or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Google's push Gmail changes surprise new iPhone buyers, Apple store reps
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Google's push Gmail changes surprise new iPhone buyers, Apple store reps

post #1 of 83
Thread Starter 
Despite word from Google months ago that it would be discontinuing Exchange support, many users buying new iOS devices have been surprised to discover that push email no longer works with Gmail accounts in Apple's default Mail application.

Push


Google officially ended its Exchange support on Jan. 30, but the search company has grandfathered in existing users' hardware to continue allowing push email. That means most users will only discover the changes if they get a new iPhone, whether through upgrading, or simply receiving a replacement from Apple.

Still, Google's announcement couldn't have reached everyone, and as a result users have started a number of threads (1, 2, 3) on the Apple Support Communities website wondering why they can no longer receive instant push e-mail notifications from Gmail. Instead, Gmail users who set up a new iOS device must "fetch" their mail, which iOS does automatically in timed intervals set by the user that can be as frequent as once per 15 minutes.

Google's recent changes may not even be very well known among Apple's own retail employees, as two Genius representatives at the company's heavily trafficked Grand Central Terminal Store in New York City recently expressed surprise once they were informed of the issue.

Google's change affects only those who use the native Mail application built in to iOS. Users who still wish to receive push notifications of new emails can use Google's official Gmail application, which is a free download on the App Store.

Google also offers the ability to add Exchange support to a Gmail account by upgrading to the company's paid Google Apps service. Google Apps for Business starts at $5 per user, per month, or $50 per user, per year, and increases a Gmail inbox size to 25 gigabytes, in addition to allowing push email support with third-party mail clients.

Google Apps


Part of the confusion over Google's switch likely stems from the fact that users who activated their devices before the Jan. 30 cut off date, including iPhone 5 owners, have been grandfathered in. Those Gmail users may not become aware of the changes until they upgrade to new iPhone hardware.

Google announced last December that Exchange support, offered with its Google Sync service, would be removed as part of the company's "winter cleaning." Google Sync allowed push email, along with calendar and contact syncing, via Microsoft's Exchange ActiveSync protocol.

While push email support for Gmail is no longer available for free with iOS Mail, users can still sync calendars and contacts via CardDAV and CalDav, both of which are supported by both Google and Apple's iOS.

Email support for Gmail through IMAP remains available, allowing users to use Apple's native Mail application for iOS. But they will need to either have iOS fetch mail on 15-, 30- or 60-minute intervals, or manually by launching the app and refreshing.

Users who want to use the native Mail app can also use third-party notification services such as Boxcar, which can separately send push notifications. And beyond the official Gmail app, users can turn to other third-party email options like popular newcomer Mailbox.
post #2 of 83
The cost of "free" seems higher every day.
post #3 of 83
Isn't Google also killing off CalDAV?
post #4 of 83
More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features. Unfortunately, Apple must allow these Google apps into the App Store or potentially face anti-competition charges.

It remains to be seen if iOS users will give up Google services like GMail and keep Apple hardware. Will they keep using Google's core services and abandon their iPhones because their beloved service is compromised on iOS devices? The more Google can get between iOS users and their hardware, the more the value proposition of iOS and Apple hardware comes into question.

I'm not a sky-is-falling Apple fan, but I do think Apple could use a strategy to defend against these maneuvers. Also, personally, I do not have email pushed to my iPhone, as it drains battery life. But many others, especially Blackberry converts, live and die by push email.
For your sake, I hope you're right.
Reply
For your sake, I hope you're right.
Reply
post #5 of 83
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post
More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email.

 

iCloud sure doesn't exist. Nor do any other e-mail providers.


Unfortunately, Apple must allow these Google apps into the App Store or potentially face anti-competition charges.

 

Not really.


It remains to be seen if iOS users will give up Google services like GMail and keep Apple hardware.

 

Does it? Really?


The more Google can get between iOS users and their hardware, the more the value proposition of iOS and Apple hardware comes into question.

 

Not really. Just stop using Google's stuff.


I'm not a sky-is-falling Apple fan, but I do think Apple could use a strategy to defend against these maneuvers.

 

It's called iCloud and Apple Maps and all the other services they've created as of late. 1confused.gif1hmm.gif

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #6 of 83
I don't use gmail so it's totally irrelevant to me.
post #7 of 83
I have a Google Apps account since I use a private (vanity) domain for my email address. I would gladly switch from Google to Yahoo! if Yahoo! had something similar.
post #8 of 83

I stopped using Google anything a long time ago, don't trust them don't want them

post #9 of 83
Should have seen this coming, it has been almost 3 days since google did something to poss me off!
OSX, because making UNIX user friendly is easier than debugging windows.
Reply
OSX, because making UNIX user friendly is easier than debugging windows.
Reply
post #10 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features.

