or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Investors › AAPL Investors › Apple, Inc. stock breaks $545 barrier as Samsung calls 'Crisis Awareness' meeting
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple, Inc. stock breaks $545 barrier as Samsung calls 'Crisis Awareness' meeting - Page 4

post #121 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post

What I think is happening is Samsung is losing high end smartphones very rapidly after Apple released iPhone 5S.  For example, iPhone sales in Japan in October is a whooping 76%.  Japan is a very rich country.  Japanese certainly can afford high end smartphones.  Thus Japanese are very much exposed to Samsung Galaxy S4, S5, Note 2 and Note 3s.  Despite this fact, Japanese are moving to iPhones in droves.  This says there are some inherent problems of Androids that Samsung marketing and Google propaganda can not hide from the affluent consumers.

I think next some market research firm will try to separate high end smartphones into the report.  When this happens AAPL will probably hit all time high agains. 

I think it being a wealthier nation on average helps tremendously but I think the biggest contributing factor is the subsidization of the handsets. Even in wealthy countries if there is no subsidization the iPhone doesn't seem to do as well as in Japan or the US.

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply
post #122 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by bananaman View Post

chrome book??
y would any1 use that??
I meant google chrome.
you saw how it fit "net worth of Microsoft CEO Steve ballmer" after the $14 billion??
edit:apparently it's the net worth of mark zuckerburg as well.
edit2:zuckerburg is at 9.4 billion and ballmer is at 15.9 billion.
back to safari I go.

I tried google Chrome and hated it. I took it off my system and it took me a couple of days to figure out all of little tiny pieces of code it puts in various places in the OS, it's like baby written MS code if you ask me. I use safari and it works just fine! every once in a while I might use Firefox because some website that well written, but so far, I really don't have any problems with safari and it's plenty fast enough and actually works better for certain sites. There is just one or two features from Firefox I'd like to see in Safaria and that is with the Star button to manage bookmarks. That to me is a cool feature. But Chrome? Hated it.
post #123 of 180
Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
It's a guess; but likely the best REAL answer...

 

It’s a guess, but likely the best real answer: You’re incapable of reading the title.

post #124 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
 

 

I think Tim Cook did a wonderful thing while at Compaq.  As you know, Compaq was acquired by HP, and that's where he was prior to going to work with Apple.  Today, with the new space doughnut being built on land formally owned by HP, it will have a certain je ne sais quoi to it..!

Tim Cook only worked at Compaq for like 6 months as VP of Corporate Materials. for most large companies, that's about how long it takes to know where the bathrooms are.  That's not a long time with a company.  He was actually with IBM Personal Computer as Director of North American Fulfillment for 12 years.  That's plenty of time getting acclimated to a large corporation, knowing where the bathrooms are and really knowing the industry.

 

What's actually more to it was that Jobs had worked for HP, so that's where the "Je ne sais quoi" is coming from.  It's not Tim Cook, Tim never worked for HP.

post #125 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
 

It's a guess; but likely the best REAL answer...  My guess is that Apple is finally going to release Flash for the iPhone/iPad, now that they've managed to develop processors and chips that are fast enough for Flash.

 

That's the "Crisis Awareness Meeting" worth discussion.

 

LOL :)

 

Yeah.  Apple will adopt mobile Flash, what?  6-8 months after even Adobe announced they are ceasing support for it?  Are you serious?  I mean, really, where do get these ideas?  You're like the Glenn Beck of Apple theories.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
 

 

Boy, you seem real angry when you write.  Are all Apple shareholders terminally angry?  If so, you may need a new apple product or an app.  I'm usually correct about these types of things.  :-) 

 

Have a nice Thanksgiving!

 

Not angry at all.  Actually, I was laughing.  And I notice that you didn't respond to what I actually said.  Just to make it clear, in bullet point format:

 

Retail Stores, FY 2013

 

-- $4.5bn in revenue

-- $10.9m in revenue per store

-- 18.5k visitors per store PER WEEK

-- 412 stores

 

And these are just the numerical reasons supporting the success story that is Apple retail.  Do you really think -- REALLY believe for one second -- that Apple would (for whatever mystical reason you seem to be attached to) discard flagship retail locations like the 5th Avenue store, the Beijing location, etc.?

 

None of this is even addressing the importance of face-to-face contact with employees, the importance of things like One-to-One, Personal Pickup (which, btw, I just used recently to get my iPad Air on release day), Workshops, Personal Setup, Genius Bar, etc.

 

I am guessing that you've never actually been to an Apple Store.

post #126 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post
 

 

Just block "Malcolm Tucker". You'll be much happier when his posts don't appear in your thread view.

 

I know, I'm sure you're right.  I just couldn't resist, even if it's bad for my heart. :)

post #127 of 180
A common dart thrown by Samsung fanboys is that Apple is only successful be cause of its great marketing. GIven that, then SAmsung should be 10x the success of Apple because they spend 10x promoting their products.

And saarek observes "I'd hardly describe Samsung as a company in crisis. They essentially own the Android market .." So, if Samsung is so enamored with Android, why do they want to dump it for TIzen?
post #128 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by spider2465 View Post

Well I know a lot of people on here are Apple fans but I think it's funny when they insult Samsung's products that at the heart for their iproducts, runs a processor made by Samsung. I also think it's funny that people are so surprised by this considering that Samsung has payed Apple almost $1.3 billion because of all those ridiculous lawsuits.

The lawsuits are a drop in the bucket for Samsung.  Heck, their advertising budget wasted more than 10 times as much money as all the lawsuits combined.  The real problem is that the sales of all of their premium phones combined failed to meet their expectations for the S4 alone.

post #129 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cintos View Post

A common dart thrown by Samsung fanboys is that Apple is only successful be cause of its great marketing. GIven that, then SAmsung should be 10x the success of Apple because they spend 10x promoting their products.

