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Apple CEO Tim Cook disagreed with Steve Jobs over suing Samsung

post #1 of 100
Thread Starter 

A new profile of the love-hate relationship between Apple and Samsung details how the tech heavyweights springboarded off each other to emerge as the two dominant forces in the ongoing mobile computing revolution, while also disclosing that Apple CEO Tim Cook didn't share the same views as late company co-founder Steve Jobs in pursuing Samsung legally.
 

Galaxy S III mini
Samsung's Galaxy S III mini was added to Apple's suit in November. | Source: Samsung


The two companies have been engaged in an international litigation since Apple filed suit in April 2011, alleging that Samsung's smartphone and tablet designs were largely copied from the iPhones and iPads that preceded them. Since then, the case has spread to courts in Europe, Asia and Australia. Cook, worried about the critical supplier relationship, was opposed to suing Samsung. But Jobs had run out of patience, suspecting that Samsung was counting on the supplier relationship to shield it from retribution.


But the modern day ties between Apple and Samsung were actually forged in a partnership back in 2005, when Apple was seeking out a stable supplier of massive quantities of flash memory. Jobs and Co. were betting the company on iPod Shuffle, iPod nano, and forthcoming iPhone designs that would forgo traditional hard disk drives with moving parts for solid-state versions based on NAND flash chips.

It was a time when the memory market was extremely unstable, and the Cupertino-based company wanted to assure that it was working with a supplier that was rock-solid financially, people familiar with the relationship told Retuers. And Samsung was already controlling half of the NAND flash memory market at that time.
 

The partnership gave Apple and Samsung insight into each other's strategies and operations. In particular, Samsung's position as the sole supplier of iPhone processors gave it valuable data on just how big Apple thought the smartphone market was going to be.
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As for Apple, it reaped the benefit of Samsung's heavy investments in research and development, tooling equipment and production facilities. Samsung spent $21 billion (23 trillion won) on capital expenditures in 2012 alone, and plans to spend a similar amount this year.



Within years, however, the relationship would stumble upon its share of turmoil as Samsung began gaining market share with its family of Galaxy devices that Jobs felt were largely aped off the innovations and hard work over at Apple.

When face-to-face meetings between Jobs and Samsung's top brass delivered little confidence that the Korean electronics maker would alter its designs to avoid further dispute, Jobs' strategy turned to the "thermo-nuclear" legal war that has been playing out in public courthouses across the world for the past 18 months.

But as Retuers reveals for the first time publicly, Tim Cook -- then Jobs' Chief Operating Officer and CEO in grooming -- would not necessarily have taken the same direction:
 

Tim Cook, Jobs' successor as Apple chief executive, was opposed to suing Samsung in the first place, according to people with knowledge of the matter, largely because of that company's critical role as a supplier of components for the iPhone and the iPad. Apple bought some $8 billion worth of parts from Samsung last year, analysts estimate.


Samsung Phones
Court document from the Apple v. Samsung jury trial.


Apple was initially awarded a billion-dollar jury verdict against Samsung in Europe last August in a decision that appeared as if it would have sweeping influence in courts across the world. But Apple has recently faced trouble convincing U.S. courts to uphold those bands because the sheer success of the iPhone has made it difficult for the company to show any hard evidence of irreparable harm at the hands of Samsung. "Whoever controls flash is going to control this space in consumer electronics," Jobs said at the time, according to a source familiar with the discussions.

With the litigation slowly grinding to what Retuers has dubbed a 'stalemate,' Apple is moving to reduce its reliance on Samsung in the areas of manufacturing, while Samsung is focusing on its strategy of deploying its overly-broad range of mobile devices and creating memorable TV advertisements that mock the iPhone maker.

All that aside, however, Reuters cites people familiar with the matter who say the legal proceedings between the two sides have been "less poisonous to the relationship than some of the rhetoric suggests."

post #2 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple was initially awarded a billion-dollar jury verdict against Samsung in Europe last August ...

 

Europe?

 

True, many people think California is different from most states, but I'm pretty sure that right now it's still part of the USA.  

 

1biggrin.gif

 

Seriously, thanks for the article.

post #3 of 100
I wish people would stop repeating the "thermonuclear" thing. The whole narrative around the lawsuits has been based on this one angry comment attributed to Steve Jobs in Isaacson's biography. We know from the lawsuits that Apple's goal was licensing with a no-cloning clause. That's what they gave Microsoft prior to the lawsuits. That's what they offered Samsung before suing them. That's what they got HTC to agree to in a settlement. They sued to get the licensing terms they wanted. What the ridiculous "thermonuclear" narrative does is set up a situation where Apple cannot win.
post #4 of 100
And yet Tim did not drop the suit after he became CEO and after Jobs died. And they initially won the suit to boot. High ranking executives disagree all the time but band together and put a united front outwardly, so not sure why this is news.
post #5 of 100
Originally Posted by poke View Post
What the ridiculous "thermonuclear" narrative does is set up a situation where Apple cannot win.

