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Japan's largest carrier sees no urgency to get Apple's iPhone - Page 2

post #41 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wovel View Post


You think a 5" phone is what Apple needs for China? 1oyvey.gif

How do people think this stuff up...

 

 

The article is talking Japan not China. This is subjective, but it seems a lot of my friends who are Asian like bigger phones because they only want one device. The phone takes the place of a tablet and or computer. It seems cultural. 

post #42 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Samsung is scaling back on their oversized phones as they aren't selling nearly as well. The span of the human hand most commonly known is the target.

 

Thats because they keep putting bigger screens on them, at some point they were bound to reach a breakpoint were bigger just wont work anymore. Looks like 5" is when a phone enters the phablet territory. So anything between 4.5" and 5" is a good size for a "phone".

 

BTW did you guys looked at the S4, it beats the crap out of the iphone 5 on every metrics. Thats what an high end smartphone should look like.


Edited by herbapou - 6/27/13 at 11:21am
post #43 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yojimbo007 View Post

I love my iphone and ipad...
But wonder why apple has not put out a bigger phone yet... This is a big mistake....
Ios is competing against android available on so many manufactures ... Sizes and price points.
To compete effectively apple has to address different sizes. It boggles my mind that they are so slow and kickback about expanding the iphone lineup. Just dont get it !!!

 

Apple is not going to expand its user base until its ready to do so. OEMs don't have to worry about platform constraints... that's Google's problem and as we've witnessed from usage stats, not many "Android" smartphones are part of the platform - they're just glorified feature phones..

 

Apple has to worry about making sure the back end services that support these devices can handle the influx of requests from an expanded product line.

Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #44 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

 

 

The article is talking Japan not China. This is subjective, but it seems a lot of my friends who are Asian like bigger phones because they only want one device. The phone takes the place of a tablet and or computer. It seems cultural. 

 

I am in Canada and this is what I want too.  I dont want to carry 2 devices. Tablets at home and on vacation and the phone for commute and work. I would like a device between 4.5" and 6". What I really want is a phabet but I could settle for a big phone.

 

imo if Apple release a bigger phone, it should between 4.5" and 5" and they could keep the 4" for the few that wants that "I can edit a pic with one hand BS". Since you are not suppose to dial or text while driving I really dont get that one hand crap. Maybe being able to dial with one hand is good thing, but after that its useless imo.


Edited by herbapou - 6/27/13 at 11:26am
post #45 of 105

Very obvious comments.  A few years it was Apple or junk when it came to a smartphone.  Now, for all intents and purposes, their are options that are reasonable, and cheaper, alternatives.  I wonder what the market would look like if Apple had taken the initiative to come out with different sizes and a lower cost model a couple years ago.  

 

Like it or not the quality gap has narrowed significantly and in some respects Samsung offers more advanced features.  Arrogance or genius on Apple's part?  I guess time will tell if Apple has any other innovations up their sleeves.  Right now the more Apple talks about their innovation the less it seems like they are actually innovating.

 

Well the nice thing about all this is the cheaper share prices makes for a more efficient buyback.

post #46 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by helicopterben View Post

"Apple's phone is no longer "the god of all smartphones."   This is a very strong line by CEO in the Business world. I wonder if he was drunk during the interview or if it was his Ego coming in for some reason. By stating such line, is he thinking himself as a god by bashing Apple?

This qualifies as bashing?

You're not god. Is that bashing?
Edited by stelligent - 6/27/13 at 11:19am
post #47 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkell31 View Post

Very obvious comments.  A few years it was Apple or junk when it came to a smartphone.  Now, for all intents and purposes, their are options that are reasonable, and cheaper, alternatives.  I wonder what the market would look like if Apple had taken the initiative to come out with different sizes and a lower cost model a couple years ago.  

Like it or not the quality gap has narrowed significantly and in some respects Samsung offers more advanced features.  Arrogance or genius on Apple's part?  I guess time will tell if Apple has any other innovations up their sleeves.  Right now the more Apple talks about their innovation the less it seems like they are actually innovating.

Well the nice thing about all this is the cheaper share prices makes for a more efficient buyback.

I think there are some very good Android phones and many Android-bashers here have never really used one. They just think worshipping Apple must be accompanied by bashing everything else. But I am intrigued by the mention of more advanced features on android. What might those be?
post #48 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Samsung is scaling back on their oversized phones as they aren't selling nearly as well. The span of the human hand most commonly known is the target.

