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Apple's iPhone builds on US smartphone lead as iOS gains on Android

post #1 of 59
Thread Starter 
According to research firm comScore's latest U.S. smartphone user report, Apple saw quarterly subscriber gains in June as iOS slowly crept up on Android, which held stable with over half of the market.

comScore
Source: comScore


On the heels of IDC's look at the worldwide smartphone market, comScore issued the latest findings from its MobiLens service for the second quarter of 2013.

The firm found Apple to lead the U.S. market with a 39.9 percent share at the end of June, a positive 0.9 point change from the first three months of the year. Samsung also boosted its piece of the pie by 2 percent, ending the second quarter with 23.7 percent of the market.

Apple and Samsung's gains were at the expense of the other top five manufacturers, with No. 3 HTC holding 8.5 percent of the market, fourth place Motorola with 7.2 percent, and LG at 6.6 percent. Each of the bottom three lost marketshare equating to 0.5 percent, 1.3 percent, and 0.2 percent, respectively.

comScore


In terms of operating system marketshare, Android dominated with 52 percent of the market, but exhibited no growth quarter-to-quarter. Apple's iOS came in second with a 39.9 percent share, again up 0.9 points from last quarter.

BlackBerry took 4.4 percent of the market, down 0.8 percent from the March quarter, while Microsoft's Windows Phone moved up slightly from 3.0 percent to 3.1 percent. Symbian continued to fall, losing 0.2 points quarter-to-quarter to finish with 0.3 percent of the market.

At the end of the June quarter, almost 142 million people in the U.S. owned a smartphone, a number up 4 percent since March. According to comScore, smartphones now account for 59 percent of the mobile market.
post #2 of 59
But but but but but…

Originally Posted by asdasd

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Originally Posted by asdasd

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post #3 of 59
Samsung is doing quite a number on the other Android vendors.
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post #4 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

But but but but but…

but, by the numbers all of iOS's gains were from other platforms.
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post #5 of 59
Everyone including Tim Cook knows the iPhone does well in the western world.

It's been on top in the US and UK for a long time now.

Where growth has been declining for Apple is the Eastern world such as Russia, China, and India. That's why their global share is shrinking.

All that to say this issue will be addresses when the iPhone 5C comes out. I'm sure it will be positioned as the iPhone for everyone.
post #6 of 59
And this is being done without any product announcements since last sept/oct. for any iOS device, so as they say, it's the calm before the storm.
post #7 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

But but but but but…

The Surface has a kickstand...   See........................  click.

post #8 of 59
All this cascade of data on shipment shares from the various data vendors for various quarters for various parts of the world for various manufacturers versus various device types versus various software platforms using various (unexplained) methodologies amount to a little more than noise. Utter junk. For fools, by fools.

The only honest numbers on quantities sold in the business are the ones put out by Apple every every quarter in its financial statements. Period.
post #9 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

Where growth has been declining for Apple is the Eastern world such as Russia, China, and India..

That is simply factually incorrect.
post #10 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

The Surface has a kickstand...   See........................  click.

What does that have to do with the article?
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"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
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post #11 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

But but but but but…

 

Fandroids switched their talking points from U.S. to global statistics a long time ago. Where have you been? The inconvenient truth about U.S. numbers is not something they like to talk about.

post #12 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

The Surface has a kickstand...   See........................  click.

And you can break dance to it.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #13 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Fandroids switched their talking points from U.S. to global statistics a long time ago. Where have you been? The inconvenient truth about U.S. numbers is not something they like to talk about.

My favorite talking point: "I'm a long time Apple user and I am concerned about Apple's lack of competitiveness which would be solved by giving the iPhone 5s a giant screen, Steve must be rolling over in his grave P.S., here is the list of Apple products I've owned since 1926..."

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #14 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post


My favorite talking point: "I'm a long time Apple user and I am concerned about Apple's lack of competitiveness which would be solved by giving the iPhone 5s a giant screen, Steve must be rolling over in his grave P.S., here is the list of Apple products I've owned since 1926..."

You can't forget the most important part of their talking point!

 

"Now I'm going to have to buy an Android, Windows, etc."

post #15 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


That is simply factually incorrect.

 

Last quarter sales in China and India dipped along with Apple's marketshare in those areas. In Russia the top carriers all dropped the iPhone. Those are the problems I'm talking about.

post #16 of 59
So I figured it out. I'll let you all in on it, but you have to stifle any contempt and just argue rationally.

Apple has discovered that people in the so-called developing world actually prefer personal objects that are made of plastic, the more brightly colored the better, over things that are made of metal, whether shiny or satin finish. If you go into a Chinese or Japanese toy store, or one that carries stuff for young people, all you see is bright plastic in colors. Hello Kitty and all that.

Different peoples have different broad areas of preference according to their respective stages of development. The West suffers from Plastic Fatigue. It is Post Polymeric.

The East is entering the era of chemical mass manufacture. It is in the midst of the Plastic Revolution, the secret that was given to Dustin Hoffman in The Graduate. That was too late, thus the joke.

John Crowley wrote a post-apocalytic novel (Engine Summer? Little Big?) in which survivors spend an inordinate amount of time looking through the ruins for plastic, since they value it above all other materials. This seems to be a likely prediction of what would happen.