And saarek observes "I'd hardly describe Samsung as a company in crisis. They essentially own the Android market .." So, if Samsung is so enamored with Android, why do they want to dump it for TIzen?

 

Apple has GREAT marketing.  They do.  But they don't need to spend gazillions on it.  They do it right, and thus it works.  

 

But more to the point, Apple makes quality, premium products and has a thriving ecosystem which supports those products.  As we all know, Apple doesn't produce many different products at all, and they only compete in a small segment of the market.  Apple can, thus, keep their focus quite narrow -- instead of throwing anything and everything against the wall in an attempt to see what sticks.

 

Samsung both does and does not own the Android market.  They do in the sense that, as far as I can tell, they are the only company actually making profits (at least profits of any significance) selling Android hardware.  Both Google and Amazon lose money on the hardware they sell, but make money through other avenues.  Companies like LG and HTC lose money.  And then there are the white box no-name companies -- I don't know what their business plan is, to be honest.

 

OTOH, Samsung doesn't own the Android market, in as far as most Android devices aren't Samsung, by a long shot.  They do, however, own the premium Android market, in much the same way that Apple owns the premium device market overall.

post #130 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by spider2465 View Post

Well I know a lot of people on here are Apple fans but I think it's funny when they insult Samsung's products that at the heart for their iproducts, runs a processor made by Samsung. I also think it's funny that people are so surprised by this considering that Samsung has payed Apple almost $1.3 billion because of all those ridiculous lawsuits.

 

As has been pointed out, Apple designs the Ax series of chips.  Samsung only fabs the chips because TSMC doesn't -- yet -- have their act together, quite.  Everything I've read recently seems to indicate that Apple will be moving to TSMC when possible.

 

And the "ridiculous lawsuits" go both ways.  Research it.  It's not a one-way street, by any stretch of the imagination.

post #131 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post
 

 

LOL :)

 

Yeah.  Apple will adopt mobile Flash, what?  6-8 months after even Adobe announced they are ceasing support for it?  Are you serious?  I mean, really, where do get these ideas?  You're like the Glenn Beck of Apple theories.

 

 

Not angry at all.  Actually, I was laughing.  And I notice that you didn't respond to what I actually said.  Just to make it clear, in bullet point format:

 

Retail Stores, FY 2013

 

-- $4.5bn in revenue

-- $10.9m in revenue per store

-- 18.5k visitors per store PER WEEK

-- 412 stores

 

And these are just the numerical reasons supporting the success story that is Apple retail.  Do you really think -- REALLY believe for one second -- that Apple would (for whatever mystical reason you seem to be attached to) discard flagship retail locations like the 5th Avenue store, the Beijing location, etc.?

 

None of this is even addressing the importance of face-to-face contact with employees, the importance of things like One-to-One, Personal Pickup (which, btw, I just used recently to get my iPad Air on release day), Workshops, Personal Setup, Genius Bar, etc.

 

I am guessing that you've never actually been to an Apple Store.

Judging by his completely ignorant statements, he's probably just sits in front of his Xbox and that's where he gets all of his information. Or he's still running XP and that filters out anything relevant to news over the past 8 years, so he's getting bad information from a long time ago that isn't relevant.  

post #132 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post
 

What I think is happening is Samsung is losing high end smartphones very rapidly after Apple released iPhone 5S.  For example, iPhone sales in Japan in October is a whooping 76%.  Japan is a very rich country.  Japanese certainly can afford high end smartphones.  Thus Japanese are very much exposed to Samsung Galaxy S4, S5, Note 2 and Note 3s.  Despite this fact, Japanese are moving to iPhones in droves.  This says there are some inherent problems of Androids that Samsung marketing and Google propaganda can not hide from the affluent consumers.

 

I think next some market research firm will try to separate high end smartphones into the report.  When this happens AAPL will probably hit all time high agains. 

 

There doesn't seem to be any evidence to support your hypothesis.  If Counterpoint Research has it right, it's Japanese smartphone makers who are hurt the most by Apple's new iPhones.  Samsung's overall sales/marketshare in Japan was never that significant to warrant a "crisis awareness meeting."  

 

 

post #133 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tooltalk View Post

There doesn't seem to be any evidence to support your hypothesis.  If Counterpoint Research has it right, it's Japanese smartphone makers who are hurt the most by Apple's new iPhones.  Samsung's overall sales/marketshare in Japan was never that significant to warrant a "crisis awareness meeting."  

[image]

Losing 1/3 of your marketshare since June is a very significant.

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply
post #134 of 180

Tim Cook has ran Apple like any PC hardware maker has which is pushing incremental updates down the chain and forcing customers and businesses to subscribe to their hardware.

 

There really aren't much innovations left at Apple because every year we're only seeing refinements and fixes that already existed in the industry.

 

The Apple showcases are so corporate is Apple the "different" technology company anymore?  

 

When you listen to Tim Cook talk in interviews, all he talks about is how they are meeting sales goals and playing down criticisms while offering zero insights to what Apple's vision of the future is going to be.  

 

Every Apple product these days is so one-size fit all mindset is very uninspiring for forward thinking technology users.

post #135 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Losing 1/3 of your marketshare since June is a very significant.

 

Sure, the S4 was released and its sales peaked in June quarter, but there has been virtually no change since May.  Apple frequently records significant QoQ sales drop after new iPhone is released.  For instance, after the 4S release in 1Q 2012, the iPhone sales plummeted by -5.34% and -25.77 the next two quarters; again by -21.75% (2Q 2013)  and -16.04% (3Q 2013)  after the 5 release in 4Q 2012, 

 

Samsung reportedly sold some 1 million Galaxy lines in Japan -- that's a teeny weeny fraction of their overall Galaxy sales.  Samsung isn't going to lose any sleep over it. 


