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Apple throws out the rulebook for its unique next-gen Mac Pro - Page 30

post #1161 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post
 


Typically LG makes IPS when it comes to desktop displays intended for general use. I know Panasonic does make some IPS panels, but they seem to be relegated to highly specialized use cases. Mitsubishi and Hitachi ceased doing so long ago. Samsung comes up more in the notebooks and mobile devices. I was surprised to see their name come up at times with imacs, as IPS falls outside of their general territory. Samsung may have won the battle if PVA didn't have the gamma shift issues relative to viewing angle a few years ago. It lacked quite a few other problems.

Samsung and LG are two of Apple's panel suppliers.  According to Wikipedia, which I know isn't always 100% reliable, but they have LG, Samsung, Sony Pro, Japan Display, Panasonic, and AU Optronics that mfg IPS based screens.  Which companies that mfg screens for Apple have included, that I'm aware of, LG, Samsung, and Panasonic, it's just a matter of who is supplying which screens for which products.

post #1162 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

Samsung and LG are two of Apple's panel suppliers.  According to Wikipedia, which I know isn't always 100% reliable, but they have LG, Samsung, Sony Pro, Japan Display, Panasonic, and AU Optronics that mfg IPS based screens.  Which companies that mfg screens for Apple have included, that I'm aware of, LG, Samsung, and Panasonic, it's just a matter of who is supplying which screens for which products.


Yeah I forgot about AU Optronics. Note that I was going over  those used in desktop displays for anything other than highly specialized use. I can't think of a desktop display over 21" that uses a panel by Sony or Panasonic. Both seem to deal with broadcast displays only. There might be other circumstances such as those designed for medical use. Both make televisions and may or may note make the panels for their own televisions. They don't seem like realistic suppliers for Apple, even though they have some IPS experience. A few years ago it was a bit different. You had a greater number of display and panel brands in use. Falling prices/margins forced many of them out around 2008-2010.

post #1163 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v View Post

Imagine the Lennon-esque PR shock wave it would produce if Tim Cook stepped outside and announced "Okay, we've now got more money than Europe and Asia combined so we're gonna ease up and lower the price of everything we sell." I'm definitely no economist and there are at least a million ways I could be wrong, but something in my gut insists it would be a better approach than the current strategy of making buyers choose between a Mac or food! 1smile.gif
[/COLOR]

I've always felt they should bring prices down a notch to boost marketshare but I don't think the numbers work out. If their gross margins are 30%, a $1999 rMBP makes about $600 gross profit. If they drop the price to $1699, they have to sell double the amount to make the same profit. Apple sells about 1/3 the volume of the biggest PC manufacturers that are selling way down to $500. There's no way they'd double their volume at $1699 so all that happens is they lose money. If they made a $1299 15" Air, that could help boost volumes but it drives people down from the Pro, which lowers their average selling prices.

I wish there was a way for them to increase Mac volume to allow them to get the prices down but the market as a whole isn't upgrading often enough. The increased prices don't help that trend of course so the problem worsens. I personally think it's crazy to have an entry 15" laptop (the most popular form factor) starting at $1999. I think there should be a dual-core model, possibly with 4GB RAM and starting more like $1499. I don't like the idea of it having 128GB but some people can get by with that amount.
post #1164 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post
 


Yeah I forgot about AU Optronics. Note that I was going over  those used in desktop displays for anything other than highly specialized use. I can't think of a desktop display over 21" that uses a panel by Sony or Panasonic. Both seem to deal with broadcast displays only. There might be other circumstances such as those designed for medical use. Both make televisions and may or may note make the panels for their own televisions. They don't seem like realistic suppliers for Apple, even though they have some IPS experience. A few years ago it was a bit different. You had a greater number of display and panel brands in use. Falling prices/margins forced many of them out around 2008-2010.

Yeah, I know.  I read an article I believe it was last year that Panasonic was going to start focusing more on the mobile device market, whether or not that has happened yet.  Unfortunately, it's not listed in the About this Mac s/w which panels they use.  It would be nice, but obviously, it's not that important as long as it works and Apple has replacement parts on hand.

 

I took a 3 day IBM training course and it was hilarious when one of the IBM instructors was giving a hypothetical customer presentation on their solution and when the discussion got technical, he said "But you don't need to know that" insinuating that what technology they use wasn't important to the customer as the actual solution was what was the key factor about the presentation.   We all cracked up and I almost fell out of my chair.  It kind of reminds me how consumers get wrapped up with technical information, but they forget that it's the solution that is what is key.  Sometimes, I really don't give a rat's ass about what technology they are using, if it's fast, reliable, and does what I need to have done, I sometimes could care less what's inside the box.  Because in the long run, whatever they use now will most likely change a few years from now, so all of the information about what technology is used today becomes trivial.

post #1165 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldCodger73 View Post
 

 

Wow, a post that's actually on topic in this thread!

 

Had to try!

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #1166 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I wish there was a way for them to increase Mac volume to allow them to get the prices down but the market as a whole isn't upgrading often enough.

 

Do you think Apple is a victim of their own success. Their products last a long time, CPU's in their desktops also remain fast for a very long time do to OSX , heck most users can get by just fine with a 5 -7 year old iMac with a Core2Duo chip. My husbands sister still uses a Titanium series for goodnesss sake and it's still very usable, though it's been upgraded a little, G4 1Ghz, 2GB RAM and a KingSpec 64 GB PATA SSD. Anyway it's still a very fast machine, I opened up 12 movies and played them all at once, not one frame dropped. I told her that if she ever get's another computer I want it as it was one of my favorite mac portables after the Powerbook 2400c that I h,ave owned and hers is spotless, looks like the day she bought it, I think December 14th 2002 is what her receipt said. Heck the DVD still works, I forgot they made that weird noise when ejecting a disk

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1167 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Do you think Apple is a victim of their own success. Their products last a long time, CPU's in their desktops also remain fast for a very long time do to OSX , heck most users can get by just fine with a 5 -7 year old iMac with a Core2Duo chip.

