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10M Samsung flagship phones in 28 days a 'record,' 5M iPhone 5 in 3 days 'disappointing' - Page 2

post #41 of 192

I am not talking specifically about Galaxy S4/TouchWiz filled Android (although I find some of their features to be attractive: eye-tracking(pause/play) / hand/hover gesture when my hands are wet / quick-pick / built in camera software).  I am not saying I will be using them all the time, but choices/options are good when the right moment comes.  Just like having flash enabled by default may not be good but having an option/ability to use it when I actually need it would be appreciated.

 

But, I am talking more in general about the latest version of Android.  

To me at least it has been better in many ways than iOS 6.  I think it may be too subjective so I will restrain myself from rambling further.  You may agree or disagree, I don't really care.  And you shouldn't care about my subjective opinion either.

post #42 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loptimist View Post

I think the market is fairly concentrated these days even more than when iPhone 5 came out.

Be it iPhone 5/4s, Galaxy S3/Note 2, ONE, Nexus 4, Xperia Z, Optimus G Pro, all of them seem to perform well for most of common tasks...

Frankly, probably each has more cpu/gpu power than those smartphone sized/compatible apps may demand.

 

I think it is quite impressive that Galaxy S4 can still fight well against other competitors even when many consumers find no need to switch,

and am wondering how many people would stick to iPhone for its next cycle soon.

 

iOS 7 better be good this time.

 

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

 

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive and a ruthless desire for absolute domination.

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #43 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive.
Yep. And unibody aluminum with chamfered edges can't beat a $12B marketing budget.
post #44 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

 

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive.

 

their fabs are different, which actually makes some difference in quality...

 

but you are right that practically speaking, real world experience would be about the same.  

 

Also, Exynos equipped Galaxy S4 has big.LITTLE core and it seems like will be fully supported by Google staring late June.  I am more curious about that version than the US version which you rightly point out as not really special in terms of hardware.

 

but come on guys, it's kinda weird to see iPhone users to talk/belittle about specs...

post #45 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

 

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive.

And yet it is so much more sluggish than the HTC One. Go figure. It is speculated that they use very cheap and slow flash memory.

 

Anyway, shipped does not mean sold. Every where I go, I see the S4 in stock and sitting on shelves. Compared to the iPhone 5 that was sold out for months.

post #46 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I'm hoping to get a Nobel Peace Prize for my contributions to AI.

You got my vote.
post #47 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

It's all about expectations. Derek Jeter comes up to bat and he's expected to hit a single or a double but if ARod is up to bat a homerun is expected.

^This.

Here's to hoping Apple either communicates their estimated targets or at least units available at launch (shipped will equate to sold day 1). If that doesn't work, just take it private. The Street has been a distraction.
post #48 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

So the 5M figure included returned devices? Or stores were out of stock because Apple couldn't make them fast enough? Again, my question is what % of the 5M in 3 days Apple reported was channel inventory compared to the same for Samsung's 10M in 30 days.

Near 0 for Apple as they sold out that first weekend.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Yep. And unibody aluminum with chamfered edges can't beat a $12B marketing budget.

When Sammy smothers the airwaves with ads, it's tough for other Android vendors to get the word out.
post #49 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by shard View Post

And yet it is so much more sluggish than the HTC One. Go figure. It is speculated that they use very cheap and slow flash memory.

 

Anyway, shipped does not mean sold. Every where I go, I see the S4 in stock and sitting on shelves. Compared to the iPhone 5 that was sold out for months.

 

Not trying to say S4 is better than One, but what you are saying is completely wrong.

S4 uses DDR3, HTC ONE uses DDR2. (fact).

Note 3 and iPhone 5S are likely to use next-gen/PC-grade DDR3. (speculation).

 

Also, I am not sure whether being sold out means much to Samsung, because they just mass produce so well and may be they predicted demands so well.  Nexus 4 sold out in a few minutes, but that does not translate to its record-breaking sales record.

