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Apple retail workers file class action suit claiming lost wages over bag searches - Page 3

post #81 of 273
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Originally Posted by jumper View Post

Gee .... if I didn't like something about my job I'd quit and get a job some place else. Hope these nit-wits lose and they have to pay legal fees to Apple.
 

Why don't we throw out all minimum wage and worker safety laws while we're at it.  After all, if the workers don't like it they can quit and get a job somewhere else. It's very easy for someone who gets paid properly to put down workers who may not be.

 

The real question here is whether the security check really takes that long or whether that was a once in a while extreme case.   The other issue is why is it necessary at all?   Doesn't everything in the store have security tags on it?   Won't the security buzzer ring if an employee attempts to leave with product?    Don't they already have security cameras which would detail if an employee stole product (or cash from the register)?      And do they have so little trust in their own employees?     

 

Furthermore, with the possible exception of the geniuses, if the pay reports are accurate, they stink.  If you're a part-time student and/or living with your parents, fine..it's extra cash.    But if this is how you make your living, you can't live on it in any major city in this country.  Considering that Apple is one of the most profitable companies in the U.S., they should be the leaders in terms of providing decent pay to their workers.     $15 an hour is about $30K per year.   Back before 1986, the lowest I could pay any knowledge worker in a corporate environment was $31K.    The official inflation rate since then would make $31K $66,000 in 2013 dollars, which works out to $33 an hour.   

 

Based on the minimum wage in 1970 and adjusting for inflation, the minimum wage should be $11.08 per hour.   You'd think Apple could at least pay that. 

 

Having said that, the workers should be careful what they wish for.   Apple could start paying for the bag search time, but then cut back every employee's hours by an hour a week.   So while the workers will be paid for that time, they'll be no further ahead.  

post #82 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

After spending a good part of my youth in retail, starting in the stockroom and working my way into management, I will assure you, NO ONE takes more thank 3 minutes to check bags. Unless the managers made themselves unavailable, which I doubt. Everyone checked backs after closing, and employees were clocked out while I locked the store. No one at all complained. 

Furthermore, I would bet these employees are the same ones stealing time from the company by not being productive 100% of the time they are there, spending a 3rd of their time doing nothing. 

Companies are forced to give 15 minute breaks to people not doing much work. 

This is no more than America turning into the French, and we see what that gets you. 

Idle time is the nature of retail. Sometimes it's busy, other times not. When not, there are usually plenty of things to do, but sometimes there are not. Employees are compensated based on their time, busy or not. It's disingenuous to claim that they should trade their "idle time" for a mandatory check. The manager is derelict if his employees are insufficiently busy; he should be tasking them or reduce staff levels. If the claims are true, then the claimants should prevail.
I challenge any of you who still think the employees are being cry babies to voluntarily calculate how much time you waste during the day and give back that portion of your wages or salary. Go ahead, I'll wait...
Didn't think so.
post #83 of 273
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Originally Posted by diplication View Post

I missed it in the Bill of Rights where employees have a civil right to bring a bag to work.  If there is no such right, then what's the problem.  If you don't want your employer to waste your time, then don't bring a bag to work.  It's that simple.

 

Right on brotha... chicks can just tape tampons to their head right...

BAGS SUCK!

Down with bags and their lack of mention in the Bill of Rights...

 

Hey man, you wanna meet up and have a bag burning?

The only good bag is a dead bag.

Next thing you know, the 'Bag' gunna want to vote... and have rights n' shit...

 

1rolleyes.gif

post #84 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by acslater017 View Post

2) A bag, while not crucial, is a basic need in this line of work. They don't have desks or anything. When I first started we didn't even have lockers. How many people only go to work carrying what they have in their pockets? You want your wallet in your pants when the store is packed with 200 people? No change of clothes, no food, no drink, no shoes, no writing utensils, no business cards, no envelope openers? Nothing to read or entertain yourself at lunch? I like how people suddenly become anti-bag when it's put up against the almighty Apple.