Not going to happen. Exchange, like Blackberry does 'push' and it's benefit has more to do with saving power and getting instant notifications.

This can also be done with:
- Skype
- Jabber
- SMS text messages
- Apple's own Messages


Most people are moving away from email's uselessness when it comes to instant notifications, so this is not exactly a problem. Businesses who need it, either run their own exchange server or they are paying someone else to. That is no change.

Individual users who need it, probably already use skype for their instant notifications, or SMS.

There is nothing the 'Android' camp is offers that is any different here. You don't magically get push notifications by buying a an android device when that's in fact a server-sided service you have to subscribe to.
post #11 of 83
Doesn't Apple's iOS Mail client support MS Exchange with push notification? What does this have to do with GMail?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #12 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features. Unfortunately, Apple must allow these Google apps into the App Store or potentially face anti-competition charges.

Wouldn't google then be facing anticompetitive charges, if anything? I don't use gmail so it doesn't matter to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post


I'm not a sky-is-falling Apple fan, but I do think Apple could use a strategy to defend against these maneuvers. Also, personally, I do not have email pushed to my iPhone, as it drains battery life. But many others, especially Blackberry converts, live and die by push email.
Gmail isn't the only email in town.
post #13 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Doesn't Apple's iOS Mail client support MS Exchange with push notification? What does this have to do with GMail?

Google was using Microsoft's Active Sync just like Apple and almost everyone else that is offering push email.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
post #14 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features. Unfortunately, Apple must allow these Google apps into the App Store or potentially face anti-competition charges.

It remains to be seen if iOS users will give up Google services like GMail and keep Apple hardware. Will they keep using Google's core services and abandon their iPhones because their beloved service is compromised on iOS devices? The more Google can get between iOS users and their hardware, the more the value proposition of iOS and Apple hardware comes into question.

I'm not a sky-is-falling Apple fan, but I do think Apple could use a strategy to defend against these maneuvers. Also, personally, I do not have email pushed to my iPhone, as it drains battery life. But many others, especially Blackberry converts, live and die by push email.

 

For one thing... Push notification is a nice to have in an iMAP environment.  For most (90%) of iOS users, push vs poll is a 'why do I care?' question.  And for ha've of the remaining 10%, it's 'I do know why to care, and I choose not to'

 

Yes, that remaining 5% is a big number, when you approach 500Million users, and it equates to the do business by the second sorts who grew up with BES sync or android phones and switched.   Most of the rest... I love the fact that I'm   It could hurt... but the sum of all the other non-google apps will likely outweigh the gmail app (if they didn't why did they pick iOS in the first place?)

 

As for google handicapping them... I'd worry more about Samsung.

 

As for strategy... why not have a 'switchers' campaign to drive people to apple icloud mail?

 

 

 

As for google... 'don't be evil'    .... seems to be so far back in history....

post #15 of 83
I just created a new Outlook account, forwarded my Gmail account to it, and then setup an alias in Outlook to send mail as if it were my gmail account.

I sign into my new Outlook account on my device and get my Gmail pushed to me, and no one knows I'm not using my Gmail account when I send mail.
post #16 of 83
Somebody mentioned Yahoo.. ahahaha

Apple increments product features one bite at a time...hence the logo. Want the next big thing? You're gonna have to pick another fruit from the Apple Tree.

Reply

Apple increments product features one bite at a time...hence the logo. Want the next big thing? You're gonna have to pick another fruit from the Apple Tree.

Reply
post #17 of 83
The problem here is primarily with Apple not Google (though Google should never have supported push email via the stupid Exchange protocol in the first place). Google mail's IMAP has supported IDLE (IMAP's implementation of push notifications) for years now, the problem is Apple's iOS Mail app doesn't support IDLE and so had to use the Google Exchange hack instead. Now that that's been dropped Apple's users are hurting.

The solution is for Apple to implement IDLE support in iOS Mail and thus give users access to push email for any IMAP service that supports IDLE, not just Google.
post #18 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by dshan View Post

The solution is for Apple to implement IDLE support in iOS Mail and thus give users access to push email for any IMAP service that supports IDLE, not just Google.

They probably should soon since it has been implemented in Apple Mail for awhile.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
post #19 of 83
Google are becoming increasingly douchey - my only contact with any of their services, is YouTube and the way they're ruining that with their constant unnecessary fiddling with the channel design is driving me to distraction! If I didn't have so much invested in it, when it comes to music and playlists - I'd run a mile!