Edited by tooltalk - 11/29/13 at 5:10am
post #136 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision33r View Post
 

Tim Cook has ran Apple like any PC hardware maker has which is pushing incremental updates down the chain and forcing customers and businesses to subscribe to their hardware.

 

There really aren't much innovations left at Apple because every year we're only seeing refinements and fixes that already existed in the industry.

 

The Apple showcases are so corporate is Apple the "different" technology company anymore?  

 

When you listen to Tim Cook talk in interviews, all he talks about is how they are meeting sales goals and playing down criticisms while offering zero insights to what Apple's vision of the future is going to be.  

 

Every Apple product these days is so one-size fit all mindset is very uninspiring for forward thinking technology users.

How old are you?  Do you have a college degree in business?  What's your work experience?  What's your experience working in the corporate world?

You sound like someone that doesn't know how things work.

 

Why don't you give me a couple of specific examples rather than generalities, you almost sound like someone without any validity to your statements. And when you explain how Apple does things, explain how each of the others do it.  Maybe I can shed some light to explain things to you.  Some people come from the PC crowd and they don't get it.  Some have to have Apple and their mentality explained so it makes sense.  At least, if you are open minded about it.  If you have a valid point, I will agree with you, but until you give specifics, then I really don't want to guess as to what you are talking about.

 

What does a forward thinking technology person look at?  Explain.  Making generalized statements without anything to back them up makes you look evasive, which doesn't lead to credibility.  So, please explain.  In detail and use specifics and how a forward thinking technology user would do things differently.

post #137 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision33r View Post
 

Tim Cook has ran Apple like any PC hardware maker has which is pushing incremental updates down the chain and forcing customers and businesses to subscribe to their hardware.

 

There really aren't much innovations left at Apple because every year we're only seeing refinements and fixes that already existed in the industry.

 

The Apple showcases are so corporate is Apple the "different" technology company anymore?  

 

When you listen to Tim Cook talk in interviews, all he talks about is how they are meeting sales goals and playing down criticisms while offering zero insights to what Apple's vision of the future is going to be.  

 

Every Apple product these days is so one-size fit all mindset is very uninspiring for forward thinking technology users.

1.  Tim Cook is running Apple pretty much the way they've been running the company when it was under Jobs and others.  they make their own hardware, OS, apps, etc. and they design it to work together as well as they can with other products they make.  When a company comes out with a new and successful product like the iPad or the iPhone, etc.  they always come out with incremental enhancements to further improve the initial product and along the way it gets case redesigns.  And?  They've always done that.

 

What and how would you want them to do things differently that will also keep their profit margins intact.  Think it through, because they get scrutinized by the media all of the time when they don't hit their margins.  So, instead of just making broad BS, what would you do if you were Tim Cook.  Remember, if you come up with stupid ideas, you would be fired.  Obviously, you don't have his job and you never will know what it feels like to be in his shoes.  But I assure you, he's doing quite well in certain areas.   he obviously hasn't needed to sell the company, lay off tens of thousands of people, resign, or have a "crisis awareness' meeting with hundreds of employees or had to write down $1Billion because of too much inventory of product bombing.

post #138 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision33r View Post
 

Tim Cook has ran Apple like any PC hardware maker has which is pushing incremental updates down the chain and forcing customers and businesses to subscribe to their hardware.

 

There really aren't much innovations left at Apple because every year we're only seeing refinements and fixes that already existed in the industry.

 

The Apple showcases are so corporate is Apple the "different" technology company anymore?  

 

When you listen to Tim Cook talk in interviews, all he talks about is how they are meeting sales goals and playing down criticisms while offering zero insights to what Apple's vision of the future is going to be.  

 

Every Apple product these days is so one-size fit all mindset is very uninspiring for forward thinking technology users.

Here is a list of the things that the PC and Android mfg have done over the past few years that Apple hasn't.

 

1.  Write down $1 Billion because of a product bombing.

2.  Resign due to lousy profits and sales.

3.  Have a "crisis awareness" meeting with several hundred employees.

4.  Get stuck owing a company they copied $1 Billion.

5.  Had to start selling 3 different platforms of Operating Systems (Android, Windows, Chromebooks) just to get sales because the way they've been doing business doesn't work.

6.   Take the company private and ask others to help fund it because the financials SUCK.

7.  Had to exit a growing market.  There have actually been companies that dropped selling Android products recently. NEC was one of them.

8.  Huge financial losses. 

9.  Layoff tens of thousands of employees due to crappy sales, huge write downs from overpaying for other companies.

10.  Discontinuing a product within a couple of weeks after the product was announced.

11.  Sell or try to sell off the company due to poor sales/profits as they needed to get out of the business.

12.  Selling a computer platform that only gets 1% of the market in terms of sales, yet has almost every major PC mfg offering these products.

 

All of the above things have been done by a variety of different companies over the past 10 years.  here's a list of the companies that have been guilty of one or more of the above circumstances.

 

HP, Microsoft, Compaq, IBM, Dell, Fujitsu, Samsung, Google, NEC, Acer, ASUS, and there are others, but these are the biggies off the top of my head.

 

And what was it that you were trying to say?

post #139 of 180

I know this is off topic, but how many of the Google Glass people that wasted their money on them actually STILL use them daily?  I've heard a peep from anyone talking about long term usage or have seen any recent rumblings from Sergy Brin on his little Glass project.  Whatever happened to that overhyped POS anyway? And how come we don't see Eric Schmidt and Larry Page waltzing around with those things on their heads?  Don't they eat their own dog food? Apparently not.  Maybe they don't want to look stupid or mess up their eyesight.

post #140 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Losing 1/3 of your marketshare since June is a very significant.

