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Citing iPhone 5s yields & iPhone 5c pricing, Jefferies lowers Apple target to $425 - Page 2

post #41 of 139
Check channel ? If they are that smart to check , tell me what Apple will wow us this fall .
post #42 of 139
Apple is most likely taking pre-orders on 5c so that they can get a better grip on distribution. If it's available in 10 countries, some countries might prefer some colors over others. It would be a mess if they evenly distributed each of the colors to 10 countries. Pre-orders allows Apple to sell everything they have in the right places.
That's my uneducated guess.
post #43 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Mecca View Post

Apple is most likely taking pre-orders on 5c so that they can get a better grip on distribution. If it's available in 10 countries, some countries might prefer some colors over others. It would be a mess if they evenly distributed each of the colors to 10 countries. Pre-orders allows Apple to sell everything they have in the right places.
That's my uneducated guess.

Sounds reasonable.
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post #44 of 139
If Apple releases cheaper one , these motherfuckers will say it will harm Apple gross margin .

Bullshit
post #45 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


My sister just got an email on the new iPhones and forwarded to to me asking why Apple chooses such ugly colors. I hate to say it but it could be a swing and a miss color wise.

 

One would assume Apple has a pretty good idea what colors sell after years of experimentation with iPods.  Or maybe Jony Ive just likes those colors.  Either way, most will be hidden inside a 3rd-party case.

post #46 of 139

I hope this isn't a mistake. I went to sprint.com to see about pre-orders for the 5s and noticed that the price for the 16GB was only $99 and the 32GB only $199 and the 64GB was $299. That is a $100 discount. I may be tempted to now get the 64GB version instead of the 32GB for that price. 

post #47 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Interdyne View Post

Second, this explains why no pre-ordering of iPhone 5S.  They don't have enough to fulfill pre-order demand. 

Or maybe they expect the supply to be good enough that everyone who wants one will get one.

You really don't have any idea what it means - if anything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colibri View Post

These analysts want an 'innovative' $400 phone - as good as a top-of-the-line iPhone but low-priced. And by the way, keep those margins up at the same time!

Agreed. The expectations are totally unrealistic. They want the best phone in the world for a very low price but they don't want margins to suffer or for there to be any cannibalization of the high end phone. Just not going to happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colibri View Post

Seriously, the difference is $150 between their price and the actual no-contract 5c price (which helps Apple to meet margin expectations). You still have to get service somewhere, and that's where the real cost resides. If I am still willing to pay $100 a month for enough minutes, data, and messages to satisfy my needs, do they think that I am sweating it over the $150? If my monthly service costs were $20, then the $150 would make a difference.

There are lot of ways to pay for a smartphone these days and lot of carriers. But anybody who doesn't have $549 probably doesn't have $400 plus the service cost to use a smartphone. In the end, a smartphone is still a luxury and not a necessity.

To be fair, things are different in other parts of the world. In much of the world, phones are typically not subsidized, so the real prices are $549 vs $649 (for the 5S). And, yes, there are a lot of people who could afford $400, but not $550 - they may have to save up for an entire year or more just to get the $400.

That doesn't mean that Apple should go after that market, but denying the existence of people who really can't afford more doesn't help, either.
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Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #48 of 139
Hmm...earlier this morning the 16GB yellow was listed with a 9/25 ship date on the US site. Now it's back to 9/20.
post #49 of 139

F..k Jefferies! I love the 5S, its going to be a hit and I'm getting one!

post #50 of 139

1. When was the last time Apple released a new product/upgrade that didn't have "inventory problems" at the outset? They sell by the millions over a couple of days. Huge initial demand, which they mitigate over a brief period, usually a couple of weeks. They aren't going to increase capacity to the point that they can satisfy 100% of release period demand on the day. That capacity would then sit fallow the rest of the time. It's a balancing act, for sure, but one they manage very very well.

 

2. Apple just added DoCoMo. Just got their license approved for China Mobile. They're going to add 10s of millions of sales to those two carriers alone, almost "regardless of price". Don't forget the prices local Chinese scalpers were getting… consider the added millions of handsets needed to feed that pent up demand, and Apple is going to have "supply issues" no matter what they do.

 

This imaginary "yield problem" isn't going to suppress Apple's sell through. They're going to break sales records yet again. THe stock is near $470. This nincompoop thinks it's going to drop to $425?

 

Right. In your dreams. That said, I'll be buying AAPL all the way down. You bet!

post #51 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Or maybe they expect the supply to be good enough that everyone who wants one will get one.

You really don't have any idea what it means - if anything.
Agreed. The expectations are totally unrealistic. They want the best phone in the world for a very low price but they don't want margins to suffer or for there to be any cannibalization of the high end phone. Just not going to happen.
To be fair, things are different in other parts of the world. In much of the world, phones are typically not subsidized, so the real prices are $549 vs $649 (for the 5S). And, yes, there are a lot of people who could afford $400, but not $550 - they may have to save up for an entire year or more just to get the $400.