So HTC made a big mistake with the One, and if Samsung follows through on their intentions to raise the quality of their phones, well, we shall see about what's thought to be cheap and what's not.
post #17 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post


And you can break dance to it.

And the cover clicks too!     like that hasn't been done before.........

post #18 of 59

One minute it is iOS, another minute it is Android. Should we really care?

post #19 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

Last quarter sales in China and India dipped along with Apple's marketshare in those areas. In Russia the top carriers all dropped the iPhone. Those are the problems I'm talking about.

In India you can buy an Android phone for $81

http://www.knowyourmobile.in/android/7311/top-10-cheapest-android-phone-india-below-rs-5000-july-2013

In India the iPhone starts at $433 for the iPhone 4... then goes to $745 for the iPhone 5

http://shop.airtel.com/pages/iphone

Are you really surprised Android is dominating in India?



I could go on for China and Russia... but you know the outcome.

BTW... aren't China, India and Russia considered to be developing nations? Do you think that's why rather expensive Apple products go unnoticed by a vast majority of their populations?

You know Apple doesn't do "cheap"
post #20 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post


My favorite talking point: "I'm a long time Apple user and I am concerned about Apple's lack of competitiveness which would be solved by giving the iPhone 5s a giant screen, Steve must be rolling over in his grave P.S., here is the list of Apple products I've owned since 1926..."

 

The underlined may be true to many iPhone 5 users.  Moto X is quite similar (a tiny bit wider) with iPhone 5 in smartphone size, but it has 4.7 inch screen size.  4 inch is just not on.

post #21 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

But but but but but…

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“A PC is no bargain when it doesn’t do what you want.” - Apple 2009
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post #22 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

But but but but but…

 

Fandroids switched their talking points from U.S. to global statistics a long time ago. Where have you been? The inconvenient truth about U.S. numbers is not something they like to talk about.

I believe it's the oposite. Most of us didn't want to face the truth of global statistics. If Apple does not change their strategy, it's a new mac situation and that worked great for them once they made it right.

 

But iOS can be much more. It's Apple's call. They know what they have to do, just like everyone else does. I really doubt the iPhone still outsells all other high end offerings combined, it's an all out assault.

 

If they want a different situation (certainly they don't need it unless they want more than 5% market share in a year) another high end offering with bigger screen is mandatory, that's the only reason to go high end android in the first place. Pricing is right with the current line.

 

But they need to drop the 4 and 4s around the world, nobody will pay 400 euros for a 3 year old phone that will have the last update without most features in a few months. they need a cheaper alternative with something no one offers at the chosen price point, be it retina screen and/or the camera used on the iphone 5.

 

And then... what good is for them dominating the US? Growth isn't there. The most talented people in the world at almost everything aren't native USA. With those resources, it's a shame Apple isn't treating the rest of the world like they should since long ago. 400 stores and all sorts of services in the USA, 0 in Portugal. There's no excuse.

 

And what the hell are they waiting for monetizing android? Where's the android itunes store? There's simply no excuse, expecially from a company that always played the low market share game and until a few years ago Mac users had troubles finding and using alternatives to popular software. No excuse.

 

I need a new phone, Apple gives me only the option to go android, and I lose my ecosystem? It's bad for everyone, even Apple in the long term.

post #23 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

400 stores and all sorts of services in the USA, 0 in Portugal. There's no excuse.

The high unemployment rate is the reason?
Quote:
And what the hell are they waiting for monetizing android? Where's the android itunes store?

What is an Android iTunes Store?
Quote:
I need a new phone, Apple gives me only the option to go android, and I lose my ecosystem? It's bad for everyone, even Apple in the long term.

Can't you buy an iPhone here?
http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone5
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post #24 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

What is an Android iTunes Store?

I think he meant where's Android's equivalent to iTunes.
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post #25 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

The high unemployment rate is the reason?


What is an Android iTunes Store?

Can't you buy an iPhone here?
http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone5

The reason is that Apple made a decision of playing a conservative game. And that's fine, it worked fine on the Mac, but they lost the agressivity they once had with the iOS plataform. Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

 

Apple could have something different, but they are paying for it and will have "only" another Mac situation, but this time, there's 2 Microsofts. Google and Samsung, not to mention what an agressive Microsoft might accomplish. Let's not be fools, Apple is letting the Android and Windows ecosystem breath again and everything is far from stable. 13% Market share when most developed countries don't know what a smartphone is and the US or UK are already saturated? It will only go down from here. Then what?

 

About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it. Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

 

About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5? 600 € for 4s? 400 € for the 4? No way in hell. the costumers that still do not have an iPhone can easely be in one of these 2 groups:

 

 a) need a bigger screen;

 b) need a cheaper device;

 

Apple has nothing for us. I would pay with hard work for a phone that's more confortable for reading, consumption (games, movies) and editing documents. I have no interest on an iPad since many phones can do it, but OEMs always find a way to f*ck them with other things, like bad build quality (like the s4. the HTC one shows that a big phone can have great build quality), bad pentile screen (like the s4. the HTC one shows that's possible to make a phone with a big and better screen than the one used on the iPhone), no software updates (HTC, unfortunately).

