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Samsung's recent momentum 'begs an answer from Apple,' Barclays says - Page 2

post #41 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


I don't understand your analogy. Apple has never did things that only worked 100% of the time. All the iDevices were panned when they were announced.

Apple cares about making the best products with the most profit. It doesn't play the market share game. It plays the profit share game.

Market share doesn't pay the bills. Look at HP and Dell.

You said, "Apple will never please anyone, so why try?"  I'm explaining to you why they should attempt to reach more customers by expanding into other markets.  

 

You're right that market share in an of itself doesn't pay bills, but when you have greater market share and good profit margins, your profit is greater than when you have good profit margins and less market share.

post #42 of 100
"We are losing money on every unit we sell, but we'll make it up on volume" -- That's the strategy analysts like to hear.
post #43 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Who said anything about cut-rate products?  

Every analyst on the planet.

Next question?
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post #44 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Every analyst on the planet.

Next question?

I think you're misjudging their recommendations.  First, they're calling for a larger iPhone.  That larger iPhone would probably be even more expensive than the current iPhone because of a higher resolution screen and a larger battery.  Second, when they call for a less expensive model, they're almost always recommending it for markets outside the US where carrier subsidies are not as common.  I don't understand why you don't want Apple to market their products to a wider audience, either here in the US with a larger iPhone or overseas with a cheaper one.

post #45 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

I think you're misjudging their recommendations.  First, they're calling for a larger iPhone. Second, when they call for a less expensive model, they're almost always recommending it for markets outside the US where carrier subsidies are not as common. I don't understand why you don't want Apple to market their products to a wider audience, either here in the US with a larger iPhone or overseas with a cheaper one.

In this article they're calling for a larger phone. In previous articles, the analysts have been all over themselves whining for Apple to produce a low cost phone for China and other developing countries.

I don't have any problem with Apple appealing to a larger audience. I do, however, object to their introducing crappy products in order to do so or selling products at extremely low margins. And some of the prices given by analysts were so low that it would be impossible to sell a product at a reasonable margin without making a crappy one.

Apple is an experience company. They sell high quality products that offer superior user experience. Better to lose a few users than to give up the things that make them great.
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post #46 of 100
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Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

I think you're misjudging their recommendations.  First, they're calling for a larger iPhone.  That larger iPhone would probably be even more expensive than the current iPhone because of a higher resolution screen and a larger battery.  Second, when they call for a less expensive model, they're almost always recommending it for markets outside the US where carrier subsidies are not as common.  I don't understand why you don't want Apple to market their products to a wider audience, either here in the US with a larger iPhone or overseas with a cheaper one.

But you're misjudging their legitimacy. Your comment has not been well received because you seem to have accepted the validity of what these "analysts" say. They have no business "calling for" Apple to do anything, especially to follow Samsung's "lead."

If you divorce your point of view from that of these parasites—the poisonous parasites they have shown themselves to be recently—then maybe you could get your point under the door. Giving the "analysts" any respect at all, as a class, is to be on the wrong side of history. They will be marginalized into pariahs, as soon as "journalists" get the idea. They should never appear without "quote marks" here. "Analysts" indeed.
post #47 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

The issue is not Apple's profits, which are doing quite well. The long term issue is the market size for each ecosystem. If Android eventually takes the vast majority of the market, that will effect Apple in many ways, all of them bad. They cannot just sit on their laurels and hope for the best (not that I think they are).

 

Apple has never cared about gaining marketshare. If they did, Macs would be $500, iPads would be $200 tops and iPhones would be free

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #48 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post


But you're misjudging their legitimacy. Your comment has not been well received because you seem to have accepted the validity of what these "analysts" say. They have no business "calling for" Apple to do anything, especially to follow Samsung's "lead."

If you divorce your point of view from that of these parasites—the poisonous parasites they have shown themselves to be recently—then maybe you could get your point under the door. Giving the "analysts" any respect at all, as a class, is to be on the wrong side of history. They will be marginalized into pariahs, as soon as "journalists" get the idea. They should never appear without "quote marks" here. "Analysts" indeed.

Frankly I don't care if anyone accepts my view or not.  It's typically contrary to the general sentiment here anyway.

