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post #81 of 87
The question I have for you all is what is wrong with a different 'style' CEO? Who the hell says a CEO can only be a brash assertive person? And NOW everyone admires SJ as a visionary? He was lambasted daily while he was alive as a cocky fool by the media. 'Reality distortion field' etc.

Jobs was a visionary the whole time regardless of what was reported about him.

Cook is different from Jobs, why can't he just do his thing without all this fuss? He's actually been running things for years. Nope, this is partially Wall Street morons and partially something in development and he dares not reveal it.

I think that Cook has certain things planned. Remember his 'we are stepping on the gas' quote from when they renewed their entire product line in time for the holidays? It seemed almost like they were clearing the decks for something really big coming. However, there were manufacturing issues, not the least of which was finding alternates to Samsung. There were the precision bevels that were hard to do, screens, etc. I do wonder what is in the pipeline and when they can show us.

Anyways, Cook may be a lot better CEO for Apple than some of you might think, precisely because his style is different. He just can't talk about any of it for good reason.
What is really factored into the price is a kind of perpetual sense of disbelief that any company could be as good as Apple is. ~Retrogusto
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What is really factored into the price is a kind of perpetual sense of disbelief that any company could be as good as Apple is. ~Retrogusto
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post #82 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plagen View Post

No teenager (that I know of) would pay $120 a year for the service.

Then your defiantly not a parent of one, 10 songs on iTunes a month or unlimited bands to listen to. We moved our daughter over to GrooveShark a long time ago and ended the 100+ dollars she was spending on iTunes a month. Trust me, any parent with a teenager in the house loves streaming music over pay by song.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #83 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


Now that Scott Forstall... that's another subject. You may want to check out his career path, watch some of his captivating presentations, and maybe read about his being a "difficult self-absorbed SOB" sometimes to deal with. You're staring at a young SJ in the making... and there are enough "geniuses" sprinkled throughout history with these vary same traits.

Enough of an explanation for ya? 1smoking.gif
So because was/is a jerk like Steve could be and to some was a good speaker on stage he's the next Steve Jobs or will come back to Apple to save the day like Steve did? What exactly is his vision? Has he ever given an interview or spoken outside of a keynote where we can get a feel for what his vision for Apple would be?
post #84 of 87
@ThePixelDoc and palomine, great to see others who "get" Tim Cook and what he's about.

I had a nice long reply I was working on, but my ancient, beat-up and overloaded iPad one crashed after four or five weighty paragraphs, and I lost the whole thing. I guess I'll have to blame Apple and its so-called supply-chain genius. /s

More later.
Edited by Flaneur - 5/18/13 at 12:33am
post #85 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by palomine View Post

The question I have for you all is what is wrong with a different 'style' CEO? Who the hell says a CEO can only be a brash assertive person? And NOW everyone admires SJ as a visionary? He was lambasted daily while he was alive as a cocky fool by the media. 'Reality distortion field' etc.

Jobs was a visionary the whole time regardless of what was reported about him.

Cook is different from Jobs, why can't he just do his thing without all this fuss? He's actually been running things for years. Nope, this is partially Wall Street morons and partially something in development and he dares not reveal it.

I think that Cook has certain things planned. Remember his 'we are stepping on the gas' quote from when they renewed their entire product line in time for the holidays? It seemed almost like they were clearing the decks for something really big coming. However, there were manufacturing issues, not the least of which was finding alternates to Samsung. There were the precision bevels that were hard to do, screens, etc. I do wonder what is in the pipeline and when they can show us.

Anyways, Cook may be a lot better CEO for Apple than some of you might think, precisely because his style is different. He just can't talk about any of it for good reason.
Thinking more about this I remember speech last year Malcolm Gladwell gave to a conference I attended. The meme of the speech was practical innovation and he used Apple as one of his examples. That Apple often times wasn't first or even second to market with something but what they did eventually bring to market revolutionized that space. Whereas Google and other companies want to be in every space or want to be the first at something, Apple doesn't care. Apple isn't interested in having their hands in everything (ala Google) or necessarily being first to bring something to market (e.g., LTE, NFC). It's about building great products and a great user experience first and foremost, and being profitable off it second. Reminds me of a quote from Jony Ive from last year:
Quote:
"Most of our competitors are interesting in doing something different, or want to appear new - I think those are completely the wrong goals. A product has to be genuinely better. This requires real discipline, and that’s what drives us - a sincere, genuine appetite to do something that is better. Committees just don’t work, and it’s not about price, schedule or a bizarre marketing goal to appear different - they are corporate goals with scant regard for people who use the product."

Of course people will quibble over whether everything Apple does is always better, but I do think that is their philosophy. It's not about littering up a spec or feature sheet or constantly pushing different iterations of product out (how many Samsung mobile phone models exist now?). If it takes Apple longer to get something right (at least what they believe is right), and someone else beats them to market, than so be it.
post #86 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

So because was/is a jerk like Steve could be and to some was a good speaker on stage he's the next Steve Jobs or will come back to Apple to save the day like Steve did? What exactly is his vision? Has he ever given an interview or spoken outside of a keynote where we can get a feel for what his vision for Apple would be?

NO. He wasn't allowed or had the opportunity to do so. The same as Tim Cook has kept mum. It's adhering to the NDA and secrecy that Apple demands from ALL of it's workers, including the board.

