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Editorial: What WWDC 2013 tells us about Apple - Page 3

post #81 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by CustomTB View Post


Wouldn't they both have to run on the same chip?

No. Much has been made of LLVM technology that allows retargeting of code. The c programming language and Unix are good examples where different targets run functionally equivalent software ("equivalent" not "equal" -- in the mathematical sense). Oracle RDBMS, Java, Scheme, Haskell run functionally "equivalent" software on different chipsets. 

post #82 of 139
The best AI editorial I've read so far - so this site can write good'uns after-all!
post #83 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

No. No. No. Rather than themes they need to seriously consider the strong negative feedback on iOS 7. In the words of Gordon Ramsay, "I only care about negative feedback".
Usually those the most negative speak the loudest. I'd be curious to know how much negative feedback Apple is really getting.
post #84 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Usually those the most negative speak the loudest. I'd be curious to know how much negative feedback Apple is really getting.

 

Quantity is less important than understanding who, why, and what the negative feedback is.

 

Apple listens to negative feedback (iPod Shuffle redesign backpedal, anyone?), but it has to reflect the needs of the broader population, not a particular (vocal) subset. And yes, the tech pundits and power users think they speak for everyone, but not always. I am not implying Apple dismisses any negative feedback just because it happens to be vocalized by a particular subset of users--not without understanding whether it is also shared by the broader population base.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #85 of 139

The editorial is pure fluff, all about look, feel, marketing, branding, with a fawning tone.

 

Where is the critical analysis? Were is Apple going? There is no substantial clue in the article.

 

Where is analysis of the graphic design- color, typography, usability?

 

Where is a critical analysis of functionality? After all, why buy a computer if not to use?

 

I was looking for basic improvements in Mac OS and a few have indeed come, notably screen sharing (previously inept), how long has it taken?? Also a better Safari. 

 

The progressive loss of functionality is disturbing, for example deprecation of the mouse to the trackpad which is near useless for graphic precision. The rise of the obnoxious in-your-face notification center with no easy way to turn it off so I can get on with the days work.  All this with removal of previous options such as unread mail numbers in the dock icon. Why not leave the original functionality and just add the new options?

 

And no update to iWork since 2009, 5 years!!! And no hint that there will be any improvement to this software, though we get iCloud and iOS integration which is useless for any serious business use. One of the main failures of Apple is software which is patchy at best. Aperture, the Final Cut Pro debacle.

 

And success or otherwise of the new Mac Pro will depend on professional take-up, not geeky admirers of the shape and shine. Difficulty of upgrade and customisation will strangle it, i.e. poor functionality, again.

post #86 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Quantity is less important than understanding who, why, and what the negative feedback is.

Apple listens to negative feedback (iPod Shuffle redesign backpedal, anyone?), but it has to reflect the needs of the broader population, not a particular (vocal) subset. And yes, the tech pundits and power users think they speak for everyone, but not always. I am not implying Apple dismisses any negative feedback just because it happens to be vocalized by a particular subset of users--not without understanding whether it is also shared by the broader population base.
Yep. Thing is developers are under NDA so it's hard to get an accurate picture of what people who are using it the most think. Rene Ritchie over at iMore seems to be excited, though he must be under NDA because he isn't saying a lot, just hinting.

Apple has to be saving something for the iPhone/iPad launch later this year. Is that finger print sensor technology or maybe a game controller? In the developer sessions there seemed to be a big focus on UIDynamics and this whole physics engine. Will be interesting to see what 3rd parties do with this new OS and new API's.
post #87 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicsike View Post

I would like to comment on the following statement:
"Macs aren't really priced significantly higher than generic PC's of similar built qualities and specs."
It is not quite true, but in a different direction that one may think about.
About four years ago when I switched from Windows PC to a Mac, a move I regret only for not doing it years earlier, I went on Dell's website and built a similar quality PC compared with the Mac Pro I had purchased. The Mac Pro was $100 more expensive, which compared to the $3000 something price is only 3%. This difference was a result of not being able to choose the 8GB DDR3 RAM memory for the Dell machine, only DDR2, since DDR3 was not available in the spring of 2009 for Dell.
If I would have been able to choose DDR3 RAM memory for the Dell PC the price difference would have been probably nil.
Half a year later I purchased an additional Apple computer, a 17 inch MacBook Pro.
I did the same "exercise" as for the Mac Pro and my Apple laptop came out $100 cheaper than the comparably configured Dell laptop.
So, my conclusion is: there is no price difference at all between Machines running the Apple OSX operating system compared tp machines running the Windows operating system.
Or, if still there is, it's non significant.

