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Samsung topped Apple, Lenovo in China's smartphone market for 2012

post #1 of 45
Thread Starter 
Chief Apple rival Samsung tripled its Chinese smartphone sales in 2012, taking the top spot ahead of Lenovo and Apple in the increasingly important Chinese market.

gs3 v iphone5


Yonhap News reported (via The Next Web) Sunday on a new analysis out from Strategy Analytics. That report had Samsung selling 30.06 million smartphones in China, nearly three times the 10.90 million units it sold in 2011. That total gave Samsung control of 17.7 percent of the Chinese market, solidly ahead of its competitors.

Chinese tech firm Lenovo took second place, with 13.2 percent of the market, while Apple came in third place with 11 percent. Chinese manufacturers Huawei and Coolpad trailed with 9.9 and 9.7 percent, respectively. Nokia dropped from 29.9 percent and a number one ranking in the country in 2011 to 3.7 percent and a seventh-place spot in 2012.

The newest report marks the first time that Samsung has taken the top spot in the Chinese market. Industry observers cite both Samsung's efforts at working with Chinese carriers and the company's growing brand recognition as drivers of its improved position.

China has quickly emerged as one of the most important markets for consumer electronics in general and smartphones in particular. In February, research firm Flurry estimated that China surpassed the United States in terms of total smartphone activations.

Apple has been looking to address the Chinese market, but the company has taken a cautious approach to doing so in order to maintain the quality users expect from its products, as well as its usual profit margins.

While the typical Chinese worker is probably unable to afford Apple products, the company has introduced installment plans on some devices. Investors and analysts, though, still clamor for Apple to release a low-cost iPhone in order to better capture the market.

Apple CEO Tim Cook has also visited China multiple times in the past year, most recently meeting with China Mobile in order to discuss ways to bring the iPhone to the world's largest carrier.
post #2 of 45
The article fails to see the big picture. Apple still has 11% of China's market without access to China Mobile...

A low end phone w/ China Mobile deal could end up boosting apple upwards of 20%+.
Edited by Satalite - 3/10/13 at 8:13pm
post #3 of 45

How is that the big picture?  If anything you fail to see the big picture--the article focuses on the big picture just fine.  Jeez, I'm a long time lurker, but I had to register to comment on how dumb your comment was!

post #4 of 45

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

 

If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

post #5 of 45
What's the profit share? Apple isn't on the #1 carrier in China yet.
post #6 of 45

Why...where does your proof come from...

post #7 of 45

In China, India and many other countries most of Samsung's and other Android phone manufacturer's sales come from low end devices. They have plenty of models in $100-300 price range. Some barely even qualify as 'smartphones'.
 

post #8 of 45
People can may numbers say anything they want. This article seems to be based on sales or the number sold, not the income from the sales.

Given the security problems on the Droids and the recent reports of hacks originating from China, this win may not be worth as much as expected.
post #9 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

 

If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

Where did $499 come from?  The S3 retail list price is $699 for the 16GB unlocked model.  I don't know how Samsung can sell an unlocked 16GB for $499 and make a dime doing so, because they would have to sell it to the dealers for about $375.

 

I don't know why people seem to know the price of an unannounced product.

post #10 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Where did $499 come from?  The S3 retail list price is $699 for the 16GB unlocked model.  I don't know how Samsung can sell an unlocked 16GB for $499 and make a dime doing so, because they would have to sell it to the dealers for about $375.

 

I don't know why people seem to know the price of an unannounced product.

If LG can sell the nexus 4 8gb for 299.99 I think it is possible 

post #11 of 45
Leave it to a Korean news agency to toot the victory of Samsung, but the real question is how much of a profit share Apple has.