I bring my lunch in a plastic bag; my wallet, phone, keys are carried in my pocket.

Are you telling me Apple doesn't have pens or envelope openers (use your finger)?

How many hourly workers require business cards?

You have your phone to entertain yourself. In addition, you can carry a book with you. No bag required.

Apple is a store, not a gym: leave your clothes in your car.
post #85 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by denobin View Post


I challenge any of you who still think the employees are being cry babies to voluntarily calculate how much time you waste during the day and give back that portion of your wages or salary. Go ahead, I'll wait...
Didn't think so. Hypocrites, every one of you.

But none of us are suing our employers for time lost. In lots of people's minds, it evens out in the end. 5 minutes spent in security check = 5 min chatting about Walking Dead when on the clock.
post #86 of 273
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Originally Posted by Retrogusto View Post

This whole thing is pretty silly, but somehow I feel compelled to comment. I am on salary, but I have a contract that states our official company hours. Almost nobody in the company (500+ employees in New York) works the actual hours, and most people work a lot more, certainly no "overtime" compensation. That's pretty normal in New York, and probably a lot of other places.

 

 

 

Apples and oranges.   You're not paid by the hour.   You're paid a guaranteed (if they don't fire you) annual salary and you get paid vacation, sick time, personal days, holidays, etc.    And by the way, companies who force overtime on workers who are not truly "exempt" (executives/managers who have people reporting to them) or fall into a category called "highly compensated" are breaking the law.   Technically, they are supposed to be paid overtime.    

 

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If the employees are locked into a long-term contract with penalties if they breach that contract, it would be unfair if they didn't know the terms of their employment, but I don't think that's the case here. If they weren't told ahead of time, they probably figured out after about one day that bringing a bag means that they will have to wait to be searched, on their own time. So they have choices: bring the bag, be searched and deal with it, or don't bring the bag. If we're going to be super petty, should the people who choose to bring bags get to work less productive time for the same pay, so they won't have to be searched on their own time? 

 

These are hourly positions and many are part-time.   It's not unreasonable to assume that many employees are students who need to carry bags or have other reasons for carrying bags, especially women.   

 

 

 

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My manager wants us at our seats at 9:30, but sometimes the elevator takes FOREVER to come (and it's 42 floors, so it's still faster to wait). Once I'm in the office building, should I have to wait for the elevator on my own time? (Unfortunately, I think the answer is yes.)

While it's usually not the case, I think one SHOULD be compensated for elevator time.   I'm a consultant and I bill my clients from the second I walk into their building.   It's not my fault if they took space in a building with lousy elevator service.   On the other hand, I don't generally nickel and dime them to death, so if I get a few emails when I'm not there and they don't require any research to respond to and the responses are short, I don't bill them for that time.   And perhaps more importantly, I'm well compensated.   When you get paid spit, as the Apple retail employees do, every second that you're not earning feels like an insult and being forced to clock out before your bag is checked is simply petty.    

post #87 of 273
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Originally Posted by Blitz1 
[stupidity]

So neither of you has any manner of backing for your statement (and lack thereof)?
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Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

1) People have bags. This is just reality. It's unreasonable to suggest that people not arrive at work with bags or leave their bags at home.

… Or they could not take them to work if they don't want them searched. That's sort of the point here, isn't it?
 
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2) The employees aren't the "cause" of the searches.

Try working at the Federal Reserve and deciding you get to take your spare change into the building every day and not be searched. It's ludicrous. The item is not required for the job, therefore there is no reason to expect to be paid while your employer goes out of his way to allow you to bring the item to your job.
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They will certainly say that they would prefer not to be searched on balance.

Then they can not bring their bags. Seems fairly straightforward. Maybe don't bring your guns to the airport if you don't want to be taken aside and questioned when going through security.
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3) Again, people have bags.  It's unreasonable to go for a day without your bag because some Nazi at your job says so. 