 

When I bought my iMac 27in in 2010 I also configured the same setup at Dell. To my surprise, the Dell came out way, way more expensive. It turned out after some research that Dell had a few sharply priced items with very limited specs, but as soon as you went to decent specs they became at least as expensive as Apple and in my case a lot more expensive. 

post #88 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by geojohn View Post

The editorial is pure fluff, all about look, feel, marketing, branding, with a fawning tone.

 

Where is the critical analysis? Were is Apple going? There is no substantial clue in the article.

 

Where is analysis of the graphic design- color, typography, usability?

 

Where is a critical analysis of functionality? After all, why buy a computer if not to use?

 

I was looking for basic improvements in Mac OS and a few have indeed come, notably screen sharing (previously inept), how long has it taken?? Also a better Safari. 

 

The progressive loss of functionality is disturbing, for example deprecation of the mouse to the trackpad which is near useless for graphic precision. The rise of the obnoxious in-your-face notification center with no easy way to turn it off so I can get on with the days work.  All this with removal of previous options such as unread mail numbers in the dock icon. Why not leave the original functionality and just add the new options?

 

And no update to iWork since 2009, 5 years!!! And no hint that there will be any improvement to this software, though we get iCloud and iOS integration which is useless for any serious business use. One of the main failures of Apple is software which is patchy at best. Aperture, the Final Cut Pro debacle.

 

And success or otherwise of the new Mac Pro will depend on professional take-up, not geeky admirers of the shape and shine. Difficulty of upgrade and customisation will strangle it, i.e. poor functionality, again.

 

"deprecation of the mouse to the trackpad which is near useless for graphic precision" How is making the best trackpad in the world deprecating the mouse? Plug in a USB wireless mouse or bluetooth mouse and go!!

 

"The rise of the obnoxious in-your-face notification center with no easy way to turn it off so I can get on with the days work." Go to settings, go to notification center (2 clicks total). Now spend 3 minutes and fine tune the apps you want showing up in notification centre or remove them all if you want. 3 freakin minutes!!!

 

"All this with removal of previous options such as unread mail numbers in the dock icon" Are you making this up? The mail app shows unread mail in the dock icon. It never went away.

 

"Difficulty of upgrade and customisation will strangle it, i.e. poor functionality, again." Welcome to 2013 where Pros can add remotely the devices they want via Thunderbolt 2 instead of having a giant box with many bays that half the pros will never use.

“What would I do? I’d shut Apple down and give the money back to the shareholders”

Michael Dell - 1997

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“What would I do? I’d shut Apple down and give the money back to the shareholders”

Michael Dell - 1997

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post #89 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


Yep. Thing is developers are under NDA so it's hard to get an accurate picture of what people who are using it the most think. Rene Ritchie over at iMore seems to be excited, though he must be under NDA because he isn't saying a lot, just hinting.

Apple has to be saving something for the iPhone/iPad launch later this year. Is that finger print sensor technology or maybe a game controller? In the developer sessions there seemed to be a big focus on UIDynamics and this whole physics engine. Will be interesting to see what 3rd parties do with this new OS and new API's.

 

The game controller SDK is huge. Not sure what it portends, but it's a sign that Apple is getting serious about iOS as a mainstream game platform. The iPod Touch/iPhone embedded in a controller sleeve together with Dual Screen gaming via $99 Apple TV should give Sony pause. Nintendo too. While the Vita has impressive mobile hardware, it's a sitting target for the rest of its existence, while Apple will keep pushing more power into the A-series chips each year. MFi controller support would open up iOS devices to much more mainstream type of games, not just games adapted to touch screen controls.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #90 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshMcCullough View Post

I thought this article was annoying and biased so I stopped reading. Then I realized it was from AppleInsider and now it all makes sense!