 

Oh, they can certainly win it. They would be in the media if people would stop being paid by other companies to suppress the truth. 

 

No, I don't have any proof of that. But YOU (not you, poke, third-person plural 'you') come up with a better explanation for the negative spin that has flown in the face of established fact ever since this crap started.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #6 of 100
Who is/are Retuers?

Never heard of 'em.


oh. Maybe they mean Reuters?

Great journalism. This really give a lot of confidence in what was written in the article.
post #7 of 100
In summary, Steven P. Jobs's three corporations running as a founder/ceo gave him infinite more insight than Tim Cook, who is now realizing his mentor is correct and it is full-steam ahead to bury Samsung until they actually innovate on their own and stop using IP they later call ``obvious and thus shouldn't have patents, so we're not breaking the law,....''

Tim realizes now those private conversations with Steve that were far more explitive were spot on.

TSMC, Global Foundries, FOXConn are all in to help Apple out, not to mention Micron, Qualcomm, Broadcom and others to leave Samsung with not a single dime of contracts from Apple.
post #8 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

TSMC, Global Foundries, FOXConn are all in to help Apple out, not to mention Micron, Qualcomm, Broadcom and others to leave Samsung with not a single dime of contracts from Apple.

That's the best solution, getting critical parts from other suppliers.

But even that approach will only delay slightly Samsung's copying!

post #9 of 100

Sounds like Cook wants peace between the two companies.  Might be a good thing, on fair terms.  Samsung will always be a tough competitor.

post #10 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by hypercommunist View Post

Samsung will always be a tough competitor.

When/if Samsung develops software capabilities and an ecosystem to match Apple's, then they'll be a tough competitor.

post #11 of 100
Originally Posted by hypercommunist View Post
Samsung will always be a tough competitor.

 

Maybe they should start competing, then, instead of stealing.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #12 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by LovejoyOne View Post

Who is/are Retuers?

Never heard of 'em.


oh. Maybe they mean Reuters?

Great journalism. This really give a lot of confidence in what was written in the article.

Lighten up Dude...if you want perfection, you may have to visit another site. :)

post #13 of 100
These lawsuits are similar to the one Apple waged against Microsoft over the Macintosh's look and feel. Microsoft eventually prevailed just as I predict Samsung will. The courts generally consider harm done to Consumers and not whether a company was harmed. While I am an iPhone user, having Android handset manufacturers, as competition, has generally benefited consumers through more/better choice, faster innovation, and lower prices.

Now Apple is free to pursue other suppliers, but unless Samsung is found to have a monopoly on a key component (i.e. flash memory) they will likely not be constrained by the courts.

While Steve Jobs may have been driven by passion and anger over Samsung copying Apple's designs, Tim Cook had to ensure a stable supply chain so that Apple can get their products into the hands of customers in both a timely manner AND at a competitive price. As such, he would be VERY wary of suing one of Apple's largest and most important suppliers.
post #14 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSteelers View Post

And yet Tim did not drop the suit after he became CEO and after Jobs died. And they initially won the suit to boot. High ranking executives disagree all the time but band together and put a united front outwardly, so not sure why this is news.

Assuming there is any truth to this story it's possible that Tim wasn't opposed per se but didn't feel it was worth risking the supplier relationship and Steve countered that Samsung was likely counting on that view. So they were going to sue and Tim, as the logistics guy, was going to find them some other suppliers. Tim looked at the situation, found some alternate companies ready to talk, and all objections started to fade away.

 

which is why he didn't pull Apples initiated suits the moment he could. And has possibly filed a few more

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #15 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post
What the ridiculous "thermonuclear" narrative does is set up a situation where Apple cannot win.

 

I assume the situation you refer to is one of PR. If Apple doesn't win 100% on all design cases then yeah they could come off as aise hats and whiners in 'the court of public opinion'. And have.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #16 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Oh, they can certainly win it. They would be in the media if people would stop being paid by other companies to suppress the truth. 

 

No, I don't have any proof of that. But YOU (not you, poke, third-person plural 'you') come up with a better explanation for the negative spin that has flown in the face of established fact ever since this crap started.


so..........there is some broad range conspiracy against Apple? Are you serious? Apple is the media darling......just about every TV show has a Apple device featured. If there is a piece of technology in the segment then it is an Apple product. So who is doing all the negative towards Apple? Can you give examples?

