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iPhone 5s no longer available for in-store pickup at Apple retail stores

post #1 of 46
Thread Starter 
Likely indicating still steady demand for the iPhone 5s, Apple has removed pick-up-in-store availability for its high-end smartphone after just one day.



On Monday, both the iPhone 5s and the iPhone 5c became available for customers to order online and pick up at their local Apple Store, sometimes in as little as one hour. Now, though, a check of Apple's online store reveals that the iPhone 5s is unavailable for in-store pickup in any color or configuration.

The iPhone 5c, however, is still available for pickup in an Apple Store. Some reports have noted that the faster selling pace for the higher-end iPhone may be due largely to the rush of early adopters eager to have Apple's latest and greatest smartphone model.

Demand for the iPhone 5s has been particularly high, with initial supply exhausted in less than two days. Soon after the device launched, units ordered online went from shipping in days to shipping at an unspecified time in October.

Apple released figures on Monday revealing that it had sold nine million total iPhone 5s and 5c units in the devices' first three days of availability. The Cupertino company could likely have sold more of its high-end device had there been greater supply available, but Apple's 5s inventory is believed by many to have been lower than usual due to poor production yields of the built-in Touch ID biometric sensor.
post #2 of 46
5C i selling like hell as well. Who thinks opposite, has no clue about Apple and its customers...
post #3 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple released figures on Monday revealing that it had sold nine million total iPhone 5s and 5c units in the devices' first three days of availability. The Cupertino company could likely have sold more of its high-end device had there been greater supply available, but Apple's 5s inventory is believed by many to have been lower than usual due to poor production yields of the built-in Touch ID biometric sensor.

I wish people would stop repeating stupid rumors as if they were true.

If supply were lower than normal, how did they sell record numbers of iPhones?

Dropping of 5S in-store pickup seems odd. Maybe they expect supply to catch up with demand fairly quickly which would make the in-store pickup policy superfluous.

OTOH, the analysts will say that the demand is so poor that they don't need to offer pickup any more. /s
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post #4 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi View Post

5C i selling like hell as well. Who thinks opposite, has no clue about Apple and its customers...

 

I think the 5c best time will be later in the cycle, when both phones becomes outdated, customer buying 6 months or less from the next upgrade are more cost sensitive and less after the lastest tech.

post #5 of 46

Yeah, channel stuffing. /s

 

Another foolish analyst -- Munster -- bites the dust.

post #6 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


I wish people would stop repeating stupid rumors as if they were true.
If supply were lower than normal, how did they sell record numbers of iPhones?

 

 

The arguments of some analysts (and it makes senses to some extend BTW) is that a chunk of the 9 millions phones are 5c's that went into the channel (merchants other than Apple, like Best Buy for example). Those phones may not be "sold" units yet. Like it or not, some of Apple "sold" numbers are actually "ship" numbers and not sold numbers. Phones "ship" into the channel are count as "sold" by Apple.  Phones sold on Apple online site and in Apple stores are real "sold" phones.

 

Normally this would not matter if Apple would have sold the iphone 5 at a discount.  But because the 5c is a new phone, channel shipments are higher than usual. In the case of the 5s, since its sold out, its fair to say those units in the channel are "sold" units because, well, they are sold out.

 

So some of the 9 millions "sold" phones are "ship" iphones 5c. But its almost impossible to know how many.


Edited by herbapou - 9/24/13 at 8:20am
post #7 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
 

Yeah, channel stuffing. /s

 

Another foolish analyst -- Munster -- bites the dust.

 

Munster is right, like it or not. Read my post above

 

edit:  Note: He is right that "some" units in the channel are unsold 5c's, but I NOT saying is numbers are accurate. He mention 2 to 3 millions units are unsold 5c's, imo its much lower than that. Also remember Apple doesnt count its Apple store channel like sold units. They only reports real sales done at Apple stores.


Edited by herbapou - 9/24/13 at 10:55am
post #8 of 46

Heh... my 64gb 5s will be here Thursday but for kicks I looked last night to see the availability...

 

According to the online Apple store there was multiple configurations of the space gray unit in various stores... ONE silver unit in Lynnwood... and no gold units anywhere around the entire Seattle metro area.

 

I feel fortunate I ordered a silver... I will have a unique iPhone!  LOL

post #9 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

The arguments of some analysts (and it makes senses to some extend BTW) is that a chunk of the 9 millions phones are 5c's that went into the channel (merchants other than Apple, like Best Buy for example). Those phones may not be "sold" units yet. Like it or not, some of Apple "sold" numbers are actually "ship" numbers and not sold numbers. Phones "ship" into the channel are count as "sold" by Apple.  Phones sold on Apple online site and in Apple stores are real "sold" phones.