 

I (and the others) would still use my Macbook air (or a PC) for those things without making a fuss about it if Apple provided a cheaper alternative that belong in 2013. Look at this:

https://loja.vodafone.pt/homephone/telemovel.htm?id=72492-1&modelo=Sony-Xperia-L-Preto 

vs this:

http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone4?product=IPHONE4

 

Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

 

They are just waiting and saving those things, meanwhile the money keeps coming... just like MS did, but with more class now.

 

Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start. We all know what Apple should do if they want more market share.It's up to them. We also know that all these giant companies can be rulled and defended by retarded CEOs and fans, like Apple was, Microsoft is, RIM is, Apple can be.

post #26 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

The reason is that Apple made a decision of playing a conservative game. And that's fine, it worked fine on the Mac, but they lost the agressivity they once had with the iOS plataform. Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

Apple could have something different, but they are paying for it and will have "only" another Mac situation, but this time, there's 2 Microsofts. Google and Samsung, not to mention what an agressive Microsoft might accomplish. Let's not be fools, Apple is letting the Android and Windows ecosystem breath again and everything is far from stable. 13% Market share when most developed countries don't know what a smartphone is and the US or UK are already saturated? It will only go down from here. Then what?

About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it. Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5? 600 € for 4s? 400 € for the 4? No way in hell. the costumers that still do not have an iPhone can easely be in one of these 2 groups:

 a) need a bigger screen;
 b) need a cheaper device;

Apple has nothing for us. I would pay with hard work for a phone that's more confortable for reading, consumption (games, movies) and editing documents. I have no interest on an iPad since many phones can do it, but OEMs always find a way to f*ck them with other things, like bad build quality (like the s4. the HTC one shows that a big phone can have great build quality), bad pentile screen (like the s4. the HTC one shows that's possible to make a phone with a big and better screen than the one used on the iPhone), no software updates (HTC, unfortunately).

I (and the others) would still use my Macbook air (or a PC) for those things without making a fuss about it if Apple provided a cheaper alternative that belong in 2013. Look at this:
https://loja.vodafone.pt/homephone/telemovel.htm?id=72492-1&modelo=Sony-Xperia-L-Preto 

vs this:
http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone4?product=IPHONE4

Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

They are just waiting and saving those things, meanwhile the money keeps coming... just like MS did, but with more class now.

Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start. We all know what Apple should do if they want more market share.It's up to them. We also know that all these giant companies can be rulled and defended by retarded CEOs and fans, like Apple was, Microsoft is, RIM is, Apple can be.

You're over dramatizing the situation.

Apple's market share is still growing in most parts of the world even with the higher price of their devices.

The necessity for a bigger screen is overrated.

Most of the Android phones that are outselling the iPhone are actually smaller cheaper devices. That means that the biggest selling "feature" for those phones is the price.

The iPhone still handily outsells every 5 inch Android phone. Nothing has changed there.

What's more important at this point is getting an iPhone in the mid range market. The iPhone 5C will address that and we'll see the iPhone go to places it has never gone before.
post #27 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

 

Last quarter sales in China and India dipped along with Apple's marketshare in those areas. In Russia the top carriers all dropped the iPhone. Those are the problems I'm talking about.

One quarter means nothing. It's pure noise, and a function, among other things of new product introduction schedules of Apple versus its competition.

 

It only makes sense to look at an annual number, so as to smooth over a whole new product launch-growth-maturity-decline cycle.

post #28 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

The reason is that Apple made a decision of playing a conservative game. And that's fine, it worked fine on the Mac, but they lost the agressivity they once had with the iOS plataform. Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

 

Apple could have something different, but they are paying for it and will have "only" another Mac situation, but this time, there's 2 Microsofts. Google and Samsung, not to mention what an agressive Microsoft might accomplish. Let's not be fools, Apple is letting the Android and Windows ecosystem breath again and everything is far from stable. 13% Market share when most developed countries don't know what a smartphone is and the US or UK are already saturated? It will only go down from here. Then what?

 

About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it. Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

 

About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5? 600 € for 4s? 400 € for the 4? No way in hell. the costumers that still do not have an iPhone can easely be in one of these 2 groups:

 

 a) need a bigger screen;

 b) need a cheaper device;

 

Apple has nothing for us. I would pay with hard work for a phone that's more confortable for reading, consumption (games, movies) and editing documents. I have no interest on an iPad since many phones can do it, but OEMs always find a way to f*ck them with other things, like bad build quality (like the s4. the HTC one shows that a big phone can have great build quality), bad pentile screen (like the s4. the HTC one shows that's possible to make a phone with a big and better screen than the one used on the iPhone), no software updates (HTC, unfortunately).

 

I (and the others) would still use my Macbook air (or a PC) for those things without making a fuss about it if Apple provided a cheaper alternative that belong in 2013. Look at this:

https://loja.vodafone.pt/homephone/telemovel.htm?id=72492-1&modelo=Sony-Xperia-L-Preto 

vs this:

http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone4?product=IPHONE4

 

Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

 

They are just waiting and saving those things, meanwhile the money keeps coming... just like MS did, but with more class now.

