or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Formerly critical of Apple, officials now cautiously optimistic with iOS 7 anti-theft features
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Formerly critical of Apple, officials now cautiously optimistic with iOS 7 anti-theft features

post #1 of 53
Thread Starter 
Once vocal critics of Apple's efforts to prevent mobile device theft, the Attorneys General of San Francisco and New York are now a bit more optimistic in the wake of the iPhone maker's unveiling of new a new anti-theft mechanism.

activation


New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman and San Francisco Attorney General George Gascon have made headlines over the past several months calling out Apple and other smartphone industry players for not doing enough to deter the theft of mobile devices. Now, though, the two have said they're encouraged by the new Activation Lock Apple will add to iPhones and iPads with the new iOS 7.

"We are appreciative of the gesture made by Apple to address smartphone theft," the two prosecutors told the Associated Press in a joint written statement. "We reserve judgment on the activation lock feature until we can understand its actual functionality."

Nearly one out of every three robberies nationwide involves a mobile phone, according to the Federal Communications Commission. Smartphone manufacturers, the two prosecutors say, could virtually eliminate the market for stolen phones by building in the ability to render the devices useless when stolen.

Apple appears to have developed just such a technology, if the company's WWDC claims are to be believed. The new Activation Lock feature, according to Apple, will keep a phone from being activated even if a thief wipes the device's memory entirely. Additionally, iPhones and iPads have a Find My iPhone feature that will display the device's approximate location on a map.

Gasc?n and Schneiderman have invited Apple and other smartphone makers to attend a Smartphone Summit this week in New York, where attendees will discuss ways to prevent smartphone theft. Representatives from Apple, Google, Microsoft, and Samsung have agreed to attend the meeting, which will take place on Friday. Gasc?n says the ball is entirely in the smartphone makers' court when it comes to stopping mobile device theft.

"With 1.6 million Americans falling victim to smartphone theft in 2012, this has become a national epidemic," said Gascon. "Unlike other types of crimes, smartphone theft can be eradicated with a simple technological solution.
post #2 of 53
Wondering if the phone has to be on when put into lost mode. A friend was <2 minutes by car to recovering hers and it went offline never to be seen online on Find my iPhone again.

Reckon if the phone is thought to be lost, putting it in lost mode will be an immediate first step.

edit: removed article typo ask.
Edited by ChristophB - 6/11/13 at 2:00pm
post #3 of 53

Screw them. Just screw them. What do they matter?

 

It is Apple's fault that people want to steal their products. No, it is; they're desirable products.

It's not Apple's fault that people steal their products, and it's not Apple's job to catch said people. 

 

These police forces need to shut up and do their jobs.


Edited by Tallest Skil - 6/11/13 at 12:28pm

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #4 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Once vocal critics of Apple's efforts to prevent mobile device theft, the Attorneys General of San Francisco and New York are now a bit more optimistic in the wake of the iPhone maker's unveiling of new a new anti-theft mechanism.

 

So glad that Apple was able to help the Police prevent crimes.  That will leave more time for the Police to setup speed traps and visit their local Starbucks cafes for lattes.

post #5 of 53
This will be a pretty cool feature as long as there is absolutely no way to disable it even if the iPhone has been jailbroken. I feel like this should also have a hidden receipt feature as well. For instance the only way to turn this off is if you willingly type in your credentials to disable it and the iPhone keeps a record of that in the cloud somewhere so that when people go to complain, Apple can show proof that it was knowingly and willingly disabled by the user.
post #6 of 53
Originally Posted by RedRaider2011 View Post
This will be a pretty cool feature as long as there is absolutely no way to disable it even if the iPhone has been jailbroken.

 

Jailbroken users put their security in their own hands. Apple couldn't care less about them.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #7 of 53

I just don't understand why the police don't hold the manufacturers of other products responsible for theft.  What about bicycle manufacturers?  What are they doing to prevent bicycles from being stolen?  And how about cars?  Why don't they all come with factory installed methods for tracking hte vehicles and shutting off their motors permanently if they get stolen?  What about blenders?  Why do household blenders not come with built-in anti-theft protection.  Police should be highly critical of all blender makers.

 

Dude, it's up to the owner to safeguard their sh*t.  We should be thankful that Apple is making it harder to sell iPhones -- cause the makers of watches, TV's, cars, appliances, etc don't even worry about it, and no one complains.

 

Or do we just need ANOTHER reason to hold Apple to a completely different standard than every other company on the planet, when it comes to security, profits, margins, innovation and every other metric one can possibly think of?

post #8 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

"Formely critical of Apple" = "Formerly critical of Apple" ?

Wondering if the phone has to be on when put into lost mode. A friend was <2 minutes by car to recovering hers and it went offline never to be seen online on Find my iPhone again.

Reckon if the phone is thought to be lost, putting it in lost mode will be an immediate first step.

