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Apple's Haswell-powered 15" MacBook Pro revealed in benchmark test

post #1 of 50
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A system appearing to be Apple's next-generation 15-inch MacBook Pro, featuring a quad-core Haswell processor clocked at 2.4 gigahertz, has appeared in an online benchmark test.

Benchmark


The Geekbench result for a machine identified as "AAPLJ45,1" was spotted on Tuesday by MacRumors. The test machine features 16 gigabytes of RAM and was spotted running OS X 10.9 Mavericks Build 13A2052.

The machine earned a Geekbench score of 12,497, which is comparable with current-generation 15-inch MacBook Pro models. It's likely that any MacBook Pros with Haswell would see improvements in battery life rather than horsepower, as already seen in the new Haswell-equipped MacBook Air models.

The CPU found in the assumed pre-release MacBook Pro is an Intel Core i7-4950HQ. Intel's latest-generation Core i7 mobile chips feature Iris 5200 graphics.

rMBP


The Iris moniker launched by Intel this year is a way for the chipmaker to differentiate its premium integrated graphics from the traditional "Intel HD" solution. Iris 5200 is Intel's top-of-the-line GPU option, intended to compete with Nvidia's GeForce GT 650M, a discrete GPU currently found in the 15-inch Retina MacBook Pro.

Last month, Geekbench tests also revealed what appears to be a next-generation 13-inch MacBook Pro with Intel's Haswell. That system, which featured a Core i5-4258U processor clocked at 2.4 gigahertz, earned a score of 7,140.
post #2 of 50

I don't think I ever realized before that the i7 is 75% more powerful than the i5.

post #3 of 50
Nice. My old MacBook Pro (2009) 3.06 2-core was 4717. New one is almost three times as quick. My MacPro (2010) 3.33 6-core was 15713. Not quite a MacPro but close. So when?

Eph

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Eph

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post #4 of 50
I'm not sure what the implication of this is. It is going to have a GT650m class integrated GPU along with a discrete unit?

or...

No. No that couldn't be. We won't think of such awful things.
post #5 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LighteningKid View Post

I don't think I ever realized before that the i7 is 75% more powerful than the i5.

For certain types of apps it's the preferred processor, but if you aren't running those types of apps, then you might not see that big of a difference and it might be better to spend the money on some other feature like addition SSD or a Fusion drive.  but if you have the money and run certain apps that are heavy CPU, then go for it.

 

If you do lots of video editing, trancoding, a very heavy Photoshop work, you'll benefit.  If not, and you are general user, spend the money elsewhere unless you have the extra cash.

post #6 of 50
Thinking about it for a few minutes... there's no way they'd drop the dGPU. Not yet. But that might be in the cards in the not-so-distant future.
post #7 of 50

700

post #8 of 50
I have money burning a hole in my pocket waiting for a Haswell-powered 13" Retina. Come on, Apple. Release them already haha.
post #9 of 50
Anyone want to place bets on size vs battery life? Same thickness and dramatically extended life, or roughly the same but 30% (or whatever) thinner?
post #10 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddyRevell View Post

I have money burning a hole in my pocket waiting for a Haswell-powered 13" Retina. Come on, Apple. Release them already haha.

 

You and me both. That they are waiting for Mavericks to be finalized is absolutely infuriating. I'm using Mavericks already, it's nothing worth waiting for. Release the refresh already, Cook. Stop trying to artificially increase the value and market share of your OS update by tying it to new systems. It's such a garbage tactic. 

post #11 of 50
deansolecki - They will definitely drop the discrete GPU. The Iris 5200 can almost match the 650M and can beat it in OpenCL tests. It also has the advantage of ECC memory unlike the 650M and far lower battery drain. The discrete chip is definitely going away.
post #12 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by esummers View Post

deansolecki - They will definitely drop the discrete GPU. The Iris 5200 can almost match the 650M and can beat it in OpenCL tests. It also has the advantage of ECC memory unlike the 650M and far lower battery drain. The discrete chip is definitely going away.

