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Apple now requires Apple IDs to schedule Genius Bar appointments online

post #1 of 35
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In a minor policy change regarding how customers schedule Genius Bar appointments via Apple's online support webpage, the company now requires users to sign in with a valid Apple ID.

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When customers looking to make a Genius Bar appointment visit Apple's online reservations system, they are now met with the screen seen above, which notes that an Apple ID is needed to proceed. The new rule was reported by TechCrunch on Wednesday, though it is not clear when the shift in policy first rolled out.

According to the publication, Apple instituted the policy to ensure higher levels of control over support appointments, including payments. In addition, customer information tied to an Apple ID, like outstanding support tickets, can be accessed by the Genius Bar staff before a customer comes in, streamlining the process for both parties.

Apple has been busy revamping its customer support infrastructure over the past months, including a recent price hike to the AppleCare+ for iPhone deductible. While the plan remains priced at $99 and covers two incidents per device, the accidental damage service fee now runs $79, up from a previous cost of $49.
post #2 of 35

And that stops the scalpers. Doesn't stop being stupid enough to scalp appointments in the first place, but it stops the scalpers.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #3 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

And that stops the scalpers. Doesn't stop being stupid enough to scalp appointments in the first place, but it stops the scalpers.

 

There are Genius Bar appointment scalpers? Is that...lucrative?

post #4 of 35
Originally Posted by Arlor View Post

There are Genius Bar appointment scalpers? Is that...lucrative?

 

There were, at least. Those crazy Chinese will do anything.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #5 of 35
While it would cut down on scalping, I think the true purpose is to draw more users into the Apple ecosystem. This benefits Apple in the obvious ways such as being able to sell content and improve loyalty, but also in a more subtle Google-like fashion.

It shows advertisers (via iAd) there are that many more paying eyes/ears to consume their ads. iAd is a very small component of their bottom line today, but they have learned well from Google that it is an extremely lucrative business. Apple can’t compete with Google/Facebook for vast amounts of personal data, but instead can strike at the heart of what advertisers are after in the first place – user’s wallets (Credit Card Numbers).
post #6 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post

While it would cut down on scalping, I think the true purpose is to draw more users into the Apple ecosystem. This benefits Apple in the obvious ways such as being able to sell content and improve loyalty, but also in a more subtle Google-like fashion.

It shows advertisers (via iAd) there are that many more paying eyes/ears to consume their ads. iAd is a very small component of their bottom line today, but they have learned well from Google that it is an extremely lucrative business. Apple can’t compete with Google/Facebook for vast amounts of personal data, but instead can strike at the heart of what advertisers are after in the first place – user’s wallets (Credit Card Numbers).

 

Um, what? This is for genius bar appointments.

post #7 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post
 

 

Um, what? This is for genius bar appointments.

 

They now force users to create an Apple ID to make an appointment, which gives Apple their personal information and credit card data. Your exact reaction is why this is so subtle and clever on the part of Apple.

post #8 of 35
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post

They now force users to create an Apple ID to make an appointment, which gives Apple their personal information and credit card data.

 

Apple ID don't require credit cards.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #9 of 35
Do not really need a credit card for a ID apple account.
post #10 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post

They now force users to create an Apple ID to make an appointment, which gives Apple their personal information and credit card data. Your exact reaction is why this is so subtle and clever on the part of Apple.

An iCloud account = an AppleID = free. An iTunes AppleID can be started with an iTunes gift card.
post #11 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post
 

 

They now force users to create an Apple ID to make an appointment, which gives Apple their personal information and credit card data. Your exact reaction is why this is so subtle and clever on the part of Apple.

 

I see that you're new here (well not exactly new, but new to me, your post count is in single digits). You should stick around and read for a while, because you clearly don't know much about Apple, based on your wild speculations.

 

Apple already has one of the largest credit card data bases on the planet, and people who own devices are already registered with Apple. Most Apple users probably have multiple devices already registered with Apple. What you write makes no sense at all. Hundreds of millions of people trusts Apple with their personal data and credit card data. 

