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Apple and Samsung give closing remarks in damages retrial, Samsung pushes for mistrial

post #1 of 33
Thread Starter 
In the Apple v. Samsung damages retrial on Tuesday, attorneys for each side offered their respective closing pitches to jurors -- one of which prompted Samsung to call for a mistrial -- as a decision is close at hand.

Apple v Samsung
A slide from the Apple v. Samsung trial


During Tuesday's proceedings, Apple counsel Harold McElhinny used his allotted 90 minutes to restate evidence presented over the course of the week-long retrial, which for Apple is a chance to be "made whole" by reinstating some $380 million in vacated damages. In opposition, Samsung attorney William Price said Apple exaggerated the importance of the five patents-in-suit.

Of particular interest was a request to call a mistrial over a portion of McElhinny's closing arguments. According to CNET, the Apple lawyer said U.S. television manufacturers went belly-up because they did not adequately protect their patents. Samsung took this as playing a nationalistic/racial card, which has no place in the case.

"Our economy will disappear," McElhinny said of the U.S., offering the history of once-strong American TV manufacturers as an example. "If the cost of breaking the law is a small fine [...] Samsung's copying will have proven successful."

Despite hearing repeated requests for a mistrial, presiding U.S. District Court Judge Lucy Koh denied the motion, but instructed jurors to disregard where Apple and Samsung are based. Also not to be considered are race and other comments that could negatively color the arguments.

"I don't think what occurred rises to the level of a mistrial, but some remedy might be appropriate to avoid further issues later on," Koh said.

Bressler Testimony
Comparison of Apple and Samsung devices. | Source: Apple v. Samsung court documents


According to further in-court reports from Reuters, Apple counsel Bill Lee hammered Samsung over its inability to produce senior executives for testimony, saying the jury should instead be guided by the Korean company's internal documents. The papers, when presented by Apple, point to an informed change in smartphone design and operation when the iPhone first debuted.

"Witnesses forget, or in the case of Samsung here, witnesses don't appear," Lee said.

As for Samsung, Price said the company is willing to pay a penalty for infringed patents, but noted it should not be made to overcompensate for design flourishes that any manufacturer should be able to incorporate in their products.

"Apple doesn't own beautiful and sexy," Price said. "What they're saying is, in the market, justice is just us."

The soon to be decided case involves 13 Samsung products found to be in infringement of five Apple patents. In 2012, the Apple v. Samsung jury trial awarded Apple $1.05 billion in damages incurred by Samsung's copycat products. Later, Judge Koh vacated $450 million from the total after finding discrepancies in that jury's calculations. The jurist called for a retrial on the products tied to the vacated damages to settle the matter.

Apple is seeking $380 million for lost profits, Samsung profits and royalties pertaining to the infringement of five U.S. patents. Samsung does not dispute that it infringed upon Apple's property, but argues damages should be limited to $53 million.

The retrial jury is scheduled to begin deliberations today.
post #2 of 33
What a ridiculous argument for a "mistrial". There's nothing racial about that statement.

"Apple doesn't own beautiful and sexy," Price said. "What they're saying is, in the market, justice is just us."

Samsung's lawyers love these strawman, irrelevant, childish arguments that have nothing to do with the point.
post #3 of 33
"What they're saying is, in the market, justice is just us." ?

Scumbags.
post #4 of 33
Oh, my. I hope Apple is awarded the biggest award in patent infringement history.

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post #5 of 33

Actually, Apple does own beautiful and sexy.:lol: But, anyway, this trial is about patent infringement, and the Samsung representative seems to have forgotten that.:rolleyes:

post #6 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

Actually, Apple does own beautiful and sexy.lol.gif But, anyway, this trial is about patent infringement, and the Samsung representative seems to have forgotten that.1rolleyes.gif

Samsung really cheaped out on their lawyers.

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post #7 of 33
Samsung deserves the full 360 million dollar fine to compensate Apple for outright stealing and copying. They even have admitted it in court even. They've been caught opening and distributing legal confidential documents from Apple as well and trying to use these against there competitors.
Samsung needs to be brought down a notch. They think they are not liable for any of there actions like some spoiled kid. This has to stop and I think Apple will someday convince the courts enough is enough already.

Hopefully the jury here is more wise then the judge as she has turned down action in the past against Samsung. Now the appeals court has turned down Judge Koh for her lack of action against Samsung. Maybe that will also get some justice here for Apple as well.
post #8 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Also not to be considered are race ...... that could negatively color the arguments.

Couldn't help chuckling at that one.... (emphasis mine).

post #9 of 33
NOT only Apple owns beautiful and sexy but they also own samsung and google's mobile business.

AND ... yes samsung, for as long as I'm alive, I support Made / Designed In California!

