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BlackBerry could be building comeback off iPhone, Android converts

post #1 of 60
Thread Starter 
The Z10 and its accompanying BlackBerry 10 OS were something of a Hail Mary pass for troubled Canadian manufacturer BlackBerry, but that gambit may be paying off, as a new report says half of BlackBerry Z10 buyers are coming to the device having left Google's Android platform and Apple's iPhone.

Z10
BlackBerry's new Z10 smartphone. Source: New York Magazine


Precise figures on BlackBerry Z10 sales are as unavailable and will likely remain so until until BlackBerry's (n? Research In Motion) next quarterly financial disclosure. Still, a report on Thursday from FierceWireless had one-third of new BlackBerry 10 device sales coming from customers switching over from Android and iOS devices.

"The other thing that kind of surprises us," Rick Costanzo, BlackBerry's executive vice president of global sales told FierceWireless, "is that of the sales we're getting, the percentage that are actually flipping over from other platforms onto BlackBerry 10 is a lot higher than we expected. We're actually getting roughly speaking about a third coming in from outside the BlackBerry community.

Another report from BGR on Friday put that figure at half of Z10 sales for the Canadian market. BGR claimed to have independently confirmed with several high-level BlackBerry executives that half of all Z10 sales in Canada came from platform switchers.

BlackBerry has a sizable core group of devotees, but the prevailing wisdom has it that the company needs to greatly expand beyond that group if it wishes to remain a player in the smartphone segment. Such reasoning likely drove the decision to release the touchscreen-based Z10 ahead of the company's Q10 model, which also runs BlackBerry 10 but features BlackBerry's signature hardware QWERTY keyboard.

Once a major player in the smartphone market, BlackBerry was caught off guard by the emergence and sudden popularity of Apple's touchscreen-based iPhone. Over several years, the company saw its market share plummet along with revenues as consumers and large organizations abandoned its platform for devices running iOS and Android.

It is difficult to translate the news of iOS and Android converts into sales estimations for the Z10. Given that the two platforms account for roughly nine out of ten smartphones sold, the odds are that if someone had owned a smartphone before and bought a Z10, they would be coming from iOS or Android.
post #2 of 60

Hmm...call me skeptical.  Isn't this the same blackberry that lied about sales in the UK?

post #3 of 60

They may well be getting converts, but the sales figures must be very small. I am plugged into the wireless device industry and people are still buying iPhones and Androids en mass, very few are going BB, no matter the rubustness of QNX. With devices like the HTC One, Xperia Z and Galaxy 4 available or soon to be, the temptation is too strong. And there are even cooler Androids to follow, believe you me! (Not to mention rumoured 5S/6 from Apple.) The value prop of BB isn't strong enough at this juncture.

post #4 of 60

I hope BB is able to maintain a niche for itself, but no, this is not even going to have even a negligible effect on iPhone/Android sales. There's absolutely nothing that most users will see as an advantage, and there's a ton of disadvantages. I've used one, and although not a bad device, it didn't spark an ounce of excitement out of me. I don't see this coming in ahead of even Windows phone, nor do I see how these mythical "converts" might be. What advantages outweigh jumping ship and foregoing Apple or Google's ecosystem?

post #5 of 60
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
Hmm...call me skeptical.  Isn't this the same blackberry that lied about sales in the UK?

 

Nope, that was RIM. Which means the media will completely ignore it.

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post #6 of 60

A Blackberry comeback is good for everyone. The desire of so many to write its epitaph is oh so short-sighted.

post #7 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

A Blackberry comeback is good for everyone. The desire of so many to write its epitaph is oh so short-sighted.

I guess, but they committed the cardinal sin in business...complacency! :) They were content to give their customers a sh*t phone.