There's no doubt that China is the most significant smartphone market on earth right now. But as it has gone in the US, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple had a #2 or #3 position in units sold, but a commanding lead in the profit share.
post #12 of 45
I am shocked that AI bothered to reprint and treat as legitimate material from Yonhap News gathered by Strategy Analytics. As many readers, including me, will quickly recall, Strategy Analytics for years had seemec to be be functioning practically as a branch of Samsung PR, putting out huge sales and market share edtimates of Samsung mobike devices that can never be checked against reality, because Samsung refuses to release official unit sales figures.
Now why, you ask, would the supposed global and China national smart phone leader apparently fear releasing unit numbers for which, like Apple, it could be held legally accountable? Could it be that the edtimates put out by the likes of Strategy Analytics have become so inflated that there is no way for Samsung to tell the truth without suffering massive embarrassment and a share crash?
Note that Srategy Anslytics had no legal requirement for honesty and that they do not disclose their client list..
post #13 of 45

The "profit" marketing logic will cost Apple dearly at the end. Currently iOS still enjoys advantage in software development and sales, but with solely leaning on profits thus neglecting the quantities and user base will shrink the software developers effort and make iOS a niche product like OS X.

 

Apple could announce its willingness to take more share and falling profits will not be taken as sign of weakness, since the profits are abnormally high anyway...

However, if profits only shake a little with current business model, everyone claims Apple is dead and so on....Like we've seen in last few months...

 

If Apple wants to stay mainstream mobile brand, they need 2 things: mid-range model, the true one, not old models of premium, so users can believe long term dedication and buy such handsets with confidence and bigger screen phone to simply satisfy demand in a real part of the market which grows the most and is here to stay.

post #14 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China.

Why wuld Apple be in serious trouble if their competitor is going to sell a phone for $499? Never has been a problem before.
Quote:
No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk

So Apple fans aren't rich?
Quote:
that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

I'm sure everyone cares about spending money, now more than ever.
Quote:
If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

Should people keep their AAPL if Samsung announces it for less than $499? I am completely failing to see the reason for selling your stock based on the price of a competing device, while having so many more products and services. Besides, it's all in the software, for which I gladly pay a hypothetical extra $150. To put it in another way, if Samsung made the exact same phone (hardware) but were to sell it for $499 with Android on it I'd buy Apple's with their iOS.
post #15 of 45

Without mid-range and bigger screen model Apple will loose market share further, because the real growth remains now more or less on the market where premium phones don't contribute to premium market share. Falling market share is bad news for developers and then also for Apple. Arrogance is a bad thing...

post #16 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple v. Samsung View Post

If LG can sell the nexus 4 8gb for 299.99 I think it is possible 

First off Google only sold about 1 million units, and I'm sure they didn't make much money off those things.  The thing ended up being another POS with a crappy camera, 8G is a low end model, and it doesn't support 4G/LTE, and it kind of bombed in the market because they really didn't make many of them.  The probably sold it at around what LG charged them to make the darn thing.   Google doesn't make much on their hardware because they are trying to "BUY" market share so they can make money from the Google Play as well as ad clicks, etc.  And what does Google pay LG for the thing?

post #17 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


Why wuld Apple be in serious trouble if their competitor is going to sell a phone for $499? Never has been a problem before.
So Apple fans aren't rich?
I'm sure everyone cares about spending money, now more than ever.
Should people keep their AAPL if Samsung announces it for less than $499? I am completely failing to see the reason for selling your stock based on the price of a competing device, while having so many more products and services. Besides, it's all in the software, for which I gladly pay a hypothetical extra $150. To put it in another way, if Samsung made the exact same phone (hardware) but were to sell it for $499 with Android on it I'd buy Apple's with their iOS.

I wouldn't get fixated on a $499 list price for a 16G model that's unlocked.  I think that it's just going to replace the SIII at that price point while they drop the price of the SIII, etc. etc.

post #18 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

 

If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

you are forgetting that Apple fans = 90% of the worlds population. Those with enough money will buy it because despite being expensive, is a much better product on every single rational metric.

post #19 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satalite View Post

The article fails to see the big picture. Apple still has 11% of China's market without access to China Mobile...