You make good points but Apple could offer the following configurations;

 

1. 13" rMBP using integrated Iris 5100 graphics

2. 15" rMBP using integrated Iris Pro 5200 graphics

3. 15" rMBP using integrated Iris Pro 5200 graphics + discrete GPU

post #13 of 50
My 2012 retina Ivy Bridge 2.7 GHz i7 quad-core MBP scores about 13,500 under OS X 10.6.8 and about 15,500 under Windows 7 Ultimate in Bootcamp, so no upgrady for me!
post #14 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fithian View Post

Nice. My old MacBook Pro (2009) 3.06 2-core was 4717. New one is almost three times as quick. My MacPro (2010) 3.33 6-core was 15713. Not quite a MacPro but close. So when?

Given the back to school specials are out right now... Likely Late Sept/early October at the earliest.  my guess is that they will hold off until Mavericks is released, as you can see there is no marketable performance benefit for buying one now on the spec side of the sheet.

post #15 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeanSolecki View Post

I'm not sure what the implication of this is. It is going to have a GT650m class integrated GPU along with a discrete unit?

or...

No. No that couldn't be. We won't think of such awful things.

It's not as awful as it seems and it may just be the entry model in order to get the price down so they can get rid of the old design. The performance of this chip is tested here against the 650M:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-5200-graphics-review-core-i74950hq-tested/6

In game tests, the 650M comes out around 40% faster and this year's dGPUs will be 30% faster again so I'd say 2013 dGPUs would be ~50% faster but the OpenCL compute performance of Iris is higher than the 650M.

The really important factor to consider is power consumption, which Intel puts at 47W but there's an interesting note on the Anand site here:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-5200-graphics-review-core-i74950hq-tested/5

"At the request of at least one very eager OEM, Intel is offering a higher-TDP configuration of the i7-4950HQ. Using Intel’s Extreme Tuning Utility (XTU) I was able to simulate this cTDP up configuration by increasing the sustained power limit to 55W, and moving the short term turbo power limit up to 69W. OEMs moving from a 2-chip CPU + GPU solution down to a single Iris Pro are encouraged to do the same as their existing thermal solutions should be more than adequate to cool a 55W part. I strongly suspect this is the configuration we’ll see in the next-generation 15-inch MacBook Pro with Retina Display."

The benchmarks on Anandtech may not be accurate for the rMBP because they tried to simulate the increased power but they clocked the CPU to 3.2GHz and the Geekbench test shows the standard 2.4GHz so if Apple has got a special 55W part, they might be able to allocate it better to the IGP.

Still, you'd be looking at 55W max vs 45W CPU + 45W dGPU = 90W max. As Anand rightly points out, both CPU and GPU won't typically be at maximum but the two-chip laptops can definitely draw over 90W:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1426601

So in those instances, the power adaptors shouldn't get anywhere near as hot, fan noise less and battery-life will improve. They'll most likely be able to advertise it with similar usage times as the Air. Even if the upper models have dedicated GPUs, they can shut them off.

I could actually see them using Iris Pro in the whole 15" lineup and just lowering the prices. It has been suggested in a few places that Iris was made at Apple's request. If that's the case, it makes sense for them to use it in a big way. They won't have to deal with graphics switching any more.
post #16 of 50
Yes! I was dying for new news either on the Mac mini or on Iris Pro or something! Huzzah!
post #17 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LighteningKid View Post

I don't think I ever realized before that the i7 is 75% more powerful than the i5.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fithian View Post

Nice. My old MacBook Pro (2009) 3.06 2-core was 4717. New one is almost three times as quick. My MacPro (2010) 3.33 6-core was 15713. Not quite a MacPro but close. So when?

We need to get away from the concept that a single benchmark tells you anything useful.

Under SOME tests, you get the results above. Other tests will show something entirely different. In fact, in my experience, Geekbench often UNDERestimates the performance that most people will see.

It comes down to what you're planning to do. If game fps is the most important thing to you, then you should test the game(s) you use to get their fps. If Photoshop editing is your application, then your testing should mimic Photoshop performance. And so on.

Of course, only a very small percentage of users need to care any more. Even an older system is more than adequate for what most people do. Heck, I'm typing this on a 2.33 Ghz Core 2 Duo MacBook Pro (with 3 GB RAM maximum) and the computer isn't the limiting factor other than the very rare times when I'm editing video - and that's rare enough that the little extra time doesn't hurt me.
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post #18 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


...
So in those instances, the power adaptors shouldn't get anywhere near as hot, fan noise less and battery-life will improve. They'll most likely be able to advertise it with similar usage times as the Air. Even if the upper models have dedicated GPUs, they can shut them off.

