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Microsoft Surface revenue at $853M, less than write-down and associated ad-spend - Page 3

post #81 of 120
The Surface Pro actually is an iPad killer. Its priced too high though for people to be interested. My Surface Pro destroyed my iPad 4 in every area to the point where i stopped using it and sold it. More memory plus 64gb xt card. I can play gsmes like tf2 hl2 cod2 and plenty of other games at nice detail and 60fps for the ones i just mentioned. Nice keyboard. Photoshop and 3ds max. Office. Real applications. Its quiet. Windows full OS. Only heavy for weeny arms. Beautiful screen. Fast ssd and cpu up to 2.7 ghz. Replaced my laptop as well. Usb 3.0. Looks sexy and makes people at work jealous. Way more productivity than my iPad. There is nothing it cant do that my laptop could do. I use it every day at home and work. Windows phone wont replace my iphone and ms fucked up on xbox one hardware but anyone who says a surface pro aint the shit just doesnt know and are free to continue using their toy of an iPad at their leisure.
post #82 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacemanjupiter View Post

The Surface Pro actually is an iPad killer. Its priced too high though for people to be interested. My Surface Pro destroyed my iPad 4 in every area to the point where i stopped using it and sold it. More memory plus 64gb xt card. I can play gsmes like tf2 hl2 cod2 and plenty of other games at nice detail and 60fps for the ones i just mentioned. Nice keyboard. Photoshop and 3ds max. Office. Real applications. Its quiet. Windows full OS. Only heavy for weeny arms. Beautiful screen. Fast ssd and cpu up to 2.7 ghz. Replaced my laptop as well. Usb 3.0. Looks sexy and makes people at work jealous. Way more productivity than my iPad. There is nothing it cant do that my laptop could do. I use it every day at home and work. Windows phone wont replace my iphone and ms fucked up on xbox one hardware but anyone who says a surface pro aint the shit just doesnt know and are free to continue using their toy of an iPad at their leisure.

Not an iPad killer because most people don't want to do anything you just said on their tablet.

And Id rather use a MacBook Air for everything you just said.
post #83 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsico View Post

No, that's how you interpreted my sarcasm.  Another way you could have interpreted it was as me stating it's disingenuous to claim that Microsoft copied Apple when the research was actually conducted at Xerox, meaning Apple is not the victim you want to present it as.

 

I think you need to fix you timeline of event here.

 

SJ and the Apple teams visited Xerox in 1979, a year after some of the Parc researcher like Jef Raskin (the Macintosh father) joined Apple.

 

Apple showed the Macintosh prototype to some selected software partner and even gives one early Macintosh prototype to Microsoft in 1983 to help them to get Word and other software ready for the Macintosh launch in 1984.  A year after, Microsoft announced Windows 1.0 for PC, and for 10 years until Windows 95 (with help of Quickdraw and Quicktime for windows source code they stole from an Apple consultant they used for porting those software to Windows) Microsoft was unable to match Quickdraw performance and functionality. 

 

Microsoft has stole Quickdraw and Quicktime from Apple, this was the core of the dispute that conduct to the infamous 150 milions $ settlement between Microsft and Apple in 1997. 


Edited by BigMac2 - 7/31/13 at 1:38pm
post #84 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacemanjupiter View Post

The Surface Pro actually is an iPad killer. Its priced too high though for people to be interested. My Surface Pro destroyed my iPad 4 in every area to the point where i stopped using it and sold it. More memory plus 64gb xt card. I can play gsmes like tf2 hl2 cod2 and plenty of other games at nice detail and 60fps for the ones i just mentioned. Nice keyboard. Photoshop and 3ds max. Office. Real applications. Its quiet. Windows full OS. Only heavy for weeny arms. Beautiful screen. Fast ssd and cpu up to 2.7 ghz. Replaced my laptop as well. Usb 3.0. Looks sexy and makes people at work jealous. Way more productivity than my iPad. There is nothing it cant do that my laptop could do. I use it every day at home and work. Windows phone wont replace my iphone and ms fucked up on xbox one hardware but anyone who says a surface pro aint the shit just doesnt know and are free to continue using their toy of an iPad at their leisure.

 

I wont replace my 15in laptop for an 1000$  10inch netbook with worse performance.

 

Surface Pro is not worst or better than every other past and failed TabletPC, the problem here is not really the hardware (beside using windows apps on a sub 12inch screen is always a pain in the b****). Windows softwares was never made and optimized for being use on a small tactile screen, therefor the Surface Pro has no advantages over the classic laptop to compensate for the tablet form factor compromises. 

 

The iPad success has a lots to give to new and completely refreshed Apps, where every Apps make mandatory uses of the touchscreen, the Surface Pro without the optional keyboard is pretty useless, the touchscreen is unusable for the classic windows UI who depend to much of right-clicking and small toolbars 

 

I would say the same thing if Apple would come out with an OSX compatible tablet. 


Edited by BigMac2 - 7/31/13 at 1:59pm
post #85 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsico View Post

I did not say anything "anti-Apple", at most I said something pro-Xerox.

Whatever you want to pretend it was, it was a lie.
Quote:
The facts that made me post originally remain untouched, though: many of the concepts used on modern computers, ranging from the mouse to network protocols are commonly rooted in Xerox.

Then why didn't you post that instead of your lie?
Quote:
Perhaps

Or you could take five seconds and look it up instead of pulling this crap.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply
post #86 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

the (third generation) Zune wasn't "that bad" either.

 

it was just the wrong thing in the wrong place at the wrong (way too late) time.

 

that and way too "cola candy" colored for my taste. yeah, the aesthetics also matter to me, I guess.

post #87 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacemanjupiter View Post

The Surface Pro actually is an iPad killer. Its priced too high though for people to be interested. My Surface Pro destroyed my iPad 4 in every area to the point where i stopped using it and sold it. More memory plus 64gb xt card. I can play gsmes like tf2 hl2 cod2 and plenty of other games at nice detail and 60fps for the ones i just mentioned. Nice keyboard. Photoshop and 3ds max. Office. Real applications. Its quiet. Windows full OS. Only heavy for weeny arms. Beautiful screen. Fast ssd and cpu up to 2.7 ghz. Replaced my laptop as well. Usb 3.0. Looks sexy and makes people at work jealous. Way more productivity than my iPad. There is nothing it cant do that my laptop could do. I use it every day at home and work. Windows phone wont replace my iphone and ms fucked up on xbox one hardware but anyone who says a surface pro aint the shit just doesnt know and are free to continue using their toy of an iPad at their leisure.

 

 

wow… weeny arms? really?