 

Apple requiring Apple ID's to schedule a Genius Bar appointment has nothing to do with Apple trying to gain more personal info from people. If somebody owns a device and they need a Genius Bar appointment, then chances are that they'll already have an Apple ID.


Edited by Apple ][ - 9/11/13 at 9:40pm
post #12 of 35
Yes, there is scalping of Genius Bar appointments, and yes it's profitable. Very profitable.

This puts a stop to it.

The scalping is especially a problem in China (Though I wouldn't be surprised if it happens in other countries too) where there are only a few Apple stores, but millions of customers. Some of these customers have paid well over a thousand or two thousand dollars for a black market iPhone, so paying five bucks for a Genius Bar appointment, that's otherwise impossible to get, is a no brainier.
post #13 of 35
Employees sometimes fill appointments up so they don't have to work as hard at the end of the night. This also prevents this from happening. Before this, fake appointments were made all the time. Although making a fake Apple ID isn't difficult, since you can make a new account with a new email but I guess it will help.
Edited by djd214 - 9/11/13 at 10:54pm
post #14 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post

They now force users to create an Apple ID to make an appointment, which gives Apple their personal information and credit card data. Your exact reaction is why this is so subtle and clever on the part of Apple.

A credit card is not required for creating a valid Apple ID. Don't make things up.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #15 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Apple ID don't require credit cards.

Yeah, they'd rather trust Google with their personal and payment info. Because, you know, it's only evil when Apple does it.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #16 of 35

Wether you create an apple id or not apple are still legally obliged to honour their warranty obligations.

I'd be interested to see the ensuing argument when apple fanboy refuses to use the new scheme and apple refuses to repair his "under warranty" device.

post #17 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post
 

 

I see that you're new here (well not exactly new, but new to me, your post count is in single digits). You should stick around and read for a while, because you clearly don't know much about Apple, based on your wild speculations.

 

Apple already has one of the largest credit card data bases on the planet, and people who own devices are already registered with Apple. Most Apple users probably have multiple devices already registered with Apple. What you write makes no sense at all. Hundreds of millions of people trusts Apple with their personal data and credit card data. 

 

Apple requiring Apple ID's to schedule a Genius Bar appointment has nothing to do with Apple trying to gain more personal info from people. If somebody owns a device and they need a Genius Bar appointment, then chances are that they'll already have an Apple ID.

 

And I see you are new to the world. Only because a company (or a state for that matter) has collected a massive amount of personal information and not used against anyone yet does not guaranty that they are not going to do that exact thing in the future. Apple today does not have to be Apple in 10 years. But the information collected remains in their hands. Apple could pass on sensitive info (think NSA or FBI) and it can just be nicked from Apples servers. That all happened before. Suddenly someone is after you for illegally downloading music or stretching software licenses. You being investigated because someone from your address book deals in drugs or  you start having a hard time renting a place because something flags up, ... So to force users to register for every little thing is not very sympathetic from Apples side.


Edited by glnf - 9/12/13 at 3:31am
post #18 of 35

Question :

What's stopping scalpers from registering multiple Apple ID's , allowing them to buy out Genius Bar appointments ?

post #19 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by helicoil View Post
 

Wether you create an apple id or not apple are still legally obliged to honour their warranty obligations.

I'd be interested to see the ensuing argument when apple fanboy refuses to use the new scheme and apple refuses to repair his "under warranty" device.

Interesting point. Probably Apple will provide another entrypoint.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

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post #20 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikilok View Post
 

Question :

What's stopping scalpers from registering multiple Apple ID's , allowing them to buy out Genius Bar appointments ?

Registration of devices. You don't need a Genius Bar appointment if you don't have a device, so it makes sense to filter out any person who cannot show an ID linked to an existing device.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #21 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by helicoil View Post

Wether you create an apple id or not apple are still legally obliged to honour their warranty obligations.
I'd be interested to see the ensuing argument when apple fanboy refuses to use the new scheme and apple refuses to repair his "under warranty" device.

Can't you still walk in and wait? For hours?
post #22 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by CustomTB View Post


Can't you still walk in and wait? For hours?

