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Carl Icahn says he'll consider shareholder proxy vote if Apple rejects his buyback plan

post #1 of 153
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Appearing in a television interview Thursday afternoon, billionaire investor Carl Icahn said that he would consider, but will not commit to, a possible proxy vote to force Apple executives to buy back more of their own shares, if they don't agree to his proposal.

Icahn


Icahn made it clear in an interview with CNBC that he isn't "going away," and plans to continue his efforts to persuade Apple executives to spend $150 billion on a share buyback. Icahn made a splash earlier Thursday when he published a letter he wrote to Apple Chief Executive Tim Cook encouraging him to consider issuing an immediate tender offer, borrowing money to buy back shares at a price of $525 from investors.

When asked whether he is planning to push for a proxy vote to drive his agenda, Icahn said he would consider it if his proposal is rejected."We'll test the waters and see if the shareholders want us to do it." - Carl Icahn on the prospect of a proxy vote.

"We'll test the waters and see if the shareholders want us to do it and want us to win," he said.

Icahn said he believes Cook is doing a good job as CEO, and shouldn't be replaced. He wouldn't say the same for the rest of the Apple Board of Directors, however.

The billionaire investor believes that a change may be necessary on the board, and he'd prefer to see someone with an investor's point of view providing input at the company. However, Icahn said he's not interested in such a role.



"I really don't want to spend the time to go on a board at this point," he said.

Icahn expects to hear from Cook after Apple reports its quarterly earnings next Monday. He said the two agreed to speak again after Apple's September earnings report when they met for dinner in New York late last month.I really don't want to spend the time to go on a board at this point." - Icahn

But Icahn stands by his belief that Apple has too much money in the bank, and that letting that money sit is a disservice to investors.

"It's ludicrous to say that they need $150 billion sitting in a bank somewhere in Europe to do innovation," he said.

Apple is currently in the process of spending $100 billion through 2015 on share buybacks, as well as dividend payouts. But Icahn believes Apple should increase its share buyback program and spend $150 billion on its share buyback, and he'd like to see that sum spent immediately.
post #2 of 153
What a piece of shit this fuckwad is.

"The billionaire investor believes that a change may be necessary on the board, and he'd prefer to see someone with an investor's point of view providing input at the company. However, Icahn said he's not interested in such a role."

Yeah, no. How the **** would anyone with an "investors point of view" actually have the capability to provide input that is constructive to Apple's long-term success and product quality? What a mind-numbingly short-sighted scum bag this guy is. Apple didn't get to where it is today by following the "investor" point of view. It got to where it is by ignoring almost all of it.
post #3 of 153
I'm a shareholder and I'd vote against it. I'm sure I'm not alone. I trust the board.
post #4 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

What a piece of shit this fuckwad is.

your first sentence pretty much sums up my sentiments, so i'll defer to your post.

icahn should know this: i'm a long-time aapl holder and i support tim and the board.
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post #5 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by realpaulfreeman View Post

I'm a shareholder and I'd vote against it. I'm sure I'm not alone. I trust the board.

That's two of us and I am sure you are correct, he'd be slaughtered in a vote.
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post #6 of 153
I don't like Carl Icahn. And I believe share buybacks have historically shown to have short term benefits. But I am intrigued by this confrontation. Let's see how it plays out.
post #7 of 153

Bravo.  I have a small stake (300 shares) and I'll vote yes to $150B buyback.

 

Let the shareholders decide.

post #8 of 153

In other news, Apple has responded to Icahn’s demands by taking the company private. Reports are coming in that paper representations of each of Icahn’s shares were mailed to his door this morning, each stamped with a hand, its middle finger extended.

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post #9 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post

I don't like Carl Icahn. And I believe share buybacks have historically shown to have short term benefits. But I am intrigued by this confrontation. Let's see how it plays out.

 

IBM has purchased over 45% of their shares since 1995.  The last 5 years the stock has appreciated 250% despite having flat revenue and earnings.  Buybacks executed at the right share price is an excellent way to increase shareholder value.  In fact Warren Buffet personally told Steve Jobs to purchase shares if he thought Apple was being undervalued.

post #10 of 153
Quote:
The billionaire investor believes that a change may be necessary on the board, and he'd prefer to see someone with an investor's point of view providing input at the company. However, Icahn said he's not interested in such a role.

Investors point of view! Talk about the best way to ruin a company built on innovation and making products.

 

Wall Street has never made anything. They just play with paper and screw people.

post #11 of 153

has apple's board ever had a decision overturned by its shareholders?

 

if not, why would anyone expect it to change now?

post #12 of 153

This is why I wish Apple was private in the first place. This dipshit couldn't care any less about Apple as a company. He just wants Apple to make him and his rich friends more money. 

 

Investors don't know, or understand how Apple works as a company. This is what I hate. They rely on people with no facts what so ever even though they claim they have the facts. We see this here time and time again, nearly everyday with some stupid prediction from some "expert" thats completely way off. 

 

Apple knows what its doing. It didn't get there out of the blue. It has good people top to bottom to run the company and its finances. 

