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Apple's iPhone 5 and iPhone 4S are world's two most popular smartphone models - Page 2

post #41 of 75
2/20/13 at 11:19am
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Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Only if it has the 1080p's. I gotta have the 1080p's.

And a stylus! Waiting for Apple's response. AAPL down 100.
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post #42 of 75
2/20/13 at 11:22am
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Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

But Apple is still doomed, right?

Aren't we all from Day 1?
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Winston Churchill
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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post #43 of 75
2/20/13 at 11:40am

I had 4S and now the 5. Yeah it's nicer but I'm sorry with over 156Bn in their checking account, I'd expected a bit more from APPL. As much as I dislike samsung, everytime I see one of their phone, its a constant reminder of how bigger is somehow better. We're all used to that notion anyway... so making the phone a bit longer  with minor improvments is not what I'm looking for from APPL. Now they're talking about coming withe a new cheaper iPhone!!! No thanks, please charge us a bit more as you've been doing for the past 10 years SO WELL and announce a product that would have a wow effect before all are cash are traded in Korea rather than here. 

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post #44 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Exactly, especially because there's no way 15 millions S3 were sold this quarter (and 18 the last one).

Still, one can be assured that they (samsung) sold more than than 10 million, that means that 10 million people are absolutely stupid and retarded. For me watching someone with a galaxy s3 is like watching those guys and girls with pants bellow their asses. It's retarded and it quickly shows how stupid and ignorant they are. 
I'm waiting for the Galaxy 4 to appear.
It will have 8 cores and 32 GPUs. 16 GB of RAM. It will measure 12 inches in screen size to to be able to store the extra hardware and huge batteries to run the thing.
It will have 12, not 1, slots for expanded memory.
The UI will be margarine smooth.
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post #45 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Why not? Do you have proof that they didn't?
I agree with him and not you.
Samsung does not reveal sold numbers nor do Apple reveal model breakdowns.
So you calling him to prove a point that cannot be verified and dubious is rather silly. Can't you go to an android site and be happy there ?
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post #46 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:12pm
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Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

URL?
You are funny, every time you ask for citations, get of your behind and look for yourself.
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post #47 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling View Post

So...

+47.8 million total sold
-27.4 million iPhone 5
-17.4 million iPhone 4S
=================
= 3 million iPhone 4

Interesting.  The lowest priced one is selling the lowest amount, by far.  

Of course, it's also the oldest and is missing Siri.

Proof there's no low end iPhone market?  Or just not low priced enough?  Or ... ?
Thanks for the MATH lesson. I think most people could do it in their heads.
So your conclusion is the correct one?
Think before you post.
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post #48 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post


I'm waiting for the Galaxy 4 to appear.
It will have 8 cores and 32 GPUs. 16 GB of RAM . . . 

The rumor-mill says that Samsung won't be using their Exynos 5 Octa (8-core) processor for the next Galaxy phone, instead opting for the Exynos 5440 quad-core. Ram is still said to be 2GB, not 16. Launch is supposedly late March, but everything is only rumor of course. Nothing official.

melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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post #49 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post

I agree with him and not you.
Samsung does not reveal sold numbers nor do Apple reveal model breakdowns.
So you calling him to prove a point that cannot be verified and dubious is rather silly. Can't you go to an android site and be happy there ?

Of course you believe him, it's what you want to hear and it's what mindless sheep do. Me, I question everything whether I want to hear it or not.
"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Winston Churchill
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Winston Churchill
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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post #50 of 75
2/20/13 at 12:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post


You are funny, every time you ask for citations, get of your behind and look for yourself.

Sorry that my asking for the URL was so deeply offensive for you.  I'd found it on my own not long after; rather unremarkable posts there, not worth the visit.

 

Have a better day.

"Surely it is possible to love Apple products and still respect what others have achieved?" - Stelligent
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post #51 of 75
2/20/13 at 1:04pm
Best selling phone.....is this a my dad can beat your dad moment.



