fact, Apple's huge profit share suggests that they're very precisely in tune with the portion of the market that they want.
Since your quote above doesn't say anything like that, I'm still waiting for you to show where anyone said that Apple doesn't worry about the market or doesn't have to respond to the market. In reality, they clearly HAVE responded to the market (larger iPhone, smaller iPad, etc). Your argument is completely false.

Please see my post above for several examples within this very thread.

post #64 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

 

A million units at $200-250 a unit is over $2 billion of revenue a month. Since when the hell did we start turning up our noses and ignoring competition only generating $2 billion in sales a month?

Check your math, buddy.

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post #65 of 113
I guess no one is going to comment on how ridiculous the wording is.

"Approaching 1 M per month" is meaningless. If they used to sell 10 per month and now sell 20 per month, they're approaching 1 M.

Obviously, their numbers are nowhere near that low, but it's a meaningless fluff phrase. Why is everyone in Android-land so eager to hide their actual sales figures?
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post #66 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

I guess no one is going to comment on how ridiculous the wording is.
"Approaching 1 M per month" is meaningless. If they used to sell 10 per month and now sell 20 per month, they're approaching 1 M.
Obviously, their numbers are nowhere near that low, but it's a meaningless fluff phrase. Why is everyone in Android-land so eager to hide their actual sales figures?

 



They are doing this to fool the consumers.  Like Amazon. 

post #67 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

 

I somewhat agree on this. There were reports that sales of the Nexus and Fire jumped immediately after Apple introduced the iPad mini. Of course this spike will level out as I'm sure most of those sales went to cheapskates who were only interested in the mini if it was priced as cheap as the others.

 

This sales jumping is misleading I think. Did anyone say say that sales were dipping weeks before the iPad announcement? How many would be tablet buyers would be waiting to see what Apple announces before making a purchase? Surely sales would dipped because of anticipation, and then 'jump'  afterward. There's just not enough data here to make sense of it. I'm one of those guys specifically in that boat. I won't be use a tablet heavily, but I'm going to wait to have a first hand experience on the mini before making a decision, otherwise I may have already bought a nexus7.

 

Sames goes for S3 sales 'jumping' after the iPhone 5 announcement. It may very well have, but the statement in itself doesn't say much but provokes a reaction

post #68 of 113

I don't get it. They lie about their sales in the first place, so why not just lie and say, "We've topped 1 million per month"? 

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post #69 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac-user View Post

sold products or shipped into the channels?

You know, Apple also defines goods 'sold' as being the same as 'shipped' to resellers...  It's in the fine print of their quarterly statements if you actually take the time to look.  

post #70 of 113
So 1 million people a month are buying a 200 coaster! Ooo lala big spenders 1wink.gif at least the plastic back will keep the heat of your coffee from leaving a ring on your table while you surf on your iPad bahahah
post #71 of 113
Microsoft and Android are direct competitors. I can foresee MS chipping away at Google's share of the tablet market. But not really so much of Apple's. To be honest, Apple is such a polarizing company that people either want an iPad or they want an iPad alternative. Thats about it.
post #72 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

I guess no one is going to comment on how ridiculous the wording is.
"Approaching 1 M per month" is meaningless. If they used to sell 10 per month and now sell 20 per month, they're approaching 1 M.
Obviously, their numbers are nowhere near that low, but it's a meaningless fluff phrase. Why is everyone in Android-land so eager to hide their actual sales figures?

Nice subject change.  But I do agree that specificity would go a long way.

post #73 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by HyteProsector View Post

Microsoft and Android are direct competitors. I can foresee MS chipping away at Google's share of the tablet market. But not really so much of Apple's. To be honest, Apple is such a polarizing company that people either want an iPad or they want an iPad alternative. Thats about it.

 

Saying "to be honest" doesn't make something the truth. Just "truthy." Thats about it.

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post #74 of 113
The Android ecosystem is now getting much bigger, with Samsung selling twice as many smartphones as Apple selling iPhones. Factor in all the other smartphone makers, the Android ecosystem is bigger.
The iPad mini is just a defensive move to slow the Android expansion.
post #75 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by vqro View Post

I call b.s.  Though I'm sure it's selling well, anyone can say they're selling a million of this or a million of that if no one's checking and if they don't actually publish numbers.  Me, I have over a million friends!  I just don't feel like naming them all, however.  See how that works?

That's just about it.

 

I have no idea why AI continues to publish stories about such drivel. These people can (and do) say anything. No one other than Apple puts out any actual sales numbers. There is only one possible reason for it: they couldn't bear to reveal the truth.


Edited by anantksundaram - 10/31/12 at 1:55pm
post #76 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeb85 View Post

You know, Apple also defines goods 'sold' as being the same as 'shipped' to resellers...  It's in the fine print of their quarterly statements if you actually take the time to look.  

And, if you actually know anything about quarterly financials and CEO/CFO conf calls around them, you would know that, with the additional channel information Apple always provides, you can come up with a fairly precise number for 'sold.'

 

Since your tone suggests that you must know, I won't bother to tell you....

post #77 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

That's just about it.

 

I have no idea why AI continues to publish stories about such drivel. These people can (and do) say anything. No one other than Apple puts out any actual sales numbers. There is only one possible reason for it: they couldn't bear to reveal the truth.

 

Homerism at it's finest.  Only Apple tells the truf.

post #78 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Please see my post above for several examples within this very thread.

Not a single one of them says what you are claiming.

Apple obviously is concerned about what the competition does. They even respond when appropriate. They are very concerned about the market - even though they are generally the leaders.

The quotes you provided say that Apple doesn't worry much about market share. That's not the same thing at all. Apple strives to make high quality, innovative, reliable products and believes that the market share will take care of itself. Specifically, they've made it clear through their actions that they'd rather have a good market share at great margins than have a great market share at low margins. If they are driven by ANY financial metric, it is profits, not share. But, in the end, it doesn't matter. Even if were true that Apple doesn't care about market share, that's not the same as your claim that people were saying that Apple doesn't worry about the competition or the market. Two entirely different concepts.
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post #79 of 113
Originally Posted by muffinman View Post
Homerism at it's finest.  Only Apple tells the truf.

 

Well, since Samsung has been proven to not tell the truth and Google's numbers suggest they can't be… 

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post #80 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter236 View Post

The Android ecosystem is now getting much bigger, with Samsung selling twice as many smartphones as Apple selling iPhones. Factor in all the other smartphone makers, the Android ecosystem is bigger.
The iPad mini is just a defensive move to slow the Android expansion.

I really don't think unit sales automatically equals "bigger" ecosystem. I don't think there are many true tablet apps for android even now.
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