or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Apple's iOS 7 3D Maps leave Google Earth, Nokia Maps 3D looking old fashioned
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple's iOS 7 3D Maps leave Google Earth, Nokia Maps 3D looking old fashioned - Page 2

post #41 of 82

Even Google's name is old fashioned! An absolute disingenious and dishonest company which does everything in its power to survive.

 

On another note, I truly enjoy this site and its priceless articles. Every day, I visit here at least a few times! So, thank you for all your hard work and information.


Edited by Disturbia - 7/31/13 at 8:54am

....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

Reply

....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

Reply
post #42 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Disturbia View Post

Even Google's name is old fashioned!

How? It's a misspelling, but old-fashioned?

I love the irony that the largest search engine in the world is a misspelling because they couldn't remember how 'googol' was spelled… and couldn't look it up. 1tongue.gif

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #43 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Astounding.

It's been what, a year? and Apple Maps has already come this far.

All of this in a year, against a competitor that apparently specializes in this sort of thing, and Apple is apparently putting them to school in a number of areas within this service.

 

Google has always focused on the underlying data, but didn't really start taking presentation seriously until Larry Page took over as CEO.

post #44 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

The 3D Hoover dam image is the perfect litmus test to portray the insane discrepency between the coverage of Apple and Google products. The distorted image was used to headline pretty much every single negative Maps article, I must have seen it posted thousands of times, accompanied with mockery and denigration. The image was supposed to show just show shitty Apple maps was. Every single fandroid and apple hater reposted it with glee, over and over again, and used it to troll about how bad the product was. Major news sites such as CNN also used it, feigning shock and contempt. 

 

Meanwhile, Google has had the SAME image with pretty much the EXACT SAME distortions- on a product they've been working on for 7 years. Noone ever noticed, and the ones who did didn't give a shit. Even now, almost a year after Apple maps was released and this imagery was mocked, Google STILL hasn't fixed theirs, and again- noone gives a shit or cares, especially Google cheerleaders. Meanwhile, Apple's version looks perfect, with an insane level of detail. 

 

This 1:1 comparison is pretty rock-solid evidence for how intellectually dishonest critisism against Apple tends to be, as well as the different standard they're held at, even by people who claim to despise the company. Its incredibly sad and childish. 

 

I agree that the media coverage of Apple's Maps based on the Hoover Dam images was intensely biased, but I don't agree that the whole Hoover Dam thing is a valid test or comparison between the available products as presented in this article.  

 

Google Maps and Nokia maps have the same problem with Hoover Dam that Apple had in their original maps because all three use the same technology and the same technique for rendering it.  Outside of Apple's flyover areas, they default to simply showing the satellite images projected onto an elevation map which is exactly how Google maps and Nokia maps work as well outside of areas where they also provide additional meshes of objects placed in this landscape.  The road dips down simply because it's a flat picture projected onto a mesh of a canyon. 

 

Where the article argues that Google maps had been "released seven years earlier, and regularly updated since," and then further argues that it "still isn't accurate," "a year later," it's really being a bit disingenuous.  There are no updates to the technology being used here that would "fix" the Hoover Dam problem and it's really just a perception of a problem in the first place, as opposed to an actual problem.  Apple fixed this perceived problem by adding in a 3D model of Hover Dam and dropping it into the surroundings, but that's really an entirely different thing from assuming that updates to the original mapping technology and process would do.  This same "problem" is true of pretty much any bridge, anywhere in the world that crosses a river or a canyon outside of Apple's flyover maps coverage or outside of Googles Google Earth or city building coverage.  The solution in all cases is to use a different technology to build meshes for the bridges and drop it into the simpler, satellite map.  Since there are millions of bridges in the world, this will take an impossible amount of time.  

 

The Hoover Dam fiasco is more of a media problem than an actual mapping problem and just a high profile example of the limitations of the technologies being used by all parties.  To suggest as the article does that it's simply related to how regularly Google updates it's imagery, or that because Apple fixed Hoover Dam that they are intrinsically "better," or have better technology than Google is wrong. Apple was responding to a media issue by fixing Hoover Dam, not a mapping issue. 