Normally this would not matter if Apple would have sold the iphone 5 at a discount.  But because the 5c is a new phone, channel shipments are higher than usual. In the case of the 5s, since its sold out, its fair to say those units in the channel are "sold" units because, well, they are sold out.

So some of the 9 millions "sold" phones are "ship" iphones 5c. But its almost impossible to know how many.

And yet supplies in carrier stores for both 5s and 5c were "grotesquely low" just earlier this week... and now they're stuffed? I'm betting most of the 5c inventory is in apple retail stores, which wouldn't figure into sell in anyway.
post #10 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

The arguments of some analysts (and it makes senses to some extend BTW) is that a chunk of the 9 millions phones are 5c's that went into the channel (merchants other than Apple, like Best Buy for example). Those phones may not be "sold" units yet. Like it or not, some of Apple "sold" numbers are actually "ship" numbers and not sold numbers. Phones "ship" into the channel are count as "sold" by Apple.  Phones sold on Apple online site and in Apple stores are real "sold" phones.

Normally this would not matter if Apple would have sold the iphone 5 at a discount.  But because the 5c is a new phone, channel shipments are higher than usual. In the case of the 5s, since its sold out, its fair to say those units in the channel are "sold" units because, well, they are sold out.

So some of the 9 millions "sold" phones are "ship" iphones 5c. But its almost impossible to know how many.


Several problems with your 'analysis':

1. All reports are that 75-80% of the sales were the 5S, so even if ALL of the 5C units went into the channel, it was still a record setting figure.

2. Most reports are that even the 5C is sold out - so there's little channel inventory left.

3. Apple doesn't count 'shipment' numbers. They count sales. Maybe you have them confused with Android.

4. If you are correct and there is channel inventory, what about their failure to replenish iPhone 5 inventory for weeks or months? The iPhone 5 inventory is down even if the 5C inventory is up, so EVEN IF your hypothesis is correct, it's meaningless.

In the end, it was an incredible, record breaking performance no matter how much silly fools want to pretend otherwise.
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post #11 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by th3burninator View Post


And yet supplies in carrier stores for both 5s and 5c were "grotesquely low" just earlier this week... and now they're stuffed? I'm betting most of the 5c inventory is in apple retail stores, which wouldn't figure into sell in anyway.

 

To the best of my knowledge, it would.

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post #12 of 46
Munster is very dependable. He's dependably wrong.

This is the guy who said AAPL was going to 1000 last year.
post #13 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by th3burninator View Post


And yet supplies in carrier stores for both 5s and 5c were "grotesquely low" just earlier this week... and now they're stuffed? I'm betting most of the 5c inventory is in apple retail stores, which wouldn't figure into sell in anyway.

 

You can bet what you want, but retailers still have stock's of 5c. Like I said, its hard to tell how many are shipped 5c's. When Analyst's says they did a "channel check", what they are trying to do it estimates how many units in the channel are sold or ship units.

post #14 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Several problems with your 'analysis':

1. All reports are that 75-80% of the sales were the 5S, so even if ALL of the 5C units went into the channel, it was still a record setting figure.

2. Most reports are that even the 5C is sold out - so there's little channel inventory left.

3. Apple doesn't count 'shipment' numbers. They count sales. Maybe you have them confused with Android.

4. If you are correct and there is channel inventory, what about their failure to replenish iPhone 5 inventory for weeks or months? The iPhone 5 inventory is down even if the 5C inventory is up, so EVEN IF your hypothesis is correct, it's meaningless.

In the end, it was an incredible, record breaking performance no matter how much silly fools want to pretend otherwise.

 

a. If the 75-80% figure is true then I think everyone would have to agree that's a shit load of 5s phones sold. [Cook has to be commended for that]

 
b. If the 75-80% figure is true and Apple has stuffed the channel to some degree then that would be a sad tale for the 5c at the moment.
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post #15 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Several problems with your 'analysis':

3. Apple doesn't count 'shipment' numbers. They count sales. Maybe you have them confused with Android.
 

 

This is completly false, units in the channel are count as "sold" by Apple, regarless of them being sold or not.. This is how it works, but believe what you want.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by jragosta View Post
4. If you are correct and there is channel inventory, what about their failure to replenish iPhone 5 inventory for weeks or months? The iPhone 5 inventory is down even if the 5C inventory is up, so EVEN IF your hypothesis is correct, it's meaningless.
 

 

We can bet that Apple tryied to reduce channel inventory of the iphone 5 in the prior months. So this will results in less "sales" indeed. But when launching a new phone, Apple will have to restock the channel inventory if units are available.

