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Adobe goes subscription-only, rebrands Creative Suite as Creative Cloud - Page 3

post #81 of 180

I'd be less annoyed by this if each recent version weren't buggier than the last one. I keep up to date with the three Adobe products I use (and yes, I do pay for them) to maintain compatibility with OS updates and with other freelancers I work with, and each upgrade comes with a period of learning the workarounds for the new bugs. The last version of Illustrator went a step further by actually removing features I've relied on for years with my web development workflow.

 

Now my cost to use these products will roughly double and I'll lose the flexibility to time the upgrades for when I actually need them -- with no benefit that I can see. Thanks Adobe.

post #82 of 180
This is amazing stupid of Adobe. Right when they are poised to bury Final Cut X for the crap product that it is with the far superior Premiere Pro CS6 suite, they do this malarky - which will insure that they don't win a majority of the video editing software business.

Who are the knuckle heads at Adobe who think a sound business plan consists of huckstering consumers and screwing over professionals that have been long time customers?
post #83 of 180
Will there be a Creative Suite PE* ?


*pirate edition
post #84 of 180
Originally Posted by Growlroo View Post
…Final Cut X for the crap product that it is with the far superior Premiere Pro CS6…

 

Enjoy your lies.

Originally posted by Marvin

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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #85 of 180

It's a little disgusting to read here people suggesting that the only people who might not want this subscription model are software pirates. I have bought all of my Creative Suites over the years. I currently have CS5 and I see no reason to upgrade, certainly not now. I'm probably like many Adobe customers. I use all occasionally, but some very much less than others. But it was nice feeling that the tools were there if I ever should need them.

 

Users like me are frozen out on the subscription model. For every ten professional users who will sign up, Adobe has lost a hundred casual users. Great work there! 

 

This is the end of Adobe, their last bone-headed move. It has been ten years of shambling incompetence and greed. So long Adobe — and thanks for all the fish.

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post #86 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post

 

Yes, because casual home users, hobbyists, and self-employed freelancers just love forking out $1500 - $2000 for software all at one time.

 

Yeah right. Where is this attitude coming from? And who pays MSRP for software suites? I'm one of those freelancers, and no we don't LOVE forking out large sums of money for overpriced software, but every legitimate user (myself included) HAS paid for the full package at least once. I paid $800 for my first purchase of CS2… 

 

I've been upgrading since, averaging about $600 every three years (I don't always upgrade "on schedule"). It's a lump sum I plan for, I save up for it, and pull the trigger when I'm ready… I decide when, and I decide how much I will spend. The subscription model puts an end to me determining my own pace / priority for software purchasing.

 

Your snarky tone is tiring… what does this have to do with not liking 'subscription based' software?

post #87 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

It's a very confusing name... but the software is still installed and runs locally from your computer.

 

Until you don't pay the monthly subscription, and then what ho! It stops working (and so do you) until you pay up...

 

Nothing at all confusing about it.

post #88 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post

Then your boss is an idiot. For one, it becomes an operating expense rather than a capital expense, and should be favourable come tax time. That's why companies lease equipment rather than buying it. And two, counting upgrades, assuming you use more than two of their apps, you probably paid more than $50/month on average if you upgraded every time to keep current. If you use one or two adobe apps, then rent those individually for $20/month each.

 

You wouldn't make much of an accountant.  Leasing - is more expensive long term, everyone knows that.  To go with the Creative Cloud for tax savings is what's known as being "A penny wise, and a pound foolish"

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post

 And two, counting upgrades, assuming you use more than two of their apps, you probably paid more than $50/month on average if you upgraded every time to keep current. If you use one or two adobe apps, then rent those individually for $20/month each.

 

 

 

Who keeps current with Adobe Apps?  They are so flipping buggy when they come out, full of features that are for the "prosumer" market - not Pros.  The last time I upgraded was June 2010, when I paid $676 for CS 5 Design Premium.  I'm not about to go to something that is paid off to $600/year for the same functionality just so I can save $20 a year in taxes.

post #89 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Coda. You'll never go back.

 

Indeed… Panic Software makes great apps.

 

http://www.panic.com

post #90 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

You can subscribe to Dreamweaver CC version for $19.99 a month

 

or buy Coda is $99 $75 up front.

 

So, with Coda, you pay once and come out ahead after 3.5 months.

