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Apple looking to expand role of Siri as an 'OS within an OS'

post #1 of 64
Thread Starter 
Apple is looking to hire user interface engineers to make "the next big thing even bigger," expanding the capabilities the company's Siri search assistant to new apps on iOS, and also, apparently, the company's desktop Mac platform.

Apple has posted a full time position that will "join the team that implements the UI for Siri," specifically the presentation of results in Siri's "conversation view" (as shown below for various existing apps that integrate with Siri).



The task involves a study of each new application or service that will interact with Siri, including a process to "distill it down to fundamentals, and implement that application's UI in a theme fitting with Siri."

Siri for Mac OS X coming soon?



Apple tells Siri UI engineer applicants to "consider it a an entire miniature OS within the OS, and you get a good idea of the scope."

Consider it a an entire miniature OS within the OS, and you get a good idea of the scopeCuriously, the job listing makes no direct mention of iOS, the most obvious target for Siri integration.

Apple brought Dictation features to OS X last year, but hasn't debuted full Siri functionality yet. It is expected to do so in the upcoming version due to be unveiled this summer.



Apple similarly brought Dictation features to iPad before releasing full Siri functionality in a subsequent release, suggesting a similar two-step deployment for Mac users.

However, the job listing also provides additional hints that the Siri team is working to deliver features for the Mac (in addition to just doing their development work on Macs). It calls for knowledge of Apple's APIs on both OS X and iOS and specifically asks for familiarity with the core of Mac OS X.

Finally, it lists as a requirement "passion for the Macintosh platform and writing simple, elegant software that is easy and fun to use."

iOS expansion calls for strong mobile skills



While moving Siri to the Mac seems like an obvious step, Apple job listing isn't just describing a port of the existing features to its desktops. It specifically describes a major expansion of Siri features in working with new apps to deliver a natural voice interface.

The listing describes close collaborative work with other teams that build apps, noting that "you'll need to work with them to enable access to their data and behaviors, and wire them up to your implementations. As a result, strong API design is needed to keep communication ideal."

Given the limited resources of mobile devices, we need to squeeze every last bit of performance we can getThe job asks for in depth development experience with either Apple's own Cocoa or "at least one of the following" other mobile platforms, specially naming Google's Android, Microsoft's C#, Oracle's Java and C++.

The job also specifically notes performance analysis and tuning as a significant responsibility," stating that "given the limited resources of mobile devices, we need to squeeze every last bit of performance we can get."
post #2 of 64
Siri for OSX is going to make a whole bunch of people happy!

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AAPL - Apple Inc is going up nicely today: $390

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post #3 of 64
That would be a big mistake. Two people generally cannot understand each other. To ask a device to understand someone better than a friend is asking more than the state of the art can deliver. These are boundaries which Apple & associates have no prospect of breaching any time soon. The user experience would be poor and reflect badly upon Apple.

It is a worthy challenge for the next generation of Apple - not the current incumbents.
post #4 of 64
Originally Posted by timmillea View Post
That would be a big mistake. Two people generally cannot understand each other. To ask a device to understand someone better than a friend is asking more than the state of the art can deliver. 

 

Uh, what? Siri understands language already. Why couldn't it perform tasks in OS X?

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post #5 of 64

I'm using Siri to do more and more. Lately, I've been using it to launch applications, instead of swiping through several screens and poking at an app.

 

It would be very cool if Siri could open bookmarks saved to my homescreen. Anyway, I'll probably use it even more on the Mac. Can't wait.

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post #6 of 64

I'm probably the only person who thinks this, but I don't want to control devices by talking to them and would find it a purchase impediment if it were a ubiquitous requirement.
 

post #7 of 64
Maybe this is the year that Apple will add an API for Siri?
post #8 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

I'm probably the only person who thinks this, but I don't want to control devices by talking to them and would find it a purchase impediment if it were a ubiquitous requirement.
 

 

I tend to agree if the device is being used in public...I tend not to use Siri in public - but I'd love to use Siri with the Apple Remote app, on the rumored Applevision. 

 

"Siri...find episodes of "How I Met Your Mother" from 2009"

 

Siri is great when she doesn't time out on me.  I'd love to see them fix that first.

post #9 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmillea View Post

That would be a big mistake. Two people generally cannot understand each other. To ask a device to understand someone better than a friend is asking more than the state of the art can deliver. These are boundaries which Apple & associates have no prospect of breaching any time soon. The user experience would be poor and reflect badly upon Apple.

It is a worthy challenge for the next generation of Apple - not the current incumbents.
 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Uh, what? Siri understands language already. Why couldn't it perform tasks in OS X?

