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Samsung Galaxy S4 'less refined' than Apple's iPhone 5, not seen as a game changer - Page 2

post #41 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

"Retina" doesn't really mean a whole lot any more. All the newer handsets seem to qualify. By this time next year it won't even be valuable as a marketing term IMO.

Sure, marketing terms do fall away as they become standard but let's remember that Apple did this with great battery life in 2010 on a smartphone, in 2012 with a 10" tablet and notebooks. There is still a long way to go, especially on PCs for everything to get to a point that Retina will no longer be used.

Let's also remember that at a 332 true PPI this is the first Galaxy S series phone that qualifies as being Retina-quality and it's not due out until the end of April 2013.

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post #42 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacerays View Post

What to do with such high dpi is just the android app developer's headache now. And seriously, who (or what app) really uses all those GHz and cores? Other than Android OS ofcourse. 

 

I agree, that is just too much for app developers to try and deal with. I mean who in their right mind would ever want their app to look good? Should just take all the resolutions back to a 480 x 320px at 163 ppi resolution. That way they don't have to worry about things like this any more.

 

Yeah, who would ever use that many GHz and cores? No one ever will create anything that could use that. It is pointless to even put something like that in place. It has been determined with research that 1.3 GHZ Dual Core is the physical limit that anything will ever be able to utilize. Anything else is just for the spec sheets.

post #43 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

We have all these trolls that come here just to spread FUD, but i have to say something...

After reading some news on some blogs (I like android, i have an android phone. In fact, i love android, i would love a nexus from LG, i just think Apple's devices and strategy are better) i came across something.
Not all android fans are stupid and retarded like the ones we see here, and not all android blogs are apple-bashing sites. Far from it.

Some sites have really great comparisons and great reviews and nicely illustrate the pros vs cons of choosing a given smartphone. Obviously, on those sites, stupid fandroids (like the ones that come here) get irritated, but you can ignore them.

Sites like these, objective reviews like these, should help some of you to understand and even like Android for what it is. You can love Apple, prefer the iPhone by a large margin, but still like Android and choose a cheap but good smartphone (like the nexus) when you can't justify 700 euros.

http://www.androidauthority.com/samsung-galaxy-s4-vs-apple-iphone-5-169810/

When using logic and facts, anyone can see that you cannot call the gs4 "superior" or "better" than the iPhone, or some android devices. It's a great read.

Kudos to them.


I think many of us are aware. I have repeatedly seen comments from regular members here about the quality of the HTC One.

I believe it is important to note that the review you linked does seem fair initially, the repeated reference to iOS as a "simple" operating system and Android as a "complex" operating system is clearly biased.
Edited by MacBook Pro - 3/15/13 at 8:46am
post #44 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

And it's not just about the total number of pixels, as accuracy is also an important factor to take into consideration, and those pentile/amoled screens have horrible color accuracy.

True, but I'm hoping that finally being a Retina-like density on par with the iPhone that the sub-pixel trickery will actually allow for a better representation of the image.

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post #45 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Sure, marketing terms do fall away as they become standard but let's remember that Apple did this with great battery life in 2010 on a smartphone, in 2012 with a 10" tablet and notebooks. There is still a long way to go, especially on PCs for everything to get to a point that Retina will no longer be used.

Let's also remember that at a 332 true PPI this is the first Galaxy S series phone that qualifies as being Retina-quality and it's not due out until the end of April 2013.

True, But Sony, HTC, LG, Samsung, Google and probably others all offer smartphones with "retina" displays now. 

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post #46 of 209
That camera protruding out the backside is just plain ugly. Wonder what Sir Ive would have to say about that.
post #47 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDMeister View Post

That camera protruding out the backside is just plain ugly. Wonder what Sir Ive would have to say about that.

Hopefully nothing. . .

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post #48 of 209

The main problem with this phone, and its predecessor, is that when you use it as an actual phone (i.e. hold it against your head and talk to someone), you look like an absolute cock.

post #49 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa View Post

Why are companies competing in doing higher then retina displays? The eyes cant see the difference.  ...

