Microsoft's Surface Pro to ship with as little as 36% of advertised storage available to users - Page 2

Your counters are expected and mostly valid. I would argue that if you're using it as a tablet then a USB stick or external HDD sticking out of your Surface is far from ideal. And having Core-i5 is great but it's a ULV Core-i5 on a 10" display. Plenty of Windows apps won't work to well on that system.

I 'm certainly not saying there is no market or uses for the Surface Pro but if you look at the what tablets are used for and how they are used I think you'll see the market much prefers the iPad. I use Prompt, Screens and LogMeIn to connect my iPad to Windows. I have absolutely no interest in a device that isn't an ideal tablet OS and can't be used on a lap and needs an another $130 to get a Type Cover for a notebook-ish typing experience.

I've seen the Surface RT and even that had you going into the Classic UI for stupid settings so this has to be worse so you'll need a mouse, too, I'd imagine. It all just seems like a huge kludge to me except for a very, very narrow market where it will be the best thing ever.
Edited by SolipsismX - 1/29/13 at 5:07pm

This doesn't make much sense.

Problem you have described is pointing to your GPU problem, likely drivers but also possibly hardware. It is not necessarily GPU hardware, it could be insufficient/fluctuating power, motherboard voltage regulators, chipset (though hardware problem usually would not be amendable by driver's restart) .

Of all the possible culprits, Windows 8 itself is the least likely.

Or would you prefer if your OS has frozen/BSOD on graphics failure, causing you to lose whatever you might have been working on at the moment, like good old XP would do?

Oh.......and to never have to use iTunes to transfer stuff.

Drag and drop or insert SD....boom....there it is.

Friggin' nirvana.

The only thing I hate about my iDevices.

Maybe you are yet to reach awareness of your ignorance? Took some time for Socrates to realize that, too.

Since Surface Pro is basically i5 based ultrabook hardware, you should be able to install Linux (presuming that there is chipset support in any Linux distro), or even to do the Jackintosh. I'm not aware that MS has locked Surface Pro to Windows, and even if they had, smart people will find a way.

I was thinking the same thing but the ADMIN. had already determined that the things I want a tablet to do were silly and I should only talk when my expectations of a tablet met their's.

Thanks.

I assume Apple stock will go down on this news.

 

        What an amazing tale, brother Grimm!  I actually like the part where you own Windows-based PC  /clap

Looks like the storage can be expanded by inserting a relatively inexpensive memory card. Which seems simpler than the iPad method of selling the device on eBay and buying a new one when you want to add capacity.

Did you say sales for it didn't go well? I wouldn't blame. I have same question as for those who bought Asus Transformer. If you need keyboard, attached to a tablet, why won't you buy slim laptop instead? 

Epic fail for MS

I expect to hear anti-MS stuff here.....I just wish it was more intelligent.

You don't "need" a keyboard. It comes with several virtual ones that can just be minimized and called up at will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhxtFxWchWY&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Seriously people......get it together.

Sent from my iPad.

 

If you cut and paste from a website you get whatever HTML formatting from that site.  It's a PITA period.

I think that misses the point.

Realistically, the iPad competes against the Surface RT.

Since MS advertises the separate keyboard as being an integral part of the Surface Pro experience (have you seen a single ad or commercial which doesn't highlight that silly click?), the Pro is most comparable to the MacBook Air.

 

Mmm...it would replace my MBA before it replaced my iPad Mini.  Maybe.  I'd have to jump to Lightroom and Premiere and that's spendy since I'm not a pro.

 

Folks that think Surface Pro is stupid probably would think a MBA where the screen could be detached and act as a tablet would be brilliant.

 

Me I think both are cool except one actually exists and the other not so much.

 

It's not a tablet replacement.  It's an ultrabook replacement that can act as a tablet on weekends.  

 

And as a work laptop/tablet combo the stylus is awesome for engineers or artists that need to draw or any folks that prefer to take notes long hand vs typing.

I'm sticking with the notion that it is a half-baked concept that is really just a small screened ultra book or netbook that can sort of work like a tablet (in landscape only mode, that is).  And I'm sorry, but using between 1/3 to 2/3's of the available marketed memory for the OS is not normal.  It's just wasteful to try to address the "needs" of a population of users and software companies that are unwilling to move forward and program around a new OS.  

I would compare the Surface Pro that way but the OP was defending his desire for the Surface Pro over the iPad hence my reply.

