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First look: Sony's iPhone-compatible QX10 and QX100 Cyber-shot lenses

post #1 of 79
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Sony held an event in New York on Wednesday to give members of the press their first hands-on with its new iPhone-compatible QX10 and QX100 high-quality camera lenses. AppleInsider was on-hand for a first look at the new accessories.

Sony


The QX10 and QX100 were officially unveiled in a presentation by Phil Molyneux, president and chief operating officer with Sony. Both devices are set to launch later this month, and are available to preorder now through Sony's online store, Amazon and other authorized resellers.

Both are wireless cameras that lack extensive controls or even a dedicated screen or viewfinder. Instead, those duties are relegated to a smartphone that is connected to the device over peer-to-peer Wi-Fi.

Both cameras are compatible with Apple's iPhone when running the latest version of Sony's PlayMemories Mobile application, available for free on the iOS App Store. The cameras will also work with an iPad, if users want an exceptionally large viewfinder.

Both the QX10 and QX100 will ship with an expandable, secure clip that's compatible with a range of smartphones. Using this, the lens can be attached to the back of an iPhone, and together the units will work in tandem as a high-end camera.

Sony


Hands-on



The camera lens clips easily and securely to an iPhone. We tried picking the device up by both the phone and the lens, and did not come away with the impression that either device would be easily dropped.

Sony


Connecting the iPhone to a lens was relatively simple through Sony's app. We did experience a few random disconnects, but this could have been due to the fact that numerous members of the press were on-hand attempting to connect their own smartphones to the devices.

Each QX-series camera is securely connected through a unique password that can be found printed in the accessory's battery compartment. The lenses will also use Sony's standard camera batteries.

Sony


The low-end QX10 will come in both black and white colors. One demo unit provided by Sony paired a white QX10 with a white iPhone, and the two matched each other quite well.

Once the camera is paired, the official Sony application can be used to snap pictures. Pictures can be stored on both a microSD card found within the lens itself, as well as automatically transferred to the iPhone. High- and low-quality transfer options are available to conserve storage on the connected smartphone.

Sony


The peer-to-peer Wi-Fi connection between the iPhone and QX10 allowed for minimal lag between devices when viewing the camera's perspective live. We didn't come away with the impression that the wireless connectivity would cause any issue when snapping pictures.

Things were a bit slower when automatically transferring photos to the iPhone. Given the size of the lenses on the QX10 and QX100, transferring a full-size image over Wi-Fi direct to the iPhone took a few seconds. Users looking to rapid-fire photos may want to turn off the auto-transfer functionality.

Sony


The wireless connectivity of the QX10 and QX100 is also important, because it allows the cameras to be controlled and viewed remotely from a smartphone. Each camera includes a tripod mount on the bottom for remote sturdy placement. However, Sony cautioned that the cameras are not intended to be used a great distance from a Wi-Fi-connected device.

Sony has pitched the QX10 and QX100 as "game changing" accessories that will appeal to consumers who want high-end pictures, but are more comfortable snapping pictures on their smartphone. We tend to agree: The pure pocket-ability of these accessories makes them an appealing option for someone who wants to conveniently snap pictures on the go, but may not have the space to carry a DSLR or even a compact digital camera on them.

Sony


Tech specs



The QX series cameras leverage Sony's existing heft in imaging into attachments that make a smartphone capable of capturing images in the quality range of a higher-end dedicated point-and-shoot device. They both connect wirelessly to a smartphone through Sony's PlayMemories Mobile app, available in the App Store for free. That app allows the smartphone to serve as the viewfinder for the camera, which can be used while attached to the phone or remotely. The smartphone can release the shutter, start and stop movie recordings, and adjust common photographic settings such as shooting mode, zoom, and autofocus area.

cybershot-1-130904.jpg


On iOS, the QX series cameras will pair with devices through Wi-Fi, and images taken will be stored both on the lens camera's internal memory and on the paired device. Android users will have the option of pairing the devices by touch using near-field communications technology.

