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Google's Eric Schmidt says Android 'clearly' winning against Apple in phones - Page 4

post #121 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry 3 Dogg View Post

From Google's shareholder's perspective Android is a total waste of money as they make more return from each iPhone than from each Android phone.
So for Google's shareholders, iOS is the clear winner.
Perhaps Eric Schmidt would be better to focus on his shareholders interests, rather that absurd comparisons between an OS that is so poor that he has to give it away, and one that drives the profits of a company worth well over twice as much as his advertising agency. Even now.

Did you just make that up for dramatic effect, or have you seen reports of significant shareholder complaints about Android? Serious question as I've not seen them. Maybe Google shareholders really do think Android is a wasted effort. Perhaps not. I don't hold a stake in any tech company.

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post #122 of 198
I completely agree. Well said! Well said!!
post #123 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Brother 84 View Post

Yes, is there not an irony in the fact that a big US corporation is fueling the success of a foreign competitor at the expense of another US corporation?


This is the most myopic clueless response I've read today. Apple, Samsung, and Google all have a significant presence both within and outside the US. You may as well get used to the idea that multi-national corporations view themselves as sovereign entities.

post #124 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Wh… wh… wh… You're saying this without sarcasm. You're literally saying this without sarcasm.

Not ten years ago, Microsoft had 97% of all marketshare. In less than ten years, they've lost 27% marketshare. And you're pretending that they have nothing to worry about? 

I seriously don't know why I'm surprised that you're saying this, but I am. I guess I have more faith in you than I should.

You apparently think market share matters in certain circumstances but not in others. I remember a thread here about RIM being doomed here when it's marketshare fell below the iPhone. The importance of market share changes depending on who is achieving it. Platform market share matters...... But...
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Yeah, but the data they are using is PRE-iPhone 5 sales.  IPhone 5 STILL hasn't landed in China yet.  So far, in the US, the numbers are vastly different, based on the latest information, iPhone is more like 30% and growing.  These guys are just using last quarter's data and just milking it to get attention.

Eric Schmidt is a dick.

Except for the ad hominem that's correct. It was last quarters numbers not installed base. Apple will double share this quarter at least.
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post #125 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Apple are still selling more iPhones than they were before, at a level of marketshare well beyond Steve Job's wildest hopes at launch where he proposed 1-2% as a target.

Android is roughly where Nokia was, pre-iPhone, that dominant market share has worked out well for Nokia since 2006.
This is the missing view! Microsoft also sees the writing on the wall too.
post #126 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevt View Post

It's perverse this "ah, but Apple makes the largest profit" line. This will have shareholders cheering, but Apple charging a lot and screwing me (the customer) out of more money is not something I want to celebrate. 

How does Apple charge more and screw the customer on iPhones?

post #127 of 198
The market share analysis put out there is completely irrelevant and I have to believe market analysts and stock holders recognize that as well. Look at the bigger picture. Subsidies of Apple products is much higher than Android phones. Sure, they cost the same to the user ($199), but the cost that goes to Apple or Google is much different by a hundred or so dollars. Selling 9 million phones at $100 vs 3 million at $300 is still the same income even though market share is much more. Market share alone is irrelevant. Add in the app store income generated by Android Market vs App Store is even more favorable towards Apple. Add in the iPad market share and Apple is most likely making more money per device than Google.

As to Google being the Microsoft vs Apple battle? Not a chance. Although both Google and Microsoft get by primarily by selling the software and OS to partners and make very little off the hardware themselves, Google does not make a huge profit on the actual OS, especially when it is open source. Microsoft used to charge PC makers hundreds to use their OS and it was the only option. Amazon, Nook, etc all utilize the Android OS, but they build most of it themselves and have their own markets bypassing Google almost entirely. Google's business model is still ads and in a much lesser extent the Android Market.

As a result, I'm fairly certain that if we are purely talking monetary value, Apple is light years ahead of Google iOS compared to Android. At the end of the day, monetary value is all that matters, especially to investors and Apple.
post #128 of 198
Yeah but the threads about market share, not profit share.
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post #129 of 198
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post
Yeah but the threads about market share, not profit share.