That doesn't mean that Apple should go after that market, but denying the existence of people who really can't afford more doesn't help, either.

 

That's my point.  Some many people everywhere cannot afford a $400 phone much less a $549 phone.  So Apple is not even inhabiting their world.  If you need a year to save up $400, the next model and price point are already here.  And on top of that, you still have to come up with the money to pay for service that takes advantage of that $400 phone.  More likely, you have money for one or the other, so you are going to be a customer for a free phone and pay for the service alone.

post #52 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by WonkoTheSane View Post

And so the analyst spoke: thou shall be punished for being innovative!

Actually what they are saying is: thou shall be punished for being too fucking greedy!

post #53 of 139
Originally Posted by NelsonX View Post
Actually what they are saying is: thou shall be punished for being too fucking greedy!

 

Wall Street. Punishing a company for the same profits they've been receiving for the past four years. On a product that is known to sell well.

 

… No.

post #54 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

That would explain why Apple is taking pre-orders for the 5c but not the 5s.

Unless someone has another theory?

Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

Unless they want to ensure retail inventory on introduction day.
Apple made a smart long term move with the 5c: because of its simpler construction, it will be much easier to produce and keep up with demand. And, next year it will be entry level iPhone, the following year, they will update the innards...it will be a design they keep in the entry level iPhone position.

These people are likely the ones that fed the low-price iPhone rumor, so that, when it didn't happen they could drive the price down, buy more, then watch it go back into a steady upswing on the long term.
post #55 of 139
Unlocked yellow iPhone 5c are sold out
post #56 of 139
Curios timing to report this. It just happens to be that he found out about this on the day of the release of the new iphone ?.. Lol
post #57 of 139

Oh go **** yourself, Jefferies. 

 

And AppleInsider, you're not much better, for constantly posting this drivel, validating these people, and giving them attention and publicity, helping them to do what they want to do. Do we really need to know everything a useless analyst changes their price targets? Whats the point? This shit is all irrelevant. If Apple followed the strategies that these kinds of people wanted, it would have become nothing more than a carcass a long time ago. Amazing how these parasites consistently snub their noses at the most valuable company on the planet, making more money than almost all major tech companies combines, as if they know a better way.

post #58 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

That would explain why Apple is taking pre-orders for the 5c but not the 5s.

Unless someone has another theory?

There is more pent up demand for the 5C. It is a lower cost 5, but is a new model that ditches the "last year model" stigma they had at that price point every year when the pushed last years model.
post #59 of 139
If they price the 5c like they previously priced the outgoing model, but the cost to manufacture it is lower than the outgoing model, then Apple retains a higher profit margin. Isn't that a good thing? Also, they are offering the 4s, for free here with a 2 yr contract. In China, I suspect a 4s with iOS 7 at a sub $400 price is going to be very appealing. And profitable for Apple. What am I missing?
post #60 of 139

And then we have Carl Icahn, not known for being an idiot, putting a lot of his money on the other side of the analysts mouths.  Now, who do you think knows more?

post #61 of 139
So what will Apple stock do on Monday when they announce "We sold x million iPhones on launch weekend" like they always do?

If they sell 3 million it will drop because it's not enough. If they sell 5 million it will drop because they ran out of stock and have production problems. If they sell 7 million the stock will drop as these represent all the people due for an upgrade and sales will plummet next quarter.

Did I miss any?
post #62 of 139

If you're not an early adopter and you want an iPhone, why wouldn't you get the 5C? This will be HUGE in subsidized countries. There's still room for growth in the U.S... a lot of people are still buying cheap smartphones. The 5C will be MAX of $99 on contract, $0 down at T-Mobile, and will be discounted heavily for various promotions. 

 

Apple will also be able to mass produce these better. 

post #63 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by benji888 View Post



Apple made a smart long term move with the 5c: because of its simpler construction, it will be much easier to produce and keep up with demand. And, next year it will be entry level iPhone, the following year, they will update the innards...it will be a design they keep in the entry level iPhone position.

These people are likely the ones that fed the low-price iPhone rumor, so that, when it didn't happen they could drive the price down, buy more, then watch it go back into a steady upswing on the long term.

 

We were discussing the 5S.

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post #64 of 139
This analyst is beyond ridiculous. The 4s is the emerging market champ now. A great phone that runs the new iOS sold at a very appealing price without contract. Duh.

There is the news dummy. Apple drops price radically on popular 4s.

It's in supply and on sale now

Oh and apple does a sexy upgrade to the 5.

Kaching. Buy AAPL. I am buying more.

I'm with Carl is my new tee shirt slogan.
post #65 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

So what will Apple stock do on Monday when they announce "We sold x million iPhones on launch weekend" like they always do?