… Or they can not bring their bags in to work. Godwin's Law says you lose, in addition to that just being a terrible analogy in the first place.
post #88 of 273
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Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So neither of you has any manner of backing for your statement (and lack thereof)?

Sorry TS, women need bags. Women pants rarely have pockets. Women have purses, keys, makeup, meds, woman products, etc.
post #89 of 273
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Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Again.  Most people carry a bag of some kind.  

Enjoy your lies and insults.
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Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Sorry TS, women need bags. Women pants rarely have pockets. Women have purses, keys, makeup, meds, woman products, etc.

Again, that's just wrong. 1confused.gif
post #90 of 273
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Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

 

where is the thumbs down button?! 

 

Once more in America, we make up hardship and the sue for compensation! 

 

This has nothing to do with America.  This is basic law.  The definition of a job is that you are required to be somewhere for a certain amount of time and they pay you for it.  If they require you to be there, for whatever purpose then they should pay you.  

 

The only alternative is to pass a rule saying no bags, but that's so categorically ridiculous that only old grumps like Talest Skil would even dare to argue it. 

post #91 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

 

After spending a good part of my youth in retail, starting in the stockroom and working my way into management, I will assure you, NO ONE takes more thank 3 minutes to check bags. Unless the managers made themselves unavailable, which I doubt. Everyone checked backs after closing, and employees were clocked out while I locked the store. No one at all complained.

 

Right, so you agree that the amount of time these people have claimed to have had to wait was unreasonable.    We have someone from Costco claiming 1 minute here, and you claiming no more than 3 minutes.  When I worked in retail, the amount of times at various locations was totally negligible.  However, as I stated over and over, IF THE CLAIM IS TRUE, then the wait the employees had to go through without compensation is unreasonable and Apple should either fix the amount of time the employees have to wait or pay them for waiting. 

 

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Furthermore, I would bet these employees are the same ones stealing time from the company by not being productive 100% of the time they are there, spending a 3rd of their time doing nothing.

 

That has nothing to do with the lawsuit.  If the employees are not being productive, management should fire them, or not schedule them to be on the job when it's too slow for them to be productive.  You don't hire and schedule employees and then because you over-scheduled decide not to pay them for the time they were scheduled and at the work location ready to work.

 

Quote:

 

Companies are forced to give 15 minute breaks to people not doing much work.

 

Yes, again, there are laws that we've decided as a society are needed to benefit workers in this country.  Argue for changing the law if you don't like things like people being able to take a lunch break at work, but the law is what it is, and if Apple was in fact preventing people from having their due break time due to excessive and unreasonable wait periods, then the lawsuit has merit.

 

 

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This is no more than America turning into the French, and we see what that gets you.

 

This is no turning of anything.  These laws were established a long time ago.

post #92 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

 

For a bunch of people who stand around all day, when not taking several 15 minute break and a lunch, talking, they really have it hard don't they? 

 

That's not the point.   When you work for a company, the question is, "is it my time or your time?"    If I work for a company I expect to be paid for all the time that I'm there.  It's not my fault if the store isn't busy and the store management doesn't give me something else to do (like arranging stock, dusting, training, etc.)  I'm now a consultant and when I travel for my clients, they have to pay my regular rate, because it's not my time.   

 

If they do get 15 minute breaks, it was part of the deal.    A number of people here have claimed that, but do they for sure?      

 

Many decades ago, I worked in retail selling audio.   The manager had quit to take a better job with a distributor.   The assistant manager was sent to become manager of another branch.   As a result, our sales floor was incredibly busy.    I didn't take lunch.   I did not expect to be paid for that hour but I did it "for the team" (and I still would have made commissions on any sales during that hour, if any).     They eventually fired me and that was one of the reasons:  because I didn't take lunch that day, since taking lunch was part of the union contract.   So you can't win.   

post #93 of 273
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Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Again, that's just wrong. 1confused.gif

I don't know how that's wrong.
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Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

This has nothing to do with America.  This is basic law.  The definition of a job is that you are required to be somewhere for a certain amount of time and they pay you for it.  If they require you to be there, for whatever purpose then they should pay you.  