Doesn't sound like "guaranteed service" to me. More like "possibly, you might maybe get service if we can find some small amount of time for you".

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #23 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightknight View Post
 

Doesn't sound like "guaranteed service" to me. More like "possibly, you might maybe get service if we can find some small amount of time for you".

 

Too true, "Please fix my iDevice" would soon become "Refund please, ta very much"

post #24 of 35
"Apple now requires Apple IDs [or soon, their finger print'] to schedule Genius Bar appointments online" ... Fixed it. 1smile.gif
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
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From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
Reply
post #25 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by glnf View Post

And I see you are new to the world. Only because a company (or a state for that matter) has collected a massive amount of personal information and not used against anyone yet does not guaranty that they are not going to do that exact thing in the future. Apple today does not have to be Apple in 10 years. But the information collected remains in their hands. Apple could pass on sensitive info (think NSA or FBI) and it can just be nicked from Apples servers. That all happened before. Suddenly someone is after you for illegally downloading music or stretching software licenses. You being investigated because someone from your address book deals in drugs or  you start having a hard time renting a place because something flags up, ... So to force users to register for every little thing is not very sympathetic from Apples side.

I wonder exactly how much personal information Apple really keep? I honestly don't know but maybe someone here does. Given they, unlike Google et al, have no financial interest in selling the sort of data you worry about, why would they retain it in the first place? Of course they have proof of who you are tied to credit card information, that is part of living in the 21st Century, but beyond that what would they need?
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
Reply
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
Reply
post #26 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I wonder exactly how much personal information Apple really keep? I honestly don't know but maybe someone here does. Given they, unlike Google et al, have no financial interest in selling the sort of data you worry about, why would they retain it in the first place? Of course they have proof of who you are tied to credit card information, that is part of living in the 21st Century, but beyond that what would they need?

Google has as much financial interest in selling personal data as Apple does. 1wink.gif . . . and both collect personal data and use "anonymized" versions of it for targeted ads on behest of the companies they place advertisements for. Besides the ability to see/modify/delete the types of information stored, which only one of the two currently offers, the only real difference that I know of is scale. Apple's currently putting in much more effort on the advertising side than they previously have. They look serious now, and to be effective for the companies they represent they need as much personal data (ie income. interests, work/home location, type of employment, family demographics, etc) as they can collect, anonymized of course except for the finance part.
Edited by Gatorguy - 9/12/13 at 6:47am
melior diabolus quem scies
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melior diabolus quem scies
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post #27 of 35
I applaud Apple's requirement for Apple ID's for Genius Bar appointments.

In China, certain scammers have monopolized Genius Bar appointments by making multiple appointments to fill up the schedule. Then no one else can schedule an appointment. They then SELL their Genius Bar appointments to those who want one.

This new requirement will stop this scam.
post #28 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvalus View Post

While it would cut down on scalping, I think the true purpose is to draw more users into the Apple ecosystem. This benefits Apple in the obvious ways such as being able to sell content and improve loyalty, but also in a more subtle Google-like fashion.

It is highly unlikely that this information would ever go near anything advertising related. Too much risk of law suits for privacy violations.

If anything I think its a step in the direction of getting rid of some of the minutia steps before folks come in like checking if they have an iCloud account, is backups turned on, if not instructing them how to back up before coming in. Also getting details about what is going on, advising them of warranty status etc.

Even just things like making sure the appointment is set for the right type of tech, showing them options at more than one store if they have several in the area. Warning them about being late etc also.

Just like there is that training portal for folks that buy into that program, perhaps customers need a Genius portal where they can and are strongly encouraged to register their products and can find instructional help, trouble shooting for various issues and if needed outside help. This could be a step in that way.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #29 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by djd214 View Post

Employees sometimes fill appointments up so they don't have to work as hard at the end of the night. This also prevents this from happening. Before this, fake appointments were made all the time. Although making a fake Apple ID isn't difficult, since you can make a new account with a new email but I guess it will help.