Hand size be damned. That's like saying the physical wheel wells in cars will stop "urban wheels" from getting to 30- or 40-inches, wrapped in ever-lower profile rubber bands. In the race to one-up your competition, you don't want to be seen driving a Chrysler 300 with uncool 20-inch rims.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #49 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Apple reached the limit for what a 4" premium can do. If they want a higher volume of sales (if) and more profit they need:

 

- A premium 5" line together with the premium 4" line and current models (or a iPod-like phone, with only 1 or 2 gen behind hardware, not 3 or 4);

- A cheaper iPhone together with the current 4" (oh no, don't do it like that!);

- keep doing the same thing, but let carriers putting some crapware on it.

 

If they don't do one of those, they will lose the "extra" power that's so useful to have carriers doing what they want. DoCoMo, China Mobile, etc won't need to bend to Apple's demands.

 

But a 5" premium line? Oh yes they would.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Who said something about China? But now that to mention it, yes.

 

In Europe, India and Chine is ALL about big screens. Apple can have it all, they don't even need a cheaper iPhone, just another premium 5" line. Then, 500 stores in China, 500 india, 600 Europe and Global iTunes and Ecosystem. No delays, no "US" App store crap. Just "global" app store.

 

Here, the tips for iOS domination. Give me a beer.

 

I love reading this guys posts.  First reaction I always get is "what the heck is this guy talking about"?  1confused.gif  But then afterwards I always have a good chuckle as I recognize that this is his own naive opinion (I dont think he realizes Apple does tons of research on this stuff and what he wants is not necessarily what the majority wants).  It is ALMOST as good as reading 'The Daily WTF'...

 

I'll end with this: Apple is good at figuring out what most people want or making them want something customers didn't even know they wanted.  They may make a bigger phone, they may not.  Apple will do what it thinks is best, not what some bloke on the internet who thinks he has the next best idea since sliced bread.


Edited by ExceptionHandler - 6/27/13 at 11:32am

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

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W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

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post #50 of 105
IPhone will be on the largest carrier within a few years when SoftBank grows larger than Docomo if they don't get iPhone first. Docomo marketshare in Japan is steadily decreasing.
post #51 of 105

Agreed on a bigger screen size and other innovations.

Apple(Tim Cook) should take to heart what SJ advised concerning NOT to think what SJ would do...

 

I have an iPhone 4 and considering an upgrade---and the HTC One looks very nice (vs iPhone 5).

The only thing holding me back is android (vs IOS).

 

I also chose Lightroom 4 over Aperature.

Same reason: lack of innovation and upgrade.

 

And  although I wouldn't buy Samsung for the game they play, I admire their recent innovation with the Galaxy S4 ACTIVE.

Think about it: cracked screens and water damage are the 2 primary icebergs for the iPhone.

How obvious does it need to be for Apple to bring greater value to the iPhone by simply addressing these 2 issues?!?

Or producing a 4.5 or 4.75" screen? Keep the same width, just length it 1/2 to 3/4".

Or making the screen without any border?

Honestly, we're not talking earth shaking innovations.

 

And I believe my Apple stock is sucking air because other investors see similar tail spin.

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post #52 of 105
Sony is of course Japanese, so I'm sure it is partly Japan pulling together as no.1.

Where the carriers get it wrong is that they believe its all about them.....the iphone is about the iphone for me...the carrier is merely a way for me to use it...and if I didn't have too I wouldn't!

Good to see Sony faring better... They had all that ecosystem once..... as apple do now.
post #53 of 105
Its necessary to explain the economics of the carriers - often different outside the US.

1) They lose money the day you buy the phone. Lets say that for the iPhone that is a cost on average of $450 and for Samsung it is a cost of $300.
2) They gain money per month in the contract. However the contract price outside America is not really related to the original price of the phone, you pay more for better contract terms, unlimited data, texts etc. The expensive phone is a sweetener for expensive contracts, but that's it.
3) The monthly consumer payment for iPhones and Samsung devices is about the same, so it takes longer for carriers to get the upfront iPhone costs back.
4) They also make money if you over use your phone, particularly data, but iPhones would probably be sold with unlimited data at the high end, and Apple with iMessage has potentially cost them some revenue with texts, and voice with FaceTime. Although the text and voice limit on high contracts is really high.
5) They make money from installed "crapware" and "services" on Android phones, and in fact these services - like cloud for instance - can also lock people into a carrier.

