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ITC judge clears Apple, Intel, HP of patent infringement allegations

post #1 of 30
Thread Starter 
A U.S. International Trade Commission judge on Friday ruled in favor of defendants Apple, Intel and HP in a case pertaining to processor patent technology asserted by X2Y Attenuators LLC, a small technology firm.

In his ruling, ITC Administrative Law Judge David Shaw not only cleared the three companies of any wrongdoing, but determined the patents asserted by X2Y to be invalid, reports The Wall Street Journal.

The Erie, Pa., company first filed the complaint in June 2011, seeking an import ban over Intel's alleged infringement of three energy conditioning patents. Machines specifically cited in the initial claim were Apple's 27-inch Core i3 iMac and HP's TouchSmart 610 Series PC, while Intel's Core i7-950 3.06Ghz LGA1366 Desktop Processor was also named.

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In response to the allegations, members of Congress sent letters to the ITC in support of Intel, urging the Commission to not to issue an import ban.

From an X2Y statement regarding the letters:

Intel did not take a license, but appears to have adopted X2Y?s technology anyway. X2Y is willing, and has always been willing, to provide Intel with a license at a reasonable rate similar to that paid by its other licensees for their manufacture and use of X2Y technology.


From what can be gathered from X2Y's website, the company does not manufacture hardware, but instead licenses its technology to OEMs and parts makers.

As for Friday's judgment, Intel spokesman Chuck Mulloy said Apple and HP are now indemnified.

"Needless to say we are gratified with this result," he said. "We said all along that we don't believe our products infringe and we questioned the validity of the patents."

The law firm representing X2Y, Alston & Bird LLP, disagrees with the ALJ's ruling and said it will request an official review.
post #2 of 30

Another troll gets butted off the bridge and into the stream...

post #3 of 30

Companies that frivolously sue for patent infringement should be made to pay legal fees and court costs of the sued companies, if they lose.  They'd think twice about suing.

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post #4 of 30

Funny you should mention it. There's a bill in Congress that would accomplish that.

http://blogs.findlaw.com/in_house/2012/08/patent-trolls-may-have-to-pay-litigation-costs-new-bill-says.html

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post #5 of 30
Patents. They only serve big business, it would seem?


A U.S. judge ruled in favor of US defendants Apple, Intel and HP in a case asserted by a small UK technology firm;

What a surprise. Waiting for all the people who bashed the British judge who required Apple to put a notice up on its website to come and bash the US judge. Oh, wait.

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post #6 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by sequitur View Post

Companies that frivolously sue for patent infringement should be made to pay legal fees and court costs of the sued companies, if they lose.  They'd think twice about suing.

Who decides what is frivolous? If it is frivolous every time a person loses, how will a small inventor ever have a chance of protecting his/her patent
against a multi-billion dollar transnational infringer?
post #7 of 30
Originally Posted by quinney View Post
Who decides what is frivolous? If it is frivolous every time a person loses, how will a small inventor ever have a chance of protecting his/her patent
against a multi-billion dollar transnational infringer?

 

If their patent is valid and actually being infringed, they have nothing to worry about.

 

I don't get it; if you're absolutely, objectively right, what would you ever have to fear (in any situation)?

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post #8 of 30
Patent suits, and the seemingly never-ending appeals, can be fought as battles of attrition. A big corporation is capable of bankrupting
an individual, even if the individual is in the right. And what about cases which are close calls? Does the more wealthy party always win,
just because of their wealth?
post #9 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightknight View Post

Patents. They only serve big business, it would seem?
A U.S. judge ruled in favor of US defendants Apple, Intel and HP in a case asserted by a small UK technology firm;
What a surprise. Waiting for all the people who bashed the British judge who required Apple to put a notice up on its website to come and bash the US judge. Oh, wait.

 

What kind on nonsense are you spewing?  Erie, PA is in the USA, not UK.

 

Are you trying to make some reference to another case?  If so, provide some links and some type of tie-in to how this is related to the topic of this thread. 

 

Oh wait..

post #10 of 30
Originally Posted by quinney View Post
Patent suits, and the seemingly never-ending appeals, can be fought as battles of attrition. A big corporation is capable of bankrupting
an individual, even if the individual is in the right. And what about cases which are close calls? Does the more wealthy party always win,
just because of their wealth?

 

Were I a lawyer and I knew for a fact that my client was right, I'd simply add whatever extra pay I'd need during a campaign to the winnings I knew he will get.

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post #11 of 30

Ah, I see you've graduated from a simple mod to an Admin! 

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post #12 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

If their patent is valid and actually being infringed, they have nothing to worry about.

