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LG Display's profits grow, but reports cite 'weakened' demand for Apple's iPhone & iPad

post #1 of 65
Thread Starter 
LG Display reported its fourth straight profitable quarter on Monday with a year over year increase, but numerous reports took a negative spin on the news because of the company's close relationship with Apple.

It's believed that Apple accounts for about 30 percent of LG Display's revenue, which is why a number of outlets on Monday chose to focus on the iPhone maker following LG's earnings report. Apple will report its own earnings on Tuesday.

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LG had an operating profit of 151 billion won in the first quarter, a major turnaround from the loss of 211 billion won the company saw a year ago. But a report from Reuters focused on LG's sequential, seasonal loss of 74 percent from the holiday quarter, and cited "weakened" demand for iPhone and iPad displays.

The report was not alone: London's Financial Times also made note of "concerns about falling sales" from Apple, while the Associated Press made claims of apparent "slackening orders" from the iPhone maker.

In contrast, the story was portrayed much differently by The Wall Street Journal, which focused on the fact that LG had "swung to a net profit in the first quarter." Reporter Min-Jeong Lee also cited "increased" sales of iPad displays to Apple.

For its part, LG said the quarter over quarter fall in profits was due to seasonally weak demand and adjusted orders made by customers.

LG also expects its panel shipments to increase between 5 percent and 10 percent in the second quarter of 2013. Market watchers view that as likely to be good news for Apple, given its large share of LG's orders.

Apple Chief Executive Tim Cook warned market watchers in January that they should not attempt to decipher sales of major products such as the iPhone with data from its suppliers. He noted that the supply chain is "very complex" and that Apple has "multiple sources" for various components.

"Even if a particular data point were factual, it would be impossible to interpret that data point as to what it meant for our business," he said.
post #2 of 65
Hey LG makes screens for Google Nexus too, perhaps it was the model that didn't sell well and had to see its order reduced. But it has to be Apple who cut the orders, huh?

Really, all three sources are simply speculating on what Apple might have done (if they did anything). The FT and Reuters say that was due to order cut. The WSJ says it's supplier diversification. So far, LG hasn't said anything, so it was a best an analyst's guesting game.
post #3 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoffdino View Post

Hey LG makes screens for Google Nexus too, perhaps it was the model that didn't sell well and had to see its order reduced. But it has to be Apple who cut the orders, huh?

Really, all three sources are simply speculating on what Apple might have done (if they did anything). The FT and Reuters say that was due to order cut. The WSJ says it's supplier diversification. So far, LG hasn't said anything, so it was a best an analyst's guesting game.

For all the doom and gloom the analysts and trolls shove onto Apple the fact that hardly any other company gets mentioned when these vendors have dozens if not hundreds of customers is proof that Apple still holds all the cards when it comes to mindshare.

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post #4 of 65
Apple should not have any conference call this Tuesday.. everyone knows everything already? i mean they value the stock depending on what other company's report?
post #5 of 65
This is a drop from holiday quarter, yes? Then no poop Sherlock. Holiday is Apple's (any retails) biggest quarter. It's like 60% of yearly sales in that six weeks. Plus launch quarters are like 70-80% of sales for new iDevices.

So of course demand is less now. Both for the devices and for screens. Particularly since Apple won't be ordering an extra 30-40% to make sure any fails for QA don't hold up unit production. But the analysts don't think of this and instead spin it like folks are buying the Note, Nexus, Surface instead. And THIS is that kills the stock. By itself and the implication that Apple could have sold more, no matter how much they sell.
post #6 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpvn View Post

Apple should not have any conference call this Tuesday.. everyone knows everything already? i mean they value the stock depending on what other company's report?

Feels like it. Pity legally Tim has to release the numbers. But perhaps he should kill it off with a dose of the reality I mentioned previously. And maybe a request to the analysts to post facts with verified and named sources or STFoxtrotU
post #7 of 65
Reuters bank accounts probably will tell the truth .
post #8 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

. . . I don't think this is about mindshare. . . .