You were a standout in the slow class, weren't you?

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #91 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

And if OS X is now going to be named after famous California locales, then do you think that we'll see Mac OS X Hollywood? What else? Mac OS X Beverly Hills or maybe just Mac OS X 90210? Mac OS X Brentwood (OJ murders)? Mac OS X South Central?

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Mac OS X Humboldt County.1smoking.gif

 

No, I expect Apple to stick the California surf spot theme, my bet is on OS X Rincon, OS X Santa Cruz, OS X Malibu, etc.

post #92 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayz View Post

A well-researched, well-written, well-presented article. What the hell's it doing here?

I was pointing out to someone that the IOS app switcher was lifted from WebOS. They disagreed, saying that the IOS task switcher was simply the IOS Safari page switcher repurposed. His argument was that Palm simply used the Safari page switcher for something else. Not sure if I agree, but I can see his point.

Look up Apple HyperCard. It is very similar to WebOs' application switcher. Apple abandoned it years ago, and the patents likely have expired.
post #93 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Actually, Solaris is also BSD based and SUN was co-founded in 1982 by the main programmer behind Berkley Software Distribution, Bill Joy. NeXTSTEP didn't come into the picture till 1987, with a commercial ready product in 1989, NeXT Computer, i.e. The Cube.

 

Well Sun OS was 100% BSD derived but Solaris was based on SVR4. (System 5 Release 4)

SVR4 is a combination of System V, BSD and Xenix put together by AT&T and Sun Microsystems. 

post #94 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post

My wife and I own an iPad and an Ipad Mini.
We refer to them as the Maxi Pad and the Tampon.

 

So stupid! 1oyvey.gif

post #95 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicsike View Post

So, my conclusion is: there is no price difference at all between Machines running the Apple OSX operating system compared tp machines running the Windows operating system.
Or, if still there is, it's non significant.

 

Apple dropping the 17" MBP and dragging their heels on incorporating USB3 pissed me off (I sat on a USB3 I/O device for over a year before I could finally use it with a Mac) so I went looking for alternatives. I found that a similarly equipped Asus was actually a few hundred bucks cheaper, while offering USB3 instead of USB2 and a Blu-Ray burner instead of DVD.

 

My take-away was that price was similar enough to not matter, but that Asus did a better job of keeping up with technology while Apple seemed more interested in telling me what I do and do not need to do my job -- "No one uses optical anymore" and "Blu-Ray is a world of hurt" (SO?! If that's what my clients want, let ME decide whether it's worth the pain or not!) and "Why do you need USB3 when you have Thunderbolt?"

 

But I digress...

 

I agree that prices for "pro" hardware are similar across brands, but there are differences. Other brands are better than Apple when it comes to zeroing in on customization preferences. Apple has the advantage of OS X. For me, the latter matters.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

[...] The MP lasts way longer, and parts can be upgraded, which also makes it the cheapest Mac Apple has to offer.

 

Which parts can be upgraded? The only one I can identify is the power cord! 1smile.gif Oh, and the RAM sticks.

 

As for longevity, there's really no way to know yet since it hasn't yet been released. Because it employs a completely new approach to cooling, it would seem prudent to wait and see. (Note: I really LIKE the new cooling scheme and suspect it will probably be a huge improvement, but you never know FOR SURE until it spends some time in the wild.)

post #96 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noway Bro View Post

 

No, I expect Apple to stick the California surf spot theme, my bet is on OS X Rincon, OS X Santa Cruz, OS X Malibu, etc.