The QX100 features a 1.0-inch, 20.2MP Exmor RCMOS sensor, the same one featured in Sony's acclaimed Cyber-shot RX100 II. Sony has paired that sensor with a fast, wide-aperture Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T lens with 3.6x optical zoom and a Bionz image processor. It also has its own dedicated control ring for camera adjustment.

cybershot-2-130904.jpg


The Qx10 model packs an 18.2MP Exmor RCMOS sensor and 10x optical zoom Sony G Lens. It also features built-in Optical SteadyShot image stabilization, as well as a number of shooting modes to choose from, including Program, Auto, Intelligent Auto, and Superior Auto.

Both devices will become available later this month from Sony. Customers can also preorder both from Amazon right now, though. The QX100 retails for $498, while the QX10 will sell for $248. Both items will see release on September 27 and should ship from Amazon thereupon or shortly thereafter.

cybershot-3-130904.jpg


Other announcements



In addition to the iPhone-compatible Cyber-shot lenses, Sony also announced a number of other new cameras at Wednesday's event. They include:
  • The Alpha 3000, an easy-to-use, ultra-right camera with a DSLR feel and style. Ideal for consumers who want to get into a DSLR but are intimidated by the size. Priced at $399, available in September.
  • The NEX-5T, an upgrade to the NEX-5R introduced last year. It's a compact mirror-less camera that includes Wi-Fi, but also adds NFC compatibility. This camera includes all of the same functionality as a DSLR, but is more portable. A flip-up LCD on the device can be pointed forward to allow for "selfies." Priced at $799 available in September.
  • The HDR-AS30V is a new action camera that includes integrated GPS. This feature, with enhanced software, allows an overlay to be placed on recorded video with tracked speed and distance. The sports camera also includes NFC and Wi-Fi. Also announced as part of the AS30V is a wrist-worn live remote with a screen that will show live video from the camera. This year's action camera is about 25 percent smaller and lighter than its predecessor. It will be available in October for $299. Remote will be in December for $150.
  • The Music Video Recorder HDR-MV1 is a compact camera with full HD video recording and linear PCM CD-quality audio. It sports a high-performance built-in microphone that can also record from external mics or a sound panel. Built-in Wi-Fi with NFC will allow users to quickly upload video to social media, allowing bands to quickly broadcast their performances on the Internet.
  • Finally, Sony also revealed the FDR-AX1, the world's first prosumer 4K camcorder for under $5,000. It's an all-in-one video camera designed for filmmakers working with modest budgets. This will be able to output video to two new 4K TVs also announced by Sony Wednesday: a 65-inch model for $4,999, and a 55-inch 4K HDTV for $3,499.
post #2 of 79
It looks like a neat option, but my biggest question is whether it will enable the flash capability when taking a picture on your phone. Can you use the flash on your phone when you take a picture with the Sony lens. If not it's limited to daytime use.
post #3 of 79

Hmmm.... champagne and white....

post #4 of 79
Hmm... interesting.

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post #5 of 79
There seems to be confusion (among various reports) whether the WiFi connection to an iPhone is through a WiFi network (base station) or if it's a peer-to-peer connection. One of Sony's own videos seems to imply you need the network (base station). Here's a screen grab of the section of the video I'm talking about:

i-r4BfnP7.jpg


If it was peer-to-peer, you'd think Sony would include that in the text.

Obviously, if it's NOT peer-to-peer, the lens just became FAR less useful for folks with smartphones that lack NFC. I can't imagine Sony would have worked it that way. Still, the wording of that text blurb is curious.

The full video is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQPNNJMnH9I#t=121

Mark
Edited by Mark Booth - 9/4/13 at 10:54am
post #6 of 79
This is the future of point-and-shoot . . .
post #7 of 79

It would be nice to have the option to connect the lens to the lightning port for photo transfer (either while shooting or afterwards).  Also as a way to mitigate WiFi connectivity issues in saturated areas.  But overall, this looks pretty good.

 
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post #8 of 79
Great. A 1" CMOS sensor! F 1.8!! All good in the zoom model, although I wish they would have had a f/2.5, instead of 4.9, at the tele end. Still superb. For $500, you're getting a DSLR, pretty much.

