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Apple reportedly cutting iPhone 5c orders as it boosts 5s production [u] - Page 3

post #81 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingela View Post

Since changing colors on these things wouldn't be such a large task, I say they should change the colors up to make them not only collectable, but appeal to different consumers. I say it is a great time to offer a black model and other more adult or sophisticated color pallets, like sand or eggshell, the list can be endless

 

Hmmm... you might be right but the first thing I thought about was that a black 5c would look really cheap.

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post #82 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

It’s really not at all the same argument.

 

Why not? He was asking how stupid Apple would look right now for a mea culpa and then lowering the price. Jobs did it and lived with the consequences.

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post #83 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by MazeCookie View Post
 

This is a lot of peoples argument against the 5c, but it has no backbone.

 

Nobody complained about the 4S when the 5 was around. There was a $100 difference then. If you were buying a new upgrade, it makes sense for $100 to get the latest.

This 100 times over.  This is the rebuttal to any "5c is a failure" comment.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

It looks and feels cheap, considering nowadays you can get an HTC One for the same price as the 5C.

What OS does the HTC One run?  Oh ya.... :no:  For the record- the HTC One Mini is my favorite designed phone out there.  Too bad the OS and specs are garbage.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post
 

True but the 4s had the same glass and aluminium construction, the 5c has a cheaper plastic case. It should be cheaper.

By how much- 6 bucks?  Seriously- how much cheaper is aluminum vs plastic when it is constructed in the exact same manner (one block and drilled).  Do you not contend that the cost of the 4G/LTE bands, the front camera, and the bigger battery offset those minor savings?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssls6 View Post

They should have either gave it the 64 bit SoC or made it another $100 bucks cheaper. I would have gone the 64bit route.

Were you arguing that the 4S last year should have been $100 cheaper and run an A6?

 

 

 

The bottom line is that no one can argue that the 5s is a bad phone- so they just reach and grab after something else.  It just happens to be the 5c.  Which, as MazeCookie said- it's last years model.  That's like analysts last year complaining about the lack of sales of the 4s.  All you whiners- were you whining about 4S sales?  No?  Because it's the same freakin' thing!  It's asinine- and further proof that Apple has done amazingly again with the 5s!

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post #84 of 153
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

Why not? He was asking how stupid Apple would look right now for a mea culpa and then lowering the price. Jobs did it and lived with the consequences.

 

Oh, if it’s JUST the question of lowering a price, I agree with you. But I disagree on taking the action itself in this instance and on calling the two scenarios the same.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #85 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

I have very little doubt that Apple will NOT give a mea culpa and lower the price.  Even if Apple, in retrospect, decides that a lower price for the 5c would have been better (and it's far from obvious that that is the case), there is no way they would apologize for the initial price.  That would be turning a victory (millions of sales of 5Cs to happy customers, and apparently even more millions of sales of 5Ss) into a defeat.  How stupid would you have to do be to do that?  On a personal note, I know 2 people who wanted a new iPhone and didn't see the sense in spending an extra $100 for features they didn't value.  In both cases they love the color options and love their new phones (and probably feel pretty smug that they have the same iPhone experience I have plus an extra $100 in their pocket).

 

Would Apple have sold more 5Cs at a lower price?  Of course.  Would they have sold fewer 5Ss?  Yes.  Can they lower the price of the 5C over time to pick up additional sales?  Yes.  I don't get why this is turning into to such a drama.

The only one seeing 'drama' here is you. It's not such a big deal. As Apple has done before, they'll do a '$100 iTunes gift card' or some such thing for the early buyers who registered their phones.

 

In fact, it'll be a terrific opportunity to make a virtue out of a necessity.

post #86 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

Hmmm... you might be right but the first thing I thought about was that a black 5c would look really cheap.

How about a camo iPhone. I can take it hunting with me...

post #87 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secular Investor View Post
 

Some failue, when the 5C is outselling their main competitor's supposedly "best selling" Galaxy S4 ....LOL

Exactly.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I would not at all be surprised if this story is true. It was quite obvious that the relative pricing of the 5C was a mistake from the get-go. Apple had a chance to blow away the competition there, but chose not to do it.