I do think that, especially with the iOS devices. They make such high quality products from the outset now that people can happily hang onto them for years. They at least seal in components that will always go bad eventually to force a repair or upgrade - batteries and SSD will always fail eventually and the display has a good chance of going bad. But this is nothing like years ago when people had to deal with MHz clock speeds and KB of RAM and performance upgrades were driving sales.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Heck the DVD still works, I forgot they made that weird noise when ejecting a disk

I'm glad they've removed those from newer models, that noise was weird and it makes people think the machine is broken because it does it when rebooting and no disk is in. Now with SSDs, they are pretty much silent. I'd guess the next step for the Air is to go passively cooled like the iPad.
post #1168 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
 Air is to go passively cooled like the iPad.

 

That will still be a while, especially if you get the i7 CPU like I did. When Apple goes all ARM we will start to see passive cooling. Intel chips just run too hot, I actually wouldn't mind if Apple used a Quad core Atom CPU for an ultra long battery version of the Air. The one thing I want more then passive cooling though is a battery slice that can attach itself to the bottom. I have one for my Thinkpad X220, when used with the 9 cell battery I easily get 23 hours. I was in Paris last year for 4 days, I charged the laptop once before leaving and when I got home I still had like 7 hours left. Battery slices are easy to implement and wouldn't hinder the look of the unit. I just don't understand Apples aversion to laptop accessories like; docking stations, removable batteries, battery slices, etc.  I really like the 11" Air and I am defiantly done with laptops that are any larger. Actually, I already made a deal with myself, if I survive I'm going simplfy my computer life, iPad Air, Surface Pro 2 for everyday computing needs, a Mac Mini for the family rooms TV and a Samsung Chromebox i5 for the TV in my room. I will continue with my super server that is in my bomb shelter, that will never change, I love that Sun, sounds like a jet taking off when you first turn it on but still one of the coolest pieces of hardware I have owned in recent times.

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1169 of 1290
Sometimes the technology is more important than the solution. This is especially the case if it is a solution that needs to be maintained for decades.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Yeah, I know.  I read an article I believe it was last year that Panasonic was going to start focusing more on the mobile device market, whether or not that has happened yet.  Unfortunately, it's not listed in the About this Mac s/w which panels they use.  It would be nice, but obviously, it's not that important as long as it works and Apple has replacement parts on hand.

I took a 3 day IBM training course and it was hilarious when one of the IBM instructors was giving a hypothetical customer presentation on their solution and when the discussion got technical, he said "But you don't need to know that" insinuating that what technology they use wasn't important to the customer as the actual solution was what was the key factor about the presentation.   We all cracked up and I almost fell out of my chair.  It kind of reminds me how consumers get wrapped up with technical information, but they forget that it's the solution that is what is key.  Sometimes, I really don't give a rat's ass about what technology they are using, if it's fast, reliable, and does what I need to have done, I sometimes could care less what's inside the box.  Because in the long run, whatever they use now will most likely change a few years from now, so all of the information about what technology is used today becomes trivial.
post #1170 of 1290
It isn't just Apple, the industry has hit a certain maturity where more performance isn't a huge requirement for the average user. This is more a function of software than anything. To drive PC sales you need to put more intelligence into software. Here I mean artificial intelligence and other techniques that would leverage higher performance machines.

The problem Apple has is that they have no machines acceptable to industry except in some situations the Mini. Apple could easily increase sales to the business world with machine suitable for that world. Apple sales could improve simply by offering hardware into markets the don't currently have a play.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I wish there was a way for them to increase Mac volume to allow them to get the prices down but the market as a whole isn't upgrading often enough.

Do you think Apple is a victim of their own success. Their products last a long time, CPU's in their desktops also remain fast for a very long time do to OSX , heck most users can get by just fine with a 5 -7 year old iMac with a Core2Duo chip. My husbands sister still uses a Titanium series for goodnesss sake and it's still very usable, though it's been upgraded a little, G4 1Ghz, 2GB RAM and a KingSpec 64 GB PATA SSD. Anyway it's still a very fast machine, I opened up 12 movies and played them all at once, not one frame dropped. I told her that if she ever get's another computer I want it as it was one of my favorite mac portables after the Powerbook 2400c that I h,ave owned and hers is spotless, looks like the day she bought it, I think December 14th 2002 is what her receipt said. Heck the DVD still works, I forgot they made that weird noise when ejecting a disk
post #1171 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


I do think that, especially with the iOS devices.
They haven't had any issues selling iOS devices though.
Quote:
They make such high quality products from the outset now that people can happily hang onto them for years. They at least seal in components that will always go bad eventually to force a repair or upgrade - batteries and SSD will always fail eventually and the display has a good chance of going bad. But this is nothing like years ago when people had to deal with MHz clock speeds and KB of RAM and performance upgrades were driving sales.
Performance is still an issue with iOS devices. With Macs it is a different story though which is usually a function of the user and his needs.


I'm glad they've removed those from newer models, that noise was weird and it makes people think the machine is broken because it does it when rebooting and no disk is in. Now with SSDs, they are pretty much silent. I'd guess the next step for the Air is to go passively cooled like the iPad.[/quote]

Sometimes the optical drives do come in handy. I've been sicker than an old dog after a road kill dinner the last few days, it was nice to pop in a DVD into the MBP to passes the time. As nice as downloads are or streaming for that matter, not everything can be had online. I know the net is the way forward but I will most likely be buying an external drive for my next machine.
post #1172 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

 Air is to go passively cooled like the iPad.

That will still be a while, especially if you get the i7 CPU like I did. When Apple goes all ARM we will start to see passive cooling. Intel chips just run too hot, I actually wouldn't mind if Apple used a Quad core Atom CPU for an ultra long battery version of the Air.
That is the case today, but things could change radically if Intel makes it to 14 nm and maybe a step beyond that. Depending upon the chip Intel has either lowered power with Haswell or dramatically increased GPU performance to the point that Intel actually has high performance GPUs that are effectively very low power.

However I'm not sure extremely long run times are Apples primary goals. Many users would love to see improved performance out of the AIRs the next go around. Just think about an Iris level GPU in an AIR or quad cores without a clock rust compromise.
Quote:
The one thing I want more then passive cooling though is a battery slice that can attach itself to the bottom. I have one for my Thinkpad X220, when used with the 9 cell battery I easily get 23 hours. I was in Paris last year for 4 days,
Never been to France.

