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Haswell chips could bring 50% more battery life to Apple's next-gen MacBooks - Page 2

post #41 of 104

I'm hoping this chip will offer a quantum leap in weight reduction and longer battery life. My old MBP could use an upgrade.

post #42 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

We like our Macbooks in large part because Intel's done a pretty good job of increasing both horsepower and energy efficiency time and again over the last decade.

Power efficient CPUs are also a big deal for data centers so hopefully the Haswell server chips, whenever they come out, will offer similar energy savings.

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post #43 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post


How many loyal Mac customers have enough experience with other brands to make a reasonable comparison?

 

Customer satisfaction ratings are only that, subjective opinions based on what is most frequently a limited range of experience.  See the hundreds of thousands of posts in the Apple Support forums for details....

That is true, but the fact remains that Apple customers are subjectively more satisfied than other companies customers.

post #44 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


And his point is as foolish as wanting the GPU to be user-replaceable in a notebook in case it goes bad so he doesn't have to be without his machine for 2 days whilst Apple repairs it.


Except I've had to replace batteries, but never a GPU. Your point is foolish.

post #45 of 104
This is indeed great news if it's true, I get about 4 hours of use with my Air 11" and would love to see that number jump up to at least 8 hours. I still would like a external battery slice that fixes itself to the bottom like my ThinkPad does but Apple has abandon the use of removable battery's, so that ain't happening.
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post #46 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursadorable View Post

Can't decide.. 13" MBA or iPad. Eager to see what both bring to the table this fall. I wonder if Apple plans on adding touchscreens to the MBA.
MBA will not be having a touch screen!

If this is true probably all MacBooks, and iPads will have simular battery life. (10 hours)
post #47 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursadorable View Post

Can't decide.. 13" MBA or iPad. Eager to see what both bring to the table this fall. I wonder if Apple plans on adding touchscreens to the MBA.

It is mind boggling how so many people get the idea that Apple will give the MBA a touch screen. That will not happen. It is a computer, not an Pad. That would definitely make it require a thicker display.

It is a silly idea.
post #48 of 104

deleted


Edited by MacRulez - 7/25/13 at 2:06pm
post #49 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzTerri View Post

Still doesn't solve the problem of being without your laptop for a few days while its battery gets changed when it goes bad. Not to mention Apple's overpriced battery replacement fee.
 
 

Wait, what? 

 

I have never --repeat, never-- replaced a laptop battery in my life, and I first started using the things back when bleeding-edge laptops came with an i386 stuffed inside of them. I never really understood the whole 'removable battery' thing in a laptop, save for one use case (it was a Dell Inspiron 8100 that had a second battery stuffed in the drive bay), and that was only because it was the only use case where you could swap batteries without shutting the whole thing down first. 

 

Otherwise, when a battery craps out, you evaluate whether or not a new battery costs less than a new laptop. That said, Apple batteries have been naught but good to me - I held onto a 1994 PPC Powerbook that even in 2005 managed to eke out 30 minutes of battery, in spite of it being 11 years old (30 minutes was more than enough for what little I did on it by that point - usually to shake out an old file that I had stashed on it.)

 

As for the Apple battery performance? Let me clue you in a little:

I can crank along doing 3D/CG mesh-making, compositing and renders, and only burn off ~20% battery an hour on my 15" MBP using all available cores (wait, what do I mean by cores? Read on...)

 

My previous laptop, a Samsung RC-512, was touted to have a 5-hour battery life. I could drain the thing to nothing in only 90 minutes doing the same things on Windows 7 with the exact same applications - and that was after throttling processor affinity for the apps to just two cores in order to save power. Otherwise using all 8 cores would drain the whole thing in 60 minutes flat.

 

So far, I've exercised the battery on this MBP fairly heavily (I travel on business a lot), and it has been more than up to the challenge. If the battery goes south after the warranty dies on this thing, I'll just buy another battery and put it in myself**.  Odds are perfect I won't be shelling out too much money to do it because of some stupid model-specific proprietary battery case shape either, like I would with most other OEM laptops.