Apple has the mindshare and attention of all the sectors it chooses to compete in..... The whole TV industry was in a panic when they thought Apple was making a TV.....the news media loved it. Apple gets more positive press than any other company. Who uses Apple products the most? Creative types like TV writers..editors...producers....actors.....news anchors. All the people you say are giving them negative press? Please explain.....

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #17 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

When/if Samsung develops software capabilities and an ecosystem to match Apple's, then they'll be a tough competitor.


Agreed!

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #18 of 100
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post
so..........there is some broad range conspiracy against Apple? Are you serious?

 

So Apple has NOTHING but GOOD things said about them in the media? Are you serious?


So who is doing all the negative towards Apple? Can you give examples?

 

Stop playing dumb.


Apple gets more positive press than any other company.


Citation needed.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #19 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

So Apple has NOTHING but GOOD things said about them in the media? Are you serious?

 

Stop playing dumb.


Citation needed.


so your defense is........???? you always do this TS....you make outlandish comments with no proof! You make statements that are just opinion and present them as fact! Just look at my signature.....yeah you still sticking to those statements too?

EVERYONE knows there is NO negative press at Apple.......you know it too! So if there is soooo much negativity about Apple....it really hurts their bottom line huh? they are really hurting to make money huh? can you address that? they are the most highly profitable companies in the world selling products amid all that negativity huh? Yeah right! If Apple has all this negative press show me some! Show me how they can survive this conspiracy you say exists. Apple dominates every product category they choose to compete in.......

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #20 of 100
Until we live in a society that gives more than it takes, then I will agree with Tim Cook. Until then, I'm on Steve's side.
post #21 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

So Apple has NOTHING but GOOD things said about them in the media? Are you serious?

 

Stop playing dumb.


Citation needed.


you have now deleted 2 of my posts ...explain why?????? They are on Google cache!!!!

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #22 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Maybe they should start competing, then, instead of stealing.

You can't steal IP
post #23 of 100
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post
you have now deleted 2 of my posts ...explain why?????? They are on Google cache!!!!

 

Honestly? To save you the embarrassment of having something so mind-bogglingly dense and wrong visible publicly. I'd think you'd want at least some people to be able to believe the things you say.

 

Secondarily because it was just blatant lies, flying in the face of all common sense. We're sick of this trolling nonsense.


Originally Posted by jfanning View Post
You can't steal IP
 

Fine, Samsung "borrowed it without intention of returning or giving payment". However you want to spin it.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #24 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Honestly? To save you the embarrassment of having something so mind-bogglingly dense and wrong visible publicly. I'd think you'd want at least some people to be able to believe the things you say.

 

Secondarily because it was just blatant lies, flying in the face of all common sense. We're sick of this trolling nonsense.

 

Fine, Samsung "borrowed it without intention of returning or giving payment". However you want to spin it.


then where are they? I have posted twice and they are both gone!

You are calling me a troll?? Back that up with proof!

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #25 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Honestly? To save you the embarrassment of having something so mind-bogglingly dense and wrong visible publicly. I'd think you'd want at least some people to be able to believe the things you say.

 

Secondarily because it was just blatant lies, flying in the face of all common sense. We're sick of this trolling nonsense.

 

Fine, Samsung "borrowed it without intention of returning or giving payment". However you want to spin it.

you admit to deleting posts that disagree with you? You have not denied deleting my responses to you huh? Your a "moderator" adminstrator...deleting post that prove you wrong!

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #26 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Oh, they can certainly win it. They would be in the media if people would stop being paid by other companies to suppress the truth. 

 

No, I don't have any proof of that. But YOU (not you, poke, third-person plural 'you') come up with a better explanation for the negative spin that has flown in the face of established fact ever since this crap started.

 

What I mean is the "thermonuclear" quote makes it seem as if Apple has to "destroy Android" in order to win. There have been many articles claiming Apple isn't winning because you can still buy Samsung phones. It's nonsense and the "thermonuclear" quote plays into it. There's no evidence that Apple sued Samsung because Steve Jobs threw a tantrum one day when Isaacson was interviewing him (and given the general quality of Isaacson's book I'm not even sure that happened the way people think), but that's the impression you'd get from reading about it in the media. There's ample evidence that they sued with the specific goal of getting good licensing terms and, if you take that to be their goal, they were successful in their settlement with HTC (whereas the "thermonuclear" crowd thinks they failed because HTC still exists). But none of that stuff is mentioned in these articles. The "thermonuclear" narrative is accepted by detractors and supporters.

post #27 of 100
That must suck for Tim Cook - inheriting a war he didn't want to fight. With his unabashed love for Jobs, Cook will fight Samsung to the bitter end, or at least to the logical end.
post #28 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

then where are they? I have posted twice and they are both gone!
You are calling me a troll?? Back that up with proof!