 

That said, these analysts are not the morons so many here think them to be.  They have enormous resources backing their research because their analysis is used by the financial institutions to manage assets in massive portfolios.  These analysts specialize in particular industries and learn as much as they can from any source within the industry to make judgments about likely future performance of industry players.

post #49 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Frankly I don't care if anyone accepts my view or not.  It's typically contrary to the general sentiment here anyway.

That said, these analysts are not the morons so many here think them to be.  They have enormous resources backing their research because their analysis is used by the financial institutions to manage assets in massive portfolios.  These analysts specialize in particular industries and learn as much as they can from any source within the industry to make judgments about likely future performance of industry players.

Then please explain why they're so consistently wrong? Where's the Apple television that most major analysts have been predicting for years, for example?
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post #50 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Frankly I don't care if anyone accepts my view or not.  It's typically contrary to the general sentiment here anyway.

That said, these analysts are not the morons so many here think them to be.  They have enormous resources backing their research because their analysis is used by the financial institutions to manage assets in massive portfolios.  These analysts specialize in particular industries and learn as much as they can from any source within the industry to make judgments about likely future performance of industry players.

Yes but they never admit to being wrong. They say the product must not be ready or it is delayed.

Apple will expand its product line if and only if it can make a damn good product and have oodles of profit. It isn't going to make a cheap or 5" phone because Sammy does. I do predict a 5" as that appears to be a hole in the product line.
post #51 of 100
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post
Yes but they never admit to being wrong. They say the product must not be ready or it is delayed.

Apple will expand its product line if and only if it can make a damn good product and have oodles of profit. It isn't going to make a cheap or 5" phone because Sammy does. 

 

Absolutely right. 


I do predict a 5" as that appears to be a hole in the product line.

 

There will always be a fabricated hole. If Apple is stupid enough to make a 5" "phone", people will whine there's no 5.2" model.

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post #52 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Absolutely right. 

There will always be a fabricated hole. If Apple is stupid enough to make a 5" "phone", people will whine there's no 5.2" model.

As I've said before, if there's a lot of money to be made, Apple will investigate it. Again, it will release a 5" when Apple feels it's good and ready.
post #53 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Then please explain why they're so consistently wrong? Where's the Apple television that most major analysts have been predicting for years, for example?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Yes but they never admit to being wrong. They say the product must not be ready or it is delayed.

Apple will expand its product line if and only if it can make a damn good product and have oodles of profit. It isn't going to make a cheap or 5" phone because Sammy does. I do predict a 5" as that appears to be a hole in the product line.

I couldn't tell you why they get it wrong except to say it's hard to predict the future.

And you're right about Apple not making a larger phone simply because Samsung does. No company operates on a principle like that. I think the better way to interpret the analysts' statements is to view them in the context of market pressure. If Samsung, HTC, Motorola, and the rest are changing consumers' impression of what a smartphone should be, then Apple has to respond to the view of consumers. It's quite clear that the iPhone is loved by consumers, which is why analysts are not calling for Apple to abandon the current model. It's also quite clear, however, that Apple can be successful with larger and cheaper models in addition simply due to market demand, not because it's what Samsung does.
post #54 of 100
Samsung is selling a lot of large screen devices, Galaxy 3 and Note. These are the only devices which can generate anything like iPhone sales numbers. Customers who purchased these devices had nothing in that size range from Apple to even consider. That is over 40 million sales in which Apple is not competitive. And, these are Samsung's high end, high profit devices, their crown jewels.
From a marketing standpoint, this does not sound wise to me. The more Sammy sells, the more justification there is for another resolution in the iOS universe, one that can support a 5-5.5 inch screen. Time to cut off Samsung's air supply by making a device in this size range. Watch as Sammy's profits stall.
post #55 of 100
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post
As I've said before, if there's a lot of money to be made, Apple will investigate it.

 

Yep!


 Again, it will release a 5" when Apple feels it's good and ready.

 

If at all. Right on the mark.

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post #56 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post


I couldn't tell you why they get it wrong except to say it's hard to predict the future.

It has nothing to do with predicting the future. It is clearly a matter of them simply making something up and pretending it has a basis in reality.