 

You're probably right. I'm from the opposite coast, and to be honest, I'd never even heard of Mavericks before.

post #97 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicsike View Post

I would like to comment on the following statement:
"Macs aren't really priced significantly higher than generic PC's of similar built qualities and specs."
It is not quite true, but in a different direction that one may think about.
About four years ago when I switched from Windows PC to a Mac, a move I regret only for not doing it years earlier, I went on Dell's website and built a similar quality PC compared with the Mac Pro I had purchased. The Mac Pro was $100 more expensive, which compared to the $3000 something price is only 3%. This difference was a result of not being able to choose the 8GB DDR3 RAM memory for the Dell machine, only DDR2, since DDR3 was not available in the spring of 2009 for Dell.
If I would have been able to choose DDR3 RAM memory for the Dell PC the price difference would have been probably nil.
Half a year later I purchased an additional Apple computer, a 17 inch MacBook Pro.
I did the same "exercise" as for the Mac Pro and my Apple laptop came out $100 cheaper than the comparably configured Dell laptop.
So, my conclusion is: there is no price difference at all between Machines running the Apple OSX operating system compared tp machines running the Windows operating system.
Or, if still there is, it's non significant.

I had a similar experience back in 06 comparing my iMac to the other all in ones. At that time, not only was the iMac cost competitive, but actually had better hardware for the money. I think where you you are a bit off on the pricing though, is when a Mac is nearing a refresh. Sine Apple doesn't usually change prices between refreshes, at the end of a models run, Apples prices can be higher than their competitors. I know, small nits that I am picking.
Crying? No, I am not crying. I am sweating through my eyes.
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Crying? No, I am not crying. I am sweating through my eyes.
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post #98 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post

My wife and I own an iPad and an Ipad Mini.
We refer to them as the Maxi Pad and the Tampon.

Well, whatever turns you both on. Please spare us your family scatology.
post #99 of 139
Yes macs cost a lot(with a lot of features with them for bonus) as for Mac OS is extremely powerful compared to windows, and IOS edges android for power
post #100 of 139
Quote:

Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post
 

The de-emphais on OS X version numbers may be a reflection of the fact that changes now occurring to OS X are not flashy, cyclical shifts designed to sell to a mass market audience (as they formerly have been in past releases)

I don't think I've ever seen Prince so sweepingly critical of Apple before.   Is this a recent shift of opinion, or was he that critical at the time of those releases he now feels were just fluff?

post #101 of 139
Quote:
Microsoft's "Vista" and Google's Android "Honeycomb" also seemed like odd names when they were first released, but nobody cares about them now

 

I never thought Vista was a bad or odd name for an OS.  I actually kind of liked the name.  It was the OS that was garbage.

 

Android release names, however, are amateurish and silly.  Will the one after Jellybean be Krispy Kreme or Kentucky Fried Chicken?

post #102 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

 

You're probably right. I'm from the opposite coast, and to be honest, I'd never even heard of Mavericks before.


Me either.  I imagine they will go with the less touristy sounding names. 

post #103 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

I don't think I've ever seen Prince so sweepingly critical of Apple before.   Is this a recent shift of opinion, or was he that critical at the time of those releases he now feels were just fluff?

 

Alas, in your desperation to twist things you've failed to grasp the point.

 

OS X has most certainly offered "flashy" features in "cyclical shifts designed to sell to a mass market audience," back when the Mac was Apple'e primary product. Things like Photo Booth, iChat AV/iChat Theater, Dashboard widgets and 3D Time Machine. There's nothing wrong with these things now or then, they were just evidence of Apple pushing regular new updates it once sold for $129. Apple was selling OS X as a product itself.

 

Today, Apple is upgrading OS X, and does so at nominal cost. It's $29. And OS X Mavericks appears to be the most serious, streamlined release yet. There's very little flashy feature focus, and instead it's getting quite restrained and overtly functional apps. Maps, iBooks, streamlined new Finder and Safari. 

 

The flash is (at least for now) being reserved for iOS, which is being targeted more toward the entry level consumer market.

 

It's not a value judgement, it's an observation of what's happening. 

post #104 of 139
Ask any real estate agent if they'd rather sell luxury houses to the affluent or cardboard boxes to homeless people.