They actually tricked me via YouTube into a Google+ account which I never wanted, just by suggesting I change my user name, which I was foolish enough to do. They're the enemy now, and I used to actually like them once...bloody privacy thief's!
post #20 of 83

Why anyone would rely on Gmail as their primary email provider I'll never understand.  There are so many better options out there.  Especially if you're using email for business.

post #21 of 83
yensid98: Could you list some good alternatives? I've slowly grown to hate Google, and every move they make nowadays is never in my interests. I happen to use Gmail primarily. I got it when it was still invite only, and I've grown to appreciate Gmail as a service, but lately I've been looking into ways to abandon Google (YouTube will be a lot tougher).
post #22 of 83

That's the sound of Google gasping for air.

 

ah well, looks like Gmail is going to be my junk only account from now on.  No big deal.  They think they have everybody hooked.  we'll see.

post #23 of 83
Quote:
Google officially ended its Exchange support on Jan. 30, but the search company has grandfathered in existing users' hardware to continue allowing push email. That means most users will only discover the changes if they get a new iPhone, whether through upgrading, or simply receiving a replacement from Apple.

 

Actually, they forgot to mention one fact here... This will also become reality with CURRENT hardware if the user decides to perform an iOS factory restore on the device, such as when they perform that function during an iOS update via iTunes to completely nuke and re-load the OS from scratch...

 

I tried this in my iPhone 5, and even after restoring from a fresh iCloud backup to the original state, my push email is now DEAD on all my Gmail accounts, including the Google Apps accounts I have running on the free subscription.

 

The "grandfathering" is at the software level and will be removed on existing hardware if you restore the device for any reason. Yet another omission (or lie) from the people that proclaim "Do No Evil"...

 

Am now officially moving all my accounts to Outlook.com and iCloud, screw you Scroogle!

post #24 of 83
Google is the new Microsoft

It's the 80s all over again.

Microsoft had their own OS but makes products for both Apple and PC. Slowly Microsoft stops supporting Apple. Eventually you have to use their OS.

Google maps.. gmail.. same stuff all over again. We support everyone!! We support our OS more.. we don't support yours anymore.

As bad a PR problem as Apple maps was it was Apple's best (and only) move. Google maps was generations behind the Android equivalent until Apple decided not to take it anymore.. then suddenly Google maps gets a 3 generation upgrade.

Don't be evil my ass...
post #25 of 83

This is a shame because Google's GMail app for iOS is incredibly slow. 

 

Hopefully this will all be ironed out by the time that I upgrade to the next iPhone. 1smile.gif

post #26 of 83
Well I just set up my iCloud email account. No idea why I didn't do it earlier. I didn't realize how simple it would be AND that there is nice, clean archive support. One of the reasons why I liked Gmail was its clean archival system. Now I gotta start changing emails for a million different websites :|
post #27 of 83
To get a push "notification" for a Gmail-based account on an affected iOS device you can add your Gmail account(s) to the Gmail app and turn off all notifications for that app except for "Sounds". Then, when you hear the tone, open your regular Mail app and get your new message.
post #28 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

It remains to be seen if iOS users will give up Google services like GMail and keep Apple hardware.

Seriously?  "Give up Google services"?  You're just going from push to fetch, which I'd already done with my Gmail accounts because "push" is a battery hog. 

 

There are a lot of places on the net that offer free "throw-away" mail accounts.  Gmail makes me nervous anyway since they essentially "read your mail' to look for opportunities to see you stuff.

post #29 of 83

Simple solution .....switched to my iCloud.com email address.    

 

Sent out a notice of new email address to my contacts.   Setup vacation reminder in gmail to send a second reminder of new iCloud.com email address.  

 

Changed by bank and credit cards. 

 

Took half hour to accomplish above.

 

now my mail arrives faster than ever on iPhone and iPad.       Within seconds of each other.  

 

Simple solution. 

post #30 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features. Unfortunately, Apple must allow these Google apps into the App Store or potentially face anti-competition charges.

It remains to be seen if iOS users will give up Google services like GMail and keep Apple hardware. Will they keep using Google's core services and abandon their iPhones because their beloved service is compromised on iOS devices? The more Google can get between iOS users and their hardware, the more the value proposition of iOS and Apple hardware comes into question.

I'm not a sky-is-falling Apple fan, but I do think Apple could use a strategy to defend against these maneuvers. Also, personally, I do not have email pushed to my iPhone, as it drains battery life. But many others, especially Blackberry converts, live and die by push email.

 

Which is why Apple's move away from Google, with inhouse maps etc, makes absolute sense for anyone who had a shred of insight. Imagine if Google had the ability to cripple every core app in iOS. It's why those screeching that Apple were moving away from Google dependance to "screw their users" or because of "greediness" or an "agenda" were so utterly idiotic.