We've been hearing for years that Apple has a TV already in production and will be shipping it in a matter of months. This is supposedly information from their alleged inside sources who claim to know that it's already underway. Or an iPhone mini that is already in production to ship next quarter. Or Apple has already reached a decision to switch to OLED (which supposedly happened years ago but apparently hasn't come true). Or predictions for years that Apple's NEXT MBA will be based on ARM.

If they had said "I don't know what's happening, but based on my knowledge of the market, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple does xyz", no one would be hard on them. Instead, they pretend inside knowledge and make their pronouncements claiming that something is a done deal and already in production - which turns out to be a complete fabrication.
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post #57 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


It has nothing to do with predicting the future. It is clearly a matter of them simply making something up and pretending it has a basis in reality.

We've been hearing for years that Apple has a TV already in production and will be shipping it in a matter of months. This is supposedly information from their alleged inside sources who claim to know that it's already underway. Or an iPhone mini that is already in production to ship next quarter. Or Apple has already reached a decision to switch to OLED (which supposedly happened years ago but apparently hasn't come true). Or predictions for years that Apple's NEXT MBA will be based on ARM.

If they had said "I don't know what's happening, but based on my knowledge of the market, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple does xyz", no one would be hard on them. Instead, they pretend inside knowledge and make their pronouncements claiming that something is a done deal and already in production - which turns out to be a complete fabrication.

That certainly would be better phrasing.  Perhaps that is the way they phrase their results.  Here on AI, I've never seen an actual report linked in the articles.  The authors seem to pick the most controversial points when they write articles referencing analysis of Apple and paraphrase the original report.

post #58 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Frankly I don't care if anyone accepts my view or not.  It's typically contrary to the general sentiment here anyway.

That said, these analysts are not the morons so many here think them to be.  They have enormous resources backing their research because their analysis is used by the financial institutions to manage assets in massive portfolios.  These analysts specialize in particular industries and learn as much as they can from any source within the industry to make judgments about likely future performance of industry players.

No, they're not morons.
But two questions:
1. Are they smarter than Apple's leadership?
2. Are these recommendations what's best for Apple, or what's best for them?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #59 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

That certainly would be better phrasing.  Perhaps that is the way they phrase their results.  Here on AI, I've never seen an actual report linked in the articles.  The authors seem to pick the most controversial points when they write articles referencing analysis of Apple and paraphrase the original report.

You haven't been paying attention, then.
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post #60 of 100

No, actually.

Apple has (almost) always had a strategy of taking the profitable portion of the market and letting others fight for the rest. They know that success is not about market share, but profit share. This strategy has served them well and will continue to do so in the future, even in emerging markets. It is a long view, but effective. The only reason Apple might end up with a majority of the market in any space (as they have in portable music players) is if their offering has so transformed the space that the majority of the the market has transformed into a lucrative one for their more complete and integrated offering.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

At some point market share will impact profit share. Apple has to be mindful of market numbers. I don't see how they can maintain a 70% or whatever it now is profit share and see their global market share in sales decline every single quarter. Eventually many of these people that buy these crappy and super cheap Android phones will buy more expensive models and if they are already in the Android ecosystem and are familiar with that platform they will be more likely to stick with it. 

 

Apple is not doomed if they don't release a smaller and larger iPhone this year. Nor are they doomed if they do. They have time to address concerns at least until 2014. But eventually I think these analysts are correct and Apple will have a cheap, standard, and large version to compete in the global market space. What works in the U.S. doesn't always work in other countries and even in the U.S. the trend is for larger displays. They are getting hit on both sides. Without a larger display iPhone this year you might see a lot of iPhone defectors to Android. 

 

The cheapest phone Apple now sells overseas is the iPhone 4 for $500. A 2 1/2 year old phone selling for that dear a price is just not going to cut it. If they can make a 16GB iPod touch and sell it for a nice profit at $199 there is no reason why they couldn't at $330 either. The phone specific parts are not that expensive especially if it is just a 3G phone without LTE. 

post #61 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

If Samsung, HTC, Motorola, and the rest are changing consumers' impression of what a smartphone should be, then Apple has to respond to the view of consumers. It's quite clear that the iPhone is loved by consumers, which is why analysts are not calling for Apple to abandon the current model. It's also quite clear, however, that Apple can be successful with larger and cheaper models in addition simply due to market demand, not because it's what Samsung does.

