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Samsung CEO says Galaxy S4 sales are fine, doesn't foresee patent truce with Apple

post #1 of 50
Thread Starter 
Samsung CEO J.K. Shin had a lot to say this week, reassuring investors that the company's latest flagship smartphone is indeed selling well, while at the same time dismissing the notion that the company is anywhere close to d?tente with its chief rival, Apple.

gs4


Samsung's stock dropped six percent last week when a J.P Morgan report warned investors that sales of its recently launched Galaxy S4 smartphone could fall short of expectations. Speaking with reporters on Wednesday, though, Shin dismissed J.P. Morgan's analysis of S4 sales, according to The Korea Times.

"I can say sales of the Galaxy S4 smartphone are fine. It's been selling well," Shin told reporters after meeting with executives from Samsung's partners. "The report was based on its own analysis. Probably the bank may have corrected its previous bullish estimate about the S4 sales."

Samsung launched the S4 amid tremendous hype, and the company expects to sell around 100 million of the Android-powered device. Within its first 28 days of availability, the S4 moved 10 million units, but both J.P. Morgan and Morgan Stanley revised their sales estimates downward recently.

The ensuing sell-off resulted in Samsung's largest single-day drop in nine months, taking Samsung's shares to a four-month low. The South Korean conglomerate lost $12.4 billion in market capitalization, and the stock has been trending downward since.

Shin also commented on Samsung's ongoing worldwide patent struggle with Apple, saying that Samsung has no plans to relent or concede.

"Patent disputes against Apple will continue," Shin said in his first Apple-related comments since the ITC handed Samsung a win in the form of an import ban on older iPhones and iPads.
post #2 of 50

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.

 

post #3 of 50
post #4 of 50
"Sales have been smooth."

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post #5 of 50

Apple - We sold precisely X number of devices over the opening weekend of our new product. There's no guessing, there's nothing to hide. Apple just lays out the cold hard facts.

 

Samsung and everybody else - Our sales are smooth. Our sales are fine. Trust us. We sold a shit load of devices, but there is nothing suspicious at all about us refusing to reveal any numbers. Scouts honor! I swear on my dead mother! And by the way, we are also proud to announce that 17 Billion Android devices have now been activated, and no, we are not going to provide any proof for that either.

post #6 of 50

There is a difference between a rivalry and a war. The former is healthy and capitalistic, the latter is destructive. He seems to be bragging to his investors that the patent war will continue and as an investor myself I am not happy to hear this. Because both companies have large patent libraries, each one is holding the other back so the collective result is BOTH companies are being handcuffed from bringing better products to market and therefore producing more revenue. This is not something Mr. Shin should be bragging about and astute investors would call him to the carpet for this. 

post #7 of 50

Nonsense! Creators create because it's in their nature, not because of competition.

post #8 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

There is a difference between a rivalry and a war. The former is healthy and capitalistic, the latter is destructive. He seems to be bragging to his investors that the patent war will continue and as an investor myself I am not happy to hear this. Because both companies have large patent libraries, each one is holding the other back so the collective result is BOTH companies are being handcuffed from bringing better products to market and therefore producing more revenue. This is not something Mr. Shin should be bragging about and astute investors would call him to the carpet for this. 

 

Samsung investors (whoever they are) would be more likely to attack him if he "gave in" on the patent front. 

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post #9 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Apple - We sold sales are fine. Trust us. We sold a shit load of devices, but there is nothing suspicious at all about us refusing to reveal any numbers...

He seems like a pretty stand-up guy. I believe him.

Does he have anything else that he would like to sell me?
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post #10 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.

This statement is not worth much.
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post #11 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don108 View Post

Nonsense! Creators create because it's in their nature, not because of competition.

Rubbish!

Da Vinci was just trying to beat Van Gogh to the punch!

1wink.gif
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post #12 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post


Rubbish!

Da Vinci was just trying to beat Van Gogh to the punch!

1wink.gif


1452 - 1519

vs

1853 - 1890

 

With a four century head start, I think Leonardo had it in the bag.

post #13 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Apple - We sold precisely X number of devices over the opening weekend of our new product. There's no guessing, there's nothing to hide. Apple just lays out the cold hard facts.