 

Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start. We all know what Apple should do if they want more market share.It's up to them. We also know that all these giant companies can be rulled and defended by retarded CEOs and fans, like Apple was, Microsoft is, RIM is, Apple can be.

 

Where do I start?  

Europe and Asia have the most talented people?  I would suggest that they do have talented people, but I don't know if they are the MOST talented.  So what successful desktop computer has come out of Europe? Asia only provides use with cheap labor, but Apple's are designed in the US and they have the best laptops, AIO units, and the new MacPro looks like a very interesting change to the traditional, ugly, heat generating, power sucking tower which usually provide more than what people actually use.

 

I agree that Apple needed to change the iOS management, but since they made the change about 10 months ago, so far, the changes seem to be for the positive.  In terms of hardware design, in order to meet the requirements Apple has for a large screen smartphone, I think it is just taking them longer than it should, but they are working on a lot of new stuff that no one else is working on, plus they are bursting at the seams from the job growth.  Apple's doing the work that probably 40+ other companies are trying to copy bits and pieces.  Who actually develops as much as they do from a desktop/laptop, OS, mobile devices, apps, processors, controller chips, and God knows what else?  NO ONE.  They aren't perfect, but they are moving their ship as fast as they can and I'm looking forward to improved products and some game changers along the way, whether they are small or large.

 

So what if Google owns more market share, that just indicated there are more sheep buying into a platform that has more malware and security problems with less apps (quantity and quality) and third party hardware products to choose from and most of these Android mfg can't seem to make a decent profit.  Surprise, surprise.

 

Samsung can't even upgrade all of the phones they sell to the latest OS that is available.  WHAT A SCAM.  Users that buy into Samsung are getting stung and they don't even know it, or realize it, unless someone sits them down and explains how they are buying technology with an old OS that has bugs and security flaws. OOOPS.  Talented people don't always know everything.

 

I don't know if Apple wants to be an Android developer since that takes resources and since there are too many different OS versions, screen sizes and screen resolutions and products to test an application on, they would rather avoid it than have to waste the time when most Android users barely have two quarters to rub together or if they do, they certainly don't want to spend it on content or apps.

 

I agree with having a bigger screen iPhone, I'll admit that.  As far as a cheaper iPhone?  How cheap do you want it?  $150?  NO PROFIT IN IT to make it worthwhile, I'm sure that what these rumors look like is an iPhone 5 but in a polycarb case for $400 or SLIGHTLY less, is my guess.  Obviously, I don't know what will be announced anymore than anyone else outside Apple, but would that be good enough for your pompous ego?   Obviously, you like supporting a platform that doesn't really seem to understand how to make decent profits unless you are component supplier that's competing with their component customers (which is conflict of interest and just plain unethical).

 

From what it sounds like, you really don't spend much money on IT products.  What do you do for a living or your main source of using a computer/mobile device?


Did you know that about 800 Million Android phones are exposed to this latest security flaw?  Or do you not keep up?

I'd rather wait until Apple releases their large screen iPhone instead of buying some FLAWED POS.  sorry, but I can do things by syncing up certain apps I use daily between all of my devices because for certain things I prefer a desktop with a BIG monitor, some things i prefer using a 9.7 inch screen tablet and I use my phone for needs that serve my current needs.  I will say that beyond much of the BS hype around the iPhone 4, I've owned one for over 1 1/2 years and it hasn't crashed, the battery still holds a charge just fine, I've never cracked a screen or had to reset the OS, and it has never dropped call from my end that I'm aware of unless i was indoors in a bad cell zone, which is to be expected.  My iPad works flawlessly.  My iMac works great, and I enjoy only having to learn basically one company's platform where I can call one company that actually answers the phone (typically in less than 2 minutes to a live person) and my needs get resolved.  I would rather pay a little extra and have what I have than pay less and have the experiences my Android using friends have had with their Android phones, since most of them bitched and complained, many have switched to an iPhone and I don't hear them bitching and complaining about things like dropped calls, texting errors, battery drain, malware, devices that die, etc. 

 

Enjoy your malware, if you even find out you have it. Remember, anti virus apps don't always recognize all of the different types of malware.

 

Samsung is not a company I would support other than their components, they are a VERY unethical company in my book.  They've been caught with price fixing, they do what I think is VERY unethical business by entering the smartphone and tablet market and copying all of the well known brands that designed their products FIRST.  I've never held a Samsung product where I thought it was high quality. 

post #29 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

Careful now. Talent comes from every corner of the planet. Stupidity as well BTW, without insinuating you are.
Quote:
About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it.

"Write software for Android? I'd rather piss on it"
Quote:
Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

There are no people that need it bigger screen. There are, however, people who think they do. In the end it won't be a portable device anymore. People who want a bigger screen (to look at, so don't need voice over cellular) buy an iPad Mini
Quote:
About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5?

Seems a fair price for what the product and its included services give you. I paid € 874

Yes, and? It doesn't come with iOS. And the experience is all in the software. No iOS = no sale.
Quote:
Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

Degrade the company to create sub-par products? No, I think people (and Apple) have opened their eyes, and see how truly pathetic the competing products are.
Quote:
Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start.