 

Those short, one and two-word descriptive sentences and choices of "what's important" also tell me that a) you spend way too much time worshipping at the altar of the "steve ballmer church of tech thinking" (you know, the same one that held a ritual "iPhone funeral" at the M$ campus) or, b) we now know which account on AI belongs to the Chief Monkey Boy himself…...

post #88 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJones View Post

It's a well-known distortion of history that Apple "stole" from Xerox PARC. They gave Xerox PARC options for 100,000 shares at a $10 pre-IPO price in exchange for being able to see their work and use the ideas. Maybe next time you should do a few minutes of research before spewing your anti-Apple screed? Since that's all it would have taken to disprove your claim.

 

“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal' - and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.” - Steve Jobs

 

The man was "great" because he was shameless about stealing great ideas?  This is your hero?  How do you people sleep at night?

post #89 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WageEsq View Post

 

“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal' - and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.” - Steve Jobs

 

The man was "great" because he was shameless about stealing great ideas?  This is your hero?  How do you people sleep at night?

 

Do you know the context where and when this quote is coming from?

 

Do Gates or Ballmer are better than SJ? One thing for sure, Jobs has shaken the world more than once, and we all still talk about him after his death.

post #90 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WageEsq View Post

 

“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal' - and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.” - Steve Jobs

 

The man was "great" because he was shameless about stealing great ideas?  This is your hero?  How do you people sleep at night?

 

Originally Posted by BigMac2 View Post

Do you know the context where and when this quote is coming from?

 

Do Gates or Ballmer are better than SJ? One thing for sure, Jobs has shaken the world more than once, and we all still talk about him after his death.

_______________________________________

 

 

Do you think that Jonathan Ive figured out that context when Steve Jobs stole from him?  (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20124720-37/jonathan-ive-steve-jobs-stole-my-ideas/)  Steve Jobs certainly was "shameless"....but at least he was an honest person about his character.

 

No....I don't think that Gates or Ballmer are any better.  They are all shameless.  I just don't like the implication that Apple should be placed on the pedestal of integrity.

post #91 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WageEsq View Post

“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal' - and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.” - Steve Jobs

The man was "great" because he was shameless about stealing great ideas?  This is your hero?  How do you people sleep at night?

Ideas are one thing, stealing implementation is another.
post #92 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WageEsq View Post

Do you think that Jonathan Ive figured out that context when Steve Jobs stole from him?  (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20124720-37/jonathan-ive-steve-jobs-stole-my-ideas/)  Steve Jobs certainly was "shameless"....but at least he was an honest person about his character.

 

No....I don't think that Gates or Ballmer are any better.  They are all shameless.  I just don't like the implication that Apple should be placed on the pedestal of integrity.

 

Steve Job was a beloved person because he was never afraid to get his envision done.  He wasn't a one hit wonder like most in this industry.

 

You got a very twisted and conspirational mind. No body has ever said SJ was perfect, no one are.  I'm pretty curious what personalities you could admirer with those kinds of reflections. You're shameless to criticize other base on quote and off context stuff, trash talk is easy, recognize good is much harder, I think you need more humility. 

post #93 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMac2 View Post

 

Steve Job was a beloved person because he was never afraid to get his envision done.  He wasn't a one hit wonder like most in this industry.

 

You got a very twisted and conspirational mind. No body has ever said SJ was perfect, no one are.  I'm pretty curious what personalities you could admirer with those kinds of reflections. You're shameless to criticize other base on quote and off context stuff, trash talk is easy, recognize good is much harder, I think you need more humility. 

I know a lot of people don't say much about this, BUT.  Ben Rosen was the Chairman of the Board with one of the top two PC companies called Compaq.  I think at one point they were the top PC brand, at least in quality they were right up there.  They designed their own motherboards, got the source code from Microsoft for the BIOS, whereas everyone other than IBM and Compaq used to have to get some third party BIOS which was highly suspicious of not being 100% compatible, etc. etc.  Ben Rosen admitted he switched to a Mac shortly after he sold Compaq to HP.  He even told Steve Jobs to not sell their OS as an OEM product and to continue designing that hardware and OS together.    I wonder if this guy is in the movie.  But I will tell you, for someone like Ben Rosen to switch to a Mac tells me that he's not pleased with Microsoft and this guy was in bed with Microsoft, supporting nothing but Microsoft and based the entire business supporting Microsoft, and for him to switch to Apple?   That's a major thing to certain people.  I used to love company products back when they came out.   I've sold a TON of their products over the years, but when Dell started to gain traction in the Industry, Compaq started slipping and then HP started to gain ground.  It's a shame really.  I wish Compaq was still around, and Dell and these other slimly little PC companies weren't around screwing up the industry.  Nothing worse for a platform when you have too much competition and everyone has to slash profit margins, product quality slips as does quality of support.  

post #94 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

I know a lot of people don't say much about this, BUT.  Ben Rosen was the Chairman of the Board with one of the top two PC companies called Compaq.  I think at one point they were the top PC brand, at least in quality they were right up there.  They designed their own motherboards, got the source code from Microsoft for the BIOS, whereas everyone other than IBM and Compaq used to have to get some third party BIOS which was highly suspicious of not being 100% compatible, etc. etc.  Ben Rosen admitted he switched to a Mac shortly after he sold Compaq to HP.  He even told Steve Jobs to not sell their OS as an OEM product and to continue designing that hardware and OS together.    I wonder if this guy is in the movie.  But I will tell you, for someone like Ben Rosen to switch to a Mac tells me that he's not pleased with Microsoft and this guy was in bed with Microsoft, supporting nothing but Microsoft and based the entire business supporting Microsoft, and for him to switch to Apple?   That's a major thing to certain people.  I used to love company products back when they came out.   I've sold a TON of their products over the years, but when Dell started to gain traction in the Industry, Compaq started slipping and then HP started to gain ground.  It's a shame really.  I wish Compaq was still around, and Dell and these other slimly little PC companies weren't around screwing up the industry.  Nothing worse for a platform when you have too much competition and everyone has to slash profit margins, product quality slips as does quality of support.  

 

I'm nostalgic of the 80's where most computer company back then was in control of the hardware and software, system like Apple II, AtariST, Amiga Workbench, X68000, TRS-80.  They all has their charms and no one was cloning their neighbour.  Microsoft as killed hardware innovation forcing every PC mfg to play with the sames rules.  Big brand like IBM and compaq quickly lost their market to nameless clones and generic hardware shops.   

post #95 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMac2 View Post

 

I'm nostalgic of the 80's where most computer company back then was in control of the hardware and software, system like Apple II, AtariST, Amiga Workbench, X68000, TRS-80.  They all has their charms and no one was cloning their neighbour.  Microsoft as killed hardware innovation forcing every PC mfg to play with the sames rules.  Big brand like IBM and compaq quickly lost their market to nameless clones and generic hardware shops.   