A low end phone w/ China Mobile deal could end up boosting apple upwards of 20%+.

 

Apple has 11% of China's market, because of the operator subsidies.  Didn't Unicom pretty much give away free iPhone 4's a couple of years back?
 
post #20 of 45
What's Chinese for shipped does not equal sold?
post #21 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


 

 Oh nice the pick apart a post piece by piece game, I'll play

 

 

Quote:
 
Why wuld Apple be in serious trouble if their competitor is going to sell a phone for $499? Never has been a problem before.
 

It already is a problem, or else they would be number 1 in China. Apple isn't even number 2. If Samsung is selling so well at the current price point, then a $499 price point would simply destroy any chance Apple has of breaking the Chinese market.

 

 

Quote:

 

So Apple fans aren't rich?
 

Unnecessary comment to fill space on a reply defending Apple's loser status in China

 

 

Quote:

 

I'm sure everyone cares about spending money, now more than ever.
 

Right, I'm sure the people that bought the I AM RICH app cared about spending money 1rolleyes.gif

 

 

Quote:

 

Should people keep their AAPL if Samsung announces it for less than $499? I am completely failing to see the reason for selling your stock based on the price of a competing device, while having so many more products and services. Besides, it's all in the software, for which I gladly pay a hypothetical extra $150. To put it in another way, if Samsung made the exact same phone (hardware) but were to sell it for $499 with Android on it I'd buy Apple's with their iOS.

 

Unfortunately share price isn't dictated by how a small few think, but by expectations of a company. A brand new phone for $499 vs a 6 month old phone for $649. Let's keep it realistic now...

post #22 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogobo View Post

What's Chinese for shipped does not equal sold?

I know - irrelevant and dated argument.
post #23 of 45

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

you are forgetting that Apple fans = 90% of the worlds population. Those with enough money will buy it because despite being expensive, is a much better product on every single rational metric.

post #24 of 45

According to Engadget, this is the new Galaxy S4.  Wow, ugly.  If its true and the phone is glossy plastic again I think people will be disappointed.

 

 

post #25 of 45
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.

Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.
post #26 of 45
@mrrodriguez

Normally I don't drag apart a post - sorry about that.

So not being #1 in China is a problem? Does not compute

"a $499 price point would simply destroy any chance Apple has of breaking the Chinese market" What? You cannot possibly believe this statement to be true.

"Only the Apple fans and the rich folk" reads to me that these are two different groups of people, is all.

That $999 app is pathetic, and not the first time. I remember a $6999 app, some green diamond app that didn't do much, was sold 7 times. They pulled it, but I never read that the developer had to return the money - if he ever received it in the first place.

"Unfortunately share price isn't dictated by how a small few think, but by expectations of a company." THAT is such a true statement I'd put it in a sig if I were you; I couldn't agree more.

"A brand new phone for $499 vs a 6 month old phone for $649. Let's keep it realistic now..." Really doesn't seem to hurt. There are various reports that many buy in Hong Kong, for over $1000 just to get the iPhone. Not en masse, but supposedly it is big business nonetheless. However, I might have a total different view than most when it comes to price: I simply do not care. If I want the product I'll pay for it, and if it's out of my reach, I'll save for it.
post #27 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.

Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.

 

That is exactly what has happened and what is going to happen....I also added in my comment that faith of iPhone is that of the Mac: being a niche product as number of software developers and titles will collapse...

 

Apple "sticking to quality" is childish and arrogant position that was made clear by the Street as unacceptable. Same will be response of wide customer base. No doubt about it. Cook and the guys are clearly stating they will build only the best. Soon or a later majority of customer base will say: "OK, let them.". As they did in PC world...

post #28 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

 

If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

 

Where will that leave the S III and the Note 2?

 

They both sell for well over $499.

 

The "smartphones" that make up the bulk of Samsung's sales are not their flagship phones.

 

One only has to look at Nokia's profit and loss statements to see what raw Chinese market share means.