 

Or, $240 a year, every year, for DW? After using it for 2 years ($480 and growing), I'd be feeling robbed. And if you don't want to pay MORE? No more toys for YOU!

 

At least I can still use the tools I paid for previously, even if I decide not to upgrade them right now...

post #91 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

You can subscribe to Dreamweaver CC version for $19.99 a month

 

or buy Coda is $99 $75 up front.

 

Quote:

 

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post


Thanks!

It looks like you can pay $20 a month for a single program.

Then again... for $50 a month you get EVERY program Adobe makes. It all depends on how much of Adobe's software you use (and make money with)

 

Thank you ALL for you Feedback, but on http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/buying-guide.html I did NOT see Dreamweaver as an Individual Option! Did I miss it?

 

Meanwhile, Squarespace this http://www.squarespace.com/pricing/ at $16/ prepaid for the Year, or $20 Monthly is beginning to look good!  

 

I just did about 1 hour Text Chat with them, and got a lot of useful info:

 

 

USING THE SQUARESPACE FOR IPAD APP
 
So I can be in bad or at a coffee shop with my iPad and Update my Site!!!! 
 
Will Adobe Offer Phone Support, or will it be Email or maybe Text Chats? 
 
Squarespace can Import and Export Wordpress! So, in Theory…, one could create a Site with Squarespace, Export it as Wordpress File, Host it on Godaddy, and do Edits Updates via FTP! But then I am not sure how much Less Expensive GoDaddy Hosting would be! 

My biggest Attraction to Dreamweaver was WYSIWYG and Templates, but Squarespace seems to do all that, and it's sites do look great on iOS too! Although I was told that NOT all their Template have Independent Font Sizes Adjustment for Mobile Sites like iOS, in case I want a Bigger Font on iPad, without changing Font Size for Macs!
 
Squarespace does NOT Install Local Mac App, but I can work on my Files, Text Only, Offline, and then either Sync or Copy and Paste them, to Update my Site with Squarespace, I don't know for sure…. I'll be Investigating all that! 
 
If Adobe doesn't INCLUDE Phone Support in that $20 or $50 Monthly, then Squarespace at $16 makes more sense, as far as I think, right now! But of course I am VERY ANGRY with Adobe right now!

As to Phone Support, every day I am reminded how spoiled I am with AppleCare!!! $345 for 3 Years!!!! That's Less than $1 Per Day for the 1st Year, and the remaining 2 Years are Free, All You Can Eat, UNLIMITED!!!
 
I'd be willing to pay that $345 for 3 Years to Google, Adobe, if I could talk to Humans, like I can with Apple! AppleCare is The Best Deal In Town!!! I wish Apple allowed to Re-Purchase it after 3 Years Expires! But I guess they would prefer me to buy a new Mac every 3 Years:)!

 

Go  Apple, AAPL!!!

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post #92 of 180

If you only use just one of Adobe's products there's a chance you can find an individual alternative. However, if you use the the big 4 - Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign and Dreamweaver as your main tools there is no serious alternative out there, and certainly no suite of software - it's practically a monopoly.

 

I expect to pay for software, it is one of the tools of my trade, but at least I had the choice to upgrade when I could afford it - with subscription I have no choice. This will be considerably more expensive for me. I'll be sticking with CS6 for as long as possible.

 

Until now Adobe needed to make improvements to each CS to encourage users to upgrade. Once we're all under subscription, and with little competition, there will be no real incentive for them to improve the products. I think we can expect to see their profits rocket.

post #93 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical View Post

I've been upgrading since, averaging about $600 every three years (I don't always upgrade "on schedule"). It's a lump sum I plan for, I save up for it, and pull the trigger when I'm ready… I decide when, and I decide how much I will spend. The subscription model puts an end to me determining my own pace / priority for software purchasing.

Thank you for this post. You said it a lot better than I did. I was weighing the possibility of purchasing CS6 or waiting for CS6.5 so now I know my options have changed.

post #94 of 180

There are quite a few posts with similar comments about professionals, agencies, freelancers etc. I too, like some others here would have preferred to keep an every other version refresh of CS but it never worked out because as soon as a new CS version was released we would get a file from a collaborating designer or customer that was in the new format. Then we would have to scramble to get upgraded and it wasn't always the most convenient time. Or we add a new workstation which caused incompatibility in-house. That is just what happens in a professional environment. Similarly in the agency model whether the freelancers are in house or at home it is much more practical to have everyone on the same version of the software. When we share our files we always send the IDML files as well but most designers aren't that courteous or perhaps they are just naive. Often they are in a drastically different time zone which can put a project behind a couple days just trying to get in touch with them.