It was mostly DELL, Gateway to a certain extent, but mostly DELL.  They were the ones that actually did it since what they were doing is "BUYING" market share by basically low balling bids to win accounts and they started the trend of outsourcing a lot of assembly work and they didn't spend hardly any money in R&D because all they really did was use someone else's guts and slap a label on the outside.  They were horrible at support, it was just a box pusher and people got suckered into them.  Trust me, I lost a lot of deals to these losers as they went direct to bypass the corporate reseller.  HP had to also play the game and their quality has gone down to match Dell's, so they could compete.  The other brands/clones weren't the major affect on IBM/Compaq from my perspective, it was mostly DELL, Toshiba to some extent with laptops.

 

But I've seen Dell get kicked out of accounts for some various bad business practices which my customers would tell me about that IBM, Compaq, HP, Apple would NEVER do with a major account that buys millions of dollars worth of computers and servers.  They basically drove down profits to barebones and a lot of resellers got out because of it.   I know of one order to a particular LARGE customer of Dells that shipped back a ton of product because it wasn't configured properly.  They did that to one of my customers as well and they had to send back 300 computers that had the wrong size hard drive.   F--- Dell.  They are the four letter word of the Computer industry that also just so happens rhymes with HELL.

 

I crack up that Apple, this little company managed to actually succeed IBM, whom used to be the company EVERYONE followed.  Back in the 80's, people waited with baited breath to find out what IBM was doing.  It was funny. But IBM did make some horrendous mistakes with Token Ring and Micro Channel.  For a while IBM got licensing to make their own Intel processors which saved them money since IBM has a lot of semiconductor foundries set up.

 

Compaq came out with their luggable and then they came out and grew faster than anyone and started to make some really nicely made and designed product that was built to last. HP used to do that too, but most of the HP products aren't that good anymore because they are forced to drop their quality standards to they can match others on price.  It's sucks, but that's the PC market.

 

For the longest time I didn't even consider DELL a REAL mfg.  in their beginning, i think they would just buy Intel Motherboards, slap together a box with the DELL logo on it and that's really all they did. HP, Compaq, IBM used to design their own motherboards, controller cards, and other aspects of the computer instead of just stuffing in standard stuff that was pretty much generic.   Compaq didn't use standard memory for the longest time because they designed even their own memory cards to improve performance.  They would also design their own hard drive controller cards and even video cards.  But they had to go the same route as everyone else, and the quality went downhill on their desktops.  Their laptops were too expensive because did a lot of engineering with their docking stations to turn a laptop into a desktop.  Paying $1000 for a docking station was just too expensive for the average person as Toshiba sold a $250 docking station.

 

It was interesting times back in the 80's and 90's.  But now, there really isn't much real interesting products coming out of the PC industry.  I used to have excitement about a new product announcement regardless of which company it was.  But now it's totally different for me.  I do still have excitement over what Apple announces, but anyone else? I could give a rip.  HP doesn't do exciting product announcements, neither does Dell, nor anyone else for that matter. The Android platform only seems to have something that might seem interesting, but since they don't have any decent apps/hardware available, I have no real interest.  Apple still holds my interest.


Edited by drblank - 8/1/13 at 9:57am
post #96 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post


iOS7 does indeed look bit more like W8P.  Deal with it.

Comparing iOS7 to Windblows8 is like saying a Ferrari and a skateboard are the same because they both have wheels!

Sorry my negative Surface & Windblows comments upset you.

I can understand how you were probably confused by the vast amount of Google & Android article's but this is actually supposed to be an Apple Forum!
post #97 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by macart View Post


Comparing iOS7 to Windblows8 is like saying a Ferrari and a skateboard are the same because they both have wheels!

Sorry my negative Surface & Windblows comments upset you.

I can understand how you were probably confused by the vast amount of Google & Android article's but this is actually supposed to be an Apple Forum!

1. Windoze 8 and W8P are two different products.
2. iOS7 looks more like W8P then iOS6 (or any previous) did. In ways that stand out from iOS6 and before.
3. Windoze 8 sucks, I have tried to use it, and well, tried is the operative word.  W8P does not.

I don't think surface offered anything special (Besides the kickstand, which is an interesting idea) and if you cannot tell, I am not a huge fan of Windoze.

What upsets me is when people compare products they have never tried for an extended period of time.

I have used iOS for a few years, Android for ~4 months, and W8P for ~2.

I hate using android (only got because the nook HD+ is good for watching videos, and was on sale) iOS is nice and polished, W8P feels the best, and I don't use many apps, so not a problem for me.  if you use tons of apps stay away from w8p for quite a while!

-Q

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post #98 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

1. Windoze 8 and W8P are two different products.
2. iOS7 looks more like W8P then iOS6 (or any previous) did.
3. Windoze 8 sucks, I have tried to use it, and well, tried is the operative word.  W8P does not.

I don't think surface offered anything special (Besides the kickstand, which is an interesting idea) and if you cannot tell, I am not a huge fan of Windoze.

What upsets me is when people compare products they have never tried for an extended period of time.

I have used iOS for a few years, Android for ~4 months, and W8P for ~2.

I hate using android (only got because the nook HD+ is good for watching videos, and was on sale) iOS is nice and polished, W8P feels the best, and I don't use many apps, so not a problem for me.  if you use tons of apps stay away from w8p for quite a while!

-Q

 

 

 

Windows RT

Windows 8

Windows 8 Pro

WIndows 8 Student


Is what Microsoft's web site indicates.

 

I would suggest that Windows RT is like iOS and that Windows 8 Pro is more like OS X.  and the other versions are just something Microsoft likes to do to confuse people. Which is the Microsoft way.

 

It's almost getting to the point where I don't even want to KNOW this information because i don't use WIndows, I don't like Windows and I will probably never actually buy WIndows products so why fill my brain with that information when there is other things to know about. The same goes with Android.  I wish I didn't even have to know ANYTHING about Android.  I know NOTHING about Symbian other than it exists and that's how I'd like to keep all information regarding other platforms since I highly doubt I'll ever use.  It's kind of like knowing what the Hyndai product is all about when you'll never own one. Why bother, it's a waste of time.. Some times, it's actually better NOT to know something.  Being an expert in Windows doesn't impress me.  It just tells me that you can't help me since I don't use Windows anymore.

 


W8P?  Huh?  What is W8P?  

post #99 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMac2 View Post

 

Do you know the context where and when this quote is coming from?

 

Do Gates or Ballmer are better than SJ? One thing for sure, Jobs has shaken the world more than once, and we all still talk about him after his death.

Personally, I don't know if one can technically STEAL another person's idea.  They can certainly use an idea, but I don't know if one can technically steal an idea. An idea is more of a thought than a physical product.

