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Rumor: Poor fingerprint sensor, LCD driver yields to impact 'iPhone 5S' shipments

post #1 of 65
Thread Starter 
A report out of the Far East on Tuesday claims the first batch of Apple's next-generation iPhone could be smaller than expected, thanks to poor yield rates for the handset's much rumored fingerprint sensor, as well as LCD driver chips.

TruePrint


The report comes from the hit-or-miss DigiTimes, which cited industry insiders as saying yield issues have caused volume production of "fingerprint-recognition" and LCD driver components for the so-called "iPhone 5S" to be pushed to the end of July. To make the scheduled September launch, manufacture of the parts should have started by the end of June or early July, the sources said.

According to the publication, the next-gen iPhone will use fingerprint sensors designed by AuthenTec, the biometric security firm Apple purchased for $356 million in 2012. The unnamed sources claim Apple contracted production of the chips to Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co. (TSMC), while Xintec will handle wafer-level packaging.

A possible TSMC and Xintec collaboration was first mentioned in April by KGI Securities analyst Ming-Chi Kuo, who has a reliable track record in predicting Apple's movements,

No information was given regarding the purported LCD driver problems, though Apple is widely expected to carry over the same 4-inch display from the current iPhone 5.

With the reported yield rate trouble, the publication said insiders estimate around three million iPhone 5S units will be delayed into the fourth quarter.
post #2 of 65
Speculation on top of speculation !
Compounded by reports from unnamed sources 1biggrin.gif
post #3 of 65
The other speculation said IGZO screen - anyone know how much power savings that would translate to?
post #4 of 65
I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!
post #5 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65C816 View Post

The other speculation said IGZO screen - anyone know how much power savings that would translate to?

I think it is 50% less power consumption with the Sharp IGZO screen.

post #6 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

Me too !
I not concern with story.
I also not concern with your post.
post #7 of 65
Every product has yield issues and I'm not just talking about Apple and rumors. You just manage the yield and work to make them better even if they are already acceptable. The last iMac was the only product really delayed by issues. Others seem to hit their launch window but may have taken longer than desired to reach a supply and demand balance.

Only thing interesting here may be that there are some yield issues on the fingerprint sensor. That means we may finally see it in a phone. Of course you have to believe digititimes which is not something I will do. I am fine waiting and seeing.
post #8 of 65
Don't we get some unconfirmed report from some unknown source stating delays with some component or other at about this time every year?
Edited by DaveMcM76 - 7/15/13 at 11:44pm
post #9 of 65
So, would the fingerpringt sensor be integrated into the home button?
post #10 of 65
Unknown. But yes that's what most reports expect as logical.
post #11 of 65

When new technology is implemented, troubles are expected and accounted for. Especially by Apple. This is just pure speculation about something indefinable. 

post #12 of 65

Reeks of bullshit.

post #13 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

 

I not comment on your state-of-the-art plastic purchase, but let me tell you why your korean idols not have problems with that: nobody cares. They have all the time they need, because whatever they come up with, nobody really expect it will reliably work. They not care.

post #14 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by alex101 View Post

So, would the fingerpringt sensor be integrated into the home button?

Most likely. I use fingerprint sensors often and the most logical place is near the keypad or the one button where the integration saves space.

post #15 of 65
Way too many speculations. Just wait and see.
post #16 of 65
Haha, what would any launch of a future Apple product be without crack fueled speculation from the "far east" , reported by the ever so reliable Digitimes? Digitimes should win a Pulitzer for their in depth reporting and outstanding journalism when it comes to Apple. To be honest, those bastards should be behind bars for repeatedly printing untrue lies and their pathetic attempts at illegal stock manipulation.

Here's another Apple story that is breaking today, and dare I say that it is far more news worthy and fun to talk about than this Digitimes garbage!