 

I would think the first thing one would want to do would be to put the device in 'lost mode'.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply
post #9 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I would think the first thing one would want to do would be to put the device in 'lost mode'.

Yep - hope word gets around quick after the Fall launch. I wonder what the mean ransom per iDevice will be since the accidental criminals will now be able to negotiate the return of the device. Oh, I meant reward.
post #10 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post


Yep - hope word gets around quick after the Fall launch. I wonder what the mean ransom per iDevice will be since the accidental criminals will now be able to negotiate the return of the device. Oh, I meant reward.

 

The thing that worries me about the increased level of security:  Criminals will quickly learn the devices are worthless without the passwords so they will be more likely to demand (possibly with violence) the password from the owner before they leave with the stolen device. Actions can lead to unforeseen reactions.

 

That being said, I understand that Apple more or less had to do something to appease their critics.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply
post #11 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

"Formely critical of Apple" = "Formerly critical of Apple" ?

Wondering if the phone has to be on when put into lost mode. A friend was <2 minutes by car to recovering hers and it went offline never to be seen online on Find my iPhone again.

Reckon if the phone is thought to be lost, putting it in lost mode will be an immediate first step.

 

Even if you don't put it in lost mode, the phone cannot be used, even if reformatted, if you do not enter the correct owner icloud name and password.

post #12 of 53

What about selling the iPhone? Is it enough to remove it from your registered devices in iTunes?

It is useless for sheep to pass laws outlawing carnivorism when the wolf is of a different mind.
Reply
It is useless for sheep to pass laws outlawing carnivorism when the wolf is of a different mind.
Reply
post #13 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Screw them. Just screw them. What do they matter?

 

It is Apple's fault that people want to steal their products. No, it is; they're desirable products.

It's not Apple's fault that people steal their products, and it's not Apple's job to catch said people. 

 

These police forces need to shut up and do their jobs.

Pretty ungracious of the AGs to say: "We are appreciative of the gesture made by Apple to address smartphone theft," the two prosecutors told the Associated Press in a joint written statement. "We reserve judgment on the activation lock feature until we can understand its actual functionality."

 

To which I should comment to their statement: shouldn't they have said "We are appreciative of the effort made by Apple . . ."

Stamping "please don't steal me" on each iPhone sold in big cities would be a gesture.

 

I think what Apple has done is certainly more than a gesture. What else do these quacks expect Apple to do? Provide individual guards with each iPhone?

 

Meh.

When I find time to rewrite the laws of Physics, there'll Finally be some changes made round here!

I am not crazy! Three out of five court appointed psychiatrists said so.

Reply

When I find time to rewrite the laws of Physics, there'll Finally be some changes made round here!

I am not crazy! Three out of five court appointed psychiatrists said so.

Reply
post #14 of 53
Surprised they didn't take credit, like most politicians do.
post #15 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Once vocal critics of Apple's efforts to prevent mobile device theft, the Attorneys General of San Francisco and New York are now a bit more optimistic in the wake of the iPhone maker's unveiling of new a new anti-theft mechanism. ...
... New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman and San Francisco Attorney General George Gascon ...

 

George Gascon is actually the San Francisco District Attorney. The last I checked, San Francisco didn't have an Attorney General, not being a state in its own right.

post #16 of 53
but ebay will still let it be sold online as parts. This means nothing and you will still never get it back.
post #17 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonevw View Post

but ebay will still let it be sold online as parts. This means nothing and you will still never get it back.

 

The solution is to get insurance for your products.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

Reply
post #18 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Jailbroken users put their security in their own hands. Apple couldn't care less about them.

He meant that it needs to remain locked even if the thief jailbreaks it.
post #19 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordio View Post

Even if you don't put it in lost mode, the phone cannot be used, even if reformatted, if you do not enter the correct owner icloud name and password.

a. Lose iPhone
b. Loser Finds iPhone.
c. Loser Powers off iPhone
d. Loser Yanks SIM from iPhone
e. Loser powers iPhone up in DFU mode.
f. Loser uses iTunes to restore.
e. Loser drops own SIM in and voila!

If the iPhone was not put into Lost Mode prior to step c, will step e be impossible? I've done a - f (on my 5).
post #20 of 53
Originally Posted by iaeen View Post
He meant that it needs to remain locked even if the thief jailbreaks it.

 

They can't restore it in the first place; obviously they can't jailbreak it.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #21 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

a. Lose iPhone
b. Loser Finds iPhone.
c. Loser Powers off iPhone
d. Loser Yanks SIM from iPhone
e. Loser powers iPhone up in DFU mode.
f. Loser uses iTunes to restore.
e. Loser drops own SIM in and voila!

If the iPhone was not put into Lost Mode prior to step c, will step e be impossible? I've done a - f (on my 5).