Do I need to go to your post history 1 year ago?  Were you complaining that the "pricing of the 4S was a mistake from the get-go"?  No?  Then why complain now?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


I was one who questioned the pricing of the 5C, but can we wait for Apple's earnings call before we start calling things a mistake?!?

Again- did you question the pricing of the 4S a year ago?  No?  Then why complain now?


(see- I can do this all day)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post
 

 

I have very little doubt that Apple will NOT give a mea culpa and lower the price. 

 

Can they lower the price of the 5C over time to pick up additional sales?  Yes.

They won't lower the price.  They never lowered the 3gs, 4, or 4S price (when they were the 2nd tier model)- they won't lower this.  They might offer incentives later on in life- like when AT&T ran the 4S for $1 instead of $99 towards the end of the cycle.  Outside of that- it'll be the same as it's always been.  Because it is the same previous generation phone as its always been.  Just with a plastic case that gets offset with better camera, battery, and LTE bands- and expands it's market to not just the semi-cheap (the cheap still would go for the free 4S), but also the "colorful" and young.

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post #88 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

This 100 times over.  This is the rebuttal to any "5c is a failure" comment.

 

What OS does the HTC One run?  Oh ya.... :no:  For the record- the HTC One Mini is my favorite designed phone out there.  Too bad the OS and specs are garbage.

 

By how much- 6 bucks?  Seriously- how much cheaper is aluminum vs plastic when it is constructed in the exact same manner (one block and drilled).  Do you not contend that the cost of the 4G/LTE bands, the front camera, and the bigger battery offset those minor savings?

 

Were you arguing that the 4S last year should have been $100 cheaper and run an A6?

 

 

 

The bottom line is that no one can argue that the 5s is a bad phone- so they just reach and grab after something else.  It just happens to be the 5c.  Which, as MazeCookie said- it's last years model.  That's like analysts last year complaining about the lack of sales of the 4s.  All you whiners- were you whining about 4S sales?  No?  Because it's the same freakin' thing!  It's asinine- and further proof that Apple has done amazingly again with the 5s!

It's not technically the same thing because it's in a different casing. That casing, whether right or wrong, is not viewed as high quality as the casing on the 5. Therefore, many people feel like the price should be reduced further to make up for getting what they view as a cheaper build compared to last years model.

 

The actual cost difference from making the 5 casing to making the 5c casing doesn't matter. What matters is the perceived cost of making it.

post #89 of 153
Analysts are just carnival fortune tellers, except they're less accurate and not as entertaining.

These guesses are based on discussions with supply chain suppliers. Are these analysts complete morons or total idiots. Cook specifically warned that overall production levels cannot be determined by viewing such partial information. Just become one supplier is no longer producing at a certain level for Apple doesn't mean that others have not increased their supply or that enough has been produced to meet and perhaps even exceed Apple's market needs. Supply orders go up and down, and unless you have access to an overarching understanding of ALL supplies, an analysis is incomplete and incorrect.
post #90 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post
 

How about a camo iPhone. I can take it hunting with me...

 

I was thinking about a clear one and then I wondered if the word 'Samsung' could be seen through the back. All hell would break loose.

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post #91 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

Exactly.

 

Do I need to go to your post history 1 year ago?  Were you complaining that the "pricing of the 4S was a mistake from the get-go"?  No?  Then why complain now?

 

Again- did you question the pricing of the 4S a year ago?  No?  Then why complain now?


(see- I can do this all day)

 

They won't lower the price.  They never lowered the 3gs, 4, or 4S price (when they were the 2nd tier model)- they won't lower this.  They might offer incentives later on in life- like when AT&T ran the 4S for $1 instead of $99 towards the end of the cycle.  Outside of that- it'll be the same as it's always been.  Because it is the same previous generation phone as its always been.  Just with a plastic case that gets offset with better camera, battery, and LTE bands- and expands it's market to not just the semi-cheap (the cheap still would go for the free 4S), but also the "colorful" and young.