In any event what is the point if the unit runs for more than 12 hours at a time? You can't use the machine for 24 hours straight. Unless you spend your nights in the gutter, the hotel/motel/resort should have an outlet to recharge from. The only time I can see this being really useful if you are off grid for days at a time, maybe doing search & rescue after a disaster.
Quote:
I charged the laptop once before leaving and when I got home I still had like 7 hours left. Battery slices are easy to implement and wouldn't hinder the look of the unit. I just don't understand Apples aversion to laptop accessories like; docking stations, removable batteries, battery slices, etc. 
If you have battery technology that revives the need for constant replacement the smart thing to do in my estimation is to install it as securely as possible. This is part of the reason Apple went with internal batteries, the other is that it affords them the opportunity to allocate more volume to the battery. Even after all of these years the AIR is still a hard machine to match in the PC world.

As for docking stations Apple has the ultimate docking solution in Thunderbolt. Of course I don't know the internal decision making at Apple but I have to believe that docking was the primary reason to support TB at Apple. Everything else that goes along with TB is just gravy. As a docking solution TB is relatively cheap too.
Quote:
I really like the 11" Air and I am defiantly done with laptops that are any larger. 
So how old are you right now. It won't be long until a big screen with nice fat text will be very appealing.
Quote:
Actually, I already made a deal with myself, if I survive I'm going simplfy my computer life, iPad Air, Surface Pro 2 for everyday computing needs,
Of all the things MicroSoft related why would you even consider a Surface Pro?
Quote:
a Mac Mini for the family rooms TV and a Samsung Chromebox i5 for the TV in my room. I will continue with my super server that is in my bomb shelter, that will never change,
You have a bomb shelter? You would be right at home in America, you just need to get an AR, a years worth of food, water sanitation hardware and a generator. We will have to nickname you prepper Relic
Quote:
I love that Sun, sounds like a jet taking off when you first turn it on but still one of the coolest pieces of hardware I have owned in recent times.
So do you ever see displacing it with a Mac Pro? A Pro should run circles around that old Sun.
post #1173 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Of all the things MicroSoft related why would you even consider a Surface Pro?
You have a bomb shelter? You would be right at home in America, you just need to get an AR, a years worth of food, water sanitation hardware and a generator. We will have to nickname you prepper Relic

So do you ever see displacing it with a Mac Pro? A Pro should run circles around that old Sun.

I like the Surface Pro, I currently have a Thinkpad Tablet 2 and I adore it, I also really enjoy Windows 8 as a tablet OS, just me though. I like to run Photoshop on tablet and other desktop apps but I'm really into making music and I would love to use Abelton Live on the Surface Pro, with 8GB, i5 it's certaintly powerful enough to run it.

 

It's a Swiss law that every building must have a bomb shelter, it has been this way since Word War II, they are outfitted with air scrubbers and generators. We of course just use them as storage, when we had our house built I made sure to run a steel tube through the floor up to the main house so I could pass cables down it. I had the foresight of using it as a server room.

 

I wouldn't use a Mac Pro as a server but I would love to have one none the less. I'm going to wait for the reviews though, as you know from my posts I have built a theatrical workstation using Amazon as the parts provider, for the same price as the 4,000 dollar Mac Pro I can have a dual CPU machine with the same Xeon model, more memory, faster graphic cards with more VRAM. This is just me putting together parts though, again I will have to see if the Mac Pro is worth the money. I still like my server, it's a SunFire X4170 (2)Intel Xeon 5570 8 cores, 16 total if you count both, 96gb ram(I bought it with 48GB but found an additional 48GB from eBay, paid 80 dollars for it), 8 X 72GB HD's(came with 4 but I found 4 more new,still in sealed plastic at a local auction, original SUN HD's, well their not Sun but they have it stamped on each HD, paid 20 CHF for each). Total cost of the server with upgrades 860CHF, 940 USD. It's lowed thoughike a jet fighter when starting up.

 

 

We have small doors that connect to an underground passage way. The passage ways go all threw out my city so we could still contact each other, trade, share food during a crisis.

 

 

 

Yeah, we Swiss are a little over prepared and a little crazy.


Edited by Relic - 11/14/13 at 4:49am
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1174 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

I like the Surface Pro, I currently have a Thinkpad Tablet 2 and I adore it, I also really enjoy Windows 8 as a tablet OS, just me though. I like to run Photoshop on tablet and other desktop apps but I'm really into making music and I would love to use Abelton Live on the Surface Pro, with 8GB, i5 it's certaintly powerful enough to run it.

 

It's a Swiss law that every building must have a bomb shelter, it has been this way since Word War II, they are outfitted with air scrubbers and generators. We of course just use them as storage, when we had our house built I made sure to run a steel tube through the floor up to the main house so I could pass cables down it. I had the foresight of using it as a server room.

 

I wouldn't use a Mac Pro as a server but I would love to have one none the less. I'm going to wait for the reviews though, as you know from my posts I have built a theretical workstation using Amazon as the parts provider, for the same price as the 4,000 dollar Mac Pro I can have a dual CPU machine with the same Xeon model, more memory, faster graphic cards with more VRAM. This is just me putting together parts though, again I will have to see if the Mac Pro is worth the money. I still like my server, it's a SunFire X4170 (2)Intel Xeon 5570 8 cores, 16 total if you count both, 96gb ram(I bought it with 48GB but found an additional 48GB from eBay, paid 80 dollars for it), 8 X 72GB HD's(came with 4 but I found 4 more new,still in sealed plastic at a local auction, original SUN HD's, well their not Sun but they have it stamped on each HD, paid 20 CHF for each). Total cost of the server with upgrades 860CHF, 940 USD.

 

 

 

You seem to collect a lot of outdated products in your arsenal of computers. Why do you do that?  I don't know how anyone can collect as much as you and actually use any of it for something productive.  What's your goal?  Collecting one of everything?

post #1175 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


The problem Apple has is that they have no machines acceptable to industry except in some situations the Mini. Apple could easily increase sales to the business world with machine suitable for that world. Apple sales could improve simply by offering hardware into markets the don't currently have a play.