 

That being said, if you go various resellers and check the 5c availabilty, you are more of less doing a channel check to estimate sales... if the 5c is sold out too, you can assume most of the 5c in the channels are sold units.

 

Other examples:

Apply playing with its channel inventory prior to launches is nothing new. For example, at last earnings, Apple ipads sales were apparently lower because they started to reduce inventory ahead of the new ipads. It was even mention by Apple on the conference call... in that case, it was good for the sale numbers, because Apple "sold" x numbers of units taking into account it started to reduce channel inventory of ipads, meaning that if channel inventory would have stay the same, the numbers of "sold" ipads would have been higher.


Edited by herbapou - 9/24/13 at 8:49am
post #16 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoonerYoda View Post

I'd want a gold one, but I'm not a proud large wig-wearing black woman.

 

Judging by how quickly the gold ones sold out, their appeal is probably not restricted to one contrived stereotype (even though we don't know how many were available relative to the silver and grey models).

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post #17 of 46
I had a silver 32 5s ordered for "October" delivery. Stopped by my retail Apple at 2:30 yesterday and they had received a shipment 10 minutes before. Cancelled my online order, picked up the new phone, traded in my old phone and it took 37 minutes on the parking meter! Timing is everything. They said they never know when they will get shipments.
post #18 of 46
D!ck head misk is at it again. I just wish he gets fired

"Shares of Apple (AAPL) are up $1.61 at $492.25, after Jefferies & Co.‘s Peter Misek issued a skeptical view of the company’s reported 9 million in first-weekend sales of the iPhone 5S and 5C. Based on reviews of the supply chain, Misek estimates the company sold 4 million of the 5S and 2.5 million of the 5C, with the rest being sold into the channel, meaning non-Apple stores. Misek opines “While 6.5 million sell-through is still solid, it is not a huge amount of upside.” He reiterates a Hold rating on Apple shares and a $425 price target."
post #19 of 46

Guess there are many such women in China you obvious racist!

post #20 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post
 

Munster is right, like it or not. Read my post above

Nonsense. He's purely speculating, and has zero clue. Like you do.

post #21 of 46
Maskwendeng!
post #22 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post
 

Apply playing with its channel inventory prior to launches ... 

 

You're using the wrong word here and it gives away your bias.  Apple doesn't play with its channel inventory, it manages it.  If Apple allowed the stock of the 5 to be high just when the 5c was launched, they would be conducting their business poorly.  Likewise, if they didn't ship enough 5c's to keep retailer's shelves as full as possible, they wouldn't be doing their job.  Apple is doing its job like a responsible corporation should.  Armchair and professional analysts like you and Munster are seeing manipulative spin where it doesn't exist.  

 

Munster owes the community an apology, a mea culpa, but I don't see it coming.  He grossly missed the big picture on the 9 million weekend units.  We don't care about nit-picky details about channel management.  We care about why and how he (and others) got it so very wrong.  Why should we give him any credibility at all when he doesn't take ownership of his mistake and try to explain to us why it happened and why it won't happen again in the future?  Distribution channel discussions are a distraction from the real story.

post #23 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi View Post

5C i selling like hell as well. Who thinks opposite, has no clue about Apple and its customers...

 

Who does have real clues about Apple and its customers? Many pretend to know, but no one does. To wit: this whole shipped v. sold argument. Repeated n times every month, and everyone is purely guessing (sooooo passionately too) every time of out of n.


Edited by StruckPaper - 9/24/13 at 9:33am
post #24 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacMan View Post

D!ck head misk is at it again. I just wish he gets fired

"Shares of Apple (AAPL) are up $1.61 at $492.25, after Jefferies & Co.‘s Peter Misek issued a skeptical view of the company’s reported 9 million in first-weekend sales of the iPhone 5S and 5C. Based on reviews of the supply chain, Misek estimates the company sold 4 million of the 5S and 2.5 million of the 5C, with the rest being sold into the channel, meaning non-Apple stores. Misek opines “While 6.5 million sell-through is still solid, it is not a huge amount of upside.” He reiterates a Hold rating on Apple shares and a $425 price target."

If he really said that, then he's even more of an idiot than I thought.

Apple is currently at 490. If you have a target of 425, why would you have a 'hold' rating? Anyone thinking that it's really going to hit 425 should be selling.
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post #25 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post
 

 

Munster is right, like it or not. Read my post above

 

He may be right that "some" were sold to channel, but he has no way of coming up with the number. Conveniently, his estimate of channel stuffing is the difference between reality and his estimates. Go figure.