 

One can take a design that someone has and use the same design, but I don't know if that's stealing.  Now, some people can violate a patent, but there are plenty of ways to make small changes to what the patent outlines where it's not in violation of a patent and that's not stealing, it's just changing a design or an application of something that has been granted a patent.  

 

One can only steal a physical thing.  Just to be a literal, not figurative.

post #100 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

 

 

Windows RT

Windows 8

Windows 8 Pro

WIndows 8 Student


Is what Microsoft's web site indicates.

 

I would suggest that Windows RT is like iOS and that Windows 8 Pro is more like OS X.  and the other versions are just something Microsoft likes to do to confuse people. Which is the Microsoft way.

 

It's almost getting to the point where I don't even want to KNOW this information because i don't use WIndows, I don't like Windows and I will probably never actually buy WIndows products so why fill my brain with that information when there is other things to know about. The same goes with Android.  I wish I didn't even have to know ANYTHING about Android.  I know NOTHING about Symbian other than it exists and that's how I'd like to keep all information regarding other platforms since I highly doubt I'll ever use.  It's kind of like knowing what the Hyndai product is all about when you'll never own one. Why bother, it's a waste of time.. Some times, it's actually better NOT to know something.  Being an expert in Windows doesn't impress me.  It just tells me that you can't help me since I don't use Windows anymore.

 


W8P?  Huh?  What is W8P?  

Windoze 8 RT just is Windoze 8 that runs on ARM.  Windoze 8 is desktop;

W8P = Windows 8 Phone.  That is what is comparable to iOS, although iOS is more polished and has more apps.  Microsoft should have just called it "Windows Phone +" or something.  First time I have used a Microsoft product that I would (and did) take over an Apple one, maybe I'll switch back once iOS7 comes out.  Probably not, mostly because I don't have the money to get a newer phone, and I don't want to keep using iPhone 4, it is starting to feel a bit slow.

-QAMF

Active on S}A forums.  S|A student level subscriber.  Don't claim to know what is in the articles.

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post #101 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacemanjupiter View Post

The Surface Pro actually is an iPad killer. Its priced too high though for people to be interested. My Surface Pro destroyed my iPad 4 in every area to the point where i stopped using it and sold it. More memory plus 64gb xt card. I can play gsmes like tf2 hl2 cod2 and plenty of other games at nice detail and 60fps for the ones i just mentioned. Nice keyboard. Photoshop and 3ds max. Office. Real applications. Its quiet. Windows full OS. Only heavy for weeny arms. Beautiful screen. Fast ssd and cpu up to 2.7 ghz. Replaced my laptop as well. Usb 3.0. Looks sexy and makes people at work jealous. Way more productivity than my iPad. There is nothing it cant do that my laptop could do. I use it every day at home and work. Windows phone wont replace my iphone and ms fucked up on xbox one hardware but anyone who says a surface pro aint the shit just doesnt know and are free to continue using their toy of an iPad at their leisure.

I don't equate the Surface Pro to the iPad.  The Surface Pro is more like what they had if you bought a Windows tablet. It was a full blown copy of WIndows with a touch interface.  It's similar if Apple came out with a tablet that had a full blown version of OS X on it.  

 

Microsoft seems to think that people would rather have a full blown OS on a tablet with a physical keyboard to use much like a laptop, but with a touchscreen GUI.

 

I think Microsoft is confused as to what a tablet should be in order to be successful.  While some iPad users might buy a physical keyboard to use, the majority of iPad owners don't use a physical keyboard with it, since it wasn't really designed to take the place of a laptop/desktop computer, although some people seem to think you can.  It's kind of like using a bike to carry passengers.  Yeah, I've seen kids carry another kid on a bicycle, but it's not really designed to do that very well, unless it's a tandem bicycle.   I think it would be interesting to see what would happen if Apple actually had a full blown tablet that ran OS X w/ a touch screen and then if you connected a mouse/trackpad a cursor emerged and that you could connect a physical keyboard.  I wonder if people would actually like it, prefer it, or what apps they would like using with that type of design.  I wonder if iOS would be great to use if it employed the menu bar on top, just like OS X and it would disappear when not using it.  I wonder if iOS might eventually have that.

post #102 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

Windoze 8 RT just is Windoze 8 that runs on ARM.  Windoze 8 is desktop;

W8P = Windows 8 Phone.  That is what is comparable to iOS, although iOS is more polished and has more apps.  Microsoft should have just called it "Windows Phone +" or something.  First time I have used a Microsoft product that I would (and did) take over an Apple one, maybe I'll switch back once iOS7 comes out.  Probably not, mostly because I don't have the money to get a newer phone, and I don't want to keep using iPhone 4, it is starting to feel a bit slow.

-QAMF

OK.

 

Maybe Microsoft should have just come out with Windows RT where it's much like how Apple does iOS, whereby they have Windows RT and one is slightly changed to run on tablets and the other is slightly changed to run on Smartphones, and apps can be written specifically for one or the other or both much how people design apps for iOS.  Some work on both, some work on one or the other due to the nature of the app since one has a bigger screen and maybe more processing power.

 

Microsoft does like to confuse people.    i just got turned off to the GUI of WIndows 8 and all of the variations because it kind of forces you to constantly stare at the startup screen for notifications because a square/rectangle icon might flip around or display some information.  I just think MS blew the design.  At first it gets your attention, but after playing around with it for about 10 minutes, I was not impressed, at all.  Yes, there were a couple of features i liked about it, which is always going to happen, but those features can and will certainly added to iOS just like iOS will have features that will eventually get used in Windows.

post #103 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

OK.

 

Maybe Microsoft should have just come out with Windows RT where it's much like how Apple does iOS, whereby they have Windows RT and one is slightly changed to run on tablets and the other is slightly changed to run on Smartphones, and apps can be written specifically for one or the other or both much how people design apps for iOS.  Some work on both, some work on one or the other due to the nature of the app since one has a bigger screen and maybe more processing power.

 

Microsoft does like to confuse people.    i just got turned off to the GUI of WIndows 8 and all of the variations because it kind of forces you to constantly stare at the startup screen for notifications because a square/rectangle icon might flip around or display some information.  I just think MS blew the design.  At first it gets your attention, but after playing around with it for about 10 minutes, I was not impressed, at all.  Yes, there were a couple of features i liked about it, which is always going to happen, but those features can and will certainly added to iOS just like iOS will have features that will eventually get used in Windows.

That would have been nice, but to much to expect from Microsoft.

I mean, they put Windoze 8 UI into there server operating system, because of all those touchscreen servers?


-QAMF

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post #104 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WageEsq View Post

 

“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal' - and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.” - Steve Jobs

 

The man was "great" because he was shameless about stealing great ideas?  This is your hero?  How do you people sleep at night?