Then maybe you shouldn't invoke it with posts like these.
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post #30 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Samsung is doing quite a number on the other Android vendors.

Indeed.

post #31 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Then maybe you shouldn't invoke it with posts like these.

Don't you mean provoke?

post #32 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

I'd rather wait until Apple releases their large screen iPhone instead of buying some FLAWED POS.  

Is there such a thing as an unflawed POS? :)

post #33 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

Yes, Apple has its defenders. But in no way are they milking anything. 

 

Apple is designing and manufacturing some of the best products ever made in the iPhone, the iPad and the Macs. They are responsible for production of these products the volume exceeding 100M annually. They are providing the OS, an app store, cloud storage, map services, search services (yes, Siri is part of the search service), email, core apps, a music and video store for these products.

 

How many other companies in the world are doing this much? Would you point to any of them and say they are milking it?

post #34 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

The reason is that Apple made a decision of playing a conservative game. And that's fine, it worked fine on the Mac, but they lost the agressivity they once had with the iOS plataform. Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

 

Apple could have something different, but they are paying for it and will have "only" another Mac situation, but this time, there's 2 Microsofts. Google and Samsung, not to mention what an agressive Microsoft might accomplish. Let's not be fools, Apple is letting the Android and Windows ecosystem breath again and everything is far from stable. 13% Market share when most developed countries don't know what a smartphone is and the US or UK are already saturated? It will only go down from here. Then what?

 

About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it. Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

 

About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5? 600 € for 4s? 400 € for the 4? No way in hell. the costumers that still do not have an iPhone can easely be in one of these 2 groups:

 

 a) need a bigger screen;

 b) need a cheaper device;

 

Apple has nothing for us. I would pay with hard work for a phone that's more confortable for reading, consumption (games, movies) and editing documents. I have no interest on an iPad since many phones can do it, but OEMs always find a way to f*ck them with other things, like bad build quality (like the s4. the HTC one shows that a big phone can have great build quality), bad pentile screen (like the s4. the HTC one shows that's possible to make a phone with a big and better screen than the one used on the iPhone), no software updates (HTC, unfortunately).

 

I (and the others) would still use my Macbook air (or a PC) for those things without making a fuss about it if Apple provided a cheaper alternative that belong in 2013. Look at this:

https://loja.vodafone.pt/homephone/telemovel.htm?id=72492-1&modelo=Sony-Xperia-L-Preto 

vs this:

http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone4?product=IPHONE4

 

Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

 

They are just waiting and saving those things, meanwhile the money keeps coming... just like MS did, but with more class now.

 

Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start. We all know what Apple should do if they want more market share.It's up to them. We also know that all these giant companies can be rulled and defended by retarded CEOs and fans, like Apple was, Microsoft is, RIM is, Apple can be.

And what are the two biggest selling phone models? 4S and 5.  OK?   The S3 and S4 haven't sold as many per unit as the iPhone 4S and iPhone 5.  OK?

 

Apple is one company in a market where there a lot of mfg making hundreds of phones that sell in more countries and more carriers. If Apple turned on EVERY country and every carrier that Android is marketed through, they couldn't build them fast enough to meet demand. They kind of have to ramp the number of carriers and countries as their assembly suppliers and component suppliers can handle an increased in demand.  But at least Apple doesn't force you to buy a new product to get the latest OS.  Remember, 4.3 is the latest OS, and how many phones/tablets actually run it?  I think you can count on one hand. How many can't?  HUNDRED OF MODELS that represent probably 96% of the market of 900 Million devices.  So MOST of the devices can't or don't even run 4.3.  OOOPS.  Heck, just even getting Android devices to run a 6 month old OS is almost as bad as the latest version OS.  FAIL.  MAJOR FAIL.


Imagine that, buying a product that doesn't and probably won't run the latest OS for at least 6 months, IF at all.  SUCKERS!

post #35 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

The reason is that Apple made a decision of playing a conservative game. And that's fine, it worked fine on the Mac, but they lost the agressivity they once had with the iOS plataform. Samsung OWNs Europe and Asia. That's also where the most talented persons of the world live.

 

Apple could have something different, but they are paying for it and will have "only" another Mac situation, but this time, there's 2 Microsofts. Google and Samsung, not to mention what an agressive Microsoft might accomplish. Let's not be fools, Apple is letting the Android and Windows ecosystem breath again and everything is far from stable. 13% Market share when most developed countries don't know what a smartphone is and the US or UK are already saturated? It will only go down from here. Then what?

 

About the iTunes Store... It's about time for Apple to put iTunes on Android and monetize it. Google isn't Microsoft, and is already building a great and competitive alternative to iTunes. Since Apple doesn't have a nice phone for millions of costumers that a) need a bigger screen or b) need a cheaper device, those millions of people (more than the number of iPhone costumers) are forced to leave the iTunes all together.

 

About the iPhone... Are you keeding me? 700 € for the iPhone 5? 600 € for 4s? 400 € for the 4? No way in hell. the costumers that still do not have an iPhone can easely be in one of these 2 groups:

 

 a) need a bigger screen;

 b) need a cheaper device;

 

Apple has nothing for us. I would pay with hard work for a phone that's more confortable for reading, consumption (games, movies) and editing documents. I have no interest on an iPad since many phones can do it, but OEMs always find a way to f*ck them with other things, like bad build quality (like the s4. the HTC one shows that a big phone can have great build quality), bad pentile screen (like the s4. the HTC one shows that's possible to make a phone with a big and better screen than the one used on the iPhone), no software updates (HTC, unfortunately).

