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New York authorities ask Apple, Google to help stop smartphone thefts - Page 2

post #41 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Even if a Wifi only iPad were to be stolen, the "Find iPhone" app could be used, because the thief will eventually connect to a Wifi network. And even though the Wifi only iPad lacks GPS, Wifi localization seems to be pretty accurate, because when I tested it, it located the exact location of the iPad, down to the exact building that it was in.

That was something I was wondering because when I temporarily lost my iPhone it was not connected to the WiFi because I had just returned from a trip where I had turned WiFi off to prevent it from connecting to my mobile hotspot.

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post #42 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post


Even Snake Plissken on standby?

My family lived in New York for three years. The first night we arrived, we got mugged.

It was awesome!

We could have used Snake then but, in his defence, we'd heard that he was dead.

I miss The City That Never Sleeps.

 

How long ago was that? New York has changed a lot and places like Times Square have been cleaned up and sanitized. A bit too much, in my opinion.

post #43 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

1) Make the crime more severe, akin to grand theft auto. Have variations of the theft classified, like stealing a car if the keys are left in it on a street at night is less severe than snatching a phone out of someone's hand on a subway. Make the later crime more inline with a physical assault to retrieve the device. If a bag or pocket has to be accessed in any way to grab the phone (as opposed to someone simply left it on a table or chair) make that more inline with breaking and entering, which includes the bag in question being stolen.

2) I've said this many times but I'll say it again, Apple should make any hard power cycle force a restart (not simply turning off the device) and require a PIN to do a soft shutdown. This wouldn't prevent someone who planned ahead from using a container of some sort that can block radio waves but it may prevent and catch the more opportunistic crimes. Also, add a PIN code option to Settings since a phone that is obtained within x-duration can was have the perp go into Setting to enable Airplane Mode.

3) Why doesn't Android have a similar feature to Find My iPhone? Why is it still called Find My iPhone?

Forcibly stealing from someone is in a higher crime classification, but the courts are busy with more severe crimes than a iDevice getting taken from someone especially if they were unharmed.
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post #44 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

How long ago was that? New York has changed a lot and places like Times Square have been cleaned up and sanitized. A bit too much, in my opinion.

And many of the bad neighborhoods are now overrun with hipsters, especially in Brooklyn.
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #45 of 85
The ability to resell stolen phones at a profit is a risk to all of us. Here in the bay area the new strategy is the blitz mugging. That is you punch the target out and the ask them to hand over the phone. A good friend of mine has been a victim of two such attacks. The problem is partly a responsibility of the carriers. They apparently have some ability to block a phone from its network that has been stolen. Apparently the carriers in Australia block such access which resulted in a substantial reduction in phone thefts. http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/nevius/article/An-easy-way-to-curb-smart-phone-thieves-2344797.php

Undermining this to some degree is the fact that a good number of phones stolen here are shipped outside the country, however at the margin it should have a positive impact.
post #46 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


And many of the bad neighborhoods are now overrun with hipsters, especially in Brooklyn.

I haven't been to Brooklyn in a bit, but yeah, I hear that there are a lot of hipsters there.

post #47 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

How long ago was that? New York has changed a lot and places like Times Square have been cleaned up and sanitized. A bit too much, in my opinion.

It was a long time ago, and I'm sure it has changed.

However, we still loved it exactly as it was.

A superb city.
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post #48 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Before the iPhone there was nothing. Nothing.

 

False.  Worrying about stolen phones has been a concern for a long time, especially since the earliest smartphones were mostly used by business people.

 

Before the iPhone, there were various ways of tracking and disabling phones.

 

  • There were location tracking programs for smartphones ( WinMo phones for sure had them).
  • CDMA carriers like Verizon/Sprint disabled stolen phones.
  • Remote wiping of stolen phones was available on WinMo phones via MS Exchange, and I'm pretty sure on Blackberrys as well.
post #49 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

 

99% of thieves are smart enough to turn the phone off as soon as they steal it. Then all they need to do is perform a reset and they've got a fresh iPhone for sale. 

 

Has Apple made strides towards hindering thieves? Yes. Could they do more? Yes.

 

Apple might want to consider a system where it's impossible to turn a phone off without entering a passcode (difficult as the power switch interacts with the software at a very low level but probably not beyond Apple) or forcing the user to enter a passcode when they flash/wipe a device in iTunes. These are two ideas just off the top of my head; I'm sure there's even better ways to stop thieves.

 

Most police forces could do more too though.