^^^ those can be found here
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
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I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
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post #29 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

 

What I mean is the "thermonuclear" quote makes it seem as if Apple has to "destroy Android" in order to win. There have been many articles claiming Apple isn't winning because you can still buy Samsung phones. It's nonsense and the "thermonuclear" quote plays into it. There's no evidence that Apple sued Samsung because Steve Jobs threw a tantrum one day when Isaacson was interviewing him (and given the general quality of Isaacson's book I'm not even sure that happened the way people think), but that's the impression you'd get from reading about it in the media. There's ample evidence that they sued with the specific goal of getting good licensing terms and, if you take that to be their goal, they were successful in their settlement with HTC (whereas the "thermonuclear" crowd thinks they failed because HTC still exists). But none of that stuff is mentioned in these articles. The "thermonuclear" narrative is accepted by detractors and supporters.

I agree on at least one thing - the quality of the Isaacson book is questionable. Isaacson was out to create a personal perspective and unafraid to take a artistic license, IMO, as he did in his other biographies. The problem here is that Jobs is not yet a historical figure because there are too many of his contemporaries still around.  

post #30 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post




^^^ those can be found here


So he has a habit and history of deleting posts he does not agree with or that prove him wrong! he calls names (called me a troll) so who knows how many post he deletes.....simply because he does not agree with the posts? WOW! This forum has no integrity is that is happening!

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
post #31 of 100

You have to be careful with business partners, that you can really trust them.

post #32 of 100
Once you get to a certain size, you might need to consider moving everything in-house if your supplier becomes an image of you. I wouldn't be surprised Samsung makes everything in the washing machine I bought, down to the holding screws and plastics. Or at least own the suppliers that do.
post #33 of 100
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post
you admit to deleting posts that disagree with you? 

 

No. How could you possibly get that from what was said?


You have not denied deleting my responses to you huh?

 

I actually confirmed it. Why you'd ask if I was denying anything is confusing.


Originally Posted by geekdad View Post
deleting post that prove you wrong!

 

Nothing in that post proved any information of any sort using any argument. It made a claim, unsubstantiated, with no evidence thereof.

 

I'm learning that people would rather look like total idiots than be saved the trouble of being publicly discredited. In that case, I probably won't make this same mistake again. lol.gif

 

Originally Posted by geekdad View Post
So he has a habit and history of deleting posts he does not agree with or that prove him wrong! he calls names (called me a troll) so who knows how many post he deletes.....simply because he does not agree with the posts? WOW! This forum has no integrity is that is happening!

 

Probably because it isn't happening. We delete troll posts and accounts. I don't delete posts due to disagreements.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #34 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

you admit to deleting posts that disagree with you? You have not denied deleting my responses to you huh? Your a "moderator" adminstrator...deleting post that prove you wrong!


Somebody around here has a few bats in the belfry.  I would suggest finding somewhere else to post comments and views.  Somewhere that is moderated properly.

post #35 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Secondarily because it was just blatant lies, flying in the face of all common sense. We're sick of this trolling nonsense.
Fine, Samsung "borrowed it without intention of returning or giving payment". However you want to spin it.

I'm not spinning it anyway, you infringe patents, you can't steal them
post #36 of 100
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post
I'm not spinning it anyway, you infringe patents, you can't steal them

 

I don't recall saying anything about patents. They're stealing intellectual property by infringing Apple's patents.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #37 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Maybe they should start competing, then, instead of stealing.

Maybe karma sucks, and Apple should consider writing Xerox a huge check for 30 years worth of unlicensed use of their IP.
post #38 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

So he has a habit and history of deleting posts he does not agree with or that prove him wrong! he calls names (called me a troll) so who knows how many post he deletes.....simply because he does not agree with the posts? WOW! This forum has no integrity is that is happening!

Ehm, maybe you can discuss that matter in the thread that I linked to?
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
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I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
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post #39 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

I don't recall saying anything about patents. They're stealing intellectual property by infringing Apple's patents.

You can't steal IP, but like patents, you can also infringe it.
post #40 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

No. How could you possibly get that from what was said?

 

I actually confirmed it. Why you'd ask if I was denying anything is confusing.

 

 

Nothing in that post proved any information of any sort using any argument. It made a claim, unsubstantiated, with no evidence thereof.

 

I'm learning that people would rather look like total idiots than be saved the trouble of being publicly discredited. In that case, I probably won't make this same mistake again. lol.gif

 

 

Probably because it isn't happening. We delete troll posts and accounts. I don't delete posts due to disagreements.


wow...some idiots would rather delete posts that makes them look foolish......then deny it.....so you admit to deleting my posts? Because why?

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

Reply
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