Question: Since the connection of the lens to phone is through P2P, does it mean I can be out in the wild taking photographs without any available Wi-Fi?
post #9 of 79
Seems clunky to me. Get out your lens, turn it on, get out your camera, start it up, find and run the dedicated app, and then you're ready to take a photo of that precious moment in time... that happened two minutes ago.
post #10 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post

Seems clunky to me. Get out your lens, turn it on, get out your camera, start it up, find and run the dedicated app, and then you're ready to take a photo of that precious moment in time... that happened two minutes ago.

 

Because, with an SLR, you always have it out of the case, hanging around your neck, turned on, with the lens cap off, ready to shoot at a moment's notice.  There's an initial setup time for any camera which isn't a point-and-shoot.

 
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post #11 of 79
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Originally Posted by abarry View Post

Great. A 1" CMOS sensor! F 1.8!! All good in the zoom model, although I wish they would have had a f/2.5, instead of 4.9, at the tele end. Still superb. For $500, you're getting a DSLR, pretty much.

 

Hardly! Hanging one of these Lens-Style Cameras on your smartphone makes it a point & shoot, NOT a Digital SLR.  It's not even close to being a Digital SLR.

 

Mark

post #12 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post

Seems clunky to me. Get out your lens, turn it on, get out your camera, start it up, find and run the dedicated app, and then you're ready to take a photo of that precious moment in time... that happened two minutes ago.

 

If you're in a hurry and didn't expect to be taking pictures at all, then you'll just use your iPhone as usual--the lens in your pocket won't prevent that. And if you weren't expecting to be taking pictures, then you left your dedicated camera at home anyway, so that's no better.

 

If you WERE expecting to take pictures, then just as you'd have decided to lug your dedicated camera, you would instead decide to attach this camera to your iPhone. "Getting it out" and "turning it on" are not steps you can avoid with a regular camera either. Finding the app? Put it in your Dock. It's not as though adjusting the settings of a regular camera is an instant thing.

 

A standalone camera has its place, but lacks the photo apps (editing, organizing, sharing) and Internet connectivity of an iPhone. This new line allows a new option to combine the features of both. I welcome it.

 

Lack of peer-to-peer would of course be bizarre and a deal-breaker! My AR.Drone flying camera works out in the wild with no base station (it IS one, essentially) so there's hope. (True peer-to-peer without the cam acting as a base station would be better, so you could still be on local WiFi if available for sending photos. Useful to avoid your data cap... vital with an iPod Touch.)

post #13 of 79

Apparently, the "I want to look as stupid as possible" market is much larger than I thought. This product will be just perfect for the ignoramus using an iPad to shoot several hundred photos while sitting in front of me at my kid's school play.

post #14 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Booth View Post
 

 

Hardly! Hanging one of these Lens-Style Cameras on your smartphone makes it a point & shoot, NOT a Digital SLR.  It's not even close to being a Digital SLR.

 

How is it not?  You don't have to attach it to your phone (you can carry it separately or mount it on a tripod), the $499 model has a real (not optical) zoom, it uses high-quality sensors and lenses.

 

The only thing missing really is a good way to grip it when you want both the phone and lens together.  But I have no doubt accessory makers aren't far behind with a proper handheld mounting bracket.

 
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post #15 of 79
Quote:
Using this, the lens can be attached to the back of an iPhone, and together the units will work in tandem as a high-end camera.

 

high-end? you are not being serious are you? 

 

Quote:
Users looking to rapid-fire photos may want to turn off the auto-transfer functionality.

Hence not even close to high-end

 

As I said before, this will do a lot to change the way we take pictures. Helium balloons (tethered) for large scenic and group shots and weddings. Hopefully no more in the mirror self portraits. This can easily be put onto a boom or a mono pod to gain different angles. It looks like a lot of fun. I just wish this was the quality of Canon glass, but hopefully, Canon will see this and introduce their own. 


Edited by Richard Getz - 9/4/13 at 11:31am
post #16 of 79

Why does the larger lens have only a 3.6x zoom, while the smaller one is 10x?  

post #17 of 79

The high-end version is basically a $750 Cyber-shot RX100 II camera where the iPhone is the screen and all the controls.  Seems like an awkward tweener product.  It's not that much more compact/portable than the real camera and it's not that much cheaper and I give up the dedicated controls.  A $100 product that is smaller (and isn't as high quality, obviously) makes a lot more sense.

post #18 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

Hence not even close to high-end

 

Uh, did you miss the part about it storing the images to a memory card on the lens?  The auto-transfer feature is only to get the pictures to your phone (if you need that).