 
These guys are all morons. They have less credibility than my cat.
post #26 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

To the best of my knowledge, it would.

 

Why would it? Apple Stores are not considered channel, and they don't "sell" to themselves. Carrier stores are part of channel, as are non-Apple retail stores. These ARE counted in "sold" as there are contracts to buy them. 

 
This is all dumb. Not only did Apple report sales, they also upped their guidance. Why would they up their guidance if they're going to report a crapload of 5C's in channel?
 
Also, the 9M "sold" number isn't necessarily including ANY from channel, as it was an informal announcement. It probably does include orders that haven't shipped yet, however. 
post #27 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoonerYoda View Post

I'd want a gold one, but I'm not a proud large wig-wearing black woman.

If you saw one in person, I don't think you would say this. Gold iphone or a black woman.

post #28 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post
 

If you saw one in person, I don't think you would say this. Gold iphone or a black woman.

 

I have yet to see one in person, but from pictures it looks quite classy.

 
Loving my space grey.
post #29 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendergast View Post
 

 

I have yet to see one in person, but from pictures it looks quite classy.

 
Loving my space grey.

 

Yep, the gold is really light and understated. In the Apple Store it was sort of hard to even see that it was gold. I liked it.

post #30 of 46

Wow, I ordered mine online at 7:40 last night with in-store pickup, and picked it up at about 8:15.  Looks like I got in right under the wire.  

 

For what it's worth, I waited in line for 2 hours yesterday morning before opening only to be turned away because I was told they didn't have the one I wanted.  

post #31 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacMan View Post

D!ck head misk is at it again. I just wish he gets fired

"Shares of Apple (AAPL) are up $1.61 at $492.25, after Jefferies & Co.‘s Peter Misek issued a skeptical view of the company’s reported 9 million in first-weekend sales of the iPhone 5S and 5C. Based on reviews of the supply chain, Misek estimates the company sold 4 million of the 5S and 2.5 million of the 5C, with the rest being sold into the channel, meaning non-Apple stores. Misek opines “While 6.5 million sell-through is still solid, it is not a huge amount of upside.” He reiterates a Hold rating on Apple shares and a $425 price target."

 

Even if the rest of his "methodology" is correct (which I doubt) isn't he asserting that it's reasonable to assume that not a single phone that was shipped to Best Buy, WalMart, AT&T, etc., etc. sold?

 

There is no f'ing way that Tim "Inventory Master" Cook would have Apple release a number of phones "sold" by including every phone passed on to a third-party reseller.  A) I don't think he's the kind of guy to do that (because he doesn't really care what Wall Street thinks on a day to day basis, and he strikes me as a high-integrity guy); B) He'd be asking for trouble (and law suits) if he intentionally mischaracterized sales to boost the stock price.  Apple says 9 million; I believe 9 million.

post #32 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi View Post

5C i selling like hell as well. Who thinks opposite, has no clue about Apple and its customers...

 

According to numerous reports it appears the 5S made up 78% of all iPhone sales last weekend.

 
In China where the 5C was supposed to do well, the 5S made up 91% of iPhone sales. The only placed the 5C sold at 20% or more of all sales were places where subsidized phones are the norm. In places such as China and other parts of Europe the 5C was a non-starter and the 5S dominated.
 
Not bad for Apple but overall but the 5C is still a dud in it's current state.
post #33 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

According to numerous reports it appears the 5S made up 78% of all iPhone sales last weekend.
 
In China where the 5C was supposed to do well, the 5S made up 91% of iPhone sales. The only placed the 5C sold at 20% or more of all sales were places where subsidized phones are the norm. In places such as China and other parts of Europe the 5C was a non-starter and the 5S dominated.
 
Not bad for Apple but overall but the 5C is still a dud in it's current state.

Yet the iPhone 5c would still have sold between 1 and 2 M using your figures. That's amazing performance for a 'last year's phone'. Please name any other phone that has done that.
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post #34 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendergast View Post
 

 

He may be right that "some" were sold to channel, but he has no way of coming up with the number. Conveniently, his estimate of channel stuffing is the difference between reality and his estimates. Go figure.

 
These guys are all morons. They have less credibility than my cat.

 

 

I agree with you, "some" units in the channel are unsold, but the numbers he comes up with is another story.

post #35 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

 

Even if the rest of his "methodology" is correct (which I doubt) isn't he asserting that it's reasonable to assume that not a single phone that was shipped to Best Buy, WalMart, AT&T, etc., etc. sold?