I could actually see them using Iris Pro in the whole 15" lineup and just lowering the prices. It has been suggested in a few places that Iris was made at Apple's request. If that's the case, it makes sense for them to use it in a big way. They won't have to deal with graphics switching any more.

Yeah! I can't wait to see a MacBook Pro with no AMD or nVidia dGPU... but with Intel's GPU and their magnificent drivers. I'm sure all Pro users will be happy to see such a thing happen! Why use a dGPU while doing 3D stuff or OpenCL stuff when you can use Intel integrated super powered graphics!

post #19 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View PostRelease the refresh already, Cook. Stop trying to artificially increase the value and market share of your OS update by tying it to new systems. It's such a garbage tactic. 

And you know this, how?

post #20 of 50
cash907 - Other vendors have not released any machines with this chip either. Nothing beyond 2-core, Iris 5100 and lower chips so far. It is not clear if they are waiting for Mavericks or if the machine and suppliers just are not ready.
post #21 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by heffeque View Post

Yeah! I can't wait to see a MacBook Pro with no AMD or nVidia dGPU... but with Intel's GPU and their magnificent drivers. I'm sure all Pro users will be happy to see such a thing happen! Why use a dGPU while doing 3D stuff or OpenCL stuff when you can use Intel integrated super powered graphics!

I think they will do one model with an integrated and one with discrete. It would be a disaster to do purely integrated especially for $2k+ "Pro" notebook. We'll see though.
post #22 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

That they are waiting for Mavericks to be finalized is absolutely infuriating.

Citation needed, but will never be provided, because it isn't true in the slightest, as years of evidence to the contrary prove.
Quote:
Release the refresh already, Cook. Stop trying to artificially increase the value and market share of your OS update by tying it to new systems. It's such a garbage tactic. 

Maybe stop concern trolling, too.

Originally posted by Marvin

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Originally posted by Marvin

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post #23 of 50
As far as I know, no one has said that they are waiting for Mavericks. The impressin is that they are waiting on hardware to finalize. What that hardware is, is an open question. Some think it is a new screen technology while others think it might be a wait for TB2 while others again think that it is a wait for intels new CPU to actually ship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

You and me both. That they are waiting for Mavericks to be finalized is absolutely infuriating. I'm using Mavericks already, it's nothing worth waiting for. Release the refresh already, Cook. Stop trying to artificially increase the value and market share of your OS update by tying it to new systems. It's such a garbage tactic. 
Doubtful.
post #24 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by esummers View Post

deansolecki - They will definitely drop the discrete GPU. The Iris 5200 can almost match the 650M and can beat it in OpenCL tests. It also has the advantage of ECC memory unlike the 650M and far lower battery drain. The discrete chip is definitely going away.

I'm not too sure about that! A discrete GPU would significantly enhance the OpenCL potential of the machine. Even if it is never used to drive the screen a discrete GPU is a very high value item in a Pro Machine.
post #25 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDBA View Post

And you know this, how?

He needs proof? Really? You're right- I'm sure that Mountain lion and the 2012 MacBook Air just coincidently got finalized on the same day....

Something gets held up, Whether it be the hardware or software. Personally, I like the co-launch. But to pretend that they don't delay a release for either hardware or software to co-launch with it is foolish.

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2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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post #26 of 50

Any rumors about a 15" MacBook AIR??

post #27 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by loader View Post

My 2012 retina Ivy Bridge 2.7 GHz i7 quad-core MBP scores about 13,500 under OS X 10.6.8 and about 15,500 under Windows 7 Ultimate in Bootcamp, so no upgrady for me!

Why would you upgrade a one year old machine anyways?

By the way this benchmark is for the most part useless unless the app has been recompiled for Haswell and its new technology. There are benefits for apps tht can make use of the new AVX instructions for example.
post #28 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

He needs proof? Really? You're right- I'm sure that Mountain lion and the 2012 MacBook Air just coincidently got finalized on the same day....
Of course he needs proof, there is nothing to indicate that Mavericks is the hold up here and a lot to indicate that hardware is the issue. For one thing Intel isn't even expected to ship the required chip until September.
Quote:
Something gets held up, Whether it be the hardware or software. Personally, I like the co-launch. But to pretend that they don't delay a release for either hardware or software to co-launch with it is foolish.