Thet really should require a password to turn the phone off. No one turns their phone off, and anyone with an iPhone in a city should be used to entering their passcode mulitple times a day anyway.  I've made the request here http://www.apple.com/feedback/ and I hope will make the request as well. A simple toggle to require passcode to turn off the phone would go along way in retrieving stolen phones and have thieves thinking twice about stealing them (until they can figure out a hack around it).

post #50 of 85
It seems reasonable to build better security into the iPhone if possible. Anything that makes an iPhone less easy to steal has to be good for the life of the iPhone owner. I would like to see the phone mated to the new charger as an extra line of security and maybe give the phones chip and and motherboard some sort of digital/physical signature that is random but unique.
post #51 of 85
Why am I not surprised there are the usual assortment of people objecting to the Mayors reasonable request? These companies could easily implement a cutoff policy to help the police and people who have had their phones stolen.
post #52 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

And many of the bad neighborhoods are now overrun with hipsters, especially in Brooklyn.

What's a hipster? I did a search but it seems like there is no clear definition. Is it sort of like a modern day hippie?

 

Mostly it mentions that they're an alternative subculture of early adopters and free thinkers which doesn't sound all that bad compared to what normally comes to mind when one speaks of bad neighborhoods.

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post #53 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barley View Post

It seems reasonable to build better security into the iPhone if possible. Anything that makes an iPhone less easy to steal has to be good for the life of the iPhone owner. I would like to see the phone mated to the new charger as an extra line of security and maybe give the phones chip and and motherboard some sort of digital/physical signature that is random but unique.

Like a chipped car key?
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post #54 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

 

99% of thieves are smart enough to turn the phone off as soon as they steal it. Then all they need to do is perform a reset and they've got a fresh iPhone for sale. 

 

Has Apple made strides towards hindering thieves? Yes. Could they do more? Yes.

 

Apple might want to consider a system where it's impossible to turn a phone off without entering a passcode (difficult as the power switch interacts with the software at a very low level but probably not beyond Apple) or forcing the user to enter a passcode when they flash/wipe a device in iTunes. These are two ideas just off the top of my head; I'm sure there's even better ways to stop thieves.

 

Most police forces could do more too though.

And if a "real" owner forgets the pass codes?  Then what?  They somehow magically get them?  They get them from Apple?  They have to register them with Apple?

 

The only certain way to prevent theft of this type is to not buy or use the product.   That's 100% prevention of stealing it.  Once you buy and use, there is always a way for someone that what's the item to steal it.

post #55 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

What's a hipster? I did a search but it seems like there is no clear definition. Is it sort of like a modern day hippie?

Mostly it mentions that they're an alternative subculture of early adopters and free thinkers which doesn't sound all that bad compared to what normally comes to mind when one speaks of bad neighborhoods.

Modern day hippie is close enough. Even the baddest of neighborhoods have good hard working people, and many have gotten priced out of their homes because the hipsters are able to pay higher rents. Williamsburg used to be a shit hole (just watch where Eddie Murphy moves into in Coming to America) and now the rents there are comparable to Manhattan.
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post #56 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

I've only owned Wifi iPads, and though I've luckily never had a reason to use the "Find iPhone" app, it did work on the few occasions when I tested it.

Even if a Wifi only iPad were to be stolen, the "Find iPhone" app could be used, because the thief will eventually connect to a Wifi network. And even though the Wifi only iPad lacks GPS, Wifi localization seems to be pretty accurate, because when I tested it, it located the exact location of the iPad, down to the exact building that it was in.

Where I live, the cops won't do anything for wifi only because of the margin of "accuracy". I'd like to imagine a world where the thief would be smart enough to wipe it instantly. Alas, our entropic public education system...
post #57 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Williamsburg used to be a shit hole (just watch where Eddie Murphy moves into in Coming to America) and now the rents there are comparable to Manhattan.

I thought that was Queens. I distinctly remember them going to Queens to find King Jaffe's queen.

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post #58 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I thought that was Queens. I distinctly remember them going to Queens to find King Jaffe's queen.

Then script had it in Queens. It was filmed all over NYC. I think the McDowell's was in Queens. I could really go for a Big Mc. No seeds.

Edit: http://www.movielocationsguide.com/Coming_to_America/filming_locations citation
post #59 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I thought that was Queens. I distinctly remember them going to Queens to find King Jaffe's queen.

No where they lived was Brooklyn but the Queens border isn't far and the McDowell's was actually a Wendy's on Queens Blvd. The inaccuracies in NYC movies is hilarious to me, they rarely get it right. The train chase scene in The Taking of Pelham 123 being one of the worst.
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post #60 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

No where they lived was Brooklyn but the Queens border isn't far and the McDowell's was actually a Wendy's on Queens Blvd. The inaccuracies in NYC movies is hilarious to me, they rarely get it right. The train chase scene in The Taking of Pelham 123 being one of the worst.

I'd like to visit that barber shop and catch the next gig of Sexual Chocolate.
post #61 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

Then script had it in Queens. It was filmed all over NYC. I think the McDowell's was in Queens. I could really go for a Big Mc. No seeds.