. . . says the resident serial manipulator of our minds.

Insert "attempted" in there somewhere.
post #9 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpvn View Post

Apple should not have any conference call this Tuesday.. everyone knows everything already? i mean they value the stock depending on what other company's report?

every public company is like that

 

wall street maps out the company's products to their suppliers and customers and uses the numbers to predict earnings. they are accurate most of the time

 

if you have the resources its not rocket science to predict apple's earnings and revenues

post #10 of 65

Market is getting saturated.

post #11 of 65
Another useless comment by an analyst who doesn't seem to get that component orders don't track with quarterly sales.

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post #12 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

Another useless comment by an analyst who doesn't seem to get that component orders don't track with quarterly sales.


Unless they do in this case.

 

I wouldn't say too much at this point... we only have a day to wait.

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post #13 of 65
Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post
Insert "attempted" in there somewhere.

 

Oh, what do you call two crows?

 

Attempted murder. lol.gif


Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post
Market is getting saturated.


Not in the slightest.

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post #14 of 65
I'm surprised analysts didn't link McDonald's performance to Apple. "Sales fall at McD's. people aren't interested in Dollar Menu = lack of disposable income = no one can afford iDevices = iPad mini sales fall YOY"
post #15 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

every public company is like that

wall street maps out the company's products to their suppliers and customers and uses the numbers to predict earnings. they are accurate most of the time

if you have the resources its not rocket science to predict apple's earnings and revenues

If WS is so accurate, why haven't they accurately predicted the success of Apple in the last 10 years?
post #16 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

 

The story mentions the fact that Apple is responsible for 30% of LG's display business, so I don't think this is about mindshare. It seems clear that Apple will not have a great quarter (all of the supply chain indications are negative), but on the bright side, this seems priced into the stock at this point.

 

...and what percentage of Samsung's screen business, oh and Sharp's screen business?

 

Maybe the SEC should start looking into all the bullshit going on with all these articles which are affecting Apple's stock and see who is behind them.

 

My guess is a South Korean based company with an open chequebook to pay off bloggers.

 

Apple don't own the stock, why should they give a f*ck, their focus should be to just keep on making and selling great stuff.

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post #17 of 65
Apple is NEVER at fault.
post #18 of 65
Originally Posted by bleh1234 View Post
Apple is NEVER at fault.

 

Prove they are, then.

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post #19 of 65
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Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

I'm surprised analysts didn't link McDonald's performance to Apple. "Sales fall at McD's. people aren't interested in Dollar Menu = lack of disposable income = no one can afford iDevices = iPad mini sales fall YOY"

I'm surprised too! A few years back some of the Apple products at McDonald's had to be recalled due to listeria fears. 

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post #20 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Prove they are, then.

He really means that Apple isn't at fault¡ He thinks the iPod was just dumb luck. He thinks iTunes was luck. He thinks the success of a quality, high end PC was luck. He thinks the MBA was luck. HE thinks the iPhone was luck. He thinks the App Store was luck. And he thinks the iPad was luck. Every success Apple has ever had has not been caused by their efforts but sheer dumb luck¡

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

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post #21 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


If WS is so accurate, why haven't they accurately predicted the success of Apple in the last 10 years?

they haven't? the stock price had gone up before earnings almost every time. in early 2012 all the apple blogs were blogging how cirrus logic and other suppliers had monster quarters and then apple followed as well

 

funny how in jaunuary 2013 a lot of apple suppliers reported after apple

post #22 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

I'm surprised too! A few years back some of the Apple products at McDonald's had to be recalled due to listeria fears. 

The Listeria sounds like the name of a Carnival cruise ship.

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

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post #23 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

 

The story mentions the fact that Apple is responsible for 30% of LG's display business, so I don't think this is about mindshare. It seems clear that Apple will not have a great quarter (all of the supply chain indications are negative), but on the bright side, this seems priced into the stock at this point.

 

The only known data-point so far is Verizon had 25% growth of the iPhone and Android either held steady with no growth or slid 1%. The rest is wild tea leaves.

post #24 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Market is getting saturated.