Personally, it's a BS quote to begin with.  It implies that to be a great artist you have to steal other people's ideas.  What happens if you steal other people's ideas, but you suck at stealing them?  Then you are a bad artist because you just suck at using other's ideas.

 

When I first saw the Android iPhone/IPad products they looked like a bad copy. Now, if they did a better job, that's different, but they didn't.  It looked more like a copy done by a child that doesn't know what they are doing.

 

It's kind of like looking at a REAL authentic car like a vintage Mercedes SSK and then comparing to one of those replica cars that's a fiberglass copy on top of a VW chassis.  One is the real thing, the other is a Pile of $hit that I wouldn't be caught dead in.

 

 

Android is like a tranny on the street, from a distance it might look like the real thing, but as you get closer, you realize it isn't.

post #105 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

That would have been nice, but to much to expect from Microsoft.

I mean, they put Windoze 8 UI into there server operating system, because of all those touchscreen servers?


-QAMF

They did not put that GUI on Windows Server?  Really? OH Shit.   Please don't tell me they were that stupid to do that.  Please don't say that.  If they did, Microsoft deserves to loose their market share and be reduced to what they really are, some cheesy OS that is made for cheap clones selling to the lowest common denominator.

post #106 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

They did not put that GUI on Windows Server?  Really? OH Shit.   Please don't tell me they were that stupid to do that.  Please don't say that.  If they did, Microsoft deserves to loose their market share and be reduced to what they really are, some cheesy OS that is made for cheap clones selling to the lowest common denominator.

well, they were already losing Server marketshare, maybe they though engineers were children who just wanted to look at color things???

-QAMF

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post #107 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

well, they were already losing Server marketshare, maybe they though engineers were children who just wanted to look at color things???

-QAMF

Well, I've run into a few IT people that would act like children from time to time.   I think Microsoft is conditioning their XBox users from a young age, so when they grow up and start using computers, they already have that familiarity with a similar interface.   Maybe Microsoft will be offering little games to be played in the background on a server so the IT Admin personnel have something to do when they aren't playing around with settings.  I remember when Windows 95 first came out and people seemed to think that Windows 95 was better than Mac OS because they had Solitaire and Minesweeper games as a standard install.  That was typically the apps most commonly used for Windows users for the longest time.  I think that's the only reason some people bought Windows, for the games.

post #108 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

1. Windoze 8 and W8P

You lost my attention right there!

So this is Steve BALDmer's new strategy to cruise Apple forums boring Apple users to death with info about their failing operating systems or soon to be end-of-life lineup of inferior products.

MicroScrap doesn't do anything like Apple, so the comparison ends there!

They watch through their Windows, so it looks easy! Like a kid playing T-Ball, they've seen the Major Leagures do it, but they just can't hit the ball off the tee. No matter how hard they try, Zune, Phones, XBox, and now Surface and soon Sync etc. etc. etc....

It's Cute to watch though! Look at them trying so hard, oh swing and a miss again, keep your eye on it, oh he missed again! Now he's down and crying!
post #109 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Well, I've run into a few IT people that would act like children from time to time.   I think Microsoft is conditioning their XBox users from a young age, so when they grow up and start using computers, they already have that familiarity with a similar interface.   Maybe Microsoft will be offering little games to be played in the background on a server so the IT Admin personnel have something to do when they aren't playing around with settings.  I remember when Windows 95 first came out and people seemed to think that Windows 95 was better than Mac OS because they had Solitaire and Minesweeper games as a standard install.  That was typically the apps most commonly used for Windows users for the longest time.  I think that's the only reason some people bought Windows, for the games.

hahahahah :)

I only use windoze because Linux is a pain to deal with for games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macart View Post


You lost my attention right there!

So this is Steve BALDmer's new strategy to cruise Apple forums boring Apple users to death with info about their failing operating systems or soon to be end-of-life lineup of inferior products.

MicroScrap doesn't do anything like Apple, so the comparison ends there!

They watch through their Windows, so it looks easy! Like a kid playing T-Ball, they've seen the Major Leagures do it, but they just can't hit the ball off the tee. No matter how hard they try, Zune, Phones, XBox, and now Surface and soon Sync etc. etc. etc....

It's Cute to watch though! Look at them trying so hard, oh swing and a miss again, keep your eye on it, oh he missed again! Now he's down and crying!

I have used a zune, I can't say it was really bad at anything, just worse than an iPod.
Phones, Microsoft doesn't make phones, what are you rambling about again?
Xbox is a failure from a profit standpoint currently I believe (if you only include the Xbox branded stuff i believe MS is still a few billion in the hole on that) but with Live having took off, and the new xbox they will be making money on it in (overall) in 5 years at most.
The Surface was a failure, and it shows why if Apple keeps on doing what it is doing with OSX what could arise.  However, I trust Apple to do know how to keep OSX afloat.

Microsoft also has made products such as: Windows 7 (the only Windoze OS to get a "w" over a "z") which is very well made, stable and easy to use, W8P also easy to use, the only "downside" is lack of apps, which bothers quite a few people.  They also have made products like "Onenote" which, if developed more, could make Windoze eventually a good tablet OS.

Honestly, the fact you cannot read what I write, and criticize things you have clearly not used is enough.

I don't care how biased someone is, however, i hate people who criticize things they have never used.

FWIW, I have used OS8/9 a little, OSX quite a bit, Windoze 95 a little, Windoze 2000 a little, Windoze XP quite a bit, Windows 7 a lot, Windoze 8 for as long as I could (a few hours) iOS 3-6 for years, Android for a few months, W8P for a few months, and various copies of Linux on and off for the last 5 years.
I own: iPod Touch (3rd gen, 4th gen) iPhone 4, nook HD+ tablet, cheap Android phone (took it apart) and a Nokia Lumia 920.
I also have a T61 15" thinkpad, and my custom desktop, a Power Mac G5, I also have been using my friends Mac Mini for the past year or so.

I feel that I have enough experience with the different OSes to criticize Apple, Microsoft, Google and Linux.  I feel people like you who dismiss a product because of what you have heard, or seen online are fools.  To be honest, I though W8P was a POS until I used it.  Android did prove to be a POS however, the nook is still good for watching videos on thankfully.

-QAMF

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post #110 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

hahahahah :)

I only use windoze because Linux is a pain to deal with for games.

I have used a zune, I can't say it was really bad at anything, just worse than an iPod.
Phones, Microsoft doesn't make phones, what are you rambling about again?
Xbox is a failure from a profit standpoint currently I believe (if you only include the Xbox branded stuff i believe MS is still a few billion in the hole on that) but with Live having took off, and the new xbox they will be making money on it in (overall) in 5 years at most.
The Surface was a failure, and it shows why if Apple keeps on doing what it is doing with OSX what could arise.  However, I trust Apple to do know how to keep OSX afloat.

