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Jobs family yacht seized in Amsterdam over 3M euro dispute with designer

post #1 of 48
Thread Starter 
The mega yacht commissioned by late Apple co-founder Steve Jobs has reportedly been sequestered by lawyers for designer Philippe Starck in Amsterdam over a payment dispute.

The yacht was originally set to cost 150 million euros, but the Jobs family now reportedly claims that the actual cost was 105 million euros, according to Dutchnews.nl. The total cost of the ship determines the payment for Starck, who is due 6 percent of the cost price.

As a result, the heirs to the yacht allegedly believe Starck is due 6 million euros, while the designer himself has contested that his fee should be 9 million euros.



Bailiffs reportedly boarded the yacht, named "Venus," last week armed with a court order from Amsterdam. The ship is now said to be chained to the dock, and port authorities have been told the yacht cannot leave.

The Jobs family super yacht was first revealed in October. Jobs began designing Venus himself after returning from a cruise that traveled from Italy to Turkey.

The 80-meter-long ship is made completely of aluminum, with huge plate windows covering the wheelhouse, saloon and main deck entrances. The yacht relies on 27-inch iMacs for navigation, systems control and other seafaring software.

Starck himself outed the yacht earlier this year as a "revolutionary" project that he had been collaborating on with Jobs for seven years before he passed away. Starck said after Jobs' death, he began meeting with his wife, Laurene Powell Jobs, to finish the ship.
post #2 of 48
If you negotiate a percentage of the total cost, you have to accept that it might not be what you estimated.
post #3 of 48

Here come the "Apple is doomed" comments  1rolleyes.gif

post #4 of 48
Was it in writing? This is a significant amount of money.
post #5 of 48

I like the look of the hull of this ship, but the pagoda plopped down on top looks stupid.

post #6 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Was it in writing? This is a significant amount of money.

 

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2012/12/steve_jobs_yacht_sequestered_o.php

 

Quote:

"The FD asks whether the sequestration will last long. Jobs and Starck became very friendly during the building process and there is no formal contract. The paper says an out-of-court settlement is the likely outcome."

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post #7 of 48
"No formal contract."

Stark is as bad a business man as he is a designer.

My curiousity is how the hell they missed on costing by such a large margin. Was that Stark's goof as well? Or, did they just not bother to finish the ship since it isn't exactly seaworthy...

(Yes, I know his name isn't spelled Stark...)
post #8 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

Here come the "Apple is doomed" comments  1rolleyes.gif

 

"Jobs super yacht" doesn't even show up on Apple Maps.  This is ridiculous!! 

post #9 of 48
The super rich has such big problems, this makes me sad.
post #10 of 48
Steve Jobs should have had Jony Ive design the boat.
post #11 of 48

Apple stock price is down $10 on the news.  Or maybe it's because the world didn't end.

post #12 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_b View Post

Steve Jobs should have had Jony Ive design the boat.

Now that would have been subject to well justified outrage.  Using company resources (or distracting company resources) for personal glory/benefit.  So I'm glad he went Tony Stark instead. 

post #13 of 48
I dunno, 6m or 9m euro's... The poor guy must be struggling to keep shoes on his feet if it's only 6m he gets 1wink.gif
post #14 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_b View Post

Steve Jobs should have had Jony Ive design the boat.


But I'm glad it's PS suing Laurene, and not Jony Ive.

 

P.S. remind me to not hire him for anything.

post #15 of 48

Yachtgate!!!!!

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post #16 of 48
Hey AI, how about reporting on this instead? http://beta.fool.com/jaans/2012/12/21/apple-ipad-mini-screaming/19544/?ticker=AAPL&source=eogyholnk0000001

Estimates of 12M mini's sold this quarter and Intermedia reporting that Apple owns 92.6% of the small to medium-sized business market, with Android not even making a blip on the radar. Yeah yeah yeah I know the mini estimate is coming from DigiTimes but AI seems to report everything else from them so why not this?

Or how about Apple capturing a record 53% of the smartphone market in the US?
http://************/2012/12/21/report-iphone-captures-record-53-of-u-s-smartphone-market-for-the-first-time-as-android-drops-to-42/
Edited by Rogifan - 12/21/12 at 7:59am
post #17 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

Now that would have been subject to well justified outrage.  Using company resources (or distracting company resources) for personal glory/benefit.  So I'm glad he went Tony Stark instead. 

No, he actually went to Iron Man lol.gif

post #18 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider 
The yacht was originally set to cost 150 million euros, but the Jobs family now reportedly claims that the actual cost was 105 million euros, according to Dutchnews.nl. The total cost of the ship determines the payment for Starck, who is due 6 percent of the cost price.

As a result, the heirs to the yacht allegedly believe Starck is due 6 million euros, while the designer himself has contested that his fee should be 9 million euros.

If they were expecting it to cost 150m euros and actually saved 45m, an extra 3m doesn't seem that significant. Still, without a formal contract, maybe they can haggle him down to 5 euros. I'm guessing the Jobs family has already paid for the boat though so it's probably in their best interests to pay the extra.