This is offensive to me. I'm homeless
post #105 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrections View Post

It's not a value judgement, it's an observation of what's happening.

Thanks, Prince, for sharing with us that you believe your opinions to be distinct from others' by being the only ones which somehow aren't opinions at all, the only words which can describe how the world is.   Bravo.  I know a few folks at Cupertino who feel a bit differently about their work, but hey, all they have is their opinion....

post #106 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrail View Post

 

I never thought Vista was a bad or odd name for an OS.  I actually kind of liked the name.  It was the OS that was garbage.

 

Android release names, however, are amateurish and silly.  Will the one after Jellybean be Krispy Kreme or Kentucky Fried Chicken?

 

Key Lime Pie.  (This isn't a joke post, that's really what they're calling it.)

"Proof is irrelevant" - Solipsism
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"Proof is irrelevant" - Solipsism
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post #107 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

I wholly disagree with the author on this one point at least. OS X and iOS will merge. I'd bet my life on it.

...

In short, nothing is more certain than the merging of iOS and OSX.

Without a timeframe (not even a, "within my lifetime.") it's a sucker bet, and an empty prediction.

But, were you to say, "within the next 10 years," with an expectation that you'll live longer than that, I think you'd be a very unhappy man 10 years from now if you got anyone to take that bet.

This claim essentially asserts that Apple will have s single OS that runs on, and behaves the same across, all their platforms and on which an app written for any platform will run on all of them. I wouldn't bet a plugged nickel that that will happen within the next 10 years.
post #108 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Totems View Post

Ask any real estate agent if they'd rather sell luxury houses to the affluent or cardboard boxes to homeless people.

This is offensive to me. I'm homeless

You're offended? And yet the point stands.

By the by, the point's focus was on the agent's preference, not a judgement of the potential customer. Just a fact.
post #109 of 139
What Apple has done in the past and is clear about is that OS X is designed for desktops and laptops, and iOS is for mobile devices. Sure, Apple will leverage both OS technologies to co-exist and work together and may eventually have similar attributes in design, but they are two different OSs from a hardware/device standpoint. I don't think there will be only one OS anytime in the near or even long term because they are completely different needs and uses.

But I would expect that eventually OS X may look similar to iOS and still leverage features as time goes on, but they still are different enough to not warrant combining into one OS.

I think the iPad is going to get significantly more powerful once Apple migrates from 32 bit to 64 bit processing in terms of what can be done from a software perspective, but still different markets than the desktop/laptop markets.
post #110 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

 

I like that line. lol.gif

 

Most Android phones are cardboard boxes. All netbooks are cardboard boxes. Macbook Air ripoffs are cardboard boxes. iMac ripoffs are cardboard boxes. Almost every tablet made besides an iPad is a cardboard box. And the people who buy those things represent the homeless people. 

 

I've said this before, but I thought that this was one of Apple's best keynote's in a while.

 

And if OS X is now going to be named after famous California locales, then do you think that we'll see Mac OS X Hollywood? What else? Mac OS X Beverly Hills or maybe just Mac OS X 90210? Mac OS X Brentwood (OJ murders)? Mac OS X South Central?

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Mac OS X Humboldt County.1smoking.gif

I think you might want to not relate Android as only for homeless people.  There are homeless people that actually use iOS devices.  The Android market are predominately people that don't have or don't spend much money on mobile devices, and they may not be able because of their income levels or the fact that Apple simply doesn't market with every carrier in every country.  A lot of China Mobile users can't use Apple yet.  Once Apple signs on China Mobile, then their sales will go up and market share will also increase.  But I do know people that have been homeless or don't have much money buy Apple products.

 

Yes, I agree, it was one of Apple's best Keynotes in a while.  The new version of OS X and iOS are much more interesting, plus they had the new MacBookAirs, which was a product refresh using several new technologies as well as a sneak peak at the MacPro.  I'm still wondering if Apple shot themselves in the foot by not having PCI slots in the new MacPro and not having internal drive cages since a large number of Pros have the desire to have things internally and need PCI slots for various cards.  As cool as the box is, I'm wondering if they are going to lose some Pros in the process.  The external Thunderbolt PCI expansion chassis are very noisy and Apple can't address those products and the Pros that work in the audio and video production industry require quiet running equipment since they work in specially designed rooms where unwanted noise is a must.