 

There is no f'ing way that Tim "Inventory Master" Cook would have Apple release a number of phones "sold" by including every phone passed on to a third-party reseller.  A) I don't think he's the kind of guy to do that (because he doesn't really care what Wall Street thinks on a day to day basis, and he strikes me as a high-integrity guy); B) He'd be asking for trouble (and law suits) if he intentionally mischaracterized sales to boost the stock price.  Apple says 9 million; I believe 9 million.

 

 

Indeed.

 

And people still give more credit to some much-of-the-time-wrrong-analysts with little to lose, because integrity worth not much for those analysts, than they give to a CEO who have much to lose.

Apple is a very peculiar corporation, Apple has a zillion of competitors, and it is in bed with very few players, so it has allot to lose if it cook the books.

post #36 of 46

Apple just can't catch a break.....

 

They sell 9 million phones and the analysis's say they did not have enough phones.  If Apple had made, let say, 15 million phones and had plenty on hand to satisfy immediate demand and did not sell out over the weekend, they would claim that demand is weak...

 

It is my "OPINION" that Apple is doing much better than expected on all fronts...  Most here (some of the biggest fans) were predicting 6-7 million.  I think that they had BETTER supply than in years past.  So maybe they did not have enough gold phones, but that one would be hard to predict by anyone...

 

Sooner or later common sense is going to take over and the stock market is going to realize that Apple is significantly undervalued...

 

I bought APPL at $400 and bough some more when it dipped to about $450...  

 

Want win big on stocks?  Listen to the Analysis and do the exact opposite of their recommendations.  You will be right more than 50% of the time.  The investors (Not gamblers) in Las Vegas get very rich on 51%....

post #37 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendergast View Post
 

 

Why would it? Apple Stores are not considered channel, and they don't "sell" to themselves. Carrier stores are part of channel, as are non-Apple retail stores. These ARE counted in "sold" as there are contracts to buy them. 

 

 

As long as you are absolutely certain about that.    :lol:

 

[What I was told is that Apple Retail is no different than Walmart or any other vendor... and I really doubt that Pendergast can prove otherwise... so everybody is guessing]

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post #38 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

[What I was told is that Apple Retail is no different than Walmart or any other vendor... and I really doubt that Pendergast can prove otherwise... so everybody is guessing]

 

"The Company recognizes revenue when persuasive evidence of an arrangement exists, delivery has occurred, the sales price is fixed or determinable, and collection is probable. Product is considered delivered to the customer once it has been shipped and title and risk of loss have been transferred. For most of the Company’s product sales, these criteria are met at the time the product is shipped. For online sales to individuals, for some sales to education customers in the U.S., and for certain other sales, the Company defers revenue until the customer receives the product because the Company retains a portion of the risk of loss on these sales during transit."

 

Are you implying that Apple Retail is considered a customer of Apple, Inc? 

post #39 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendergast View Post
 

 

"The Company recognizes revenue when persuasive evidence of an arrangement exists, delivery has occurred, the sales price is fixed or determinable, and collection is probable. Product is considered delivered to the customer once it has been shipped and title and risk of loss have been transferred. For most of the Company’s product sales, these criteria are met at the time the product is shipped. For online sales to individuals, for some sales to education customers in the U.S., and for certain other sales, the Company defers revenue until the customer receives the product because the Company retains a portion of the risk of loss on these sales during transit."

 

Are you implying that Apple Retail is considered a customer of Apple, Inc? 

 

That I am.

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post #40 of 46

I have to wonder how accurate the in-store inventory indicator is, especially for a high-demand product like the 5s.  When I looked at the in-store pickup availability, I saw that several Apple stores in my area had the Space Gray models available, especially the Sprint and Verizon configurations. 

 

But, considering the high demand for the 5s, I really wonder just how "real time" that inventory check really is.  When you check the in-store pickup availability, the online store says either "Available today" or "Unavailable for pickup."  Does that mean that the store will receive a shipment today sometime, or does it mean that they actually have units in-store right this moment?  From what I've been reading, the 5s shipments are trickling into Apple stores with shoppers already waiting for new inventory to arrive.

 

In my experience, Apple's in-store pickup seems run at a leisurely pace and does not seem well suited to handling high-demand items.

 

I remember when I bought an iPad using in-store pickup, I placed the order and then I received an e-mail telling me that the order was received and being prepared for pickup.  That first e-mail also said that I needed to wait for another confirmation message before heading to the store to actually pick up the iPad, and that the confirmation would usually take less than two hours.  I received the confirmation about 90 minutes later.  The process was orderly and the in-store service was great.  But, I was surprised that Apple did not provide something comparable to the real-time inventory indicator and 30 minute pickup window that other electronics and office supply stores use for their online/in-store pickup services. 

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