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Rumor: Photo may show retail packaging for Apple's low-cost "iPhone 5C" - Page 5

post #161 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

iPhone 5C stands for Color. It is a big deal to have colored iPhones like this for the first time.

 

Yes. Truly innovative.

 

 

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post #162 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

I think there is a false impression here that anodized aluminum is more easily scratched than plastic. That is far from reality. It is true, however, that scratches are better hidden on certain plastics.

I believe the poster was referring to susceptibility of scratching during the manufacturing process when it is being moved around in the assembly line in proximity to sharp instruments as it was in reply in that context.

 

I have no complaints about the anodized surface when in normal use. I've had my iPhone 5, white, since release day, still scratch free, and I don't use a case of any sort. I did use a case for a couple weeks at first fearing that the surface might scratch easily but I found it uncomfortable and discarded it. I'm happily satisfied with the finish and the materials and in no means am I suggesting that plastic is a better material. Plastic is an acceptable material for a less expensive iPhone but I really like my current metal and glass iPhone. 

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post #163 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan uff View Post

I am very surprised that this and other web sites are even giving this story the light of day. Why would Apple call something with a "C" at the end? And, when have you known for the company to use cheap plastic packaging for something as important as an iPhone?

So you think that someone has gone to the trouble of injection moulding and screen printing HUNDREDS of little boxes just to mess with our minds?

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post #164 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy View Post

So you think that someone has gone to the trouble of injection moulding and screen printing HUNDREDS of little boxes just to mess with our minds?


lol

post #165 of 217
I see a lot mixed feelings in this discussion. Truthfully, I see Apple hitting a home run with this alleged iPhone 5C. I see this phone as the iPad release all over again. A ton of criticism and mixed feelings at first, but at the end... well, we all know the story. This phone is nothing new, but it allow Apple to reach more demographics and get them hooked to their ecosystem. This iPhone is going to be less costly indeed but not cheap --as in quality. Anyone who truly knows Apple's culture knows this. I know Apple will take over --you just watch.
post #166 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy View Post

Will you go for Powder Blue, Peach Blush or Baby Puke?

All the colors for this plastic iPhone look like different shades of baby puke.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy View Post



THIS is another reason why the iPhone Color should be aluminum and not plastic.
post #167 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post

 

But that's far from beyond the point. 

 

Far from beyond the point? What does that even mean? I understand far from the point and beyond the point. But ... far from beyond the pt sounds like I am on point! :)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post

But I give Cook a lot of credit for coming to his senses and not making it available as an entry level product when the 5S hits the shelves.

Expect Apple stock, margins and profits to skyrocket next year. This is yet another prediction that I will get right.

 

Coming to his senses? The so-called iPhone lite hasn't been confirmed. And you're commending him for a change of heart on how to position a product that doesn't officially exist? Has it occurred to you, assuming the 5C is real, it was what they had in mind all along? Coming to his senses, my ass.

 

"This is yet another prediction that I will get right" - Are you that's far from beyond the point?

post #168 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I believe the poster was referring to susceptibility of scratching during the manufacturing process when it is being moved around in the assembly line in proximity to sharp instruments as it was in reply in that context.

 

I have no complaints about the anodized surface when in normal use. I've had my iPhone 5, white, since release day, still scratch free, and I don't use a case of any sort. I did use a case for a couple weeks at first fearing that the surface might scratch easily but I found it uncomfortable and discarded it. I'm happily satisfied with the finish and the materials and in no means am I suggesting that plastic is a better material. Plastic is an acceptable material for a less expensive iPhone but I really like my current metal and glass iPhone. 

Why would anodized aluminum be more susceptible to scratches in an assembly line than plastic?

post #169 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

And you know this how? Do you work at Apple?

Btw, the black HTC One scuffs too, so I suppose they don't use high grade materials either?

In Apple's own words they are using low grade 6000 series aluminum alloy, when they should have used forged 7075 T6 with a hard coat anodize and Teflon coated.

Had they done that the iPhone 5 would be far more wear and marring resistant and overall a more durable device.

Generally I think the iPhone 5 is just a pain in the ass design that requires way too much exact precision to get right.
Edited by Technarchy - 7/28/13 at 7:48pm
post #170 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Why would anodized aluminum be more susceptible to scratches in an assembly line than plastic?