Edit: http://www.movielocationsguide.com/Coming_to_America/filming_locations citation

Cool link thanks. I actually saw Demi Moore (looks like a average MILF now) and Dakota Fanning (radiantly beautiful) filming in Brooklyn last summer and the Chicago whorehouse in Boardwalk Empire is really in Brooklyn.
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post #62 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

No where they lived was Brooklyn but the Queens border isn't far and the McDowell's was actually a Wendy's on Queens Blvd. The inaccuracies in NYC movies is hilarious to me, they rarely get it right. The train chase scene in The Taking of Pelham 123 being one of the worst.

I don't think it's their intention to be wrong. The amount of planning for locations can get obscene. Sometimes they pay for the expense, like the scenes with Tom Cruise in Vanilla Sky (2001), but usually the cost seems like an attempt for viral publicity when they go all out. I spent enough time in the Hollywood area of LA that I notice locations that are out of whack on TV shows from time to time. I seem to recall in Terminator (1984) that Schwarzenegger appears in one area and in the next seen is at the Griffith Observatory where he fights punks with a switchblade, which I assume is homage to Rebel Without a Cause (1955).


Edited by SolipsismX - 5/13/13 at 5:25pm

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post #63 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

I'd like to visit that barber shop and catch the next gig of Sexual Chocolate.

That boy is good! Lol
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post #64 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling View Post

False.  Worrying about stolen phones has been a concern for a long time, especially since the earliest smartphones were mostly used by business people.

 

*

 

These were considerably more challenging to steal though, yes?

 

1wink.gif

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post #65 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I don't think it's their intention to be wrong. The amount of planning for locations can get obscene. Sometimes they pay for the expense, like the scenes with Tom Cruise in Vanilla Sky (2001), but usually the cost seems like an attempt for viral publicity when they go all out. I spent enough time in the Hollywood area of LA that I notice locations that are out of whack on TV shows from time to time. I seem to recall in Terminator (1984) that Schwarzenegger appears in one area and in the next seen is at the Griffith Observatory where he fights punks with a switchblade, which I assume is homage to Rebel Without a Cause (1955).

No I understand, the scene called for police cars to chase the train almost to Coney Island but the problem with that is the train runs very little on a elevated track. So they had to find a longer stretch of el to film.
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post #66 of 85
You can disable cars with a system called LoJack, but it is not a required part of a car. If it was it would cut down on thefts and ease the work of law enforcement. However, car companies dealers wouldn;t lie it. For every unrecovered stolen vehcle, there is another vehicle sales. Likely the reason the cell phone operators wee slow. Lost ohone may mean another sale and an eearly termination fee.
post #67 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by pridon View Post

You can disable cars with a system called LoJack, but it is not a required part of a car. If it was it would cut down on thefts and ease the work of law enforcement. However, car companies dealers wouldn;t lie it. For every unrecovered stolen vehcle, there is another vehicle sales. Likely the reason the cell phone operators wee slow. Lost ohone may mean another sale and an eearly termination fee.

Or less Machiavellian, distributing the cost of such a 'feature' as standard impacts most of the consumers that aren't at much risk at all isn't good business. Perhaps those at risk purchase a private property insurance policy that covers smartphone loss.
post #68 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

 

Well I've long since stopped caring who is who or wasting my time tracking them.  I guess you are implying that you think DaHarder and TECKSTUD are the same person? Or that you are the same person?  It doesn't really matter either way.  

 

The list is the list.  If someone acts like a complete asshole (IMO of course), or is someone who isn't interested in a civilised argument or debate, they go on the list.  I don't clean off the list or try to figure out if there are doubles.  The list is actually too long to fit in my sig, so there are more people in it than are visible.  

 

The only reason I put it in my sig is that the previous anti-religion message got me a lot of flak and there was a short period where so many meanies joined the forum ("Flaneur" etc.), that I was updating it every day.  I've no doubt that most of them are not even here anymore since trolls generally don't last.  

 

Interestingly, there is no one on my list that hasn't at some point or other revealed themselves to be male.   1smile.gif

 

I certainly am neither "TEK" nor "Da"... I tangled with them in the past and always wondered if they were the same person.

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post #69 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


Did you write that in the 70s? NYC is one of the safest cities in the US.

 

Depends on exactly which crimes one is referencing I suppose, but if you pore over this data...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cities_by_crime_rate

 

...you'll see that NY crimes are generally lower compared to other major cities with more than 250,000 people, but the murder rate is no better than Fort Worth, Texas, and in terms of violent crime overall New York ranks 40th.

 

Another stat to consider is that populations are shrinking as Boomers die off and there are fewer Gen-X and Y to replace them. This also has an effect on crime since there are simply fewer people around who actually commit "crimes".