Man sues Apple for his porn addiction and for breaking up his marriage!1biggrin.gif

http://www.ibtimes.com/apple-sued-porn-addiction-man-says-macbook-cost-his-marriage-kids-1345831#

Jeez, is there anything in the world that Apple is not responsible for? 1smoking.gif
post #17 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

With the reported yield rate trouble, the publication said insiders estimate around three million iPhone 5S units will be delayed into the fourth quarter.

"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough."
- Mario Andretti

Sent from my iPhone Simulator

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Sent from my iPhone Simulator

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post #18 of 65
This makes since, if true, bcasue those LCDs have to go though(duh) quality control. My ex physics teacher told me why the first acrylic cinema dismays were initially so damn expensive. Poor yields and the cost was carried over to the consumer.
post #19 of 65

Apple rumors are easy:

 

November: Apple looking into holographic display company.

January: iPhone to get holographic keyboard & display.

March: Apple reportedly buying holographic camera modules, likely for next iPhone.

May: Apple to release new iPhone in late July.

July: Faulty holographic camera modules forcing Apple to push iPhone release to fall.

September: iPhone is released! (No holographic tech...)

November: Apple looking into laser warfare company.

...

post #20 of 65
Rumors generator:
Code:
rumored_features.each( function(feat) {
  if( feat.is_new() and feat.is_hardware()) {
       cout << "Rumor: delays due to low yield issues</br>";
         ++delay;
  }
  cout << "Volume production delayed " << 2 * delays << " weeks</br>";
});
post #21 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

... To make the scheduled September launch, ... around three million iPhone 5S units will be delayed into the fourth quarter.

 

I guess I missed this news. What was the release date Apple announced for the next iPhone? The one they're now missing?

 

Of course, there never was a "scheduled September launch", at least not one known outside of Apple. All this talk of being behind schedule and delays is BS. I'd be very surprised if Apple had pinpointed a date, particularly one in September, since it's not yields on fingerprint sensors and LCD drivers that will most likely determine the exact release date of the next iPhone, but the state of development of iOS 7. 

post #22 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

The report comes from the hit-or-miss DigiTimes,

In order to be 'hit or miss', don't they have to occasionally be right? We're still waiting for the first correct prediction from Digitimes, so your characterization is inaccurate.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #23 of 65
AppleInsider View Post
A report out of the Far East on Tuesday claims the first batch of Apple's next-generation iPhone could be smaller than expected...

 

I think you mean "less than expected," unless the iPhone 5S will revert to a 3.5" screen.

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[this account has been abandoned]

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post #24 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

Losing ground?  Well, let's think about this for a minute.

 

The IPhone 5 has been on the market since last Sept. That's about 10 months.  In this smartphone world, 10 months is a LONG time.  Apple traditionally has their best quarter in December and then it systematically goes down each quarter and then the December quarter blows out the previous Dec quarter.  So far, each quarter has done better than the previous year's quarter.  Each smartphone model outsells the previous year's smartphone model.

 

Now, with all of the rumors and speculation for new models to be announced, a lot of places are selling less because of this and that their are new model Android phones that are being released BEFORE the new iPhone model, so it appears as though Apple is losing ground.

 

I would wait until Apple's next model release.  Apple does well in the 3.5 and 4 inch model phones.  They make a large portion of what's been sold, they just have to release a larger screen size.  WIth this "low cost" phone, only Apple knows what it is, how much it costs to mfg and what they plan on selling it for.  Apple won't go after the $150 or less unlocked market because there is NO MONEY in it.  The only reason why Samsung and others would go after that market is to gain market share numbers to give the illusion that the company is doing well.  Sure market share numbers do have their purpose in explaining market trends, but the bottom line is Net Profits and sales growth.

 

Do you think Mercedes Benz gives a crap about market share?  Maybe only in the price range they sell into.  But at long as they make cars that have a certain profit margin and they sell more cars each year than before, then they are happy.  They just have to figure out which models to make and whether it makes sense to keep them on the price lists.  (they removed the R class because it wasn't selling) If a auto mfg wanted to increase market share, all they would have to do is put out the same crap as the next automaker at the sub-$20K market, which they don't currently make. their cheapest product line, the A class, is still around $30K, once you add options, taxes, shipping, etc.  That's their low end. Heck, even their SmartCar division aren't making inexpensive cars.  They sell a higher cost small vehicle for those that want the quality and safety of something like a Mercedes, but a small footprint with good gas mileage.   While Ford, Chevy, Toyota, etc. make and sell cars for less than $20K fully equipped.