I'm also doubtful they will lower the price, at least not significantly. Lowering the price significantly would mean they would probably also have to lower the price of the 4s. I don't really see that happening.

post #92 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post
 

It's not technically the same thing because it's in a different casing. That casing, whether right or wrong, is not viewed as high quality as the casing on the 5. Therefore, many people feel like the price should be reduced further to make up for getting what they view as a cheaper build compared to last years model.

 

The actual cost difference from making the 5 casing to making the 5c casing doesn't matter. What matters is the perceived cost of making it.

Huh? 

All the casing did is open up the market to more people.  If someone was going to buy the 1st tier iPhone 5s- they still are- that doesn't change.  If someone was wanting to go the super cheap route- they get the free one iPhone 4s.  So we're only talking about a tiny sector of "mid-tier" people.  That is now expanded.  Some parents who have kids that would have gotten the "free" 4s because it's cheap- are now getting the 5c because it seems more kid-friendly.  Or people like the color- whatever.


I just can't believe there is this much b*tching and moaning about a previous generation phone.  It's insane!  If the galaxy s4 came out, and they made the galaxy s3 plastic- would it make news?  Oh wait...

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post #93 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

Huh? 

All the casing did is open up the market to more people.  If someone was going to buy the 1st tier iPhone 5s- they still are- that doesn't change.  If someone was wanting to go the super cheap route- they get the free one iPhone 4s.  So we're only talking about a tiny sector of "mid-tier" people.  That is now expanded.  Some parents who have kids that would have gotten the "free" 4s because it's cheap- are now getting the 5c because it seems more kid-friendly.  Or people like the color- whatever.


I just can't believe there is this much b*tching and moaning about a previous generation phone.  It's insane!  If the galaxy s4 came out, and they made the galaxy s3 plastic- would it make news?  Oh wait...

Sorry but I disagree. Most people I'm talking to are calling the 5c the cheap expensive iPhone. Cheap because of the build, expensive because of the cost. 

 

Think about a lot of the people that buy iPhones. These people are obsessed with the way it looks. Plastic, no matter what you call it, screams cheap compared to the casing Apple has used before.

 

This may be momentary though. Once more people actually hold the phone in their hands they will see that it's not as cheaply built as they thought. So, there's still hope that 5c sales will pick up. Or, Apple can make deep discounts on it.

 

Also, people who are buying s4's are also looking for something different. Looks and build quality doesn't matter to them as much as people buying the iPhones. They're trading build quality and OS reliability for either a bigger screen or a little bit more customizability.

post #94 of 153
As usual the discussion turns crap when Americans wake up. It's all a paranoid rant about the mainstream media.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post


Except Apple did not change the price for the original iPhone. Originally it was not subsidized. AT&T then subsidized it. Apple made the same amount of money. 

Apple absolutely changed the price and absolutely offered rebates.
Quote:
Originally Posted by starbird73 View Post

BINGO!


Who says they miscalculated? You? Notice these stories always come a week or so prior to their earnings report? And Tim says "don't take a report of one manufacturer and try and make connections" and Peter O can say "We order an amount up front to get pricing, and cut later"

So, those "stories" will come up next Wednesday night/Thursday

Typical Fox News style paranoia. The big bad MSM. lots of reports are now saying this and rather than discussing it we get paranoid ranting. This report - and AI has two sources now including Reuters - is not based on one manufacturer. Did you read it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by starbird73 View Post

Yes, it could indicate weak demand. It also could indicate efficient estimating or proper planning (yes, I appreciate alliteration), ensuring the channel is well stocked, they have the average on hand. Remember, they can build these 5c phones faster than the 5 or 5s.

Apple generally hopes to keep channel inventory at a certain level. If they don't they risk not selling enough next quarter and giving lower forward guidance. Which harms the stock. When other firms sell too much into channel people here get upset about stuffing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

If he were still alive and didn't learn from past mistakes.  The fact that they cut the price of the original iPhone and pissed off the early adopters is not a justification for repeating that fiasco.  The way to make happy customers into unhappy ones is to make them look like suckers.  That's exactly why a mea culpa would be insane (to say nothing of being unnecessary).