 

Cough

 

 

Quote:

Apple decided to do a very un-Apple thing this morning when it announced iPad sales for the last three days.

Everyone wanted to know how many iPad Minis Apple sold, since it's the newest Apple product on the market.

Instead of saying how many iPad Minis it sold, Apple decided to obfuscate, saying it sold thee million iPad Minis and fourth-generation iPads last weekend.

post #14 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don108 View Post

Nonsense! Creators create because it's in their nature, not because of competition.

very true! But that doesn't mean they will create something people want.....competition does that....

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post #15 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.

 

 

Wow, what a ridiculous supposition! Apple wouldn't be motivated to improve or innovate without a "threat"? You clearly don't understand them as a company at all.

 

Even though I agree with the basic notion that 'healthy competition is a good thing' you took it into pretty faulty territory. The history of Apple all by itself proves you wrong in that regard. They are not, nor have they ever been "threat driven" in their product development.

post #16 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Apple - We sold precisely X number of devices over the opening weekend of our new product. There's no guessing, there's nothing to hide. Apple just lays out the cold hard facts.

 

Samsung and everybody else - Our sales are smooth. Our sales are fine. Trust us. We sold a shit load of devices, but there is nothing suspicious at all about us refusing to reveal any numbers. Scouts honor! I swear on my dead mother! And by the way, we are also proud to announce that 17 Billion Android devices have now been activated, and no, we are not going to provide any proof for that either.

Spot on.

 

These guys don't reveal their volumes sold/shipped because the numbers likely suck (relative to the hype). It's as simple as that.

post #17 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.

Now, there's a crock.

post #18 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Apple - We sold precisely X number of devices over the opening weekend of our new product. There's no guessing, there's nothing to hide. Apple just lays out the cold hard facts.

 

Cough

 

 

Quote:

Apple decided to do a very un-Apple thing this morning when it announced iPad sales for the last three days.

Everyone wanted to know how many iPad Minis Apple sold, since it's the newest Apple product on the market.

Instead of saying how many iPad Minis it sold, Apple decided to obfuscate, saying it sold thee million iPad Minis and fourth-generation iPads last weekend.

Hey.... we'll take any volume numbers from the likes of Samsung.

 

Why don't we let your pals get to that first, before asking Apple for how many Verizon 16GB white iPhone 5s were sold on alternate Thursdays in Alabama.

post #19 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Spot on.

 

These guys don't reveal their volumes sold/shipped because the numbers likely suck (relative to the hype). It's as simple as that.


So would you therefore suggest that Samsung are making up their numbers when they report their quarterly profits and revenue?

 

They are either making up their financials and misleading the stock exchanges of the world or they are selling something else other than phones.  \s

 

 

Quote:

Samsung Electronics has posted a record quarterly profit, boosted mainly by growing sales of its smartphones.

It made a net profit of 7.15tn won ($6.4bn; £4.2bn) during the period, up from 5.05tn won a year ago. Profits also rose from the previous quarter.

The Korean firm's results are in sharp contrast with rival Apple, which this week reported a drop in quarterly profits for the first time in a decade.

Samsung displaced Apple as the world's biggest smartphone maker last year.

Bryan Ma of research firm IDC said that the South Korean firm was doing "very very well right now".

"They have a lot of momentum behind what they are doing around phones, and clearly from a consumer perspective, they have a lot of excitement around their devices.

"They have a lot of their competitors wondering what they are going to do."

'Great strategy'

Samsung has enjoyed great success with its smartphone division.

According to the latest figures, profits there rose more than 55% to 6.51tn won during the first three months of the year, from a year earlier.

 

"With everything that we have seen from Samsung in the past few months, and more importantly going forward, they are the competitor to beat”

Bryan Ma IDC

Analysts said that a key factor behind Samsung's success is that it offers a much broader range of models than its rival, Apple, which sells only the iPhone.

"It has a great strategy of targeting its devices to multiple consumer at multiple price points," Andrew Milroy of Frost & Sullivan told the BBC

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22305179

post #20 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Patent disputes against Apple will continue," Shin said in his first Apple-related comments since the ITC handed Samsung a win in the form of an import ban on older iPhones and iPads.