Obviously, you don't know how Apple sales and product announcement coincide and how Samsung's product announcements and sales coincide.

 

What REALLY happened was building up pent up demand as people started holding off on purchases because there's a ton of product information regarding the next major product release.  And Apple outdid their previous year's weekend product release in terms of sales.  So, when has Samsung had record first weekend sales like Apple?  Anyone else for that matter.


Seriously, you obviously don't know how to analyze product releases and sales very well.  Sounds like you bought into the Samsung/Android hype and how much sales has Android lost in Japan recently?    I hope Apple releases their larger screen iPhone in June/July and we'll see what REALLY happens. Oh, and we'll see what happens when Apple finally signs on China Mobile.  People such as yourself are probably going to resort to hiding in shame one these things happen and you see the sales results.  But, the bottom line is, how much profit did the Android platform make?  They made about as much as Apple, COMBINED.  

 

It's going to be REAL embarrassing when Apple finally ships their large screen phone and signs China Mobile.  

post #141 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cintos View Post


And saarek observes "I'd hardly describe Samsung as a company in crisis. They essentially own the Android market .." So, if Samsung is so enamored with Android, why do they want to dump it for TIzen?

 

 

android sucks.
post #142 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tooltalk View Post
 

 

Sure, the S4 was released and its sales peaked in June quarter, but there has been virtually no change since May.  Apple frequently records significant QoQ sales drop after new iPhone is released.  For instance, after the 4S release in 1Q 2012, the iPhone sales plummeted by -5.34% and -25.77 the next two quarters; again by -21.75% (2Q 2013)  and -16.04% (3Q 2013)  after the 5 release in 4Q 2012, 

 

Samsung reportedly sold some 1 million Galaxy lines in Japan -- that's a teeny weeny fraction of their overall Galaxy sales.  Samsung isn't going to lose any sleep over it. 

Apple has their iPhone releases in the last month of the quarter and they usually have to wait a little until they ship and they only have so much they can produce and ship during basically a two week period.  When does Samsung announce the product and ship the product?  Samsung announced the S4 in April, which is the beginning of the quarter and then ships in May, which still has well over a month, almost 2 months of sales for that quarter and Apple usually has a couple of weeks at the tail end.  Why does Apple do this?  First off, Sept is a bad quarter anyway, and then they have a spike in sales, for over 2 more quarters.

 

It's WHEN Apple releases product.  See Apple always has their best quarter in Dec and then in the March quarter, then the June/Sept are progressively their worst quarters.  It's been like that for well over a decade, maybe even since the beginning.  I haven't tracked Apple sales in that way, but I'm sure if you got a hold of their data, it's a definite cycle.  Some companies are structured differently.  Samsung, makes appliances, components, and other unrelated things, so they are more of a conglomerate rather than a computer company.  Samsung also doesn't sell nearly as much of their so-called Flagship model on a yearly basis than Apple sells of their flagship model on a year to year basis.

 

Apple releases at the end of a quarter, so they only have 2 weeks out of a full quarter of sales of the new product and then each year, they've always has better first weekend of the product announcement.  How many iPhones did they sell the first weekend?  9 Million?  How many last year?  5 Million? And the year before? 

 

It's all about timing of the product release, how many weeks during that announcement quarter.  But every year, sales drop during the quarter leading up to the product announcement, and then they ramp up production to meet demand, and then it takes about a quarter to meet demand, and then it cruises for a quarter or so, then then it starts slowing down for the next major release.


for some reason, it would not surprise me if they have to now flip flop their 4inch (which is the best selling screen size BTW) and a newer larger screen size model every six months.    Apple couldn't release a 4inch iPhone and a 5inch(or somewhere in that size range) at the same time.  They just simply can't make enough.   Many people actually prefer the 4inch size because they don't want a larger screen size  But some of us do, so it will be interesting to see the actual sales once Apple releases a larger screen size.

 

 But the iPhone 5S will outsell the iPhone 5, which will outsell the iPhone 4S, which outsold the iPhone 4, etc. over the life of the product, but I would lump iPhone 5 and the 5C as the same phone, even though they are slightly different on the outside, the guts are practically identical.

post #143 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
 


Well, subscribing to Group-Think concepts is a great way to address alternative points of views!

First thing, know the subject before you make a statement. Then bring up valid reasons to back up your statement.  Have you ever gone to college and taken a critical thinking course?  If not, then maybe you should.  A lot of the things you are posting really show not much expertise in the subject matter for which you are commenting on.

 

I'm all for different points of view, as long as they have some validity to them.

 

I've never thought that Apple was always perfect in everything they do, there isn't too many companies that make 100% perfect products.   I know of some companies that make great products that are as close to perfect as possible, but they haven't changed the actual product almost since the beginning of the introduction.   But in the computer industry, it's just a fast paced industry with ever changing needs/wants by the consumer base, that it's hard to consistently come up with good products that are "hits".  Apple has been quite good at producing very little dogs in their product line.  The PC industry is riddled with dog products and a LOT of "me too" products where it's just the same thing over and over.  So, I don't know what company you think is overall better.  Especially when you factor in every aspect of the company product range, how the company supports the product, financial statements of the company, etc. etc.  If you just don't want to use Apple products, you are entitled to that, but don't put Apple down if you don't use their products because OBVIOUSLY, they didn't go from almost being bankrupt to being one of the most profitable and most valuable companies in the world within about a decade for no reason.  People have to respect that.  They are at least doing what they can for increasing the jobs throughout the world.  Not just in China, but they've created a LOT of jobs in the US that seemingly go unnoticed from their vendors, and definitely the shipping companies.  

post #144 of 180

Samsung is doomed.

post #145 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogJack View Post
 

Samsung is doomed.