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post #13 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


That's two of us and I am sure you are correct, he'd be slaughtered in a vote.

Make that 3

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post #14 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

In other news, Apple has responded to Icahn’s demands by taking the company private. Reports are coming in that paper representations of each of Icahn’s shares were mailed to his door this morning, each stamped with a hand, its middle finger extended.

 

I and I think many many other people wish this could happen. Apple doesn't need to be public. There's too much BS going on. 

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post #15 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

Bravo.  I have a small stake (300 shares) and I'll vote yes to $150B buyback.

Let the shareholders decide.

If that is what Tim and his team think I'm all in, if not I go with the sage and 'pro Apple' centric views rather than a self interested corporate raider. You really want for Apple, arguably the best run tech company in history to acquiesce to the desires of one, and provably self interested, man? If he were to win this, what would he demand next?
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post #16 of 153
so...basically, it's extortion.
post #17 of 153

what a tool! 

post #18 of 153

"Investor point of view" by which he means short term, quick-buck, future-be-damned, vampire vulture? No thanks Mr Icahn.  Go back to the subterranean vent that spat you out.

post #19 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

IBM has purchased over 45% of their shares since 1995.  The last 5 years the stock has appreciated 250% despite having flat revenue and earnings.  Buybacks executed at the right share price is an excellent way to increase shareholder value.  In fact Warren Buffet personally told Steve Jobs to purchase shares if he thought Apple was being undervalued.

IBM and GE are two examples cited in favour of share repurchasing. But what if IBM sent the roughly $100B (more?) on dividends instead? Naysayers would bring up the tax angle. Furthermore, the problem with share repurchase is that natural market vacillations makes it real hard to objectively nail down one's true capital gain.

 

IBM, as you mentioned, needed to do something because of relatively meagre growth in revenue and earnings (not at all flat as you stated). Is Apple in such a situation?

 

Go beyond IBM and GE, how many clear success stories can one name? Dell? No. Microsoft? No. HP?

post #20 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

what a tool! 

He's a brilliant investor, no tool at all. I don't like him either. But let's get our invectives straight :)

post #21 of 153
If you're really looking around for shareholder reaction, Carl, here's one. Keep your filthy short-term gain investment hands off Apple. Get a real job somewhere instead of trying to wring a nickel out of other people's ingenuity and creativity. Leach.
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post #22 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_dog View Post

so...basically, it's extortion.

Which has worked so well for him.

 

This is why it will be fascinating to watch - world's most successful tech company in the last 10 years v. world's most successful vulture investor.

post #23 of 153
Make it four. This guy needs to shut down hard! Why would I vote to have the company add $150 billion worth of debt to its balance sheet? Wall Street can get federal government bailouts for its debt, Apple does not have that cushion.

Is this something the SEC could investigate?
post #24 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


If that is what Tim and his team think I'm all in, if not I go with the sage and 'pro Apple' centric views rather than a self interested corporate raider. You really want for Apple, arguably the best run tech company in history to acquiesce to the desires of one, and provably self interested, man? If he were to win this, what would he demand next?

 

Its not one man's view.  If there is a proxy all the shareholders will vote whats best for the company.  Thats the way it should be.

 

Personally I'll vote for the buyback.  Just look at the numbers:

 

In 10 years Apple will have $700B in cash

WTF are they going to do with all that cash?

It should go back to the investors in dividends and buybacks if they don't have any good use of it.  Just from inflation alone Apple would be losing $25B a year just sitting on the cash.

post #25 of 153
So he wants Apple to buy back shares from investors at $525 a share. At a current price of $530 a share, I ain't sellin.
post #26 of 153
Carl can go F himself !
post #27 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

Its not one man's view.  If there is a proxy all the shareholders will vote whats best for the company.  Thats the way it should be.

Personally I'll vote for the buyback.  Just look at the numbers:

In 10 years Apple will have $700B in cash
WTF are they going to do with all that cash?
It should go back to the investors in dividends and buybacks if they don't have any good use of it.  Just from inflation alone Apple would be losing $25B a year just sitting on the cash.

As I said, if Tim agrees I am all in. But none of us know what Tim has planned for the future and I for one trust him over you, Carl or anyone else, to know what Apple have planned. To say a small group of shareholders 'know what's best' is just silly.
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post #28 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post
 

IBM and GE are two examples cited in favour of share repurchasing. But what if IBM sent the roughly $100B (more?) on dividends instead? Naysayers would bring up the tax angle. Furthermore, the problem with share repurchase is that natural market vacillations makes it real hard to objectively nail down one's true capital gain.

 

IBM, as you mentioned, needed to do something because of relatively meagre growth in revenue and earnings (not at all flat as you stated). Is Apple in such a situation?

 

Go beyond IBM and GE, how many clear success stories can one name? Dell? No. Microsoft? No. HP?

 

Dell had a colapsing business model.  Plus a lot to the buybacks were done during the dot.com era.

HP just like Dell.

Microsoft buybacks were done during the dot.com era also.

 

All three had terrible valuations when the buybacks were done

post #29 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


As I said, if Tim agrees I am all in. But none of us know what Tim has planned for the future and I for one trust him over you, Carl or anyone else, to know what Apple have planned.