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.

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post #171 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Why would anodized aluminum be more susceptible to scratches in an assembly line than plastic?

 

Jesus what's with some of you people. Let's just say that if anything happened to a plastic one, people are going to give a lot less fucks than a milled aluminum one with a crystal polished chamfered edge, a anodized coating and precision cut polished glass inserts.. some of you people are hard headed nuts. WTF is wrong with you? Jesus lol

post #172 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.

 

lol, Exactly! Why is this so hard for people to understand?

post #173 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post

 

Jesus what's with some of you people. Let's just say that if anything happened to a plastic one, people are going to give a lot less fucks than a milled aluminum one with a crystal polished chamfered edge, a anodized coating and precision cut polished glass insert.. **** you people are hard headed nuts. WTF is wrong with you? Jesus lol

The question is what's wrong with you, trying to pretend you're knowledgeable in areas foreign to you?

post #174 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

The question is what's wrong with you, trying to pretend you're knowledgeable in areas foreign to you?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Why would anodized aluminum be more susceptible to scratches in an assembly line than plastic?

 

Jesus what's with some of you people. Let's just say that if anything happened to a plastic one, people are going to give a lot less fucks than a milled aluminum one with a crystal polished chamfered edge, a anodized coating and precision cut polished glass inserts.. some of you people are hard headed nuts. WTF is wrong with you? Jesus lol

 

LOL, are you kidding me? I'm talking about things that are only obvious.

post #175 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.

Not in a properly run assembly shop. 

 

If (big if) there are hundreds of thousands of phones being returned because of scratches, it was mishandling by Foxconn. They'd have been scratched (perhaps fewer in numbers) even if the back was plastic.

 

 

Watches, cars are as intricate if not more so than iPhone 5. They don't often come with scratches. Hell, food processing plants are more intricate than smartphones. 

 

Plastic, aluminum or paper - a well designed and well run assembly line would not allow the scratching that has been alleged.

post #176 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

The question is what's wrong with you, trying to pretend you're knowledgeable in areas foreign to you?


LOL Are you kidding me? I'm only talking about things that are only obvious.

post #177 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Technarchy View Post


In Apple's own words they are using low grade 6000 series aluminum alloy, when they should have used forged 7075 T6 with a hard coat anodize and Teflon coated.

Had they done that the iPhone 5 would be far more wear and marring resistant and overall a more durable device.

Generally I think the iPhone 5 is just a pain in the ass design that requires way too much exact precision to get right.

It may be a pain to manufacture. But you're mixed up about the aluminum.

 

True, aircraft or 7075 aluminum is tougher. But you can hard-anodize 6061 aluminum just as easily. And 6061 aluminum comes in T6 variety too. So your comparison just wasn't fair or valid.

 

You do raise a good point about hard anodizing. The iPhone 5 back does not appear to be hard-anodized. In such situations, this is undesirable because it messes up tolerances. But the anodized surface is not part of any high tolerance mating surface (insofar as I can tell). So I am guessing, if indeed it isn't hard anodized, it is because of color or color consistency.

post #178 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post


LOL Are you kidding me? I'm only talking about things that are only obvious.

What you notice to be obvious.

 

As I explained to MStone above, a properly run assembly line can handle any material with a very low rate of scratches. This is not an aluminum v. plastic issue. 

 

It is true plastic would be easier and cheaper for the manufacturing process. Scratches simply should not an issue.

 

But I understand what you saying - the real facts are not obvious to you.

post #179 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.

Not in a properly run assembly shop. 

 

Good point however it does not explain events such as aluminum dust in the polishing station to explode as happened at Foxconn

 

With the current design there are literally dozens of mishaps in the wings. Even a slightly misaligned foil stamping in the last stage creates a throwaway. In the leaked designs they have selected black screen print which if accidental misaligned can be recovered with a little solvent and reapply the ink.

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post #180 of 217
C for Counterfeit. Why would Apple use a plastic box when other products are packaged in more environmentally benign paper packaging (except when the jewel box is a carrying case)?

And the messy pile of boxes look more like a small time manufacturer.

I'll be surprised if this is accurate.
post #181 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

True, however in that previous instance there were several things wrong with that photo. Producing that single fake press sheet could have been done for less than $100 where as these molded cases would require somewhere in the neighborhood of $100,000 for making the die, Of course they could have been printed on a 3D printer for considerably less so yeah they could be fake, sure. They also could be a mold for some completely unrelated product that someone just screen printed with iPhone 5C for a joke.