 

Anyway we've been on the subscription since it started and it is great. It also comes with cloud storage and sharing features which some people don't need because they are working in a vacuum but in a professional environment the additional services have an added value. So yes, it is more expensive but the added value of synchronization of versioning and the cloud features are intended for professionals only.

 

It may not be an ideal situation for some solo designers but for the larger teams and for Adobe's application delivery process, it is a big improvement. You can surely understand why they want to move to this model and I'm sure piracy is also a big part of it.

 

Finally, for the last time, the new platform does NOT require always on high speed Internet. You install the app on your local machines and you only need to be connected once in awhile to revalidate your subscription. Otherwise it works the same as always but it can take advantage of the cloud services should you choose but they are completely optional.


Edited by mstone - 5/6/13 at 5:25pm

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post #95 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by macologist View Post

Thank you ALL for you Feedback, but on http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/buying-guide.html I did NOT see Dreamweaver as an Individual Option! Did I miss it?

It appears that you can get Dreamweaver for $20 a month.

https://creative.adobe.com/plans?plan=single

Quote:
Originally Posted by macologist View Post

Meanwhile, Squarespace this http://www.squarespace.com/pricing/ at $16/ prepaid for the Year, or $20 Monthly is beginning to look good!  

I just did about 1 hour Text Chat with them, and got a lot of useful info:

USING THE SQUARESPACE FOR IPAD APP
http://help.squarespace.com/customer/portal/articles/648190 
 
So I can be in bad or at a coffee shop with my iPad and Update my Site!!!! 
 
Will Adobe Offer Phone Support, or will it be Email or maybe Text Chats? 
 
Squarespace can Import and Export Wordpress! So, in Theory…, one could create a Site with Squarespace, Export it as Wordpress File, Host it on Godaddy, and do Edits Updates via FTP! But then I am not sure how much Less Expensive GoDaddy Hosting would be! 

My biggest Attraction to Dreamweaver was WYSIWYG and Templates, but Squarespace seems to do all that, and it's sites do look great on iOS too! Although I was told that NOT all their Template have Independent Font Sizes Adjustment for Mobile Sites like iOS, in case I want a Bigger Font on iPad, without changing Font Size for Macs!
 
Squarespace does NOT Install Local Mac App, but I can work on my Files, Text Only, Offline, and then either Sync or Copy and Paste them, to Update my Site with Squarespace, I don't know for sure…. I'll be Investigating all that! 
 
If Adobe doesn't INCLUDE Phone Support in that $20 or $50 Monthly, then Squarespace at $16 makes more sense, as far as I think, right now! But of course I am VERY ANGRY with Adobe right now!

As to Phone Support, every day I am reminded how spoiled I am with AppleCare!!! $345 for 3 Years!!!! That's Less than $1 Per Day for the 1st Year, and the remaining 2 Years are Free, All You Can Eat, UNLIMITED!!!
 
I'd be willing to pay that $345 for 3 Years to Google, Adobe, if I could talk to Humans, like I can with Apple! AppleCare is The Best Deal In Town!!! I wish Apple allowed to Re-Purchase it after 3 Years Expires! But I guess they would prefer me to buy a new Mac every 3 Years:)!

As for Squarespace... it's kinda silly to compare that to anything Adobe offers.

Squarespace is a wonderful web hosting and web design solution... while Adobe makes professional-grade software.

You're right... you cannot call Adobe for questions about your website... if that's what you're looking for...
post #96 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This move sucks for pirates but isn't such as a bad deal for professionals who pay for the software. Creative Suite is an industry-leading software package and is priced appropriately.

There's many ideological reasons why people hate renting software. However, if you check of the EULA of any software package, you'll realise that you don't own your existing software either.

 

That's hardly a rationale for, "if you're not willing to pay a monthly subscription, you will now lose all access to the software you need"…...

 

I paid for my license once. That worked for me. I pay for upgrades when I want to. No company should be able to dictate when and how much I will pay to CONTINUE using software that I bought a license for… 

post #97 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by macologist View Post

 

Will Adobe Offer Phone Support, or will it be Email or maybe Text Chats? 