 

You might be completely right that there are stocks sitting around due to lackluster sales but I would not make that quick of a conclusion.

post #50 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Near 0 for Apple as they sold out that first weekend.
When Sammy smothers the airwaves with ads, it's tough for other Android vendors to get the word out.
Quite amusing how the choice crowd is perfectly content with two companies - Google and Samsung - ruling the world. I'm guessing if they weren't direct competition/threats to Apple the choice crowd might care more.
post #51 of 192

Despite the naysayers, I expect the iPhone 5S to sell much more than 5M in the first week end. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple did aim to make 8-10 million 5S available in the first week-end, and launching in a lot of countries at the same time.

 

Look at what happened with the 4 -> 4S.

 

 

The iPhone 4 was a completely new case design and needed custom manufacturing techniques, and because of low yield rates they could only make enough to sell 1.7M units in the first week-end. The 4 availability was severely constrained during the first weeks (months?) as it was slowly released around the world.

 

The 4S though, came along when Apple had mastered the art of making a glass sandwich phone with a metal band around it, and was unveiled simultaneously in many more countries, so Apple managed to sell 4M in the first week-end, more than double the first w-e sales of the 4.

 

The iPhone 5, just like the 4, was a manufacturing nightmare for Apple because of the new casing and it took a while until they could ramp up the production. They still sold more than the 4S did in the 1st w-e, but could have sold much more if they had more to sell.

 

The combination of iOS 7, maybe some new hardware feature (fingerprint reader?) and a big worldwide launch could enable Apple to easily sell 10 million iPhone 5S in the first week-end. If they can make enough of them until this fall...

 

I think Samsung's comment is actually much more spiteful than it seems on the surface. In my view they're essentially saying: "Look Apple, we can take our time and still beat you to the market with our plastic GS4, while you struggle to find other partners to ramp up the production of the 5S and get those 10M units ready for launch day this fall".

post #52 of 192
Apple will be expected to sell at least 10 million iPhones within a couple of days. Anything less will be considered a massive failure. Apple is barely hanging on by a thread in the mobile industry. Anything less than 70 million iPhones in the first full quarter of the next iPhone will cause Apple investors to dump the stock due to fears that Apple has lost all credibility in the smartphone industry.

Apple's biggest problem is that it won't ever be able to beat expectations. Expectations are being raised to nearly impossible levels and I doubt Apple can get the manufacturing resources to that level. To reach Wall Street's sales expectations, Apple would probably have to start producing iPhones six months in advance before offering it to consumers. Even if the demand did reach expectation levels, Apple wouldn't be able to meet them due to insufficient inventory and distribution.

I can say right now, with certainty, that Apple's next iPhone will be considered a disappointment to the smartphone industry and Wall Street alike. Only consumers will like the product, but there just won't be enough of them to make a difference to stem the Samsung and Android tide. Apple's global smartphone market share is doomed to slip to low double digits and possible single digits rather quickly. Wall Street hates companies that lose market share to that degree. Apple's share value will fall just as quickly.
post #53 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


I've never used a Samsung phone. What is the hardware button for? With such a small bezel that button really seems out of place.

Also I love that the iPhone doesn't have any logo or branding on the front of the phone (especially no AT&T or Verizon logo!). I'd hate having to see the word Samsung every time I stared at my screen.

The hardware button is the home button. Not shown is the capacitive Back and Menu buttons to the left and right of the home button that glow when touched. It is a small area to work with and I wish all Android handset makers that use Android 4.0 and up would switch to the on screen buttons that was introduced with Android 4.0 instead of using hardware buttons that could fail over time.

 

As far as seeing the Samsung logo on the screen every time you look at it, if you were ever interested in Android, get a Nexus. Pure Android and the only logos are on the back of the phone.

post #54 of 192

A bit of web searching will reveal that Business Insider aka Silicon Alley Insider is yellow journalism. Some bloggers accuse them of "pro-Apple bias" and others accuse them of "pro-Samsung bias." It's probably neither: they're sensationalists. They'll take whatever position generates the most clicks.

 

At least AppleInsider has an unmistakable pro-Apple, Samsung-obsessed bias. 1wink.gif

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #55 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Ah, but Apple didn't pay anybody to say nice things after the iPhone 5 launch, did they?