What actually happened after the price reduction was a massive spike in sales. ( visible in historical charts of iPhone sales). Pissing off the original buyers pissed off < .1% of the total future market and they weren't very angry once they got a rebate.

Once again back to facts.

1) Apple didn't position the 5C to sell more of the 5S. If they did mean to do that they wouldn't have overestimated 5C demand and underestimated 5S demand. They made a mistake. It happens.
2) the hints in the conference call will be apple reporting high inventory at end Sept Q and higher margins than expected. We already know the latter is true.

Possibly also lower guidance although the 5S might make up for that.
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post #95 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

Wrong.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/07/technology/07apple.html?_r=0

 

Yes, I stand corrected. I was thinking of when Apple changed its subsidy agreement with AT&T bringing the entry model down to $199.

 

I still think the situation is different. With the original iPhone, Apple was releasing a new product. It did not know how successful or not it would be, and it invested hundreds of millions of dollars on research.   It also was almost betting the future of the company on its success. It is better to price high initially to try and recoup its out of pocket cost.  After it understood the dynamics for the new product, it adjusted its price. 

 

After the unreasonable public outcry though from that quick price drop, it is highly doubtful Apple would suddenly drop the price of a product again. If it did, it likely would not do it personally. Instead, it would make the phone cheaper to partners who would offer deals. I suspect the iPhone 5C, however, is serving the purpose Apple intended, and that Apple is not disappointed with its sales. 

post #96 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post
 

Sorry but I disagree. Most people I'm talking to are calling the 5c the cheap expensive iPhone. Cheap because of the build, expensive because of the cost. 

 

Think about a lot of the people that buy iPhones. These people are obsessed with the way it looks. Plastic, no matter what you call it, screams cheap compared to the casing Apple has used before.

 

This may be momentary though. Once more people actually hold the phone in their hands they will see that it's not as cheaply built as they thought. So, there's still hope that 5c sales will pick up. Or, Apple can make deep discounts on it.

 

Also, people who are buying s4's are also looking for something different. Looks and build quality doesn't matter to them as much as people buying the iPhones. They're trading build quality and OS reliability for either a bigger screen or a little bit more customizability.

Most people I'm talking to like the 5c.  See how that argument doesn't work?

 

The core problem is everyone is comparing the 5c to the 5s.  They shouldn't.  It should be compared to last year's 4s.  In which case- it is incredibly improved.  I hope that Apple releases individual numbers this next Tuesday- and I think even though theyve never done it- it's a possibility.  Even if it's "we sold x% more iPhone 5c's than 4s' the first month than last year"- I think the numbers would be staggering.

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post #97 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post
 

It's not technically the same thing because it's in a different casing. That casing, whether right or wrong, is not viewed as high quality as the casing on the 5. Therefore, many people feel like the price should be reduced further to make up for getting what they view as a cheaper build compared to last years model.

 

The actual cost difference from making the 5 casing to making the 5c casing doesn't matter. What matters is the perceived cost of making it.

 

Yes, but if statistics are to be believed, the iPhone 5C is selling more than the iPhone 4S did last year. It seems to me the people complaining about the 5C are really just iPhone 5S buyers who want to justify their purchase or people who wanted Apple to give them a $399 phone. Either way, Apple is at least selling as many iPhone 5Cs as it did 4Ss last year, and at a higher profit margin. It can always reduce its wholesale cost to partners to move even more if it feels it is justified. 

post #98 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

I was one who questioned the pricing of the 5C, but can we wait for Apple's earnings call before we start calling things a mistake?!?

I have no doubt that the earnings will look good given aggregate number of iPhones sold. However, given past calls, I'd be very surprised if we got any information from Cook or Oppenheimer that breaks down 5S v. 5C numbers.