 

The reason (although they would never admit it) is two-fold.  A pen-tile display of the same resolution as the iPhone is easy to achieve without any extra outlay of money or investment in any new technology and at the same time it gives them two marketing points.  

 

When the average yokel gets "sold" on a phone at the store by the cell carrier guy, he has two great things to say to the customer.  

 

1) "This phone has more pixels than an iPhone!"

 

2) "This phone displays 1080p movies natively!"

 

Neither means anything, but they both sound fantastic.  They are (to the yokel), clear, impossible to fudge stats that show this thing is *better* than an iPhone.

 

It isn't at all of course, but marketing is powerful.  Most people don't actually make reasoned, objective choices about things like this.  By far the majority of folks buy what they think is cool, or what someone told them to buy etc. 


Edited by Gazoobee - 3/15/13 at 8:57am
post #50 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

True, But Sony, HTC, LG, Samsung, Google and probably others all offer smartphones with "retina" displays now. 

If there is anyone I know that is well versed on the specs of all the major vendor's premium smartphones it's you and yet you use the word probably. Except for Samsung and Google via the Nexus brand no one else really matters in the Android world. Sony could have a smartphone that blows the Samsung S IV away in areas that the customer would appreciate but they're likely to never know it exists.

So outside the upcoming Galaxy S IV what is there that is shipping with a real or adjusted (in the case of PenTile) Retina-like display? The only actual products I know of are on tablets from Amazon Kindle Fire HD 8.9" and the Google Nexus 10". Outside of that it's just some mention on Engadget for some low-yield device or company I never heard of again.

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post #51 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

The main problem with this phone, and its predecessor, is that when you use it as an actual phone (i.e. hold it against your head and talk to someone), you look like an absolute cock.

 

You realise that in the context you used it, your attempt at obscenity is actually a positive remark, right?   "Cock of the walk" etc.?  1smile.gif

post #52 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

The main problem with this phone, and its predecessor, is that when you use it as an actual phone (i.e. hold it against your head and talk to someone), you look like an absolute cock.

Three things make me think that isn't an issue:

1) Wired headphones with built-in mic.

2) BT headset.

3) In a world with Google Glass even holding Dell's 18" tablet up to your ear looks like douchie.

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post #53 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

 

You realise that in the context you used it, your attempt at obscenity is actually a positive remark, right?   "Cock of the walk" etc.?  1smile.gif

 

Ha!

 

I remember the first time I saw one of the Galaxy S3's (a friend of mine who works for Google always seems to have the latest and greatest Android phone), being stunningly impressed with the screen and actually quite impressed with the device as a whole, then he received a call and I found myself feeling sorry for him.  It looked like it was a phone designed specifically for old people because they need bigger buttons!

post #54 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Three things make me think that isn't an issue:

1) Wired headphones with built-in mic.

2) BT headset.

3) In comparison to Google Glass even holding Dell's 18" tablet up to your ear looks like douchie.

 

I actually think using a BT headset makes you look like a cock, especially if you're the type of person who wears one all the time, even when not on a call.  As a general rule, I believe in a headset in the car for safety purposes only.

 

I also suspect people wearing Google Glasses are going to be the champions of douchbaggery, though obviously I'll hold off my snide and unpleasant comments until I've actually seen them!

post #55 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


It's PenTile so when you remove 1/3 of the pixels to make it an even sub-pixel count it's on par with what Apple has been using in the iPhone since 2010. The difference is likely that the color accuracy is still way off which is something I'm not willing to trade away in a display simply so I can us half-truths to say my display has a higher PPI.


Why would one sacrifice one's eyesight with an inferior screen than the iphones?  The Galaxy S3/S4 buyers are stupid in this respect.

post #56 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


Why would one sacrifice one's eyesight with an inferior screen than the iphones?  The Galaxy S3/S4 buyers are stupid in this respect.

What damage are they doing to their eyes?