I think Samsung needs to change their way of doing business.  I think they make too many different models of smartphones.  I wish they would get out of the finished goods aspect and just be a really good component supplier and quit trying to control the entire industry by doing both.

post #146 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

I think Samsung needs to change their way of doing business.  I think they make too many different models of smartphones.  I wish they would get out of the finished goods aspect and just be a really good component supplier and quit trying to control the entire industry by doing both.

While I wholeheartedly agree, it's hard to argue with results. Making a multitude of devices has seemingly made them successful.
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
post #147 of 180
Originally Posted by Vision33r View Post
Tim Cook has ran Apple like any PC hardware maker has which is pushing incremental updates down the chain and forcing customers and businesses to subscribe to their hardware.

 

There really aren't much innovations left at Apple because every year we're only seeing refinements and fixes that already existed in the industry.

 

The Apple showcases are so corporate is Apple the "different" technology company anymore?  

 

When you listen to Tim Cook talk in interviews, all he talks about is how they are meeting sales goals and playing down criticisms while offering zero insights to what Apple's vision of the future is going to be.  

 

Every Apple product these days is so one-size fit all mindset is very uninspiring for forward thinking technology users.

 

Just shut up. It’s too early, it’s too late, and it’s too midday to put up with this frippery. When you want to make a post where every single sentence isn’t a lie, feel free to post again. Until then…

post #148 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

I think Samsung needs to change their way of doing business.  I think they make too many different models of smartphones.  I wish they would get out of the finished goods aspect and just be a really good component supplier and quit trying to control the entire industry by doing both.

 

Well, as I said before, AFAIK they're the only ones making a profit off of Android hardware.  So, I'm not sure they need to change anything.  

post #149 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tooltalk View Post
 

 

Sure, the S4 was released and its sales peaked in June quarter, but there has been virtually no change since May.  Apple frequently records significant QoQ sales drop after new iPhone is released.  For instance, after the 4S release in 1Q 2012, the iPhone sales plummeted by -5.34% and -25.77 the next two quarters; again by -21.75% (2Q 2013)  and -16.04% (3Q 2013)  after the 5 release in 4Q 2012, 

 

Samsung reportedly sold some 1 million Galaxy lines in Japan -- that's a teeny weeny fraction of their overall Galaxy sales.  Samsung isn't going to lose any sleep over it. 

Where are you getting your iPhone sale figure from?   Here's the total number of iPhone sales, by quarter since the inception of the iPhone.  If you take the data and create a chart, it will have a seesaw effect. It's kind of peaking as of last quarter, but we have to see how well they do in this quarter which is historically their best quarter. I will be the first to agree that Apple needs to kick out a larger line of iPhones to help increase unit sales, gross rev/profits, etc.  but they will also increase these numbers significantly once they get China Mobile lined up AND can actually get their production levels to meet demand so they don't have a 2 to 3 week lead time.  I think they are at the 500 thousand units a day production levels that's running 24/7, but they have to increase that number to meet the next wave of demand from the larger screen phone AND adding China Mobile to the carrier list.

 

Q3 2007  270,000
Q4 2007  1,190,000
Q1 2008  2,315,000
Q2 2008  1,703,000
Q3 2008  717,000
Q4 2008  6,890,000
Q1 2009  4,363,000
Q2 2009  3,793,000
Q3 2009  5,208,000
Q4 2009  7,367,000
Q1 2010  8,373,000
Q2 2010  8,752,000
Q3 2010  8,398,000
Q4 2010  14,102,000
Q1 2011  16,240,000
Q2 2011  18,650,000
Q3 2011  20,340,000
Q4 2011  17,070,000
Q1 2012  37,044,000
Q2 2012  35,100,000
Q3 2012  26,030,000
Q4 2012  21,849,600
Q1 2013  47,800,000
Q2 2013  45,000,000
Q3 2013  33,800,000

 

 

Right now, they are at 500K a day, so that's about 45MIllion per quarter if they cranked phones out 360 days a year (they have to give them at least 5 days a year for holidays).  That's about 180 Million a year at current capacity.  Now, if  the last 4 quarters they did 148+ Million Units.

So, it's conceivable that they might be able to kick up to 180 Million units over the next 12 months, especially if they kick in China Mobile AND a 5inch model.  I'm sure they will add more production lines during the next 12 months.

 

It's just going to be interesting to see if they can actually sell more than 47.8Million units this quarter since their production level is around 45MIllion (yeah, this quarter has a couple of major holidays in it) where the physical stores (Apple and resellers) are shut down for sales.


Edited by drblank - 11/29/13 at 9:30am
post #150 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

They won't ever get it. Not with a 4 day meeting, not with 600 managers, not by spending $14B on ads. It's simply not in their DNA.

But they're not doing bad. They have their insurance, shipping and other branches doing very well. and SE will simply continue to pump out stuff for people that think they are better off. This won't ever change, and that's probably a good thing.

Maybe not, but they also seem to be the only company that is actually trying to figure out how and why Apple has the following it has. That as unique among Android-based vendors as Apple is among smartphone vendors.


True. I don't understand why they don't follow up on their Bada efforts. They might have a shot at replicating Apple by creating both the software and hardware. This will require for them to rethink the way they have been working and not pimp-up the hardware so much with everything that could be added, but only add things that make sense or are truly useful.