 

So such speculation as what we're seeing in the WSJ will unfortunately continue to fill the information void....

post #99 of 153

Love those analysts. When Apple announced the 9 million iPhone numbers they jumped to say large percentage (30% if I am not mistaken) of those are iPhone 5C. Now they say they are not selling well.

 

Anyway, I am seeing more and more iPhone 5C on our university campus. The thing about them is you can instantly tell that they are the 5C.

post #100 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

Possibly also lower guidance although the 5S might make up for that.

Apple raised their guidance for September.

Let me repeat: the 5C and 5S target different demographics. $100 difference is too much for some consumers. That's why people buy generics over brand names when the difference is just $1 or $2.
post #101 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
 

I have no doubt that the earnings will look good given aggregate number of iPhones sold. However, given past calls, I'd be very surprised if we got any information from Cook or Oppenheimer that breaks down 5S v. 5C numbers.

I don't think they would compare those either.  But why would they- that's a dumb comparison.  I would love for them to announce the 5c vs 4s from last year- even if just percentage differences and not specific units.  That is a valid comparison year over year, and the results would be staggering.

 

I don't understand the 5s vs 5c comparison.  Compare the 5s to the 5 last year and compare the 5c to the 4s last year.  Both are dominating their predecessor, which is a huge win for Apple.

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post #102 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayani1 View Post

The iphone 5c could have been popular if they made them in colored metal like the touch. Plastic seems too synonymous with cheap.

Or maybe demand for last year's phone was never higher than the new model. Changing case color and/or material doesn't make it the latest and greatest iPhone model.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #103 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsherly View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secular Investor View Post

The comments by milting & racingbull indicate that Apple has got its pricing right with the 5C.

The more affordable 5C attracts people wanting/aspiring to a new iPhone but on careful consideration they feel that the extra is worth it for the state of the art 5S, the most advanced smartphone around.

Also retailers discounts for the 5C attracts and pulls in potential buyers to stores, many of whom also upgrade to the 5S.

As racingbull rightly says, the 5S a better investment and will command a significantly higher trade in value, making it cheaper in the long run.

Both the 5S and 5C have similarly high margins for Apple, but more people moving to 64 bit, Touch ID and motion sensor M7 chip create new opportunities for developers. There will be a rush of new, high quality Apps making use of these new features, greatly increasing the already large quality gap between iOS Apps, compared to inferior Android Apps.

 

...What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?

 

What it also says it that there is little reason to buy the 5C. Which is evidently true if the newspaper is to be believed and production is being cut back….

 

I suspect with the holiday season coming up that the 5c will probably be a good seller for those buying for their kids/grandkids… etc. What little I know about manufacturing tells me it is better to a bunch a once and then have them available. I just don't see Apple having to eat the 5cs and its not like Apple had to borrow the money to pay for the inventory.

 

The other very important factor, if other rumors are to believed, is that Apple has several more new products in the pipeline for this year. Most of those are going to need high resolution screen (retina or retina+) and in the past this seems to have been a bottleneck. I realize we are talking about different size screens for different products but the difficulties remain, if not get worse as the size gets larger.

 

I also think it is great that Apple is able to get a bit of a breather and only be manufacturing 3 variants of the 5s, and the 4s. Adding another 5 variants of the 5c really complicates things. (BTW: I intentionally left out the different carrier versions and the different memory configs which although small the difference SKUs does complicate matters quite a bit.)

post #104 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayani1 View Post

The iphone 5c could have been popular if they made them in colored metal like the touch. Plastic seems too synonymous with cheap.

Or maybe demand for last year's phone was never higher than the new model. Changing case color and/or material doesn't make it the latest and greatest iPhone model.

 

+1

post #105 of 153
Originally Posted by dillio View Post
Funny how much in denial you people are, about this flop called IPhone 5c.

 

Prove it or shut your trap.

 
I don’t think anyone except Tim Cook and Jony Ive asked for…

 

I don’t think anyone gives a frick about what you “ask” for, not just Apple.

 
Apple needs to catch up with the times, and update iOS and the iPhone meaningfully.

