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NYT article accuses Apple of not doing enough to prevent iPhone thefts - Page 3

post #81 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonshf View Post

Exactly. You are clueless.

A fairly idiotic statement. 

 

Quite obviously, you're not a techie either.

post #82 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecs View Post

I agree with the article. One of the things that disappointed me when I got my iPhone was that it doesn't have a ROM-encoded serial number (I mean non-writable non-erasable ROM, unlike NVRAM which can be rewritten). A solution like that would turn iPhones very hard to steal... criminals would need to disassemble the unit, and replace the ROM chip. Hard to do. This would certainly stop teenagers-friends thefts.

 

If it had that ROM serial number, you simply call Apple "hey, my iPhone was stolen", then Apple blacklists your serial number, and no phone operator would allow such unit anymore. Case closed. Just make the ROM chip very hard to replace (so that you easily break the iPhone if you want to remove it), and nobody will care to steal iPhones anymore.

See, this ignores the whole issue of privacy.  Not to mention security.  I may not want my phone to be a non-resettable ID tracking device.  I may not want a government or a phone company to be able to have that degree of information on a minute-by-minute basis about me.  Furthermore, suppose my ex-girlfrind calls  the phone company and tell them "hey my iPhone was stolen" and give them my number... then suddenly I'm either arrested or my phone is bricked.  Nice.  Imagine someone having the ability to "brick" the phone belonging to a policeman... a senator... a military general... a high political officer... White House chief of staff....  Imagine the potential for industrial snooping (the location info) or the potential for blackmail (bricking a CEO's phone).  

 

Noooo... what you suggest is way too simplistic, IMO.

post #83 of 151
Originally Posted by jfc1138 View Post

The only thing I can think of is a bricking code that just slags the phone. But I'd think anything that is doable from a distance is probably reversable by someone with enough tech, unless the phone is physically disabled in some permanent way....

 

The bad guys could immediately power down the iPhone, take it into the nearest Faraday cage, and work on it at their leisure.  (See "Enemy of the State," 1998, Will Smith, Gene Hackman.)

 

One way to counter that is to implement a timeout that will begin if the phone hasn't connected to a cell network after some interval.  It would force the user to enter their passcode, then brick the phone if they don't.  And it would continue to count even after a hard reset and wipe.  (I'm sure Apple has worked out something like that, since the government is supposedly considering using iPhones for "high security uses.")

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post #84 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post


How's about writing this instead:

"Recently, I had a friend's roll of $700 that got stolen in a Jersey mall.  He just put the money down for 5-10 seconds while attending to their kids where it got swiped..."

Why is carelessly putting down a $700 phone be more important than say, putting down that much in cash and not expecting anything?

Because he was sitting right next to it and had to wipe the kid's face.

 

With your logic... that's like saying Hot Blonde's who walk in mini skirts and not Burka's deserved to be raped.

post #85 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress View Post

 

Well if you don't have some kind of solution then you can't bitch about it. Why is it Apple's responsibility for YOUR phone?

What a daft response. Who said anything about it being Apple's 'responsibility'?!

 

Ugh. Learn to read. Before posting.

post #86 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

(I'm sure Apple has worked out something like that, since the government is supposedly considering using iPhones for "high security uses.")

Excellent point.

post #87 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfc1138 View Post

It's way after the fact, but did you try calling your phone while the sheriff was talking to the guy? I had to resort to that once when I misplaced the thing in my house.... miught have been the only time I used my landline that whole Summer....

 

Yes, I tried calling from my wife's iPhone but he had powered off my iPhone moments after he parked his car and before the sheriff arrived. Apple should not allow LOCKED iPhones to be powered off without a password.

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post #88 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

 

"Without white colored cars, the number of car thefts would be down overall for 2012."

 

"Without left handed people, the number of homicides would be down overall for 2012."

 

All equally useful probably true statements.


Great analogy!

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post #89 of 151
So Apple doesn't do enough to stop resetting of phones by thieves, to deny service to stolen phones etc. but then if they do these things, especially the baseband level stuff, the privacy groups will flame on over how they are blocking privacy rights. And then there's the whole bashing of Apple playing cop and all the risks of abuse. But then if they say they require a police report etc they are being too strict.

And so on.

So basically they can't win

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #90 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

A stolen iPhone goes for $500? How much for a stolen Galaxy S3?

Trick question. Who wants to steal a Galaxy phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Car companies are doing a lot. Educate yourself. (Also, read the NYT article). Moreover, taking out an iPhone to make a call or watch a video or listen to a song or surf the web is not "flashing a pricey product in public." Do you use yours only in private?

Apple has dropped the ball on this. That is simply a fact. Don't get so defensive.