Apple doesn't need to respond. If it did, it would have released a Mac Netbook, a sub $500 Mac, and an iPhone with a physical keyboard. Apple sold 48MM iPhones last quarter when the SG3 and Note were out.
post #62 of 100

I'm and AAPL shareholder.

I call it another buying opportunity. :-)

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


True, but AAPL shareholders care - every time these analysts open their mouths, the stock falls some more. Even when their ramblings are consistently shown to be nonsense later, the damage has already been done. Everyone repeats these "Apple is doomed" stories. No one repeats the "never mind" stories.
post #63 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

No, they're not morons.
But two questions:
1. Are they smarter than Apple's leadership?
2. Are these recommendations what's best for Apple, or what's best for them?

1. They're not more knowledgeable about Apple's product plans, but may be more in touch with industry trends.
2. The recommendations are what they think financial managers should watch for, which implies they are the best for shareholders. If you subscribe to the belief that what's best for the shareholders the same as what is best for the bottom line, then yes that's what they think is best for Apple. Is it actually best for Apple? Nobody can know until the results of Apple's decisions are seen.
Edited by wakefinance - 2/19/13 at 7:20pm
post #64 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

You haven't been paying attention, then.

Care to give me a link? I'd like to read one of their full reports.
post #65 of 100

There's usually a link to the original article (varies by AI author) if it is not behind a pay wall.

 

For the rest, Google works well, although it may take a few minutes depending on your skill and luck.


Edited by DESuserIGN - 2/19/13 at 7:46pm
post #66 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Apple doesn't need to respond. If it did, it would have released a Mac Netbook, a sub $500 Mac, and an iPhone with a physical keyboard. Apple sold 48MM iPhones last quarter when the SG3 and Note were out.

Apple does need to respond. They respond to consumers' demands every time they update one of their models with a faster chip, more RAM, or a brighter screen. There is a line, however, that they don't cross when it comes to margins. Netbooks and sub $500 PCs are not realistic options for increasing profits. The keyboard isn't widely demanded by consumers at the expense of other features like weight and size; if it were then more than a few phones would have physical keyboards.

Finally, I've said this about sales before: when someone wants iOS, they buy an iPhone. All sales of iOS phones are sales of iPhones. If there were other phones running iOS, sales of the iPhone would decrease because consumers would have more than one choice. Even though sales of the iPhone would be lower in this scenario, sales of iOS devices would be higher due to the fact that consumers would have more hardware options, options that would reduce the chance for a given limiting factor to sway a person away from an iOS device. I want to see Apple make some of those other hardware options a reality. Of course in this reality these other iOS devices would still be iPhones, and all the additional sales would go to Apple.
post #67 of 100

RE: 1. "Industry trends" — that's laughable. The industry trend in this space is what Apple did 3 or 4 years ago. Apple is an innovator, which means they create industry trends. Apple's competitors are "phone manufacturers," which makes them followers.

RE: 2. You are a quibbler of Olympic talent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post


1. They're not more knowledgeable about Apple's product plans, but may be more in touch with industry trends.
2. The recommendations are what they think financial managers should watch for, which implies they are the best for shareholders. If you subscribe to the belief that what's best for the shareholders the same as what's is best for the bottom line, then yes that's what they think is best for Apple. Is it actually best for Apple? Nobody can know until the results of Apple's decisions are seen.
post #68 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by DESuserIGN View Post

RE: 1. "Industry trends" — that's laughable. The industry trend in this space is what Apple did 3 or 4 years ago. Apple is an innovator, which means they create industry trends. Apple's competitors are "phone manufacturers," which makes them followers.

RE: 2. You are a quibbler of Olympic talent.

 

RE: RE: 1. Apple hasn't done most of the things that Android phone manufacturers are doing with their phones.  I'm not saying that the iPhone isn't competitive or even that it's worse, but it's evident that Android phones are packing in new technologies and features that Apple hasn't yet touched.

