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post #41 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrENGLISH(TM) View Post

Can you imagine if the only Mac you could pick from was the Mac Pro 2012, 2010, and 2009 models? Or the 15" MacBook Pro 2012, 2011, and 2010 models - NO 13" option, NO MacBook Air models.

 

You mean, "can I imagine something that isn't true?" Why? I worry about real things.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #42 of 87

This is just the beginning. In Romania, 3 years ago, I was able to buy an iPhone 4 for 200 Euro with contract. Now you can buy an equivalent iPhone 5 for 350-400 Euro with contract. That is from all 3 major carriers. At the same time you can buy an equivalent Android phone, Galaxy 4, OneX, for 200-250 Euro with contract. The result is that the iPhone 5 is almost extinct from the market. There is only one solution for Apple if they want to survive in the future: Give up the insanely margin, be less greedy!

post #43 of 87

This "news" is very poor, therefore stupid comments, full of prejudice, made by years of no-brains propaganda don't surprise...

 

First of all, you can buy and iPhone in Russia without any kind on problem in APple stores and Svyaznoy retail chain. 

Second, I strongly believe Apple wanted this kind of outcome, since this is a very good opportunity for them to start a new sales model without mobile providers as sellers. They are unreliable and can always be bribed by personal sales bonuses from other manufacturers.

 

Russia is very important and successful market for Apple, so if Apple would believe their sales is in danger, they would make deals with mobile providers. The only conclusion is that Apple expect better profits and sales without them. Perhaps not in a shortest terms, but who cares about that, except WS pundits...

post #44 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by NelsonX View Post

This is just the beginning. In Romania, 3 years ago, I was able to buy an iPhone 4 for 200 Euro with contract. Now you can buy an equivalent iPhone 5 for 350-400 Euro with contract. That is from all 3 major carriers. At the same time you can buy an equivalent Android phone, Galaxy 4, OneX, for 200-250 Euro with contract. The result is that the iPhone 5 is almost extinct from the market. There is only one solution for Apple if they want to survive in the future: Give up the insanely margin, be less greedy!

 

that is nonsense. S4 costs app same as iPhone 5, both unlocked. You should ask your local or regional Apple representatives or distributors about price problems.  

 

what is insane margin is another story. For me it is insane that such low quality device as S4 is sold for the same price as iPhone 5.

post #45 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksec View Post


This.

The problems with Russia Carrier dropping them has absolutely nothing to do with iPhone demands. They are simply far too expensive compared to black market ones.

 

LOL. Ebay = Black Market. Yeah, ok.

post #46 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi View Post

 

that is nonsense. S4 costs app same as iPhone 5, both unlocked. You should ask your local or regional Apple representatives or distributors about price problems.  

 

what is insane margin is another story. For me it is insane that such low quality device as S4 is sold for the same price as iPhone 5.

 

Actually, I've found the S4 to be a high quality device that is popular among it's users. It's not my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean it's not perfectly drinkable.

post #47 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

 

Actually, I've found the S4 to be a high quality device that is popular among it's users. It's not my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean it's not perfectly drinkable.

 

Really? How did you find that? Here, in my office the only S4 that hasn't a broken glass is the test one. There are 3 other colleagues with same problem and one actually stopped working after 1 week of usage. Friend called to customer support continuously for 7 hours!!! After that they took phone back and told him he has to wait for all one month an half to get it "repaired", which means getting some demo used unit back. Since this happen to him also with S3, he switched to iPhone 5.

There are 7 different iPhones, none had ever had broken glass, at least not by simply carrying it around pockets.

 

There is absolutely nothing in terms of quality that is comparable to iPhone. HTC One is much better in terms of look and feel, but S4 is just good looking when taken fresh out of box. Quality? Please...

post #48 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by NelsonX View Post

This is just the beginning. In Romania, 3 years ago, I was able to buy an iPhone 4 for 200 Euro with contract. Now you can buy an equivalent iPhone 5 for 350-400 Euro with contract. That is from all 3 major carriers. At the same time you can buy an equivalent Android phone, Galaxy 4, OneX, for 200-250 Euro with contract. The result is that the iPhone 5 is almost extinct from the market. There is only one solution for Apple if they want to survive in the future: Give up the insanely margin, be less greedy!

Apple is a business and they need to charge the most they can sell the product for. That's the hard part about being a for-profit business. It sucks, but even Apple has to make their investors happy.