....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

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....the lack of properly optimized apps is one of the reasons "why the experience on Android tablets is so crappy".

Tim Cook ~ The Wall Street Journal - February 7, 2014

Inside Google! 

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post #10 of 33

Hoping for a speedy and positive outcome.

post #11 of 33
Mistrial? For what? Because Samsung lied and said they didn't do anything wrong and then later admitted they copied Apple?

They are REALLY pushing it. REAL SCUM.
post #12 of 33
I love it when White lawyers paraphrase black comedians!! "in the market, justice is just us."

"U come here lookin' for justice and that's what u find... Just Us" (Richard Pryor)
post #13 of 33

Loser Government gets involve in each and everything but cannot see OUTSIDER Company abusing Court System and Copying American products.

 

Get involve here you mindless fruckers and damage those liars :lol: 

 

Grill those Liars in Congressional hearings and issue a ban on cheaters :p   

 

If S Korea tries to act smart, leave N Korea out of cage for a hunt :err:  Dominate on the ones who cheat, not on ones who cannot fight back!


Edited by helicopterben - 11/19/13 at 3:29pm
post #14 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Samsung really cheaped out on their lawyers.

I find it difficult to call them lawyers, when they don't know the meaning of "confidential."

post #15 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post
 

I find it difficult to call them lawyers, when they don't know the meaning of "confidential."

 

At least they got the first syllable right...

post #16 of 33
Apple needs to stop worrying about the old design of the iphone and worry about the next big thing. I love apple, but it worries me how desperate they are in trying to stop a copycat because they are slowing losing their market share in smartphones.
post #17 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICEx14 View Post

Apple needs to stop worrying about the old design of the iphone and worry about the next big thing. I love apple, but it worries me how desperate they are in trying to stop a copycat because they are slowing losing their market share in smartphones.

You don't have the remotest clue about what thievery is, and why it's a crime, do you?

post #18 of 33
Yes, I do know and I understand why some people are angry, but my argument is that it happened and it's done. Other companies have similar smartphones in the market and it is the "standard". Therefore, instead of trying to sue and block samsung products they need to take future measures to prevent this. And again, I love apple and I buy the newest iPhone every year, in fact I replied with my iPhone 5s.
post #19 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
 

You don't have the remotest clue about what thievery is, and why it's a crime, do you?


I believe Apple is also going to have that problem when it comes to a jury. The jury foreman is really the one that screwed Apple if what I read about the first trial is true. I really don't think people take patents seriously and most don't really see the harm. If I remember correctly the jury foreman in the first trial was seen as manipulating the jury because he has filed patents in the past.
 

I could be wrong but I think Samsung is going to get away easy on this. No one ever wants something to go to a jury because it can go big in either direction.

post #20 of 33

Apple and Samsung give closing remarks in damages retrial:

 

Apple Representative: F*ck you.

 

Samsung Representatative: F*ck you, also.

 

Apple Representative: Did you just Goddamn copy us AGAIN?

post #21 of 33
You have to see Samsung's attempt at turning a losing battle in the courtroom into a winning battle in the global PR campaign of blackening Apple's name. So far they have been very effective through the use of paid shills on social media networks. I know of two ex-iPhone users who now have Samsungs, one said "it's just the same as an iPhone, but cheaper" the other said "they're all copying off each other so I got the one with the bigger screen".

By muddying the waters and playing on the lack of knowledge of the average consumer, saying things like "it's all about rounded corners" and other idiocy will commercially compensate for any legal losses Samsung has to pay. Hence, they should pay with an injunction, not a fine. Or both.
post #22 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwissMac2 View Post

You have to see Samsung's attempt at turning a losing battle in the courtroom into a winning battle in the global PR campaign of blackening Apple's name. So far they have been very effective through the use of paid shills on social media networks. I know of two ex-iPhone users who now have Samsungs, one said "it's just the same as an iPhone, but cheaper" the other said "they're all copying off each other so I got the one with the bigger screen".

By muddying the waters and playing on the lack of knowledge of the average consumer, saying things like "it's all about rounded corners" and other idiocy will commercially compensate for any legal losses Samsung has to pay. Hence, they should pay with an injunction, not a fine. Or both.

 

We'll see how attractive Samsung rip-off phones are once they are either banned or eventually include a large licensing fee added onto every phones cost to the consumer (yes, this is a reference to the Rockstar Consortium suits).

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post #23 of 33

I certainly hope so. It isn't right that they are doing what they are doing, but Apple really isn't winning the PR campaign in social media as far as I can see. I hope I'm wrong, but Phil Schiller is an old school, classical marketing guy and seems to have missed the boat on this one.