Microsoft also has made products such as: Windows 7 (the only Windoze OS to get a "w" over a "z") which is very well made, stable and easy to use, W8P also easy to use, the only "downside" is lack of apps, which bothers quite a few people.  They also have made products like "Onenote" which, if developed more, could make Windoze eventually a good tablet OS.

Honestly, the fact you cannot read what I write, and criticize things you have clearly not used is enough.

I don't care how biased someone is, however, i hate people who criticize things they have never used.

FWIW, I have used OS8/9 a little, OSX quite a bit, Windoze 95 a little, Windoze 2000 a little, Windoze XP quite a bit, Windows 7 a lot, Windoze 8 for as long as I could (a few hours) iOS 3-6 for years, Android for a few months, W8P for a few months, and various copies of Linux on and off for the last 5 years.
I own: iPod Touch (3rd gen, 4th gen) iPhone 4, nook HD+ tablet, cheap Android phone (took it apart) and a Nokia Lumia 920.
I also have a T61 15" thinkpad, and my custom desktop, a Power Mac G5, I also have been using my friends Mac Mini for the past year or so.

I feel that I have enough experience with the different OSes to criticize Apple, Microsoft, Google and Linux.  I feel people like you who dismiss a product because of what you have heard, or seen online are fools.  To be honest, I though W8P was a POS until I used it.  Android did prove to be a POS however, the nook is still good for watching videos on thankfully.

-QAMF

I just don't care about Microsoft.  I used to sell their software between the Mid-80's to 2000 to corporate/government accounts in pretty large quantities.  I've used it since they released Windows 2.0 and stopped using in the early 2000's and 2000 Professional was what I was using and I've played around with XP, Windows 7 and 8 enough to know I'm not missing anything.  I'm sure those that like using like using it.  Good for them.   But having used OS X, when someone I know brings me a Windows 7 laptop to help them fix it, and i play around with the thing for about an hour and compared to the Mac, it's a really confusing OS. Sure Microsoft gives you all of these options to screw around with, but the way they organize the OS in how to administer and set it up is just dumb.  It's GUI is not intuitive, the way they have things organized is not intuitive and it's frustrating to use.  It's always been frustrating to use even when I used it daily side by side with Mac OS and earlier versions of OS X.  I know that OS X had a few years to get its act together.  But OS X is now better than Windows.  Windows 8 is and will always be the biggest joke to me.  Seriously, a touch screen on a 27 in monitor?  I have a 27inch monitor and in order to sit close enough to properly see the entire screen, I sit too far away to touch all four corners without getting out of my chair and leaning over.   So how is having a touchscreen for a desktop OS good?  It's dumb. REALLY dumb.

 

I just don't like the GUI they have,  seriously, I don't want to hear about you using this stuff enough to criticize it like I can't tell if something is good or bad.  You are really coming off like your feces comes out gift wrapped.

 

I've been using computers since 1977 and I get a pretty good feel for something very quickly.   Nothing is perfect, but Apple is doing far better than the viable options if I'm going to spend my own money on something.  in the beginning when the Mac first came out, I ripped on it for many reasons and it took until the iMac for to put a box that was what the FIRST one SHOULD have been.  (larger screen, built-in ethernet, color, more RAM, built in hard drive and I thought they should have Unix from Day 1).   Even though I hated the small screen on the Macs in the beginning, I used one for 3 years on that tiny little screen WITH a 3270 emulation and it worked. NEVER had a problem with it.  I actually couldn't believe that that tiny little thing was freaking trouble free for 3 years. I also just kept it stock installs on everything and didn't do much else as I only used it for email, running 3270 emulation to run a quote system and checking inventory.  I just never liked Windows.  I always disliked it's UI.  I always hated using it.  They can dress up all they want, I just never liked using it.  I've had high hopes for it, but so far, they've not changed the user experience to make it enjoyable to use.  Linux?  Which VERSION.  to me it's probably fun for a geek to play around with, it's great for taking an OS, modifying around as specialty product, and then locking it down is probably what it's best at.  It won't ever make it to mainstream levels amongst the human population.   It's more of a geek OS and it's got SOME apps here and there that are high end, but I would NEVER recommend it for the mainstream population.  I've watched Linux geeks talk about the problems with LInux and the list I heard was pretty extensive for it to be considered mainstream enough to be an alternative for the average consumer. It's just not that type of product and probably never will be.  I'm surprised Android is doing as well as it is. I'm actually appalled that anyone with a technical IT background would consider using something where you are pretty much forced to seek support away from the mfg because they won't update your OS or if they do, it's months after Google released it.  That is just the biggest joke.   You would have to pay me and ENORMOUS amount of money to use an Android phone and I still wouldn't pay for one.   The Windows phone, I picked one up and then put it down.  I just don't like the Xbox-like GUI.  It's just ugly. Solid colored squares and rectangles using mostly primary colors is just not my thing.

 

I played around with an SGI and there were some visual things they did on their OS that was actually quite cool. It obviously wasn't an Mainstream OS, but there were things about the UI was cool.

 

I like to make sarcastic comments because it's FUN.  I get joy out of doing it.  It's my release if you will and this is where I do it.  I've defended Microsoft against hard core Android users.  Trust me, I can figure out a way to dig into a product, regardless of the brand, yes, even Apple.  They've made some boner mistakes here and there too.  It's all in good fun.

 

I don't have to use something to evaluate it.  I can look at a video of someone showing demos of something to see faults in a product.  I can also just simply say I don't like a company too.  I don't have to read every word you say either.  And I don't have to always agree with people I don't agree with.

 

Pretty gutsy for you to admit you bought a Zune.  I didn't buy an iPod until the 3rd or 4th generation and mine got stolen and I never replaced it, but I have an iPhone that does basically the same thing.  I was never much one of those people that wears earphones and listens to music, even though I'm a musician.  I do most of my music listening at home with my entire catalog which is too big to put in any mobile device since I rip all of it in lossless format and it's too large of a catalog.  I usually only listen to maybe a handful of albums at a time in the car anyway.  I don't want my total catalog of music in the car.

 

I'm not one of those people that just goes out and buys a tech product to have a tech product.  I put a fair amount of thought into what I am going to use and I don't get sucked into every toy put on the market.  The Surface products were a JOKE.  I played around with them for about 5 minutes each and walked away laughing.  

 

You seem to hang on to old equipment too long.  I had a Stinkpad back in the late 90's.  POS if you ask me, I hated that stupid little eraser. Dumb idea even though some people love it.  I usually like to get rid of a product typically within 3 years so I'm up to date, even though my last iMac was the first generation Intel, but it served it's useful like long enough. But hanging on to an G5 Mac?  For what?   You think I'm a fool?  really?