 

Yeah, I'm wondering what they are going to do with future locales?  Big Sir, Shasta, Tahoe, Napa, Northstar, Bear Mountain, Heavenly, Boreal, Sierra, Yosemite, Mammoth, Mendocino, Palm Beach, San Francisco, Santa Cruz, Palo Alto, Hollywood, Cupertino are some potential names they could use, but actually, just using the moniker of the version number might be the only thing they need.  I wonder if they are going to 10.10, or if they will do OS XI release 1.0.

post #111 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by DroidFTW View Post

 

Key Lime Pie.  (This isn't a joke post, that's really what they're calling it.)

I heard their next release is 4.3.x and it's still called Jelly Bean.  Still.  Key Lime Pie is 5.x.x

post #112 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessi View Post

I think the new Mac Pro will come in a "mini" flavor.  That is to say, I think it's a reasonably economical platform.  So they can make the high end that they showed off, but by simply replacing the GPUs & CPU, they can make a cheaper version.  I wouldn't be surprised to see models as cheap as $1,299 (with more pedestrian CPUs and maybe a single GPU)

 

Not immediately, but eventually, yes this formfactor has the potential to (and therefore will) filter down across lower and lower price points with each iteration.
 
If the rumors of Apple 27-inch "retina" panels are to be believed displays are about to get extremely expensive. A 4K display purchased this year will likely exceed most users computing requirements for years to come. I'm sure the will also be prohibitively expensive to include them in the iMac lineup for now. Too many people would buy one retina iMac and hold onto it for years. Apple needs a way to decouple the display purchase from the computer purchase so the user doesn't have to shell out for the cost of a new display each time. A thunderbolt 2 driven "retina" display is a no-brainer. Traditional towers don't really fit Apple's business model in that consumers can buy cheaper individual components elsewhere instead of spending money on a new computer. Apple sort of managed this by making the previous Mac Pro bulky, heavy and (most of all) expensive. Basically as unappealing to non pro-consumers as it could be. The Mac Pro doesn't suffer from any of those problems. Sure it is upgradeable - There are 6 thunderbolt ports - but I sincerely doubt an external graphics card over the thunderbolt interface would be nearly as efficient as one soldered to the motherboard. With 4K the GPU is soon to become the system bottleneck all over again. Apple has that critical Achilles heel to prompt users to upgrade. All is well in the universe.
post #113 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

Here's Apple's cover flow for album art.





Here's a video of WebOS app switching.





Anything look familiar? The current item is more prominent while the other Apps (WebOS) or albums (cover flow) are off to the side and smaller. Albums (Apps) zoom in when they're in the middle ready for selection or actions. And cover flow was around long before anyone heard of WebOS.

Now take a look at iOS 7 task switching.




It's different from cover flow and WebOS. All the "cards" representing each App are the same size and simply scroll side-to-side with none of the zooming effects of cover flow or WebOS. The big difference is Apple has added icons below the cards. I'm not sure why Apple removed the "zooming" effect where the current App is more prominent.

Regardless, it's pretty clear WebOS got their idea from cover flow. Now take cover flow and rotate it 90 degrees. What do you get? Gee, I don't know, kinda looks like Safari tabs maybe?



Irrelevant. All the Android losers who post here don't have a clue and whenever they say "Android had this first" they're really pulling ideas from stock Android, Touchwiz, Sense or any other App they happened to see run on an Android device and attributing that feature to Android as a whole.

$1 Million question: so where do you think CoverFlow was inspired from?
A: HyperCard - designed be Bill Atkinson in 1987 for Apple.

First CEO of Palm? Donna Dubinsky. Where did she work before Palm? Apple and Claris.