I don't particularly like the style of the boat. It's quite a contrast between Apple's rounded corners and this squared off design. There aren't many examples of boats that aren't garish to look at so it will still stand amongst the better ones but it doesn't look like it's worth 105m euros. None of the yachts here look like they're worth what they cost either:

http://www.bornrich.com/entry/top-12-high-tech-luxury-yachts/

but I suppose the same goes for a movie blockbuster or video game.
post #19 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

"No formal contract."
Stark is as bad a business man as he is a designer.

Not necessarily. The issue doesn't seem to be the percent of payment which is what would have been the issue in the 'contract' but rather the costs. Those costs would have receipts etc backing them up. So the lack of a written document on the percent is moot since the heirs have acknowledged the same percent Starck gave

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post #20 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerryb View Post

The super rich has such big problems, this makes me sad.

It's all relative.

post #21 of 48

Quote from the article: "...the yacht, named "Venus,..."

 

English schoolboys in the '50/60s used to sing...

 

"Twas on the good ship Venus,

By God you should have seen us,

The figurehead was a pro* in bed,

And the mainmast was a penis."

 

* "pro" is English for a prostitute, or hooker on your side of the pond.

 

Can't remember any more verses... but I'm glad Starck stuck to his tried and tested modern-minimalistic design style for the yacht.
 

post #22 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotoformat View Post

Quote from the article: "...the yacht, named "Venus,..."

English schoolboys in the '50/60s used to sing...

"Twas on the good ship Venus,
By God you should have seen us,
The figurehead was a pro* in bed,
And the mainmast was a penis."

* "pro" is English for a prostitute, or hooker on your side of the pond.

Can't remember any more verses... but I'm glad Starck stuck to his tried and tested modern-minimalistic design style for the yacht.

 


Lyrics: http://www.diamondgeezers.org.uk/sounds/lyrics/thegoodshipvenus.html


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post #23 of 48
i agree... he deserves only 6 Million or 6.49 million (max amount that can be rounded to an even integer)

Did he Specifically meet with Lauren so he can get paid more or really did he meet with her to get additional funding to finish the yacht?... that is the question.

It was his pet project(Stark) which Lauren (after Steve's death) helped him complete and now he wants to be paid more money for that project... HE DESERVES 6 MILLION.
post #24 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Estimates of 12M mini's sold this quarter and Intermedia reporting that Apple owns 92.6% of the small to medium-sized business market, with Android not even making a blip on the radar. Yeah yeah yeah I know the mini estimate is coming from DigiTimes but AI seems to report everything else from them so why not this?

They did, back on Wednesday: http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/12/19/apples-iphone-takes-682-of-new-small-medium-business-smartphone-activations

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post #25 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by haar View Post

i agree... he deserves only 6 Million or 6.49 million (max amount that can be rounded to an even integer)
Did he Specifically meet with Lauren so he can get paid more or really did he meet with her to get additional funding to finish the yacht?... that is the question.
It was his pet project(Stark) which Lauren (after Steve's death) helped him complete and now he wants to be paid more money for that project... HE DESERVES 6 MILLION.

 

I'm sorry but nobody except the insiders really know what happened. Especially if it's just verbal contract. 

post #26 of 48

For the greater part of his life Steve Jobs lived a comparatively (to his wealth) modest life materially speaking. He spoke about it and rejected the lavish lifestyle of the plutocrats for all the right reason. At the very end of his life he got involved in this vulgar monstrosity. It is kind of sad and I suspect if he hadn't gotten ill he would not have bothered. But regardless of the reasons behind its creation this thing should be recycled asap. Use the proceeds for something useful - like the liberal arts or education, for instance. 

post #27 of 48
Meh. It's not like Steve will be taking his yacht out for a spin anytime soon. More forum fodder.

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post #28 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_b View Post

Steve Jobs should have had Jony Ive design the boat.

 

I believe that Jon Ive has mostly (only?) done industrial case design.   Starck has designed everything from radios to yachts to hotels.

 

--

 

Still, it was surprising that Jobs would hire Starck after his famous comment about Ive's tendency to reuse Dieter Rams' previous Braun designs.

 

There's a well known video interview with Dieter Rams, where he tells of how his fellow designer Philippe Starck rushed up to him at a Los Angeles exhibition and exclaimed, "Apple is copying you!"

 

To which, Rams replied, "To me, it's a compliment."

 

Dieter Rams is a classy gentleman.  One wonders if his admirer, Jon Ive, has the same amount of class and secretly feels the same about others who follow his own Rams influenced designs.

post #29 of 48

This over sized Sausalito houseboat might be the result of post-Steve design changes intended to reduce the cost and Philippe Starck wants a fee based on the original glass roof yacht design.

 

My wife would do the same!