 

** Why myself? I'm a sysadmin by trade, and have been monkeying with computer hardware internals -- from PDAs to 370-chassis mainframes -- since the late 1980s - to me, it's machts nichts as long as I can get parts and have the tools handy.

post #50 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

No doubt your own CPU designs are both more energy efficient and more powerful, and we look forward to using them.  When will they be available?

 

In the meantime, Intel is not exactly the incompetent idiots you imagine.  This thread is about Macs, not iPads, and Mac users choose their Macs because they're more powerful.  Not that there's anything wrong with iPads, just a very different set of tasks it's aiming for, while the tasks people do on their Macs require more horsepower than any ARM chip ever made or even likely to be made in the next few years.

 

In fact, while you lament the notion that Intel only now understands that people are buying laptops, if you've bought a Mac at all in the last decade you have an Intel processor inside.  We like our Macbooks in large part because Intel's done a pretty good job of increasing both horsepower and energy efficiency time and again over the last decade.

 

The reason Haswell is such big news is that it goes far beyond the sorts of improvements you've been enjoying all these years.  What's important about Haswell is that it's the beginning of what may well be a sea change for the industry:

 

With a lithography process roadmap that ARM isn't scheduled to even match for years, by the end of 2014 we just might see x86 both outperforming ARM's best effort while also providing longer battery life.

 

Think about the implications.  Haswell is today a modest boost, but underlying it is a process change that could well reshape the industry...

 

Yep. I agree with the roadmap/future. No one loved the PPC more than I, but I also knew that Intel wasn't sitting still. It's hard to imagine billions of dollars of R&D and an intense focus on making ever more powerful/cooler CPUs by the largest chip maker not eventually dominating the portable CPU biz.

 

Intel wants Apple's portable business and they will continue to throw their considerable cash and brain power at it until they achieve their goals. I imagine a partnership between Intel and Apple that will bear difficult-to-copy fruit regarding power and battery life.

post #51 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

lol. Manufacturers LOVE mind sets like yours, Sol. You're just the blank check that keeps cashing out. Meanwhile, ifixit and I continue plucking away and solving our own problems without ridiculously overpriced extended warranties and repair fees.

Speaking of battery replacement, this is funny: I can get an OEM replacement for my 2009 MBP 13" for 49 dollars online, and swap it out in about ten minutes. Apple, on the other hand, wants 130 bucks and a day to do the same thing. What? If I'm paying 50, they are probably paying 35 or less, which means they expect almost 100 dollars for ten minutes of labor. I don't care if you're Daddy Warbucks himself, that's ridiculous.

If I pay $1000 to $2000 on a laptop from Apple, I can afford to pay $130 for a new battery on the off chance that my battery needs to be replaced. I've not had any of my MBA battery packs ever go bad and I still occasionally use my Rev. A. version. .
Edited by iRun262 - 5/24/13 at 6:05pm
post #52 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRun262 View Post


If I pay $1000 to $2000 on a laptop from Apple, I can afford to pay $130 for a new battery on the off chance that my battery needs to be replaced. I've not any of my MBA battery packs go bad.

 

Computers often go through more than one owner. They're handed down to spouses or kids or sold. The annoying side effect here is that it basically renders older machines unserviceable. Apple sells a lot of refurbished units from prior years at times, but within 5 years of cutting off new sales, hardware service can be discontinued. It's part of their vintage policy. If a battery is relatively inaccessible, third party options are no longer viable. I've never personally run into such a problem, although I do keep an older notebook around just for travel purposes.

post #53 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I'm not quite sure it will be a 50% improvement but it should be decent if that's what they focussed on this time around. Thank you Intel!

The processor doesn't account for all the load in a laptop so even if it is a 50% improvement you still need to get similar improvements out of the rest of the rest of the machine. LCD screens take considerable power for example as does secondary storage. Of course with SSD and new LCD tech floating around the potential is there
post #54 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

Haven't they said similar thinsg about SandyBridge chipset as well?
That is what they said and that is what we got. The problem is the savings in power is traded off for much higher performance. Apple just designs in a chip at the same power point that the platform supports. This leads to much higher performance each go around. This is a very good thing as performance is still an issue for many of us.

