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Chicago Sun-Times axes all staff photographers, offers reporters 'iPhoneography training' - Page 5

post #161 of 184
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

...  fired its entire pool of 28 photographers on Friday, and plans to source future graphics from reporters who will be trained to capture print-worthy images with their iPhones.

 

Penny wise, pound foolish.  You can tell reporters to take photos, but that doesn't make them photographers.  Some things you're either born with or born without.  I'm about 99.5% certain that the photographic "eye," that aesthetic talent, is something you can't completely learn.  You can study it, you can learn all about composition and contrast, but your photos will still look like snapshots.  

 

And it's not just technical.  Good photographers can anticipate the peak moment and capture it.  Which requires talent *and* experience.  Good luck with all that.

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post #162 of 184
What's going to happen to Jimmy Olsen??
post #163 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

 

Penny wise, pound foolish.  You can tell reporters to take photos, but that doesn't make them photographers. ...  Good photographers can anticipate the peak moment and capture it.  Which requires talent *and* experience.  Good luck with all that.

 

It's easy to blame the newspaper, but of course the real blame goes to US, who insist on consuming "free" news, and won't shell out a measly buck a week to pay for the reporting and photos.  

 

Oh, you think a buck a week is going to be easy to collect?  Tell that to all the public radio stations who are begging listeners to offer up a mere $50 a year for "membership".  My local station recently had to fire its entire meteorology department. 

 

The notion that internet sites can be sustainably supported by advertising seems to be proving false... the news is regurgitant, the photos are amateurish, the analysis is horse****, and eventually people will stop reading it entirely--thus the ad support will vanish.  And society will be left with news reporting not much better than in the European dark ages.  This leads to ignorance, and is exactly what the political and corporate titans want--an ignorant populace is so much easier to control than an enlightened one.  We see it already, with the rise in religiosity.

post #164 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Cotsis View Post

It is just part of the pathetic and inexorable dumbing down of all graphical standards worldwide, and nobody cares.

Things just change in life.

 

There will still be people out there taking great photos with dedicated cameras, such as DSLRs.

 

Speaking up for the iPhone, it can come in really handy (fast) when you need a quick shot and the other person is still pulling out and configuring their DLSR.

 

P

post #165 of 184
Well, no more pulitzer's for photography for the Sun Times. There are obviously problems with traditional print media competing, but I'm not sure this is the solution.
post #166 of 184

If doing things more poorly and cheaper was going to save newspapers ... they would be saved already.

 

I can see the meeting from which this came. All the faux images on the powerpoint.

 

As usual, Apple chuggs along without any concept other than power or money.

 

Just like Steve Jobs doing a pitch. Control the image. Content ... with the right package no one will notice. Everyone who can afford Apple is a genious.

 

And to the person who said it was too bad. And then noted that android wasn't mentioned ... this si an apple promo.

post #167 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

 

Speaking up for the iPhone, it can come in really handy (fast) when you need a quick shot and the other person is still pulling out and configuring their DLSR.

 

P

 

That's not how a photojournalist gig works.  You show up (often with two cameras around your neck) and you are ready to shoot from the second you set foot there.   Once you are there you are ready to shoot.   There isn't any time consuming DSLR configuration.  That's not a factor.  I guarantee a guy with a phone is not going to beat any photojournalist in a quickdraw contest.

 

Which reminds me of another thing:  When I've had gigs shooting an event it's been continuous burst mode all the time.   You shoot single mode with a phone and you get half the shots with eyes closed on a blink or some other dealkiller.  If you don't take a lot of shots you're not covered, and if you can't get 30 shots in in that moment that only lasts 30 seconds you might not have any keepers.

 

Another thing is that those long zoom lenses aren't just for show.  If a close-up of the newsmaker is the only thing they can use but you can't get within fifty feet of them a phone won't cut it.  The lens adapters I've currently seen don't give anything near a gamechanging zoom except for the ones that are so bulky (and not easily swappable) that they defeat the purpose of not having brought a camera.   Are they really going to be equipping all of these reporters in the field with suitable expensive iPhone lens adapters so they won't have to be standing 5 feet in front of the subject?

post #168 of 184
Originally Posted by splintercottage View Post

As usual, Apple chuggs along without any concept other than power or money.

 

Thanks for inserting this pointless lie.

post #169 of 184
I think it's really about Sun Times just wanting to shave off some salaries. Any good photographer should be able to take a good pic with an iPhone (they don't need a class for that - ridiculous). If it wasn't about salaries then why didn't they just give them iPhones to use if they really wanted them to use iPhones? Of course it makes no sense since the photographers already have their own DSLRs. So, it has to be about cutting salaries/costs.
post #170 of 184
@apple ][
I feel your pain, I'm always hounding my own wife for taking videos of our kids that way. How the heck am I supposed to make those videos into a compilation for a DVD or mp4 when you do that?!! What's worse is I deal with people at work who took video that way & then later ask our IT department to help them convert it to horizontal. Pfuahahaha!!!! Sorry, you're hosed.
post #171 of 184

bah!


Edited by owep - 6/2/13 at 10:34pm
post #172 of 184

While the press vigorously defends itself from the encroachment of the government on it's rights, the press ravenously eats it's own; behind a dumpster in a side alley. This is shortsighted and another example of 21st century group-think. Instead of using photographers to enhance their content across ALL media, they fire 'em all… Hello, DSLR's shoot video and hi res stills for tv, web, mobile.. fired 'em, instead of saying "go get pix and video that'll pull people in and distinguish us from the crowd." Bah! they're "training" writers to use iphone cameras. Foolish cost cutting = suicide. Photographers are NOT anachronistic. 

post #173 of 184
I shoot. Sometimes pro, usually as a hobby, almost never for news outlets. While I suppose you can get away with this, I think replacing real photogs with iPhones will prove to be a huge mistake.