So unless the iPhone is so much better than the other phones, and so much more in demand, or you have guaranteed exclusivity there is little advantage to iPhones at the moment and far more for Android, particularly in countries where consumers prefer bigger screens.

No doubt there will be arguments but thats the reality. Me? I would give carriers a take, say 30%, of the App Store revenue - that is of Apple's take, because taking 70% of a market which is potentially twice as big as now is more than 100 % of todays market. As for crapware a compromise would be a permanent link on the app store to the carriers stuff. in the banners at the top, maybe.

And, this is Japan. No nonsense about people not paying for apps. Anyone who knows shareware knows the Japanese are the most honest consumers.

If Apple doesn't do this it doesn't really matter to most carriers whether they get the iPhone or not.
Edited by asdasd - 6/27/13 at 12:03pm
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post #54 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post


I love reading this guys posts.  First reaction I always get is "what the heck is this guy talking about"?  1confused.gif   But then afterwards I always have a good chuckle as I recognize that this is his own naive opinion (I dont think he realizes Apple does tons of research on this stuff and what he wants is not necessarily what the majority wants).  It is ALMOST as good as reading 'The Daily WTF'...

I'll end with this: Apple is good at figuring out what most people want or making them want something customers didn't even know they wanted.  They may make a bigger phone, they may not.  Apple will do what it thinks is best, not what some bloke on the internet who thinks he has the next best idea since sliced bread.

He is merely saying what he sees - and the evidence and stats show. You on the other hand are hoping for a unicorn.
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post #55 of 105

I'm a little curious how Apple would market a larger display to the public when they currently take pride in enlarging the screen "the right way" by making it taller but not wider (http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/)

post #56 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

No doubt there will be arguments but thats the reality. Me? I would give carriers a take, say 30%, of the App Store revenue - that is of Apple's take, because taking 70% of a market which is potentially twice as big as now is more than 100 % of todays market. 

 

From what I've read, Apple already shares their App Store revenue, with carriers who made it part of their deal for carrying the iPhone.

 

(Some carriers used to make some pretty good money from their own feature phone app stores.)

post #57 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


He is merely saying what he thinks he sees - and the evidence and stats show what the media and analysts want them to show. You on the other hand are hoping for a an awesome product produced by Apple.

FTFY.

 

I am just a random bloke on the internet just as he is.  It is interesting to see someone else's 'common sense' at work when it defies my own common sense.  I would argue the 4.5+" iPhone is the unicorn "bigger screen is better" enthusiasts are hoping for.  THAT really is a fictional beast until Apple releases one.

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #58 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by d4NjvRzf View Post

I'm a little curious how Apple would market a larger display to the public when they currently take pride in enlarging the screen "the right way" by making it taller but not wider (http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/)

 

The same way that they brought out the iPad mini after their CEO claimed that the original model was the minimum size for tablets, and that any smaller would require sandpapered fingertips.

post #59 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


He is merely saying what he thinks he sees - and the evidence and stats show what the media and analysts want them to show. You on the other hand are hoping for a an awesome product produced by Apple.

FTFY.

 

I am just a random bloke on the internet just as he is.  It is interesting to see someone else's 'common sense' at work when it defies my own common sense.  I would argue the 4.5+" iPhone is the unicorn "bigger screen is better" enthusiasts are hoping for.  THAT really is a fictional beast until Apple releases one.

Clearly you never used a phone with a bigger screen. Give it a day.

 

Even if inferior as a device, the bigger screen alone makes it a gazillion times better to do everything you use your iPhone for. I said 5" but I don't care it it is 4.7 or 5.01. It has to be bigger, but that that big.

 

The phone functionality is secondary for everyone I see and talk with. An iPhone with a bigger screen is simply a better iPhone for millions of people willing to pay good dollars. Every one that buys an s4, one, z, zl, z ultra, bla bla is a potential sale lost. That's how many dozens of million per quarter?