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post #57 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

What damage are they doing to their eyes?

 

Bigger screen, better for porn, more "relaxing in a gentlemens way", go blind.......!

post #58 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by mausz View Post

touchscreen has hover and glove support

 

That sounds like a nice feature. I have tried to use an iPhone with gloves and it doesn't work very well. Fortunately, I live in warm climates so I rarely need gloves except for gardening or cycling. In colder climates it must be annoying to not be able to use a touch screen without first removing your glove.

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post #59 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


Why would one sacrifice one's eyesight with an inferior screen than the iphones?  The Galaxy S3/S4 buyers are stupid in this respect.

Sacrifice one's eyesight? How so?

As for inferior, it's visual trickery but it's also a clever way to reduce power usage and cost and at being slightly above but on par with the iPhone's PPI once you adjust for true pixel count it's not inferior unless it renders the image poorly. I think that's still likely but I also think that as we get into Retina-like displays that effect can be limited dramatically. Only time will tell how much better, if at all, the results are, but I don't think we can do anything but speculate on that at this time.

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post #60 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

 

Bigger screen, better for porn, more "relaxing in a gentlemens way", go blind.......!

1080p porn anywhere you go!

post #61 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

The reason (although they would never admit it) is two-fold.  A pen-tile display of the same resolution as the iPhone is easy to achieve without any extra outlay of money or investment in any new technology and at the same time it gives them two marketing points.  

When the average yokel gets "sold" on a phone at the store by the cell carrier guy, he has two great things to say to the customer.  

1) "This phone has more pixels than an iPhone!"

2) "This phone displays 1080p movies natively!"

Neither means anything, but they both sound fantastic.  They are (to the yokel), clear, impossible to fudge stats that show this thing is *better* than an iPhone.

It isn't at all of course, but marketing is powerful.  Most people don't actually make reasoned, objective choices about things like this.  By far the majority of folks buy what they think is cool, or what someone told them to buy etc. 

You are using the term "yokel" to refer to the average person derisively which isn't fair. There are a fair number of subjects about which most people are uninformed, technology happens to be one and you happen to be an exception. Many of the technological achievements we enjoy today wouldn't have been possible without mainstream acceptance.
post #62 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

 

Bigger screen, better for porn, more "relaxing in a gentlemens way", go blind.......!


But the colors are not right thus not pleasing.

post #63 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


But the colors are not right thus not pleasing.

1) We don't know if they'll be inaccurate; all we know is that so far AMOLED displays typically ship with high saturation. Is this a limitation of the tech, a poor calibration at the factory or inability for the OS to correctly display images, or (see point number 2)?

2) Some people seem to like that vivid yet inaccurate over-saturated look so maybe it's a marketing decision more than a technical one.

3) Has PenTile been shown to be more or less accurate than non-PenTile AMOLED displays?
Edited by SolipsismX - 3/15/13 at 9:30am

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post #64 of 209
The problem with the s4 is that it's too complicated to use, you have to be literally a genius to properly figure all the software features. Also they went back with using plastic which breaks easily and feels cheap in the hand.
post #65 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by quest01 View Post

The problem with the s4 is that it's too complicated to use, you have to be literally a genius to properly figure all the software features.

Based on a lot of the Galaxy users that come here to bash Apple I would beg to differ.

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post #66 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


But the colors are not right thus not pleasing.

That's not necessarily true either. Some users like the heavily saturated "color pop" on the AMOLED screens. In fact vendors have been known to intentionally oversaturate their displays for maximum color vibrancy. Drop by any box store HDTV section for proof. I've seen complaints about Apple's "Retina" display being too muted for some tastes, despite claims that the color might be accurate. Different stokes. . . 