They look pretty real to me.
Sometimes the easy explanation is the best. Your last explanation fits the bill.

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post #182 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Good point however it does not explain events such as aluminum dust in the polishing station to explode as happened at Foxconn

That happened in mid 2011, likely during manufacturing of iPads rather than iP5? Regardless, it has nothing to do with design complexity.

post #183 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

True, however in that previous instance there were several things wrong with that photo. Producing that single fake press sheet could have been done for less than $100 where as these molded cases would require somewhere in the neighborhood of $100,000 for making the die, Of course they could have been printed on a 3D printer for considerably less so yeah they could be fake, sure. They also could be a mold for some completely unrelated product that someone just screen printed with iPhone 5C for a joke.

They look pretty real to me.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplication View Post


Sometimes the easy explanation is the best. Your last explanation fits the bill.

Likely. Lest we forget, however, that there many been case manufacturers who committed to injection molding new iPhone cases based on speculated dimensions, only to have to throw them all out.

post #184 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Not in a properly run assembly shop. 

 

If (big if) there are hundreds of thousands of phones being returned because of scratches, it was mishandling by Foxconn. They'd have been scratched (perhaps fewer in numbers) even if the back was plastic.

 

 

Watches, cars are as intricate if not more so than iPhone 5. They don't often come with scratches. Hell, food processing plants are more intricate than smartphones. 

 

Plastic, aluminum or paper - a well designed and well run assembly line would not allow the scratching that has been alleged.


Oh brother. That's nonsense.

I'll be honest with you, one of my first jobs was at a high end luxury products company, nothing to do with electronics. Anyone can come up with really far out stuff, such as that The Simpson's episode where Homer is allowed to design a car. You have to consider how they are made, what difficulties are involved and what liabilities may lie ahead. Then after all of that is figured out, have to calculate exactly what the final price the customer will have to pay. And even as luxury items go, some things just don't make financial sense.

I designed a lot of cool stuff that I had to track prototypes from design to manufacturing that never made it to retail once the numbers were crunched. So no, this is not foreign to me at all.


Edited by Ingela - 7/28/13 at 8:28pm
post #185 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post


Oh brother. That's nonsense.

I'll be honest with you, one of my first jobs was at a high end luxury products company, nothing to do with electronics. Anyone can come up with really far out stuff, such as that The Simpson's episode where Homer is allowed to design a car. You have to consider how they are made, what difficulties are involved and what liabilities may lie ahead. Then after all of that is figured out, have to calculate exactly what the final price the customer will have to pay. And even as luxury items go, some things just don't make financial sense.

I designed a lot of cool stuff that I had to track from design to manufacturing that never made it once the numbers were crunched. So no, this is not foriegn to me at all.

Oh brother, bringing up personal history (imagined or otherwise) and generalizing. Two clear signs of logical failure. Just a reminder - we were talking about whether using aluminum would lead to more scratches in a well-run assembly shop. 


Never mind, I'm done cleaning the floor with you.

post #186 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Oh brother, bringing up personal history (imagined or otherwise) and generalizing. Two clear signs of logical failure. Just a reminder - we were talking about whether using aluminum would lead to more scratches in a well-run assembly shop. 


Never mind, I'm done cleaning the floor with you.

 

 

Since cleaning the floor is probably your day job, focus on that first. lol

post #187 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.
Serious question, as I have no experience in this area, but is injection molding a one-step process? Is there any trimming of excess plastic and polishing after the piece is removed from the mold?

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post #188 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Good point however it does not explain events such as aluminum dust in the polishing station to explode as happened at Foxconn

That happened in mid 2011, likely during manufacturing of iPads rather than iP5? Regardless, it has nothing to do with design complexity.

No it has to do with a properly run shop as per your argument. Same manufacturer same designer. The specific product is not at issue.

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post #189 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplication View Post


Serious question, as I have no experience in this area, but is injection molding a one-step process? Is there any trimming of excess plastic and polishing after the piece is removed from the mold?