 

I (and the others) would still use my Macbook air (or a PC) for those things without making a fuss about it if Apple provided a cheaper alternative that belong in 2013. Look at this:

https://loja.vodafone.pt/homephone/telemovel.htm?id=72492-1&modelo=Sony-Xperia-L-Preto 

vs this:

http://store.apple.com/pt/buy/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone4?product=IPHONE4

 

Basically, if a crap company like HTC can do the One, and an worse company like sony can do the Xperia L, Apple, the company responsible for almost all evolutions and all revolutions, with 160 billions in the bank, amazing engineers and huge market cap, should be able to do not the same but MUCH BETTER. There's no excuse, they are simply milking it and most posters blindly defending them.

 

They are just waiting and saving those things, meanwhile the money keeps coming... just like MS did, but with more class now.

 

Having said that, I just hope the typical TS coments like "oh, so you know better than Apple? Go away" don't start. We all know what Apple should do if they want more market share.It's up to them. We also know that all these giant companies can be rulled and defended by retarded CEOs and fans, like Apple was, Microsoft is, RIM is, Apple can be.

You have a MacBook AIr? And how many apps that you run on your Android device sync up with your Mac without doing anything?  Which apps are they? Some Google Doc BS?  I don't qualify those as decent apps.  Sorry.  But what else syncs up without doing anything between your Android device and your laptop?  Name em.

post #36 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post



There are no people that need it bigger screen. There are, however, people who think they do. In the end it won't be a portable device anymore. People who want a bigger screen (to look at, so don't need voice over cellular) buy an iPad Mini
 

You'll be eating these words when apple release a 5" iPhone.

post #37 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

And the cover clicks too!     like that hasn't been done before.........

The iPad 2 Smart Cover clicks.

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post #38 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by patpatpat View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

There are no people that need it bigger screen. There are, however, people who think they do. In the end it won't be a portable device anymore. People who want a bigger screen (to look at, so don't need voice over cellular) buy an iPad Mini

 
You'll be eating these words when apple release a 5" iPhone.

Nope. I'll be holding onto my 4", possibly longing for the days of the 3.5"

If I want a larger screen I'd get an iPad Mini. For a phone there's a reason they're small.
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post #39 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Nope. I'll be holding onto my 4", possibly longing for the days of the 3.5"

If I want a larger screen I'd get an iPad Mini. For a phone there's a reason they're small.

Phones are dead. No one gives a **** about phones anymore because they are archaic stuff without value besides fashion, just like watches.

 

What we have now are portable computers that can make calls, but that's only a small part of it. If you don't browse the web, read pdfs, tweet, facebook, play some games and watch some videos or even read some magazine, that's your problem and I'm sure the current iPhone is perfect for your needs.

 

However, for us that were born in the digital era, Internet is something constant. A big screen phone makes a world of difference, and a big screen device made by Apple has tremendous potential. No one is saying that it would sell more than the current model, or that Apple should stop selling the current model. We are only saying that as millions of potential costumers show, a big screen iPhone can be a better iPhone, even if not for you.

 

Not seeing the obvious and continuing with your line of thinking makes discussing this tiresome. Your opinion is irrelevant (and wrong), but the facts are there. Open your eyes. People love big screens. Those monkeys at motorola managed to create a phone with the same dimensions as the iphone 5 but with a 4.5" screen. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

 

Where do I start?  

Europe and Asia have the most talented people?  I would suggest that they do have talented people, but I don't know if they are the MOST talented.  So what successful desktop computer has come out of Europe? Asia only provides use with cheap labor, but Apple's are designed in the US and they have the best laptops, AIO units, and the new MacPro looks like a very interesting change to the traditional, ugly, heat generating, power sucking tower which usually provide more than what people actually use.

 

I agree that Apple needed to change the iOS management, but since they made the change about 10 months ago, so far, the changes seem to be for the positive.  In terms of hardware design, in order to meet the requirements Apple has for a large screen smartphone, I think it is just taking them longer than it should, but they are working on a lot of new stuff that no one else is working on, plus they are bursting at the seams from the job growth.  Apple's doing the work that probably 40+ other companies are trying to copy bits and pieces.  Who actually develops as much as they do from a desktop/laptop, OS, mobile devices, apps, processors, controller chips, and God knows what else?  NO ONE.  They aren't perfect, but they are moving their ship as fast as they can and I'm looking forward to improved products and some game changers along the way, whether they are small or large.

 

So what if Google owns more market share, that just indicated there are more sheep buying into a platform that has more malware and security problems with less apps (quantity and quality) and third party hardware products to choose from and most of these Android mfg can't seem to make a decent profit.  Surprise, surprise.

 

Samsung can't even upgrade all of the phones they sell to the latest OS that is available.  WHAT A SCAM.  Users that buy into Samsung are getting stung and they don't even know it, or realize it, unless someone sits them down and explains how they are buying technology with an old OS that has bugs and security flaws. OOOPS.  Talented people don't always know everything.