In store employees have other systems to book appointments that might not require an Apple ID. So this scheme you are talking about might still be possible.

That said, it is likely that managers etc are able to see where and how appointments are booked, perhaps even to knowing if it was an in store or out of store computer. And how many appointments don't show. They would adjust scheduling accordingly because why have five folks working when the traffic only needs three. So such games could backfire. Especially when they see a pattern and sort out the scam and possible fire folks for it.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #30 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google has as much financial interest in selling personal data as Apple does. 1wink.gif . . . and both collect personal data and use "anonymized" versions of it for targeted ads on behest of the companies they place advertisements for. Besides the ability to see/modify/delete the types of information stored, which only one of the two currently offers, the only real difference that I know of is scale. Apple's currently putting in much more effort on the advertising side than they previously have. They look serious now, and to be effective for the companies they represent they need as much personal data (ie income. interests, work/home location, type of employment, family demographics, etc) as they can collect, anonymized of course except for the finance part.




Obvious ! so why post ?(also applies to this post lol) Googles WHOLE company is about posting ads which are assured from the personal data that they anonymized because it is worth more than Singular data...

if Apple had to survive on AD Revenue Like Google does, Apple would no longer exist....

so Gatorguy did you post this on your coffee break at Google, because they stopped the 20% time perk???... (Sorry for the ad hominem attack but I couldn't resist)
post #31 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

In store employees have other systems to book appointments that might not require an Apple ID. So this scheme you are talking about might still be possible.

That said, it is likely that managers etc are able to see where and how appointments are booked, perhaps even to knowing if it was an in store or out of store computer. And how many appointments don't show. They would adjust scheduling accordingly because why have five folks working when the traffic only needs three. So such games could backfire. Especially when they see a pattern and sort out the scam and possible fire folks for it.

I am speaking from experience. Managers are clueless about the family room and don't look at appointments that closely. The employee system show if it is booked by an employee that is why they would go online and book for the site with a fake name and email. How can you monitor that?
post #32 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google has as much financial interest in selling personal data as Apple does. 1wink.gif . . . and both collect personal data and use "anonymized" versions of it for targeted ads on behest of the companies they place advertisements for. Besides the ability to see/modify/delete the types of information stored, which only one of the two currently offers, the only real difference that I know of is scale. Apple's currently putting in much more effort on the advertising side than they previously have. They look serious now, and to be effective for the companies they represent they need as much personal data (ie income. interests, work/home location, type of employment, family demographics, etc) as they can collect, anonymized of course except for the finance part.

Right on cue. You know we mean selling access to every bit of data about you.
post #33 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I wonder exactly how much personal information Apple really keep? I honestly don't know but maybe someone here does.
No one bothered with an answer so perhaps they don't know. This is what Apple specifically says they collect and store. Some of it is sharable outside of Apple itself, some is not and some is only sharable if anonymized or under a legal order to do so according to their privacy policy.

-Your Apple ID user name, real name, mailing address, email address, phone number, contact preferences, and credit card info.
-Information on others you know from your use of the "share" button and gift certificates, and again generally basic things like name, address, phone number etc.
-Your device's unique ID number
-What language you speak and the area you live in.
-What you do for a living
-Your contacts
-Siri usage (disassociated from your user ID after 6 months)
-Where you use your Apple device
-Read/write and purchase activity on iCloud, iTunes and Apple websites
-Other misc website visit information collected via cookies and beacons

Probably other stuff but this is only from Apple's mention in their privacy policy.
Edited by Gatorguy - 9/13/13 at 8:14am
melior diabolus quem scies
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post #34 of 35

Blame and deflect, blame and deflect.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #35 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

No one bothered with an answer so perhaps they don't know. This is what Apple specifically says they collect and store. Some of it is sharable outside of Apple itself, some is not and some is only sharable if anonymized or under a legal order to do so according to their privacy policy.

-Your Apple ID user name, real name, mailing address, email address, phone number, contact preferences, and credit card info.

Which only comes up if you use that Id to buy anything.

So if you are that paranoid make up an id just for booking appointments and never use it for anything else.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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