Apple's stock price says otherwise!
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post #52 of 75
2/20/13 at 2:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

Money talks and bullshit walks. They can release all the studies they want, it still wont change the fact Apple didnt had any YoY EPS growth between Q4 2011 and Q4 2012. This is despite the fact the iphone had 25% YoY growth and the ipad had 47% YoY growth in unit sales.

If bullshit walks, you must be a world class walker.

First, Apple's EPS did grow by 7% on a weekly basis. Last year had one extra week. That's considerably more than the Wall Street average - and Apple's EPS is already greatly depressed. And it is also an increase over results that no other company seems to be able to match. If Billy Jo McGuffrey improves his time in a race by 5%, it's no big deal. If Michael Phelps improves his time by 5%, it's huge.

Second, Apple previously explained that they had enormous investments in product launches in Q4 - which would reduce margins at first.

Finally, Apple's results (7% increase YoY) were obtained even in spite of major product shortages due to the launch of new products.

There's absolutely nothing rational about the pummeling of AAPL. By any reasonable metric, the stock is grossly under-priced.
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post #53 of 75
2/20/13 at 2:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamC View Post

Perhaps
Perhaps you are not aware that 1st 2012 had 14 weeks vs 13 weeks got 1st 2013 or you are simply ignorant.

Sorry didn't mean to lecture someone who was into stocks since llci or whatever.

I am very aware of this. If you take the 2011 xtra week into account we get 8% YoY EPS growth. To me this is still insignificant growth compare to what Apple did between 2007 and 2011. We are getting dangerously close to negative growth which will be even more horrible for the stock.
Edited by herbapou - 2/20/13 at 3:50pm
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post #54 of 75
2/20/13 at 2:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

If bullshit walks, you must be a world class walker.

First, Apple's EPS did grow by 7% on a weekly basis. Last year had one extra week. That's considerably more than the Wall Street average - and Apple's EPS is already greatly depressed. And it is also an increase over results that no other company seems to be able to match. If Billy Jo McGuffrey improves his time in a race by 5%, it's no big deal. If Michael Phelps improves his time by 5%, it's huge.

Second, Apple previously explained that they had enormous investments in product launches in Q4 - which would reduce margins at first.

Finally, Apple's results (7% increase YoY) were obtained even in spite of major product shortages due to the launch of new products.

There's absolutely nothing rational about the pummeling of AAPL. By any reasonable metric, the stock is grossly under-priced.

This is one of the reasons i am still holding my leaps. But we are bottom feeding here, if Apple would have done the usual growth we had in the past 5 years, we wouldnt be arguing about all those details. The story has changed and the stock as reacted to it. Apple went to growth stock to a value stock that may or may not be a down stock. That is one hell of a change.
Edited by herbapou - 2/20/13 at 3:52pm
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post #55 of 75
2/20/13 at 3:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

I have a problem with that. you do realize they just had the best quarter ever with one less week, right? of course they won't grow so quickly again... They can't.

 

you and others like you talk like if apple is on a crysis.

 

 

Apple, the company is not in a crisis, but they stock sure is.  Stock price is based on 2 things:

 

1. Valuation (Stock price divide by earning per share will give you the Price/earning indicator, which is one of many valuation stat)

2. Hopes of growth.

 

  • The more "hopes of growth" there is, the more stock price will "expand" compare to its valuation, making the the P/E indicator bigger. The logic is if the company earns more in the future, the valuation will improve to the justify the price.
  • If the "hopes of growth" are neutral, the company becomes a 'value' play.  The P/E will be set depending on interest rates and broad market performance. Value stock P/E average is around 14 at this time.
  • If the"hopes of growth' are negative, then the stock will trade below its valuation, the P/E will be very small making the stock "to seem" attractive on valuation, but its all "fake" because if the company is earning less, it wont be able to keep the current valuation which will be worst and worst as time passed.