He cannot activate it without Internet. When he tries to activate it it will not activate without the proper Apple ID. So it is will not work unless there is a way to hack the activation. I believe even after he activate it if the owner reported it as stolen the device will lock and require Apple ID and password of the original owner.
Edited by NasserAE - 6/11/13 at 3:45pm
post #22 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

He cannot activate it without Internet. When he tries to activate it it will not activate without the proper Apple ID. So it is will not work unless there is a way to hack the activation. I believe even after he activate it if the owner reported it as stolen the device will lock and require Apple ID and password of the original owner.

I hope this is the case. I'm tempted to test it out of pure curiosity. I still suspect that the Lost Mode must be triggered prior to power off.
post #23 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

It's not Apple's fault that people steal their products.

No, it isn't. But one can still politely ask them to consider adding such a feature and applauding them when they do.

post #24 of 53
Edit: Misread quote of TS.
Edited by ChristophB - 6/11/13 at 4:07pm
post #25 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post


He cannot activate it without Internet. When he tries to activate it it will not activate without the proper Apple ID. So it is will not work unless there is a way to hack the activation. I believe even after he activate it if the owner reported it as stolen the device will lock and require Apple ID and password of the original owner.

 

Yes, as I understand it the thief would have to change the IMEI address (or something similar). Which is possible if you crack open the device and have the right equipment and knowledge. In a sense you could say the iPhone is used to provide parts by taking out the parts that represent the identity of the phone. An iPhone screen, frame, display, battery, etc. don't have a registered identity I would assume.

post #26 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by 512ke View Post

I just don't understand why the police don't hold the manufacturers of other products responsible for theft.  What about bicycle manufacturers?  What are they doing to prevent bicycles from being stolen?  And how about cars?  Why don't they all come with factory installed methods for tracking hte vehicles and shutting off their motors permanently if they get stolen?  What about blenders?  Why do household blenders not come with built-in anti-theft protection.  Police should be highly critical of all blender makers.

 

Dude, it's up to the owner to safeguard their sh*t.  We should be thankful that Apple is making it harder to sell iPhones -- cause the makers of watches, TV's, cars, appliances, etc don't even worry about it, and no one complains.

 

Or do we just need ANOTHER reason to hold Apple to a completely different standard than every other company on the planet, when it comes to security, profits, margins, innovation and every other metric one can possibly think of?


Because it wouldn't make sense to add anti-theft to bikes and blenders. iPhones, on the other hand, have a perfect foundation for anti-theft with relatively minor modifications.

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply
post #27 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonevw View Post

but ebay will still let it be sold online as parts. This means nothing and you will still never get it back.


Good point. Perhaps it will be less valuable, though.

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply
post #28 of 53

One more critical step for anti-theft is that Apple must require a password for any LOCKED iPhone to be powered off. This gives you time to track the phone and/or put it in Lost Mode.

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply
post #29 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

 

The thing that worries me about the increased level of security:  Criminals will quickly learn the devices are worthless without the passwords so they will be more likely to demand (possibly with violence) the password from the owner before they leave with the stolen device. Actions can lead to unforeseen reactions.

And security measures can be used against you, remember Mat Honan? Basically, if somebody gets your AppleID password, they'd change it then wipe all your devices and brick your iPhone. Sure, Apple will have tools to un-brick it again but it will take some convincing that you are the rightful owner and not the thief yourself.

post #30 of 53
One key ingredient that is missing however is sandboxing the users message to return/user contact info as well so that if found it can still be returned if wiped. I left my iPhone in a taxi and had to erase it when the battery got too low after watching it traveling around at which point there was no way for anyone to contact me to return it.
post #31 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeRange View Post

One key ingredient that is missing however is sandboxing the users message to return/user contact info as well so that if found it can still be returned if wiped. I left my iPhone in a taxi and had to erase it when the battery got too low after watching it traveling around at which point there was no way for anyone to contact me to return it.


A persistent message even after the phone is wiped is part of the new system.

post #32 of 53
You know, if this works and the theft rate of iphones drop, you know what the MSM headlines will say then:

Quote:
iphones so unpopular even thieves wont steal them!
It's the heat death of the universe, my friends.
Reply
It's the heat death of the universe, my friends.
Reply
post #33 of 53

I would love it if I can let Apple know about the IMEI of my stolen iPhone 5 so it bricks when the current owner installs iOS 7. Somehow I doubt that will be an option but I can certainly dream about it.

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply
post #34 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Screw them. Just screw them. What do they matter?

 

It is Apple's fault that people want to steal their products. No, it is; they're desirable products.

It's not Apple's fault that people steal their products, and it's not Apple's job to catch said people. 

 

These police forces need to shut up and do their jobs.

I disagree.   If there's a simple technical solution to stopping such thefts, there's no reason why Apple or any other manufacturer shouldn't implement it and obviously, Apple agreed.    