 

You don't need research, go outside. People actually love big screens, even if some people take it to the extreme with bricks, like everything else.

post #60 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by d4NjvRzf View Post

I'm a little curious how Apple would market a larger display to the public when they currently take pride in enlarging the screen "the right way" by making it taller but not wider (http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/)

 

The same way that they brought out the iPad mini after their CEO claimed that the original model was the minimum size for tablets, and that any smaller would require sandpapered fingertips.

He only said that 7" is stupid and for stupid people. Because of that they made a screen that offers 40% more real estate on portrait and called iPad mini.

post #61 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Who said something about China? But now that to mention it, yes.

In Europe, India and Chine is ALL about big screens. Apple can have it all, they don't even need a cheaper iPhone, just another premium 5" line. Then, 500 stores in China, 500 india, 600 Europe and Global iTunes and Ecosystem. No delays, no "US" App store crap. Just "global" app store.

Here, the tips for iOS domination. Give me a beer.

What makes you think iOS doesn't dominate now? Most usage statistics indicate that iOS does indeed dominate.
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post #62 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

He only said that 7" is stupid and for stupid people. Because of that they made a screen that offers 40% more real estate on portrait and called iPad mini.

That's only part of what he said. SJ also said this.
Quote:
There are clear limits of how close you can place physical elements on a touch screen, before users cannot reliably tap, flick or pinch them. This is one of the key reasons we think the 10-inch screen size is the minimum size required to create great tablet apps.

It's obvious now that SJ and whoever else was included in 'we' were mistaken.
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post #63 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Clearly you never used a phone with a bigger screen. Give it a day.

 

Even if inferior as a device, the bigger screen alone makes it a gazillion times better to do everything you use your iPhone for. I said 5" but I don't care it it is 4.7 or 5.01. It has to be bigger, but that that big.

 

The phone functionality is secondary for everyone I see and talk with. An iPhone with a bigger screen is simply a better iPhone for millions of people willing to pay good dollars. Every one that buys an s4, one, z, zl, z ultra, bla bla is a potential sale lost. That's how many dozens of million per quarter?

 

You don't need research, go outside. People actually love big screens, even if some people take it to the extreme with bricks, like everything else.

I repeat: Never. Ceases. To. Amaze. Me.

 

I do go outside.  I see more iPhones in the wild than anything else.  When I go to tech conferences, I mainly see iPhones.  At airports, I mainly see iPhones. At my church, I mainly see iPhones.  Going outside will not prove anything.  It could be that just my region and the places I travel to mainly have iPhone users.  I have not been everywhere, but from my experience, the iPhone is pretty ubiquitous.  The android big screener is the exception.  Heck, even my boss who is an android enthusiast mentioned that anything bigger than 4.3 is getting ridiculous and superfluous.  My boss and I might be in the minority, but who cares?  Apple will design a product that meets the needs of the majority based on the research and usability tests it does, not what some blokes on the internet think is best (you and me).

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #64 of 105

When talking about carriers a lot of people here seem to ignore the fact that the CEO of a carrier has to deliver to HIS shareholders ... and not to Apple shareholders.

 

So when the CEO of docomo is less than enthusiastic about the Iphone, what that really means is that it's not an attractive business proposition overall. That is what Android has brought into the game. Every Iphone that the carrier sells is simply transferring profit from the Carriers shareholders to Apple shareholders. Now that MIGHT make sense under some circumstances, but given the shift towards Android, it makes less sense than ever.  Apple COULD counteract that by reducing their margins by offering discounts to the carriers .... but they refuse to do that.

 

Then there's the problem of the ecosystem. That's also a case where apple is siphoning profit from the carriers to apple. If there's nothing, or not a lot in it for the carriers .... then they won't be interested in the deal.

 

A third aspect is the evolution of the networks. That is a high investment area .. more speed, better coverage etc. That involves high R&D (which apple doesn't seem to be willing or able to contribute to) and high capital investments. The problem is that Iphones consume more bandwidth and don't generate as much profit from this in comparison to Android, particularly mid- to low- end Android devices. So it makes more sense to the carriers to push Android rather than Iphone. .... particularly because they get better deals from the Android handset manufacturers than they get from apple.

 

So all of that adds up to the fact that Apple is not very attractive ... and its not a "must have" for the carriers. ... and becoming less so every day. They no longer have a function or performance lead. In almost every area the competition has an equivalent or better offer than Apple. They don't even have the coolness advantage that they had back in 2007.  Actually, about the only advantage that Apple seems to have held onto is in customer loyalty. Its a big advantage ... but probably not big enough as the competition gets better and better.