It's interesting that to disagree with his post stating that two people generally cannot understand each other, you have to state that you don't understand him.

post #10 of 64
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post
…would find it a purchase impediment if it were a ubiquitous requirement.

 

It'll never be a requirement for use.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

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post #11 of 64
Adding Siri seems to be the natural big thing for OS X 10.9
post #12 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

Siri is great when she doesn't time out on me.  I'd love to see them fix that first.

Speaking of that. If you have some free time (and don't mind starting your Siri server-side profile over again) you can turn off Siri and the voice command pre-Siri will work again for calling a contact, playing music, etc. When Siri is on these basic commands are all pushed server-side. There are a lot more options with this setup that a 1GHz ARM CPU can't handle but it's still annoying when you only want a simple task like two mentioned previously. Even with a strong single and LTE it will take longer to complete.

I would love if Apple made the device smart enough to know when the request is simple enough to benefit from being local or to at least know when the server connection isn't good enough that commands it can do locally will get down if you can't make a proper connection to the backend. Am I asking for too much?

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post #13 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacApfel View Post

Adding Siri seems to be the natural big thing for OS X 10.9

Tim Cook on stage: "We were the company that brought the computer mouse to the world. Now we're the company that is taking it away. Introducing the first Mac that is completely controlled by your voice."

Demo… "Move the cursor a little more to the right. A little bit more. Oh, that's too far. Now a little bit down. A little more. A little more. Now click."

30 minutes later.

Tim Cook back on stage: 'All that with the power of voice."

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #14 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Speaking of that. If you have some free time (and don't mind starting your Siri server-side profile over again) you can turn off Siri and the voice command pre-Siri will work again for calling a contact, playing music, etc. When Siri is on these basic commands are all pushed server-side. There are a lot more options with this setup that a 1GHz ARM CPU can't handle but it's still annoying when you only want a simple task like two mentioned previously. Even with a strong single and LTE it will take longer to complete.

I would love if Apple made the device smart enough to know when the request is simple enough to benefit from being local or to at least know when the server connection isn't good enough that commands it can do locally will get down if you can't make a proper connection to the backend. Am I asking for too much?

No, you're not asking too much. That needs to happen soon.

For your sake, I hope you're right.
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post #15 of 64

I'd like to have these added to Siri:

 

1. Keyboard entry mode. You can actually edit a Siri query by tapping on the query (after Siri responds), and a keyboard pops up, and you can edit away. The keyboard click sound is turned off though. I think to have a keyboard button pop up next to the Siri microphone after the long press of the home button.

 

2. Training mode. I'd like some way to train Siri to understand what certain words, names, acronyms, initialisms, etc.

 

3. Siri commands for apps. At least have Siri understand play, pause, skip forward/back, etc.

post #16 of 64
I'm sure there are hundreds of other ways to expand Siri functionality, but after using it for a few months I have 3 suggestions:

1. I'd like to ask Siri "do not disturb me for 1 hour" - but all she does is offer to take me to the Do Not Disturb feature to turn it on myself.
2. Siri should be able to learn names better. For instance, city names in my area are frequently misspelled when using dictation.
3. The oft-mentioned API. I want to tell Siri "add butter to my grocery list" and it adds to my Grocery List app accordingly.
post #17 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by LighteningKid View Post

 

It's interesting that to disagree with his post stating that two people generally cannot understand each other, you have to state that you don't understand him.

Reread timmilea's first paragraph; it's borderline-hieroglyphic, IMO. And, I do not agree that generally two people do not understand each other. Generally speaking, people do tend understand each other.

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post #18 of 64
We're doing lists of 3 now….


1) Don't take me into the OS and to Safari if you don't know. Allow Siri to pull up the WebKit engine (at least) from that interface. Regardless of other shortcomings of Google Play that one feature makes it look much better than Siri.

2) Get with linguistic experts so users can repeat a carefully crafted paragraph in Settings and when you first register a new device so it can learn how you speak different sounds. Cultural and physical differences can highly affect how we say the same thing. The Canadians know what I'm talking aboot. 1biggrin.gif

3) Give me another button on the phone to call Siri. For what is essentially an all digital concierge service having to hold down the Home Button for an extended time is not convenient. Right above the Mute toggle switch would be my preference.
Edited by SolipsismX - 2/5/13 at 1:34pm

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #19 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


I would love if Apple made the device smart enough to know when the request is simple enough to benefit from being local or to at least know when the server connection isn't good enough that commands it can do locally will get down if you can't make a proper connection to the backend. Am I asking for too much?

 

You're not asking for too much.  I think that's how Google's "Google Now" does it, right?  Decides if it's server side or local before executing?  I think I read that.

 

I don't need 3 points of a Siri "wish list."  Only 1: I want Siri to be like Nina:

 

http://www.youtube.com/embed/561SVPrf1YI?rel=0&autoplay=1&autohide=1

post #20 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

We're doing lists of 3 now….