 

I decided a LONG time ago not to use Windows.  I don't consider Android a viable platform.  OK?  I think they are putting out crap, I've played around with it, and due to their updating practices, lack of attention to security plus it doesn't work well with my OS X system and any software/hardware that I'm considering doesn't run with anything other than OS X and iOS products.   Being a musician, as time goes on, there is so little support for Android, if you went to NAMM show, and emmersed yourself in everything that's going on, you'd think that Android was about as popular someone getting hit by lightning 10 times in the same day.  It's almost like the platform ceases to exist.  It's almost getting that way for Windows.  Everywhere you go you see iPads, and OS X computers.  Not many PCs.  Even though software is written for Windows, not many higher end professionals are using Windows, if they are, it's on a Mac.  What I hate is someone that made what I would consider a bad buying decision and ridicule me because I don't like the product and I've never owned the product.  Do i have to drive or own a Yugo to not like it?  

 

This is a Apple-centric site, so you get an Apple Centric mentality, so get used to it, or leave.

post #111 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

<snip>

This is a Apple-centric site, so you get an Apple Centric mentality, so get used to it, or leave.

I know, I wasn't talking to you for the most of that.

I don't mind bias, I mean, I read Charlie's articles (Semiaccurate)

I just dislike people saying "this is bad" when they have never used it, or talked to anyone who used it, or heard feedback from people who picked it up.  I completely understand people saying Windows 8 is stupid, touch screen interface not on a touch screen, not to mention how it moves everything around.  Also, asthetics and such are perfectly fine to talk about.

I more hate when people disregard things people who have used the platform a lot say.  Especially with phones, you have to use it to truly experience it.  I didn't believe how laggy Android would be (in 2013!) until I bought something with it (that wasn't a $50 POS, of course) and likewise I didn't think W8P would be as good as it has been until I bought something with it and tried it.  I cannot stand someone who will say a phone OS "is shit" or "it will be worse" before they have tried it.  
note: If anyone here ever has tried Windows 8 Phone for a week or so will be able to bring up many issues besides "it lacks the apps" quite easily.  It is not perfect in any way.  It just feels better to me than iOS6 does to me.

Oh, and I didn't buy a zune, a friend did (something about it having HDMI-out or something for watching videos on a TV, I don't think he ever even used it for that *facepalms*) I borrowed it for a month or two when my iPod nano broke, and before I got an ipod touch :)

note: Mostly for Linux I used jolicloud, and various ubuntu distros.


I have the power Mac G5 still because it has a really nice case.  I am planning to take it apart and use the case for my current desktop soon.

LT;RD: I don't mind people "disliking" something.  I dislike them saying "this product sucks" when they have not actually used it.  There are some glaring examples of when I don't see a problem with it (like it Apple decided to fully integrate iOS into OSX, (note: that would be far better than Windoze 8) and Windoze 8) Same goes for "I think Windows 8 Phone looks bad" That is fine by me, saying "Windows 8 Phone sucks, because Microsoft made it, and has no apps" I have a problem.

-QAMF

EDIT: Thank you for bringing the need to clarify myself to my attention.

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post #112 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by macart View Post


Your obviously a fool, trying to gather mutual love or respect for MicroScrap in an APPLE forum. Your bright!

And thanks for educating me about MicroScrap products and software, I never heard of them before you showed up!

I've used many different work stations, the first Macs, forced to use MicroScrap and Silicon Graphics. So save your uppity shit speech!

I don't use or care about MicroScrap because I don't like them!

He who buys the most MicroScrap or knows more about said company proves he's the bigger fool! You Win!

This is how they sucker people into their mentality.  You need to use the product I love, if you don't you're a fool.  


I had one person tell me that I should buy a Android phone before I dismiss them.

 

My response, I don't have to drive or buy a Yugo to know that I don't like it.

post #113 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by macart View Post
Your obviously a fool, trying to gather mutual love or respect for MicroScrap in an APPLE forum. Your bright!

And thanks for educating me about MicroScrap products and software, I never heard of them before you showed up!

I've used many different work stations, the first Macs, forced to use MicroScrap and Silicon Graphics. So save your uppity shit speech!

I don't use or care about MicroScrap because I don't like them!

He who buys the most MicroScrap or knows more about said company proves he's the bigger fool! You Win!

Yes, I love Microsoft so much I call the majority of there "Windows" product "Windoze" products.

I am trying to explain how people can and should criticize and critique something.  no matter what the product is, especially when there are no tests designed to measure user experience definitively.

You seem to not be able to read what I write with any clarity.  Especially once I clarified what I meant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

This is how they sucker people into their mentality.  You need to use the product I love, if you don't you're a fool.  


I had one person tell me that I should buy a Android phone before I dismiss them.

 

My response, I don't have to drive or buy a Yugo to know that I don't like it.

Before you dismiss them, no.  Before you criticize specific things that seem unwieldy but actually work fine, yes.

Example: If you said the Yugo had the worst steering ever and it feels horrible without having tried it.  Not liking something versus saying "this feature sucks" is a different thing.

I though I explained my position fairly well.

-QAMF

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post #114 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

Yes, I love Microsoft so much I call the majority of there "Windows" product "Windoze" products.

I am trying to explain how people can and should criticize and critique something.  no matter what the product is, especially when there are no tests designed to measure user experience definitively.

You seem to not be able to read what I write with any clarity.  Especially once I clarified what I meant.

Before you dismiss them, no.  Before you criticize specific things that seem unwieldy but actually work fine, yes.

Example: If you said the Yugo had the worst steering ever and it feels horrible without having tried it.  Not liking something versus saying "this feature sucks" is a different thing.

I though I explained my position fairly well.

-QAMF

I've been in the IT industry a long time and have used a lot of OS's since the late 70's and I decided 10 years ago to only use OS X and then started getting into iOS devices a couple of years ago.  I couldn't give a rip about Windows anything.  I have played around with Windows XP, 7, and 8, and RT long enough to know I STILL won't buy it. I've played around long enough with Android Gingerbread, Ice Cream Scamwitch, and Jelly Bean long enough to know I won't buy it.  I also look at the updating practices, I also look at how well Apple supports what I've been using, how easy it is to use and how reliable the hardware and OS are. I also look at what apps and hardware I plan on using.