 

At the same time, you can't make your product so expensive that you lose sales and marketshare and eventually profits.

 

Apple isn't there yet, but my very very humble opinion is that the smartphone market is beginning to make a shift. When computers first came out they were priced so that only the wealthy could own them. Over time, it became easier and cheaper to make computers and the cost came down. I think smartphones are going to begin that trend soon. The technology in them has just become much more common than 5 years ago.

 

I don't think that Apple will go for the low end, it is Apple, but they will make a more affordable iPhone. Just like they did with macs. They're still known for making the best computers but they now sell one starting at a $1000. Much lower than the $2500 price tag of the Macintosh 128k.

post #49 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Russians illegally imported and used the first-gen iPhone when it wasn't available in their country.

Illegally imported? It was against Russian law to import a first gen iPhone? Wow, that is interesting, can you provide a link for this?

Yes, they illegally import them to avoid the taxes. If the buy them from outside of Russia legitimately and legally import them, they have to pay the import taxes which sort of ruins the point of importing them in the first place. So it isn't that importing them is illegal, but how they import them is.
Edited by Phone-UI-Guy - 7/17/13 at 3:48am
post #50 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by am8449 View Post

Isn't it interesting that all three dropped the iPhone around the same time? Maybe they are trying to gain some leverage by working in concert.

I wonder how the Russian consumer will react to this. Perhaps they'll switch carriers in droves.

 

It doesn't affect consumers at all, because almost no one in Russia buys phones from carriers anyway (which is also the reason why they decided to stop committing to sell iPhones). In Russia carriers just provide you service, and the phone you obtain separately from any retail store.

post #51 of 87
Duties and taxes are also higher than normal for Europe...

 

Dear Americans,

 

would you please for the love of (your) god learn some geography? Russia is NOT a part of Europe. I believe I already told AI about that mistake about a year before. It's Europe | Baltic and Balkan | Russia.3

 

Thank you,

someone who actually lives in Europe.

Now running on a 20" aluminium iMac (Fall 2008), as well as a Macboook Pro 13" (mid 2009) and an iPhone.
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Now running on a 20" aluminium iMac (Fall 2008), as well as a Macboook Pro 13" (mid 2009) and an iPhone.
Reply
post #52 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denmaru View Post

 

Dear Americans,

 

would you please for the love of (your) god learn some geography? Russia is NOT a part of Europe. I believe I already told AI about that mistake about a year before. It's Europe | Baltic and Balkan | Russia.3

 

Thank you,

someone who actually lives in Europe.

 

Eastern Europe ends at the Ural mountains, so a significant part of Russia is in Europe.  In fact, even just the bisected part makes it the biggest country in Europe by land area.

 

Europe is not the EU.

 

Thanks,

 

Someone else who lives in Europe.

censored

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censored

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post #53 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crowley View Post

 

Eastern Europe ends at the Ural mountains, so a significant part of Russia is in Europe.  In fact, even just the bisected part makes it the biggest country in Europe by land area.

 

Europe is not the EU.

 

Thanks,

 

Someone else who lives in Europe.

 

Great job, mate! 1biggrin.gif  You were quicker than myself. 

post #54 of 87
In
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Russians illegally imported and used the first-gen iPhone when it wasn't available in their country.

They'll do the same now.

The telecoms have only screwed themselves. So screw 'em. Who cares?

TS has spoken again, exposing his unflawed logic

Indeed, it is much easier to sell unsunsidized iPhones without distribution channel of interest than to sell subsidized iPhones through 3 distribution channels representing over 80% of the market.

Time to buy Aeroflot shares. They'll make a killing flying all the people to the nearest Apple store.
post #55 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessi View Post

iPhones will now be an even more elite status symbol in russia.

 

 

The Russians will view them as the rest of the (sensible) world does, as little more than fashion accessories or as above -a "status" symbol.

post #56 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

LOL. Ebay = Black Market. Yeah, ok.

Sarcasm? Yeah. Ok.
post #57 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post

Apple is a business and they need to charge the most they can sell the product for. That's the hard part about being a for-profit business. It sucks, but even Apple has to make their investors happy.

 

At the same time, you can't make your product so expensive that you lose sales and marketshare and eventually profits.

 

Apple isn't there yet, but my very very humble opinion is that the smartphone market is beginning to make a shift. When computers first came out they were priced so that only the wealthy could own them. Over time, it became easier and cheaper to make computers and the cost came down. I think smartphones are going to begin that trend soon. The technology in them has just become much more common than 5 years ago.