The Canadians know what I'm talking aboot. 1biggrin.gif

I have no problem with people making fun of us Canadians, but no one here sounds like that! Maybe Newfoundland, but more often than not people doing "Canadian" accents end up sounding like Minnesotans !
post #21 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

2) Get with linguistics so users can repeat a carefully crafted paragraph in Settings and when you first register a new device so it can learn how you speak different sounds. Cultural and physical differences can highly affect how we say the same thing. The Canadians know what I'm talking aboot. 1biggrin.gif

Until you brought it up I hadn't looked to see if Google was doing anything similar. They are, and have been since 2010. That may be why Google does so well with text to speech and voice search. 

 

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/37306/google-voice-search-android-improvements

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post #22 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelsalt View Post

I have no problem with people making fun of us Canadians, but no one here sounds like that! Maybe Newfoundland, but more often than not people doing "Canadian" accents end up sounding like Minnesotans !

Sure. I'm just kidding. I meant no offense. Frankly, of all the Canadians I know those in Vancouver sound just like a typical American and those in Quebec sound French, but since I don't speak French I can't discern any variance in French speaking accents (unless it's Caribbean). I do agree that 'us' Americans consider Canadians to sound like characters from Fargo.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #23 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelsalt View Post


I have no problem with people making fun of us Canadians, but no one here sounds like that! Maybe Newfoundland, but more often than not people doing "Canadian" accents end up sounding like Minnesotans !

 

One of my best friends is from Canada and he sounded just like a MInnesotan when he first came to the States.  Now that he's been in the south for awhile, he sounds like a hillbilly.

post #24 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

 

I tend to agree if the device is being used in public...I tend not to use Siri in public - but I'd love to use Siri with the Apple Remote app, on the rumored Applevision. 

 

"Siri...find episodes of "How I Met Your Mother" from 2009"

Why would you need a remote app? Shouldn't the TV incorporate Siri?

Shut up and go away, you useless, pathetic FUDmonger - Tallest Skil
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post #25 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy View Post

Why would you need a remote app? Shouldn't the TV incorporate Siri?

I don't like shouting at the TV. ;-)
post #26 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

I don't like shouting at the TV. ;-)

In all seriousness I can see a Siri based home entertainment working. Siri would still have to be initiated which is why I'd expect it to be a BT remote that would have a button that would call Siri to listen via microphones on your remote that would then send it to whatever device is controlling the content for the TV. You could even make it intelligent enough that it could pick up the content coming from the TV so it can cancel that out from your voice so it wouldn't have to momentarily mute the TV when you said, "Record Comedy Central from 11pm to Midnight MOnday through Thursday."

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #27 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Tim Cook on stage: "We were the company that brought the computer mouse to the world. Now we're the company that is taking it away. Introducing the first Mac that is completely controlled by your voice."

Demo… "Move the cursor a little more to the right. A little bit more. Oh, that's too far. Now a little bit down. A little more. A little more. Now click."

30 minutes later.

Tim Cook back on stage: 'All that with the power of voice."

Well we're at the start of voice command revolution. Siri will become more and more precise with the mouse pointer. Some time more in the future the mouse pointer will be fully abandoned! Granted, for the moment it's a bit cumbersome.
post #28 of 64

Not to hijack this thread -- but things are happening in Apple Maps too:

 

Then

 

 

 

NOW

 

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post #29 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

I don't like shouting at the TV. ;-)
That is why I believe a remote will be always out, even if it is microphone only.
When will Siri be able for developers to integrate? There are lots of apps that would be easier for it.
post #30 of 64
Computer on! Oh I see you need a keyboard how quaint!
post #31 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by joelsalt View Post


I have no problem with people making fun of us Canadians, but no one here sounds like that! Maybe Newfoundland, but more often than not people doing "Canadian" accents end up sounding like Minnesotans !

 

One of my best friends is from Canada and he sounded just like a MInnesotan when he first came to the States.  Now that he's been in the south for awhile, he sounds like a hillbilly.

 

What does that sound like?    "Don'tcha know what that's aboot, y'all?"

 

(From a Minnesotan who moved to LaLa Land)  Slange!

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #32 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

In all seriousness I can see a Siri based home entertainment working. Siri would still have to be initiated which is why I'd expect it to be a BT remote that would have a button that would call Siri to listen via microphones on your remote that would then send it to whatever device is controlling the content for the TV. You could even make it intelligent enough that it could pick up the content coming from the TV so it can cancel that out from your voice so it wouldn't have to momentarily mute the TV when you said, "Record Comedy Central from 11pm to Midnight MOnday through Thursday."