Perhaps a custom version of Tizen, if that is allowed. And only IF that is a viable option. There was a summit in Korea, just two weeks ago, or so their homepage tells me.
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
Reply
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
Reply
post #151 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post
 

 

Well, as I said before, AFAIK they're the only ones making a profit off of Android hardware.  So, I'm not sure they need to change anything.  

It depends on how they want to run their business. If you look at their entire catalog of smart phones, they make a LOT of dog products that probably lose money, run outdated OS (like Gingerbread/ICS) and are just not profitable junk.   It might hurt their gross sales and market share, but they might actually be able to retain more profits.   The only reasons why they actually make a somewhat decent Net Profit is they don't put as much effort into supporting their products.

 

Take a look at what they do, they don't really design the Android OS, and they don't really do anything to update the OS on older model phones other than MAYBE the S series.

 

How many of their phones are actually running 4.2.2?  I think maybe only a couple, most are running much older OS versions. That's kind of chicken $hit if you ask me.  That shows no pride in what they do.  That's what sucks about the OEM Android smart phone industry as a whole,  It's like passing a bad penny around acting like it's gold when it isn't.  They don't really develop anything in the area of decent apps.  All they do is packaging different processors, screen sizes in different cases and spitting them out at different price points, but it would be interesting to find out which products of their actually have REASONABLE profit margins.  I don't know how they can sell a phone with a $150 MSRP and make a decent amount of net profit after you factor in returns, defective product, and support costs. Is it worth being in that market segment just to "buy" market share?  That's why most every PC company can't make any decent profits.  The only thing that's saving Samsung is that they mfg components.    But I would think that they should start getting rid of products that lose money and slim down their product line to what sells and makes a decent profit and get off of this market share BS.   It really makes the company look more schlocky if you look at their entire product line.


Think of it this way, what happens when you walk into a car dealership, do you want to see a bunch of brand new cars that are essentially 4 year old models?  Or do you want to see only the latest and greatest models from a wide range of categories?  At least Apple sells brand new product where they actually run the latest version OS.  But they won't sell a computer or iDevice that can't run the latest OS, Apple would be chastised by everyone if they did.  So why do so many people allow Samsung and other Android device mfg to get away with that practice?  I don't understand why the media is so lenient about that practice.  To me, that's the main reason why I don't do OEM Android, that's unacceptable.  Even Microsoft would get ridiculed to no end if they sold products that actually didn't or couldn't run the latest OS.  Imagine walking into a store and buying a brand new unit that ran XP on it and the unit couldn't run Windows 8 or even Windows 7.  Most intelligent people would think that the company that does that is STUPID.

post #152 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

True. I don't understand why they don't follow up on their Bada efforts. They might have a shot at replicating Apple by creating both the software and hardware. This will require for them to rethink the way they have been working and not pimp-up the hardware so much with everything that could be added, but only add things that make sense or are truly useful.

Perhaps a custom version of Tizen, if that is allowed. And only IF that is a viable option. There was a summit in Korea, just two weeks ago, or so their homepage tells me.

I'm not the person to ask on that front. I don't know what they don't seem to be evolving Bada faster, why HP bought Palm just to can it, why Dell, Compaq, etc. all didn't slowly evolve a great OS knowing that longterm with Windows would ruin them.

Well, let me take that back regarding Samsung. Samsung could theoretically evolve Android and then fork it so it's a licensed or private OS the way Bada and iOS are, respectively. With an Android-based OS Samsung can let Google do all the heavy lifting — we know they like others to do all the real work — and then put their own final touches on it, which include not including Google's licensed apps. This would actually be legal (which may be why it doesn't sit well with Samsung 1biggrin.gif).

They are also in a prime position to copy Apple's curated App Store model and create a better SDK that is Samsung specific. They already have APIs for their Note product line for the digitizer. This could theoretically give Samsung the best of both worlds by allowing any and all Google Play apps on their "Samdroid" OS which gives them a rich app environment from the start, but also offer higher quality apps similar to how Apple's App Store and SDK work. No one else is in the position to make this move.

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply

This bot has been removed from circulation due to a malfunctioning morality chip.

Reply
post #153 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

It depends on how they want to run their business. If you look at their entire catalog of smart phones, they make a LOT of dog products that probably lose money, run outdated OS (like Gingerbread/ICS) and are just not profitable junk.   It might hurt their gross sales and market share, but they might actually be able to retain more profits.   The only reasons why they actually make a somewhat decent Net Profit is they don't put as much effort into supporting their products.

 

Take a look at what they do, they don't really design the Android OS, and they don't really do anything to update the OS on older model phones other than MAYBE the S series.

 

How many of their phones are actually running 4.2.2?  I think maybe only a couple, most are running much older OS versions. That's kind of chicken $hit if you ask me.  That shows no pride in what they do.  That's what sucks about the OEM Android smart phone industry as a whole,  It's like passing a bad penny around acting like it's gold when it isn't.  They don't really develop anything in the area of decent apps.  All they do is packaging different processors, screen sizes in different cases and spitting them out at different price points, but it would be interesting to find out which products of their actually have REASONABLE profit margins.  I don't know how they can sell a phone with a $150 MSRP and make a decent amount of net profit after you factor in returns, defective product, and support costs. Is it worth being in that market segment just to "buy" market share?  That's why most every PC company can't make any decent profits.  The only thing that's saving Samsung is that they mfg components.    But I would think that they should start getting rid of products that lose money and slim down their product line to what sells and makes a decent profit and get off of this market share BS.   It really makes the company look more schlocky if you look at their entire product line.