RE: RE: 2. Thank you very much!  That's the compliment of a lifetime considering the quibbling on these forums.

post #69 of 100

Well, that's indeed true. There's no lack of quibbling talent representing a variety of viewpoints here at AI.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

RE: RE: 2. Thank you very much!  That's the compliment of a lifetime considering the quibbling on these forums.

post #70 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Frankly I don't care if anyone accepts my view or not.  It's typically contrary to the general sentiment here anyway.

 

That said, these analysts are not the morons so many here think them to be.  They have enormous resources backing their research because their analysis is used by the financial institutions to manage assets in massive portfolios.  These analysts specialize in particular industries and learn as much as they can from any source within the industry to make judgments about likely future performance of industry players.

 

Besides the analysts that you're defending, I can think of one other profession where they can be wrong 75% of the time and not get fired.....and consumers still come back---time and time again---for their advise.

 

Weather people.

 

My opinion? Anyone that takes advise from anyone in either profession.....is foolish.

Why does Apple bashing and trolling make people feel so good?

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post #71 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

2. The recommendations are what they think financial managers should watch for, which implies they are the best for shareholders. If you subscribe to the belief that what's best for the shareholders the same as what is best for the bottom line, then yes that's what they think is best for Apple. Is it actually best for Apple? Nobody can know until the results of Apple's decisions are seen.

Apple has the most profitable CY in human history yet it wasn't good enough for these analysts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Apple does need to respond. They respond to consumers' demands every time they update one of their models with a faster chip, more RAM, or a brighter screen.

Finally, I've said this about sales before: when someone wants iOS, they buy an iPhone. All sales of iOS phones are sales of iPhones. If there were other phones running iOS, sales of the iPhone would decrease because consumers would have more than one choice. Even though sales of the iPhone would be lower in this scenario, sales of iOS devices would be higher due to the fact that consumers would have more hardware options, options that would reduce the chance for a given limiting factor to sway a person away from an iOS device. I want to see Apple make some of those other hardware options a reality. Of course in this reality these other iOS devices would still be iPhones, and all the additional sales would go to Apple.

The upgrades are evolutionary. They weren't going to stick with the original iPhone specs forever. If Apple waited to respond to what customers want, there be no iDevice in the first place. Apple is HW. Unless they license iOS at $300 a pop, they aren't going to do it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

RE: RE: 1. Apple hasn't done most of the things that Android phone manufacturers are doing with their phones.  I'm not saying that the iPhone isn't competitive or even that it's worse, but it's evident that Android phones are packing in new technologies and features that Apple hasn't yet touched.

Spec list warning! NFC? Check. Stylus? Check. Can run split screen apps? check, although only 20 are available. Have you ever bought a car based on a spec sheet?
post #72 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

There will always be a fabricated hole. If Apple is stupid enough to make a 5" "phone", people will whine there's no 5.2" model.

And by "hole" I don't mean a hull breach in a sinking ship. I mean "we have a cruise ship with a gap on the deck. Lets put a frigging wave pool here!"

A 5" won't replace the 4".
post #73 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


The upgrades are evolutionary. They weren't going to stick with the original iPhone specs forever. If Apple waited to respond to what customers want, there be no iDevice in the first place. Apple is HW. Unless they license iOS at $300 a pop, they aren't going to do it.

Spec list warning! NFC? Check. Stylus? Check. Can run split screen apps? check, although only 20 are available. Have you ever bought a car based on a spec sheet?

You're getting there.  Why did Apple make these changes?  Were they made out of the goodness of management's hearts?  Were they made on a dare?  Apple made these changes because consumers demanded them.

 

Call it what you want, features are features, and the iPhone has fewer, so it's not fair to say that Android manufacturers are following Apple's lead.

post #74 of 100
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post
Why did Apple make these changes? Apple made these changes because consumers demanded them.

 

Wait, what changes?


…features are features…

 

Mmm… I disagree with this.

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post #75 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

You're getting there.  Why did Apple make these changes?  Were they made out of the goodness of management's hearts?  Were they made on a dare?  Apple made these changes because consumers demanded them.

Call it what you want, features are features, and the iPhone has fewer, so it's not fair to say that Android manufacturers are following Apple's lead.