However Haswell does to a step or two further and does much better under light load than previous processors so if you don't stress the machine battery life will probably be much better.
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Wasn't there supposed to be a sigificant battery improvement with well....EVERY new chipset relased? I don't that has come to fruitition.
I'm not sure you are looking at this with an historical eye. Today's laptops are power houses that do far more on battery power than any laptop from the past even thought about.
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I hope it is true..... My rMBP battery lasts about 6-7 hours of normal use for me.
Think about it a bit that is pretty incredible. You are driving one of the highest performance displays out there and have one of the better performing laptops made. There was a time when laptops had 640 x 480 screens and half hour battery life times.
Quote:
So the new Haswell rMBP would last 9- 10 hours? I hope this true....i might have to upgrade just for the battery alone....
No you can't say that from the info you have. The processor is only part of the equation. On top of that Intel laptop processors can run very hot under high loads and we have no info on how Haswell will perform in situations like that. In the end it is all about how you use the machine and how well the new power savings states and techniques work in conjunction with your usage.
post #55 of 104
Unfortunately, 50% less consumption by the CPU doesn't mean a doubled battery life. The screen is also consuming quite a bit of energy. Also, Intel's plans includes a lot of tweaking of other parts of the computer to save energy. If Apple takes the time to do that, we could see a dramatic improvement. If not, it'll be less impressive.

Personally, I'd like to see Apple add a reasonably priced EL edition to most of its laptop line. The EL (for extended battery life) would simply have a thicker base with a larger battery. That'd be enough to get me to set aside my aging MacBook for a new MacBook Air. As it, I seen no reason to spend $1200 to get a couple of more hours of battery life and to save a couple of pounds. There's a hundred better ways to spend that money.

This thinner is better mantra is silly. On a desk, thin matters not one bit. Transported about, my laptop is always in a padded case that's about two-inches thick for protection. It matters not if the laptop itself is a half-inch thicker. It matters a lot of that if that half-inch can give me several more hours of battery life.

Keep in mind that a battery life of over about twelve hours is essentially infinite. Few people can or need to work more than that in a day and recharging means it'll be ready to go again the next morning. Like a retina display and the human eye, never running down in normal use is like an infinite life.

In about two-and-a-half weeks at WWDC we should know what Apple's plans are.
post #56 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

lol. Manufacturers LOVE mind sets like yours, Sol. You're just the blank check that keeps cashing out. Meanwhile, ifixit and I continue plucking away and solving our own problems without ridiculously overpriced extended warranties and repair fees.

Speaking of battery replacement, this is funny: I can get an OEM replacement for my 2009 MBP 13" for 49 dollars online, and swap it out in about ten minutes. Apple, on the other hand, wants 130 bucks and a day to do the same thing. What? If I'm paying 50, they are probably paying 35 or less, which means they expect almost 100 dollars for ten minutes of labor. I don't care if you're Daddy Warbucks himself, that's ridiculous.

Have you gone to the auto repair shop lately? Flat rates aren't much better. The reality is it costs a lot of money to retain a staff of repair techs no matter what the industry. When it comes to computers though there is a lot of competition out there for this sort of staff.

By the way I'm not disagreeing with you about the savings. I tend to repair as much as I can around my house. That includes cars, computers, appliances, cell phones, furnace and whatever else I can. Why because I can for one, but more so I know that a good portion of the bill will go to support wages and business expenses, not the parts required for the repair. At times it can be rather foolish to pay for a plumber to make a house call to replace a few dollars worth of parts. Likewise it is foolish to pay Apple to replace a battery you can DIY.
post #57 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRun262 View Post

It is mind boggling how so many people get the idea that Apple will give the MBA a touch screen. That will not happen. It is a computer, not an Pad. That would definitely make it require a thicker display.

It is a silly idea.

The display thickness would remain the same. Have you ever seen a Windows 8 Ultrabook, Asus has one with a thinner screen then a Macbook and that's touch. I to agree it's a silly idea, a Wacom board is a lot more useful.
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post #58 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Is it just me or do people need so little computing capability these days that they can get by with just a mobile device?
Actually today's mobile devices have a great deal of capability.
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Hell, I can't even get by with just a rMBP 15, I am just such a long time user of large screen monitors and multi-cpu machines that I would feel crippled without my familiar desktops.
I tend to agree with the more cores is better mentality, however MBPs now come with quad core chips.
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To me it would be like after owning a luxury automobile to have get by with only a bicycle. Sure I have a couple mobile devices, and I also own a bicycle but it is not my only mode of transportation.