The definition of a job also requires working when on the clock. No socializing, texting, personal phone calls, etc. again it all evens out in the end, that's why the lawsuit is junk.
post #94 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

Companies are forced to give 15 minute breaks to people not doing much work. 

 

 

There's no such law.   It might be a union agreement, but it's not a law.  And according to this, employers do not have to compensate employees for meal time (I thought that they did), although most do.

 

Here's the Department of Labor regulation:

 

 

Quote:

Federal law does not require lunch or coffee breaks. However, when employers do offer short breaks (usually lasting about 5 to 20 minutes), federal law considers the breaks as compensable work hours that would be included in the sum of hours worked during the work week and considered in determining if overtime was worked. Unauthorized extensions of authorized work breaks need not be counted as hours worked when the employer has expressly and unambiguously communicated to the employee that the authorized break may only last for a specific length of time, that any extension of the break is contrary to the employer's rules, and any extension of the break will be punished.

Bona fide meal periods (typically lasting at least 30 minutes), serve a different purpose than coffee or snack breaks and, thus, are not work time and are not compensable.

post #95 of 273
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Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

There's no such law.   It might be a union agreement, but it's not a law.  And according to this, employers do not have to compensate employees for meal time (I thought that they did), although most do.

Here's the Department of Labor regulation:


Check state labor laws, in NYC companies are forced to give a 30 minute break for every 4 hours of work.
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"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #96 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBlongz View Post

They should be compensated for any extra time on work premises while under the authority of the employer.  Doing a search is work...work = compensation.  This is a shame for a company who's products I enjoy.
The option to take a bag or whatever along is totally up to the employee. Frankly any "bag" that takes more than a minute to search should be used to whack the employee over the head. Going to work is well work, not a tropical vacation.
post #97 of 273
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Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Check state labor laws, in NYC companies are forced to give a 30 minute break for every 4 hours of work.

Actually in New York it is an hour for lunch. There is no specific requirement for a break.
post #98 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

There's no such law.   It might be a union agreement, but it's not a law.  And according to this, employers do not have to compensate employees for meal time (I thought that they did), although most do.

Here's the Department of Labor regulation:


Many states have laws regarding paid breaks. In my state, we're required to provide a paid 15 minute break for every 4 hours worked, in addition to an unpaid 30 minute meal break.
post #99 of 273
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Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Your an idiot.  It has nothing to do with civil rights.  People have bags.  Most people have bags.  Students especially have bags.  The idea that people should not bring their bags to work is as faulty as arguing that they should all wear clothes without pockets.  

I can pretty much guarantee that everyone making this stupid stupid argument about bags is some kind of old dude with a car that only has his keys and his overstuffed wallet to carry.  

Again.  Most people carry a bag of some kind.  

You have a bias toward people without cars, based on your other comments. So obviously you think the majority of people carry bags.

I rarely ever carry a bag.

And lots of people have cars.
post #100 of 273
Do these people have documentation of how much time was being "wasted"? It sounds like an exaggeration.

Most other retail stores have similar bag checks. Not just Apple.
post #101 of 273
``At the end of a shift, as well as when clocking out to leave for a meal break, Apple's hourly retail employees must submit to "personal package and bag searches," during which the employees are off-the-clock. The complaint notes that these checks are "significant, integral, indispensable... and done solely for Apple's benefit to prevent employee pilferage."