 

And then the iPhone came along and showed them how to do it right. They were ripping off their loyal customers by not innovating. I have no sympathy for them. I feel the same way about HP, Dell, MS, Nokia, Sony and Samsung.

post #8 of 60

In Canada, from my own experience with friends and colleagues, the RIM devotee percentage is fairly high, so it wouldn't be surprising if some people who had to switch from an older BB to either iPhone or Android, would switch back.  It will be interesting to see what their return numbers look like.  RIM/BB has made just so many mistakes over the past 3-4 years, that they have a lot of fence mending to do just to get back those that left the fold over the years.  And given people do move on (at least many people do, some don't), they'll need to prove it's worth it to make the switch back.

post #9 of 60

gee, BB lost about 75% of its customers to Android/iPhone, and now a few are actually trickling back! wow, what news!

 

"It is difficult to translate the news of iOS and Android converts into sales estimations ..." well, actually, it's impossible. but don't let that stop AI from posting this tripe.

 

you can do a little more with "...half of Z10 sales for the Canadian market ...". given that the Canadian market is maybe 2% of the global market, why it's bound to be in six figures even!

 

boy is this ever garbage can web news.

post #10 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

...  of the sales we're getting, the percentage that are actually flipping over from other platforms onto BlackBerry 10 is a lot higher than we expected. We're actually getting roughly speaking about a third coming in from outside the BlackBerry community. ...

 

This is the essential point of the article but while it sounds like good news it actually isn't.  

 

A company gets in Blackberry's position not by doing poorly by it's customers, but by not attracting new ones in what is essentially a booming market.  This is the problem that the new phones and the new OS were made to correct.  What this guy is saying however is that in essence, two thirds of their sales are to existing Blackbery owners.  Two thirds of their sales are to people who already love Blackberry so much that they hung in there over all the shit they've been going through these last few years.  This means that they actually *aren't* doing much good at attracting new converts to the new platform.  

 

It's far too little and far too late.  

 

People need a good reason to throw off iOS or Android and move to Blackberry.  It has to have some obvious thing that makes it better than iOS or Android.  Android has cheapness, and hackability which are presumably the main reasons for switching.  

 

What does Blackberry have?  Not much, and more importantly, nothing different from what it always had.  It's (slightly) better received in corporate networks, and it has the BBM service.  Neither was enough to float the original Blackberry boat, and there is no reason to think that either of those two reasons are enough to float the shiny new boat either.  

 

What we are seeing here is Blackberry die-hards upgrading to what's possibly the last Blackberry device they will own, and a few people buying the "shiny new thing" because it's being pushed like crazy by the dude in the cellphone store and it has a bit of brand recognition.  They won't be singing the same tune in December.  

post #11 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oflife View Post

I am plugged into the wireless device industry

 

I think you're doing it wrong.

post #12 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

 

I think you're doing it wrong.

Brilliant! Made me laugh! :)

post #13 of 60

This is complete rubbish and cheap propaganda.

 

There is no report. Some website happened to interview Blackberry's executive vice president of global sales, and that Blackberry executive is the one who is making the outlandish claims.  Remember how playtime was over? This is just more of the same BS.

 

Though he declined to provide exact sales figures, Rick Costanzo, Blackberry's executive vice president of global sales, said early sales of the BlackBerry Z10, the company's first BlackBerry 10 device, are exceeding expectations. 

 

So if sales are going so great and "exceeding expectations", why don't they provide any figures to back up their claims? What are their expectations, a thousand units shipped? Man up, grow some balls, and do like Apple does, release real figures if you have anything to announce, otherwise don't say anything at all. Don't waste everybody's time with useless garbage, non-information and insane speculation.