 

Please, all you pro photographers, enlighten us unwashed masses on how this is not a reasonable DSLR (obviously not for professionals, but for most others)?

 
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post #19 of 79
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Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

The high-end version is basically a $750 Cyber-shot RX100 II camera where the iPhone is the screen and all the controls.  Seems like an awkward tweener product.  It's not that much more compact/portable than the real camera and it's not that much cheaper and I give up the dedicated controls.  A $100 product that is smaller (and isn't as high quality, obviously) makes a lot more sense.

 

I think you are missing the advantages from a photography viewpoint. Read my post two up from yours. 

post #20 of 79
To answer the question regarding peer-to-peer or requiring an existing WIFI network, of course it won't require an existing WIFI network. It'll work anywhere. Peer-to-peer via a wifi connection between the phone and the lens. There's a photo above that includes information that explains the wifi password is unique and is printed in the batter compartment.

As for the flash question... I can't find anything on it. From the pictures it looks like, at least on the iPhone, the flash isn't obstructed. So I don't see why it couldn't be triggered via Sony's app. The question is will the lens obstruct the flash's reach.

Clunky? Obviously you've never traveled with a variety of camera gear. This looks like it might be THE perfect travel photography setup for the average person. Pretty much everyone has a smartphone. Now they can turn it into a powerhouse point and shoot.

This is quite possibly the best move Sony has ever made in the smartphone market. Creating an accessory like this that supports the iPhone and other Android phones and is smartphone agnostic is a brilliant move.

The best camera is the one you have with you, and while the iPhone and current high end Android's have fantastic cameras, they aren't an RX100 and this makes it possible to have an RX100 at the ready. Perfect not just for travel but everyday carry. Anyone that doesn't see the value in this is blind.

Can't wait to take the QX100 for a spin myself. I just returned from a trip to Panama and Costa Rica and would have loved to have had this while traveling.
post #21 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by reydn View Post

This is the future of point-and-shoot . . .

 

Correct, as they won't be available until later this month :P 

post #22 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post

Seems clunky to me. Get out your lens, turn it on, get out your camera, start it up, find and run the dedicated app, and then you're ready to take a photo of that precious moment in time... that happened two minutes ago.

 

Pretty silly conjecture. For those shots, turn on your iPhone, point and shoot. You'll still get a respectable result (aka a hi-res "snapshot"). This device, like any fuller featured SLR, enables a number of options, none of them fitting your sudden "capture the candid unexpected moment" scenario (unless, like any SLR, you are already all set up and ready to go).

 

- Remote viewing and shooting. This is also great for those "group shots" you can't get without help from another pair of hands.

- Higher quality lens, with optical telephoto, etc.

- Companion control and processing app

- "outboard" storage option (meaning, not using the iPhone memory)

 

There's a lot to like.

 

Finally, I haven't watched the video, but somehow, I suspect it might be possible to trigger the "shutter" without having the phone connected... can anyone confirm?

 

Also realized, with this particular device, the words "connected" vs "attached" are going to matter  to avoid confusion… 

post #23 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by auxio View Post
 

 

How is it not?  You don't have to attach it to your phone (you can carry it separately or mount it on a tripod), the $499 model has a real (not optical) zoom, it uses high-quality sensors and lenses.

 

The only thing missing really is a good way to grip it when you want both the phone and lens together.  But I have no doubt accessory makers aren't far behind with a proper handheld mounting bracket.

 

Obviously, you've never used a Digital SLR camera.  At least, not extensively.  There's a BIG difference in the image creation capabilities of a Digital SLR versus a point & shoot.  Not the least of which is tighter control over depth of field thanks to the SIGNIFICANTLY larger image sensors in Digital SLRs.  And recent Digital SLRs can focus and take a photo in a fraction of the time and in a fraction of the light needed for point & shoot cameras.