 

Good point.  But neither Tim nor the Board of Directors own Apple.  The shareholders do and they have a right to demand a captial allocation plan that benefits shareholder value.

post #30 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

IBM has purchased over 45% of their shares since 1995.  The last 5 years the stock has appreciated 250% despite having flat revenue and earnings.  Buybacks executed at the right share price is an excellent way to increase shareholder value.  In fact Warren Buffet personally told Steve Jobs to purchase shares if he thought Apple was being undervalued.

 

That took almost 20 years... Icahn(t) wants Apple to buy back ⅓ of the company in one day! Apple is already purchasing $100 billion over the next few years, why can't this moron be happy with that? If you don't like the way the company is being run, why the f@#k did he invest in the first place?

 

He doesn't give a sh!t about Apple, he is obviously just trying to grab as much cash from APPL as he can.

 

Sorry folks, but wish Apple's stock would completely tank to the point that Apple could buy back all their shares and take the company private. This market/investor crap is just getting stupid as far as Apple is concerned and really needs to be taken out of the equation.

Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #31 of 153

Even if Carl has a bit of a point, by releasing this letter it kills the possibility.  If Tim and the board were to increase the buyback it would seem like they are just doing what Carl tells them to do and thus appear weak.  Never going to happen.  Apple would be better off by making a big strategic purchase of another company with some of it's extra cash.

post #32 of 153
Isn't it surprising that Apple has managed so well without this chuckleheads invaluable advise. How HAVE they done it? Oh, that's right, ignoring people like Icahn. Message to Icahn, I'm a shareholder too, please just go away.
post #33 of 153
You don't save your money for 15 years to pointlessly give it away without ANY benefit to the company itself. I own Apple stock and I do not want people like Icahn anywhere near it. People like him are the reason why the financial industry keeps screwing up the entire world economy. Go frock yourself, Carl!
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post #34 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennettvista View Post
 

Even if Carl has a bit of a point, by releasing this letter it kills the possibility.  If Tim and the board were to increase the buyback it would seem like they are just doing what Carl tells them to do and thus appear weak.  Never going to happen.  Apple would be better off by making a big strategic purchase of another company with some of it's extra cash.

 

Look what happened with Google purchasing Motorolla.  The purchase price was $20B and they are losing $1B each year.  Its not easy to make a big strategic purchase.  Most times it loses the company billions.

post #35 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

In fact Warren Buffet personally told Steve Jobs to purchase shares if he thought Apple was being undervalued.

If you believe Warren then you shouldn't support Icahn. He just basically told Tim to ignore him.
post #36 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennettvista View Post

Even if Carl has a bit of a point, by releasing this letter it kills the possibility.  If Tim and the board were to increase the buyback it would seem like they are just doing what Carl tells them to do and thus appear weak.  Never going to happen.  Apple would be better off by making a big strategic purchase of another company with some of it's extra cash.
I'd like Apple to go after Nest. I think it would be a good fit and the guys running it are ex-Apple employees.
post #37 of 153
Go away...I am a share holder and surely vote against this $hit
post #38 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post
 

 

That took almost 20 years... Icahn(t) wants Apple to buy back ⅓ of the company in one day! Apple is already purchasing $100 billion over the next few years, why can't this moron be happy with that? If you don't like the way the company is being run, why the f@#k did he invest in the first place?

 

He doesn't give a sh!t about Apple, he is obviously just trying to grab as much cash from APPL as he can.

 

Sorry folks, but wish Apple's stock would completely tank to the point that Apple could buy back all their shares and take the company private. This market/investor crap is just getting stupid as far as Apple is concerned and really needs to be taken out of the equation.

 

$150B would be about 33% of the company.  Apple is only purchasing $60B in buybacks (the rest is dividends).  They have already bought about $30B, so Carl's plan is to spend an additional $120B.

 

Buying back 33% of shares is not out of the ordinary.  Its just Apples numbers are so massive and most companies don't have the luxury to buyback all the shares at once like Apple.

post #39 of 153
He's not going to win a Shareholder proxy vote! Proxy votes always lose. So he's already lost because Tim Cook's not going to do this.

I'd have to agree that I don't see the long term benefit of his idea. As someone said, Apple's already done a buy-back.
post #40 of 153

Buyback (not 150 B) at a good pace should lower the float and they would not have to pay dividend to shareholders for the number of shares they buy which saves money!

 

Also Apple needs to think about what they will do with such a boost in company's cash in years ahead. They need to plan ahead!

They should buy some really great companies for free cash flows. Bring out Apple payment system and crush the CC companies over a long run. Lot can be done but I guess they are so slow towards service side of business!

 

Icahn can be good for shareholders for short term but Apple needs to do their own thing in benefit for the long term holders!  I do not mind share price hitting $1000 by itself rather than hitting 1250 as Carl mentioned!

I am happy Icahn brought in such notice, at least some of the lazy board members will wake up and do something good now or get fired! 


Edited by helicopterben - 10/24/13 at 10:47am
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