The biggest problem with Apple today is the high entry price into a solid multi core desktop machine. A machine that is frankly very dated. Most of Apples machines these days are bicycles or in some cases motor cycles. They don't have a machine that is really designed for heavy lifting.
post #59 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Is it just me or do people need so little computing capability these days that they can get by with just a mobile device? Hell, I can't even get by with just a rMBP 15, I am just such a long time user of large screen monitors and multi-cpu machines that I would feel crippled without my familiar desktops. To me it would be like after owning a luxury automobile to have get by with only a bicycle. Sure I have a couple mobile devices, and I also own a bicycle but it is not my only mode of transportation.

 

the 15 inch retina MBP has a 4 core i7, can be configured with 16 gigs of ram, can drive multiple large screen displays, and benchmarks within a hair of the 27 inch iMac.  Certainly the 8 and 12 core Mac Pro is faster, but other than that, there's no real performance advantage in a desktop vs the retina MBP.

post #60 of 104
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Originally Posted by ndirishfan1975 View Post

That is true, but the fact remains that Apple customers are subjectively more satisfied than other companies customers.

I is a mistake to believe that Apple users don't have experience with other machines. Many of us have plenty of experience with MS based systems in the workplace, even a few UNIX based mainframes. At home we may have a brace of Linux machines too.

The reality is Apple leads the pack in customer satisfaction because they have significantly better hardware and software. It isn't something that is subjective but rather an outgrowth of a wide array of experience. Satisfaction is due to the relative experience.
post #61 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by emig647 View Post

 

You really have access to OEM (ie Apple battery) for $50? Or is it a chinese knock-off passed off as a OEM battery that could have consequences later on (like expanding from heat, and blowing up like other aftermarket batteries have in the past)?

 

I doubt most have been as have been as hard on a MBP as I have. Running dual drives (SSD 256 & 7200 500gb in optical bay) and iOS and Mac programming an average of 10 hours a day 5-6 days a week for the last 2 years. My battery is still doing great. Doesn't mean all batteries will last like that, but no one at work or in my programming ring has had issues with batteries. 

 

BTW, isn't the retina 15" glued in? Is it still easy to replace?

 

To answer your questions in order:

 

Yes, it really is a certified OEM replacement. Believe it or not, there are businesses that repair Apple products other than Apple itself, and have access to the full distribution line of genuine replacement parts. As for the Chinese knockoffs, those are easy to spot and are usually priced around $29. Not all explode, but hey, buyer beware. For 20 bucks more, I'll take the non explodey real McCoy.

 

As for your system, I'm thrilled for you. I have a similar setup, except mine is running a 512 SSD with a 1TB 7200 drive in the optical bay. Yes, I need that much space. As I said above, my MPB is a 2009, and has been running nonstop as my main machine since the day I bought it almost 4 years ago. After many, many recharge cycles, battery health was down to 68% by March, which was giving me maybe 2.5 hours of up time on average which was not acceptable. Like I said, this is my work machine, and my work doesn't always take place near a power outlet. So ten minutes and 50 dollars later, I'm back up to 100% (well, 99, but close enough)

 

As for the 15" rMBP, yes, it is glued in. If you know what you're doing, it can relatively quickly be removed with a heat gun. If you don't have experience with a heat gun, Isopropyl alcohol works just as well though is a bit more time consuming. This is the method I recommend to my friends who DON'T know how to use a heat gun and have no business applying heat anywhere near a Lithium Ion battery. As you point out, most modern laptop batteries last a good three years before replacement should even be contemplated, so I expect many, many how-to videos to be posted to the internet before then. Till that happens, here's a basic one that shows just what isopropyl alcohol does to the type of glue used to secure the batteries inside the rMBPs. Yes, I understand DIY is not everyone's cup of tea, "everyone" being most Apple users. Ignorance is bliss, I imagine. There are those of us, however, who prefer to do things ourselves when it is possible, and make it a point of pride to do so. You yourself have performed the wonderful optical-to-HDD swap, so I imagine you have an inkling of what I'm talking about. Perhaps you're like me and change your own oil instead of paying a stranger 80 dollars to do it for you as well.