Boo hoo. You're in retail. Grow up. People steal reliably. It's retail. Don't work in it if it offends you, or better yet? Don't carry in a bag. Just bring your ID and a credit-card for lunch.
post #102 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Your an idiot.  It has nothing to do with civil rights.  People have bags.  Most people have bags.  Students especially have bags.  The idea that people should not bring their bags to work is as faulty as arguing that they should all wear clothes without pockets.  
It is an option that is entirely up to the employee.
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I can pretty much guarantee that everyone making this stupid stupid argument about bags is some kind of old dude with a car that only has his keys and his overstuffed wallet to carry.  
Well ok you got me!😂😂😉😉😃😃

But seriously you really don't know what your are talking about. I work in a very large plant and seldom see people carrying bags in and out. Being a highly regulated environment, with clean rooms, air locks and etcetera there is a lot of good reason to leave your junk at home. Even then some employees do exercise the option to bring in junk and store it in their lockers.
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Again.  Most people carry a bag of some kind.  
Hardly. Hell I know a few dykes that never carry a bag. You can't make a generalized statements about a persons sex or form of employment. For example a dyke going to knight school may have a giant laptop back pack with her on a regular schedule.

A company like mine can reserve the right to search bags but here is the thing, the only time the could do so and make it legal is to do the search after you clock out. After all it is no different than shop lifting, if the store wants a shop lifting case to stick they have to grab you as you leave the store with unpaid goods. Otherwise there is always the plausible argument that the person intended to pay for the item when they leave. Since the company is effectively trying to prevent shop lifting the employee realistically has to be off the clock.
post #103 of 273
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Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Again, that's just wrong. 1confused.gif

 

You obviously profound unfamiliarity with the female gender explains a lot.

post #104 of 273
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Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

You obviously profound unfamiliarity with the female gender explains a lot.

And yet not a single one of you can prove that people actually carry bags, much less that they are somehow magically forced to carry said bags into their place of employment. All you can do is bandy insults and ludicrous statements about the pockets on women's pants.

This. Case. Has. No. Hope.
post #105 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

There's no such law.   It might be a union agreement, but it's not a law.  And according to this, employers do not have to compensate employees for meal time (I thought that they did), although most do.

Here's the Department of Labor regulation:


You're right - it's not a Federal law, but a large number of states require it. So if they're really taking 10-15 minutes out of the employee's break time both before and after break, they'd be in violation of state laws.

Since prosecution under state laws is a criminal matter and they wouldn't have to hire attorneys, my point remains. If Apple was really doing this, why haven't they filed a criminal complaint?

It just doesn't ring true:
1. No complaint about insufficient time for lunch.
2. The only people complaining are FORMER employees.
3. We never heard anything about it while they were working.
4. There's no way it takes 10-15 minutes to search a bag. I used to have to do it for retail employees and it takes about 15 seconds.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
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post #106 of 273
You are going to great lengths to twist logic around here.

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Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Wow.  You are totally wrong on all three points.  Also, you appear to actually be Adolf Hitler.  
The insanity of your statement is beyond compare. This isn't about hitler.
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1) People have bags. This is just reality. It's unreasonable to suggest that people not arrive at work with bags or leave their bags at home.  
The only thing they are doing here is searching bags. The option to bring in a bag is entirely up to the employee.
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2) The employees aren't the "cause" of the searches.  Ask them.  They will certainly say that they would prefer not to be searched on balance. 
Bull crap, employees with sticky fingers are the only reason such policies are enacted. Sure it is a problem for some people to be searched but a rational person would change behavior to minimize the problem.
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3) Again, people have bags.  It's unreasonable to go for a day without your bag because some Nazi at your job says so. 

It happens all the time in many industries. It isn't about being a Nazi. There are many reasons for heavy regulation of the work environment. For example the pharmaceutical industry can be extremely strict about what enters the work place. Even things like makeup on woman can be made illegal.
post #107 of 273
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Originally Posted by HawkBlade View Post

"Former retail employees"... repeat Former. Not current, former.

I do not take stock in former employee's "suit".