Do you count your cash or take your wallet out in public? Leave your car keys dangling by your side? People can't be oblivious to their surroundings.
post #91 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott523 View Post

Apple has done their part to prevent thefts. It's the consumers that need to do their part.

However, I wished there was a way not to allow a thief to turn off the iDevice by holding the sleep button.

Even if they did, there would likely be a way to get past it, just like there is now for pass codes. Someone would figure it out and share it with the world
Edited by charlituna - 5/2/13 at 10:52am

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #92 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by aleksivic View Post

Because he was sitting right next to it and had to wipe the kid's face.

 

With your logic... that's like saying Hot Blonde's who walk in mini skirts and not Burka's deserved to be raped.


You're comparing an expensive phone/roll of money being carelessly left behind to a woman being raped for doing absolutely nothing?  

Not only are you being an epic idiot for even bringing up that subject and comparison, you're not even worth the effort to make any further discussion.  Consider yourself blocked newbie.  Have a nice life Einstein, sad as it is.

post #93 of 151

The NY Times isn't doing enough to ensure people have access to their web site. Something about a paywall... For "the greater good" they should remove the paywall and make all of their services completely free. /s

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post #94 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

 

Yes, I tried calling from my wife's iPhone but he had powered off my iPhone moments after he parked his car and before the sheriff arrived. Apple should not allow LOCKED iPhones to be powered off without a password.

Yes, that does seem a simple fix doesn't it?

 

Then with your idea any passworded phone would provide an opportunity window for tracking etc. immediately after when the phone would potentially still be in the area.

post #95 of 151
It's not just apple it's any of the companies who make these types of products. Seems simple enough that once a device is reported as lost or stolen that the service provider issues an order to destroy the firmware. Used to have thumb drives that did just that if you exceeded the number of log in attempts.
post #96 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

 

The bad guys could immediately power down the iPhone, take it into the nearest Faraday cage, and work on it at their leisure.  (See "Enemy of the State," 1998, Will Smith, Gene Hackman.)

 

One way to counter that is to implement a timeout that will begin if the phone hasn't connected to a cell network after some interval.  It would force the user to enter their passcode, then brick the phone if they don't.  And it would continue to count even after a hard reset and wipe.  (I'm sure Apple has worked out something like that, since the government is supposedly considering using iPhones for "high security uses.")

jd_in_sb had a partial answer to that. Block a password protected phone from being powered off without entering the password.

post #97 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

 

The bad guys could immediately power down the iPhone, take it into the nearest Faraday cage, and work on it at their leisure.  (See "Enemy of the State," 1998, Will Smith, Gene Hackman.)

 

One way to counter that is to implement a timeout that will begin if the phone hasn't connected to a cell network after some interval.  It would force the user to enter their passcode, then brick the phone if they don't.  And it would continue to count even after a hard reset and wipe.  (I'm sure Apple has worked out something like that, since the government is supposedly considering using iPhones for "high security uses.")

 

Thank you all.  Hopefully, Apple has something on iOS7 to resolve this annoying theft issue.

post #98 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post


The woman in the article, Rose Cha had her iPhone stolen THREE TIMES.  At what point does this woman stop to think for a moment that she needs to change something about her behavior that makes her a magnet for getting mugged?
 

Ha! Yeah, I've known Rose well for years, and she's sweet but she could probably benefit from a change of behavior. I'm not joking.

post #99 of 151

"Without Apple product thefts, crime would have been down overall for 2012."
- Mayor Bloomberg

 

The NYPD did nearly 700,000 Stop and Frisk in 2011 and 533,000 last year. Have they recover one iPhone? 

 

http://newyork.newsday.com/news/new-york/nypd-stop-and-frisk-nyc-mayor-michael-bloomberg-defends-policies-1.5170199?qr=1

http://www.nyclu.org/node/1598

post #100 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Another one...

 

Lack of responsibility? So I can't check an SMS because some bastard might be watching? Hey, don't be a retard. The only one that is guilty is ALWAYS the guy that choses to become trash and steals something.

Do you lock your car doors?

Do you put a  lock on your bicycle when going to get a coffee downtown?

Do you leave your wallet on a table in a restaurant?

 

Phone (no matter the brand), laptop, mp3 player. 

 

All the same thing. It's your stuff, be vigilant

post #101 of 151
I had to recently replace my wife's iPhone because it was stolen. She was at fault for leaving it in an unlocked car in our suburban garage with the door open. The creepy part was the idea of having someone going through our property at 530 am while we were sleeping there. I have some ideas of how to improve security around our house.