Edited by Cash907 - 5/24/13 at 4:52pm
post #62 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


They are good for 1000 full cycles before they at 80% original capacity. If you're talking about a bad battery treat it like a bad component that needs to be replaced. This whole notion that everything should be user-replaceable is an archaic and outmoded concept in 2013 for a consumer device.


The hell it is.

 

Up until my current MBP, I had an external charger and a couple of spare batteries.  I could do a quick swap and keep going, I could take the spares with me on a plane and not have to worry about running out of power on a long flight, it just made my life easier.

 

Oh, and they don't really go for 1000 cycles, the life drops significantly at around 600-700 cycles.  Sure, it's better than the 300 cycles of the previous batteries, but hardly enough to justify locking it inside the case.  And no, even new it doesn't have the runtime of two of the old batteries, so I actually have less useable time before I have to go find an outlet.

 

Speaking of consumer device, this is the MacBook PRO we're talking about, a computer built for people who need to be able to do actual work with it.  Non-user-replaceable batteries would be absolutely unforgivable if it weren't the only available machine that runs a useable OS.  As it is, it's incredibly frustrating.

 

If Apple would give up the stupid obsession with thin on pro devices we'd all be better off.  I'd love to have a modern MBP built on the PowerBook G3 series platform, with swappable bays for drives, ports on the back, capability for multiple batteries, and easy access to change hard drives and RAM.

post #63 of 104
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Originally Posted by Lemon Bon Bon. View Post

Yep.

Lemon Bon Bon.

Historically for most of those 31 years, the desktop chip market was where most of the action was. But Intel has been making lower power versions of the Core, Core 2, and Core i3, i5, and i7 for quite some time now. The 2010 MacBook Air had an ultra low power version of the Core 2 Duo, allowing the Air to hit 10 hours continuous hours of Web surfing with the backlight turned down, and Flash disabled. The Atom CPU is another attempt to bring low power requirements to the x86 chip market. Intel knew the trend in mobile computing was coming. They weren't particularly prescient about it, but neither did they just stumble onto it.

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post #64 of 104

deleted


Edited by MacRulez - 7/25/13 at 2:06pm
post #65 of 104
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Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

I never said "all", but of course if Apple customers were buying lots of non-Apple-branded computers that would tell a very different story, wouldn'd it?

 

I work in a mixed shop myself.  And yes, Linux and nearly any POSIX system is a wonderful alternative to Windows.  But I recognize that among Mac owners, I'm in a slender minority.  Most people use a single computer, and the relative few Mac users who use Windows daily probably do so at work, where they didn't purchase the machine.  You know what I'm saying.  You and I are rare edge cases in the Mac demographic.

 

The great irony is that Linux is `mostly POSIX compliant' and as I'm typing on Debian Linux there is a world of difference from my days using HP-UX Apollos, DECStations OSF/1, to System V and BSD 4.3 NeXTStations before working at NeXT and Apple.

 

Now with 14 solid years of Debian Linux mixed with CertOS next to OS X I'll take OS X hands down other than specific server scenarios; and even then I'm counting the days when FreeBSD 10 drops with LLVM/Clang/LLDB/Compiler-RT/Libc++ replacing the GCC Toolchain.

post #66 of 104
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Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

The great irony is that Linux is `mostly POSIX compliant' and as I'm typing on Debian Linux there is a world of difference from my days using HP-UX Apollos, DECStations OSF/1, to System V and BSD 4.3 NeXTStations before working at NeXT and Apple.
Of the above what was your favorite?
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Now with 14 solid years of Debian Linux mixed with CertOS next to OS X I'll take OS X hands down other than specific server scenarios;
This would be my preference also. OS/X is possibly the best general purpose OS out there right now. However it looses badly when it comes to hardware support, which interestingly Linux does better at now a days. Apples problem here is the lack of cost effective hardware to plug specialized hardware into. This there is little incentive to write drivers for Apples OS/X.
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and even then I'm counting the days when FreeBSD 10 drops with LLVM/Clang/LLDB/Compiler-RT/Libc++ replacing the GCC Toolchain.