We have thousands of macs deployed in our enterprise. Of those probably a third are iMacs. In doctors offices I see a lot of iMacs. In schools I see lots of iMacs. There's no really big downside to iMacs for enterprise.
post #1176 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

 

You seem to collect a lot of outdated products in your arsenal of computers. Why do you do that?  I don't know how anyone can collect as much as you and actually use any of it for something productive.  What's your goal?  Collecting one of everything?

That Sun server is still used by many companies, it's also very powerful but yeah I'm a collector of old tech. Not sure what my husband is going to do with it all when I'm gone. I have had interest in my Nokia collection with display by Nokia themselves, so that will probably go back to them. The computers will most likely just be put up on auction. 

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1177 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


In any event what is the point if the unit runs for more than 12 hours at a time? You can't use the machine for 24 hours straight. Unless you spend your nights in the gutter, the hotel/motel/resort should have an outlet to recharge from. The only time I can see this being really useful if you are off grid for days at a time, maybe doing search & rescue after a disaster.

Flight time from DC to Sydney is 20 hours and if you fly coach power is harder to come by. DC to Thailand is a long assed time too. Even with an hour or two layover you can't recharge enough to matter.

On field tests we'd be out there all day and when you're doing real work the battery doesn't anything close to 8 hours or whatever. That's for 50% backlight (which is too dim for outside even in the shade) and light web usage.

I used external battery packs and sometimes a generator. There are many real world scenarios that don't involve disasters where it is more convenient/effective to use replaceable internal batteries than externals (less cables to snag...even with MagSafe it's annoying...especially on a plane) or a generator.

Trains are much more civilized and there's often power a plenty. Well modern ones in developed countries anyway.
post #1178 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post


We have thousands of macs deployed in our enterprise. Of those probably a third are iMacs. In doctors offices I see a lot of iMacs. In schools I see lots of iMacs. There's no really big downside to iMacs for enterprise.

 

I've seen lot's of iMacs in office buildings, no Mac Minis or Mac Pro's as of yet but defiantly the iMac. All the doctors here in the hospital I'm AT have iPads, they use a really neat patient care system but they all agree that not having access to a file-manager sucks. I showed my doctor how to use Dropbox for his loose files as he called them. The doctors are currently using email to store their files in, they assign a patient number to the email so they can search and find it faster. Apple should address this, when you have hundreds of scans, documents, notes, going to a specific program for each of those items is a pain, patient has letters from his house doctor, where are those, I think they are in Pages, no, oh Document Scanner, much easier to have a folder for each patient with all files in it. Cloud storage helps though and I'm amazed that their using eMail as a file-manager. This is a big reason why UBS, the bank I worked for didn't go with the iPad but the Thinkpad Tablet 2. Easier to find your files, mount server storage, even cloud storage. When you can access all of your files from one program, the intuitive UI kind of takes a back seat to being productive.

 

I don't know why I went off on a tangent there, I just see a real world problem in this hospital that can be addressed with one app. A filemanager app that doesn't need access to the entire sysrtem directory. Then be able to mount server storage, all of your cloud storage accounts in one program. These are available for Andoird and Windows 8. Check out the app FX FileManager to know what I am refering to.

 

 

Cool I think I just found one for them called iTransfer, does anyone else no of a better one. Maybe one that offers more then just Dropbox linking.


Edited by Relic - 11/14/13 at 5:31am
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1179 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

That Sun server is still used by many companies, it's also very powerful but yeah I'm a collector of old tech. Not sure what my husband is going to do with it all when I'm gone. I have had interest in my Nokia collection with display by Nokia themselves, so that will probably go back to them. The computers will most likely just be put up on auction. 

 

Used computers at an auction get pennies on the dollar, like most undesirable stuff people collect unless there is something special about it, which there usually isn't.  Otherwise, they should be recycled.  Your husband will probably have everything recycled unless there is something in your will that explains what you want to have done with them.  Better get your attorney to start figuring that out.  Might as well be prepared.   I've had friends in the past that deal with appraising art/collectables at estates.  The art appraiser I used to hang out with told me they have different appraisal prices.  One for insurance purposes which are high since you are looking at replacement value of a piece of art/collectable, another for market value if you were going to sell it, and then for an estate value since estates are using priced to move quickly and usually to other dealers that store it in the hopes of finding a buyer.  Unless there is something that will get big bucks at an auction (some famous painting or highly desirable collectable), they don't usually get top dollars when sold at a typical estate sale.  Because it depends on the item, and what auction it's sold at, and most auctions attract dealers that don't want to pay much for it, unless they already have a buyer set up to pay market value for it. But computers, generally don't get much money to even make it worth while, if they are past a certain age, it's hard just getting a buyer for it.

post #1180 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Quote:
So do you ever see displacing it with a Mac Pro? A Pro should run circles around that old Sun.
I like the Surface Pro, I currently have a Thinkpad Tablet 2 and I adore it, I also really enjoy Windows 8 as a tablet OS, just me though. I like to run Photoshop on tablet and other desktop apps but I'm really into making music and I would love to use Abelton Live on the Surface Pro, with 8GB, i5 it's certaintly powerful enough to run it.
You seem to be extremely talented.

This does highlight one thing I continue to hate about Apple, that is shipping hardware with too little RAM. iPad could certainly use a RAM update, even 2GB would have dramatically expanded its capabilities.
Quote:
It's a Swiss law that every building must have a bomb shelter, it has been this way since Word War II, they are outfitted with air scrubbers and generators. We of course just use them as storage, when we had our house built I made sure to run a steel tube through the floor up to the main house so I could pass cables down it. I had the foresight of using it as a server room.
It probably isn't a bad idea. Let's face it modern houses aren't very resistant to natural disasters.
Quote:
I wouldn't use a Mac Pro as a server but I would love to have one none the less. I'm going to wait for the reviews though, as you know from my posts I have built a theatrical workstation using Amazon as the parts provider, for the same price as the 4,000 dollar Mac Pro I can have a dual CPU machine with the same Xeon model, more memory, faster graphic cards with more VRAM. This is just me putting together parts though, again I will have to see if the Mac Pro is worth the money. I still like my server, it's a SunFire X4170 (2)Intel Xeon 5570 8 cores, 16 total if you count both, 96gb ram(I bought it with 48GB but found an additional 48GB from eBay, paid 80 dollars for it), 8 X 72GB HD's(came with 4 but I found 4 more new,still in sealed plastic at a local auction, original SUN HD's, well their not Sun but they have it stamped on each HD, paid 20 CHF for each). Total cost of the server with upgrades 860CHF, 940 USD. It's lowed thoughike a jet fighter when starting up.
Funny but my interest seems to be leaning towards small embedded boards these days.
Quote:

We have small doors that connect to an underground passage way. The passage ways go all threw out my city so we could still contact each other, trade, share food during a crisis.
Wow another way for teenage lovers to escape the house unnoticed! I may be older than the hills but that is the very first thing that popped into my mind.
Quote:

Yeah, we Swiss are a little over prepared and a little crazy.

Sadly most of America isn't even close to prepared. Houses and schools in known danger areas are still built without storm shelters much less bomb shelters. For all particle purposes they are the same thing.

In any event I want to thank you for the pictures!😘😘😘🍧🍧. Obviously we are off topic here but you have mentioned this more than once and as such I'm curious.
post #1181 of 1290

  Quote:

Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

Yeah, I know.  I read an article I believe it was last year that Panasonic was going to start focusing more on the mobile device market, whether or not that has happened yet.  Unfortunately, it's not listed in the About this Mac s/w which panels they use.  It would be nice, but obviously, it's not that important as long as it works and Apple has replacement parts on hand.

 

I took a 3 day IBM training course and it was hilarious when one of the IBM instructors was giving a hypothetical customer presentation on their solution and when the discussion got technical, he said "But you don't need to know that" insinuating that what technology they use wasn't important to the customer as the actual solution was what was the key factor about the presentation.   We all cracked up and I almost fell out of my chair.  It kind of reminds me how consumers get wrapped up with technical information, but they forget that it's the solution that is what is key.  Sometimes, I really don't give a rat's ass about what technology they are using, if it's fast, reliable, and does what I need to have done, I sometimes could care less what's inside the box.  Because in the long run, whatever they use now will most likely change a few years from now, so all of the information about what technology is used today becomes trivial.

 

I'm not that hung up on what technology goes into the thing unless I'm looking for known problems. If I can find consistent problems with a given panel across its use by multiple brands, I will try to avoid it. As you pointed out earlier, you can't see whether the oem cheaped out on power supply or transistor parts needed to support the panel. There are a couple brands that used to do far better anti-glare screen treatments than LG, but they were quite expensive. Hitachi was one of them. You didn't get the typical sparkle issue. You never had the feeling of pulsating whites due to noisy transistors. This held up across all implementations that I could find. Given that desktop displays are mostly commoditized parts at this point, I pay more attention to the individual reviews by model.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

 

You seem to collect a lot of outdated products in your arsenal of computers. Why do you do that?  I don't know how anyone can collect as much as you and actually use any of it for something productive.  What's your goal?  Collecting one of everything?

 


You never saw my old collection of retired power edge servers and an IBM era thinkpad. I used the servers to experiment with ESXi back when I was learning to use it. I retired them when they would no longer run the latest version. The thinkpad was just because the IBM era ones were cool. They were practically indestructible. I didn't buy them out of auction. They were from a couple tech consultant friends and needed a few repairs. One had 2 dying SCSI drives. The other had a dead (I want to say) bios battery, needed a firmware update, and a couple other things. They weren't worth that much, but I wasn't going to spend a lot on something just used for experiments which had nothing to do with my job at that time.

 

Edit: This was quite a while ago. I misquoted the software. It wasn't called ESXi then. It was some variant of ESX 2. The machines were maybe 5 years old.


Edited by hmm - 11/14/13 at 11:43am
post #1182 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Wow another way for teenage lovers to escape the house unnoticed! I may be older than the hills but that is the very first thing that popped into my mind.
 

I would like to say that our children are a lot more responsible than other children of the world but sadly kids will be kids. That's why these passage-ways are equipped with alarms, heat sensors and in some cities infrared cameras. You are also responsible for keeping your trap door locked as keeping it open it's pretty much like a having your front door unlocked. It still happens though every once a while, there was a story in one of the newspapers we have here called 20 Minutes. It showed that someone was using one of these tunnels as a midnight techno club, he worked for the city and had access to them.

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1183 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post
 

  Quote:

 

I'm not that hung up on what technology goes into the thing unless I'm looking for known problems. If I can find consistent problems with a given panel across its use by multiple brands, I will try to avoid it. As you pointed out earlier, you can't see whether the oem cheaped out on power supply or transistor parts needed to support the panel. There are a couple brands that used to do far better anti-glare screen treatments than LG, but they were quite expensive. Hitachi was one of them. You didn't get the typical sparkle issue. You never had the feeling of pulsating whites due to noisy transistors. This held up across all implementations that I could find. Given that desktop displays are mostly commoditized parts at this point, I pay more attention to the individual reviews by model.

 

 


You never saw my old collection of retired power edge servers and an IBM era thinkpad. I used the servers to experiment with ESXi back when I was learning to use it. I retired them when they would no longer run the latest version. The thinkpad was just because the IBM era ones were cool. They were practically indestructible. I didn't buy them out of auction. They were from a couple tech consultant friends and needed a few repairs. One had 2 dying SCSI drives. The other had a dead (I want to say) bios battery, needed a firmware update, and a couple other things. They weren't worth that much, but I wasn't going to spend a lot on something just used for experiments which had nothing to do with my job at that time.

 

Edit: This was quite a while ago. I misquoted the software. It wasn't called ESXi then. It was some variant of ESX 2. The machines were maybe 5 years old.

I actually used a Think Pad when I worked for one reseller.  I didn't like that eraser thing in the middle of the keyboard and never liked using it, and the IBM mouse I was given to use SUCKED.  I don't know what it is, but I've never liked the way Windows mice and trackpads track.  Maybe it's the algorithms they use.  They always seem "jumpy" to me.