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post #67 of 209
I really expect the Apple iPhone5s (or whatever comes next) to be iterative as well. What would not make a new phone iterative? Holographic display? Another doubling of resolution? A far more advanced Siri? It's applications that drive these devices. Phones are becoming a "mature" technology, just as computers are. It's absurd to be expecting revolutionary changes at this point. Screens will get a bit bigger, the phones will continue to get thinner and lighter and future iterations will run faster and perhaps get a bit better battery life, but I find it hard to believe we're going to see big changes in less than 3-5 year intervals.
post #68 of 209

Today the market loves Apple shares, as they climb.lol.gif

Is this a negative reaction to the S4?  1confused.gif

I wonder what phones the traders use?
 

post #69 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Funny how the trolls come out of the woodwork like roaches for certain articles. It's not just Samsung articles either, they'll often come to pooh-pooh new Apple products.

General rule of thumb, the more there are the more likely their opinions will turn out not to be accurate.

 

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post #70 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

That's not necessarily true either. Some users like the heavily saturated "color pop" on the AMOLED screens. In fact vendors have been known to intentionally oversaturate their displays for maximum color vibrancy. Drop by any box store HDTV section for proof. I've seen complaints about Apple's "Retina" display being too muted for some tastes, despite claims that the color might be accurate. Different stokes. . . 


There is a review comparing screen quality of iPhone 5, Galaxy S3, HTC One, etc.  Galaxy S3 is worst.  AMOLED is a hype. 

This is just like Mac vs Windows PC.  In general all cheap Windows PC have much poorer and inaccurate color screens than Macs.  Macs are historically being favored by artists.  This is the reason why Apple focused more on screen color accuracy.  The fact that Apple does not use AMOLED clearly shows that Apple knows AMOLED is not good.

post #71 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


There is a review comparing screen quality of iPhone 5, Galaxy S3, HTC One, etc.  Galaxy S3 is worst.  AMOLED is a hype. 
This is just like Mac vs Windows PC.  In general all cheap Windows PC have much poorer and inaccurate color screens than Macs.  Macs are historically being favored by artists.  This is the reason why Apple focused more on screen color accuracy.

Sure, but that's likely a clinical test and not what both I and GG mentioned about subjective desirability. And let's remember that people buying smartphones likely aren't going to ever consider an expensive calibrator like someone buying a Mac for photo reproduction might. It'll still come down to what they think looks good.

But besides that, there is no test of the S IV and since that is on par with the iPhone 5 when you adjust for the PenTile sub-pixels we shouldn't make our opinions read as fact until we can back them up with some solid evidence.

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post #72 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


There is a review comparing screen quality of iPhone 5, Galaxy S3, HTC One, etc.  Galaxy S3 is worst.  AMOLED is a hype. 
This is just like Mac vs Windows PC.  In general all cheap Windows PC have much poorer and inaccurate color screens than Macs.  Macs are historically being favored by artists.  This is the reason why Apple focused more on screen color accuracy.

Sure, but that's likely a clinical test and not what both I and GG mentioned about subjective desirability. And let's remember that people buying smartphones likely aren't going to ever consider an expensive calibrator like someone buying a Mac for photo reproduction might. It'll still come down to what they think looks good.

But besides that, there is no test of the S IV and since that is on par with the iPhone 5 when you adjust for the PenTile sub-pixels we shouldn't make our opinions read as fact until we can back them up with some solid evidence.

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post #73 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

 

You do realize he's not trolling an Apple review. This is an article about the Galaxy S4. He could easily say you're trolling a Galaxy S4 article. Don't be hypocritical.


No Worries...It's common practice for the (self appointed) Defenders of All Things Apple here on AI to label any/every post/poster that doesn't conform to their extremely one-sided 'beliefs' a troll, even when the article's specifically about a SAMSUNG product..

 

Pretty ironic when the truth is THEY are the real trolls around here... and rather spiteful/disrespectful/hateful ones at that.

 

Anyway... Looks like Samsung has done some fine work with this new release, especially the fact that they were able to create a more powerful device with even longer battery life with an even thinner and lighter design.

 

2013's shaping up to be another banner year for mobile devices.

 

Is there a specification of battery life by Sammy?

 

All I saw was a battery capacity spec.