Granted, the best camera is the one you have with you.  But anyone who thinks there aren't real and significant benefits to shooting with a interchangeable lens Digital SLR is just fooling themselves.

 

Mark

post #24 of 79

Those who said using this looks stupid don't know the potential of this new type of cameras.

This is a brilliant innovation! It's even more portable than an MILC camera while having similar picture quality. More important, you can put it at a lot of different (or even hard-to-reach) places. This is only the beginning; it'll continue to improve and evolve. I'm seeing this finally replace P&S and MILC cameras.


Edited by ALUOp - 9/4/13 at 11:51am
post #25 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

 

high-end? you are not being serious are you? 

 

I think people are using the "high end" reference as RELATIVE to the iPhone's built in camera. The accessory "enhances" it, providing "higher end" results… No, it isn't a Canon 1D or some such, nor is that remotely implied, I think. Understood?

post #26 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical View Post
 

Finally, I haven't watched the video, but somehow, I suspect it might be possible to trigger the "shutter" without having the phone connected... can anyone confirm?

 

Yep, I read (somewhere) that you can snap photos with the QX10 and QX100 without any smartphone connected.

 

Mark

post #27 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical View Post
 

 

I think people are using the "high end" reference as RELATIVE to the iPhone's built in camera. The accessory "enhances" it, providing "higher end" results… No, it isn't a Canon 1D or some such, nor is that remotely implied, I think. Understood?

 

read it again

 

Quote:
Using this, the lens can be attached to the back of an iPhone, and together the units will work in tandem as a high-end camera.

 

understand? 

post #28 of 79
Seriously, one of the dumbest gimmicks ever. If ur serious about photography, thr iphone won't be ur tool of choice & if ur not, the standard iPhone cam will do. This is a bunch of b.s. geared towards the people who have no clue what their needs are and have memorized to much tech shizz than they apply in real life.
post #29 of 79
This is perfect for when my wife leaves her giant Nikon at home and we end up wanting to take some nice pictures. I am a bit surprised that a lense with a 10x optical zoom is half the price of a lense with a 3.6x optical zoom. For us, 90% of the time we take pictures the optical zoom is the most important feature!
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post #30 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwerty02 View Post

Seriously, one of the dumbest gimmicks ever. If ur serious about photography, thr iphone won't be ur tool of choice & if ur not, the standard iPhone cam will do. This is a bunch of b.s. geared towards the people who have no clue what their needs are and have memorized to much tech shizz than they apply in real life.

 

 

You know nothing about photography 

post #31 of 79
Originally Posted by qwerty02 View Post
memorized to much tech shizz than they apply in real life.

 

That sounds like an urbanized job description of… anyone intelligent enough to be a specialist in any field.


Edited by Tallest Skil - 9/4/13 at 12:07pm

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post #32 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

 

I think you are missing the advantages from a photography viewpoint. Read my post two up from yours.

 

I thought about that (the fact that a lens+sensor without out the rest of the camera is slightly more "positionable" than a full camera), but I don't buy it.  A full-fledged camera that can be slaved to a smart phone easily is a cool idea, but I don't see how this product is going to succeed.  It's not that small and it's not at all cheap.

post #33 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arbiter8 View Post

This is perfect for when my wife leaves her giant Nikon at home and we end up wanting to take some nice pictures. I am a bit surprised that a lense with a 10x optical zoom is half the price of a lense with a 3.6x optical zoom. For us, 90% of the time we take pictures the optical zoom is the most important feature!

 

The glass and aperture (f/1.8) are much better on the Carl Zeiss lens which is why you are paying more. Although the specs state the optical zoom is during moving recording. The focal length for the QX100 is 28-100mm which is not bad at all for that size lens. However, the QX10 claims 27.5-275 which is very odd. I must be reading this incorrectly. 