I use my iPad now as my laptop basically, I setup my iMac to do my heavy lifting & I RDP into my VM & VNC into OS X. I also have the redpark cable for Cisco consoles and a BT keyboard with backlight. I love my iPad & even though it is the 16GB iPad 2 it has been rock solid & more than up to the task. By the way, it does do multitasking, just a very limited multitasking. I have no issues switching between RDP, iSSH, & VNC, it maintains all 3 network connections just fine. Sure it's not as full blown but then I can work on my iPad on battery nearly 4x what you can on the Surface. For me I need something that just works, Windows hardly fits that mold.

 

All those wires you are excited about connecting to your Surface makes me think you should save your money and buy a desktop PC. You'd then have enough money left over to buy a really nice portable iDevice. 

This is awesome! I had no idea this exists.

I do have a question about options. For my home lab I have 10yo swivel-head iMac connected via USB-to-Serial-to-Console Cable to a Cisco Access Server (Model 2509 or something like that) which has the Async Octal cable that all connect to the console ports of my other Cisco routers and switches. If you've used this setup you'll know that you switch back to the Access Server by using the Ctrl-Shift -6 then X sequence. This can't be done with Prompt on the iPad. I have to use Screens VNC to jump into the Mac and do the key combo. Can the Get Console app do this?

The surface is poor at being a tablet ( heavy bulky and loves to work near 100 V outlets) It's a poor ultrabook with its "welcome mat" floppy keyboard and a prop-up display... try using that on your lap. Finally, it's an expensive desktop PC. 

 

This leaves the "Awesome" stylus which you can use on an iPad or Android tablet just as easily... and for a lot less hardware costs.

 

What's left to make the Surface Pro stand out? Oh, it can run legacy software that may NEVER be rewritten to take touch screen input... yeah, stick with your old PC and supplement it with a truly portable, light weight, iDevice that has a greater likelihood of having legacy PC programs ported to it than to a Surface tablet.

I totally agree with you, the Surface Pro is most comparable to the MacBook Air... UNTIL you try to set the Surface Pro up on your lap to type up an involved document. The welcome mat keyboard wants to droop off the sides of your thighs and the propped up display wants to slide off the ends of your knees. Welcome to the worst of ANY world.

 

Mac OS X Lion does that to my Mac Book Air. It's extremely irritating. Good thing OS X boots fast, but still should never happen!

Artists use Wacom hardware... if they need a stylus. Nexus or iPad if they don't.

 

 

No place for Microsoft here.

And it gets kicked in the ass something bad.

I actually wanted this product to succeed, but Microsoft doesn't cease to disappoint. Their vision of a unified OS is quickly turning out to be a huge mistake. I'm still hoping for a Windows gaming tablet with decent specs to use as a Steam Box, though. Razer is launching one, but there are certain things that I don't like about it; perhaps either Logitech or Valve could save the day. A Windows gaming tablet that could be hooked to any TV and have any PC peripherals plugged into would be amazing; for once it would completely eliminate the need to have Windows on my Macs, as I only use it to play games, and beyond that it would provide me with a very portable PC that I could either interact with through the touchscreen or plug desktop peripherals into.

I have been wanting a decent tablet PC for a very long time; since 2006 that I've been trying and giving away HP tablets hoping to find the one, but it's never materialized because Windows tablet makers don't understand that specs and quality are important. I'd be willing to play up to $2.5k for a decent Windows tablet.

 

 

Ballmer, I command you to come out of this body !

Don't be discouraged, it is only this specific admin - others are much more reasonable. Realistically, I cannot fault his endless support for fruit company, but result is more in line of Apple fan who just happened to have Admin title, than actual Administrator.

TS did previously mention problem with Intel graphics in his PC, so I don't think he is making this up. At least there is consistency in his story. Especially that I have also came across crappy Intel drivers for their integrated graphics, albeit different problem from what he is describing.

Only problem is the way he is spinning his problem. Crappy manufacturer drivers are manufacturer problem, hardly something to blame OS. Every dedicated graphics I have seen so far on Win 8, be it Nvidia or ATI, performed well.

 

It might need to be cleaned. Dust buildup on the heat sync acts like a mat of insulation, preventing the fan from properly cooling it, and thus the card. The card will shut down when it overheats and (sometimes) come back on when it cools off.

 

1) Surface Pro will get 4-5 hours. That's short of my 10 hour ideal for air travel but not bad for a laptop.  For use at work I have a lot of outlets available.  This is on par with an 11' MBA running windows.  A  4-5 hour battery life gets me from DC to LA.  For a longer flight I would do the same for the Surface Pro that I would for the MBA...carry an external battery.

 

2) You can use the surface on your lap with the type cover.  It's not optimal but you can use the kickstand to prop it up.