I don't get it; if you're absolutely, objectively right, what would you ever have to fear (in any situation)?

Objectively right? If it were that easy, why would we need litigation? Procedural justice is always a matter of power and persuasion.

You make it seem as if courts always come up with the "objectively correct" verdict. You might just lose because the judge is having a bad day and doesn't like the look of you. Humans are animals, not computers.
post #13 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

Patent suits, and the seemingly never-ending appeals, can be fought as battles of attrition. A big corporation is capable of bankrupting

an individual, even if the individual is in the right. And what about cases which are close calls? Does the more wealthy party always win,

just because of their wealth?

Were I a lawyer and I knew for a fact that my client was right, I'd simply add whatever extra pay I'd need during a campaign to the winnings I knew he will get.

The outcomes of complex cases cannot be predicted the way you imply. The possibility of losing a case which is less than clear cut will dissuade the non-rich from even trying to defend themselves. This type of legislation will make inventing things an unattractive career choice, thereby reducing innovation.

Sorry, can't get quote looking right on iPad.
post #14 of 30
The ITC should be able to view a patent infringement claim before it gets to court, rendering a summery judgement based on a patents relevancy, not just an ambient claim made by a troll. If the claimant then wishes to take it to trial, they should then have to face paying costs if they lose. There should be no need for lawyers in the first instance. A lawyer will always tell you that you have a better chance of winning in trial. Because that's what they get paid for.
post #15 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightknight View Post

Patents. They only serve big business, it would seem?
A U.S. judge ruled in favor of US defendants Apple, Intel and HP in a case asserted by a small UK technology firm;
What a surprise. Waiting for all the people who bashed the British judge who required Apple to put a notice up on its website to come and bash the US judge. Oh, wait.

 

Certainly not. There are many instances of smaller inventors successfully asserting their patent rights against larger companies. However, the way this story is worded (and there is no telling whether or not it is accurate) it appears to be a political move. It would be very bad if genuine patent infringement cases against larger, more powerful and connected companies could be negated thanks to their political connections.

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post #16 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

If their patent is valid and actually being infringed, they have nothing to worry about.

 

I don't get it; if you're absolutely, objectively right, what would you ever have to fear (in any situation)?

 

Actually, the biggest concern of any small company or individual inventor as a patent holder is the possibility that they will be bankrupted by endless or costly courtroom assertion and legal enforcement of their patent rights. Lawyers are not cheap, but they are often essential. 

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post #17 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Ah, I see you've graduated from a simple mod to an Admin! 

How does one person manage your total vote count in such a short amount of time, especially on a technology site?

 

I can understand if this was purely a place to disseminate high school gossip, but seriously, you and a few others around here spend an awful lot of your life streaming every petty little thought you can muster on sites like AI.

post #18 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

How does one person manage your total vote count in such a short amount of time, especially on a technology site?

 

I can understand if this was purely a place to disseminate high school gossip, but seriously, you and a few others around here spend an awful lot of your life streaming every petty little thought you can muster on sites like AI.

...and there's nine more here posting even more often than me over the past 30 days. Great to see regular active forum members isn't it, particularly courteous and respectful ones.

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post #19 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

...and there's nine more here posting even more often than me over the past 30 days. Great to see regular active forum members isn't it, particularly courteous and respectful ones.

I couldn't find where you were finding the highest post count but I did stumble across the threads with the most replies. It's funny just how much Blu-ray v. HD-DVD was discussed.

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post #20 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


I couldn't find where you were finding the highest post count but I did stumble across the threads with the most replies

http://forums.appleinsider.com/pages/stats/top/range/1day/#members

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post #21 of 30

Thanks. TS has a ways to go to get to number one of all time but I think he'll do it.

I can't help wonder how many high level degrees I could have achieved in the time I've spent on this site.

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post #22 of 30
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
Thanks. TS has a ways to go to get to number one of all time but I think he'll do it.

 

I'd add both of your post counts together in any determination thereof, FYI. 1wink.gif


I can't help wonder how many high level degrees I could have achieved in the time I've spent on this site.

 

Still think you should've just laughed in their faces instead of resetting. Not exactly the politest thing to do, but where do they get off with that, anyway? Believing a man pathetic because he has a passion for something? That's what was truly pathetic.