All you really need to do is grab a developers account to see the state of Mavericks for yourself. It has a ways to go as it is now. In other words Mavericks is no more ready than the CPU chips. Beyond that other bits of hardware are rumored to be ramping up. What is foolish is buying into the idea that anything here is even delayed. The launch schedule for Haswell has been know for six month almost, if the end of September comes and the new Mac Book Pros aren't shipping then you can say there is a delay.
post #29 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by esummers View Post

deansolecki - They will definitely drop the discrete GPU. The Iris 5200 can almost match the 650M and can beat it in OpenCL tests. It also has the advantage of ECC memory unlike the 650M and far lower battery drain. The discrete chip is definitely going away.

It is unlikely that Apple will drop the discrete GPU. It would be silly for Apple to unveil a new MacBook Pro with a GPU that is 15-25% slower than the previous generation. I believe that integrated graphics will eventually be solid for gaming, but we are not quite there yet.

 

The NVIDIA GeForce 650 was already a poor choice to include in the MacBook Pro. The odds are if somebody wants to switch to using discrete, they intend to use it for gaming and likely are plugged into an outlet. In that case, include a better gaming GPU.

post #30 of 50

Wish they would hurry up and drop a Haswell in the iMac.  I got money I need to burn too.

OMG here we go again...
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OMG here we go again...
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post #31 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMCarter3 View Post

Any rumors about a 15" MacBook AIR??

Plenty. It isn't happening, though.

Originally posted by Marvin

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Originally posted by Marvin

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post #32 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Plenty. It isn't happening, though.


I don't see a huge point in one considering the minor weight difference compared to the rmbps. You shave off a few ounces.

post #33 of 50
Cash907 View Post
That they are waiting for Mavericks to be finalized is absolutely infuriating. I'm using Mavericks already, it's nothing worth waiting for. Release the refresh already, Cook. Stop trying to artificially increase the value and market share of your OS update by tying it to new systems. It's such a garbage tactic. 

I'll jump on the dog-pile for this quote to add: Shipping hardware that soon uses outdated software is the realm of Android phones, not Macs.

 

Marvin View Post
In game tests, the 650M comes out around 40% faster and this year's dGPUs will be 30% faster again so I'd say 2013 dGPUs would be ~50% faster but the OpenCL compute performance of Iris is higher than the 650M.
[...]
I could actually see them using Iris Pro in the whole 15" lineup and just lowering the prices. It has been suggested in a few places that Iris was made at Apple's request. If that's the case, it makes sense for them to use it in a big way. They won't have to deal with graphics switching any more.

The new Mac Pro can use its second GPU for calculations, rather than being a dumb parallel board. This may be too much to hope for, but a rMBP with Iris+discrete could mean excellent graphics and OpenCL-boosted apps at the same time.

Not that I want to fire up Battlefield 4 during Final Cut exports or anything...

 

At least graphics switching is currently on the fly. Remember when that feature required logging out?

 

esummers View Post
cash907 - Other vendors have not released any machines with this chip either. Nothing beyond 2-core, Iris 5100 and lower chips so far. It is not clear if they are waiting for Mavericks or if the machine and suppliers just are not ready.

IIRC, it is related to Intel manufacturing the ultrabook-class CPU variants first.

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post #34 of 50

All this debate on a possible 15-inch without having a discrete GPU is confusing me. Maybe I'm being silly or missing something obvious, but I'm just not clear on how this benchmark is being identified as a 15-inch model.

 

If the assumption was that J44,1 (with an i5) was supposed to be a new 13" rMBP, then wouldn't it follow that the J45,1 sporting an i7 and no discrete graphics could be a high-trim model of the new 13" rMBP? It would jive with the fact that the existing 13" rMBP has an i5 and an i7 option and that both leverage the integrated graphics.

post #35 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by esummers View Post

deansolecki - They will definitely drop the discrete GPU. The Iris 5200 can almost match the 650M and can beat it in OpenCL tests. It also has the advantage of ECC memory unlike the 650M and far lower battery drain. The discrete chip is definitely going away.