Apple is not "at fault" for my wife's carelessness. It would be nice if the difficulty of selling an iPhone could be increased. I am pretty sure that a powered down iPhone is good currency for any drug the user requires. It turns out there are at least 6 or 8 people willing to buy stolen gas at 7 or 8 am on Saturday as well or someone is set up to collect gas as well. I would like my gas station to have a camera collecting all license plates of gas buyer's. It would be a strong perk for the device if it was very difficult to turn it off without a password. We were already looking for the device by 10 am and realized it was stolen by 10:30. If there were someway to add security to the device and track it better, I would be quite pleased.
post #102 of 151
NYT can be a stupid paper at times. This is one those times.
post #103 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

My brand new iPhone 5 was stolen and the guy drove away in a big black SUV. I followed the guy with Find My IPhone. When he parked and powered off my iPhone I called the Sheriff. Sheriff spoke to him and he denied having it even though I saw him take it and tracked him with my wife's iPhone. The Sheriff did not search him or the car. The Sheriff wrote a report and then promptly dropped my case a week later because I had no videotape evidence of him a a actually stealing the phone. I was very upset and the Sheriff said "You're treating this like a murder case. It's just a phone. We deal with much bigger problems." And that was that. Without videotape evidence of a phone theft the Sheriff will do nothing. They completely dismiss phone tracking.

I really wish:
1) iOS would not allow people to power off a locked phone without entering a password. This would have allowed me to use Find My iPhone to make my iphone play a sound while the sheriff was there.
2) Apple would build a remote kill switch. AT&T blocking is not enough because the same phone will work in Europe thus can be sold on eBay.

1) My nephew had his iPhone 5 stolen from his middle school gym locker during class. My brother checked for it with Find My iPhone but it didn't show up. He did the commands to lock and announce when it came back online. This occurred about an hour after school got out. He grabbed a screenshot of the location and sent it along with the physical address to the school's principle, whom he'd already been in touch with. The principle contacted the police that went to residence, retrieved the device, and arrested the kid.

2) I posted about that desire change to iOS in post 24 of this thread (as well as many other times in the past). I also included some of the hurdles involved with doing this as a frozen iDevice, as rare as it may be, still needs a way to cut the power when the display isn't being responsive.


Edited by SolipsismX - 5/2/13 at 1:19pm

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post #104 of 151
I don't think Apple can do much about this wihout violating some pretty important freedoms...

Besides, why should Apple do the job of the police force?

You can go to the Police and say "hey, look, my Apple hardware is here right on apple maps" and they'll gladly ignore it.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

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post #105 of 151
My son had his hand me down iphone stolen, why, because he did as others here have pointed out, he left it unattended in a place which he knew someone might take it. We did use find my iphone and knew about where it was located until they removed the sim and he did figure out who took it. But the School and the Police where it happen refused to do anything about since as they point he did not witness him taking it so they could not accuse another kid of something with out a witness. We called AT&T to have the SIM disabled but AT&T refused to disable the IMEI number, why as they simple explain, there is no proof to them it was actually stolen, even with a police report since the police decide not to take any action there was nothing AT&T could do.

The flip side of this issue is you have people who sold or lost the phone and now wish to keep someone else from using it. Or a husband has fight with the wife and want her phone bricked. For ever reason to brick the phone there is reason not to.

Moral of the story, if you do not want your phone stolen, keep a close eye on it and I am not say hid it from public. I personally see lots of people leaving their phones sitting on a table or chair or in plain sight in a purse. I am sorry you asking for someone to rip you off. Face bad people live in the world so grow up and gain some street smarts.
post #106 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

 

The bad guys could immediately power down the iPhone, take it into the nearest Faraday cage, and work on it at their leisure.  (See "Enemy of the State," 1998, Will Smith, Gene Hackman.)

 

One way to counter that is to implement a timeout that will begin if the phone hasn't connected to a cell network after some interval.  It would force the user to enter their passcode, then brick the phone if they don't.  And it would continue to count even after a hard reset and wipe.  (I'm sure Apple has worked out something like that, since the government is supposedly considering using iPhones for "high security uses.")


Or a small tactical nuke, maybe? Don't have your Bluetooth ring next to it, countdown starts... after two hours it goes nuclear.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #107 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retrogusto View Post

Ha! Yeah, I've known Rose well for years, and she's sweet but she could probably benefit from a change of behavior. I'm not joking.


Great, you just made her a target ^^

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #108 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post


Great analogy!


No, wrong analogy. Example: two thefts in 2011, all left handed, one in 2012, right handed. Without the left handed thefts, there is an increase in thefts.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

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post #109 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Interesting how you jump to claiming it's the VICTIM'S fault, particularly when I said absolutely nothing of the sort.

