or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › France Telecom CEO says iPhone sales threatened by lack of cheaper option
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

France Telecom CEO says iPhone sales threatened by lack of cheaper option - Page 2

post #41 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Why would there be an iPhone without Apps? It wouldn't make any sense. The apps are part if the experience. That stripped down phone might a well be a dumb phone.

 

I dunno. Why is there an iPod without apps? Or why is there an iPod WITH apps? Why does the 15" MacBook Pro have a discrete graphics card while the 13" doesn't? Why does the larger iMac have user-accessible RAM slots and the smaller one doesn't? Why can you get a 7200RPM 500GB drive in the server version of the Mini but not in the standard version?

 

Like I said, I don't know why/how/if Apple would implement such a plan... that's not what I'm addressing. I'm saying that precedent for multiple models exists within their current product line. That's all. Speculating on how they would do it, why they would do it, or if they would do it all is pointless.

post #42 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

 

Total value of Apple on 9/30/11 = $294 billion

Total value of Apple today = $263 billion

total value = mkt cap less net debt = enterprise value

 

stock price up, value of company down as they have generated more cash per share than the stock price move, which in simple terms, means value of the underlying business has been diminished

 

these are facts, not speculation or conjecture.  the value of Apple has gone down under two years of Cook simply looking at point A (SJ death) and point B (today)

 

 

Your one data point does not invalidate what I said.  Apple has not "imploded" because its mkt cap has gone down 10%.  Especially when it's revenues have doubled in under 2 years, it's profit margins are higher than any other point in their history but a single quarter and it's sold more iPhones and iPads every quarter than any point of Steve Jobs at the helm.

 

Oh and Google's market cap is down nearly 6% since early March.  Are they "imploding" too?

post #43 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Wait, is France giving up? The "Low cost" iPhone is the 4/4S.
Except that that's maybe true in the US, but here in europe it's price has only gone up in the 2+ years (eg iPhone 4) since its launch and even took away half the capacity. And competitions equal products prices are going down.you can get now 2 similar equipped same sung droids for one iPhone 4.
post #44 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

I didn't say Apple was 'imploding' but they are facing significant challenges on a fwd looking basis.

So then your reply is basically irrelevant to what I was saying.  I was responding to the person claiming that Apple was "imploding" yet by every metric but market cap they are outperforming every other technology company.  To say they are "imploding" is the height of silliness.

post #45 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

This seems to be also a good argument *against* a low cost iPhone in that they could probably get more marketshare and generate more revenue by simply halving the margin on last years' phone, dropping the price by a hundred or more when bought off-contract, and making it essentially free, on-contract. 

For markets that have such contracts I think that's a great way to go, but others — especially for China, India and upcoming African markets — that may not be the best move for maximizing profits long term.

What makes you think there won't be a demand for, and hence a grey market for, and hence caterwauling for, and Apple capitulating to the yelling and screaming for such a phone in the US?

 

That could start a major race to the bottom.

post #46 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

Total value of Apple on 9/30/11 = $294 billion

Total value of Apple today = $263 billion

total value = mkt cap less net debt = enterprise value

It really depends on the purpose of such a measurement: why are you measuring the enterprise value? Are you saying that if someone is planning to acquire Apple, they'd need to come up with a check for $263B (and they would pay 'cash' to get the 'cash')? Sure.

 

But if you're looking at what it's worth to shareholders today, then it is a somewhat pointless number since does not include cash.

post #47 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

Google value over the same timeframe has gone from $127 billion to $219 billion

Samsung from US$86 billion to US$184 billion

This is true. And problematic.

post #48 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

The only thing Apple has to lose, is a race to the bottom. That is a race that Apple can never, ever, ever win.

Got anymore cliches?
post #49 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

This is true. And problematic.

Or an opportunity.
post #50 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

This is true. And problematic.

Or an opportunity.

Agreed. Apologies.

 

I should have qualified it with, "...problematic for those whose attention spans and investment horizons rival that of a gnat."

post #51 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

Total value of Apple on 9/30/11 = $294 billion
Total value of Apple today = $263 billion
total value = mkt cap less net debt = enterprise value

stock price up, value of company down as they have generated more cash per share than the stock price move, which in simple terms, means value of the underlying business has been diminished

these are facts, not speculation or conjecture.  the value of Apple has gone down under two years of Cook simply looking at point A (SJ death) and point B (today)

Your facts are not even close to reality.

As of today, Apple's market cap is $402 B. Total debt is $0 from the balance sheet. That makes the total value $402 B - using your formula.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #52 of 62

The only crack in the market right now is if they offered a 4s-size/power phone with LTE (which the carriers would like because 3g is so over-satured that moving a low-end phone to LTE would give them some breathing room, and let them offer "Full line of LTE iPhones", which sounds good.) Combined with a less expensive casing, maybe a less fancy camera, there is probably some room for it.

 

It might be the 4ls or something like that. The cost of engineering a LTE chip into the 4s probably negates its value long-term. When the iPhone 6 came out, the 4ls would just be let go, replaced with the 5, making it not worth it. 

post #53 of 62

France Telecom CEO says iPhone sales threatened by lack of cheaper option

 

News flash, Jethro. The hundred thousand people in the US with iPhones on welfare beg to differ.


Originally Posted by allenbf View Post
The only way to produce a cheaper iPhone would be to use less expensive materials.  It's the only option that I see, anyway.

 

Ah, disagreed. Research into both cheaper means of producing the raw components needed and assembly will lower costs (and price) without compromising on material.

 

That's what they've been doing for years. No multiple pieces of aluminum in their laptops anymore; it's all from one single piece.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #54 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

News flash, Jethro. The hundred thousand people in the US with iPhones on welfare beg to differ.