 

I don't think that Apple will go for the low end, it is Apple, but they will make a more affordable iPhone. Just like they did with macs. They're still known for making the best computers but they now sell one starting at a $1000. Much lower than the $2500 price tag of the Macintosh 128k.

 

Good post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

 

You mean, "can I imagine something that isn't true?" Why? I worry about real things.

Lol. Non-answer. He was comparing the current model - which they are going to abandon - with a similar type Mac model. And of course you can imagine things which aren't true. Like a unicorn.Which you just did imagine.

I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
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post #58 of 87
No matter how you look at this, Apple needs a growth strategy in three rather populated countries - China, Russia and India.
post #59 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post

No matter how you look at this, Apple needs a growth strategy in three rather populated countries - China, Russia and India.


Are you implying Apple doesn't have one?  If so, I would find that hard to believe.

post #60 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hudson1 View Post


Are you implying Apple doesn't have one?  If so, I would find that hard to believe.

You know very much that's not what I implied. But I understand that's how people troll.

 

Could I have written my post better so that you can't find an easy opening? Perhaps. But I just think it's not particular intelligent to spend too much time dwelling on this. If you enjoyed a moment of satisfaction from being able to snark on my remark, then you can thank me later in private.

post #61 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance View Post

 

Where are those customers going to go?  The top three carriers are no longer selling the iPhone, so it's not like people can jump ship from one to the other.  Had only one of them done this it would be a different story.

 

Exactly. Folks that still want the iPhone will just import it and activate it on the carrier of their choice. The carrier still gets the customer with none of the subisdy cost. It's a win-win for the carriers.
post #62 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denmaru View Post

Dear Americans,

would you please for the love of (your) god learn some geography? Russia is NOT a part of Europe. I believe I already told AI about that mistake about a year before. It's Europe | Baltic and Balkan | Russia.3

Thank you,
someone who actually lives in Europe.

Dear Concerned In Europe,

You'd think you'd know enough about your own continent to know that you're wrong.

Sincerely,
U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A!

1wink.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz1 View Post

TS has spoken again, exposing his unflawed logic

Funny how I'm unquestionably correct here and that you're trying to claim otherwise. How pathetic.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #63 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 
Funny how I'm unquestionably correct here and that you're trying to claim otherwise. How pathetic.

But of course you are right!
The least number of distributors, the better.
I'd say, dump them all. Apple will make a killing
post #64 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz1 View Post

I'd say, dump them all. Apple will make a killing

Because there's no market whatsoever in the hidden, the taboo, and the illegal¡ 1oyvey.gif

Why, Prohibition actually lowered the drinking of alcohol¡! 1rolleyes.gif

Took you long enough to come up with that ad-hom, by the way. Been waiting years for someone to be dumb enough to do that. lol.gif

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #65 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post

You know very much that's not what I implied. But I understand that's how people troll.

 

Could I have written my post better so that you can't find an easy opening? Perhaps. But I just think it's not particular intelligent to spend too much time dwelling on this. If you enjoyed a moment of satisfaction from being able to snark on my remark, then you can thank me later in private.


No, I didn't know that you implied something opposite of what you wrote.  That's why I phrased it as a question. 

post #66 of 87

Originally Posted by Denmaru View Post



Quote:
Dear Americans,

would you please for the love of (your) god learn some geography? Russia is NOT a part of Europe. I believe I already told AI about that mistake about a year before. It's Europe | Baltic and Balkan | Russia.3

Thank you,
someone who actually lives in Europe.

 

And did you realize that the people living in Canada, Mexico, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Peru, Brazil, etc. are all "Americans"?

post #67 of 87

A  lot of head in the sand going on.  These Russian carriers dropping the iPhone, A report that Verizon might be up for $12 Bn because of sales not meeting Apple's target.  Would Verizon continue to deal with Apple if that actually happened?  NTT in Japan won't carry the iPhone and China mobile has refused to carry it also.  All seemingly because Apple's contractual demands are too high-handed.

 

If these are all signs of a change in the wind, other carriers may start demanding better terms from Apple and their margins might begin to decline if they are forced to concede.

 

 

Quote:
More broadly, operator resentment of Apple's famously demanding contracts and high handed approach has been mounting for some time, to the extent that some major players, notably China Mobile, have refused to sell the iPhone. And if the iPhone continues to lose its magic, and cellcos can make a similar impact with other devices with lower subsidy and marketing costs, Apple will see more partners melting away.
post #68 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Dear Concerned In Europe,

You'd think you'd know enough about your own continent to know that you're wrong.