 

don't get me started... WORST.  PHONE.  SUPPORT. EVER!!!!

 

Seriously, each call I made took at least an hour and was entirely unsatisfactory.  Each time, and I believe there were three, I had an Indian man who was reading from a script and didn't seem to understand my question.  It was extremely frustrating!!!

post #98 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical View Post

I paid for my license once. That worked for me. I pay for upgrades when I want to. No company should be able to dictate when and how much I will pay to CONTINUE using software that I bought a license for… 

That is the model that super high end software has been using for awhile. Creative Cloud is now on the same licensing model as other high end professional solutions. I think the difference is that many pro-sumer type users were also using some of their titles. Clearly they are changing that relationship by targeting high end professionals only. I can't imagine that they haven't considered the implications of such a move and apparently this is the direction they want to go. If you don't like it, you need to find other alternatives. For us it is a no brainer decision. We use Adobe CS->CC and we could not operate the business without it.

 

There is no competition in the market but that is not Adobe's fault and all the pros have standardized on CS so what are you going to do? Pass the additional cost on to your customers.

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post #99 of 180

Quite the assumption, said the guy who's paid to upgrade to nearly every major jump since CS 1.

Yes, I know you only have to re-up by logging in once a month. As someone who spent the aftermath of Sandy scrambling from generator to generator trying to complete the projects at hand, even though I had no internet access, how exactly would I have done that if my Creative Cloud subscription had to be re-blessed during that time period? The "you're paying that much now" argument also doesn't wash, because I'm paying that much now for a perpetual license, not until the 30th of the month. This way of doing business is what Warnock, Jobs, Gates, Kapor, Borland, et al., rebelled against in the late '70s.

post #100 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

You can surely understand why they want to move to this model and I'm sure piracy is also a big part of it.

 

 

 

I can see that it works for you and that's great. But it would work the same for you if subscription were an option. But it's not. It's now a requirement. And it is that that has people enraged. There is now no choice. Design Suite for hobbyists, casuals is now over.

 

Also I am sceptical how many pirates there were in the professional environment. So how will this move put more money into Adobe's hands? Piracy wasn't taking money from Adobe before, it was simply not giving them money they were entitled to. So stopping piracy may put no more dollars than before into Adobe's coffers. It just forces the pirates to steal something else.

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post #101 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical View Post

With a subscription-based model like this, if things got tight for even one month, and you couldn't maintain the subscription, you'd lose the ability to earn!

Wouldn't you also lose the ability to eat, pay your rent, pay for internet etc? I don't see how knowing you will pay $50/month is worse than coming across a situation where Adobe issues an update and you require the update and unexpectedly have a $600 or higher expense in one month. Would it really be that difficult to keep aside $200 to cover you for 4 months?

Also:

"Users will be expected to connect to the web every 30 days to validate their software licenses, but Adobe says products will work offline for 180 days."

http://www.studiodaily.com/2013/05/adobe-doubles-down-on-creative-cloud-adopts-subscription-only-software-model/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 
Thing is, are those projections taking into account the fact that they aren't selling software at all anymore? Did they cut out their revenue stream from software actually being sold?

Those projections likely weren't but the following are:

http://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/2013/05/06/adobe-systems-to-break-out-box-by-focusing-on-web-software/

"The company expects to have four million subscribers on Adobe Creative Cloud by the end of fiscal 2015.

In the first quarter, licensed and packaged software made up 67% of Adobe’s total revenue with $675.8 million in sales. That ratio fell from 77% of total revenue in the year-ago period. Meanwhile, subscription revenue from Creative Cloud and the company’s digital marketing service was $224.3 million, or 22% of revenue, up from 14%."

You can see revenue breakdowns on their end of year accounts:

http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/invrelations/pdfs/FY11_10-K_FINAL_Certified.pdf
http://wwwimages.adobe.com/www.adobe.com/content/dam/Adobe/en/investor-relations/PDFs/ADBE_10K_FY12_FINAL_CERTIFIED.pdf

They have some enterprise and print/publishing services. They actually make quite a lot of money - about $4.5b per year. They are obviously fairly confident they can maintain this with the new model.