Never really tried BSD. It will certainly be an interesting beast with the LLVM tool chain but honestly I'd probably wait for FreeBSD 11 or at least a few months of bug fixes to take place. The important thing is for BSD to free itself as much as possible from the GPL. Even then the thing that causes me to keep Linux around is software you can't find anywhere else. I'd love to see a realtime extension to FreeBSD.
post #67 of 104
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Originally Posted by alandail View Post

I've never had to replace a battery on a unibody MacBook and we've had over a half dozen of them.

Over half a dozen? So, seven?
Edited by v5v - 5/25/13 at 1:04am
post #68 of 104
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Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

[...] 95% of users will never need or want to replace their batteries.

 

Why do people always assume that because THEY don't see a need, no one ELSE does?

 

The fact that people buy Macs with glued-in batteries does not automatically mean they don't care, it means they don't have any CHOICE. If you want a laptop running OS X, you can't have a removable battery. Some people suck it up and live with it, others, for whom enduring battery power is important, undoubtedly choose something other than a Mac.

 

My wife used to use her old MacBook Pro in the field all day. When one battery died she'd swap it out and I'd run it back to home base to recharge. Between her two and the one in my machine she was able to stay out there for as long as I was willing to run them back and forth. That's something we just plain can't do with the unibody.

post #69 of 104
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Originally Posted by AppleZilla View Post

My nearly four year old MBP has a battery health of 87%. I'll have a Retina MBP long before my battery fails.

 

So when you get a new computer, the old one will go in the recycling bin, right?

 

No? You'll SELL it you say.

 

So, the battery won't be a problem... FOR YOU. You can just offload that particular inconvenience to the NEXT user!

 

(Lest I come across as being an evangelist for removable batteries, I actually don't really care that much since mine is almost always plugged in to mains power anyway, but some of the arguments in defence of Apple's choices are amusing!)


Edited by v5v - 5/25/13 at 2:08am
post #70 of 104
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Originally Posted by Penguinisto View Post

I have never --repeat, never-- replaced a laptop battery in my life

 

...because you just buy a new computer instead. I presume that when your tires wear out you just buy a new car?

 

We recently replaced my wife's first Mac, which we purchased in 2007. When we retired it after five-and-a-half years it was on its third battery. We have two duds that will no longer take a charge. We got about two years out of each one. Replacing the computer on that timetable would have be substantially more expensive than just buying new batteries. I guess we can still pay someone to replace the internal battery, but I can't imagine that will be as easy or inexpensive as just grabbing a new battery off the shelf.

 

Besides, we also used multiple batteries to extend the time we could be away from mains power. You can't do that with a fixed battery.

 

There are benefits to the glued-in battery, but it's not without certain sacrifices.

post #71 of 104
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Originally Posted by v5v View Post

My wife used to use her old MacBook Pro in the field all day. When one battery died she'd swap it out and I'd run it back to home base to recharge. Between her two and the one in my machine she was able to stay out there for as long as I was willing to run them back and forth. That's something we just plain can't do with the unibody.

I found the removable batteries used to last a lot less than the sealed ones. They had a rated 5 hour battery life vs 7. There are also external battery options, this one's quite expensive:

http://www.hypershop.com/HyperJuice-External-Battery-for-MacBook-iPad-iPhone-USB-s/91.htm

If you used one of those for 7 hours first, then went to the internal for 7 hours and charged the pack and used it for 7 hours, you'd get 21 hour straight usage.

It's true that a second-hand machine could mean getting a new battery from Apple but that's a risk in buying an older machine. Apple's prices are here:

http://support.apple.com/kb/index?page=servicefaq&product=Macnotebooks

It's $129 for cMBP, $179 for 17" cMBP, $199 for rMBP. It would be nice if the rMBP was $129 too as that's not a huge expense.
post #72 of 104
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Originally Posted by alandail View Post

 

it still adds to the cost and makes other compromises to the machine (how do you have a user replaceable battery in a unibody design) when the battery should already last about 3 years if you drain it and charge it every single day.

 

I've never had to replace a battery on a unibody MacBook and we've had over a half dozen of them.


And by compromises and cost you surely must mean a normal screw type versus a tri wing screw used in the unibody.

PS. Batteries NEVER fail...which is why Apple has ONLY a 1 year warranty.