Sincerely,
U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A!

1wink.gif
Funny how I'm unquestionably correct here and that you're trying to claim otherwise. How pathetic.

 

Dear concerned US - get your own house in order:

 

1wink.gif

 

Quote:
Young Americans Geographically Illiterate, Survey Suggests
John Roach
for National Geographic News
May 2, 2006

Young adults in the United States fail to understand the world and their place in it, according to a survey-based report on geographic literacy released today.

Take Iraq, for example. Despite nearly constant news coverage since the war there began in 2003, 63 percent of Americans aged 18 to 24 failed to correctly locate the country on a map of the Middle East. Seventy percent could not find Iran or Israel.

Nine in ten couldn't find Afghanistan on a map of Asia.

And 54 percent were unaware that Sudan is a country in Africa.

Remember the December 2004 tsunami and the widespread images of devastation in Indonesia?

Three-quarters of respondents failed to find that country on a map. And three-quarters were unaware that a majority of Indonesia's population is Muslim, making it the largest Muslim country in the world.
...
 Survey results published in 2002 were also disappointing.

The 2002 project also surveyed 18- to 24-year-olds in Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Sweden, and Great Britain. The U.S. trailed every other country in that survey, except Mexico, which did only slightly worse.
...
 Half could not find New York State on a map of the United States.

A third of the respondents could not find Louisiana, and 48 percent couldn't locate Mississippi on a map of the United States, even though Hurricane Katrina put these southeastern states in the spotlight in 2005.

Many young Americans also lack basic map-reading skills.

Told they could escape an approaching hurricane by evacuating to the northwest, only two-thirds could indicate which way northwest is on a map.
post #69 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Because there's no market whatsoever in the hidden, the taboo, and the illegal¡ 1oyvey.gif

Why, Prohibition actually lowered the drinking of alcohol¡! 1rolleyes.gif

Took you long enough to come up with that ad-hom, by the way. Been waiting years for someone to be dumb enough to do that. lol.gif

 

What are you complaining about? Twice I confirmed your POV and that Apple should shut down all distributors.1biggrin.gif

Let's make this a world wide event.1cool.gif

Press release would head "we're shutting down our distribution channels to improve selling"1smoking.gif

There'd be some questions asked 1confused.gif, but the strategy would be obious1tongue.gif

 

Let's further make it the super exclusive product that sells by the kazillions. 1cool.gifOops exclusive and selling by the kazillions.1bugeye.gif

There must be some contradiction here1bugeye.gif

 

Regarding your second sentence: I am a little concerned over you comparing 3 distributors shutting out Apple with prohibition.1frown.gif

I'd call my local AA if I were you.lol.gif

post #70 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

A  lot of head in the sand going on.  These Russian carriers dropping the iPhone, A report that Verizon might be up for $12 Bn because of sales not meeting Apple's target.  Would Verizon continue to deal with Apple if that actually happened?  NTT in Japan won't carry the iPhone and China mobile has refused to carry it also.  All seemingly because Apple's contractual demands are too high-handed.

 

If these are all signs of a change in the wind, other carriers may start demanding better terms from Apple and their margins might begin to decline if they are forced to concede.

 

 

According to TS, this is actually a good thing!

 

We're trying to have the least possible distributors to sell much much more iPhones than we already do.

post #71 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeaEarleGreyHot View Post

And did you realize that the people living in Canada, Mexico, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Peru, Brazil, etc. are all "Americans"?

Don't start that crap again. You know that's not what he was talking about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Dear concerned US - get your own house in order: 1wink.gif

No European is geographically illiterate. 1rolleyes.gif1wink.gif

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #72 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


No European is geographically illiterate. 1rolleyes.gif1wink.gif


Of course some are, but far fewer than are in the US.

 

 

Quote:
The 2002 project also surveyed 18- to 24-year-olds in Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Sweden, and Great Britain. The U.S. trailed every other country in that survey, except Mexico
post #73 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Of course some are, but far fewer than are in the US.

Eh, call me when you cover the rest of Europe. There might be a reason they didn't include the rest. 1tongue.gif

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #74 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz1 View Post

In
TS has spoken again, exposing his unflawed logic

Indeed, it is much easier to sell unsunsidized iPhones without distribution channel of interest than to sell subsidized iPhones through 3 distribution channels representing over 80% of the market.