 

And also, this thing hasn't even launched in the US yet. Many of the markets where it has currently launched aren't really that important. Some crackheads (is that what crackberry forum members are called?) were boasting about how it was reportedly sold out in Dubai. Who the hell gives a crap about Dubai? lol.gif Watch out! Next, we'll hear that the new Blackberry is outselling the iPhone 5 in Somalia also!lol.gif

 

And you certainly can't trust what many Canadians say about it, because quite a few of them are totally blinded and brainwashed by some sort of pathetic nationalism, and many of them support Blackberry simply because it's Canadian. Don't believe me? Just head on over to a Blackberry forum like Crackberry and see for yourself. Many of those people are totally delusional. It is pathetic to support a company just because of it's nationality. I don't support Apple because it's American. I support Apple because they make the most kick ass products around, and they've been doing so for decades. 

post #14 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Precise figures on BlackBerry Z10 sales are as unavailable and will likely remain so until until BlackBerry's (n? Research In Motion) next quarterly financial disclosure. 

That tells you all you need to know.

 

FUD. (In this case, the last two letters in my acronym stand for '...... Useless Data').

post #15 of 60

Hope RIM can carve a foothold for themselves.  The more people competing the better for everyone regardless of which platform you like.  Should be interesting to see how the Tizen or Ubuntu platforms take off (or sink).

post #16 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

I guess, but they committed the cardinal sin in business...complacency! :) 

Oh, if it was just complacency, it would be somewhat excusable.

 

It was the sheer dismissive arrogance on top of that which gives me the schadenfreude.....

post #17 of 60
Meaningless. Show me the numbers a year from now.
post #18 of 60
Apple ][, Dubai is one of the richest cities in the world. If you can sell out there, it does mean something.
I hope BB can make a good comeback. Although their devices do not interest me, they have tried really hard to get back in the game and I think that they have a fighting chance against Windows at least (def not Apple or Android).
post #19 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbit View Post

Apple ][, Dubai is one of the richest cities in the world. If you can sell out there, it does mean something.

Dubai was on its death throes a few years ago, and was bailed out of ignominy by the emirate of something-or-the-other (a neighboring country). A lot of the 'wealth' is in the form of empty, absentee-landlord, real estate built by foreign architects and foreign labor. Yes, there are some fancy high-rises such as the Burj Khalifa, but there is no industry, no services (other than tourism and shoppers from Asia) to speak of. 

 

Blackberrys have always been popular all over the Middle East. The fact that they may do well there (or not) does not mean much at all.

post #20 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by "Apple 
[" url="/t/156270/blackberry-could-be-building-comeback-off-iphone-android-converts#post_2287086"]And you certainly can't trust what many Canadians say about it, because quite a few of them are totally blinded and brainwashed by some sort of pathetic nationalism, and many of them support Blackberry simply because it's Canadian. Don't believe me? Just head on over to a Blackberry forum like Crackberry and see for yourself. Many of those people are totally delusional. It is pathetic to support a company just because of it's nationality. I don't support Apple because it's American. I support Apple because they make the most kick ass products around, and they've been doing so for decades. 

I actually don't see any issue with Canadians supporting Blackberry because it is a Canadian company.
post #21 of 60

Who the hell gives a crap about Dubai? 

 

You mean United Arab Emirates? You should be asking if they really give a crap about America! America is broke as are its consumers. UAE is by far one of the wealthiest countries on the planet and holds most of its gold. You can't be that ignorant.

 

Uh its the powerhouse and financial center of the entire middle east including Israel, Lebanon, Saudi, Kuwait, Egypt, Jordan, Iraq and Iran.

post #22 of 60

Look, the facts speak for themselves. The younger generation is off Apple now and onto Android but uh oh, reports are coming in from Vietnam (80 million people most under 30) that there are lineups for the BB10 and Blackberry is maintaining its cult status. Does anyone know the population of Brazil where Apple lost its right to use the word iPhone? and Indonesia and India? The American hillbilly gingoists here better wake up and smell the coffee.

post #23 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanson Lockyer View Post

Look, the facts speak for themselves. The younger generation is off Apple now and onto Android but uh oh, reports are coming in from Vietnam (80 million people most under 30) that there are lineups for the BB10 and Blackberry is maintaining its cult status. Does anyone know the population of Brazil where Apple lost its right to use the word iPhone? and Indonesia and India? The American hillbilly gingoists here better wake up and smell the coffee.