"This is obviously a bit of a risky step for Adobe, something Morris acknowledged in our discussion. Most users, he noted, probably expected Adobe to make an announcement like this in the coming years – the fact that it’s coming today, however, will likely be a bit of a shock. What makes him and the rest of the Adobe team believe that this will work, he told me, is that virtually everybody who has subscribed to Creative Cloud loves it. It even gets a higher rating in Adobe’s online store than Photoshop, “which is virtually unheard of,” as Morris told me."

It will come with some changes like Fireworks is EOL now:

http://thenextweb.com/dd/2013/05/06/yes-adobe-is-killing-fireworks-only-plans-security-updates-and-bug-fixes/?fromcat=all
http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/05/06/after-nearly-10-years-adobe-abandons-its-creative-suite-entirely-to-focus-on-creative-cloud/

I think people will adapt to it ok.
post #102 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eluard View Post

Also I am sceptical how many pirates there were in the professional environment. So how will this move put more money into Adobe's hands? Piracy wasn't taking money from Adobe before, it was simply not giving them money they were entitled to. So stopping piracy may put no more dollars than before into Adobe's coffers. It just forces the pirates to steal something else.

Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.

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post #103 of 180

I completely agree with what seems to be the general sentiment in here: Not interested in renting the apps for $600 a year. I will hold onto CS6 until another company comes along or Adobe makes their "We're not dumb and we are not smart" announcement a la Coka-Cola and reverse their decision. I am betting on the former.

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post #104 of 180

I challenge all these so called CS 6 owners to post an appropriately redacted receipt for their software because I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners. Surely they should own software appropriate for redacting.

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post #105 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.

 

Ok but "speculated" means just that. Not known at all.

 

Surely if they continue to sell CS 6 then pirated versions of CS6 will continue to be made? So piracy will continue on the bought software — if it is there now.

 

I don't doubt that there was a lot of CS piracy — students seem to expect to get these things for free, that is a generational thing. But shutting out paying casual users to kill off pirates is like shooting yourself in both feet so that no one can borrow your shoes.

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post #106 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.

 

I call bullshit on this. Regardless, you already need to register online with the CS6 and earlier, so I'm not sure what it is about CC that is going to prevent Piracy.  

post #107 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eluard View Post

Ok but "speculated" means just that. Not known at all.

 

Surely if they continue to sell CS 6 then pirated versions of CS6 will continue to be made? So piracy will continue on the bought software — if it is there now.

 

I don't doubt that there was a lot of CS piracy — students seem to expect to get these things for free, that is a generational thing. But shutting out paying casual users to kill off pirates is like shooting yourself in both feet so that no one can borrow your shoes.

This is just what I read in the Internet. If you believe for one second that this is some sophomoric decision made off the cuff without serious research then you are another aluminum hat candidate. They have a firm conviction that this is the way forward. If you don't like it then you don't share their vision. It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents. They have a lot of smart people working there. You apparently just don't like their philosophy. It only affects me positively so I don't really share your concerns.

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post #108 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This move sucks for pirates but isn't such as a bad deal for professionals who pay for the software. Creative Suite is an industry-leading software package and is priced appropriately.
 

 

"Industry Leading" is a bit of a stretch.  They've got a monopoly, as any competitor would have formidable compatibility hurdles.  It's not priced appropriately, since Google and iOS have turned software into a commodity.  This is why they are bolting for subscription, they are panicking.

post #109 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.

 

I call bullshit on this. Regardless, you already need to register online with the CS6 and earlier, so I'm not sure what it is about CC that is going to prevent Piracy.  

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post #110 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents.

 

I'm guessing you weren't' around for that whole "Get Flash on the iPhone" episode, where you?  Creative isn't even their core focus anymore - it's social media analytics.

post #111 of 180

You can only go CC with one app at $20/month. So if you only use Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, DW, etc., you aren't TOTALLY locked in to the $40-$50/month pricetag.

 

I may give the entire CC deal a try at $30/month for 1 year. I can go back to my CS6 app for awhile anyway if it's not positive.

 

I get that Adobe wants to increase their revenue stream, but this can bring a full scale revolt. What's the alterative...Quark (ARRGGHH), GIMP.

 

As for those asking about Squarespace instead of DW.... I've used it. It's pretty decent. Interface can be kind of buggy at times, but you can (if you start a separate free developer account along with your site account) edit the CSS a great deal.