 

But if you look at Mercedes, they sell a LOT of units.  But they are profitable and growing.

 

I agree that Apple has been losing ground in the Global smart phone and tablet sales, but they still have some relatively large cell carriers yet to sign up, and there are still some countries Apple has yet to set up shop in, and they are working on new products with new technology, along with the OS that has to be improved due to the change in management. I'll give this new OS management two years to really show us what they can do.  They've only had about 8+ months to work on iOS 7 since the management change that happened in Oct.  That's not a lot of time.  I think iOS 7 does have a lot of features we've wanted and it's just a getting used to the new design look. I think what will be more important is what the new processors, screen technology, fingerprint sensors are about.  We also have to look at where the growth really is.  Is it the $150 unlocked phone?  Apple's not dumb enough to go after that market.  If they did, they would put out a cheap version of the iPhone 3GS that ran iOS 4.  Not going to happen.  Remember, Samsung makes chips and they'd rather stuff older chips with an older OS in a phone just to break even or lose a little money rather than shutting down semiconductor plants or dumping chips into landfill and taking the write off and losing even more.  But not many others are going after that market and anyone that is, isn't making money.  

 

The most important markets for Apple are the Enterprise/Education markets, for which Apple has a lot of market share and seems to be gaining ground.

 

So, don't get all sucked into the marketing hype that market share is as important as the media portrays the scenario.  Most of these journalists change their tune daily. One day Apple's the best thing since sliced bread and the next day, they aren't.  Media people are only trying to sell newspapers "so to speak", and they'll even write a bunch of bull snot just to get people to read the article.  It's their nature, they can't help it.

 

As they say, rumors are rumors, sometimes they are true, but most of the time they aren't.  

post #25 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by OllieWallieWhiskers View Post

Apple rumors are easy:

 

November: Apple looking into holographic display company.

January: iPhone to get holographic keyboard & display.

March: Apple reportedly buying holographic camera modules, likely for next iPhone.

May: Apple to release new iPhone in late July.

July: Faulty holographic camera modules forcing Apple to push iPhone release to fall.

September: iPhone is released! (No holographic tech...)

November: Apple looking into laser warfare company.

...

Apple is already making 3D printed iPhones and iPads, they just aren't being sold, they are just for prototyping.  They'll be shipping 3D printed phones next year.  But that's just a rumor.

post #26 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vorsos View Post

 

I think you mean "less than expected," unless the iPhone 5S will revert to a 3.5" screen.

 

'Smaller' refers to the size of the batch, not the iPhone.

post #27 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

 

Yeah, Apple is totally losing ground to... what again?  What's that awesome tech that the others aren't having trouble manufacturing?

 

SockRolid said it best-- Apple yield issues are a sign of the bleeding edge tech.

post #28 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

I guess I missed this news. What was the release date Apple announced for the next iPhone? The one they're now missing?

 

Of course, there never was a "scheduled September launch", at least not one known outside of Apple. All this talk of being behind schedule and delays is BS. I'd be very surprised if Apple had pinpointed a date, particularly one in September, since it's not yields on fingerprint sensors and LCD drivers that will most likely determine the exact release date of the next iPhone, but the state of development of iOS 7. 

 

Correct...until it is announced, they are still in the engineering phase.  It is like they have to produce perfect things first time every time.  When all the issues are sorted out, they will announce and release.


Edited by icoco3 - 7/16/13 at 8:53am
post #29 of 65
Am I gonna hear these bullshit worry again and again ? Then worry about Apple cutting order parts ?
post #30 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveMcM76 View Post

Don't we get some unconfirmed report from some unknown source stating delays with some component or other at about this time every year?