So they don't even want to settle. Well, that settles it then.
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post #21 of 50
In other words, Shin is saying, "Ignore that man behind the curtain!"

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post #22 of 50
If Samsung is afraid to give out the sales numbers then it is not doing well.
post #23 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.


 

You mean Sammy would have to copy from another vendor.
post #24 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

1452 - 1519

vs

1853 - 1890

 

With a four century head start, I think Leonardo had it in the bag.

 

I believe you may have got my point, but not my sarcasm...

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post #25 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Spot on.

 

These guys don't reveal their volumes sold/shipped because the numbers likely suck (relative to the hype). It's as simple as that.


So would you therefore suggest that Samsung are making up their numbers when they report their quarterly profits and revenue?

Hello, anybody home? Are we on the same planet?

 

What about the word 'volume' don't you understand? Did Samsung start reporting that today?

post #26 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Hey.... we'll take any volume numbers from the likes of Samsung.

 

Why don't we let your pals get to that first, before asking Apple for how many Verizon 16GB white iPhone 5s were sold on alternate Thursdays in Alabama.


Samsung do announce sales figures.  It seems they like to wait for round million figures, which might explain Shin's circumspection.

 

 

Quote:
Samsung confirmed earlier this week that the company has sold 2 million Galaxy Note handsets since the device launched last October, according to Forbes.

Samsung is going through a purple patch. Yesterday they announced sales of 4 million units of the Galaxy S4 over its launch weekend. They shipped a further 2 million in the following week. Sales in the first two weeks are over 5 million with a Samsung executive claiming the device is on track for 10 million units sold by the end of May.

The South Korean firm said in a Twitter post that it sold more than 30 million Galaxy S3 smartphones in the five months of its release, making it one of the fastest selling smartphones in the world.

Similarly, it claims to have sold three million of its Galaxy Note 2 devices in little over a month - a pace three times faster than its predecessor - Galaxy Note.

 

And:

Quote:
Samsung proudly announced on its official blog that sales of the Galaxy S4 has surpassed the 10 million mark in less than a month after it was released in 60 countries last April 27.
 
 

Edited by cnocbui - 6/13/13 at 2:36pm
post #27 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


"Patent disputes against Apple will continue," Shin said in his first Apple-related comments since the ITC handed Samsung a win in the form of an import ban on older iPhones and iPads.

 

Ah, what the ITC giveth, the ITC taketh away.

post #28 of 50

Samdung- You got one way to survive- Copy the future like you did in the past from TV to Phones to Iphones to tablets. Google glass is coming- get cheaper version!

post #29 of 50
We've been told over and over how Sammy makes hundreds (thousands?) of other products, besides phones, and that the smartphone business is a minor part of the company. And yet one "analyst" gives a lukewarm forecast on sales of a SINGLE product, and the entire company stock drops SIX PERCENT? Either the stock market is over-reacting severely, or there is something else wrong with the company that this article is not addressing.
post #30 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Cough

 

 

Here, take some of this, that should help you out with your cough. 

 

As for your link, so what? Apple announced total iPad sales, that's good enough. There is no need for Apple to break down the sales figures for every single model they make, giving their enemies valuable data and intelligence. I don't want Samsung or anybody else to know how many iPad Minis have been sold compared to iPad 4's.

post #31 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


So would you therefore suggest that Samsung are making up their numbers when they report their quarterly profits and revenue?

 

They are either making up their financials and misleading the stock exchanges of the world or they are selling something else other than phones.  \s

 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22305179

 

Samsung are selling something else other than Galaxy S4's (or other high end handsets), low end and mid range make up the majority of their sales.

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post #32 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


You mean Sammy would have to copy from another vendor.

 

Like in the old days when Nokia was on top and Samsung was there with Symbian based slide phones or Motorola, Samsung was there too with flip phones, Rim had the BLACKberry, Samsung had the BLACKjack.

 

Business as usual for Samsung, copying for over a decade.

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post #33 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Like in the old days when Nokia was on top and Samsung was there with Symbian based slide phones or Motorola, Samsung was there too with flip phones, Rim had the BLACKberry, Samsung had the BLACKjack.

Business as usual for Samsung, copying for over a decade.