 

I don't know if Apple wants to be an Android developer since that takes resources and since there are too many different OS versions, screen sizes and screen resolutions and products to test an application on, they would rather avoid it than have to waste the time when most Android users barely have two quarters to rub together or if they do, they certainly don't want to spend it on content or apps.

 

I agree with having a bigger screen iPhone, I'll admit that.  As far as a cheaper iPhone?  How cheap do you want it?  $150?  NO PROFIT IN IT to make it worthwhile, I'm sure that what these rumors look like is an iPhone 5 but in a polycarb case for $400 or SLIGHTLY less, is my guess.  Obviously, I don't know what will be announced anymore than anyone else outside Apple, but would that be good enough for your pompous ego?   Obviously, you like supporting a platform that doesn't really seem to understand how to make decent profits unless you are component supplier that's competing with their component customers (which is conflict of interest and just plain unethical).

 

From what it sounds like, you really don't spend much money on IT products.  What do you do for a living or your main source of using a computer/mobile device?


Did you know that about 800 Million Android phones are exposed to this latest security flaw?  Or do you not keep up?

I'd rather wait until Apple releases their large screen iPhone instead of buying some FLAWED POS.  sorry, but I can do things by syncing up certain apps I use daily between all of my devices because for certain things I prefer a desktop with a BIG monitor, some things i prefer using a 9.7 inch screen tablet and I use my phone for needs that serve my current needs.  I will say that beyond much of the BS hype around the iPhone 4, I've owned one for over 1 1/2 years and it hasn't crashed, the battery still holds a charge just fine, I've never cracked a screen or had to reset the OS, and it has never dropped call from my end that I'm aware of unless i was indoors in a bad cell zone, which is to be expected.  My iPad works flawlessly.  My iMac works great, and I enjoy only having to learn basically one company's platform where I can call one company that actually answers the phone (typically in less than 2 minutes to a live person) and my needs get resolved.  I would rather pay a little extra and have what I have than pay less and have the experiences my Android using friends have had with their Android phones, since most of them bitched and complained, many have switched to an iPhone and I don't hear them bitching and complaining about things like dropped calls, texting errors, battery drain, malware, devices that die, etc. 

 

Enjoy your malware, if you even find out you have it. Remember, anti virus apps don't always recognize all of the different types of malware.

 

Samsung is not a company I would support other than their components, they are a VERY unethical company in my book.  They've been caught with price fixing, they do what I think is VERY unethical business by entering the smartphone and tablet market and copying all of the well known brands that designed their products FIRST.  I've never held a Samsung product where I thought it was high quality. 

First of all, thanks for your post. I'm going to do my best to adress your points.

 

Take Apple (the exception) out of the equation and you will realize that all innovation from all areas comes from Asian countries like Korea, China, etc or people that were born there. It's a well known fact that the US needs to import talent. Right? But that's almost irrelevant and adds nothing to the subject in discussion, I agree.

 

I agree with almost everything you said on this paragraph, but it's obvious that a bigger screen should be in production long ago. HTC, a crap company, managed to do it. The simple fact is that there is no excuse for Apple.

 

This isn't about Google having more market share, this is about Google owning 95% of the market in a year and Apple having very fierce competition on the high end. It has nothing to do with the PC market in that particular thing. Do some simple math and you will realize that all iPhones are outsold by S-line (s2,s3,s4 all versions) + Note (1 and 2) + HTC One + Xperia combo. That's on the high end, Apple knows what costumers want and they do nothing.

 

About your next paragraph, yes most people that buy samsung high end offerings are blind sheep, like some Apple users or worse, but they could buy an iPhone and know for experience that a bigger screen is better for using the phone, even if it means lower quality and laggy device. That's how important a bigger screen is.

 

Android has tools and guides. Apple has no excuse for not putting iTunes on Android, they did it on windows and it was a great move. Android is here to stay and dominate market share, it won't go anywhere (new OEMs will appear if others fail) and Google isn't Microsoft. Besides, they are pissing off loyal costumers like me that are forced to go android because Apple doesn't provide a decent option.

 

No profit in it? Nokia does.Sony does. Samsung does. But obviously this isn't about making profit per device, this is about iOS presence. 250 dollars. Don't put words in my mouth, Google gained influence and power with Android, it was a great move for them. And Android is a great OS, obviously not on level with iOS, but that doesn't mean that it isn't great. Use a Nexus device, you will be surprised.

 

I'm a Mechanical Engineering student on the most prestigious (and the best) university of the country and of course I have some hobbys and special interests on the IT area. Yes I keep up, I just decided that it wasn't worth it to post here (or any other tech site) daily. Those things are exaggerated and you know it. Even your average user wouldn't have any of those problems because only geeks sideload apps etc. Android is as secure as any computer, it depends on the user and that's their problem.

 

About everything else, that's why I am waiting for Apple's offering. But my Android phone is as good as dead, it really was a POS, but thanks to Apple, it was the only option I had at the time (early 2010) and Android isn't shit anymore, far from it.