Think of it this way, what happens when you walk into a car dealership, do you want to see a bunch of brand new cars that are essentially 4 year old models?  Or do you want to see only the latest and greatest models from a wide range of categories?  At least Apple sells brand new product where they actually run the latest version OS.  But they won't sell a computer or iDevice that can't run the latest OS, Apple would be chastised by everyone if they did.  So why do so many people allow Samsung and other Android device mfg to get away with that practice?  I don't understand why the media is so lenient about that practice.  To me, that's the main reason why I don't do OEM Android, that's unacceptable.  Even Microsoft would get ridiculed to no end if they sold products that actually didn't or couldn't run the latest OS.  Imagine walking into a store and buying a brand new unit that ran XP on it and the unit couldn't run Windows 8 or even Windows 7.  Most intelligent people would think that the company that does that is STUPID.

 

I agree with nearly everything you said here.

 

Samsung may actually make tiny profits on the junk phones they sell, I don't know.  But their goal to seems to be to flood the market at any cost, as you basically said.  Actually, that's Google's plan with Android as a whole, if you think about it.  All Google wants is any (premium or piece of shit -- doesn't matter) device running Android so that they can get advertising returns.  So, I guess it's no surprise that Samsung is basically following the Android business model for now.

 

As to the press, I think it's fairly obvious to any of us here that the general press doesn't understand tech AT ALL.  They don't understand the underlying technology involved, they don't understand the business of tech, they don't understand how things develop and change -- they just don't understand any of it.  And let's face it:  You're never going to see a story that actually explains (let alone calls them on it) OS fragmentation among Android devices on something like the Today Show.  One, I'm not sure they have anyone who actually understands the issue, and Two, it wouldn't fit into one of their 3-5 minute segments.

 

I mean, I have no problem in general with Samsung -- the uber-Samsung company.  I have both a Samsung HDTV and a Samsung Blu-Ray.  And when I replace the HDTV -- it seems to be showing its age a bit, and I'd like to move up in size -- I would consider a Samsung as a replacement.  OTOH, you couldn't pay me to buy one of their mobile devices.

post #154 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Samsung could theoretically evolve Android and then fork it so it's a licensed or private OS the way Bada and iOS are, respectively. With an Android-based OS Samsung can let Google do all the heavy lifting — we know they like others to do all the real work — and then put their own final touches on it, which include not including Google's licensed apps. This would actually be legal (which may be why it doesn't sit well with Samsung 1biggrin.gif).

Classic already: "...which include not including Google's licensed apps"

They will need to create an incentive for developers to put their apps on the All Apps from Samsung (A.S.S.)
Quote:
They are also in a prime position to copy Apple's curated App Store model and create a better SDK that is Samsung specific. They already have APIs for their Note product line for the digitizer. This could theoretically give Samsung the best of both worlds by allowing any and all Google Play apps on their "Samdroid" OS which gives them a rich app environment from the start, but also offer higher quality apps similar to how Apple's App Store and SDK work. No one else is in the position to make this move.

Well, I'll believe it when I see it. I agree that from all the companies out there, Samsung seems to be in the best position. But if this Korean thinking and business approach of theirs' is anything to go by I also don't see them doing anything sensible, anything innovative.

Yes yes, that is a negative view on their MO, but looking at past endeavours...oh well, I might be surprised after this 'crisis meeting' though I don't think we'll see any changes soon. In 12 months time, perhaps.
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
Reply
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
Reply
post #155 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post
 

 

I agree with nearly everything you said here.

 

Samsung may actually make tiny profits on the junk phones they sell, I don't know.  But their goal to seems to be to flood the market at any cost, as you basically said.  Actually, that's Google's plan with Android as a whole, if you think about it.  All Google wants is any (premium or piece of shit -- doesn't matter) device running Android so that they can get advertising returns.  So, I guess it's no surprise that Samsung is basically following the Android business model for now.

 

As to the press, I think it's fairly obvious to any of us here that the general press doesn't understand tech AT ALL.  They don't understand the underlying technology involved, they don't understand the business of tech, they don't understand how things develop and change -- they just don't understand any of it.  And let's face it:  You're never going to see a story that actually explains (let alone calls them on it) OS fragmentation among Android devices on something like the Today Show.  One, I'm not sure they have anyone who actually understands the issue, and Two, it wouldn't fit into one of their 3-5 minute segments.

 

I mean, I have no problem in general with Samsung -- the uber-Samsung company.  I have both a Samsung HDTV and a Samsung Blu-Ray.  And when I replace the HDTV -- it seems to be showing its age a bit, and I'd like to move up in size -- I would consider a Samsung as a replacement.  OTOH, you couldn't pay me to buy one of their mobile devices.

Well, in order to fully understand an industry, it's best if you have a finance background so you can analyze the numbers, but also have been in the industry knowing what's really going on and not listening to the media all of the time and looking at REAL numbers that are meaningful and not based on some stupid survey.  Some surveys that have been conducted didn't have very good sample sizes, asking good questions and some of the metrics floating around are improperly used in the media.  As a whole, I find very few journalists that actually discuss numbers they have properly, they seem to gloss over important factors to consider.

 

Yeah, I agree Apple needs to kick down a larger screen model.  Not just because I want one for my next phone, it's because that market has defitinitely shown pver the past year that it's worthwhile going after.  I'm still not convinced the 5.5 to 6inch models will sell much more than 12 million units a year since that's basically how many they are selling.   I don't know if Apple wants to approach that line just yet.  I think the 5inch or thereabouts is definitely worth going after, but they have to increase their capacities as running at 500,000 units a day 24/7 isn't enough capacity to handle another two flagship lines, plus the additional demand stemming from China Mobile and other carriers they haven't yet added to the list.