I doubt they'll replace sports, but even for traditional stories a pro photog with a decent set of lenses simply can't be replaced with an iPhone. You pack better lenses into a connected device, great, you're good to go, but it'll be too big to be your phone. Probably the idea is to just get the story and photos done fast from one device. Might work, quality will drop though. It's disgusting one way or the other.
post #174 of 184

The photographers could get revenge by starting their own site that has just pictures for new stories and no words. It would probably be more popular these days.

post #175 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

The photographers could get revenge by starting their own site that has just pictures for new stories and no words. It would probably be more popular these days.

Something like this, which I like, also with the (discontinued) iPad app:

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/
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post #176 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by owep View Post

While the press vigorously defends itself from the encroachment of the government on it's rights, the press ravenously eats it's own; behind a dumpster in a side alley. This is shortsighted and another example of 21st century group-think. Instead of using photographers to enhance their content across ALL media, they fire 'em all… Hello, DSLR's shoot video and hi res stills for tv, web, mobile.. fired 'em, instead of saying "go get pix and video that'll pull people in and distinguish us from the crowd." Bah! they're "training" writers to use iphone cameras. Foolish cost cutting = suicide. Photographers are NOT anachronistic. 

 

News 2013 style by the people for the people.

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post #177 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennettvista View Post

Next we fire all the reporters and let the public write the stories. We unfortunately will become just a nation of bloggers as Jobs feared. I'm starting to tire of the digital world.

So your post here is an aberration?

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post #178 of 184

Not only are we getting crap reporting these days, not they going to let those same crap reports trying and figure out how to take a picture with an iphone. I guess they will also being sending in their news reports via their iphones as well.

 

I sorry a large majority of people have no clue how to take pictures and even taking a picture which is relevant to want is going on. Case and point we had a small experimental plane crash where I live, the plan hit high tension power line and almost hit cars on the road before chasing and the local paper printed on stupid picture some person happen to take of the tail of the plain in the power line, online they posted some kid's phone video of him driving down the road taking about what he thought happen. There was not single profession picture of plane or fire cased by the plane.

 

I think you all will agree there are pictures which are done by professional which still are in everyone minds of important event in history. These pictures would not exist if it was not for the profession not so stupid person running around with a camera phone.

post #179 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

Not only are we getting crap reporting these days, not they going to let those same crap reports trying and figure out how to take a picture with an iphone. I guess they will also being sending in their news reports via their iphones as well.

I sorry a large majority of people have no clue how to take pictures and even taking a picture which is relevant to want is going on. Case and point we had a small experimental plane crash where I live, the plan hit high tension power line and almost hit cars on the road before chasing and the local paper printed on stupid picture some person happen to take of the tail of the plain in the power line, online they posted some kid's phone video of him driving down the road taking about what he thought happen. There was not single profession picture of plane or fire cased by the plane.

I think you all will agree there are pictures which are done by professional which still are in everyone minds of important event in history. These pictures would not exist if it was not for the profession not so stupid person running around with a camera phone.

Considering newspapers are going the way of the dodo, perhaps these iPhotojournalists will apply for other jobs as they run around Chicago.

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post #180 of 184

Power Tools in the hands of babes does not make them master craftsman.
 

post #181 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by icoco3 View Post

Power Tools in the hands of babes does not make them master craftsman.
 

 

True, but most consumers have a sense of taste and style that has been fed by Facebook, Flickr and TMZ.

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post #182 of 184
As a photographer, this is not surprising. They may have fired, meaning taken them off the payroll, but they may all become independent contractors. This is one of the main reasons I stay(ed) away from Weddings, and report photography when the digital cameras first came about in the early 2000s. As for being able to do both, my business partner is also a news guy, and he can record the interviews, while taking photos with his iPhone, but he does have the advantage of being a photographer. As for sports, as I understand it, most photogs are independents.
post #183 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post

That is actually a possible death sentence for the publication. Freelancers in any industry charge more for the same amount of work to make up for the taxes, inconsistency, etc. If they aren't getting that, it decreases the quality of talent that they attract. There's a false notion that people are lined up, yet if it was the case, these companies would have made a similar culling years ago.



While I completely disagree with the CST decision to dump those photogs and I also agree that in general, freelancers have to charge more, unfortunately there will be a bunch of amateurs with equipment who will work for next to nothing, especially to cover sports and entertainment events or just to get hold of a press pass.

I produce web sites for musicians and do a lot of photography. We get tons of requests from "photographers" who want to shoot the shows (for free).

My father was a pro photographer and he's probably turning over in his grave. Except for the very top photogs- the ones who do magazine covers or ads for big companies, no one wants to pay them anymore.
post #184 of 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

While I completely disagree with the CST decision to dump those photogs and I also agree that in general, freelancers have to charge more, unfortunately there will be a bunch of amateurs with equipment who will work for next to nothing, especially to cover sports and entertainment events or just to get hold of a press pass.

I produce web sites for musicians and do a lot of photography. We get tons of requests from "photographers" who want to shoot the shows (for free).

My father was a pro photographer and he's probably turning over in his grave. Except for the very top photogs- the ones who do magazine covers or ads for big companies, no one wants to pay them anymore.

Photos for straight information will be fine. Some of the reporters will have an eye for photography, most won't. Papers are bleeding money and must adapt or die sooner, rather than later.

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