 

Thieves used to steal car radios constantly.   I had two stolen myself.   The worst part was they broke the window to do it, which in many cases, costs more than the radio.   The manufacturers put in a coding system rendering the radios unusable without the code and problem solved.   You rarely hear about car radios getting stolen anymore.

 

Thieves also used to steal side mirrors when the mirrors were mounted to the car with visible screws.    The manufacturers changed the way they mount them and side mirrors are no longer stolen. 

 

Nothing wrong with the police requesting manufacturers to find technical solutions to these types of issues.   

 

------

When I got off the train tonight, I didn't seem to have my iPhone.  I didn't know whether I left it in the office or whether it slipped out of my pocket on the train.   I tried calling it, but no one picked up.   I went home to use "Find My iPhone" for the first time, but I didn't know if I had set it up on the phone.   After a few tries getting into my Cloud account (because Apple has totally screwed up the Apple account system), I got in and "Find My iPhone" says the iPhone is in my house. I check my bag, my pockets and still can't find it.   I use the "beep my phone" and as it turned out, it was buried deep in my pocket the whole time.

 

OK, so I'm an idiot.   But if it had showed me that the phone was at my office, at least I would have known that I hadn't lost it on the train.   And if it didn't show up, it probably would have meant that I had lost it on the train and I probably would have headed out to buy another one.

 

So I think those features are terrific and it made me feel really good about my phone (even if other phones have something similar.)   The coming enhancement will only make it better, if it works as advertised.

 

By the way, "Find my iPhone" is still using Google Maps.  I thought that was funny.

post #35 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by noirdesir View Post

And security measures can be used against you, remember Mat Honan? Basically, if somebody gets your AppleID password, they'd change it then wipe all your devices and brick your iPhone. Sure, Apple will have tools to un-brick it again but it will take some convincing that you are the rightful owner and not the thief yourself.

True, but that is not the type of issue Apple was addressing with the Activation Lock feature, which is meant to deter the more common opportunistic theft of iPhones by strangers.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #36 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

By the way, "Find my iPhone" is still using Google Maps.  I thought that was funny.

Well, you wouldn't want to be steered off a cliff in Australia or something 1wink.gif

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #37 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by 512ke View Post

I just don't understand why the police don't hold the manufacturers of other products responsible for theft.  What about bicycle manufacturers?  What are they doing to prevent bicycles from being stolen?  And how about cars?  Why don't they all come with factory installed methods for tracking hte vehicles and shutting off their motors permanently if they get stolen?  What about blenders?  Why do household blenders not come with built-in anti-theft protection.  Police should be highly critical of all blender makers.

 

Dude, it's up to the owner to safeguard their sh*t.  We should be thankful that Apple is making it harder to sell iPhones -- cause the makers of watches, TV's, cars, appliances, etc don't even worry about it, and no one complains.

 

Or do we just need ANOTHER reason to hold Apple to a completely different standard than every other company on the planet, when it comes to security, profits, margins, innovation and every other metric one can possibly think of?

 

As the article says, 1.6 million Americans (and countless millions of illegals) lose their smartphones to theft. Those are all lost sales to Apple. 

 

If Apple beats everyone else to a solution, then that's one more reason to buy Apple. 

 

With theft being a high profile problem, imagine what attention Apple may get this fall with fingerprint recognition built into the device??

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
post #38 of 53

Once again Apple has to fix someone else's problems. First Foxconn, now Law Enforcement. Yet, even though they have to think for other people, they do it honorably. Great concept by the way! 

post #39 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post


a. Lose iPhone
b. Loser Finds iPhone.
c. Loser Powers off iPhone
d. Loser Yanks SIM from iPhone
e. Loser powers iPhone up in DFU mode.
f. Loser uses iTunes to restore.
e. Loser drops own SIM in and voila!

If the iPhone was not put into Lost Mode prior to step c, will step e be impossible? I've done a - f (on my 5).

 

g. Phone connects to Apple to activate. <------ This is the new step where "lost" mode steps in, whether the iPhone was physically put into Lost Mode or not.

 

The only possible way around it is to activate without connecting to Apple's servers.


Edited by hill60 - 6/12/13 at 2:13am
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
Reply
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
Reply
post #40 of 53
I think it would really help if you need to enter the passcode to turn off the phone if it is locked. My iPhone was stolen recently and a few minutes after realising I went on a friends phone to go to Find my iPhone, of course it was already switched off.

That simple mechanism would deter a lot of thieves i'm sure. Of course one could remove the SIM card, but it would still be able to connect to some open Wifi spots.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
  • Formerly critical of Apple, officials now cautiously optimistic with iOS 7 anti-theft features
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Formerly critical of Apple, officials now cautiously optimistic with iOS 7 anti-theft features