Yep. That's part of my point. Every year it's rumor after rumor about everything and then rumors of issues which would be the reason why some of the rumors don't come true. Or that's what the analysts etc say" rather than the real truth which was that they were wrong from the start.

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #31 of 65
It would be funny if 5s doesn't even get fingerprint .
post #32 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

I guess I missed this news. What was the release date Apple announced for the next iPhone? The one they're now missing?

Of course, there never was a "scheduled September launch", at least not one known outside of Apple. All this talk of being behind schedule and delays is BS. I'd be very surprised if Apple had pinpointed a date, particularly one in September, since it's not yields on fingerprint sensors and LCD drivers that will most likely determine the exact release date of the next iPhone, but the state of development of iOS 7. 

Careful now. Use of logic is forbidden in the Apple world. Especially when talking about new products.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #33 of 65
This is laughable. Every single product Apple is suppose to be announcing always gets this production delay rumor coming from the far East. Except for the latest iMac and normal ramp up bugs that virtually any new product would have they never turn out to be true. I'm beginning to believe the rumors about Samsung buying off tech writers and analyst to promote negative articles on Apple.
post #34 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Apple is already making 3D printed iPhones and iPads, they just aren't being sold, they are just for prototyping.  They'll be shipping 3D printed phones next year.  But that's just a rumor.

No they won't. They will be shipping 3d printers. And kits for making your own iPhone etc. that's how they are going to handle replacing iPhones etc. you just print a new one when you break the one you have.

Well that's the cheap model. The real iPhone is the embedded one. Not really 'embedded' since the FDA etc would have approve it and they would leak it to hell. Stage one will be an ear wig set combined with display contacts/glasses and a wrist controller. All connected to a little piece in your pocket that is thin and flat like an iPod touch.it is amazing. You can shoot 3d photos and videos with the cameras that are embedded in the glasses which can be prescription, prescription sunglasses or plain sunglasses. And no having to tap the ear piece. It's all on the controller so it's easy to do it on the sly. Rumor has it that the MP etc are so good you could cam a movie and it would be full quality. Not that anyone would. And since they don't look like some freaky camera thing no one will kick you out like those goggle glass heads.

Then when they get approval they will release the really embedded one which sends sounds and visuals right to your brain and records them that way also. All from a small unit inserted into the back of your skull. Easy peasy

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #35 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

Because Sammy and HTC don't sell the same quantities as Apple does per model.

I not concerned with your post either.
post #36 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronwp54 View Post

This is laughable. Every single product Apple is suppose to be announcing always gets this production delay rumor coming from the far East. Except for the latest iMac and normal ramp up bugs that virtually any new product would have they never turn out to be true. I'm beginning to believe the rumors about Samsung buying off tech writers and analyst to promote negative articles on Apple.

 

Samsung gives away free product to journalists so they can have their own product to review is my guess.  Apple doesn't give away demos for them to keep like Samsung probably does.  Samsung pays sales reps spiff money, which is why a smartphone store rep might push Samsung, because they get Spiff money.

post #37 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Samsung gives away free product to journalists so they can have their own product to review is my guess.

No, they DO pay them off. They've been caught doing it.
Quote:
Apple doesn't give away demos for them to keep like Samsung probably does.

Walt Mossberg?

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #38 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

No, they DO pay them off. They've been caught doing it.
Walt Mossberg?

I think the review models need to be returned. That and only a select few gets one.
post #39 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

I think the review models need to be returned.

Oh, I see. I guess that makes sense.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

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post #40 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Wild View Post

I not concern with the iPhone 5S or even the 6! Purchase another state of the art phone in the mean time. Why is Samsung and HTC not having troubles like Apple has. Been a loyal Apple buyer but no longer! They seem to be loosing ground!

I think that Moto X is the first true computer phone like in Star Trek: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBGU9t7NpaA

Honestly I never thought I will see the day when you can talk and give commands without touching any button, just like in Star Trek! Unbelievable!

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