 

 

 

3) It's no more an expensive desktop PC than a MBA is an expensive desktop PC.

 

4) The stylus is a pressure sensitive stylus and except on the Samsung Note and other tablets with a digitizer there's nothing like it on Android or iOS.

 

It has a 600 dpi resolution and a 0.7mm distance between stylus and the LCD...which is better than on the Cintiq 12x that has a thicker glass surface.

 

 

 

http://www.techradar.com/us/reviews/pc-mac/tablets/microsoft-surface-pro-1123800/review

 

5) I'm rewriting our legacy java app for touchscreen use on Win8 because it's easier than an Android or iOS port and we require more horsepower than ARM provides.  Even a low power i5 is much better than what you can do on a high end Transformer.

 

So essentially none of your points are true.  

Surface Pro is a laptop in tablet's clothing (touchscreen). It's designed to be used in landscape mode the majority of the time, has a short battery life, and runs on Intel processor. It runs legacy apps. Since it's designed more for content creation than consumption you need a dedicated keyboard, just like a laptop.

I would disagree with this one. Even though the Surface Pro at 64 and 128GB with a TypeCover is about* the same price as a MBA there is a very small market for $1000+ Windows-based PCs. All reports have Apple owning almost all of that market. I recall the average sale price for WinPCs being around $600-700 and Macs being around $1,200-1,400. Because of the disparity I would say that the MBA is an inexpensive Mac and the Surface Pro is an expensive WinPC.


* The MBA is actually $30 less expensive than the Surface Pro plus TypeCover for a given capacity with the MBA having about 20GB more space free for the user due to the OS size differences. On top of that the MBA starts off with a 1.7GHz Core-i7 while the Surface Pro only has a 1.7GHz Core-i5 for that price. Finally, the MBA has the options for an event faster processor and 8GB RAM, and up to 512GB of storage on the 11" model.

Windows Everywhere!

The Surface Pro includes every version of Windows, which will delight professional collectors. Don't worry, you can still run AutoCAD 1998 and that internally-developed accounting software last updated for Windows 3.1 no problem! And the Surface Pro is an ideal replacement for text-based POS systems; it runs them natively, without going through a messy VPN.

We've included drivers for every printer, keyboard, and graphics card made in the last 30 years! Contact your Microsoft Store representative about purchasing our USB 3.0 to Serial Printer adapter, or for you hardcore gamers, USB 3.0 to Radeon 7800 Desktop Edition card.

Finally, don't forget about updates! Having the full power of a desktop means needing the full virus protection of a desktop. Check in with us every Patch Tuesday and throughout the week for various critical updates to sections of legacy code that have been exploitable for years. It's a small price to pay for wall-to-wall backwards compatibility.

 

Having to wipe and reload after purchase completely defeats one of the ideal tenents of tablets.

 

Corporate accounts. And they say Apple users are blindly brand-loyal...

 

Many artists are excited about the Surface Pro.  Wacom has removed references to Surface Pro from their website but some folks report it was mentioned on their Bamboo pen page.  600 dpi might be low or it might be okay depending on what you do and how that translates into usable sensitivity.

 

Edit:  My conjecture based on the rumors is that there's a Wacom digitizer built into the Surface Pro that's been tweaked with the technology acquired from Perspective Pixel.  It's not going to the the pro-cap digitizer that PP had been working on but a Wacom EMR digitizer probably with some software heuristics taken from PP.

 

If the PP acquisition and the recent patents gives MS tradable IP with Wacom then you can expect better than average cooperation between the two and why both are playing things close to the chest and being IMHO unnecessarily secretive...

Edited by nht - 1/30/13 at 6:18am

 

The point is that neither is a desktop PC.  $30 more or less doesn't matter.  i7 vs i5 doesn't matter.

 

From a bang for the performance buck perspective the Mac Mini and iMac destroys both of them and both of those are (relative to cheap win pcs) expensive desktops.

 

I haven't done a lot of Win8 yet but I thought this ad cute:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=_ODFvy1mjoY

I still doesn't understand what the Surface Pro got any better than others failed Tablet PC from the past 15 years...

 

The issue here is not the hardware, but with legacy Windows software unfit for tablet screen size and touch input. BTW I wonder how anybody can considering a 10in Windows device for Pro working...

He definitely had overheat issue but blamed Windows. That's why I lol'd. If it's a desktop I'll recommend to get better case and to add couple of silent fans on a front and a back.

The real hell of it is, a truly fresh start for Surface OS would have likely been even smaller than iOS. The UI alone would be a huge difference, since retina-ready textures are several times larger than the dozens of bytes required for SVG icons and code that says "make a box this big and this color."