Seriously. Where were they when they were working for Apple in these horrid and illegal conditions for months etc.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #108 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

Work? They aren't working, they are standing there getting their bags checked. Furthermore, how ridiculous would Apple look if they went after employees that were not productive 100% of the time to dock their pay. Oh boy, I'm sure the world would be after them. 

Some forms of not productive can get you fired. Like making personal phone calls or texting when you aren't on your paid break.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #109 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

Why don't we throw out all minimum wage and worker safety laws while we're at it.  After all, if the workers don't like it they can quit and get a job somewhere else. It's very easy for someone who gets paid properly to put down workers who may not be.
In many cases the best possible outcome for these sorts of cases, score both the employer and employee is for the employee to quit.
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The real question here is whether the security check really takes that long or whether that was a once in a while extreme case.   The other issue is why is it necessary at all?   Doesn't everything in the store have security tags on it?   Won't the security buzzer ring if an employee attempts to leave with product?    Don't they already have security cameras which would detail if an employee stole product (or cash from the register)?      And do they have so little trust in their own employees?     
Employees are the biggest concern most large companies have. There is no way to get an idealize mix of ultra employees. It only takes one idiot to do a company a lot of harm.
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Furthermore, with the possible exception of the geniuses, if the pay reports are accurate, they stink.  If you're a part-time student and/or living with your parents, fine..it's extra cash.    But if this is how you make your living, you can't live on it in any major city in this country.  Considering that Apple is one of the most profitable companies in the U.S., they should be the leaders in terms of providing decent pay to their workers.     $15 an hour is about $30K per year.   Back before 1986, the lowest I could pay any knowledge worker in a corporate environment was $31K.    The official inflation rate since then would make $31K $66,000 in 2013 dollars, which works out to $33 an hour.   
Retail employees are well retail, there is no rational excuse to turn them into high income workers. The market decides what is suitable.
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Based on the minimum wage in 1970 and adjusting for inflation, the minimum wage should be $11.08 per hour.   You'd think Apple could at least pay that. 
Interesting many of the local stores in my area are actually advertising that wage rate for store clerks.
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Having said that, the workers should be careful what they wish for.   Apple could start paying for the bag search time, but then cut back every employee's hours by an hour a week.   So while the workers will be paid for that time, they'll be no further ahead.  

With ObamaCare coming they may have no choice but to make all their retail employees part time. Sad if it comes true.
post #110 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

Again, this is why the American work force is junk! You don't mind taking 15 minute breaks every three hours of doing nothing, but NO WAY should I give back 5 minutes for a bad check! 
It isn't so much giving back but a consideration of what legal options Apple has. The reality is if the employee is on the clock then he could easily say that he was going to pay for the items just like the common shoplifter. By clocking out the employee is making a definite action to leave the shop.
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Stupid Americans! And we have a government we deserve and an economy we deserve! 

Incredibly stupid. Sooner or later a revolution will come to this country. Much of this leftist infra structure will be demolished. Our economy has a high probability of going the same direction as much of Europe with massive stagnation, little investment and high taxes to placate the lazy.

It won't be pretty but the welfare state has failed everywhere it has been implemented.
post #111 of 273
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Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

Some forms of not productive can get you fired. Like making personal phone calls or texting when you aren't on your paid break.

How about using the bathroom while punched in? Most people I know do that.

If these people are going to complain, they should give Apple back the money they were paid for defecating.
post #112 of 273

The sense of entitlement here is...well, just plain scary.  But I live in a "right to work" state, so some of this is almost foreign - the idea that the individual gets to tell the employer how to run their business.  I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying your perspective is unsettling to me.  Your entitled to your beliefs, just don't bring them to my house.  Sometimes I really appreciate the federal system - the individual states are able to offer different choices.

We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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post #113 of 273
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Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

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Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

You obviously profound unfamiliarity with the female gender explains a lot.

And yet not a single one of you can prove that people actually carry bags, much less that they are somehow magically forced to carry said bags into their place of employment. All you can do is bandy insults and ludicrous statements about the pockets on women's pants.