If they sell 3 million it will drop because it's not enough. If they sell 5 million it will drop because they ran out of stock and have production problems. If they sell 7 million the stock will drop as these represent all the people due for an upgrade and sales will plummet next quarter.

Did I miss any?

 

So... you are saying the run to $700 was just an anomaly that will never happen again?

 

[no wonder the stock is dropping]

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post #66 of 139
Which analyst left the sky lying on the ground?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #67 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluestone View Post
 

And then we have Carl Icahn, not known for being an idiot, putting a lot of his money on the other side of the analysts mouths.  Now, who do you think knows more?

 

Hard to say... they are all just placing bets. Otherwise we wouldn't have lotteries.

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post #68 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleSauce007 View Post

Unlocked yellow iPhone 5c are sold out

Easy explanation: Steeler Nation buying all of the Yellow 5c's with the black print.
post #69 of 139

Can we have a showdown between Carl Icahn and Peter Misek on CNBC?

post #70 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSteelers View Post


Easy explanation: Steeler Nation buying all of the Yellow 5c's with the black print.

Sweet! They can save money on cases by wrapping them in their Terrible Towels.

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post #71 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotttrader View Post

Yellow sold out preorder. Wonder what the production numbers were.

 

Were are you getting this?  You can still preorder for 9/20 shipment on Apple's US site for all colors?

 

Is this an country's site?

post #72 of 139
So are people here saying the 5S will have no production issues? And the nasty lying analyst made it up? It seems that he is probably correct given the lack of per-orders.

When will sanity return to AI? Again management haven't delivered. Again the fault lies with the messenger.
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post #73 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotttrader View Post

Yellow sold out preorder. Wonder what the production numbers were.

 

It at least means that Mr Misek's remarks regarding 5c pricing are all the more puzzling... 

post #74 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by 512ke View Post

This analyst is beyond ridiculous. The 4s is the emerging market champ now. A great phone that runs the new iOS sold at a very appealing price without contract. Duh.

There is the news dummy. Apple drops price radically on popular 4s.

It's in supply and on sale now

Oh and apple does a sexy upgrade to the 5.

Kaching. Buy AAPL. I am buying more.

I'm with Carl is my new tee shirt slogan.

The 4S is an old phone. It will be supported for one iOS upgrade. 7. It's not got the lure of the new.

Now if they sold the 5C at that price - we would be cooking.
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post #75 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by basjhj View Post

It at least means that Mr Misek's remarks regarding 5c pricing are all the more puzzling... 

No it doesn't. Apple would have produced more if they could and could sell them cheaper. I bet that was the plan but again management messed up.
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post #76 of 139
Apple's innovating fast enough, it's just the mfg plants can't produce their innovations fast enough. That's what happens when you innovate.

intel can't innovate fast enough to get their XEON and Thunderbolt 2 chipsets out fast enough for Apple's other innovations. So, who's at fault? Intel? They can't innovate and mfg fast enough.

Or how about TSMC's mfg, can they spit out enough A7 chips fast enough to keep up with Apple's innovation?

God, I am so sick of the word innovation. It's now the most overused word in the industry and it's catching on in other industries.

What about the saying "thinking outside the box"? That was overused and now it's coming back around becoming overused.

How come the media doesn't rip apart the OEM Android IDIOTS that can't keep up with OS updates? NOT ONE SINGLE OEM ANDROID PRODUCT SHIPS WITH 4.3, which is the latest version. What's wrong with these idiots? Can't they INNOVATE?

What's wrong with Android, can't they come out with 64 bit chips in their smartphones? Can't they innovate fast enough?
post #77 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

My sister just got an email on the new iPhones and forwarded to to me asking why Apple chooses such ugly colors. I hate to say it but it could be a swing and a miss color wise.

Curious what you conclude there. Why so apocalyptic?

Is your sister Chinese, Japanese? A bubbly 20-year-old American pot smoker? I hate to say it, but her opinion may not be relevant.
post #78 of 139

Jeez. Making billions of dollars isn't impressive to this guy.

 

How much is the check he's getting from Samsung?

post #79 of 139
This is why I'm no longer in the market. These manipulators (so-called analysts) make it just another form of gambling. If everyone would just ignore these chuckleheads we'd all be better off. I've found that your average "Joe" on the street is a better financial analyst than these guys. Remember, these are at same people that brought us the dot.com bubble. You know, they thought that "clicks" equalled "dollars". What a joke.
post #80 of 139

I'm guessing the production reports are total crap. These devices have been in production for some time given the amount of part leaks we were seeing. Also, there are two manufacturers now with Foxconn doing the 5S and 4S, while Pegatron is doing the 5C. I am excited about the new devices and Apple's potential. Now to figure out who here is visiting the US or who in the us is visiting here first so that they can bring me an Unlocked 5S.

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