Not correct. Apple asked for exclusive right to use the trademark - and was denied. Currently, both Apple and the other company have the right to use the name.

Now, if the other company sues to block Apple's use of the name, they might get it, but that's by no means certain.
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post #24 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanson Lockyer View Post

Look, the facts speak for themselves. The younger generation is off Apple now and onto Android but uh oh, reports are coming in from Vietnam (80 million people most under 30) that there are lineups for the BB10 and Blackberry is maintaining its cult status. Does anyone know the population of Brazil where Apple lost its right to use the word iPhone? and Indonesia and India? The American hillbilly gingoists here better wake up and smell the coffee.

'Facts speak for themselves'? LOL.

Yours has to be the most fact-free post of this thread so far.

What's a 'gingoist'?
post #25 of 60

People leaving Apple and Android for BB tells me one thing: There are some malcontents out there that can't be pleased by the two richest ecosystems, so they run to BB. Let the FUN begin.

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post #26 of 60

I think Apple should do what Aaron calls 'gesture' in the following Youtube.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PDVylVZUIs#t=4m20

post #27 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanson Lockyer View Post

Who the hell gives a crap about Dubai?

 

You mean United Arab Emirates? You should be asking if they really give a crap about America! America is broke as are its consumers. UAE is by far one of the wealthiest countries on the planet and holds most of its gold. You can't be that ignorant.

 

Uh its the powerhouse and financial center of the entire middle east including Israel, Lebanon, Saudi, Kuwait, Egypt, Jordan, Iraq and Iran.

The Blackberry articles that I read and that the crackheads were boasting about specifically mentioned Dubai, like this article:

 

http://crackberry.com/blackberry-10-launch-video-dubai

 

Dubai is not even a country. It's just a city state and the population is only around 2 million. Dubai is hardly an important mobile phone market, that was my main point. 2 million people is a joke. I also remember a British guy who got arrested a while back because they found .003 grams of marijuana residue on his shoe. I read that he later on got pardoned, but needless to say, I'll be staying far away from that place, as there's probably enough marijuana residue in my Apple keyboard to put me away for life.lol.gif

post #28 of 60

The reason most Americans have never heard the term gingoism is explained here

http://jacksson47.hubpages.com/hub/Is-America-Guilty-of-Jingoism

post #29 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Meaningless. Show me the numbers a year from now.

Remember all the analysts projections that had WinMo and then WinPh taking huge chunks of the market back from the iPhone. Every quarter they kept stating that in a few years MS would be running the smartphone market. It's been nearly 7 years and they've just kept dropping. It's hard to see how BB can make a come back simply because they were on top a decade ago.

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post #30 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post
I guess, but they committed the cardinal sin in business...complacency! :) They were content to give their customers a sh*t phone.

And then the iPhone came along and showed them how to do it right. They were ripping off their loyal customers by not innovating. I have no sympathy for them. I feel the same way about HP, Dell, MS, Nokia, Sony and Samsung.

Correct on RIM, their leader was spending his time trying to get an NHL hockey team, but his preferred location wasn't acceptable to Toronto and Buffalo.  In the meantime their BBs were being passed. They tried to keep customers by coming out with so many models of BB it was confusing to all.

 

Correct as well on HP, Dell, MS, Nokia and Sony. Nokia hiring their Flop leader from MS didn't help much.

 

  Samung are a bit different, through their parts manufacture they had an inside track to Apple's future designs, which they copied. I'll give Samsung credit for having a variety of screen sizes. I'm happy with the screen size of my iPhone 4, but I know several with not so good close vision who prefer the 4.8 size Samsung screens. They know they put up with inferior  and Spyware software, but they have no choice.

post #31 of 60
Not sure how BB can get covnerts when at least one carrier won't even be carrying the Z10. I doubt the Q10 will popular with those that have moved to a modern smartphone platform.