 

It's a decent CMS, plus you can have your clients edit their blogs via a iPhone/iPad app from Squarespace. Plus the annual cost isn't that bad. Now that they also offer reasonable e-commerce solutions, they look pretty inviting compared to some of the other CMS platforms out there.

post #112 of 180
This appears to be an admission Abode has reached a plateau, where significant feature upgrades will no longer exist or be scarce. The solution: Make the user pay any way possible.
post #113 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

This is just what I read in the Internet. If you believe for one second that this is some sophomoric decision made off the cuff without serious research then you are another aluminum hat candidate. They have a firm conviction that this is the way forward. If you don't like it then you don't share their vision. It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents. They have a lot of smart people working there. You apparently just don't like their philosophy. It only affects me positively so I don't really share your concerns.

 

Well, time will tell. My money is on this not working out well for them. In two years I predict there will be a PS killer, that Quark will make a resurgence and a new drawing app will emerge. And it's not that I "just don't like their philosophy" I think they are positively harming a huge number of their loyal customers. I would feel the same way if Apple started a subscription model for OS X. (Heaven forbid!)

 

And there are two silly attitudes to businesses, both equally childish. One is that all businesses are bad and corrupt and out to do us no good. I don't hold that view. But the other is that businesses are run by clever people who can be trusted to make the best decisions for all concerned — and we shouldn't worry our pretty-little heads when we seem to be asked to pay much much more for something because — well, because there are a lot of smart people there. That way lies Fascism, and other bad -isms.

 

But there are now a huge number of people who will be on the lookout for alternatives — and what the market asks for the market will surely get. Goodbye Adobe. Not all your customers were pirates, you'll regret treating them like they were.

AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

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AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

I've used macs since 1985 when I typed up my first research paper. Never used anything else never wanted to.
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post #114 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

BA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!


Subscription ONLY?! Enjoy that, Adobe.

I haven't looked over their numbers. If they make more from firms than individuals, it won't work out the way you think. Much of the hand wringing comes from individual users with licensing changes. Businesses tend to be very conservative. They may stick with their current versions for an extended period of time until some functionality breaks, but I don't think they will ditch Adobe. Who would be the alternative? My biggest concern is bugs. In the past you could vote with your wallet and skip over versions that retained excessive bugs long into their cycles. That isn't really an option today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Why not wait a year or two until Adobe's a month from bankruptcy due to this travesty, buy them, and make their software into something with a usable interface and OS X priority?

Wait, what am I saying… OS X exclusive.

You regularly chastise others for spreading garbage. Why would you do this yourself? Provide some level of reasoning here. As for OSX exclusive, that purchase would be blocked unless they slipped out of relevance. Right now they remain crucial to too many industries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post

 

You wouldn't make much of an accountant.  Leasing - is more expensive long term, everyone knows that.  To go with the Creative Cloud for tax savings is what's known as being "A penny wise, and a pound foolish"

 

 

 

 

Who keeps current with Adobe Apps?  They are so flipping buggy when they come out, full of features that are for the "prosumer" market - not Pros.  The last time I upgraded was June 2010, when I paid $676 for CS 5 Design Premium.  I'm not about to go to something that is paid off to $600/year for the same functionality just so I can save $20 a year in taxes.

That was an upgrade price in 2010 right? The initial license would have cost much more unless you went the student route. In terms of accounting, as I point out below, it does allow more flexibility in number of licensed seats. Businesses are not tied to keeping that license up to date to ensure they're not hit with the full license cost again. It's not 100% one way or the other. Regarding expenses, it is easier to write them down quarter by quarter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by digitaldean View Post

You can only go CC with one app at $20/month. So if you only use Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, DW, etc., you aren't TOTALLY locked in to the $40-$50/month pricetag.

 

I may give the entire CC deal a try at $30/month for 1 year. I can go back to my CS6 app for awhile anyway if it's not positive.

 

I get that Adobe wants to increase their revenue stream, but this can bring a full scale revolt. What's the alterative...Quark (ARRGGHH), GIMP.

 

As for those asking about Squarespace instead of DW.... I've used it. It's pretty decent. Interface can be kind of buggy at times, but you can (if you start a separate free developer account along with your site account) edit the CSS a great deal.