 

I do beleive that Apple has better technology available, and that moving forward they will come up with the best mapping solution, but the Hoover Dam fiasco is a red herring IMO and doesn't prove anything.  

post #45 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


How? It's a misspelling, but old-fashioned?

I love the irony that the largest search engine in the world is a misspelling because they couldn't remember how 'googol' was spelled… and couldn't look it up. 1tongue.gif

 

I always thought it was "Google," as in "Googly-eyed" (because the two "o's" remind me of glasses), and thus spelled correctly. 

post #46 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by studentx View Post

"The 3D view is nice for showing off, but it really doesn't have the utility of street level photos. For example, often when I am taking a road trip, I will "drive" the route near the final destination inside of street view in order to visually memorize the landmarks I need to recognize."

Having served in the Army and being an expert in land navigation I find the 3D view far more useful since it provides a better view of the terrain. I almost never need to use street signs and I find the shape, dimensions and elevations of terrain, street, blocks, buildings and landmarks far more useful. Of course it's a skill that requires some practice but it's far superior but anyone can master it.

Street view can be helpful but it's like a trail of bread crumbs, miss one and your next to lost. It also requires too much interaction with the screen while driving.

This is the alternate view that most are missing, because it involves the right-hemisphere view of the world, which is walled-off territory for those raised on 2D media for all their lives, i.e., most of us. Apple is going for the right brain first, no doubt while they peck away at the left-brain "breadcrumb" details that have to be there too, maybe overwhelmingly for most people.

The dual-hemisphere approach goes back to the birds. They use their right eye/left brain to peck for food, pick out details, and their left eye/right brain to scan the horizon for threats and to keep track of their mate or group within the whole picture. See Iain McGilchrist, The Master and His Emissary.

I'm familiar with whole-picture navigation, as in landscape, cityscape, sun direction, and was more or less trained by using paper maps and doing the navigating on road trips with my father, who always wanted to take the back roads wherever we went. We never had a compass on the dash. They lied, and besides it would be cheating. If it was cloudy you kept track of the sun by remembering the turns and picturing yourself from above.

To this day, I never use GPS. Forget relying on a machine for turn by turn. Use the overhead view in your head. It helps enormously to see the map of where you're going from above, the more 3D the better.

studentx, I imagine you used stereo aerial-view maps in the army. These are good therapy for left-brained dominant people to wake up their right world-view hemisphere. So are Apple's 3D flyovers, but it would be better if they were in true stereo rather than rendered perspective. Brian May, guitarist for Queen and a 3D scholar, has done some stereo extractions from Apple's flyovers. Very interesting.

http://www.londonstereo.com/news.html

Go down about seven images till you get to an iPhone map image of a tower. Also contains the best exercise for freeviewing stereo I've ever seen.
Edited by Flaneur - 7/31/13 at 12:10pm
post #47 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


How? It's a misspelling, but old-fashioned?

I love the irony that the largest search engine in the world is a misspelling because they couldn't remember how 'googol' was spelled… and couldn't look it up. 1tongue.gif

 

Well ... 1smoking.gif ... LOL

....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

Reply

....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

Reply
post #48 of 82
Amazing how many people Google has on their payroll as evidence by comments in response to this editorial.

Apple Maps has improved dramatically around the world wherever Apple iPhone is popular.

Furthermore, Apple has pushed Google to develop much better maps. You are welcome all you poor, foolish individuals although I feel somewhat ill knowing my purchases of Apple products and services have helped Google and their gaggles of groupies.
post #49 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post

Amazing how many people Google has on their payroll as evidence by comments in response to this editorial.

 

*facepalm* 

post #50 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damn_Its_Hot View Post

 

Your comments about photogrammetry are amusing. The paneling markers themselves would be a huge (and might I say expensive) job involving not only common plane surveying but taking into account the curvature of the earth. There is also the minor problem of foliage and inaccessible terrain. These special cameras do not get the kind of resolution you want while trying to get "thousands of square miles at a time".