 

Apple haven't helped themselves either with the new software releases of late. Not many people I know like the new iOS 7 look and feel - me included and I am a big Apple fan - nor Mavericks or the new iWork suite. The usability has just been forgotten about! Even the dot in the red traffic light blob to tell me the file is unsaved has gone... :-(

post #24 of 33
I hope those freezing ice holes pay dearly. All they are good for is copying shit that Apple does and nothing else. Their product is inferior and no real thought put in when made. Their product presentation when releasing a new product is crap. And they wonder why Apple has such a fan loyalty base. Apple consumers spend more money to get quality products and apps vs android and samsung consumers. Screw you samsung. At least be fair and honorable and admit it and pay up. Isn't that what your culture is all about. But u guess it doesn't apply to you cause you think you are better than everyone else.
post #25 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICEx14 View Post

Yes, I do know and I understand why some people are angry, but my argument is that it happened and it's done. Other companies have similar smartphones in the market and it is the "standard". Therefore, instead of trying to sue and block samsung products they need to take future measures to prevent this. And again, I love apple and I buy the newest iPhone every year, in fact I replied with my iPhone 5s.

 

So the next time Samsung steals Apple's IP, you will say the same thing? And Apple's responsibility to prevent someone stealing from them can only extend so far - it's not like they left the front door open in broad daylight for Samsung to walk in and rob them. The responsibility lies with Samsung for it's own actions, be it to 'innovate' or to steal.

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post #26 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomhayes View Post

"What they're saying is, in the market, justice is just us." ?

Scumbags.

Quote:
Originally Posted by svesan03 View Post

I love it when White lawyers paraphrase black comedians!! "in the market, justice is just us."

"U come here lookin' for justice and that's what u find... Just Us" (Richard Pryor)

Samsung ripped off Pryor, who ripped off Eldredge Cleaver.
post #27 of 33
Koh needs to learn the difference between racism and nationalism.
post #28 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN View Post

Koh needs to learn the difference between racism and nationalism.

Eh? Koh isn't the one who played the race card.

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post #29 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN View Post

Koh needs to learn the difference between racism and nationalism.

 

I suspect you didn't read the article.

post #30 of 33

spamsandwich and hmmm.... Koh ruled on the Samsung objection and said 'race shouldn't be considered' where she should have flat out rejected the objection as saying that TVs aren't made in the USA anymore isn't a racist statement at all but it is a nationalistic statement.

post #31 of 33
Originally Posted by ICEx14 View Post
I love apple, but

 

Shut up.

 
…trying to stop a copycat because they are slowing losing their market share in smartphones. 

 

No, seriously, shut up.

 

Originally Posted by ICEx14 View Post
Yes, I do know and I understand why some people are angry, but my argument is that it happened and it's done.

 

"I raped your daughter. I don’t care that you’re angry. It happened, and it’s done. We all just need to move on.”

 

Did you seriously just say that nothing in the past should be punished because it already happened?! How stupid do you take us for? Honestly, answer both of those questions. 

 
Other companies have similar smartphones in the market and it is the "standard".

 

What is the “standard”, Apple’s design? NO. REALLY. WE WERE UNAWARE. GEE, I WONDER WHY THAT’S THE CASE, HUH.

 
Therefore, instead of trying to sue and block samsung products they need to take future measures to prevent this.

 

They took future measures. In 2007. It still happened. Now they are taking present measures to prevent future measures. How stupid do you think we are? How stupid do you want to present yourself here?

 
And again, I love apple and I buy the newest iPhone every year, in fact I replied with my iPhone 5s.

 

Just shut up and go away.

 

 

Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Apple Representative: F*ck you.

Samsung Representatative: F*ck you, also.

Apple Representative: Did you just Goddamn copy us AGAIN?

 

2 minutes later

 

Apple: Your honor, we–

Samsung: Your honor, we–

Apple: Okay, that’s really imma–

Samsung: Okay, that’s really imma–

Apple: We copied Apple.

Samsung: We copied Appl–HEY! Your honor! Your honor, they’re cheating!

 

Koh: 

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #32 of 33

So when are they going to sanction these lawyers and kick them off the case after the way they abused the justice system by releasing confidential information re license agreements?

 

The wheels of justice slowly turn and Samsung's lawyers are trying every trick under the sun.

 

If Samsung want's to push for a stay, Apple should push for everything they say to be stricken pending the outcome of the sanctions.

 

Time to pull the rug out from under Quinn Emanuel's feet.

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post #33 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

What a ridiculous argument for a "mistrial". There's nothing racial about that statement.

"Apple doesn't own beautiful and sexy," Price said. "What they're saying is, in the market, justice is just us."

Samsung's lawyers love these strawman, irrelevant, childish arguments that have nothing to do with the point.

I couldn't agree more.
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