 

It's a decent CMS, plus you can have your clients edit their blogs via a iPhone/iPad app from Squarespace. Plus the annual cost isn't that bad. Now that they also offer reasonable e-commerce solutions, they look pretty inviting compared to some of the other CMS platforms out there.


Interestingly GIMP actually has better support for formats that store in floating point rather than fixed integer values than photoshop. Photoshop doesn't support 16 bit half float. It opens as 32 and saves at the expanded size. There are a lot of things that could be improved with raw workflow and LUTs. Just look at what Black Magic has done with Resolve. Anyway it does lessen barriers to entry if a company needs to adjust the number of seats.

post #115 of 180
Originally Posted by mstone View Post
…I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners.

 

Guess Adobe won't be making much money on their new service since "you don't believe" there are many users. lol.gif

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #116 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Originally Posted by mstone View Post
…I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners.

 

Guess Adobe won't be making much money on their new service since "you don't believe" there are many users. lol.gif

Based on your past record you have proven yourself to be so completely off in market in predictions we can probably set a standard solely on the opposite of whatever you forecast.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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post #117 of 180
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I challenge all these so called CS 6 owners to post an appropriately redacted receipt for their software because I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners. Surely they should own software appropriate for redacting.

Not that I need to prove anything to you, but...

 

 

 

I updated my Illustrator and Dreamweaver to CS6 on the same day, but these are shown on separate receipts because Adobe's online store wouldn't accept my order and I had to place the order by phone and the account representative didn't know how to put all three products on the same order. I had to dictate all my contact and payment information three separate times, and the whole process took about two hours, including being transferred to several different departments. I look forward to more of this kind of innovation from Adobe in the future. irked.gif

 

Anyway, upgrading these three products for $200 each approximately every two years was costing me $300/year with the option to skip an upgrade if I didn't feel I needed it. Now it will cost $600/year with no such option.

post #118 of 180
Originally Posted by mstone View Post
Based on your past record you have proven yourself to be so completely off in market in predictions we can probably set a standard solely on the opposite of whatever you forecast.


I'm just repeating what you're forecasting.

 

So yeah, I buy that you're wrong; sure.


Originally Posted by arlomedia View Post
Not that I need to prove anything to you, but...

 

Shouldn't have given him the satisfaction.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #119 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


Wouldn't you also lose the ability to eat, pay your rent, pay for internet etc? I don't see how knowing you will pay $50/month is worse than coming across a situation where Adobe issues an update and you require the update and unexpectedly have a $600 or higher expense in one month. Would it really be that difficult to keep aside $200 to cover you for 4 months?
 

 

This sort of boils down the essence of what I see as the colossally insensitive nature of a lot of reactions here. It assumes that everyone has a steady income and that if you are not earning money hand-over-fist as a "professional user" — and, God, is that piece of self-congratulation getting old — then you have no right to even think about using this software. If people have a low, but steady income they might be struggling with their monthly bills. This constitutes a new monthly bill to add to what they pay already. And for what? To use software that they have used just fine in the past — software they paid for.

 

People: give some thought to how you are coming across. This "if you can't afford it then tough for you" attitude is pretty much what marks someone out a douchebag in my books — and I doubt I'm alone.

AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

I've used macs since 1985 when I typed up my first research paper. Never used anything else never wanted to.
Reply
AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

I've used macs since 1985 when I typed up my first research paper. Never used anything else never wanted to.
Reply
post #120 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by arlomedia View Post

I updated my Illustrator and Dreamweaver to CS6 on the same day, but these are shown on separate receipts because Adobe's online store wouldn't accept my order and I had to place the order by phone and the account representative didn't know how to put all three products on the same order. I had to dictate all my contact and payment information three separate times, and the whole process took about two hours, including being transferred to several different departments. I look forward to more of this kind of innovation from Adobe in the future. irked.gif

 

Anyway, upgrading these three products for $200 each approximately every two years was costing me $300/year with the option to skip an upgrade if I didn't feel I needed it. Now it will cost $600/year with no such option.

Sounds like there were some unusual circumstances involved. I'm glad it got worked out for you. Fortunately, I have never needed to contact Adobe sales or customer support anytime in the last 20 something years that I have been a customer.

 

I just checked and I purchased Illustrator 1a in 1986. It came with a VHS instructional tape.


Edited by mstone - 5/6/13 at 9:00pm

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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