 

 

Interesting but my phone does not yet have a Ctrl key or left mouse.. LOL. I am interested in navigation solutions that are available for use in my car and then easily taken to the train, bus, etc. from where I might walk. I can't see any of this with a laptop and certainly not a phone.

 

1) Street View cameras record both photos, and LIDAR. Foliage is an issue, but there are ways around it. There are lots of research papers floating around on street level extracting of 3D models and facades, just do a search.

 

2) The original article used the Web version of Google Maps for Earth beta which does allow free rotation. Google Earth (just checked on my iPhone) also allows free rotation with a two-finger gesture.

post #51 of 82
The most important difference between Apple and Google maps is in the SDK used by third party app developers. Google places loads of restrictions on the developer and can even turn off maps entirely if an app gets too popular. Apple has very few restrictions via their SDK and are mostly aimed at preventing out of control bugs from overloading their servers. With Apple's SDK, you can create a route between two points and access each point on the line. It even gives you alternate routes and an estimated travel time. Apple also allows developers to create map images and save them wherever a user wants. Apple's forward and reverse location look up also have very few restrictions unlike Google's that must only be used with a Google map.

The point of all this is while Apple's Maps app is very nice, there will soon be a lot of really great third party apps built on top of the new SDK in iOS 7 which will certainly put Google's very limited map to shame.
post #52 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Google Maps: 8 Years Old
Apple Maps: 1 Year Old

Is Google Maps eight times better than Apple's first effort?

 

This holds true for some time but now it looks like an excuse. By the same logic, when Google Maps will be 28 years old, Apple maps will be only 20 years old. Will  you accept an inferior Maps from Apple then?

 

iPhone was a winner from the word go, iPad was a winner from day one. Yes, Apple Maps needs time to improve but it should have been labeled a "Beta" rather than presented as a finished product.

post #53 of 82

Maps may have had a rough start, but it WILL be the app to beat in the very near future!

post #54 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsun Zu View Post

This holds true for some time but now it looks like an excuse. By the same logic, when Google Maps will be 28 years old, Apple maps will be only 20 years old. Will  you accept an inferior Maps from Apple then?

iPhone was a winner from the word go, iPad was a winner from day one. Yes, Apple Maps needs time to improve but it should have been labeled a "Beta" rather than presented as a finished product.

Let me understand this logic.

  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain
  • Google labels many of their products as public betas including some labeled as public betas for years, no one complains

Seemingly, whether Apple labels a product beta or not is irrelevant. Gaggles of Googlers will complain.
post #55 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post


Let me understand this logic.

  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain
  • Google labels many of their products as public betas including some labeled as public betas for years, no one complains

Seemingly, whether Apple labels a product beta or not is irrelevant. Gaggles of Googlers will complain.
  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked even as a beta)
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked as a non beta)

 

See the pattern?

post #56 of 82
Good article. It seems that competition is good for both Apple and Google.

My guess is that Apple will continue to add user focused GIS services and Google will be more focused on being a global GIS navigator. We shall see.
post #57 of 82

It may be pretty, but so far, Apple Maps is still useless. Just the other day...

 

 

post #58 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by patpatpat View Post

  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain (even though Siri was revolutionary)
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain (even though it is better than Google Maps)
  • Google and Samsung pay people to go to Apple Insider and other websites to post lies

See the BS that Google and Samsung feed everyone?
post #59 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by TokyoJimu View Post

It may be pretty, but so far, Apple Maps is still useless. Just the other day…

"Useless" is as useless (and wrong) a statement as can be.

Also:

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #60 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post

  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked as a non beta)
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked even as a beta)

 


See the BS that Google and Samsung feed everyone?

Au contraire. I'm quite an avid apple user and supporter. I just call a spade a spade.  