 

Perhaps take your own advice.

 

Are you kidding?  So in an article about preventing crime your solution is to emphasize the personal responsibility of the criminal?

 

Yeah, that's going to accomplish anything.

 

Either that isn't what you meant at all and you're backpedalling, or you're off your head nuts.  Evens.  lol.gif

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post #110 of 151
Originally Posted by tomjava View Post
Hopefully, Apple has something on iOS7 to resolve this annoying theft issue.

 

Hopefully they don't, since it has nothing to do with them.


Originally Posted by See Flat View Post

It's your stuff, be vigilant

 

I think the argument is "No, do it for me." 1frown.gif

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #111 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeeJay2012 View Post


"Apple has dropped the ball on this"

 

What rubbish. It's called personal responsibility. I suppose that ALL manufacturers need to step up and prevent thefts... watches, jewellery, TVs, cars.. /s  Carriers and telcos could prevent activation of stolen phones by registering all IMEI numbers and blocking ones reported stolen or hacked numbers. But they don't - you figure out why.

 

As far as Apple dropping the ball, stop trolling and go back to your Samsung shift.

 

 

 

"Apple has dropped the ball on this" is a load of rubbish indeed!!

 

But the very sad part is that this guy is probably not even getting paid for his troubles.

post #112 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Hopefully they don't, since it has nothing to do with them.

 

It has to do with their consumers though. Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should make a point of not offering a feature that would be a big value-add for their users to make a political point against the NYT?

 

There is something wrong in your head when you take your defence of Apple to such absurd depths.

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post #113 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyGuyBC View Post

Huh?  Did you miss this in the article?
"Currently, a number of antitheft technologies exist, allowing mobile device owners to track stolen smartphones and tablets. Early last year, AT&T 
rolled out a new system
 that blocked stolen iPhones from network access. Also, Apple's Find My Phone feature uses iCloud to 
track stolen iOS devices
, which has resulted in some notable busts."


Tell me which smartphone does more?

Sure the article mentions ISM hacks but let's be honest, the average smartphone thief is looking to make a quick buck to support their drug habit so it's highly unlikely they would know how, or care to spend the time to perform such hacks.  Blocking stolen phones from connecting to the networks (as has been universally done in Canada), combined with people not being complete effing idiots and realizing that if the dude on the corner is selling them an iPhone for a "too good to be true" price because IT IS, will likely cease thefts altogether.

It won't, in most cases if it is a drug addict, they'll be looking for a quick buck and sell the iPhone cheaply, they probably already know where to go to sell it and that person will know how to bypass antitheft methods.
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #114 of 151

Simple answer is an iPhone protective case that has a Samsung logo prominently painted on it.

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post #115 of 151

Since when did it become Apple's responsibility to deal with theft?

 

Here's a radical idea. How about we place the blame on the people who steal the iPhones?

post #116 of 151
Originally Posted by Crowley View Post
Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should make a point of not offering a feature that would be a big value-add for their users to make a political point against the NYT?

 

I'm suggesting adding a feature for the sole purpose of a deemed necessity of its inclusion. The premise of the article is crap.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

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post #117 of 151
I can only surmise that the "article" is, in fact, a paid advertisement from Samsung.

There is absolutely no doubt that the Apple iPhone is the most secure smartphone on the market today especially where physical access is considered.
post #118 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

I'm suggesting adding a feature for the sole purpose of a deemed necessity of its inclusion. The premise of the article is crap.

 

The sole purpose of a deemed necessity of a convoluted sentence?  Nonsense.

 

The article is an article, who gives a carp about its premise?  It'd be a useful feature for many people and would give Apple another selling point above and beyond the competition.  Focus on that, not on pumped up ire for the NYT.

 

If Apple are smart they'll take ideas from wherever they spring from, not be stubbornly reactionary.

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post #119 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post

There is absolutely no doubt that the Apple iPhone is the most secure smartphone on the market today especially where physical access is considered.

 

Rot.  Apple have a reputation for not playing well with carriers and the police in standardised responses and registers of stolen phones.  And how is it more secure where physical access is concerned?  You're just making stuff up, right?

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post #120 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I am not a techie, so I have no clue. But there has to be something better than "all hope is lost if the thieves erase the IMEI."

 

For example, is GPS tracking an option (assuming that the loss is reported to the police).

Privacy issues.  If tracking was on by default and no way to turn it off, people would complain (most of the same people that are complaining about Apple not doing enough to prevent stolen iPhones here).  This is a case of where a company can not do the right thing because there is no real way for that to happen.   The best they can do is provide options but it is still up to the consumer to use those options as they see fit (and not complain because they chose the wrong one at the time).

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