 

The current Apple P/E is around 10, which is below the average "value" stock of 14.  This indicates investors thinks Apple will have negative growth in the near future. The tricky part is people don't think Apple will sell less units, but they think the margins will compress to the point it will stall earnings or even reduce them. I personally  thinks Apple is getting oversold below $450, so I will be adding january 2015 calls on dips below $450.  But this will only work if Apple can reverse the trend and go back to some kind of EPS growth.


Edited by herbapou - 2/20/13 at 3:26pm
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post #56 of 75
2/20/13 at 3:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

This is one of the reasons i am still holding my leaps. But we are bottom feeding here, if Apple would have done the usual growth we had in the past 5 years, we wouldnt be arguing about all those details. The story has changed and the stock as reacted to it.

I wonder when 7% growth became lackluster.
You can't have record breaking qtrs every qtr for the rest of time. It's unreasonable expectations base on wishful analyst thinking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post


Apple, the company is not in a crisis, but they stock sure is.  Stock price is based on 2 things:

1. Valuation (Stock price divide by earning per share will give you the Price/earning indicator, which is one of many valuation stat)
2. Hopes of growth.
...

Explain Amazon.
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post #57 of 75
2/20/13 at 4:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


I wonder when 7% growth became lackluster.
You can't have record breaking qtrs every qtr for the rest of time. It's unreasonable expectations base on wishful analyst thinking.
Explain Amazon.

 

Going from 100% to 7% in a year is a pretty big drop. Apple went from "high hopes of growth" to "neutral to negative" hopes of growth in a few months. 7% is a great value stock growth rate indeed.  But until recently Apple was not a value stock. If Apple can maintain even only 7% EPS growth next year its currently undervalue even by value stock metrics. Keep in mind that the transition from a growth stock to a value stock means a lot of shares need to change hands, keeping the stock in the "mud" so to speak. Also, the yield is still to low for a value stock, Apple needs to double dividends to help the transition.

 

Amazon investors have very high "hopes of growth".   Amazon also has margins problems because they are too low. Even a small improvement on margins will completely change Amazon valuation.  Also, Amazon still is the leader on e-commerce, maintaining the hopes high.

 

That being said, "hopes of growth" is very subjective, this is why sometimes investors are dead wrong.


Edited by herbapou - 2/20/13 at 4:17pm
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post #58 of 75
2/20/13 at 4:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

Going from 100% to 7% in a year is a pretty big drop. Apple went from "high hopes of growth" to "neutral to negative" hopes of growth in a few months. 7% is a great value stock growth rate indeed.  But until recently Apple was not a value stock. If can maintain even only 7% growth next year its currently undervalue even by value stock metrics.

Amazon investors have very high "hopes of growth".   Amazon also has margins problems because they are too low. Even a small improvement on margins will completely change Amazon valuation.  Also, Amazon still is the leader on e-commerce, maintaining the hopes high.

That being said, "hopes of growth" is very subjective, this is why sometimes investors are dead wrong.

Amazon has had 1 profitable qtr in its existence. Apple made more profit in the last qtr than Amazon has made in its existence.

Oh and when did they have 100% growth?
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post #59 of 75
2/20/13 at 4:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


Amazon has had 1 profitable qtr in its existence. Apple made more profit in the last qtr than Amazon has made in its existence.

Oh and when did they have 100% growth?

 

1. like I said, Amazon "hopes of growth" are very high.

 

2. http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/eps_growth

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post #60 of 75
2/20/13 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


Amazon has had 1 profitable qtr in its existence.

As TS would suggest, citation needed.  As ankleskater would clarify, from an authoritative source.

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post #61 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

 

1. like I said, Amazon "hopes of growth" are very high.

 

2. http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/eps_growth

 

How many years can these "hopes of growth" be stretched out for?

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post #62 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

The rumor-mill says that Samsung won't be using their Exynos 5 Octa (8-core) processor for the next Galaxy phone, instead opting for the Exynos 5440 quad-core. Ram is still said to be 2GB, not 16. Launch is supposedly late March, but everything is only rumor of course. Nothing official.