 

The thread is about a man that believes his company is "winning". A man whose publicly-traded company is making orders of magnitude less money than the company that is "losing".

post #130 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

The thread is about a man that believes his company is "winning". A man whose publicly-traded company is making orders of magnitude less money than the company that is "losing".

But his definition is market share. Which is hardly that far out there, even if the stats were skewed by a weak iPhone quarter.

Apple can't go to 10%. The good news is - all things being equal like the US market where higher iPhone subsidies make things equal - the iPhone can compete with a much higher share.
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post #131 of 198
Define "winning".
post #132 of 198
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post
But his definition is market share.

 

All right, I—personally, on my own, individually—am winning in the cell phone market because I have the best ___________. See? 

 

But there is an objective "winning" that I don't think he's covering. 


Apple can't go to 10%

 

Of what?

post #133 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunks View Post

Define "winning".

Whatever metric makes you look good.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #134 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

The thread is about a man that believes his company is "winning". A man whose publicly-traded company is making orders of magnitude less money than the company that is "losing".

it's not even a comparison of which mobile platform is making more money. I have no doubt that Google is still very far in the hole with their mobile sector. Motorola was $12.5 billion by itself.

If we look at ads on mobile platforms iOS would appear to still be far ahead of Android and all other mobile OSes at generating revenue for Google.

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post #135 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Unfortunately, a lot of that "winning" includes utter garbage that are passed off as phones. 

If the indictor of success is marketshare due to Universal Licensing, whereby any OEM that can slam together a box is allowed to run Android, then Google can KEEP the crown. That sort of "winning" is no place for Apple. 

Haha... so true.

That's like basing your restaurant's success on how many meals you sell.... but 50% of the meals make your customers sick... 1biggrin.gif

Sure... Android has the most marketshare... but how come no one ever talks about all the crappy Android phones out there?

Shouldn't those weigh against Android in some way?
post #136 of 198
Claiming victory is a bit silly, my understanding, Google pays handset makers to put Android on their devices, sure you can get market share that way. Giving something away is a fear based decision, the hour glass has turned over and desktop search is in decline.
post #137 of 198

What is this Schmidt?

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #138 of 198
OMG it's the cola wars all over again! Millions died and suffered needlessly!

/s

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #139 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

As long as Apple has a strong ecosystem in terms of a large number of all the popular apps and tons of accessories there is no reason to worry if Android controls 70% or even 90% of the market. Like others have stated Apple is still making the big $$$. All Apple needs to do is to be considered a viable alternative.

Exactly.

How long has the Mac been in 2nd place to DOS/Windows machines... almost 30 years? Did Apple ever quit because of that? No!!!

Having the most marketshare is a nice trophy to have... but Apple is one of the most successful companies in the world despite not having the most marketshare in certain areas.
post #140 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_b View Post

I know several people that have switched from regular mobile phones or Blackberry's to Android. All of them have now switched to the iPhone.

 

Three months ago I handed in my parking pass and started taking the train to work. I remember the first day clearly because it was like a scene from a comedy movie. Almost everyone had her or his nose buried in a smartphone, which was amusing enough, and ALL but one or two were iPhones.

 

Now, a scant few months later, I see as many giant phones with enormous screens as I do iPhones. I don't know what these big devices are, but they're not big enough to be iPad Minis so I'm guessing they must be Android phones. I only see an iPhone 5 once every couple days.

 

Whatever *WE* may think of iOS vs. Android, there seems to be at least some anecdotal evidence that people are moving from the former to the latter. Decidedly unscientific and obviously geographically restricted, but if my living depended on the sale of iPhones, it would certainly get my attention.


Edited by v5v - 12/12/12 at 3:52pm
post #141 of 198

Both Ford and Honda sell more cars than Mercedes and BMW, but which duo is better engineered and higher quality?

 

Android is on up to 100 phones (http://www.android.com/devices/), Apple iOS is on 1 phone per year (right now 3 in total for sale) - it's utterly ridiculous to compare the two OS' how Schmidt is.

post #142 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstrosity View Post

At the end of the day, Google and Apple are not really competitors. Both have entirely different markets which they address. Microsoft and Google however DO compete for the same type of user (total morons).

There are plenty of morons with iPhones, just look at what happened in Australia.
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post #143 of 198

This year, more than 130 million bicycles* will be produced vs 60 million cars†. 