 

1wink.gif

 

Apple doesn't have to.

Business Insider reviewed the iPhone 5 and said: "After using the iPhone 5 for five days, I feel like it is pretty much a perfect smartphone."

 

Like I said, BI gets accused of having a pro-Apple bias too, because, you know, the iPhone 5 couldn't possibly be as perfect as they say.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #56 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


Hmm...just curious which Apple stores or re-sellers had the iPhone 5 in stock on Saturday or Sunday of the weekend it came out. All I remember is it being sold out everywhere. I guess I'd be curious to know how much of the 5M in 3 days was channel inventory. My guess is none.

Today I can go to AT&T, Sprint and Best Buy and they all have the S4 in stock and available for delivery (or in store pickup).

 

Since Apple does not disclose that information, it is an unknown. My point is that this notion that Apple reports "sold" as in customers hands is misleading. It is something in between shipped and sold - but Apple do not inflate their numbers unlike Samsung which has been proven to inflate those numbers time and again.

post #57 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loptimist View Post

 

their fabs are different, which actually makes some difference in quality...

 

but you are right that practically speaking, real world experience would be about the same.  

 

Also, Exynos equipped Galaxy S4 has big.LITTLE core and it seems like will be fully supported by Google staring late June.  I am more curious about that version than the US version which you rightly point out as not really special in terms of hardware.

 

but come on guys, it's kinda weird to see iPhone users to talk/belittle about specs...

Who in America (or a lot of other places) wants a crippled non-LTE phone?

 

With not much memory:-

 

Hype, hype, hype and a gullible audience.

 

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #58 of 192
I wonder how did the gadget business turn into Hollywood blockbuster kind of thing. T4 anyone? They made 450 million dollars during their entire run (2 weeks I believe) and the company went busted (Haycon from London).

And funny how one month old product "guesstimate sold 10 million" hail as success. Where a 3 years old iPhone 4 was completely sold out in China during new year (feb 2013) and still lots of troll brand it with useless screen?!
post #59 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Why not, it may remind you of your washing machine!

/s

But my screen says Samsung and my washing machine says Bosch
post #60 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


I've never used a Samsung phone. What is the hardware button for? With such a small bezel that button really seems out of place.

Also I love that the iPhone doesn't have any logo or branding on the front of the phone (especially no AT&T or Verizon logo!). I'd hate having to see the word Samsung every time I stared at my screen.

It's used the same way as a iPhone, it's not needed anymore as Jellybean did away with it. Samsung however still provides one because the custom skin they use still uses elements from Android HoneyComb, lame. It's nice to see you can get a S4 with vanilla Android however.

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #61 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Who in America (or a lot of other places) wants a crippled non-LTE phone?

 

With not much memory:-

 

Hype, hype, hype and a gullible audience.

 

 

They now sell a Nexus version of the Galaxy S4 which will open up the rest of the memory as a Vanilla build of Android takes up less than 1GB and it's LTE. http://www.t3.com/news/google-announces-nexus-based-samsung-galaxy-s4


Edited by Relic - 5/18/13 at 12:25am
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #62 of 192
I thinkg tkell31 has a point. The journalist is biased, no doubt, but he is reporting two different things.

In the first case with the iPhone 5, expectations were very high, and were not met. In the second case with Samsung, they are showing a growth phase.

If Samsumg proves better at managing inventory and exploiting channels this gives them an edge over Apple even if the Apple product is technically superior and preferred by customers.

Apples products are 'smart' in many ways including their customer base, that doesn't necessarily make the most successful product in a world that isn't solely made of 'smart' consumers or rich ones.

Personally I think the iPhone 5 was a mistake in a number of ways that might indicate the future of Apple. The aspect ratio/form factor does not have the comfort in the hand (and my hands are very large) of the iPhone 4S. My thumb cannot easily rotate to access the top and bottom of the screen. This bit of UX is revealing as I don't theorise that with the iPhone 5 Apple prioritized design over marketing, they felt they had to make the phone 'bigger' to meet market demands, but any of their top UX people would have pointed out the reduction in pleasure for the user. I would have loved an iPhone 4S with the thinness of the iPhone 5, but instead I got the first iPhone I didn't love.