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrinking_cities_in_the_USA

 

Look at the right-hand chart of "Historical Population of the United States" and look at the clear trend lines. Population growth and the so-called "replacement rate" has fallen precipitously in the past 3 years. Fewer people, fewer crimes.

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post #70 of 85

As soon as I work out the battery drain problem my iTaser app is going to make me millions.

post #71 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Modern day hippie is close enough. 

Is hipster a derogatory term or do they embrace it as a culture?

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post #72 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Gun regulations that have harmed the legal protection of property and persons by the citizens of New York have allowed the criminal underclass to grow as fast as the NY rat and cockroach population.
Are you serious?
I mean: do you REALY believe what you wrote?
What about the rest of the word? Why they don't have as many criminals and guns?
Why can they live in a peaceful society, without blowing out each others brain in the name of protecting of property?
Again: are you serious?
post #73 of 85

Maybe they could secretly send thousands of iPhones to the black market and then track how many crimes they are used to commit. They can call it 4G and Furious, or iPhone and Furious. 

 

I'm surprised that he didn't suggest that Apple just lower the price causing a corresponding drop in resale value as the answer. Then again, I suppose if you are a crack head and you only need $20 for your next hit you don't care if the item you are stealing was $600 or $200 so long as you get your $20. And if the resale value drops then you need to steal twice as many to support your habit. 

 

If you legalized certain things that are currently illegal the the street gangs would not profit unfairly off the insanely high prices of the product, but instead the elected gangs could profit off the insanely high taxation of those same products. 

post #74 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Is hipster a derogatory term or do they embrace it as a culture?

Smelly, unbathed, and unkempt would be derogatory lol.gif
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post #75 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Depends on exactly which crimes one is referencing I suppose, but if you pore over this data...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cities_by_crime_rate

...you'll see that NY crimes are generally lower compared to other major cities with more than 250,000 people, but the murder rate is no better than Fort Worth, Texas, and in terms of violent crime overall New York ranks 40th.

Another stat to consider is that populations are shrinking as Boomers die off and there are fewer Gen-X and Y to replace them. This also has an effect on crime since there are simply fewer people around who actually commit "crimes".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrinking_cities_in_the_USA

Look at the right-hand chart of "Historical Population of the United States" and look at the clear trend lines. Population growth and the so-called "replacement rate" has fallen precipitously in the past 3 years. Fewer people, fewer crimes.

It's pretty good when the murder rate of a city with 8+ million is comparable to a city the fraction of it's size, and the population of NYC hasn't dropped since the 70s.
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post #76 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman, it's called "Find My iPhone"... Ever heard of it?

 

As others have said, it doesn't always work. A friend of mine arrived home to discover he'd misplaced his iPhone while he was out. He immediately tried Find and just got a "Can't be found" message. Whoever found it had either shut it off or immediately wiped it. He said he wasn't out long enough for the battery to have died, so it seems his was found by someone who knew how to hide it.

 

He kept trying every hour or so for the first day then every few hours the next and never found it.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by skleiniv View Post

My friend was brutally attacked when she tried to hang onto to her iPhone.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Maybe the brazen beating wouldn't have happened had she not resisted.

 

Maybe, but sometimes it doesn't matter. Another friend of mine was just walking down the street when some nut case walked up and smashed him in the side of the head. When he came to he still had his wallet but his iPhone was gone. I'm pretty sure he would have been willing to surrender the phone to prevent the concussion, but he didn't get to choose.


Edited by v5v - 5/14/13 at 11:05am
post #77 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Bonner View Post

I do like that he asked.

really? how about common fucking sense?

post #78 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Gun regulations that have harmed the legal protection of property and persons by the citizens of New York have allowed the criminal underclass to grow as fast as the NY rat and cockroach population.

Total b.s. Serious crime in NYC is at its lowest level in 40 years. Thefts are up, but it's mostly phones and pads.
post #79 of 85
Originally Posted by mac_dog View Post
really? how about common fucking sense?

 

1. Why is it common sense that a company should do the job of a city?

2. Why should a company do the job of a city?

3. What makes you think they haven't "helped" already?

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post #80 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigelian View Post

The ability to resell stolen phones at a profit is a risk to all of us. Here in the bay area the new strategy is the blitz mugging. That is you punch the target out and the ask them to hand over the phone. A good friend of mine has been a victim of two such attacks. The problem is partly a responsibility of the carriers. They apparently have some ability to block a phone from its network that has been stolen. Apparently the carriers in Australia block such access which resulted in a substantial reduction in phone thefts. http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/nevius/article/An-easy-way-to-curb-smart-phone-thieves-2344797.php

Undermining this to some degree is the fact that a good number of phones stolen here are shipped outside the country, however at the margin it should have a positive impact.

 

"Blitz mugging"? I think an openly armed populace would quickly counter that threat.

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