 

 I asked the In-house Warranty Service Techs what they thought of the various laptops we were selling and they actually didn't like fixing Thinkpads as much as they did the HPs.  From a Service Tech's perspective, they didn't like working on them for a variety of reasons. 

post #1184 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

I actually used a Think Pad when I worked for one reseller.  I didn't like that eraser thing in the middle of the keyboard and never liked using it, and the IBM mouse I was given to use SUCKED.  I don't know what it is, but I've never liked the way Windows mice and trackpads track.  Maybe it's the algorithms they use.  They always seem "jumpy" to me.

I thought they were cool, because they were durable. I agree regarding algorithms though. The older wacom intuos drivers for windows were pretty bad too. I've never been a fan of mice. For less precise tasks the trackpad is fine, and a mouse can't compare to a graphics table for anything of greater precision.

 

Quote:
 I asked the In-house Warranty Service Techs what they thought of the various laptops we were selling and they actually didn't like fixing Thinkpads as much as they did the HPs.  From a Service Tech's perspective, they didn't like working on them for a variety of reasons. 

I've never owned an HP to compare, although I have made basic repairs. In terms of notebooks I've owned a Powerbook G4 and a couple macbook pros as well as that thinkpad. I had a ton of problems with the G4. The thinkpad needed repairs at the time I received it. The drive had too many bad sectors and the optical drive needed to be replaced.

post #1185 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post
 

I thought they were cool, because they were durable. I agree regarding algorithms though. The older wacom intuos drivers for windows were pretty bad too. I've never been a fan of mice. For less precise tasks the trackpad is fine, and a mouse can't compare to a graphics table for anything of greater precision.

 

I've never owned an HP to compare, although I have made basic repairs. In terms of notebooks I've owned a Powerbook G4 and a couple macbook pros as well as that thinkpad. I had a ton of problems with the G4. The thinkpad needed repairs at the time I received it. The drive had too many bad sectors and the optical drive needed to be replaced.

Durable, yes, the IBM's were durable due to the plastic they used was pretty solid, Compaqs, were flimsy.  HP's were very durable as well (older ones.), but IBM did certain things that were kind of weird with their port replicators, some of them were kind of junky IMO.  Just about all of my customers that bought PC laptops back in the 90's bought port replicators and for some reason, they were always had to get and they would many times have problems. I did like the higher end Compaq port replicator where you could add internal cards, drives, etc., but it was a bloody fortune for that one.  But the biggest problem with PC laptops back then was they didn't have built in ethernet for the longest time and there were TONS of problems with using PC Card ethernet, etc. as drivers was a HUGE problem.  some model laptops from certain vendors just didn't work with certain PC Cards.  It was one of the most frustrating things since we had at least 6 or 7 popular brands of PC Cards we offered and we constantly had people complaining about certain cards not working with certain model PC laptops.  I think the worked most of that out, but I was one of the nightmares of PCs back in those days. Gladly, i don't lose any sleep over it now.   LOL...

post #1186 of 1290

For those that want a OS X touch screen?

Here's one dedicated for the DAW people.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GY5NiBpasj4

post #1187 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

I actually used a Think Pad when I worked for one reseller.  I didn't like that eraser thing in the middle of the keyboard and never liked using it, and the IBM mouse I was given to use SUCKED.  I don't know what it is, but I've never liked the way Windows mice and trackpads track.  Maybe it's the algorithms they use.  They always seem "jumpy" to me.
I see the track pad as perhaps the most glaring deficiency of any Windows laptop I come across lately. At least with the Dell and Lonovo machines the track pads are for the most part worthless when compared to what is in an Apple notebook. You see most users of these windows laptops running around with a mouse of some sort. With a MBP I seldom bother with a mouse.
Quote:
 I asked the In-house Warranty Service Techs what they thought of the various laptops we were selling and they actually didn't like fixing Thinkpads as much as they did the HPs.  From a Service Tech's perspective, they didn't like working on them for a variety of reasons. 

For a long time Apples laptops have been a big fail in the service department. I have to wonder though how a service tech would rate the new machines. Personally I view serviceability as extremely important which is one reason I reject the iMac. Even so I have to wonder how far away we are from disposable computers, especially laptops.
post #1188 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

For those that want a OS X touch screen?

Here's one dedicated for the DAW people.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GY5NiBpasj4

I've seen one at a expo. It's a pretty neat setup but for 2500 I would prefer a Surface Pro, Ableton Push and a Novation ZeRO SL MkII, which I already own.

 

 

 

This

 

and this,

Plus this,

with this,

 

...and probably this as well

 

....is still cheaper then 2500, I can take my show on the road when I need to and still retain that touch screen goodness.


Edited by Relic - 11/14/13 at 2:20pm
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1189 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post



I see the track pad as perhaps the most glaring deficiency of any Windows laptop I come across lately. At least with the Dell and Lonovo machines the track pads are for the most part worthless when compared to what is in an Apple notebook. You see most users of these windows laptops running around with a mouse of some sort. With a MBP I seldom bother with a mouse.

For a long time Apples laptops have been a big fail in the service department. I have to wonder though how a service tech would rate the new machines. Personally I view serviceability as extremely important which is one reason I reject the iMac. Even so I have to wonder how far away we are from disposable computers, especially laptops.

 



We are already at a point where products are basically disposable. Once a product becomes out of date and can't run the latest OS and can't be fixed by an authorized repair center due to lack of replacement parts, or parts aren't available, then the product is typically recycled. Apple Technicians have all of the parts replaceable and can fix any model that they currently sell or have sold dating back so many years. ALL major companies have replacement parts in stock for a period of about 5 years (typically speaking) until they sell off their remaining inventory to those companies that deal with obsolete products. MOST people typically turn their computers in for recycling at some point in time once they can't use it or find any private party to sell or give to for the purposes of using it. What companies like Apple, HP, etc. is they sell a 3 year service contract, once the last unit is sold by the mfg before it's EOL, they usually keep parts on hand for about 3 years to satisfy those service contracts from the last date they offered them for sale, then they take whatever remaining inventory of parts specific to that product and sell to the surplus market for pennies on the dollar (this is why service parts are so expensive until Apple sells off their remaining inventory). They have this carrying cost they have to absorb because when they sell off their remaining inventory, it's sold at a HUGE loss.