 

Get a grip.

post #73 of 104
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Originally Posted by v5v View Post


Over half a dozen? So, seven?


LMAO. And those 7 also have the Apple life time battery warranty....which lasts 365 days.

post #74 of 104
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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I found the removable batteries used to last a lot less than the sealed ones. They had a rated 5 hour battery life vs 7. .

There was more involved in that improvement than just the battery, but there's truth to what you say. Once again, people don't realize the tradeoffs that are involved. A removable battery requires more materials - both in the battery and in the support structure. It is a component that can become loose and cause problems. It takes up extra space which makes the system larger - and reduces the amount of available battery capacity.

Just like with soldered RAM, an integral, non-replaceable battery is the most robust way to do it and will offer the greatest long term reliability. Yes, when you need to replace a battery, it takes a little more time, but it's not an enormous amount of time. Apple has chosen to trade reliability and bulk reduction and higher capacity for a slightly more expensive battery swap. I don't think that's a bad tradeoff.

And if you do need to go more than 7 hours (or whatever your model is) away from a power outlet, get an external battery pack. No less convenient than a replaceable battery.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #75 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzTerri View Post

Still doesn't solve the problem of being without your laptop for a few days while its battery gets changed when it goes bad. Not to mention Apple's overpriced battery replacement fee.
What total bullshit! It does not take a few days to change the battery, with Apple or authorized service center! And their batteries are state of the art so last a very very long time.
post #76 of 104
Looking forward to 50% more life!!!
post #77 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzTerri View Post

Still doesn't solve the problem of being without your laptop for a few days while its battery gets changed when it goes bad. Not to mention Apple's overpriced battery replacement fee.

True, having to go without your laptop for a few days once every 3 or 4 years can be inconvenient but I think you could manage.
post #78 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Ooh! Back on the Intel hype train, are we? All aboard! Next stop: It'd Be Nice If It Were True Like They Claimed A Few Years Ago, But We Probably Won't Suffer Too Much If It Isn't And As Long As They Don't Switch To iGPUs Across The Entire Lineup…ville.

It would be great if Apple could pitch the MacBook Air as having 10-12 hours of battery.

Intel does seem to over promise with their new chips. I wounded if they will still use the TIM or go back to the flux solder used in the Sandy chips.
post #79 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

[...] There are also external battery options, this one's quite expensive:

http://www.hypershop.com/HyperJuice-External-Battery-for-MacBook-iPad-iPhone-USB-s/91.htm

 

Not as convenient as an internal battery and you're right, more expensive, but it's nice to have the option. In some circumstances the need will justify the cost and slight hassle. The ability to charge it from the car battery is really handy too. I've always wondered why Apple doesn't provide a cig lighter power adaptor. I'm sure there's a reason, I just can't imagine what it might be.

 

 


Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

[...] It's $129 for cMBP, $179 for 17" cMBP, $199 for rMBP. It would be nice if the rMBP was $129 too as that's not a huge expense.

 

That's actually better than I was imagining. Anything around a buck and a half is pretty easy to swallow. $200 for the Retina is right on the threshold of pain though.

post #80 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v View Post

Not as convenient as an internal battery and you're right, more expensive, but it's nice to have the option. In some circumstances the need will justify the cost and slight hassle. The ability to charge it from the car battery is really handy too. I've always wondered why Apple doesn't provide a cig lighter power adaptor. I'm sure there's a reason, I just can't imagine what it might be.


That's actually better than I was imagining. Anything around a buck and a half is pretty easy to swallow. $200 for the Retina is right on the threshold of pain though.

Is the wattage coming from the cig lighter port powerful enough to charge the battery effectively? I've had some of the smaller, inverters that say something 150W that didn't work with my MBP, especially when I was using it because the rating is for peak, not sustained... or it was just crappy.

The airplane power options are a direct DC current where as the ones I've used via the cig lighter were always the wasteful DC to AC which again gets inverted to DC in the MBP's PSU. I assumed the amperage (or whatever it is - clearly not an electrician) wasn't high enough to power the MBP. I'd think the car battery would be fine but you'd need a more power line between the battery and device, right?



PS: It doesn't look like Apple sells their airplane power cable any longer.
Edited by SolipsismX - 5/25/13 at 9:27am

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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