Time to buy Aeroflot shares. They'll make a killing flying all the people to the nearest Apple store.


Well, there is another article on AI today about how Tim Cook wants to sell iPhones directly from Apple retail, which makes sense because presumably they get higher margins if they sell direct. If they could sell more phones directly to customers, they could afford to drop the prices maintain their current high margins. And anybody with an Internet connection should have access to http://store.apple.com/ru .

post #75 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retrogusto View Post


Well, there is another article on AI today about how Tim Cook wants to sell iPhones directly from Apple retail, which makes sense because presumably they get higher margins if they sell direct. If they could sell more phones directly to customers, they could afford to drop the prices maintain their current high margins. And anybody with an Internet connection should have access to http://store.apple.com/ru .

 

There are already 2 direct retail channels1wink.gif

One is the Apple Store, the other the Apple Webshop.1wink.gif

 

And as Apple will probably launch a worldwide carrier - funded in part by the better margin that they get -, they'll subsidize the iPhones themselves.1smoking.gif

 

Again: I totally agree with the idea that the fewer distributors, the better it is for Apple. Kill them. All of them. And let's start doing some serious business1cool.gif

post #76 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Don't start that crap again. You know that's not what he was talking about.
 

 

Mindreader. I'm in awe for your prowess1tongue.gif

post #77 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi View Post

For me it is insane that such low quality device as S4 is sold for the same price as iPhone 5.

I'm sure it costs almost the same to build either device. Aluminium is a very inexpensive metal, it's actually cheaper than some of the polycarb plastics used in cell phones.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
Reply
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
Reply
post #78 of 87
I'm a bit confused to read about Russian operators which complain on small subsidies.
Most of phones (including iPhone) are sold here in Russia without any subsidies . Buying a phone and buying a cell contract are orthogonal things.
 
I suppose people here just won't notice that iPhone isn't presented in MTS/Beeline/Megafone stories :)
 
At least three distribution channels are remain:
 
1)
My own iPhone was bought in the Svaznoy. They are official Apple partner and number of their shops is comparable with number of an operator offices...
 
2)
Recently opened Apple online store is great alternative. I hope my next iOs device will be from there just because Apple is able to start selling before anyone else
 
3) 'gray' market. These sellers import iPhones using their own (uncontrolled by Apple) ways and offer a bit cheaper iPhones (discount ~100$) without Apple's warranty. I'm not sure that they violates laws (at least I'm not a lawyer), but it is clear that they are headache for Apple at least because we cannot trust any statistics about number of sold iPhones in Russia due high popularity of this distribution channel.
post #79 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Oak View Post

Apple should buy one of the carriers if this becomes a longer term issue. Buy a carrier, ensure market distribution and direct access to cosumers

Ditto for China and India if they run into the same issues

 

Local government will not approve the purchase.  But Apple has deep pocket for the related officials...

post #80 of 87
Quote:
Young Americans Geographically Illiterate, Survey Suggests
John Roach
for National Geographic News
May 2, 2006

Young adults in the United States fail to understand the world and their place in it, according to a survey-based report on geographic literacy released today.

Take Iraq, for example. Despite nearly constant news coverage since the war there began in 2003, 63 percent of Americans aged 18 to 24 failed to correctly locate the country on a map of the Middle East. Seventy percent could not find Iran or Israel.

Nine in ten couldn't find Afghanistan on a map of Asia.

And 54 percent were unaware that Sudan is a country in Africa.

Remember the December 2004 tsunami and the widespread images of devastation in Indonesia?

Three-quarters of respondents failed to find that country on a map. And three-quarters were unaware that a majority of Indonesia's population is Muslim, making it the largest Muslim country in the world.
...
 Survey results published in 2002 were also disappointing.

The 2002 project also surveyed 18- to 24-year-olds in Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Sweden, and Great Britain. The U.S. trailed every other country in that survey, except Mexico, which did only slightly worse.
...
 Half could not find New York State on a map of the United States.

A third of the respondents could not find Louisiana, and 48 percent couldn't locate Mississippi on a map of the United States, even though Hurricane Katrina put these southeastern states in the spotlight in 2005.

Many young Americans also lack basic map-reading skills.

Told they could escape an approaching hurricane by evacuating to the northwest, only two-thirds could indicate which way northwest is on a map.
 
This stats was way back in 2006 without the iphone.  Now young adults are much smarter with iphones.  All the answers can be just a touch away.1wink.gif
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