The iMac is serviceable by trained service people. Do you typically repair everything you purchase by yourself? The average person doesn't and I don't know why people seem to think that a computer is any different than a washing machine, refrigerator, TV, stereo receiver, or any other household product. Sure, I know there are those that THINK they are qualified, or actually possess certain qualifications to repair products on their own, but most people really don't. Now, if you have bought the AppleCare service training (which Apple does sell for $300) and taken the test on a certain product that you are working on and actually have certified replacement parts, then yeah, but how many non-Apple employees actually have such training? iFixit isn't an Apple Certification process for repairing Apple products. It's a web site that sells parts and tools and goes through step by step process on how to do things but if someone does work on their own computer, it actually might violate someone's warranty/AppleCare support contract, so people have to be REAL careful about what they are doing. They do a reasonable job from what I can tell about stepping someone through the repair of an XYZ product, but it's get hold of the proper replacement part, tools, and developing the abilities to do it. But would it be considered an alternative to Apple Warranty service? I wouldn't touch a computer that's covered under Warranty. Let Apple do that. I also buy AppleCare, so for 3 years, I won't touch the insides of ANY Apple product unless it's user serviceable and I would STILL have reservations of changing it and putting 3rd party parts inside. I've already gone the route of buying 3rd party RAM to save money and I've had 50/50 success. But I'm not convinced it's going to actually save me money in the long run, since that memory isn't as reliable as Apple's. If that memory goes bad, which they usually do, then I am not saving any money. I see ALL mfg of laptops, desktops as a product that when under warranty, you bring it into the authorized service center, how easy IFixit thinks a product is easy or hard to service is NOT my concern. iFixIt just gets pissed off when they can't sell anything to those that buy that product, hence why they give Apple products low ratings on serviceability. Laptops were never really designed to be user serviceable. Maybe the drive and memory, but those days are pretty much over in a lot of ways as people want thinner, lighter laptops and the only way of doing it is by removing the user replaceable aspect of the guts inside. What would happen if you had a bad product and it's actually cheaper for Apple to just simply replace your unit (since you HOPEFULLY had your system backed up)?

For some reason, I think if you buy a computer, you should have enough financial resources to buy the required s/w, h/w and servicing you need to run it for it's useful life. If you can't afford to do that and afford whatever service costs associated with it, then maybe you should have saved money and just bought used or simply admitted you can't afford a computer and buy a tablet or some VERY cheap product that you basically throw away when it breaks and you can't afford to fix it. Those $400 computers are basically disposable as it may cost in terms of parts and labor is more than the actual product is worth. That's why I think it's good to buy a 3 year service contract on computers. That way, you have phone support and break/fix support for 3 years and I've found them to be worth the money.

I'm still trying to figure out why people think they are just as capable as an Authorized and trained service center for computers or why a company has to make their products user serviceable. It's the same with cars. Most people don't service their cars on their own. It's VERY expensive to buy the tools to do a proper service job and it also takes a lot of training and trial and error to become actually qualified to do one's own work, but people do it all of the time and MOST people end up spending more money. Every time I try to fix something myself, I don't always end up saving money. We aren't born with the knowledge on how to fix everything we buy, sometimes we're able to do it right the first time, but usually we end up spending more money and/or time fixing something than if we just had a professional do it for us.

It reminds me of Tim "the tool man" Taylor. Have you ever seen that TV show? if not, you should, every time he gets involved with some pet project, he usually ends up screwing it up, goes to the hospital or ends up spending more than it would cost if he just had a professional do the work all because he wants to add more power or fix it himself thinking he's saving money.
Edited by drblank - 11/14/13 at 11:32pm
post #1190 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

I've seen one at a expo. It's a pretty neat setup but for 2500 I would prefer a Surface Pro, Ableton Push and a Novation ZeRO SL MkII, which I already own.

 

 

 

This

 

and this,

Plus this,

with this,

 

...and probably this as well

 

....is still cheaper then 2500, I can take my show on the road when I need to and still retain that touch screen goodness.

All of the products you are showing are prosumer based crap and not used by professional recording studios all that much.  And most of those items aren't really classified as a musical instrument.  Are you a musician or one of those that want to create computer based music without having any knowledge of actually knowing how to play a musical instrument?   A lot of those items are basically toys and quite useless to REAL musicians. The downfall of the music industry are kids trying to make music without actually learning how to play a musical instrument.  It's a shame too.  

 

The RAVEN product is basically a touch screen interface to a professional grade DAW software like ProTools, not Abelton Live which isn't considered a professional level DAW, it's more of just a sequencer for people that don't know how to play a musical instrument and do things the REAL way of creating music.

post #1191 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

All of the products you are showing are prosumer based crap and not used by professional recording studios all that much.  And most of those items aren't really classified as a musical instrument.  Are you a musician or one of those that want to create computer based music without having any knowledge of actually knowing how to play a musical instrument?   A lot of those items are basically toys and quite useless to REAL musicians. The downfall of the music industry are kids trying to make music without actually learning how to play a musical instrument.  It's a shame too.  

 

The RAVEN product is basically a touch screen interface to a professional grade DAW software like ProTools, not Abelton Live which isn't considered a professional level DAW, it's more of just a sequencer for people that don't know how to play a musical instrument and do things the REAL way of creating music.

Yea, I'm not a professional by any means of the definition. I have played piano, 30 years (12 years with our local orchestra), Guitar 22 years, flute 18 years and I sing. I make music for children and the church we belong to, I don't need much to do that.

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1192 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

Yea, I'm not a professional by any means of the definition. I have played piano, 30 years (12 years with our local orchestra), Guitar 22 years, flute 18 years and I sing. I make music for children and the church we belong to, I don't need much to do that.

Well, then spend more time playing music, instead of playing with those toy whatever they call them.   Some of those things are a waste of money.  

 

The cheaper Raven is around $2500, but the bigger one is a LOT more than $2500.  I think it's around $15 to $18K for the larger 46inch model.  I don't know anyone who's used one, but I know they've sold a few of them.  It makes a lot of sense, but I would have to try one first.

post #1193 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

Well, then spend more time playing music, instead of playing with those toy whatever they call them.   Some of those things are a waste of money.  