 

Again, I don't have to own something to know it sucks or that I don't want it.  I'm not some 15 year old kid, I'm in my 50's and I've been trained through various product training over the years with all of the major companies (except Dell) since the 80's.  I've gone to IBM, Compaq, HP, Cisco, Apple, Microsoft, Novell, 3Com, and other training and I think I can say I have a pretty good idea of what I like and don't like.  If you are criticizing my sense of humor against Microsoft and Android, it's just my sense of humor.  I get a lot of enjoyment against companies I don't particularly care much about.  i've gotten stung enough with Microsoft. How would you like to have your hard drive get wiped because of virus on a PC because Windows was so susceptible to virus attacks and having virus protection doesn't guarantee you won't get one. I've wasted more time trying to get Windows PCs working that I've given up on them COMPLETELY. I've NEVER liked using the Windows interface, it's never been that intuitive.  I played with Windows 8 and thought it had a couple of decent features, but otherwise, it sucked.  I wouldn't like using it.

 

So get off your YOU HAVE TO OWN SOMETHING BEFORE YOU BASH IT MENTALITY.

 

I can dismiss something just because I don't like the looks of it, just as easily as some spec or how the company operates. etc.

 

I think I've explained my position.  If you are a PC user that doesn't like Macs, then go to a Microsoft Site and enjoy yourself. If you are an Android user and you don't like Apple, then go to an Android site and be amongst people that think like you.

 

If I ever get into a position where I have to use a Microsoft OS, then I will use it, but I probably won't like it, same goes with LInux or Android, but so far, I haven't had a need to use anything but OS X and iOS devices and I prefer them and the direction they are going. 

post #115 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

Yes, I love Microsoft so much I call the majority of there "Windows" product "Windoze"

You seem to not be able to read what I write with any clarity.

I can read through the lines...

You refer to it as "Windoze" yet preach its religion in here. Not hard to see through.

DrBlank already stated it very well!

But I would add:

I don't need to taste a dog turd to figure out its not going to be good!

For some its common sense not to eat the turd, for others they have to try the turd to figure it out!

Some others continue to eat the turd and actually try to recruit more people to eat the turd with them!

Not going to sell me on MicroTurd!
post #116 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by QAMF View Post

Yes, I love Microsoft so much I call the majority of there "Windows" product "Windoze" products.

I am trying to explain how people can and should criticize and critique something.  no matter what the product is, especially when there are no tests designed to measure user experience definitively.

You seem to not be able to read what I write with any clarity.  Especially once I clarified what I meant.

Before you dismiss them, no.  Before you criticize specific things that seem unwieldy but actually work fine, yes.

Example: If you said the Yugo had the worst steering ever and it feels horrible without having tried it.  Not liking something versus saying "this feature sucks" is a different thing.

I though I explained my position fairly well.

-QAMF

 

I used to work for a company that had about 400 employees and I was forced to run a Windows laptop they provided me. It was a top end Toshiba running Windows 2000. I went to a Sales Conference the company had all of their sales and professional service consultants were at and they had a station where employees could bring their laptop to get fixed since a lot of use worked out of our homes or satellite offices. I went to Corporate and brought my laptop to get fixed, the guy working on these systems is a MCSE and can usually fix MOST problems.  However there was a rash of employees getting a nasty virus that was taking out hard drives.   This particular virus attack hit other employees at other large companies like Cisco.  It was a REAL bad virus attack that took out hard drives so they couldn't boot up.  The virus protection software was pretty much useless at the time.  EVERYONE was getting upset and it cost the company a LOT of money in down time and support costs.  My iMac that I had for personal use worked just fine NEVER had a virus attack on it.  But was not allowed to use my personal Mac on the network remote dial up because the company wouldn't allow it because they had to get different equipment to support us dial up users. Plus they had some completely overly complicated app the sales reps had to use and it was a horrible interface as it wasn't web enabled.    Have you ever used SAP software that isn't web enabled?  If you have, then you kind of understand what a complicated app looks like.  The sales app we had to use was almost as complicated as SAP, which I have used before and it's VERY unfriendly to use unless they web enable it.

 

Another problem

 

I couldn't get a silly PC Card modem to work on a Laptop. I had another MCSE that couldn't get the PC Card working either.  I couldn't get something so simple as a PC Card to work on a freaking Windows laptop.  I was using the latest drivers.  I had TWO MCSEs try to get it to work and they couldn't.  two weeks to get the freaking thing working.  so for two weeks, I couldn't log into the company's network from my freaking laptop.   The funny thing is I was talking to a buddy of mine that just so happens works at Apple in their tech support for internal employees.  Guess what?  He actually got it to work and he's not an MCSE, but he's Apple Certified technician/admin.  He found there was some obscure trick that he knew about that wasn't widely known that somehow got it to work.  I don't have all of the time in the world to scan the support forums, etc. to get a problem fixed, especially when I can't get get logged into the internet, which is what the PC Card did since it was a modem card I got because the one the company supplied me was a pile of crap and it was one of those modem cards where the connector for the telephone jack to plug in didn't make a reliable connection and the stupid laptop didn't have a built in modem. Go figure. Apple's had built in modems and built in ethernet a lot sooner than PCs did.  Hmmmm...  And look at what Apple is doing with Thunderbolt.  See what I mean?  Apple seems to build in useful technology a lot sooner than Windows PCs do.  So I've got my own personal battle scars with Windows, and after a while, you get tired of getting stung. Once is bad, but twice is worse, but to constantly have problems that trained people can't resolve on something so simple is just unacceptable.  Never had those kinds of problems with Apple.  

 

So, these are some of the reasons I dismissed Windows computers 10 years ago and I've never had any major problems with Apple products where I got stung, so I'll stick with what works.

post #117 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

So, these are some of the reasons I dismissed Windows computers 10 years ago and I've never had any major problems with Apple products where I got stung, so I'll stick with what works.

Excellent rebuttal!
post #118 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


Excellent rebuttal!

The thing is, it's the truth.  And the truth will set you FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.  But I don't get anything for speaking the truth. It's a free, unsolicited response an unpaid endorsement.  

post #119 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Excellent rebuttal!
The thing is, it's the truth.  And the truth will set you FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.  But I don't get anything for speaking the truth. It's a free, unsolicited response an unpaid endorsement.  

That's probably why I value it more; straight from the heart.
post #120 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


That's probably why I value it more; straight from the heart.

The only thing I might change is the overall look of OS X and maybe take on the new look they are using in most of their apps like FCP, Logic, etc. with the black theme instead of the brushed aluminum, that I might agree is getting a little on the dated side. The pull down windows might need a little different appearance.  I would still keep the 3D icons, and an updated look to the folders.  I would like some other choices for the look of the dock.  But these are more superficial things.

 

I would like it if when the cursor moved on top of an icon that the icon was highlighted.  Certain flavors of Linux do this and it's a nice effect.

 

I do wish they would add a feature that Firefox has where you can delete/manage bookmarks easier with the star in the URL line.  I don't know if it's a protected feature of Firefox or if it's a feature that Apple wouldn't need to license, or if so, license it. It's a useful feature and I'm not really a fan of other things about Firefox.

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