Yes, but all those times it just happened to be a convergence of design. /s
post #34 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


Samsung do announce sales figures.  It seems they like to wait for round million figures, which might explain Shin's circumspection.

 

 

 

And:

IIRC while they announce numbers they do not report numbers in an official legal document: that's the barrier that keeps them off the NYSE from my undrestanding. They decline to submit the audited financials.

post #35 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


So would you therefore suggest that Samsung are making up their numbers when they report their quarterly profits and revenue?

 

They are either making up their financials and misleading the stock exchanges of the world or they are selling something else other than phones.  \s

 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22305179

 

Well, actually, sarcasm aside this is true and it was brought to light in one of the Apple lawsuits how Samsung actually inflates numbers drastically.

 

Additionally, apart from the fact that we mostly only get shipment numbers and not direct sales numbers, Samsung is very careful about its own wording and thus those X million of S4 devices likely consists mostly of S4 Mini and other cheap spinoff models, rather than of the high end model which is as expensive as an iPhone 5.

 

Samsung is very well aware of that and that's the reason they won't break it down for us. The same goes for all other manufacturers by the way. There's a reason for why most competitors just don't like to talk about numbers that much.

 

Samsung is the only one selling real volumes and even they don't like to be as open because it would then become apparent to everyone that what they are actually selling well is not competing with Apple at all.

post #36 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfc1138 View Post

IIRC while they announce numbers they do not report numbers in an official legal document: that's the barrier that keeps them off the NYSE from my undrestanding. They decline to submit the audited financials.

Their reporting **would be** considered sufficient by NYSE standards, since they report according to IFRS criteria.

The issue here is that they do not report quantities sold, unlike Apple. In all fairness, no one else (e.g., Amazon, Nokia, Microsoft, Motorola -- now Google) does either. Apple is head and shoulders above its competition when it comes to the quality of its disclosure.
post #37 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


Samsung do announce sales figures.  It seems they like to wait for round million figures, which might explain Shin's circumspection.

 

And:

 

Quote:
Samsung confirmed earlier this week that the company has sold 2 million Galaxy Note handsets since the device launched last October, according to Forbes.

Samsung is going through a purple patch. Yesterday they announced sales of 4 million units of the Galaxy S4 over its launch weekend. They shipped a further 2 million in the following week. Sales in the first two weeks are over 5 million with a Samsung executive claiming the device is on track for 10 million units sold by the end of May.

The South Korean firm said in a Twitter post that it sold more than 30 million Galaxy S3 smartphones in the five months of its release, making it one of the fastest selling smartphones in the world.

Similarly, it claims to have sold three million of its Galaxy Note 2 devices in little over a month - a pace three times faster than its predecessor - Galaxy Note.

 

And:

Quote:
Samsung proudly announced on its official blog that sales of the Galaxy S4 has surpassed the 10 million mark in less than a month after it was released in 60 countries last April 27.
 
 

 

Samsung confirmed. . .
They (Samsung) announced . . .
Samsung executive claiming . . .
The South Korean firm said in a Twitter post  . . 
Similarly, it claims . . .
Samsung proudly announced on its official blog . . 
Samsung sang from the shitter: "Nothing stinks in here . . ."
 

Edited by mhikl - 6/13/13 at 6:15pm

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post #38 of 50
Impressive that an out dated 3.5" iPhone & a last years 4" iPhone still goes head to head with the latest 5" S4. The "war" is over when Apple come out with multiple new iPhones & sizes
post #39 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other. 

Riiiight. Apple would never have created the original iPhone in the first place if it wasn't due to a good solid threat from Samsung to invent it first. Or the iPad, MacBook Air, iPod or iMac: Apple would never have created these things without a threat from Samsung. /s

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post #40 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

FWIW - this rivalry is a necessity. Neither Samsung nor Apple would really be motivated to improve, innovate, whatever without good solid threat from each other.

 


So true, Apple and Samsung need at least one good competitor.  Good they have each other.

The others are just also rans!

 

I don't believe S4 sales are as good as desired. Here the S4 down payment is now down about 50%.

Considering Samsung has not been getting phones recently from North Korea, they definitely have a sales problem.

 

I see the difference when I walk past our Samsung and Apple stores.

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