Edited by patpatpat - 7/31/13 at 5:31pm
post #61 of 82
The article states:
Quote:
When Google Maps' satellite imagery is taken into perspective (above), it simply appears as a flat, confusing distortion of the overhead view.

Oddly, that's the exact same behavior you get from Apple Maps when you put it in 3D/Flyover mode in an area that has no 3D data. Doesn't that make it just as much a "confusing distortion" in Apple Maps?

I'm still not sold on the value of 3D when it comes to navigation. I actually prefer the 3d gray form buildings in Google Maps because a) they still provide a sense of building geography without the bandwidth overhead of full 3D models and b) Google had the wisdom of making them transparent so they don't block the most important piece of navigation information, the roads.

Google maps continues to blow away Apple maps when it comes to traffic data. Apple continues to present only two levels for traffic: the red dashes that represent a traffic issue and nothing which indicates either there's no data or no problem with no distinction. Google meanwhile presents 5 levels: nothing for no data, green for no traffic problems, yellow for light traffic issues, red for serious issues and red/black for extreme traffic issues like road closures. Which of those sounds more useful? Google was lacking individual incident reports but added them on the most recent release.

Which brings up another point where I feel Google Maps is superior. Google can add features to its map app at anytime. How often can you expect an update for Apple Maps? Once a year with the new Version of iOS. In theory Apple could update Maps out of cycle with iOS but it most likely won't.
post #62 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Google can add features to its map app at anytime. How often can you expect an update for Apple Maps? Once a year with the new Version of iOS. In theory Apple could update Maps out of cycle with iOS but it most likely won't.

Utter nonsense. Stop spewing FUD.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #63 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsun Zu View Post

Why cant Apple or partner maps ompanies employ volunteers to correct issue like the above? I am willing to correct at least 30/40 entries a day. I am sure I am not the only one and someday you will join us. That should improve Maps tremendously in a very short time.

If you'd like to, subscribe here

https://jobs.apple.com/us/search?#specs&ss=ground%20truth&t=1&so=&pN=0

post #64 of 82
I remember when DED articles just to bring home the bacon. Now it can't even top 100 posts. 1tongue.gif

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #65 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjc999 View Post

BTW, Google Maps beta with Earth is not limited to four directions. Hold down the Ctrl key while dragging with the left mouse and you can pan in 3D at any angle.

Then instead of having to push a button to get it why not just make it work all the time what a stupid way for google to implement that.

post #66 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsun Zu View Post

With all those 3D views, if you are not living in the US or other prominent parts of the world, you will find Google Maps is far better. Apple Maps have so many errors that it is unusable in my city. Places are wrongly labeled, names are misspelled, POIs are misplaced. Google, on the other hand, is 90% of the time accurate.

 

And what you are saying here is purely area problems.  Google has just as many cities and areas in the world that have piss poor directions and piss poor implementation of POI's as well and like the article showed Googles maps have far more graphic flaws that just have not been fixed in 7+ years.  I have suffered through them where I live.  Where I live Apple Maps is far better.

post #67 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjc999 View Post

 

But you are right, they did scramble to do a press conference a week before to upstage Apple's announcement, and it worked, because when Apple Maps arrived, people had already seen it, so it was less "magical", and now Apple did not have any exclusive feature anymore. 

 

It worked for you.  Apples implementation of 3D maps is infinitely better.  The images are far more detailed.  Goolges images look like a child drew them with a crayon in most cases.

post #68 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Google Maps: 8 Years Old
Apple Maps: 1 Year Old

Is Google Maps eight times better than Apple's first effort?

+1

post #69 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling View Post
I think it'd be great if Apple did like Microsoft and Google, and offer a web version of their Maps.  This would also likely prompt more public feedback like Google gets.
That will probably be coming after the Mavericks implementation and I agree with you that it would be a good idea.
post #70 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Was another article really needed? Yes. It was really needed.
Why was another article really needed? Because the competitors paid for ten times this press, in lies, when the software was launched. Someone has to fight back.