 

P.S: Clearly you don't see the whole picture. When iOS7 is out, Apple will be selling the iPhone 4 (400€) and it will never see an update again. That's why i do not want it. Any 200 dollar jelly bean android device will be updated a lot, expecially if the user is someone like me, and roots it, unlocks the bootloader, flash kernel, flash ROM, install G-apps, bla bla... and Cyanogenmod it is. For the price and quality of OS and devices, totally worth it.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


"Write software for Android? I'd rather piss on it"

There are no people that need it bigger screen. There are, however, people who think they do. In the end it won't be a portable device anymore. People who want a bigger screen (to look at, so don't need voice over cellular) buy an iPad Mini

Seems a fair price for what the product and its included services give you. I paid € 874

 

Yes, and? It doesn't come with iOS. And the experience is all in the software. No iOS = no sale.

Degrade the company to create sub-par products? No, I think people (and Apple) have opened their eyes, and see how truly pathetic the competing products are.

Then maybe you shouldn't invoke it with posts like these.

See? Why so limited? It's not your call and it makes perfect sense for everyone one. Apple would profit from android's sucess, users like me wouldn't be frustrated, etc.

 

Again, limited, if not worse. A bigger screen can make a better phone by itself. Millions need it, your (or my) opinion is irrelevant, the facts are there.

 

Yes, the iPhone 5 is far, unless you want something as your only mobile device and actually need it, then, for millions, it isn't.

 

The Nexus isn't subpar. The Xperia L isn't sub par. 400 € for a 2010 device that will never be updated, is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post

Yes, Apple has its defenders. But in no way are they milking anything. 

 

Apple is designing and manufacturing some of the best products ever made in the iPhone, the iPad and the Macs. They are responsible for production of these products the volume exceeding 100M annually. They are providing the OS, an app store, cloud storage, map services, search services (yes, Siri is part of the search service), email, core apps, a music and video store for these products.

 

How many other companies in the world are doing this much? Would you point to any of them and say they are milking it?

You are totally right, thanks for your post.

 

But clearly you agree with me when I see that there's no excuse for the lack of an offering with a bigger screen. HTC did it right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

And what are the two biggest selling phone models? 4S and 5.  OK?   The S3 and S4 haven't sold as many per unit as the iPhone 4S and iPhone 5.  OK?

 

Apple is one company in a market where there a lot of mfg making hundreds of phones that sell in more countries and more carriers. If Apple turned on EVERY country and every carrier that Android is marketed through, they couldn't build them fast enough to meet demand. They kind of have to ramp the number of carriers and countries as their assembly suppliers and component suppliers can handle an increased in demand.  But at least Apple doesn't force you to buy a new product to get the latest OS.  Remember, 4.3 is the latest OS, and how many phones/tablets actually run it?  I think you can count on one hand. How many can't?  HUNDRED OF MODELS that represent probably 96% of the market of 900 Million devices.  So MOST of the devices can't or don't even run 4.3.  OOOPS.  Heck, just even getting Android devices to run a 6 month old OS is almost as bad as the latest version OS.  FAIL.  MAJOR FAIL.


Imagine that, buying a product that doesn't and probably won't run the latest OS for at least 6 months, IF at all.  SUCKERS!

The world is much bigger than the US. None of these models (4s and 5) are the top models in most countries in Europe, not to mention Asia and Africa. Far from it. I woulddare to say that in most countries besides the US and UK, the iPhone is being hammered by the S-line. But even if it wasn't, that isn't the point.

 

You are right on the rest, but that wasn't the point either. 4.1 to 4.3 is jelly bean. People like me will erase the phone and install Cyanogenmod, so that's a non issue, but even for the others... If your device runs jelly bean, it will be updated when new features are released.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

You have a MacBook AIr? And how many apps that you run on your Android device sync up with your Mac without doing anything?  Which apps are they? Some Google Doc BS?  I don't qualify those as decent apps.  Sorry.  But what else syncs up without doing anything between your Android device and your laptop?  Name em.

Yes I have a Macbook air, 2011 i7. If I use a Google account and have it set up on my mac, mail calendar and contacts sync without trouble, obviously and that's it. But that's Apple's fault, iTunes could and should sync too. And that's the root of the problem.

 

Apple gives no option to most users outside the US that refuse to pay outrageous prices for the carriers. Even if I had unlimeted budget, a 5" iphone would suit my needs better than an iPhone 5 + iPad combo.

 

I pay 7.5€ and have 300mb data, unlimited text and voice calls for all my friends. You start a trip from Portugal to Japan and you will see that most people leave in this reality.

 

If Apple wants more than 5% Market share, they must give these options.

 

Thanks for your posts.

post #40 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

Those monkeys at motorola managed to create a phone with the same dimensions as the iphone 5 but with a 4.5" screen.

That certainly is a valid point: I don't want a larger phone, 'so I can use the same pants'. If the iPhone can get a bigger screen without increasing the dimensions of the device itself that would work for me. Still, I like the smaller dimensions of the previous versions better, but apparently I don't mind the small increase in size of the 5. If they come out with a larger phone and won't have any of the 2 smaller form factors up for sale I'll hang on to my 5, but I don't think that will be the case.
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