 

It’s the fastest phone on the planet. Just shut up. 

 
…so I don’t…

 

“Apple needs to stop me from being impatient.” Good luck with that.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #106 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillio View Post

Funny how much in denial you people are, about this flop called IPhone 5c. I don't think anyone except Tim Cook and Jony Ive asked for a plastic phone, and in those colors, and at that price. Go ahead with your replies, but it shapes up to be true, as the latest rumors come it (yes, I said rumors, I know they are rumors; not all rumors all all false you know). Apple needs to catch up with the times, and update iOS and the iPhone meaningfully. At least the others are trying, and eventually Apple will copy them (control center anyone, notification center?, next touch-less voice control?) But Apple can do some things now just to catch up with itself: fix iMessage, fix control center so I don't turn my Bluetooth off and on when I try to swipe it back down, sweat those little details, Jony, like you boast in those videos.  And fix the horrible interface and functionality of Podcasts app, for G-d's sake. And update all those skeuomorphic leftover apps already. 

@dillio:

I'd say go away -- and while you are away you might make it a habit to proof your emails and fact check them e.g.,  "Go ahead with your replies, but it shapes up to be true, as the latest rumors come it (yes, I said rumors, I know they are rumors; not all rumors all all false you know)." If true can you quote a reliable source? Didn't think so.

 

From the Oxford English Dictionary:

Rumor

a currently circulating story or report of uncertain or doubtful truth

post #107 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillio View Post

Funny how much in denial you people are, about this flop called IPhone 5c. I don't think anyone except Tim Cook and Jony Ive asked for a plastic phone, and in those colors, and at that price. Go ahead with your replies, but it shapes up to be true, as the latest rumors come it (yes, I said rumors, I know they are rumors; not all rumors all all false you know). Apple needs to catch up with the times, and update iOS and the iPhone meaningfully. At least the others are trying, and eventually Apple will copy them (control center anyone, notification center?, next touch-less voice control?) But Apple can do some things now just to catch up with itself: fix iMessage, fix control center so I don't turn my Bluetooth off and on when I try to swipe it back down, sweat those little details, Jony, like you boast in those videos.  And fix the horrible interface and functionality of Podcasts app, for G-d's sake. And update all those skeuomorphic leftover apps already. 

Define "flop" in this case. Why is it a flop? It's last years's iPhone 5 in a colored plastic case. And it's selling better than the iPhone 4S did when it was replaced one year ago.

If Apple discovers than the ratio of 5s to 5c demand is different than initially predicted, of course they're going to tweak future orders to meet where the customer demand is. Don't confuse supply chain balancing for "flop."

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #108 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsherly View Post

This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'. 
Nope it is a rational consideration of the facts. It really says that iPhone 5S has been more successful than Apple expected.
Quote:

What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?
Ahh but they aren't sitting on shelves, they are the second highest seller behind Apples 5s for many carriers. Effectively Apple has the #1 & #2 spots sewed up at the carriers. Fall this really says is that Apple is moving more 5S phones than expected.
Quote:
What it also says it that there is little reason to buy the 5C. Which is evidently true if the newspaper is to be believed and production is being cut back.
Actually that is baloney, old products effectively get ramped down production wise as the mainline iPhone takes over. No one would rationally expect the 5C to maintain sales volumes after the initial release of the phone. It isn't the flagship product and wouldn't follow a sales pattern any different that previous phone revs from Apple.

I'd expect that Apple is still selling the 5c at a rate someplace between 20-30 million a quarter even after this cut back in sales.
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BTW, the touch id is pretty cool, but I find it's rejecting my fingerprints more often after a week or so of use. Initially it was spot on.

Where have your fingers been and is the sensor clean?
post #109 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

Most people I'm talking to like the 5c.  See how that argument doesn't work?

 

The core problem is everyone is comparing the 5c to the 5s.  They shouldn't.  It should be compared to last year's 4s.  In which case- it is incredibly improved.  I hope that Apple releases individual numbers this next Tuesday- and I think even though theyve never done it- it's a possibility.  Even if it's "we sold x% more iPhone 5c's than 4s' the first month than last year"- I think the numbers would be staggering.