 

There is no achille heel, it is to Google's benefit to make their iOS apps as good as possible, iOS users will more likely to stop using their apps o switch to an alternate app if its garbage, before switching over to an Android device. This exchange thing is not iOS exclusive, they are disabling push exchange on anything, so this has nothing to do with iOS itself. 


Edited by Slurpy - 3/25/13 at 3:52pm
post #31 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

 This exchange thing is not iOS exclusive, they are disabling push exchange on anything, so this has nothing to do with iOS itself. 

GMail still pushes to Apple Mail, just not iOS.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
post #32 of 83
Quote:
More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features.




Funny thing I don't use any Google services At all my wife uses an exchange mail server with her work all this article really means is the Google is dropping Exchange mail server support for iOS Mail unless you want to pay for It. I have my own email provider I wouldn't use Google if it was the last mail provider on the face the planet. You couldn't be more wrong about people not using iOS mail because Google drop exchange service Push mail. This is just googles way of making you pay for something that you shouldn't have to. Most businesses like my wifes push email from there exchange server. My work does as well. Google is just trying to get people to drop iOS mail and use there client so they can advertise you to the world. iOS mail is perfectly capable of using an exchange mail push server and google knows this. Its there choice. lol. A stupid one but there choice.
Edited by Mechanic - 3/25/13 at 4:29pm
post #33 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email.

iCloud sure doesn't exist. Nor do any other e-mail providers.
Oh... how does iCloud support email for domains? Do tell!

Other services... right... I'll get right on having IT switch our company from gmail to ...something else... so I can still get push mail on my iPhone. I'm sure they will be happy to oblige!

These things have a huge impact, and it is idiotic to think that there are trivial work-arounds. The problem isn't Apple, it is the core of what these "cloud" offerings really are-- a ploy at lock-in.
post #34 of 83
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post
I'll get right on having IT switch our company from gmail…

 

No self-respecting company uses Gmail.

 

Any company that does use Gmail is small enough for a switch not to matter. Any company large enough for a switch to matter is using something that is actually secure or has their own server for mail.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #35 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

More and more it seems like Google is exposing iOS's Achille's heel-very many iOS users rely on Google apps for core services like email. Google, at will, can handicap those services for iOS users, potentially pushing them even further to Android if they want the full breadth of those services' features. 

 

Apple isn't responsible for Google's decisions about how Google's services operate on competing operating systems. 

 

Oh, and like I'm really gonna leave an entire platform because of how Gmail works through Apple's own Mail app.      O.o

post #36 of 83
I have a gmail address purely because as well as my iPhone an iPad I have an android tablet. However I am trying to get rid of Google as much as possible from my technology. I don't use google as a search engine but use bing or yahoo instead (even on my android tablet), and I have deleted Google maps from my phone and iPad. The only google product that I use regularly is YouTube. As far as I am concerned the quicker apple ditches google from its products the better. Try life without google, you never know you might enjoy it.
post #37 of 83

i use mailbox app, but if i didnt i wouldnt care if i got my spam and amazon order conf's every 15 mins. i dont know any one who uses a regular none google apps email account for important biz stuff anyways

post #38 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post

Google is just trying to get people to drop iOS mail and use there client so they can advertise you to the world. iOS mail is perfectly capable of using an exchange mail push server and google knows this. Its there choice. lol. A stupid one but there choice.

Has anyone stopped to consider that perhaps Google doesn't want to pay Microsoft's licensing fee for Exchange Active Sync which is probably based on number of users if it is like any of Microsoft's other licenses? I wouldn't be surprised if MS is charging $10s of millions to both Google and Apple yearly. Why would anyone want to pay such enormous fees when there is a perfectly good free open source UNIX alternative which is how GMail actually pushes to any client app that supports it, like Apple Mail. Currently iOS Mail does not support IDLE making it incapable of receiving the iMAP push open source protocol Google is using.

 

Apple will still need Exchange support to satisfy corporate users with their own mail server, but Google apparently does not want to bother with that.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
post #39 of 83
Thankfully I use Yahoo email. And with the shuttering of Reader, Google just gave me the push I needed to disengage with their services other than search. I have some secondary email accounts on Gmail I'm in the process of shutting down and moving to other services that I trust more.

F*** Google and the horse they rode in on.
post #40 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitanTiger View Post

Thankfully I use Yahoo email. And with the shuttering of Reader, Google just gave me the push I needed to disengage with their services other than search. I have some secondary email accounts on Gmail I'm in the process of shutting down and moving to other services that I trust more.

F*** Google and the horse they rode in on.

Here you go have at it.

 

http://support.google.com/accounts/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=32046

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
  • Google's push Gmail changes surprise new iPhone buyers, Apple store reps
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Google's push Gmail changes surprise new iPhone buyers, Apple store reps