post #34 of 79

Let me clarify my point.  I think the idea is cool, but I think this implementation is lacking.  Being able to have the lens in one place while the controls and view screen are somewhere else (and connected wirelessly) is neat.  Presumably it'll be popular in the DIY porn/sexting market.  But as a stand-alone device, a lens-shaped cylinder isn't the best design.  Sure it clips onto a smart phone, but for off the phone use it's lacking.  And it's big and expensive.  If I were in the market for this, I would rather pay a couple hundred bucks more and get the camera it's based on and have the best of both worlds.  A fully functional camera with proper controls, plus the ability to control it remotely from my phone.  Or even better give me a much smaller version for $100-$200 optimized for off-phone use.

post #35 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

 

The glass and aperture (f/1.8) are much better on the Carl Zeiss lens which is why you are paying more. Although the specs state the optical zoom is during moving recording. The focal length for the QX100 is 28-100mm which is not bad at all for that size lens. However, the QX10 claims 27.5-275 which is very odd. I must be reading this incorrectly.

So wouldn't you consider this "high end" as a camera?  Yes it's not DSLR quality, but it's at the very high end of the "not a DSLR" range.  $750 (retail/Amazon price) for a camera is pretty high end -- except for professionals.

post #36 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

 

I thought about that (the fact that a lens+sensor without out the rest of the camera is slightly more "positionable" than a full camera), but I don't buy it.  A full-fledged camera that can be slaved to a smart phone easily is a cool idea, but I don't see how this product is going to succeed.  It's not that small and it's not at all cheap.

 

Try that in real life and you won't have it. Much more versatile in positioning as I stated above 

post #37 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

So wouldn't you consider this "high end" as a camera?  Yes it's not DSLR quality, but it's at the very high end of the "not a DSLR" range.  $750 (retail/Amazon price) for a camera is pretty high end -- except for professionals.

 

lol then that would be mid-range, not high-end as reserved for professional. A high-end body is >$2,500; high-end glass is  >$1,000. Mid-range is below that and low-end is below that. Why try to change the definition, just call it what it is. 

post #38 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwerty02 View Post

Seriously, one of the dumbest gimmicks ever. If ur serious about photography, thr iphone won't be ur tool of choice & if ur not, the standard iPhone cam will do. This is a bunch of b.s. geared towards the people who have no clue what their needs are and have memorized to much tech shizz than they apply in real life.

 

 

You know nothing about photography 

Agreed.

 

I am waiting with bated breath to try this, and hope the implementation (particularly the *sync*) is as good it seems. But, as I mentioned elsewhere, someone else will perfect this, because it opens new ways of capturing images and video.

 

No mention, I believe, for 3rd party APIs? Imagine if/when that becomes available. Imagine being able to control multiple cameras simultaneously. If that possibility alone doesn't change some of the cynical minds here, not only do you not know photography or video, you lack imagination altogether.

 

If done right, this is a potential game-changer in photography.

post #39 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post
 

Agreed.

 

I am waiting with bated breath to try this, and hope the implementation (particularly the *sync*) is as good it seems. But, as I mentioned elsewhere, someone else will perfect this, because it opens new ways of capturing images and video.

 

No mention, I believe, for 3rd party APIs? Imagine if/when that becomes available. Imagine being able to control multiple cameras simultaneously. If that possibility alone doesn't change some of the cynical minds here, not only do you not know photography or video, you lack imagination altogether.

 

If done right, this is a potential game-changer in photography.

 

 

I just hope Canon does this as well. I can see attaching glass to a helium balloon* and capturing some great shots. And the ability to put this onto a mono-pod for very unique, or hard to get angles will be a big deal. I'm excited, although, wishing it was Canon. 

 

*hopefully the wifi will be strong enough. 


Edited by Richard Getz - 9/4/13 at 12:59pm
post #40 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

I just hope Canon does this as well. 

Now that Sony has fired the first shot, Canon and Nikon will follow. I wonder if Apple has something in the works, too. You'd think POV camera makers like GoPro should be jumping into this, too. 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

 

I can see attaching glass to a helium balloon* and capturing some great shots. And the ability to put this onto a mono-pod for very unique, or hard to get angles will be a big deal. 

 

Excellent examples. Wonder if you can use one smartphone to control multiple QX units (even if not simultaneously). 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

*hopefully the wifi will be strong enough. 

 

This and other implementation issues might make the 1st gen version less than successful. But I'll gladly eat my words if this doesn't turn into a very successful category in the long run.

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