 

A final point is that where the Iphone has less than 50% market share (most everywhere except the USA), then the extra costs to the carrier (read lower profit) will also negatively impact the non-Iphone customers, and the calculation will fail ... why provide relatively costly services to the Iphone minority in the carrier customer base when the majority actually lose on the deal.
 

post #65 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post

I repeat: Never. Ceases. To. Amaze. Me.

 

I do go outside.  I see more iPhones in the wild than anything else.  When I go to tech conferences, I mainly see iPhones.  At airports, I mainly see iPhones. At my church, I mainly see iPhones.  Going outside will not prove anything.  It could be that just my region and the places I travel to mainly have iPhone users.  I have not been everywhere, but from my experience, the iPhone is pretty ubiquitous.  The android big screener is the exception.  Heck, even my boss who is an android enthusiast mentioned that anything bigger than 4.3 is getting ridiculous and superfluous.  My boss and I might be in the minority, but who cares?  Apple will design a product that meets the needs of the majority based on the research and usability tests it does, not what some blokes on the internet think is best (you and me).

 

Where do you live ?

In the states? Then you are right.

But when you are traveling the rest of the world, you will see more and more Samsung phones. I talked to lot of friends here in europe and there are more and more People leaving the apple eco-system. Most of the people new to the Smartphone-world are chosing android phones :-( in europe. And no, it's not only the price but more and more they want bigger screens ...

post #66 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Clearly you never used a phone with a bigger screen. Give it a day.

 

Even if inferior as a device, the bigger screen alone makes it a gazillion times better to do everything you use your iPhone for. I said 5" but I don't care it it is 4.7 or 5.01. It has to be bigger, but that that big.

 

The phone functionality is secondary for everyone I see and talk with. An iPhone with a bigger screen is simply a better iPhone for millions of people willing to pay good dollars. Every one that buys an s4, one, z, zl, z ultra, bla bla is a potential sale lost. That's how many dozens of million per quarter?

 

You don't need research, go outside. People actually love big screens, even if some people take it to the extreme with bricks, like everything else.

I repeat: Never. Ceases. To. Amaze. Me.

 

I do go outside.  I see more iPhones in the wild than anything else.  When I go to tech conferences, I mainly see iPhones.  At airports, I mainly see iPhones. At my church, I mainly see iPhones.  Going outside will not prove anything.  It could be that just my region and the places I travel to mainly have iPhone users.  I have not been everywhere, but from my experience, the iPhone is pretty ubiquitous.  The android big screener is the exception.  Heck, even my boss who is an android enthusiast mentioned that anything bigger than 4.3 is getting ridiculous and superfluous.  My boss and I might be in the minority, but who cares?  Apple will design a product that meets the needs of the majority based on the research and usability tests it does, not what some blokes on the internet think is best (you and me).

great post, if the world was only the usa. It is nothing like that in Europe and Asia, and the usa is close to saturation. What now? What do other costumers want? 

 

How good will the next iPhone be? the major factor? Dev support. If Apple continues to lose marketshare worldwide, even if they rank billions QaQ, you will see what will happen. Pretty obvious, isn't it? Another lucrative business, like the mac.

 

And that still is something great...

But it doesn't have to be like that, It has the potential to be much better. And since Apple seems like the only ones that truly innovate, it could be crucial for future projects.

post #67 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

 

I guess for a 5' tall geek maybe. I wear 34" waist pants and a 5" phone fits perfectly in my pockets... I dont mind people that prefer a 4", but at least give me a choice.

 

Have you ever seen someone put a Samsung Note or Note II up to their head while taking/making a call?  I know I chuckle when they do it.....  It reminds me of the days of the old clunky Motorola phone.  It's just funny to watch.  I guess some people will do anything to get attention.

post #68 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Have you ever seen someone put a Samsung Note or Note II up to their head while taking/making a call?  I know I chuckle when they do it.....  It reminds me of the days of the old clunky Motorola phone.  It's just funny to watch.  I guess some people will do anything to get attention.

How funny was it when smartphones first came out?
"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #69 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

great post, if the world was only the usa. It is nothing like that in Europe and Asia, and the usa is close to saturation. What now? What do other costumers want? 