 

 

+1
post #71 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by patpatpat View Post

  • Apple labels Siri as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked even as a beta)
  • Apple doesn't labels Maps as a public beta, people complain (because it sucked as a non beta)

 

See the pattern?

Define "Sucked" with some real info instead of a personal opinion.  Both work very well for me every day.

post #72 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post

Define "Sucked" with some real info instead of a personal opinion.  Both work very well for me every day.

Here we go again.. "Works for me" response therefore no-one else in the world could ever have any issues and are all wrong. It's not about person opinion it's personal experience.

post #73 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Utter nonsense. Stop spewing FUD.

Do you even know what FUD means? Because it doesn't apply here.

And if it's utter nonsense, please enlighten me to the software features that Apple has added to the Maps app since iOS 6 was released almost a year ago. I'll even take it a step further, what features has Apple added to ANY of the built in apps since last iOS release? Email? Music? Camera?
post #74 of 82

Untill Flyover covers most of the world, it will remain a gimmick and not something useful to me. Google's 3D view may be distorted at times, but at least they have more coverage and does actually provide me with accurate directions. Maybe after 7 years Apple Maps will be just as useful, but until that day, I'll still rely on something that actually finds me the correct route to my destination.

post #75 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Do you even know what FUD means? Because it doesn't apply here.
Quote:
FUD is generally a strategic attempt to influence perception by disseminating negative and dubious or false information. An individual firm, for example, might use FUD to invite unfavorable opinions and speculation about a competitor's product; to increase the general estimation of switching costs among current customers; or to maintain leverage over a current business partner who could potentially become a rival.

It perfectly applies here. Because you're lying and pushing a competitor as 'better'.
Quote:
And if it's utter nonsense, please enlighten me to the software features that Apple has added to the Maps app since iOS 6 was released almost a year ago.

Let's see, countless corrections, multiple cities in flyover, expanded reviews… 1hmm.gif
Quote:
I'll even take it a step further, what features has Apple added to ANY of the built in apps since last iOS release? Email? Music? Camera?

Why are you pretending to not know that point updates exist? Seems sort of dumb.
Quote:
Originally Posted by artvader View Post

Untill Flyover covers most of the world, it will remain a gimmick and not something useful to me. Google's 3D view may be distorted at times, but at least they have more coverage and does actually provide me with accurate directions. Maybe after 7 years Apple Maps will be just as useful, but until that day, I'll still rely on something that actually finds me the correct route to my destination.

Troll somewhere else, bucko.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #76 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by artvader View Post

Untill Flyover covers most of the world, it will remain a gimmick and not something useful to me. 

You live everywhere at once?

post #77 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

You live everywhere at once?

Oh, geez, it's God. Rapture time.

"God needs a map to not get lost?" 1tongue.gif

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #78 of 82

My team collects hundreds of thousands of miles a year of precision geospatial LiDAR and imagery of our nations roads.  I have some understanding of this market and no stake in who wins or looses, so let me provide a little perspective on the heavyweight players in this realm.  "Here" (Nokia/Navteq) has the deepest geodatabase. Google has the most users and consumer opportunities to use their data. Microsoft could have been the biggest player but several reboots have put them behind.  That leaves Apple to reinvent the paradigm with a new perspective that isn't burdened by the legacy software and data formats.  Plus, they have the successful  iOS and Mac OS platforms as an installed base.  That ecosystem alone allows them to roll out a mapping product and have instant acceptance.  Apple is in a very enviable position at this point and if they play their hand well, they could become the big player in our automobile dashboards.

post #79 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Oh, geez, it's God. Rapture time.

"God needs a map to not get lost?" 1tongue.gif

God uses Apple, I knew it :)

post #80 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

You live everywhere at once?
actually, I need accurate maps to know where to deliver my goods every December. Go figure.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
  • Apple's iOS 7 3D Maps leave Google Earth, Nokia Maps 3D looking old fashioned
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Apple's iOS 7 3D Maps leave Google Earth, Nokia Maps 3D looking old fashioned