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post #32 of 60

In other news:

 

"Windows 8 adoption is almost at a standstill"

 

http://www.extremetech.com/computing/149762-four-months-in-windows-8-adoption-is-almost-at-a-standstill

 

 

Quote:
In the month of February, according to Net Applications, Windows 8 gained 0.4% of the desktop market, moving from 2.26 to 2.67%. In comparison, Windows 7 had a market share of over 9% after four months of public availability. A growth rate of 0.4% is absolutely horrendous, and — if we assume that PCs are replaced every five years — actually below the natural attrition/replacement rate. If growth of 0.4% wasn’t bad enough, it’s also worth pointing out that it’s down from 0.5% in January — yes, Windows 8 adoption is slowing down.

 

 

Quote:
At this point, it isn’t entirely clear how Microsoft intends to spur the adoption of Windows 8. It’s a bitter pill to swallow, but Windows Vista actually enjoyed faster growth than Windows 8 — and we know all too well how the Vista story played out. Despite selling Windows 8 at a massively discounted price of $40 for three months (it’s now $200), and sales boosts from Black Friday and Christmas, it’s clear that Windows 8 has failed to take off

 

I fully expect Apple stock to drop because of this news. Isn't that how things work these days?

post #33 of 60
Good for them. Their UI innovates and the design of the phone is certainly original.
post #34 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Brilliant! Made me laugh! :)

I just realised what I typed! Epic fail on my part. "Plugged into" and "Wireless" are a contradiction in terms is what I assume made you laugh.

post #35 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

 

I think you're doing it wrong.

I just realised what I typed! Epic fail on my part. "Plugged into" and "Wireless" are a contradiction in terms is what I assume made you laugh.

post #36 of 60
If I were Apple, I'd be ripping this phone apart for stolen IP
post #37 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

I hope BB is able to maintain a niche for itself, but no, this is not even going to have even a negligible effect on iPhone/Android sales. There's absolutely nothing that most users will see as an advantage, and there's a ton of disadvantages. I've used one, and although not a bad device, it didn't spark an ounce of excitement out of me. I don't see this coming in ahead of even Windows phone, nor do I see how these mythical "converts" might be. What advantages outweigh jumping ship and foregoing Apple or Google's ecosystem?

They will still be purchased by corporations that need that level of security.
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post #38 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Dubai was on its death throes a few years ago, and was bailed out of ignominy by the emirate of something-or-the-other (a neighboring country). A lot of the 'wealth' is in the form of empty, absentee-landlord, real estate built by foreign architects and foreign labor. Yes, there are some fancy high-rises such as the Burj Khalifa, but there is no industry, no services (other than tourism and shoppers from Asia) to speak of. 

Blackberrys have always been popular all over the Middle East. The fact that they may do well there (or not) does not mean much at all.

They have oil just not much of it, and before running out and becoming broke they decided to make it a tourist destination.
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post #39 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

a new report says half of BlackBerry Z10 buyers are coming to the device having left Google's Android platform and Apple's iPhone.
Half of a small number is an even smaller number. Without proper sales figures this report means precisely nothing.

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post #40 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshA View Post

Correct on RIM, their leader was spending his time trying to get an NHL hockey team, but his preferred location wasn't acceptable to Toronto and Buffalo.  In the meantime their BBs were being passed. They tried to keep customers by coming out with so many models of BB it was confusing to all.

 

Correct as well on HP, Dell, MS, Nokia and Sony. Nokia hiring their Flop leader from MS didn't help much.

 

  Samung are a bit different, through their parts manufacture they had an inside track to Apple's future designs, which they copied. I'll give Samsung credit for having a variety of screen sizes. I'm happy with the screen size of my iPhone 4, but I know several with not so good close vision who prefer the 4.8 size Samsung screens. They know they put up with inferior  and Spyware software, but they have no choice.

Yep, Josh, you're right about Samsung. :)

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