Lead engineer and founder of Palm? Jeff Hawkins. Expertise? Handwriting recognition software for both Palm AND for Newton.

Fact: almost every road in computer tech has passed through Cupertino and Apple at one time or another.... and UI/GUI design does NOT take place in a vacuum or white room with no influences from the past.

Thanks to you and DED for pointing this out.

I was going ballistic last week from every single outlet saying Apple lifted design references from MS or Google... when in fact MS and Google were/are scrambling about trying to copy Apple's successes.

Not only with the devices, but the main interaction GUI... which let's never forget, was 'perfected' and brought to the masses by no other company than Apple.

For pundits to think that Apple is so disorganized that they don't have probably the best research library on campus... OF THEIR OWN WORK with GUI's over the years, is to be just blind to what continues to make Apple the absolute top tech innovation company on the planet.

Apple's internal Keynote's contain their OWN work and what to add or the best way to approach a design decision. They do NOT include a side-by-side comparison and footnotes, "we should be more like Android or Microsoft".

As SJ said once upon a time about the birth of the iPhone and iOS: "we pulled it off our shelf and said, "hey... this would make a great phone these days with the chips and hardware at our disposal. Let's do something with this".

He did not say, "we need to compete against Windows CE/Phone 5 or WebOS... and certainly not against Andy "Android" Rubin. (Apple Inc., manufacturing engineer, 1989 – 1992. General Magic, engineer, 1992 – 1995. An Apple spin-off where he participated in developing Magic Cap, an operating system and interface for hand-held mobile devices.) 1tongue.gif

The above is just one of the main actors in the "Road-trip Movie" called "Mobile Computing: Who REALLY Did It First and Where Did They Get Their Ideas From?".
Temporarily rated "R" due to the moderator's continued use of the F-Bomb pointing out how stupid, uneducated and lazy pundits are, that they can't even use search for background info. 1oyvey.gif

IDEA
Hey DED: the above idea of writing a "Roadmap to Mobile" would be right up your alley! (Sorry for all of the puns! 1smoking.gif )
Edited by ThePixelDoc - 6/17/13 at 1:21am
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #114 of 139
@Dunks and @drblank;

Re: MacPro

So you've seen the WWDC video with Mari, running on a new MacPro with 3 4k monitors? You took note of the Mari developer's reactions, quote,

"We have never seen Mari run this fast EVER!"

So what are you guys doing anyway that would cause the new MacPro's to stutter and jump?

The Pro's of today do not have ANYTHING at their disposal even half way similar to what the MacPro will offer. So... how the heck do they KNOW now what they need or want for the new MacPro in the Fall? How they KNOW that their won't be TB break-out boxes? How do the KNOW that there will be a bottle-neck... IF THEY HAVE NEVER seen, demoed, or used anything close to the MacPro with 6x 20gb Thunderbolt?

And finally: where do you get the idea that you guys have more tech knowledge than the engineers at Apple... and specifically Bob Mansfield. Who BTW was bribed with an 8 figure "Please Stay and Finish This Project" salary? I guess TC should have contacted you instead, huh?

1oyvey.gif and 1oyvey.gif to both of you !
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #115 of 139
One last post:

I personally here on AI stated that this WWDC was going to be, my quote, "Jaw-dropping awesome and revolutionary".

Trust me: I know these things! 1biggrin.gif... and 1smoking.gif for good measure.
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #116 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

No. No. No. Rather than themes they need to seriously consider the strong negative feedback on iOS 7. In the words of Gordon Ramsay, "I only care about negative feedback".

Most of the negative feedback is misinformed rants by designers who have skin in the game. The easier buttons are to design the fewer designers needed.

We aren't seeing the final iOS 7 look here, no more than we have the final OS. Most of your criticisms are probably due to that fact. Except typography that's final (and adjustable, so I don't see the issue) and the use of text in back buttons. The text running into text is just a bug, border less text is here to stay. Personally I love it - apps which use the old format seem crude now - and there is another benefit - swiping left anywhere goes back one level. Once you learn that you get to love it.