 

* http://www.worldometers.info/bicycles/

† http://www.worldometers.info/cars/

post #144 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

If you cheat off of someone at university, you get expelled.
If you cheat off of someone in the corporate world, you get people defending their actions and questioning why others want them to go bankrupt.

Seems strange. Maybe we should be giving automatic A's to people that cheat in college.

Cheating is rampant everywhere, watch the documentary Bigger, Stronger, Faster. I'm not saying it's right just that it's done in places you'd never imagine.
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post #145 of 198

Google is right in that Android is winning.

 

First of all you must define winning. For Apple winning means selling phones and making a big profit on the phone. They do that and they do it well.

 

For Google, and hence Android, winning means distribution which leads to more Google search boxes and of course more profits for Google. Remember that every Android phone comes with a Google search box. The more phones, the more search boxes and the more searches. Ultimately that directly leads to more money for Google. That to them is winning.

 

Furthermore, people search more often than they buy a phone. You make one purchase every two years for a new iphone, but probably makes thousands of Google searches on the phone over the same two years. Figure it out!

 

And yes I am an Apple fan. I have a Mac!

post #146 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac123 View Post

Google is right in that Android is winning.

First of all you must define winning. For Apple winning means selling phones and making a big profit on the phone. They do that and they do it well.

For Google, and hence Android, winning means distribution which leads to more Google search boxes and of course more profits for Google. Remember that every Android phone comes with a Google search box. The more phones, the more search boxes and the more searches. Ultimately that directly leads to more money for Google. That to them is winning.

Furthermore, people search more often than they buy a phone. You make one purchase every two years for a new iphone, but probably makes thousands of Google searches on the phone over the same two years. Figure it out!

And yes I am an Apple fan. I have a Mac!

1) Saying you're an Apple fan or owning some Apple product in no way validates your comment.

2) it's been shown every quarter that Google makes more money from iOS devices than all other mobile devices combines so I'm not sure how Google is winning if they make more from Apple with ad revenue and are still down many billions in their mobile division efforts. MS makes more from Android than Google does.

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post #147 of 198

I worked for Eric Schmidt at Sun Microsystems. Great Guy. Very smart and talented for an executive. That said, I use both Android 4.21 and iOS 6.0.1 everyday. While users can have more control over Android, the apps, tight integration and easy of use on iOS is much, much better. I tend to have fun on my Android devices like the Nexus 7 - I really use my iPhone and iPad for business and real serious / stable work and integration with PC and Macs. 

post #148 of 198

I worked for Eric Schmidt at Sun Microsystems. Great Guy. Very smart and talented for an executive. That said, I use both Android 4.21 and iOS 6.0.1 everyday. While users can have more control over Android, the apps, tight integration and easy of use on iOS is much, much better. I tend to have fun on my Android devices like the Nexus 7 - I really use my iPhone and iPad for business and real serious / stable work and integration with PC and Macs. 

post #149 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

Apple has not proved they are the exception yet. Steve has not been with us for only a year.

So... Apple is presumed to go out of business unless they don't go out of business? I think that criteria has already been met.

You can't state a condition that can never be satisfied, i.e. "Apple has not proven they will not go out of business" which is the same as saying, "Apple has not proven they will never go out of business."

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post #150 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

1) Saying you're an Apple fan or owning some Apple product in no way validates your comment.

They hope it improves their chances of being taken seriously. It doesn't. Pervasive "concern trolling" on the Internet has pretty much nullified the effectiveness of claiming allegiance to a particular side of an argument when attempting to argue against that side.

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post #151 of 198

If success is viewed in terms of profits only then there is cause for concern.

 

What happens when Android ships on the majority of smartphones?

- developers will jump ship and start developing first on Android. 

- iOS will be less relevant and the ecosystem of apps will be less vibrant and interesting for buyers

 

Right now, the quality and selection of apps is a huge argument for purchasing an iPhone. If this goes then what is left?

Design? Tight integration? Google is working hard on getting this right with their NEXUS line...it is just a matter of time.


Edited by replicant - 12/12/12 at 8:05pm
post #152 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

 

Unfortunately, the other search engines suck (I really wanted to like Bing, but could not bring myself to do it). Wait, maybe Apple can invest its $120Bn in developing Apple Search!