I was joking.

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post #63 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:42pm
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Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


Of course you believe him, it's what you want to hear and it's what mindless sheep do. Me, I question everything whether I want to hear it or not.

Android ?

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post #64 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

 

1. like I said, Amazon "hopes of growth" are very high.

 

2. http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/eps_growth

So hope is better than actual is it ?

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post #65 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:45pm
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Originally Posted by hfts View Post

So hope is better than actual is it ?

 

So it seems.

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post #66 of 75
2/20/13 at 5:54pm
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Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

As TS would suggest, citation needed.  As ankleskater would clarify, from an authoritative source.

Sorry, I misspoke. I confused amazon with something else
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post #67 of 75
2/20/13 at 6:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post


I'm waiting for the Galaxy 4 to appear.
It will have 8 cores and 32 GPUs. 16 GB of RAM. It will measure 12 inches in screen size to to be able to store the extra hardware and huge batteries to run the thing.
It will have 12, not 1, slots for expanded memory.
The UI will be margarine smooth.

 

It will be on par with the new HTC phone, the HTC phone will fail because their sales aren't based on overhyped marketing.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #68 of 75
2/20/13 at 6:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenkan View Post

...please charge us a bit more as you've been doing for the past 10 years SO WELL and announce a product that would have a wow effect before all are cash are traded in Korea rather than here. 

 

My iPhone 5 cost more than my iPhone 4, only because I opted for the 64GB model, the price was on par with what I paid for my 16GB 3G.

 

iPhone prices have steadily dropped or remained the same, what is this "charge us a little bit more" nonsense?

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #69 of 75
2/20/13 at 6:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

 

1. like I said, Amazon "hopes of growth" are very high.

 

2. http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/eps_growth

 

Please explain.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #70 of 75
2/20/13 at 6:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


Of course you believe him, it's what you want to hear and it's what mindless sheep do. Me, I question everything whether I want to hear it or not.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post

Android ?

 

Google overlords?

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #71 of 75
2/20/13 at 7:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Sorry, I misspoke. I confused amazon with something else


No problem.  The market's been all over the place in recent months, easy to get the edgy stocks mixed up.

 

And Amazon does run on very slender margins, but aside from the last quarter their slow growth has been just steady enough over the years to earn some reasonable attention from investors.

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post #72 of 75
2/20/13 at 8:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Please explain.

Dont expect me to explain why amazon "hopes" are so high i dont get it myself. Imo that thing is way way overbought. I sure dont share those hopes.
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post #73 of 75
2/21/13 at 5:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post


No problem.  The market's been all over the place in recent months, easy to get the edgy stocks mixed up.

And Amazon does run on very slender margins, but aside from the last quarter their slow growth has been just steady enough over the years to earn some reasonable attention from investors.

Investors believe that company like Amazon which operates on slim margins and doing brisk business is most likely to go up, and believe that phenomenal growth like Apple has achieved is unsustainable and will eventually go down.
"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Winston Churchill
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Winston Churchill
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX to whom I bid farewell.
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post #74 of 75
2/21/13 at 8:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hfts View Post


I'm waiting for the Galaxy 4 to appear.
It will have 8 cores and 32 GPUs. 16 GB of RAM. It will measure 12 inches in screen size to to be able to store the extra hardware and huge batteries to run the thing.
It will have 12, not 1, slots for expanded memory.
The UI will be margarine smooth.

You forgot the 4 mini-USB ports.

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post #75 of 75
2/21/13 at 8:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamC View Post

Perhaps
Perhaps you are not aware that 1st 2012 had 14 weeks vs 13 weeks got 1st 2013 or you are simply ignorant.

Sorry didn't mean to lecture someone who was into stocks since llci or whatever.

^this^

 

Valid criticism  is always good, but let's base it on the actual math is my preference.

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