 

Apple STILL isn't being sold in some countries and by all carriers because they can't meet the demand for everyone when they do a product release, they STILL have to roll out the product in a phased approach.   If Apple rolled out their product to their entire carrier list, with unlocked versions and added China Mobile, they wouldn't do 9 million units in the first weekend of a major product announcement, they would do more like 12 to 15 million units in the first weekend, maybe even more.  I think Apple has to kick up their max production levels to be able to handle more like 750,000 units a day 24/7 within a year.  That's still a LOT OF freaking phones.  If you think about it, Apple is maxed out production wise, which is why they have to add more assembly plants with other outsource companies, so Foxconn is having difficulties catching up.

 

It might have actually been a smart move if Apple bought Nokia for not only their IP, but mfg capabilities, since it would take them about a year to can their product line and turn them on to do new models as the market demands.  God, would that have pissed Ballmer off if they did that. Ballmer would have turned beet red, steam coming out his ears and head while his brain oozed out from a total melt down.  I would have LOVED to have seen that. If nothing else, that would have been funny.

post #156 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
 

Well, in order to fully understand an industry, it's best if you have a finance background so you can analyze the numbers, but also have been in the industry knowing what's really going on and not listening to the media all of the time and looking at REAL numbers that are meaningful and not based on some stupid survey.  Some surveys that have been conducted didn't have very good sample sizes, asking good questions and some of the metrics floating around are improperly used in the media.  As a whole, I find very few journalists that actually discuss numbers they have properly, they seem to gloss over important factors to consider.

 

Yeah, I agree Apple needs to kick down a larger screen model.  Not just because I want one for my next phone, it's because that market has defitinitely shown pver the past year that it's worthwhile going after.  I'm still not convinced the 5.5 to 6inch models will sell much more than 12 million units a year since that's basically how many they are selling.   I don't know if Apple wants to approach that line just yet.  I think the 5inch or thereabouts is definitely worth going after, but they have to increase their capacities as running at 500,000 units a day 24/7 isn't enough capacity to handle another two flagship lines, plus the additional demand stemming from China Mobile and other carriers they haven't yet added to the list.

 

Apple STILL isn't being sold in some countries and by all carriers because they can't meet the demand for everyone when they do a product release, they STILL have to roll out the product in a phased approach.   If Apple rolled out their product to their entire carrier list, with unlocked versions and added China Mobile, they wouldn't do 9 million units in the first weekend of a major product announcement, they would do more like 12 to 15 million units in the first weekend, maybe even more.  I think Apple has to kick up their max production levels to be able to handle more like 750,000 units a day 24/7 within a year.  That's still a LOT OF freaking phones.  If you think about it, Apple is maxed out production wise, which is why they have to add more assembly plants with other outsource companies, so Foxconn is having difficulties catching up.

 

It might have actually been a smart move if Apple bought Nokia for not only their IP, but mfg capabilities, since it would take them about a year to can their product line and turn them on to do new models as the market demands.  God, would that have pissed Ballmer off if they did that. Ballmer would have turned beet red, steam coming out his ears and head while his brain oozed out from a total melt down.  I would have LOVED to have seen that. If nothing else, that would have been funny.

 

Yes.  Yes it would have been hilarious. :)

 

As to a larger phone, I don't really care.  I know it's a near certainty.  And I also know that I probably won't like it.  But there's no point in complaining about something that is going to happen, no matter what I do.  I mean, it was 19F this morning.  What's the point of complaining about it?  It doesn't make it any warmer.

 

*shrug*

 

It would be great if they could keep both sizes as flagship models, but I understand what you're saying about the logistical problems inherent with that.

post #157 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post
 

 

Yes.  Yes it would have been hilarious. :)

 

As to a larger phone, I don't really care.  I know it's a near certainty.  And I also know that I probably won't like it.  But there's no point in complaining about something that is going to happen, no matter what I do.  I mean, it was 19F this morning.  What's the point of complaining about it?  It doesn't make it any warmer.

 

*shrug*

 

It would be great if they could keep both sizes as flagship models, but I understand what you're saying about the logistical problems inherent with that.

I think they'll probably call the new flagship possibly an iPhone 6 and then maybe a 4inch version and call it a iPhone6S or something silly to designate a different screen size and then either a iPhone 6C or IPhone 6SC for a polycarb version.  Or the iPhone Air and a iPhoneX, etc..  I'm sure their marketing department that's in charge of their naming conventions probably has lots of heated discussions as to what the call these things....

 

It's almost like we know what they are going to do, but sometimes they do things differently just to keep us on our toes. 

 

LOL.

post #158 of 180
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
call the new flagship possibly an iPhone 6 and then maybe a 4inch version and call it a iPhone6S or something silly to designate a different screen size and then either a iPhone 6C or IPhone 6SC for a polycarb version.

 

My “these names cannot possibly work” senses are tingling.

post #159 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

My “these names cannot possibly work” senses are tingling.

How about this naming convention for next year?

 

6 inch Model IPhone Pro

5 inch Model iPhone Air

4 Inch Model IPhone Mini

 

Poly carb versions will just have a "C" at the end of which ever models they decide to do a policarb version and maybe they'll just do a iPhone 5SC when they release the direct replacement for the iPhone 5S. and then the iPhone 5C will then replace the iPhone 4S.

post #160 of 180
Originally Posted by drblank View Post
How about this naming convention for next year?

 

6 inch Model IPhone Pro

5 inch Model iPhone Air

4 Inch Model IPhone Mini

 

I hate it.


The names make perfect sense given the scenario, and they’re exactly what I would choose. I just hate the scenario. :lol:

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: AAPL Investors
AppleInsider › Forums › Investors › AAPL Investors › Apple, Inc. stock breaks $545 barrier as Samsung calls 'Crisis Awareness' meeting