This. Case. Has. No. Hope.

Groan.

He said 'female'. Not 'person'. You're beginning sound a tad creepy, as though you've never really got out of your house....
post #114 of 273
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Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

He said 'female'. Not 'person'.

Groan, indeed. The argument is about both genders. Please read the entire argument.
post #115 of 273
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Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

Any time you are required to be at work (like lining up for bag searches) you should be compensated for your time.

 

What about employees that have to pass through security screening checkpoints to get to their desk?  Are they paid for that time?

 

What if I work at a very large office on a large campus and it takes me 10 minutes to walk from my car to my desk so that I can be there to work 9-5?  Should I get paid from 8:50-5:10 because of the time that I'm required to be walking on campus from my car to my desk?

 

Also, are these employees required to bring bags to work which then require inspection?  No, they're not.  Case closed!

post #116 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

And yet not a single one of you can prove that people actually carry bags, much less that they are somehow magically forced to carry said bags into their place of employment. All you can do is bandy insults and ludicrous statements about the pockets on women's pants.

This. Case. Has. No. Hope.

Are you serious?
post #117 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

All I'm going to say here is that all the over 60 white guys with totalitarian tendencies (who apparently don't get Hitler references) are frothing at the mouth and ganging up on the more reasonable, modern, forum members, who realise that people have bags, and if the employer wants you to stay at work for any reason at all, they must pay you. It's the f*cking basis of the whole social contract called "work" for cripes sake. 

You guys don't have logic, reason, or common sense on your side.  You guys keep arguing that it's the employees fault they are being searched. Based on … (reason?)  When in fact it's the employers choice to search them.  The employers don't have the right to force searches on their employees and then make the employee pay for the search.  It's categorically NOT the employees fault.  They are not the reason they are being searched, the employer has chosen to search them.  

To get back to Hitler … your argument is like saying "We aren't giving the prisoners of war blankets because it costs too much, it's their fault they got captured anyway."  And then you're sort of adding in ..."**** them, they are probably all dirty thieves anyway." for good measure.  

The whole lot of you should check in the bathroom mirror for tiny black moustaches under your nose. 

Godwin, yikes.

You're really comparing this trivial thing with one of the WORST things in human history?

Chill out.

You have a limited world view and assume people are just like they are where you live. I know very few people with bags.

Considering that the lawsuit is likely an exaggeration as, if true, they'd be violating a whole host of state laws regarding breaks, and likely it's only a minute or two being "wasted", it's not totalitarian or unique for Apple to perform these searches.
post #118 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress View Post

Just a pet peeve...Why is Apple always referred to as "the iPhone maker". Well never mind they make all kinds of other successful products too. Can you editors come up with something else to describe Apple other than the maker of the iPhone?


I totally agree. It doesn't bother me too much, I guess, but AI, how about just using the word "Apple"? Seems like a no brainer to me! Why must we try to come up with alternatives when we can just say the name of the company!

post #119 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Groan, indeed. The argument is about both genders. Please read the entire argument.

I've read the entire argument, and you've lost it.

C'mon, TS. Take a deep breath. Or a walk. Or something.
post #120 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

Are you serious?

Yep. Here are the main points, all in true statements.

1) People carry bags.
2) People do not have to carry bags.
3) People can carry bags into work at Apple.
4) People do not have to carry bags into work at Apple.
5) Bags are not required for work at Apple.
6) People who carry bags into work at Apple are subject to search.
7) People who do not carry bags into work at Apple are not subject to search.
8) If people do not want to be searched, they should not carry bags into work at Apple.

Any further confusion? Now for the only point of contention.

9) As bags are not required for work at Apple, the search through bags carried into work at Apple is off the clock, as the activity is not a required part of work done at Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I've read the entire argument

Your own posts disprove that. 1oyvey.gif
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