 

The fact that Sammy opened up the case to allow for a removable battery -- makes me suspect that the supplied battery will not last an entire day, No?

 

 

With the S4, you expose the innards of the device, have a less-reliable/protective overall package (removable back) -- and get to fuss with extra batteries, and Memory cards...

 

I wonder how "knox" secures these removable memory cards???

 

 

So, DaHarder how many of these little beauties will you be buying  Be sure and post pictures of all of them!

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post #74 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


It's PenTile so when you remove 1/3 of the pixels to make it an even sub-pixel count it's on par with what Apple has been using in the iPhone since 2010. The difference is likely that the color accuracy is still way off which is something I'm not willing to trade away in a display simply so I can us half-truths to say my display has a higher PPI.

 

This is true for the Samsung S4, but the HTC One and Sony Xperia Z both have true 1080p screens (full amount of subpixels and all)...

post #75 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

Nonsense. AMOLED is a very good technology and not all AMOLED displays are PenTile like the S3. The note 2 is a non-PenTile display and is very sharp.

Sharp does not mean accurate. In fact, I have no idea what definition of sharp would be relevant to this conversion.
Quote:
Apple even considered going with AMOLED but decided it wasn't quite mature enough due to longevity issues and a few other problems but not because of crispness

1) Where has Apple stated this?

2) Crispness? Are we talking color accuracy still or are you thinking about a salad for lunch?
Quote:
I guarantee you that you would not be able to tell the difference between an AMOLED display and a non AMOLED display at the same resolution.

I bet you can because AMOLED-based devices have repeatedly been shown to be much more saturated than the iPhone.
Quote:
Your complaint is over PenTile not AMOLED and with a 1920x1080 441 PPI resolution the S4 will largely overcome any PenTile deficiencies you may have seen in that S3 comparison.

Perhaps, but you can't say that with certainly just as others can't say that it won't. We need scientific testing before we can make any determination.

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post #76 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeb85 View Post

This is true for the Samsung S4, but the HTC One and Sony Xperia Z both have true 1080p screens (full amount of subpixels and all)...

Did AnandTech or anyone else do a thorough test on those displays?

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post #77 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacerays View Post

What to do with such high dpi is just the android app developer's headache now. And seriously, who (or what app) really uses all those GHz and cores? Other than Android OS ofcourse. Food for thought, Specs fans.

 

If you'd ever used the Android SDK you'd know that dealing with multiple resolutions is pretty damn easy.  

 

And all logos, UI elements, etc..., should be in vector graphics anyway, so scaling should be trivial...  

post #78 of 209
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
2) Crispness? Are we talking color accuracy still or are you thinking about a salad for lunch?

 

If you think about it, the pieces fall together.

 

The OS is stale, the display isn't crisp, the UI is boring, and the hardware is slow.

 

All in all, buying an iDevice is like buying a three day old, untoasted BLT.

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post #79 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

Nonsense. AMOLED is a very good technology and not all AMOLED displays are PenTile like the S3. The note 2 is a non-PenTile display and is very sharp. Apple even considered going with AMOLED but decided it wasn't quite mature enough due to longevity issues and a few other problems but not because of crispness.I guarantee you that you would not be able to tell the difference between an AMOLED display and a non AMOLED display at the same resolution.  Your complaint is over PenTile not AMOLED and with a 1920x1080 441 PPI resolution the S4 will largely overcome any PenTile deficiencies you may have seen in that S3 comparison. 


Yes, I am able to tell the difference.  I noticed that Galaxy S3 screen brightness is noticeably darker than the iPhone.  This is the reason I said before that using Galaxy S3/S4 will hurt the eyesight.  It may not be in a day but will in the long run. 

post #80 of 209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeb85 View Post

If you'd ever used the Android SDK you'd know that dealing with multiple resolutions is pretty damn easy.  

And all logos, UI elements, etc..., should be in vector graphics anyway, so scaling should be trivial...  

If only there were some way to search for Android developers ranting about how much of a pain it is to code accurately for so many different display shapes and sizes¡

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