Nonsense.

 

There is no limit to the number of iPhones and iPads they can sell, simply because there are always a lot of people and companies who just get the newest versions regardless (see the iPad 4 outselling the iPad 3 that only came out 6 months before).

 

133 million people are born every year so "quite a lot" of people every year fall into the "need a phone now" bracket.

 

Existing phone owners are generally on a 24 month contract so there is a natural 2 year rotation of new phones.

 

There are Android users who have eventually listened to what their friends have told them and decided to try out an iPhone.

 

There are kids who have a job now and want to upgrade that "iPad" that their parents bought them to an actual iPad.

 

Nearly limitless repeat sales and that's not taking into account the 3 or 4 year rotation on Macs or any new category products that Apple release.

post #25 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

 

Best thing that could happen tomorrow is all the analysts look silly and the reduced orders are not accurate, due to yield issues, etc.  The reality is that is unlikely given every data point is negative and the most recent rumors are that even the 5S and other items are now delayed beyond original plans.  I don't really see the benefit of releasing everything all at once again as Apple appears to be heading again this year, giving the competition a big window to bash Apple and tout their own 'innovation.'  I think Tim Cook needs to be prepared to fight.  He mocked several analysts on the call last quarter saying their supply chain checks weren't telling the entire story.... well if they got it right, he rightly deserves some 'how did you miss this' questions. 

 

I should note there were a number of stories discussing Cook's future, or lack thereof, this weekend.

Another lie?  Seriously?

 

The ONLY data point we have so far is 25% growth of iPhone activations on Verizon. You call this "negative"? I don't think that word means what you think it means. LG never divulged their customer spit so this is a weak data point at best given we know Samsung (that reported an increase in delivers - another lie about all data points being negative) and Sharp are also LCD suppliers to Apple.

 

Your "discussions" are led by people like Rob Enderle (a paid shill for HP, Dell and MS that has hated Apple for decades) and masterful stock manipulator Douglass Kass. These people all have strong vested interests against Apple's success.

post #26 of 65
Cook does not really have a responsibility to the stock price. His responsibility is to ensuring the company spends money wisely and makes a profit. If the investors are stupid enough to sell off stock at a discount because of blatant media manipulation, they are getting what they deserve. If they want to move their money over to Amazon with its escalating losses and infinite P/E, go ahead. Cook's future depends on continuing to grow Apple's profit.

Apple's profit for last quarter could be more profit than any US company has made ever. Some financial news sites will still have headlines calling it a miss. Is it criminal manipulation? Probably. Will anyone ever doing anything about it? No. If you are not a professional, you should not make short term securities investments (I will call short term anything you plan holding less then 10 years). It all works out in the end.
post #27 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

they haven't? the stock price had gone up before earnings almost every time. in early 2012 all the apple blogs were blogging how cirrus logic and other suppliers had monster quarters and then apple followed as well

funny how in jaunuary 2013 a lot of apple suppliers reported after apple

They haven't. That is why Apple has blown away the consensus estimates.
post #28 of 65
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
Every success Apple has ever had has not been caused by their efforts but sheer dumb luck¡

 

Well, idiots will buy anything, after all. How else do you think Apple is able to price its crap hardware so high?¡

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post #29 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilution View Post

....

 

133 million people are born every year so "quite a lot" of people every year fall into the "need a phone now" bracket.

 

Existing phone owners are generally on a 24 month contract so there is a natural 2 year rotation of new phones....

 

 

133 million worldwide.

Many commenters here have reminded us that the 24 month contracts are a USA phenomenon, not a global one. And despite the attempt to create hardware churn in the USA on a 2 year cycle, many of us prefer to use what we have a lot longer, hence the rising interest in the non-subsidized monthly plans offered by T-mobile, StraightTalk, VirginMobileUSA, and others.