No. It should be compared to last years 5, after all, that is the phone it is replacing. When compared to it all people see is that it went from a great case to a plastic case. People won't care about the improved front camera or the slightly better battery. The most important thing to them will be the casing.

 

As far as them releasing numbers, when has Apple ever given into pressure? It's very rare.

post #110 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by dugbug View Post
 

 

Ok so say its $200 cheaper and you pay $50/mo for your phone (likely more).  

5S 24 months:  $1399  (199 on contract)

5C 24 months:  $1200 (free on contract)

 

Ignoring aluminum vs plastic, look at what that %15 increase gets you:

  • Much improved low light camera with two-tone LED flash
  • Slow motion video (oh man is this fun)
  • 64-bit CPU 2x perf over 5C
  • New GPU 2x perf over 5C
  • M7
  • TouchID

 

 

Why not pop for the badass model?  I think to make the 5C attractive they need to push the price even lower for off-contract or for countries where phones are not subsidized. 

In every drop test I saw the 5s excelled whereas the  5c screen cracked. Almost that alone is justification for the 5s.

post #111 of 153

Please remember this fact… The 5c is just the older 5 with minor spec changes and added color choices. The 5s is the "latest and greatest" model, so of course that's the model that should be selling well.

What were the 4s sales like in comparison when the 5 came out?

What were the 4 sales like in comparison when the 4s came out?

That's how you can gauge whether or not the 5c is doing poorly in relation to the 5s. Then factor in the fact that the 5c costs less to make giving Apple a better profit margin.

Context, context, context.

post #112 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillio View Post

It is a flop because such a phone was even released. Of course some people will buy it only because Apple made it. It is a flop because it looks bad, has bad color choices, and it costs too much.

That doesn't make any sense. Considering the source, it's not a surprise.

Don't confuse your inept personal preferences with success. The 5C isn't for me but it's still successful.
post #113 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillio View Post

It is a flop because such a phone was even released. Of course some people will buy it only because Apple made it. It is a flop because it looks bad, has bad color choices, and it costs too much. Not the least, it comes with iOS7 (I hope they will improve iOS7 but for now, iOS7 is a flop in my book; too bad I can't switch back to iOS6 until 7.1 or 7.2 comes out)

The iPhone 5 has virtually identical hardware, fewer color choices, and cost more. It should have been an even bigger flop than the 5c. Guess it wasn't.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #114 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trubador View Post
 

Please remember this fact… The 5c is just the older 5 with minor spec changes and added color choices. The 5s is the "latest and greatest" model, so of course that's the model that should be selling well.

What were the 4s sales like in comparison when the 5 came out?

What were the 4 sales like in comparison when the 4s came out?

That's how you can gauge whether or not the 5c is doing poorly in relation to the 5s. Then factor in the fact that the 5c costs less to make giving Apple a better profit margin.

Context, context, context.

 

You're right.

 

I remember all the advertising for the 4s in September 2012 and for the 4 in October of 2011. Ads on the telly, ads in the bus shelters, huge posters in the malls... the advertising was everywhere, it was relentless... oh, wait...

 

Context, context, context.

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post #115 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Muller View Post
 

No. It should be compared to last years 5, after all, that is the phone it is replacing. When compared to it all people see is that it went from a great case to a plastic case. People won't care about the improved front camera or the slightly better battery. The most important thing to them will be the casing.

Incorrect again.  You can't compare the 5c sales with the 5 sales.  You can't create an imaginative environment where the 5 sells for $99 and compare that with how the 5c has done.  What you CAN do- is compare sales of the same tier model in the previous year- the 4s.

 

You're sitting here comparing the 5 and 5c- no one else is.  No one declares it a "failure" because it doesn't stack up to the 5.  People are declaring it a "failure" because they believe it's priced too high, and it isn't selling as well as the 5s.  The bottom line is that the 5s is crushing the 5's previous sales and the 5c is crushing the 4s' sales of last year.  That means the 5s is a success, as is the 5c.