 

iPhones will hold their own against the S4, the S4 will also be competing against Sony's Xperia Z and HTC's One, companies which have all but given up on the near worthless low to mid range market.

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post #29 of 45

I think that Apple needs to do something. I feel like iPhones lately have just been iterative improvements - fantastic hardware and software to be sure, but nothing too exciting over the previous version, whereas Android and Windows Phone have been making leaps of improvements. With the Galaxy Nexus and Jelly Bean 4.2, I think that Android is finally in the same league as Apple - and Apple has gotten a bit complacent as it took five years for competitors to catch up.

 

So I'm hoping that this year or next year we see a big shift in Apple's iPhone strategy, to trying to push the envelope more and be a little bit more risky in successive iOS versions. I think we forget that the iPhone itself was a risky device when it was released, and it could very well have been dead on arrival - but had they not tried, Apple wouldn't be half the company it is today. They need more of that.

post #30 of 45
Given Apple takes a hit in the media and on Wall Street even on rumors relating to ridiculous trivia can you imagine if Apple were mainly manufactured in South Korea what AAPL would be doing on the news today from Dennis Rodman's BBF? So that begs the question ... is Wall Street dumping all things Scamsung related today?
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post #31 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogobo View Post

What's Chinese for shipped does not equal sold?

 

Look at one of Apple's quarterly reports - they consider a product sold when it's shipped...  http://investor.apple.com/

post #32 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeb85 View Post

Look at one of Apple's quarterly reports - they consider a product sold when it's shipped...  http://investor.apple.com/

Is that when shipped to a end user or an Apple Store for stock? Apple charge my card when they ship thus it is sold.
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post #33 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post


Must be sarcastic because no-one can be that deluded.

post #34 of 45
iPhones are becoming much less popular in China, I see it every day. Apple needs to innovate fast...more screen sizes and more cool tech.
post #35 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lerxt View Post

iPhones are becoming much less popular in China, I see it every day. Apple needs to innovate fast...more screen sizes and more cool tech.

I thought it was because iPhones are too expensive.  Now it's because they don't feature enough "cool tech" (whatever that means)?

post #36 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. .

This, like most of your posts, is pure nonsense.

Five years ago, AAPL was around 130. Today, it's around 430 - or a 200% increase. That's hardly 'nothing'. And that doesn't include the dividends the shareholders have received.

I doubt if any long term AAPL shareholders are unhappy with that result.
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post #37 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

According to Engadget, this is the new Galaxy S4.  Wow, ugly.  If its true and the phone is glossy plastic again I think people will be disappointed.




It does look pretty disgusting. Nevermind don't sell your shares...
post #38 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post


It does look pretty disgusting. Nevermind don't sell your shares...

Cnet is guessing this is a dummy shell.  But knowing Samsung I can't imagine the real thing will look much better.

post #39 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez View Post

If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.

 

If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.

 

That is a ridiculous info. Samsung will never sell S4 for 499, because they have no competition in that segment of whatsoever. If people want premium "normal size" phone, they are bound to look at iPhone first, if they want premium large screen phone they won't even think about iPhone. If you ask me, Samsung can sell S4 easily for 650, but they shouldn't drop the price below 599.

 

More bad news for Apple is the fact that Samsung is making "halo" effect with flagship phone and people are willing to buy their mid-range phone in mass as well...

 

Apple made crucial bad decisions in last year and they will pay dearly in this one. If AAPL climbs to 500 this year it will be a miracle. However, Samsung should watch their back in 2014, because the gloves are off and I am pretty much sure that Apple has a full sleeve. On the other hand, Samsung has absolutely nothing, except copying and updated specs. As always. 

post #40 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.

That's interesting. I'm pretty sure the 5S and 4 outsold the SG3 in the last qtr. by the way, that last qtr had record sales of the iPhone. The only reason there wasn't more sold was supply was constrained. Keep drinking what you're drinking.
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