 

How good will the next iPhone be? the major factor? Dev support. If Apple continues to lose marketshare worldwide, even if they rank billions QaQ, you will see what will happen. Pretty obvious, isn't it? Another lucrative business, like the mac.

 

And that still is something great...

But it doesn't have to be like that, It has the potential to be much better. And since Apple seems like the only ones that truly innovate, it could be crucial for future projects.

The market share they are losing most to is due to the following reasons:

 

1.  The ultra cheap $150 unlocked phone (Samsung Admire which is like a iPhone 3GS)

2.  The larger screen phones.

3.  Not having various large carriers like China Mobile (approx. 700 million subscribers)

4.  Apple isn't sold in as many countries (most are fairly small markets) than Android.

 

Will Apple address these?

1.  Probably not.  there is no profit in $150 unlocked phone.  I'm sure if Apple came out with an updated iPhone 4S,  charged somewhere around $350 to $399 for an unlocked version, that might help sell into the low end.  The problem is that is that market really what they want to go after.  Think of it this way, Mercedes Benz sells a lot of cars and makes a lot of money, but they don't go after the $15,000 or less car market.  They go after the $20K car market, but that's about as low as they go.  Apple is kind of like Mercedes in a lot of respects.

2.  Yes, I'm sure Apple will address this one, HOPEFULLY this year.

3.  Hopefully, Apple will sign on China Mobile.

4.  Eventually.

 

Apple can easily grow market share, if that's important.  But they aren't going to do it if it destroys their profit margin..

post #70 of 105
Quote:

Originally Posted by drblank View Post

 

The market share they are losing most to is due to the following reasons:

 

1.  The ultra cheap $150 unlocked phone (Samsung Admire which is like a iPhone 3GS)

2.  The larger screen phones.

3.  Not having various large carriers like China Mobile (approx. 700 million subscribers)

4.  Apple isn't sold in as many countries (most are fairly small markets) than Android.

 

Will Apple address these?

1.  Probably not.  there is no profit in $150 unlocked phone.  I'm sure if Apple came out with an updated iPhone 4S,  charged somewhere around $350 to $399 for an unlocked version, that might help sell into the low end.  The problem is that is that market really what they want to go after.  Think of it this way, Mercedes Benz sells a lot of cars and makes a lot of money, but they don't go after the $15,000 or less car market.  They go after the $20K car market, but that's about as low as they go.  Apple is kind of like Mercedes in a lot of respects.

2.  Yes, I'm sure Apple will address this one, HOPEFULLY this year.

3.  Hopefully, Apple will sign on China Mobile.

4.  Eventually.

 

Apple can easily grow market share, if that's important.  But they aren't going to do it if it destroys their profit margin..

And they are already seeing less profits, as the last results showed.

post #71 of 105

Interesting.  I am from the USA.  That does just go to show it is a regional thing.  I would say the majority here would place more importance on battery life and portability.  I see a larger screen as detriment to a devices portability which is why I rarely carry my iPad around with me unless I have my backpack.  Plus some of the pants I own have tight pockets (i hate that) and it makes it a real pain to get my iPhone in and out, let alone a bigger phone.  The extra screen real estate is not worth it, and if/when I would need it I usually have access to my iPad, Apple TV, and MacBook pro.  In my mind the "bigger screen" wars ended with desktops (except maybe with TVs it is still thriving?)

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #72 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post

Interesting.  I am from the USA.  That does just go to show it is a regional thing.  I would say the majority here would place more importance on battery life and portability.  I see a larger screen as detriment to a devices portability which is why I rarely carry my iPad around with me unless I have my backpack.  Plus some of the pants I own have tight pockets (i hate that) and it makes it a real pain to get my iPhone in and out, let alone a bigger phone.  The extra screen real estate is not worth it, and if/when I would need it I usually have access to my iPad, Apple TV, and MacBook pro.  In my mind the "bigger screen" wars ended with desktops (except maybe with TVs it is still thriving?)

It's not "regional" thing. The US is the exception.

post #73 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

The market share they are losing most to is due to the following reasons:

 

1.  The ultra cheap $150 unlocked phone (Samsung Admire which is like a iPhone 3GS)

2.  The larger screen phones.

3.  Not having various large carriers like China Mobile (approx. 700 million subscribers)

4.  Apple isn't sold in as many countries (most are fairly small markets) than Android.

 

Will Apple address these?

