Originally Posted by jimmac
Trumpy scientists are people also. They can be as wrong your average plumber or electrician. That doesn't make science wrong.
You are equating a person with a field of study all while setting up a strawman. Can you show where anyone in this thread said science is wrong because scientists are people?
Here again is what BR said....
It also doesn't care when a brilliant scientist in one field oversteps his expertise and makes a fool of himself in another.
Address him. Don't be a hypocrite and has that he not act in a hypocritical manner. He is the guy who ignores a brilliant scientist while proclaiming we should listen to an anonymous blogger on the topic who at best may be a mathematician, not a climatologist.
Well much as you probably don't like it as you noted the title of the thread is " Science is Real " and I think this guy qualifies.
Again hypocrisy and you fail to address it. BR called linking to articles and scientists that disagree with his conclusion as an "invasion of the repugnant anti-science lobby" and attempted to distract, much like you do with your strange strawmen.
As far as Mr. Dyson I have been a fan of many of his theories. He designs many good products also. However once again isolated opinion vs. mountains of evidence and widely held opinion. Now they all could be wrong but right now there's no reason to believe that.
You fail to address his chief complaint, that a computer model isn't proof. Clearly you didn't watch the interview of him because you look foolish calling computer models that don't even properly model known past events as "proof" of future events. Also nice to know that you have proof of the future.
Now you could say Mr. Brower is full of it because he's on the side you disagree with.
I couldn't saw Mr. Brower is full of it because instead of relying on science he merely attacks the man by claiming bad intentions about him?
How could someone as smart as Dyson be so dumb about the environment? The answer lies in his almost religious faith in the power of man and science to bring nature to heel.
Please feel free to explain how that phrase is science, or a study or proof of anything. You've just linked to a writer who dismissed a great scientist by claiming he has a bad intention. It is a bad intention that has never once blemished nor brought lack of credibility to any of his other scientific endeavors, just this one.
You are supporting an argument that amounts to, he is wrong on global warming because he believes in science. Have you honestly read the quote you put down there?
However he's also on the side where that mountain of evidence resides.
By mountain of evidence you mean non-predictive computer models.
Above all of this there is the fact that something is happening to our environment at a rapid pace that doesn't seems to be the result of natural forces ( volcanic activity as in natural items that have caused these kinds of changes in the past ).
By rapid change you mean no changes in the last decade or do you mean the changes from the 50's to mid 70's that had everyone proclaiming we were going to freeze the planet because it was cooling the entire time?
These changes are undeniable.
Science that cannot be disputed, challenged or changed? That isn't science. That is dogma.
If it isn't us we still need to do something about it as it's clear species are dying out due to their natural environment going away. That means eventual trouble for us. You don't have to be a genius to see that.
Species dying out is a norm. We have multiple instances of mass extinctions without humans even having existed. We have had massive planet-wide climate change and also massive topographical change. You are attributing norms to humans as ill intentions and demanding control of people and their lives for norms occurring. It is no different than me demanding to sacrifice your daughter to the gods to make the rains come or stop the earth from shaking. It isn't science.
Oh! By the way Mr. Dyson isn't a climatologist either.
Science demands openness, transparency and accountability. I don't see how you get from an anonymous blogger.
Edited by trumptman - 4/7/13 at 6:52am
This cartoon imagines Tamino, aka statistician and folk singer Grant Foster, putting things right. Do suggest some more songs that Tamino might like to try. I am sure he will be very grateful.