 Yes. But the machine is spitting them out quickly and in Apple's case probably by the thousands. Cleaning and trimming is pretty fast too. And tools to do that are far cheaper and far faster than ones to trim and polish aluminum and glass. And remember we are talking one piece vs multiple with raw materials that are far more expensive too.

post #190 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplication View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Because the multi-step process required for the machined aluminum parts is more complicated with the proximity to shape instruments in the subsequent steps verses the one step process of injection molding.
Serious question, as I have no experience in this area, but is injection molding a one-step process? Is there any trimming of excess plastic and polishing after the piece is removed from the mold?

Almost none. I have observed injection molding operations for our own products where there is not even anyone observing the machine, The pieces just drop into a bin and are carted off when full but no direct involvement is required in the process unlike our CNC operations where a dedicated operator is observing every step of the operation.

 

Sometimes if you are molding several units in a single injection you do need to cut and separate them from the tree which involves trimming by hand but that would not likely be the case with cell phone cases. They would most likely be single molds.


Edited by mstone - 7/28/13 at 8:51pm

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post #191 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

No it has to do with a properly run shop as per your argument. Same manufacturer same designer. The specific product is not at issue.

Indeed. That was my point - using aluminum makes the process more complicated but there should not be more scratches as a result if the shop was well run. To be fair, the manufacturing volume probably overwhelmed Foxconn.

 

Assuming 5S + 5C >> 5 + 4S + 4, can Foxconn plus a secondary assembly shop keep up? If so, with Samsung also still selling Galaxy S phones like hotcakes, how much manufacturing capacity is left for others? This is perhaps one of the challenges facing any company that wants to catch Apple and Samsung. It is not just about design. Logistics will be an issue, too.

post #192 of 217
After looking at the pictures of the alleged packaging, I noticed that to display the printing right-side-up, the open end of the shell would have to be the top of the package. Other people here have theorized how the plastic shells would be used with the opposite orientation. Used to display the printing correctly the iPhone would have to rest inside the shell, with some sort of cover (possibly clear).

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post #193 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Almost none. I have observed injection molding operations for our own products where there is not even anyone observing the machine, The pieces just drop into a bin and are carted off when full but no direct involvement is required in the process unlike our CNC operations where a dedicated operator is observing every step of the operation.
Thanks, didn't know.

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post #194 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Almost none. I have observed injection molding operations for our own products where there is not even anyone observing the machine, The pieces just drop into a bin and are carted off when full but no direct involvement is required in the process unlike our CNC operations where a dedicated operator is observing every step of the operation.

 

Sometimes if you are molding several units in a single injection you do need to cut and separate them from the tree which involves trimming by hand but that would not likely be the case with cell phone cases. They would most likely be single molds.

Almost none? Wouldn't that be true only for cases where either aesthetics does not matter or the design includes an automatically trimmed gate.

post #195 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy View Post

Yes. Truly innovative.

Thanks for the pathetic attempt at trolling. Works better if you read the post to which you're replying.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #196 of 217

Maybe this isn't the packaging. Maybe this is the widely rumored plastic back of the new iPhone. C stands for camera - the extra thickness accommodates some high-falluting optics that will make the Lumia 1020 look amateurish.

post #197 of 217

Regardless, I think the 5C will make stockholders very happy. When all is said and done the C will ultimately stand for cash.

post #198 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Almost none? Wouldn't that be true only for cases where either aesthetics does not matter or the design includes an automatically trimmed gate.

The less complex the mold, the looser tolerance to specifications, the less refinement by hand is required. 

Just as an example I have a friend who works on CNC for aerospace and they are so dedicated to precision that they take a titanium part and machine it for a few minutes then put it back in storage for a day to keep it from overheating. Then take it out the next day and machine it for a few more minutes over and over/. It is a matter of degrees


Edited by mstone - 7/28/13 at 9:29pm

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post #199 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by murman View Post

 

Sounds horrible, but baby puke means white, for those who think its brown or something, because that's what babies consume, milk, they puke partially digested milk (yum) ... but baby poo is naaasty!

They also eat...baby food...

Anyhoo I was just looking for a fun description of the caramel colour in the photos 1wink.gif

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post #200 of 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

Likely. Lest we forget, however, that there many been case manufacturers who committed to injection molding new iPhone cases based on speculated dimensions, only to have to throw them all out.

Who exactly is going to make 3rd party RETAIL PACKAGING?

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