 

The cheaper Raven is around $2500, but the bigger one is a LOT more than $2500.  I think it's around $15 to $18K for the larger 46inch model.  I don't know anyone who's used one, but I know they've sold a few of them.  It makes a lot of sense, but I would have to try one first.

I do, well I should say we do as I'm in a all mommy group. We use those toys to edit, add background, produce, just make the tracks sound better, I guess is all all I'm saying. To record the music we use my iPad 4 attached to a Mackie DL 1608, using Auria. Right now the only DAW controllers I have is the Notion Zero SL MKII (which is a incredible useful machine and can't recommended it enough) and a Akai APC 40(which isn't mine, it's on permanent lone from someone who works in a professional studio. they use 4 of them). All of the products I listed above except for Surface Pro is used by professionals as well, I don't will nilly buy things for my home studio unless they are recommended by this person and others who work in a studio, I also get to use them in his studio before hand. Just because they use equipment that doesn't cost 1,000's is in no way a sign that it is just a toy. If Armin Van Buuren and 100's of other musicians use Abelton Live, it's defiantly good enough for my little operation. I'm sorry but I really do not think you have done enough research on this, you'll be amazed what musicians nowadays do with just using their iPads and laptops.


Edited by Relic - 11/15/13 at 4:53am
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1194 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


For a long time Apples laptops have been a big fail in the service department. I have to wonder though how a service tech would rate the new machines. Personally I view serviceability as extremely important which is one reason I reject the iMac. Even so I have to wonder how far away we are from disposable computers, especially laptops.

Apple laptops are no more nor less repairable than any other. Our IT dept has no issues with them despite having fewer apple support staff than windows ones.

The resolution for all laptops is the same. They hand you a temp one with all your stuff restored on it and yours gets sent to either dell or apple for servicing if the issue is nontrivial. We have service contracts with both.

Same for desktops as near as I can tell. They maintain enough spares in the pool to cover issues.
post #1195 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post


Apple laptops are no more nor less repairable than any other. Our IT dept has no issues with them despite having fewer apple support staff than windows ones.

The resolution for all laptops is the same. They hand you a temp one with all your stuff restored on it and yours gets sent to either dell or apple for servicing if the issue is nontrivial. We have service contracts with both.

Same for desktops as near as I can tell. They maintain enough spares in the pool to cover issues.

That might be but they are an absolute pain to take apart. I had a 17" Macbook that I sent to Apple for repair and it came back dented in many places around the seems. Apple of course replaced but I can only imagine independent Apple authorized repair shops probably dread them.

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #1196 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

That might be but they are an absolute pain to take apart. I had a 17" Macbook that I sent to Apple for repair and it came back dented in many places around the seems. Apple of course replaced but I can only imagine independent Apple authorized repair shops probably dread them.

 

I've opened my MBP to add RAM and swap out the HDD.  It's a few screws.  The iMacs can be a pain with the glue.

post #1197 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post
 

 

I've opened my MBP to add RAM and swap out the HDD.  It's a few screws.  The iMacs can be a pain with the glue.

The 27inch iMac has a user accessible panel to add RAM.  If you need a bigger drive than what it comes with, go external.  It's better since you get to keep it when you replace the main box.  I personally and going to rethink my next desktop. I am seriously considering when I replace my current iMac to buy a desktop with 128G of SSD and then go with an external SSD storage.  It will be much faster/more reliable than using a traditional drive as my main storage.  Sure it will cost more in the beginning, but when I change base units, I just retain the external SSD drive and I don't have to transfer all of my data from one internal drive to the next. So, the new Mac Pro design is actually a good direction in a lot of ways.

 

I'm just waiting for the faster SSD external drives become available, which will probably happen next year.

post #1198 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

The 27inch iMac has a user accessible panel to add RAM.  If you need a bigger drive than what it comes with, go external.  It's better since you get to keep it when you replace the main box.  I personally and going to rethink my next desktop. I am seriously considering when I replace my current iMac to buy a desktop with 128G of SSD and then go with an external SSD storage.  It will be much faster/more reliable than using a traditional drive as my main storage.  Sure it will cost more in the beginning, but when I change base units, I just retain the external SSD drive and I don't have to transfer all of my data from one internal drive to the next. So, the new Mac Pro design is actually a good direction in a lot of ways.

 

I'm just waiting for the faster SSD external drives become available, which will probably happen next year.

Why a SSD, there are much larger mechanical drives. Do you really need the speed for backups or even data. It's not like you can't watch movies or even do high end video editing with a 7200 RPM drive. Heck get a 15K Hitachi drive, still cheaper then a 600GB SSD. I totaly understand using a SSD for your system, external not so much. Not when you can buy 4TB drives for so cheap.

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post #1199 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post
 

 

I've opened my MBP to add RAM and swap out the HDD.  It's a few screws.  The iMacs can be a pain with the glue.

 Really, I'm so afraid I will break it. I've upgraded my iMac though, the glue part sucks, your right about that. I used a plastic knife for clay to do it.

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post #1200 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post
 

That might be but they are an absolute pain to take apart. I had a 17" Macbook that I sent to Apple for repair and it came back dented in many places around the seems. Apple of course replaced but I can only imagine independent Apple authorized repair shops probably dread them.

I thought I was the only one who liked the 17".

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

The 27inch iMac has a user accessible panel to add RAM.  If you need a bigger drive than what it comes with, go external.  It's better since you get to keep it when you replace the main box.  I personally and going to rethink my next desktop. I am seriously considering when I replace my current iMac to buy a desktop with 128G of SSD and then go with an external SSD storage.  It will be much faster/more reliable than using a traditional drive as my main storage.  Sure it will cost more in the beginning, but when I change base units, I just retain the external SSD drive and I don't have to transfer all of my data from one internal drive to the next. So, the new Mac Pro design is actually a good direction in a lot of ways.

 

I'm just waiting for the faster SSD external drives become available, which will probably happen next year.


Where have they been shown as more reliable? They don't suffer from mechanical wear, yet there are other possible causes of drive death.

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