 

Sort of wish we had "levels", like on MacRumors, delineating post amounts with a special title. I always wanted to see Eidorian get enough posts that they had to add "Core Duo" to the list above "G5". lol.gif

 

Well, Huddler does have an interesting reputation system; it's just turned off here. Maybe we'll turn it on, but I don't want to clutter things up. More posts = higher reputation, and you get this little badge thing by your name in the sidebar. Additionally, more posts/higher reputation = greater weighting for giving reputation to others in the form of the post thumbs-ups. So new users thumbing someone up gives one point, while older users thumbing someone up gives…

 

1000

 

Interestingly, the system has negative rankings available, but I don't know how you'd go about actually giving someone a negative reputation…


Edited by Tallest Skil - 12/15/12 at 6:09pm

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post #23 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Still think you should've just laughed in their faces instead of resetting. Not exactly the politest thing to do, but where do they get off with that, anyway? Believing a man pathetic because he has a passion for something? That's what was truly pathetic.

It was really getting hard to find old comments I had made since Solipsism is a dictionary word. I had used that handle across many sites. I felt SolipsismX would help differentiate that in searches. If I wanted to completely start anew I would have used a completely new name and only told a few about it.


PS: I like the weight adjusted comments.
Edited by SolipsismX - 12/16/12 at 8:09am

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post #24 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
PS: I like the weight adjusted comments.

We used a similar "add to reputation" system over at TomTomforums back in the day. Some members, generally those with highest post counts, could add significantly more to another's reputation in the forum than others.

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post #25 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by msimpson View Post

 

What kind on nonsense are you spewing?  Erie, PA is in the USA, not UK.

 

Are you trying to make some reference to another case?  If so, provide some links and some type of tie-in to how this is related to the topic of this thread. 

 

Oh wait..


Of course. Obviously, a LLC (UK company, hence) is in the USA. That's why the ITC judge comes into play.

 

Maybe if I make it simple for you you'll understand: it's an international court, because it has two companies, in two countries, at odds.

I'm sure you get it now. Oh, wait.

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post #26 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

If their patent is valid and actually being infringed, they have nothing to worry about.

 

I don't get it; if you're absolutely, objectively right, what would you ever have to fear (in any situation)?

 

Being absolutely, objectively right doesn't mean you'll win. enough cases in the past to not trust the future on this. Also, why even bother with having a court of appeals if people can't be wrongly convicted/cases can't be wrongly decided?

 

Apart from that, the fact that YOU think you're absolutely right doesn't mean the judge will agree with you. And on top of that, there always is a human factor in a court decision.

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post #27 of 30

Being the little guy in America means just getting screwed over by the big boys. You can work hard, develop something and even patent it properly, but the corporations with the deep pockets can simply steal virtually anything they like. It's not a level playing field and hasn't been for decades.

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post #28 of 30

All:

 

(1) Only 2 of the 3 patents were found invalid.  The 500 patent was upheld.  So the article is  incorrect.

 

(2) This is not a patent troll.  X2Y actually researched and developed the patents themselves in the USA.  There are showings a plaintiff must make at the ITC which prevent trolls from asserting patents there.  X2Y met those requirements.

 

(3) These are hardware, not software patents.  So save the software patent rhetoric for a party that deserves it.

 

(4) No "clearing" has been done yet.  This is just an administrative judge finding--no final determination will be made by the ITC until 4 months from now.

post #29 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by sequitur View Post

Companies that frivolously sue for patent infringement should be made to pay legal fees and court costs of the sued companies, if they lose.  They'd think twice about suing.

 

 

The problem with that argument is not all patent lawsuits are frivolous where the Plaintiff loses. Further, the system you propose would go against the little guy who  probably can't afford to pay his attorney fees, much less the other sides. Moreover, the legal system often sides with the wrong party. In this case, X2Y holds patents for companies that actually do invent things, like Lucent. X2y also has companies paying a patent fee for the patents at issue. The suit likely wasn't frivolous.

 

Apple and HP never had to worry anyway, as Intel has an indemnification agreement that covers its customers (e.g. Apple) that get sued for using its products. I always thought companies like Samsung should push hard to support Windows Phone if not only because Microsoft does the same for those using its products.  

post #30 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

 

 

The problem with that argument is not all patent lawsuits are frivolous where the Plaintiff loses. Further, the system you propose would go against the little guy who  probably can't afford to pay his attorney fees, much less the other sides. Moreover, the legal system often sides with the wrong party. In this case, X2Y holds patents for companies that actually do invent things, like Lucent. X2y also has companies paying a patent fee for the patents at issue. The suit likely wasn't frivolous.

 

Apple and HP never had to worry anyway, as Intel has an indemnification agreement that covers its customers (e.g. Apple) that get sued for using its products. I always thought companies like Samsung should push hard to support Windows Phone if not only because Microsoft does the same for those using its products.  

Isn't Apple's indemnity limit $50? I thought that came out when some of the iOS developer's were sued by Lodsys.

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