Ah, disagreed. Research into both cheaper means of producing the raw components needed and assembly will lower costs (and price) without compromising on material.

That's what they've been doing for years. No multiple pieces of aluminum in their laptops anymore; it's all from one single piece.

Yes, that is true. But the laptop prices didn't come down much did they? I'm honestly asking.
post #55 of 62
Originally Posted by allenbf View Post
Yes, that is true. But the laptop prices didn't come down much did they? I'm honestly asking.

 

Yes, by $300.


Penryn pre-unibody started at $1,999.

Unibody started at $1,699.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #56 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Yes, by $300.


Penryn pre-unibody started at $1,999.

Unibody started at $1,699.

Ah ok. Didn't realize that

post #57 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mieswall View Post

The guy is right. It is silly to be self-blinded because of your desires. I am very concerned about the lack of proactivity of Apple's board.

 

A year ago, we were all thinking Apple would sell 60m, even 70m iphones per Q with the arrival of iphone5 (remember, "unstoppable demand"?) . Then, supply issues tried to convince us that it was not a matter of shrinking demand. That may or may not be true; but the real consequence is that the demand, perhaps even because of that lack of supply, end up shrinking. The very same Apple has validated the droid alternatives, leaving low-income markets uncovered, not properly giving the high incomers what they wanted and when they wanted (larger phone, IFC, etc).

 

Now we are waiting forever some action of the management regarding China Mobile (years hearing this story), cheaper phone, larger phone, stock buyback, higher dividend, iTV (at least two years ago the "cracked" this), iRadio... and nothing at all happens except piling cash absurdly; instead we have lower margins, growth stalled, iphone supply issues, imac supply issues, map app problems, execs leaving the company, competitors providing equal or better products at lower prices, iPad mini cannibalizing his big brother, stock downgrades, options blatant manipulation, and the stock in free-fall, with Cook & Partners doing nothing...

 

I give up on Apple.


 I haven't given up on Apple. I read the same negative market news you do on Apple, yet Apple continues to get great financial results. 

 Thank goodness Apple doesn't make their iDevices in low wage ugly North Korea, as Samsung does!

post #58 of 62
@danv2 : actually, the French need to go back to doing things the French way, which is efficient, instead of trying to be a pale copy of the inefficient American system (you know, biggest debt in the world?)

Poor governance is killing France? Really?



Apart from that, whatever Richard says is purely his opinion, and even if true, well the iPhone will be a status symbol again instead of being that phone that every teenage girl carries 1wink.gif

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

Reply

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

Reply
post #59 of 62
And when will we see a all-in-one forfeit if you've got iPhone & iPad from Orange?
post #60 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshA View Post

 Thank goodness Apple doesn't make their iDevices in low wage ugly North Korea, as Samsung does!

 

Hopefully this is a poorly made joke.

 

The only South Korean goods made in North Korea, are those produced in the shared Kaesong Industrial Zone... and that's just low tech items such as clothes, shoes, watches, etc.

 

Various economic and security sanctions prohibit the manufacture or use of higher technology in North Korea.

 

 

.


Edited by KDarling - 4/5/13 at 6:57am
post #61 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

Well if the French say it, it must be true!


Orange is a huge operator. I think they know more about this than you do.

post #62 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

That's funny, this is from today's news:

 

 

FAILING FRANCE

The dismal French PMI boded ill for the euro zone's No.2 economy for the next quarter at least.

The Markit services purchasing managers' index fell in March for the eighth month running to 41.3 from 43.7 in February, hitting its lowest level since February 2009.

"The very weak support readings for the president (Francois Hollande) suggest it will be very difficult to go ahead with far-reaching structural reforms that are likely to lift productivity growth in the economy anytime soon, said Michels at Citi.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/04/04/us-europe-economy-idUSBRE9330E620130404

The socialist in charge of France is finding out that stealing money from people is not as easy as first planned. Many of the rich are leaving the country, after all, who wants to get taxed at 75%? lol.gif What a joke.1smoking.gif

 

And, here's another one:lol.gif

 

France ‘heading into triple-dip recession’

 

http://www.euronews.com/2013/03/22/france-hrecessioneading-into-triple-dip-/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

First, no need for super size font (I am getting old, but I still can read normal fonts, you know).

 

Second, I do not deny times are tough in France, but they also are in many other places in the world, including yours (I could substantiate this with some figures, but I do not want to make my case worse). The world crisis we go through is/will be comparable to the great depression, in my opinion.

 

About the taxation level and tax policy, may I remind you two facts concerning your own history :

 

1) Executive Order 6102 is an Executive Order signed on April 5, 1933, by U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt "forbidding the Hoarding of Gold Coin, Gold Bullion, and Gold Certificates within the continental United States". The order criminalized the possession of monetary gold by any individual, partnership, association or corporation.

2) 
The Hoover–Roosevelt Tax Increases President Hoover radically changed course from the low-tax policies of the 1920s with the Revenue Act of 1932. That law sharply increased individual tax rates at all income levels, with the top rate rising from 25 percent to 63 percent. Following Hoover, President Roosevelt signed into law a series of large tax increases for taxpayers at all income levels. At the bottom end, personal exemptions were reduced, and an earned income credit was eliminated. At the top end, the highest marginal rate was increased to 79 percent in 1936. 

 

So you see, your great President Roosevelt went even beyond what ours decided ! I was not living at that time I do not know whether he was accused of being communist or not. Without any doubt, your present President would be accused of this, should he take comparable decisions (but anyway he is already considered more or less as such by some of you, apparently..).

 

 

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
  • France Telecom CEO says iPhone sales threatened by lack of cheaper option
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › France Telecom CEO says iPhone sales threatened by lack of cheaper option