The thinness of the iPhone 5 is brilliant, however the cost of achieving that thinness was the cost of moving to a manufacturing process that failed to deliver enough units at launch.

Anyway, the subtext to all of this is that Apple created a market, and its inevitable that they would lose market share, its no biggie. I hope Apple return to making products I love and don't fall into the iPhone5 trap again. The iPad mini shows that they can continue to create great and lovable products
post #63 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

 

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive and a ruthless desire for absolute domination.

 

it's not overclocked, the Qualcomm Snapdragon 600 comes in either 1.7 or 1.9 GHZ configurations, shipped that way to the buyer.

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post #64 of 192
Love how Elmer-DeWitt exposes the flawgic and media bias
post #65 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

Samsung is hurting HTC, Sony and other Android manufacturers the most making 94.7% of Android handset PROFITS last quarter, LG took 2.5% all the others share the rest between them.

 

It seems the American press favours foreign companies over their own, do they want a world which is 100% Samsung?

 

Will the world be happy when Google's "freedom of choice" boils down to which Samsung handset to buy?

 

I think what is missing in this discussion is; what does this mean for Google? Samsung is already working on another cell phone OS. What happens when Android is synonymous with Samsung? It's a huge danger because there isn't much forcing Samsun to stay with Android when they can flip a switch and migrate a lot of this to their own LINUX version. Kind of like how INTEL became dependent on Microsoft -- only more so.
post #66 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

 

it's not overclocked, the Qualcomm Snapdragon 600 comes in either 1.7 or 1.9 GHZ configurations, shipped that way to the buyer.

 

So how do they achieve the difference?

 

Clockspeed is it not?

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #67 of 192
Can we stop the play ground articles. Samsung and Apple produce brilliant phones. And thankfully that means choice. We need the like of HTC and Blackberry to provide customer choice.

Producing articles with my dad's bigger than yours perpetuates this Apple versus the world bollox
post #68 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by pete borota View Post

Can we stop the play ground articles. Samsung and Apple produce brilliant phones. And thankfully that means choice. We need the like of HTC and Blackberry to provide customer choice.

Producing articles with my dad's bigger than yours perpetuates this Apple versus the world bollox

 

Tell that to Wall Street, where "the world (i.e. the tech press media) vs Apple" is responsible for write downs of hundreds of billions of dollars of Apple's stock value.

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #69 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hydr View Post

 

That is actually how Apple reports its numbers. Although the channel inventory for Apple for companies like Wal-Mart, BestBuy etc is considerably lower. Last quarter I believe the ratio was 70/30 of the reported numbers. So Apple does indeed report shipped and not sold products, but they are clearing out inventory a whole lot faster than the likes of Samsung & Co.

You have the link to tha's how Apple said it is shipped and not sold ?
post #70 of 192
Fortune is Samsung's little bitch.
post #71 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hydr View Post

That is actually how Apple reports its numbers. Although the channel inventory for Apple for companies like Wal-Mart, BestBuy etc is considerably lower. Last quarter I believe the ratio was 70/30 of the reported numbers. So Apple does indeed report shipped and not sold products, but they are clearing out inventory a whole lot faster than the likes of Samsung & Co.
You are mistaken. Apple announces and clearly tells you what is sold to end customers. units that are in transit are counted in that number but not what is sitting on the shelf somewhere. They report channel inventory seperately to indicate how close they are to matching demand. This is also why just about every article stipulates Apple sales but then say shipped for Samsung. The articles are written as if they were the same, but the fact they consistently use these terms and not interchangeably says they know they are incompatible.
post #72 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

So how do they achieve the difference?

Clockspeed is it not?

One could be underclocked.
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post #73 of 192

The Business Insider reporter is obviously biased toward Samsung and you can argue all the way about how things should be represented in the media. But the bigger problem is the negative image that has built up against Apple. In marketing, perception is everything, reality second. Their perception, your reality is the motto in marketing classes. Coca-Cola consistently outsell Pepsi because Coca-Cola is seen as the "better" brand. A BMW costs more than a Lexus despite being less reliable because it's seen as more "prestigious".