Consumers didn't demand in-plane switching, Retina screens, glass backs, aluminum unibody chassis, thinner and lighter, glass-to-film touch layers, machined phone cases—all these things that "analysts" (and maybe you) fail to see are the driving challenges that cause Apple's engineers and designers to do what they do. The company is motivated by urges for technical excellence that people who sit at desks and think about competition for market share don't understand. Or can't even see when they are pointed out to them.

This is why "analysts" get Apple so wrong so often, and why I personally think they are a doomed parasitic encrustation on the new kind of market system we find ourselves in. Apple is something they have never had to deal with before: a company that succeeds by a self-directed drive to "trip out" their customers with a good experience, to enrich people's lives with great products, in their words. Cynical old-market thinkers can't handle this level of sincerity. They think Apple plays by the old rules of competition and change for change's sake. Clearly Apple does not work this way.

Gruber links today to a discussion on this very point of Samsung's "innovation." Not to be missed.
post #76 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Wait, what changes?

 

Mmm… I disagree with this.

The evolutionary changes as he called them.

 

I think there are ways that Apple has led too.  Don't worry Tallest!

post #77 of 100

Given the opportunity, people generally value usable capabilities that make sense and fit into their lives. This is the only "feature" they care about.

That's why Apple designs products that provide this sort value offering. They design for an optimum and valuable user experience, not for a list of "features."

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

Call it what you want, features are features, and the iPhone has fewer, so it's not fair to say that Android manufacturers are following Apple's lead.

post #78 of 100

Dito! +5

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post


Consumers didn't demand in-plane switching, Retina screens, glass backs, aluminum unibody chassis, thinner and lighter, glass-to-film touch layers, machined phone cases—all these things that "analysts" (and maybe you) fail to see are the driving challenges that cause Apple's engineers and designers to do what they do. The company is motivated by urges for technical excellence that people who sit at desks and think about competition for market share don't understand. Or can't even see when they are pointed out to them.

This is why "analysts" get Apple so wrong so often, and why I personally think they are a doomed parasitic encrustation on the new kind of market system we find ourselves in. Apple is something they have never had to deal with before: a company that succeeds by a self-directed drive to "trip out" their customers with a good experience, to enrich people's lives with great products, in their words. Cynical old-market thinkers can't handle this level of sincerity. They think Apple plays by the old rules of competition and change for change's sake. Clearly Apple does not work this way.

Gruber links today to a discussion on this very point of Samsung's "innovation." Not to be missed.
post #79 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post


Consumers didn't demand in-plane switching, Retina screens, glass backs, aluminum unibody chassis, thinner and lighter, glass-to-film touch layers, machined phone cases—all these things that "analysts" (and maybe you) fail to see are the driving challenges that cause Apple's engineers and designers to do what they do. The company is motivated by urges for technical excellence that people who sit at desks and think about competition for market share don't understand. Or can't even see when they are pointed out to them.

This is why "analysts" get Apple so wrong so often, and why I personally think they are a doomed parasitic encrustation on the new kind of market system we find ourselves in. Apple is something they have never had to deal with before: a company that succeeds by a self-directed drive to "trip out" their customers with a good experience, to enrich people's lives with great products, in their words. Cynical old-market thinkers can't handle this level of sincerity. They think Apple plays by the old rules of competition and change for change's sake. Clearly Apple does not work this way.

Gruber links today to a discussion on this very point of Samsung's "innovation." Not to be missed.

 

 

They don't have to demand IPS specifically to be demanding a better screen.  That Apple chose IPS for their Retina display shows that they take pride in their work.   I honestly don't think that Apple is self-motivated to evolve their products.  I think they take enormous pride in what they produce, but the goal has always been and will always be to make money.  If consumers weren't demanding that Apple add features and upgrade their components, then they wouldn't pay for new models.

post #80 of 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post


They don't have to demand IPS specifically to be demanding a better screen.  That Apple chose IPS for their Retina display shows that they take pride in their work.   I honestly don't think that Apple is self-motivated to evolve their products.  I think they take enormous pride in what they produce, but the goal has always been and will always be to make money.  If consumers weren't demanding that Apple add features and upgrade their components, then they wouldn't pay for new models.

Well, it's an old argument. Sir Jony says they don't do it for the money, but the money showers down anyway.

Who are we to argue with him?
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