Why are you trying to squeeze me into that shallow drawer of people that think that TC should be replaced? I have only said that I don't think we've seen the last of Scott Forstall in some kind of capacity at Apple. The capacity of CEO fitting other "historical and successful figure's" character traits quite well, from what we've seen of him.

Let's not forget: he was hand picked by SJ to make the move to Apple from Next... AND as the VP of iOS development. THE most important project of the last decade in all of tech. Are YOU doubting SJ and his decision? I'm not... and still have no reason to. In fact... I don't doubt any reason whatsoever that TC had for removing him either, and for letting him cool down and reevaluate what it is to be a leader at Apple... maybe in a far bigger role again some day.

Maybe I'm not as eloquent as Flaneur explaining it.. but I don't think my position in this matter is so hard to understand, nor to fathom "possibly" coming true... some... day. 1cool.gif

It appears you need everything laid out for you in book form or a PowerPoint pres (I purposely use PP in your case)... and I'm sorry, I don't have the time to do that for ya.

Your last post was very good, and I agree with 100%.

As for a "NEW-Style CEO": as much as you and I would like this to be the case with Tim Cook and support him (like that really matters)... the rest of the world, which includes investors, adversaries, competitors, The Media AND customers past, present and future are not showing the guy a whole lot of respect these days. Absolutely NO reason for firing him, but cause for reassessing his role at Apple, and where he fits best in Apple's future. Actually... that's what we're doing here. It's the rest of the world that is the worry. Will they give the guy a real chance at success and or proving himself?

As I've said now often enough: WWDC is going to be the biggest jaw-dropping event in the history of Apple since the "MS doesn't have to lose for Apple to win" Macworld speech by SJ. I'm betting on "Jaw-Dropping Awesome", while other s are going the other route. We shall soon see....1smoking.gif
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #87 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

NO. He wasn't allowed or had the opportunity to do so. The same as Tim Cook has kept mum. It's adhering to the NDA and secrecy that Apple demands from ALL of it's workers, including the board.

Why are you trying to squeeze me into that shallow drawer of people that think that TC should be replaced? I have only said that I don't think we've seen the last of Scott Forstall in some kind of capacity at Apple. The capacity of CEO fitting other "historical and successful figure's" character traits quite well, from what we've seen of him.

Let's not forget: he was hand picked by SJ to make the move to Apple from Next... AND as the VP of iOS development. THE most important project of the last decade in all of tech. Are YOU doubting SJ and his decision? I'm not... and still have no reason to. In fact... I don't doubt any reason whatsoever that TC had for removing him either, and for letting him cool down and reevaluate what it is to be a leader at Apple... maybe in a far bigger role again some day.

Maybe I'm not as eloquent as Flaneur explaining it.. but I don't think my position in this matter is so hard to understand, nor to fathom "possibly" coming true... some... day. 1cool.gif

It appears you need everything laid out for you in book form or a PowerPoint pres (I purposely use PP in your case)... and I'm sorry, I don't have the time to do that for ya.

Your last post was very good, and I agree with 100%.

As for a "NEW-Style CEO": as much as you and I would like this to be the case with Tim Cook and support him (like that really matters)... the rest of the world, which includes investors, adversaries, competitors, The Media AND customers past, present and future are not showing the guy a whole lot of respect these days. Absolutely NO reason for firing him, but cause for reassessing his role at Apple, and where he fits best in Apple's future. Actually... that's what we're doing here. It's the rest of the world that is the worry. Will they give the guy a real chance at success and or proving himself?

As I've said now often enough: WWDC is going to be the biggest jaw-dropping event in the history of Apple since the "MS doesn't have to lose for Apple to win" Macworld speech by SJ. I'm betting on "Jaw-Dropping Awesome", while other s are going the other route. We shall soon see....1smoking.gif
Maybe I should be more clear. I guess I'm not questioning you as far as Cook goes, I just don't think Scott Forstall is another Steve Jobs in the making. Or because he came from NeXT he's got some special status.

Read Walter Issacson's book. Scott Forstall was mentioned 3 times, never interviewed. Jony Ive got his own chapter with a comment from Steve about Jony being his spiritual partner at Apple and having more operational power than anyone else except Steve himself. Also Steve's wife saying Jony had a special status, that most people in Steve's life were replaceable but Jony wasn't. According to Adam Lashinsky's "Inside Apple" book the only Apple executives to attend Steve's burial service were Tim Cook, Jony Ive and Eddy Cue. Jony spoke at the private memorial service and the public service on Apple's campus. Also lets not forget that the first phone call Steve made on the iPhone was to Jony. Same thing with the first FaceTime call - he didn't call Scott, he called Jony (who he referred to as "one of my best friends in the whole world").

Now I'm not suggesting Ive should be CEO, far from it. But I'm not convinced Forstall was the man at Apple and will or needs to come back to save the day ala Steve in 1997. As Don Norman wrote last year, I think Cook is the head, Ive the heart and Schiller the voice of Apple. The wild card is Bob Mansfield who I think was brought back to work on some really cool stuff. And I've heard that he and Ive get on really well so the two of them together will probably be giving us some amazing shit next year (or maybe even this fall).
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