 

 

That's the thing: for a search engine to improve, it needs to collect user data. More users, better results.

Google has a clear advantage and it is hard to see how anyone can compete with Google Search, Google Maps, etc...

post #153 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

... 2) it's been shown every quarter that Google makes more money from iOS devices than all other mobile devices combines so I'm not sure how Google is winning if they make more from Apple with ad revenue and are still down many billions in their mobile division efforts. MS makes more from Android than Google does.

 

It is pretty ridiculous.

 

Wouldn't it be great if the "journalists" doing these interviews had the intelligence and courage to call them on their bullshit and ask questions about even half of the issues that have been raised here. Or even question the hypocrisy of "open" at Google. But, no, the just publish this stuff as though it actually makes sense. Not really even an interview. More like, come on over and say whatever you want and we'll print it without question.

 


But, as pointed out earlier, Eric Schmidt and Larry Page say this kind of stuff in every interview they do, make wild predictions about this or that and it never pans out the way they said it would be. A couple years ago, it was, "Everyone is moving to Web apps." Didn't happen, not going to happen. Google TV. Android first. A string of what they obviously intend to be self-fulfilling prophecies, but no one is really listening, which is significant in itself.
post #154 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by replicant View Post

If success is viewed in terms of profits only then there is cause for concern.

 

What happens when Android ships on the majority of smartphones?

- developers will jump ship and start developing first on Android. 

 

 

Despite the number of activations, most of the purchasing of applications is being done on iOS devices. Why would they leave the where the money is to be made?

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post #155 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

Hey Eric Schmidt, actor Charlie Sheen was "Winning" also, still it didn't stop people from looking at his actions and thinking he was a kook and notice how you don't hear too much about Charlie Sheen anymore, whether on purpose or not!  

 

WINNING!...  1rolleyes.gif

/

/

/

 

I get your point, but I don't think the Charlie Sheen comparison works here.  He got a $100 million settlement from CBS for his firing.  I would call that winning.

post #156 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post



2) it's been shown every quarter that Google makes more money from iOS devices than all other mobile devices combines so I'm not sure how Google is winning if they make more from Apple with ad revenue and are still down many billions in their mobile division efforts. MS makes more from Android than Google does.

Maybe that's why they're going to charge small businesses for the use of their online docs services?

 

http://www.theage.com.au/small-business/smallbiz-tech/google-to-charge-small-firms-for-webbased-apps-software-20121212-2b922.html

 

The thin edge of the wedge, no doubt, as they try to open up more revenue streams.

 

Or perhaps it's why they try to avoid paying taxes:

 

Google chairman Eric Schmidt has defended the company's tax policies, saying of the internet giant's moves to get out of paying billions of dollars: "It's called capitalism".

 

http://www.theage.com.au/business/world-business/google-on-tax-schemes--its-called-capitalism-20121213-2batw.html

 

But we know the uproar that happens when there's a story about Apple minimising it's tax burden, don't we?
 

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post #157 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

We don't have a problem with competition. We just want the competition to stop stealing. Pepsi didn't steal coke's formula. BK didn't steal McDs secret sauce.

Please tell me how did google steal from apple. An example would be great and an FYI android did look like a Blackberry clone then when the market began to want a touch screen device then it took the shape of a touch screen device. (They adapted to the market) they did not copy from apple making it a touch-centric OS. The over over all feel to the device was still like a blackberry adapted to touch. Home screen with an app drawer with your apps in it rather then a home screen full of apps.
post #158 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple v. Samsung View Post


then when the market began to want a touch screen device then it took the shape of a touch screen device. (They adapted to the market)

 

Ahh, that's what it's called... (my emphases)

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post #159 of 198
Jawohl, Eric*. Anything you say, Eric. Let's see another salute, Eric.

* Eric Schmidt
Edited by AlexN - 12/13/12 at 3:18am
post #160 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSteelers View Post

 

I get your point, but I don't think the Charlie Sheen comparison works here.  He got a $100 million settlement from CBS for his firing.  I would call that winning.

 

Not really a settlement as it's simply what he was already owed, nothing more. CBS simply stopped payments to him.

He gets $25 million which was already owed to him and the rest will be residuals for reruns.

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