On depth - it's a mismatch. The switch button has a shadow and other buttons don't. I think there should be more shadows - between title bar content. Subtle - one pixel or two - hairline shadows.

Mostly it's great.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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post #117 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielSW View Post

Nothing is more certain than, "You're an idiot!" You won't be missed any more than Windoze 8.

He won't be missed because he thinks that iOS and OS X will merge? Where's he going?

Post reported. Also this site has moved on from insulting trolls or anti-Apple posts to insulting people with different opinions. Often people with low posts attacking people with much higher posts, sometimes for bring "trolls". That has to stop.

As for the argument - those of us who think iOS and OS X will merge really mean the APIs will merge not that you can install the Finder on an iPhone. And Apple is making many new frameworks immediately compatible with both OSes. You can write a game now for both OSes with game controller input which will work on either - just a recompile. If you need to handle touch on one and keyboard on the other then you need to worry about Appkit and UIKIT. But both are mostly the same framework, with NS renamed to UI, and non commonality in input and other minor areas.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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post #118 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

Most of the negative feedback is misinformed rants by designers who have skin in the game. The easier buttons are to design the fewer designers needed.

We aren't seeing the final iOS 7 look here, no more than we have the final OS. Most of your criticisms are probably due to that fact. Except typography that's final (and adjustable, so I don't see the issue) and the use of text in back buttons. The text running into text is just a bug, border less text is here to stay. Personally I love it - apps which use the old format seem crude now - and there is another benefit - swiping left anywhere goes back one level. Once you learn that you get to love it.

On depth - it's a mismatch. The switch button has a shadow and other buttons don't. I think there should be more shadows - between title bar content. Subtle - one pixel or two - hairline shadows.

Mostly it's great.
I liked this piece from Harry McCraken at Time magazine: http://techland.time.com/2013/06/17/ios-7/

It tracks with what a lot of what I'm seeing - that the direction Apple is going is good but its just unfinished. The question of course will be should Apple have waited until iOS 8 to introduce the new UI? I personally don't think they could afford to. Apple went over 6 months without any new product announcements. Had we gotten iOS 7 with the same interface as iOS 6 I think the backlash would have been far worse. And even more questions wondering what Apple is doing with its time.

The thing with iOS 7 is it is SO different. I don't think it's what people were expecting. You had one camp that was expecting minor tweaks on iOS 6 design (think podcasts app) and another that was expecting Windows 8. And then of course the leak prior to WWDC that called it "black, white and flat all over" had people thinking it would be black and white and boring. Then people finally see it and it's full of color and not completely flat and people go WTF? First thing I thought of when I saw it is Apple wants people to have fun with their devices. It wants them to be fun to use. And I thought about all the opportunities for 3rd party developers. To me what's most important is for Apple to keep developers wanting to develop for their platform. And reading between the lines from some who are under NDA's I get the sense developers are very happy with what they're seeing.
post #119 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

I think many people don't know what to think of iOS because it looks so different than they were expecting. They were expecting iOS 6 with the gloss and some of the worst skeuomorphism removed (think podcasts app) and that's not what we got.

Am I the only one that liked the old time tape deck?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshMcCullough View Post

I thought this article was annoying and biased so I stopped reading. Then I realized it was from AppleInsider and now it all makes sense!

That's telling considering you went to appleinsider.com to read it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

I wholly disagree with the author on this one point at least. OS X and iOS will merge. I'd bet my life on it.

So when's your funeral.
post #120 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Totems View Post

Ask any real estate agent if they'd rather sell luxury houses to the affluent or cardboard boxes to homeless people.

This is offensive to me. I'm homeless

yes, this was one of DED's not-uncommon over-reaching analogies. agents of course do not sell cardboard boxes to anyone. and the products from Apple's competition aren't that impossibly bad either. the point would have been made much better if it accurately referred to double-wides or tract homes, etc. - the actual low end of the housing market. and didn't gratuitously appropriate the homeless' misery merely for throw-away rhetoric.

 

this was an unusually restrained post by DED and very interesting too, but this one slipped through.

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