 

The 5c and "previous model 5" should not be compared in "sales"- that's an invalid- and impossible- comparison because it's an environment that doesn't exist.

 

If you can give me a single review that says the 5c is a failure because it doesn't stack up well with the 5- then I'll retract everything else I said.  In the meantime, please continue to read the dozens of reviews from analysts and close-minded posters that declare the 5c a failure because of price or its comparison to the 5s.  Both are equally idiotic stances.


Edited by Andysol - 10/16/13 at 12:47pm

2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
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2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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post #116 of 153

Are my basic math skills failing me?  

 

Is not 150,000 a day about 4.5 million 5c's being produced a month?

 

 Does that not equal 13.5 million 5C's being sold per quarter?

 

 And don't Apple's current production cuts anticipate demand after the holidays?

 

Isn't this is at least in line with last year's 4S sales at this time?  It seems to be the 5C is selling way better than the 4S did last year.

 

(Yes, we have to take into account the additional marketing costs of the 5C.  Apple wasn't out marketing the 4S heavily at this time last year.)

 

I predict that Apple's upcoming earnings call will indicate that iPhone sales are VERY robust.  Even if they're only selling 1 in 3 5C's, some simple math will confirm that the 5C is more of a hit than a flop.

 

But then, math was never my strong suit.  This seems to be something I share with most Analysts lol.

post #117 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

You're right.

 

I remember all the advertising for the 4s in September 2012 and for the 4 in October of 2011. Ads on the telly, ads in the bus shelters, huge posters in the malls... the advertising was everywhere, it was relentless... oh, wait...

 

Context, context, context.

Just because they didn't advertise it doesn't mean it didn't exist!

 

The fact is the 5c is crushing the 4s sales from last year- you can blame marketing- fine.  If the marketing is paid for by the additional phones sold- all the better.  The other fact is the 5s is crushing the 5 sales from last year.  So its a double win for Apple.  More top tier phones sold, AND more mid-tier phones sold.  I'm still having trouble connecting the dots to this being a bad thing?  What's wrong with you people?!?

2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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post #118 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

Just because they didn't advertise it doesn't mean it didn't exist!

 

The fact is the 5c is crushing the 4s sales from last year- you can blame marketing- fine.  If the marketing is paid for by the additional phones sold- all the better.  The other fact is the 5s is crushing the 5 sales from last year.  So its a double win for Apple.  More top tier phones sold, AND more mid-tier phones sold.  I'm still having trouble connecting the dots to this being a bad thing?  What's wrong with you people?!?

 

Crushing the 4s sales from last year?

 

Huh?

 

Where'd you get that from... please.

 

The iPhone 5c should be doing at least 33% and preferably 50% better than 4s sales from last year at this time.

 

From everything I've seen it look like a dead heat when you factor in the error margin.

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post #119 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

Crushing the 4s sales from last year?

 

Huh?

 

Where'd you get that from... please.

3 Million sold the opening weekend.  Also- please read the post before mine.

 

I think this is the first time Apple will give us a breakdown of 5c sold vs the 4s last year- because I think the number is staggering with the reports we've seen so far.  We might not get the unit breakdown, but I think we get a percentage comparison.  Whether this be on the 22nd (most likely) or the quarterly report- I think we see it.  I pray they do it.

2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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2012 27" iMac i7, 2010 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air, iPad Mini Retina, (2) iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
Time Capsule 5, (3) AirPort Express 2, (2) Apple TV 3

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post #120 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post
 

3 Million sold the opening weekend.  Also- please read the post before mine.

 

I think this is the first time Apple will give us a breakdown of 5c sold vs the 4s last year- because I think the number is staggering with the reports we've seen so far.  We might not get the unit breakdown, but I think we get a percentage comparison.  Whether this be on the 22nd (most likely) or the quarterly report- I think we see it.

 

Please... don't use made-up crap to counter posts. It just looks silly.

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