Samsung has a remote one can talk into, so are you sure it's a good idea?
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #33 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

I don't like shouting at the TV. ;-)

In all seriousness I can see a Siri based home entertainment working. Siri would still have to be initiated which is why I'd expect it to be a BT remote that would have a button that would call Siri to listen via microphones on your remote that would then send it to whatever device is controlling the content for the TV. You could even make it intelligent enough that it could pick up the content coming from the TV so it can cancel that out from your voice so it wouldn't have to momentarily mute the TV when you said, "Record Comedy Central from 11pm to Midnight MOnday through Thursday."

 

My position on the couch is about 6 feet away from the TV and off to the left side.  I often use Siri on my iPad 4 while the TV is playing (look up scores, schedules, etc.).  Siri (or the iPad) has little trouble eliminating background noise -- so much so that ambient noise is not a noticeable problem.   

 

Now, if you were in a group watching the Super bowl with friends and everybody was telling their Siri device to do something at the same time...

 

Siri "Tell Coach Crazy, to stop whining -- you lost -- move on!"


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 2/5/13 at 3:43pm
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post #34 of 64
People in a all Siri world.

"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
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post #35 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post

I don't like shouting at the TV. ;-)

In all seriousness I can see a Siri based home entertainment working. Siri would still have to be initiated which is why I'd expect it to be a BT remote that would have a button that would call Siri to listen via microphones on your remote that would then send it to whatever device is controlling the content for the TV. You could even make it intelligent enough that it could pick up the content coming from the TV so it can cancel that out from your voice so it wouldn't have to momentarily mute the TV when you said, "Record Comedy Central from 11pm to Midnight MOnday through Thursday."

 

What you are describing, physically, could be something small resembling the current AppleTV Remote -- but with BT and Microphone... to access Siri Central in the family room.  Siri Central could be an iPad Mini.

 

Interesting, that a similar device, with the addition of a speaker, could be a [very] smartphone. It could access the cell network and/or the WiFi network through the iPad Mini that you have with you always.  But you don't need to physically access the iPad to make a Siri-invoked phone call (the iPad can remain on the table, in your pack, etc.).   Then, when you want to see and surf -- you grab the Mini.

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #36 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmillea View Post

That would be a big mistake. Two people generally cannot understand each other. To ask a device to understand someone better than a friend is asking more than the state of the art can deliver. These are boundaries which Apple & associates have no prospect of breaching any time soon. The user experience would be poor and reflect badly upon Apple.

It is a worthy challenge for the next generation of Apple - not the current incumbents.
 

 

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #37 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Samsung has a remote one can talk into, so are you sure it's a good idea?

Does their device add value to the television experience? If so, then sure. If not, then like all things that have usually comes before Apple in form or another: doing it first is not as important as doing it right.
Edited by SolipsismX - 2/5/13 at 3:52pm

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #38 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Does there device add value to the television experience? If so, then sure. If not, then like all things that have usually comes before Apple in form or another: doing it first is not as important as doing it right.

Good retort but I was being facetious.
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #39 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

Reread timmilea's first paragraph; it's borderline-hieroglyphic, IMO. And, I do not agree that generally two people do not understand each other. Generally speaking, people do tend understand each other.

Oh, I'm with you, I think most people understand each other just fine. I just think it's ironic that Tallest didn't just tell him he's wrong, he implied he didn't understand him, which lends some support to the very statement that Tallest was disagreeing with.

post #40 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by LighteningKid View Post

Oh, I'm with you, I think most people understand each other just fine. I just think it's ironic that Tallest didn't just tell him he's wrong, he implied he didn't understand him, which lends some support to the very statement that Tallest was disagreeing with.

Accurate communication isn't as natural as we like to think. TV Shows and Movies are often based around miscommunication as the catalyst for a dramatic situation.

Consider their are about 9 billion people in the world and of those you can only communicate well with a small fraction of them. Of the people that fluently understand our language there are still few that wills understand your points of view. You can try but the chance of something being understood the way you want it understowod with a few simple words is highly unlikely. The most complex the more difficult it is.

Look at the failure rate of relationships and the common reason of couples of communicating with each well which can lead to therapy and perhaps separation. Look at math word problems. Ever not grasped something until it was explained a different way or when words were replaced with images or video?

Language in the written or spoken form is highly imprecise. I can't even say a simple 2 word sentence without there being a multiples of meanings and spellings for each word. We can process this easily because we are human just like we can process faces but a computer needs more precision and to make it simply work, which isn't going to happen, so we end up with a very complex and imperfect system.

PS: If there are autocorrect typos I'm not changing them as it proves my point. If that isn't what you meant by saying "we understand each other just fine" we'll that proves my point, two.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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