 

Once upon a time, the world stopped to listen to what Apple had to say. Now that management has stopped talking, the media turns attention elsewhere, to production problems, to shoddy consumer surveys, and yes, to Samsung mouthpieces. 12 months ago, Apple could do no wrong, now they can do no right. The negative perception first appeared in the stock price, now it's spreading Joe Average too. I have friends who were perfectly happy with the 4" screen on the iPhone 5. But now they are complaining about it being too small, after 8 months of being constantly coached the media that it is so.

 

The fault isn't Business Insider alone, Apple must also take blame for not working enough to counter the negative narrative against it.

post #74 of 192
I don't care, I live and die by the Apple, Apple gonna finish strong
post #75 of 192
Samsung should stick to appliances I hate their phones
post #76 of 192
So when are the phone companies going to be offering all these stocked Samsungs for Buy One Get Two Free to move them off the shelves?
post #77 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


This implies that iOS 6 isn't good and/or that the Galaxy S4 has somehow done something that makes iOS 6 look bad. What in the S4 is something that is going to attract iPhone users away from the iPhone?

Edited by patrickf - 5/18/13 at 2:16pm
post #78 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loptimist View Post

I think the market is fairly concentrated these days even more than when iPhone 5 came out.

Be it iPhone 5/4s, Galaxy S3/Note 2, ONE, Nexus 4, Xperia Z, Optimus G Pro, all of them seem to perform well for most of common tasks...

Frankly, probably each has more cpu/gpu power than those smartphone sized/compatible apps may demand.

 

I think it is quite impressive that Galaxy S4 can still fight well against other competitors even when many consumers find no need to switch,

and am wondering how many people would stick to iPhone for its next cycle soon.

 

iOS 7 better be good this time.

And I'm thinking about the opposite.

 

After trying those shitty phones with oversaturated screens, bad build quality, lag (as the S4 is known for), worse battery life while on use, worse ecosystem, how many will say "enough" and buy an iPhone?

 

looks like that for each person that goes from iOS to Android, 7 come from android to iOS. Not bad.

 

Now imagine if Apple had another line of iPhones with bigger screens.


Edited by pedromartins - 5/18/13 at 5:43am
post #79 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loptimist View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

Well the Galaxy S4 (LTE model) has exactly the same Qualcomm CPU and GPU as the HTC One, however they over clock it to 1.9GHz rather than 1.7GHz, both have 2GB of the same RAM.

 

What Samsung has is a multi-billion dollar marketing budget, hype in overdrive.

 

their fabs are different, which actually makes some difference in quality...

 

but you are right that practically speaking, real world experience would be about the same.  

 

Also, Exynos equipped Galaxy S4 has big.LITTLE core and it seems like will be fully supported by Google staring late June.  I am more curious about that version than the US version which you rightly point out as not really special in terms of hardware.

 

but come on guys, it's kinda weird to see iPhone users to talk/belittle about specs...

Au contrarie, it's all about specs, but specs that mean something.

 

For example, only a retarded whale cares about processor and ram. Rational humans care about speed on real life usage: iPhone.

 

Retarded whales care about resolution, color gamut. Rational humans care about accuracy, if the screen is pentile or not, real ppi and brightness levels so the screen can be used outdoors and how apps take advantage of it: The iPhone wins, with the HTC one close.

 

See? It's all about specs, but not about specs targeted at stupid and ignorant people, that usually buy the S4 because of 12B$ spent advertising it. 

post #80 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Au contrarie, it's all about specs, but specs that mean something.

For example, only a retarded whale cares about processor and ram. Rational humans care about speed on real life usage: iPhone.

Retarded whales care about resolution, color gamut. Rational humans care about accuracy, if the screen is pentile or not, real ppi and brightness levels so the screen can be used outdoors and how apps take advantage of it: The iPhone wins, with the HTC one close.

See? It's all about specs, but not about specs targeted at stupid and ignorant people, that usually buy the S4 because of 12B$ spent advertising it. 

Retarded whale, really? How is someone supposed to respect your opinion when you use terms like that?
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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