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post #30 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


If they were expecting it to cost 150m euros and actually saved 45m, an extra 3m doesn't seem that significant. Still, without a formal contract, maybe they can haggle him down to 5 euros. I'm guessing the Jobs family has already paid for the boat though so it's probably in their best interests to pay the extra.
I don't particularly like the style of the boat. It's quite a contrast between Apple's rounded corners and this squared off design. There aren't many examples of boats that aren't garish to look at so it will still stand amongst the better ones but it doesn't look like it's worth 105m euros. None of the yachts here look like they're worth what they cost either:
http://www.bornrich.com/entry/top-12-high-tech-luxury-yachts/
but I suppose the same goes for a movie blockbuster or video game.

 

For yachts of this size and finish, one pays for a lot of things that aren't apparent looking at a shot of the exterior structure, things that wouldn't be needed in a comparably sized house. Besides the hull and superstructure, which have to be built to standards that allow them to take a beating in very rough seas, and electrical and mechanical systems (navigation and communication equipment, engines, generators, water & water purification, heat, ac, av, etc, etc.) many of which are custom made equipment, there's typically a level of finish of the interior that goes beyond most homes, even very expensive ones, and is greatly complicated by the fact that there are few right angles. And they're paying master craftsmen to do all this work, with the overall expense increasing exponentially with length.

 

But, yeah, most of the "super yachts" are not, in my opinion, either, very appealing aesthetically, and yes, this is probably one of the less ugly ones.

post #31 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling View Post

 

Still, it was surprising that Jobs would hire Starck after his famous comment about Ive's tendency to reuse Dieter Rams' previous Braun designs.

 

There's a well known video interview with Dieter Rams, where he tells of how his fellow designer Philippe Starck rushed up to him at a Los Angeles exhibition and exclaimed, "Apple is copying you!"

 

To which, Rams replied, "To me, it's a compliment."

 

Dieter Rams is a classy gentleman.  One wonders if his admirer, Jon Ive, has the same amount of class and secretly feels the same about others who follow his own Rams influenced designs.

Although it is frustrating when you are not paid what you expected to be paid, I have to question Starck's decision to "seize" the yacht.  Without knowing all of the details, his decision does appear to be in poor taste.

post #32 of 48
Even for the super rich, a 100M yacht is a lot of money.

That's at the 'I have so much I don't know what to do with it level'.

Unless you're going to live on it as your base home... in which case I'd spend a lot.
post #33 of 48
"Starck said after Jobs' death, he began meeting with his wife, Laurene Powell Jobs, to finish the Jobs." :O
post #34 of 48
How can you seize property without a written agreement?

Starch won't be getting any more requests for yacht designs after this (very bad taste) move. Or if he does the customer will have a contract tighter than a Hollywood prenup.
post #35 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

For the greater part of his life Steve Jobs lived a comparatively (to his wealth) modest life materially speaking. He spoke about it and rejected the lavish lifestyle of the plutocrats for all the right reason. At the very end of his life he got involved in this vulgar monstrosity. It is kind of sad and I suspect if he hadn't gotten ill he would not have bothered. But regardless of the reasons behind its creation this thing should be recycled asap. Use the proceeds for something useful - like the liberal arts or education, for instance. 

 



Personally, I think it is none of your business what Steve Jobs did with his money or what his heirs decide to do with his legacy.

post #36 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

How can you seize property without a written agreement?
Starch won't be getting any more requests for yacht designs after this (very bad taste) move. Or if he does the customer will have a contract tighter than a Hollywood prenup.

That is why it is more likely that the money is owed based on the anticipated cost of the project that Powell may have cheapened post Steve resulting in more work for Starck, not less. Starck and his name certainly add "value" to the boat, just as designers add value to a pair of jeans. If Starck is entitled to the payment he should pursue all of it.

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post #37 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Hey AI, how about reporting on this instead? http://beta.fool.com/jaans/2012/12/21/apple-ipad-mini-screaming/19544/?ticker=AAPL&source=eogyholnk0000001
Estimates of 12M mini's sold this quarter and Intermedia reporting that Apple owns 92.6% of the small to medium-sized business market, with Android not even making a blip on the radar. Yeah yeah yeah I know the mini estimate is coming from DigiTimes but AI seems to report everything else from them so why not this?
Or how about Apple capturing a record 53% of the smartphone market in the US?
http://************/2012/12/21/report-iphone-captures-record-53-of-u-s-smartphone-market-for-the-first-time-as-android-drops-to-42/

 

Those topics have nothing to do with patents, so it obviously has no place on this site! :P

post #38 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by city View Post

This over sized Sausalito houseboat might be the result of post-Steve design changes intended to reduce the cost and Philippe Starck wants a fee based on the original glass roof yacht design.

 

My wife would do the same!

 

 

clever comment ...

post #39 of 48
Apple is doomed. It is time to sell off the parts and give the money back to the investors!
post #40 of 48
For some reason this hull looks ok. The structure above it looks pathetic. Makes one think its not sea worthy. I like the designs where the whole structure is streamline and looks like it can handle heavy seas.
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