While I don't agree that there is no limit to the number of iPhones that can be sold, I do think we are still far from reaching the limit.

post #30 of 65

How important is Apple? So important that every tech co, has to be tied to it to collect eyes. And that goes for good, bad and the irrelevant.

When I find time to rewrite the laws of Physics, there'll Finally be some changes made round here!

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post #31 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

A bit off topic. I wish Apple would simply stop using LG panels the quality really seems to be inconsistent. Lately I have been reading a lot about image retention and yellow screens on new iMac and rMBP displays. In some cases there are hundreds or pages about these issues on the Apple support forums.

I'm not sure if these are widespread issues or just a minority of people bitching a lot. With Haswell around the corner there have been some really good deals on 13" rMBP's but I have been hesitant to pull the trigger on one because of this issue. Figured I would ask you or anyone else here if they have an opinion on this issue.

Everything I've seen points to the Retina IPS panels being LG's design but LG's manufacturing really does seem quite poor. I much prefer Samsung's manufacturing of these displays. Same goes for the SSD Cards using Samsung controllers over Toshiba. For all their ethical faults Samsung has repeatedly shown to have the best foundries.
Edited by SolipsismX - 4/22/13 at 11:00am

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post #32 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Well, idiots will buy anything, after all. How else do you think Apple is able to price its crap hardware so high?¡

Don't forget the iSheep will buy multiples of all iDevices. How else can you explain the record sales every qtr. /s
post #33 of 65
Originally Posted by mhikl View Post
And that goes for good, bad and the irrelevant.

 

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post #34 of 65
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Originally Posted by igriv View Post

Just because you disagree with something does not make it a lie (and calling it a lie makes you a jerk).

No, he's an amateur advocate of the truth going up against a professional purveyor of lies. You, of course, are sensitive to this dynamic.
post #35 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

[image]


Don't forget The Ugly...


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post #36 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

I should have said I don't think the VZ data is positive - in my opinion - due to the large numbers of older models sold, which will pressure ASPs and could lead to a revenue miss.  Further is indicates slowing growth (which is the concern) despite the absolute growth.  To each is own, some have view the VZ data point as positive, some as negative.
the split between 5 and older models from Verizon didn't really change from last quarter. And from Apple's conference call last quarter, iPhone ASP didn't fluctuate much. So we have no hard data yet to suggest ASP for iPhone will be down this quarter. What we do have is a lot of people putting a negative spin on every data point (or assuming a negative data point is related to Apple) and expecting the worst.
post #37 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

Just because you disagree with something does not make it a lie (and calling it a lie makes you a jerk).
Explain why the stock is up today with this slew of negative news? Investors buying on these rumors of Cook getting the boot? Stock down so much last week that its cheap now and people want to get back in?
post #38 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdnc123 View Post

That is probably accurate and to add something positive, I don't think additional 4S sales are bad for margins....could actually be additive to gross margin % even if ASPs are moderately lower than the 5.
I don't remember the exact figures last quarter but do know the ASP was very close to the ASP from the previous quarter. However if i remember correctly the ASP for iPad was lower suggesting a higher mix of mini/iPad 2 sales.
post #39 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv View Post

You obviously haven't read what I said before: the stock is up because the bad news is baked into the price, or so people think, so they think that the only surprise could be to the upside (but it is not up a lot, so people are obviously quite wary).

What a position to take: Stock up means people already realize how shitty Apple is; stock down means people are just realizing how shitty Apple is. 1oyvey.gif

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post #40 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeaEarleGreyHot View Post

 

133 million worldwide.

Many commenters here have reminded us that the 24 month contracts are a USA phenomenon, not a global one. And despite the attempt to create hardware churn in the USA on a 2 year cycle, many of us prefer to use what we have a lot longer, hence the rising interest in the non-subsidized monthly plans offered by T-mobile, StraightTalk, VirginMobileUSA, and others.

While I don't agree that there is no limit to the number of iPhones that can be sold, I do think we are still far from reaching the limit.

24 month contracts are very popular in Europe as well. You can get 12 month ones but per minute and per GB is much more expensive.

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