There is precedent that says Apple is willing to put a iGP in a "Pro" and call it a day, but I would be very surprised if the top end MBP was restrained in this way. Unless the rMBP line took a major update, what justification would there be for doing away with the dGPU? I suppose the battery could be expanded to fill the space, although this would seem like a retro-fitting of sorts.

I'm in the camp of those that says it's too soon to drop the dGPU. It isn't unthinkable that Apple would jump the gun (they did with the 13" post-C2D MBP/MBA,) but it seems unlikely. This looks more like a move to get mid-range performance in the high-end 13"/low-end 15" without having the extra chip. This makes sense from a performance and cost perspective. Gutting the high-end graphics performance for the sake of battery life seems like a strange compromise, if they went the "retrofitted battery" direction. I'm very skeptical of this reasoning, and would bet that it won't be the case.
post #36 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by heffeque View Post

Yeah! I can't wait to see a MacBook Pro with no AMD or nVidia dGPU... but with Intel's GPU and their magnificent drivers. I'm sure all Pro users will be happy to see such a thing happen! Why use a dGPU while doing 3D stuff or OpenCL stuff when you can use Intel integrated super powered graphics!

While I think it's very unlikely that Apple wouldn't offer at least some models with discrete graphics, keep in mind that for a large percentage of users, discrete graphics (especially Haswell scale) is plenty.
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post #37 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by heffeque View Post

Yeah! I can't wait to see a MacBook Pro with no AMD or nVidia dGPU... but with Intel's GPU and their magnificent drivers. I'm sure all Pro users will be happy to see such a thing happen! Why use a dGPU while doing 3D stuff or OpenCL stuff when you can use Intel integrated super powered graphics!

I see what you did there. ;)

post #38 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post


He needs proof? Really? You're right- I'm sure that Mountain lion and the 2012 MacBook Air just coincidently got finalized on the same day....

Something gets held up, Whether it be the hardware or software. Personally, I like the co-launch. But to pretend that they don't delay a release for either hardware or software to co-launch with it is foolish.


Or maybe they wanted to release the MacBook Air first, probably it is the best selling of all Macs and then do extensive testing/tweaking on the rMBP. You know, because of the increased power consumption of the ultra high res display and all.

post #39 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by heffeque View Post

Yeah! I can't wait to see a MacBook Pro with no AMD or nVidia dGPU... but with Intel's GPU and their magnificent drivers. I'm sure all Pro users will be happy to see such a thing happen! Why use a dGPU while doing 3D stuff or OpenCL stuff when you can use Intel integrated super powered graphics!

There's one here on the left, I'm sure it sells quite well:

http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs-retina/

Like the above test showed, Iris is faster than the 650M for OpenCL, sometimes by double. 3D work doesn't require the framerates of games so no problem there, plus it has shared memory so 1GB minimum for everyone (yes it's slower but there's a special Iris model with a fast GDDR5 memory cache). It has OpenGL 4 and OpenCL 1.2 support.

For raw performance, the 2013 NVidia and AMD options would be better but not for power consumption and the performance boost would be unnoticeable for actual professional work and not gaming.

If it can lower the price considerably, improve fan noise, improve battery life and sacrifice negligible performance, I'd say it's worth doing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodGrief 
All this debate on a possible 15-inch without having a discrete GPU is confusing me. Maybe I'm being silly or missing something obvious, but I'm just not clear on how this benchmark is being identified as a 15-inch model.

The CPU in the listing is a very expensive mobile GPU and the TDP is higher than the CPU the 13" uses so it would considerably lower battery life.
post #40 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

In game tests, the 650M comes out around 40% faster and this year's dGPUs will be 30% faster again so I'd say 2013 dGPUs would be ~50% faster but the OpenCL compute performance of Iris is higher than the 650M.

The really important factor to consider is power consumption, which Intel puts at 47W 

 

This is all great news, a step forward in tech, I'm curious to how the 5200 stacks up to newer mobile GPUs, the 650M isn't the newest card out.

So the new rMBP 15 should still keep a discreet GPU & hopefully get something newer than the 650M (GTX 770M) , to make it more worthwhile, more battery will be great too.

I can see how the 5200 is a massive upgrade to the rMBP 13, the 4000 is so so.

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