1.  Probably not.  there is no profit in $150 unlocked phone.  I'm sure if Apple came out with an updated iPhone 4S,  charged somewhere around $350 to $399 for an unlocked version, that might help sell into the low end.  The problem is that is that market really what they want to go after.  Think of it this way, Mercedes Benz sells a lot of cars and makes a lot of money, but they don't go after the $15,000 or less car market.  They go after the $20K car market, but that's about as low as they go.  Apple is kind of like Mercedes in a lot of respects.

2.  Yes, I'm sure Apple will address this one, HOPEFULLY this year.

3.  Hopefully, Apple will sign on China Mobile.

4.  Eventually.

 

Apple can easily grow market share, if that's important.  But they aren't going to do it if it destroys their profit margin..

1. I think you're spot on.

2. I doubt it.  Rumor mill is suggesting that the next gen iPhone will be like the 4 to 4s iteration which would be characteristic of Apple.  Maybe next year.  I could be wrong, after all, they are just rumors.  (I thought the iPad mini was uncharacteristic of Apple and I thought the rumors were just hot air, but here we are...).  My hope is that we don't get a bigger screen.  It would be easier for developers and simpler choice for consumers (aka choose last years model or the new model).

3. No clue.

4. No clue.

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #74 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

It's not "regional" thing. The us is the exception.

FTFY.  Capitalization error :-D

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #75 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

And they are already seeing less profits, as the last results showed.

So just continue down that road?
"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
post #76 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExceptionHandler View Post

1. I think you're spot on.

2. I doubt it.  Rumor mill is suggesting that the next gen iPhone will be like the 4 to 4s iteration which would be characteristic of Apple.  Maybe next year.  I could be wrong, after all, they are just rumors.  (I thought the iPad mini was uncharacteristic of Apple and I thought the rumors were just hot air, but here we are...).  My hope is that we don't get a bigger screen.  It would be easier for developers and simpler choice for consumers (aka choose last years model or the new model).

3. No clue.

4. No clue.

The rumor mill is not always accurate.   Look at the MacPro, was ANYONE suggesting that?  I never saw anyone post a speculation of a cylinder MacPro with anything close to those specs.

 

Apple will get China Mobile signed on, it's just a matter of when.  China Mobile has their own proprietary network and they, being as big as they are, seem to be playing hard ball.

post #77 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

And they are already seeing less profits, as the last results showed.

They were down in profits because they didn't have very good yields of components, I think that is why their profits were down, plus Samsung was also trying to raise component costs because Apple started buying some components elsewhere.

post #78 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

The rumor mill is not always accurate.   Look at the MacPro, was ANYONE suggesting that?  I never saw anyone post a speculation of a cylinder MacPro with anything close to those specs.

 

Apple will get China Mobile signed on, it's just a matter of when.  China Mobile has their own proprietary network and they, being as big as they are, seem to be playing hard ball.

That was what I was trying to convey.  In large part the MacPro was a complete surprise, although I thought there was a rumor about it having lots of thunderbolt ports (which I thought was obvious at the time).  Thats the only thing I can remember.  But you are right, they are just rumors and many have been wrong (wouldve provided an example now and in the last post but I couldnt remember any off the top of my head).

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
post #79 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

And they are already seeing less profits, as the last results showed.

So just continue down that road?

It's pretty clear what premium smartphone buyers want from the iOS owner: choice, a bigger screen. For those that live on their phones, it's a priority.

 

But then again... I guess 1 billion profit per quarter is enough to survive :) No one thinks that 9 or 10 is a failure, besides fandroids.

post #80 of 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

It's pretty clear what premium smartphone buyers want from the iOS owner: choice, a bigger screen. For those that live on their phones, it's a priority.

 

But then again... I guess 1 billion profit per quarter is enough to survive :) No one thinks that 9 or 10 is a failure, besides fandroids.

 

What exactly is the allure of having a bigger screen?  I can do everything just fine on my 4s.  When I want a bigger screen (say for watching a video), I throw it up on the Apple TV or go to my iPad.  I really don't understand this thinking of the NEED to have a bigger screen on the phone.  It just sounds so cumbersome and annoying.

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply

W. Pauli, winner of the Nobel prize in physics, said that all scientific methods fail when questions of origin are involved.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI

http://www.answersingenesis.org...

Reply
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