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Rumor: LG hopes to catch up to Apple with fingerprint sensor in next-gen Android phone - Page 2

post #41 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post


This is, of course, ludicrous. A 64 bit architecture offers 64 bit address buses, data buses and registers which provide independently verifiable, significant performance improvements.

Don't forget the new ISA which by itself is better suited for Obj-C but also has modern benefits that all OSes can benefit from.

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post #42 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by leavingthebigG View Post

A retina scan is supposed to be more secure than a fingerprint scan.

History will let us all know if the retina scanner feature is more secure and useful than Touch ID.

 

The biggest benefit to a retina scan versus a fingerprint scan is that you don't leave your retina pattern on everything you look at, while you do leave your fingerprint on most things that you touch.

 

The biggest drawback to a retina scan versus a fingerprint scan is that it is harder to acquire in a small volume. Something which is necessary for usage on a mobile device. I personally hope that someone can pull it off. It would be great to have both on smartphones. Retina would be more secure for financial transactions, while fingerprint is more flexible. Could you imagine trying to unlock a phone with a retina scan while walking? I can see the lawsuits now. "I walked into a pole while trying to unlock my phone because it obscured my vision."

post #43 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


If my wife can do it anyone can. 1biggrin.gif. She has not had any problems whatsoever. My guess is your initial set up wasn't done quite right.

My GF is the same way. Although, she has always liked my Apple gear, iMac, MacBook, ATV, iPad, iPhone(s), Siri, iLife, Mail, iWork, etc., but she is not tech savvy in the least. And was reluctant to get an iPhone b/c of the cost of a plan. Her Sprint $45/mo vs. $100/mo for the iPhone.

 

We just got her a 5c (blue) and an iPad for Xmas. I told her, watching her use these for the first few days was like watching a baby take its first steps! :) But she has really embraced them and thinks I'm a genius. (Thx, SJ!)

 

The other day, she said she has the best phone, the best tablet and the best car all b/c of me! Ahhh! :) We just got her a Prius C (White, of course) and yes it has an Apple sticker on the back! Her license plate is LV53MPG. Yes, I had to help her order the plate! :)

 

P.S. She was insistent in that she wanted a folio with a keyboard...we got her an orange Logitech BT with a kind of white rubbery keyboard and I have to admit it is rather neat using for typing. I was very impressed with it. She does use it more like a laptop b/c of work, emails, forms etc. 

post #44 of 114
Touch ID has been a mixed bag for me. When it works, it's great, but I find that after a month or so the sensor refuses to recognize my thumb print and I have to rescan it. I suspect others might be having issues as well, which may be why the Touch ID setting was moved to a more easily accessible location in the latest iOS 7 update.

I like your idea of scanning the same print in multiple "fingers" though. I'll give that a try.
post #45 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

How is everyone doing with Touch ID? Mine is quite flaky, working about 20% of the time. 

Mine works 99.9% of the time. The only times it doesn't is if my fingers are a bit sweaty or I just got back indoor from the brutal winter in Chicago. Otherwise I love it. I just got an iPad air and it annoyes me when I have to enter my code. I just got used to Touch ID. How we managed without it, I don't know.

I had a Thinkpad (back when IBM sold them) that had finger print recognition and it hardly ever worked.
post #46 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacMan View Post


Mine works 99.9% of the time. The only times it doesn't is if my fingers are a bit sweaty or I just got back indoor from the brutal winter in Chicago. Otherwise I love it. I just got an iPad air and it annoyes me when I have to enter my code. I just got used to Touch ID. How we managed without it, I don't know.

I had a Thinkpad (back when IBM sold them) that had finger print recognition and it hardly ever worked.

I'm with you MacMan. Perhaps, I'm stating the obvious, but Apple will put FP ID on the iPads in 2014....maybe even MBA's and MBP's! Pretty cool stuff! :)

 

I like it when they take a new technology and quickly implement it across their entire line-up. The universal connector, Retina display, unibody construction, backlit keyboards, A7/M7 chip, camera improvements, wifi AC, etc., etc.

 

I'm on an orig. intel imac that can't be upgraded past SL and as much as I covet Mavericks, I harbor no resentment towards Apple. I would prefer they put their resources to the future making better and better OS's than making things backwards compatible.

 

I need to get on the stick and buy a new MBA or 27" iMac with Mavericks installed. :)

 

Best

post #47 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

I'm with you MacMan. Perhaps, I'm stating the obvious, but Apple will put FP ID on the iPads in 2014....maybe even MBA's and MBP's! Pretty cool stuff! 1smile.gif

I like it when they take a new technology and quickly implement it across their entire line-up. The universal connector, Retina display, unibody construction, backlit keyboards, A7/M7 chip, camera improvements, wifi AC, etc., etc.

I'm on an orig. intel imac that can't be upgraded past SL and as much as I covet Mavericks, I harbor no resentment towards Apple. I would prefer they put their resources to the future making better and better OS's than making things backwards compatible.

I need to get on the stick and buy a new MBA or 27" iMac with Mavericks installed. 1smile.gif

Best

You won't go wrong with an MBA. I have one and I love it. I had an iMac, but truth be told, I found my self wanting the portability, and my MBA is pretty darn fast with SSD drive. Either way, you won't go wrong, the iMac is pretty sexy and powerful.
post #48 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacMan View Post


You won't go wrong with an MBA. I have one and I love it. I had an iMac, but truth be told, I found my self wanting the portability, and my MBA is pretty darn fast with SSD drive. Either way, you won't go wrong, the iMac is pretty sexy and powerful.

Yep, Thx MacMan...I'm not quite ready to just go with an iPad and an iPhone just yet. I'm still have one foot stuck in the old school of having the biggest screen on an iMac/desktop AND a small MBA/Laptop. Problem is, I want both! :)

 

I found, when I got my iPad, (like a lot of people including Tim Cook), I was using the iPad and my iPhone 90% of the time. I tried to do everything I could on the iPad just because I found iOS much more fun and intuitive!

 

Oh well, decisions, decisions. I'll probably will, like you, get an MBA.

 

As you say they are truly marvelous machines! :)

 

Best

post #49 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


Have you re-scanned your fingers? imore.com had a piece up a while back with some tips on what you can do if touch ID isn't always working properly.

 

LOL only about 5 times now. I even added my thumb twice as one user said that helped. 

post #50 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacMan View Post


Mine works 99.9% of the time. The only times it doesn't is if my fingers are a bit sweaty or I just got back indoor from the brutal winter in Chicago. Otherwise I love it. I just got an iPad air and it annoyes me when I have to enter my code. I just got used to Touch ID. How we managed without it, I don't know.

I had a Thinkpad (back when IBM sold them) that had finger print recognition and it hardly ever worked.

 

I love it when it works. 

post #51 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

Mine works 99% of the time.

 

Delete all your prints and start again.

Personally I scanned my same finger in 4 of the slots.  Works amazingly well.

 

Anytime it doesn't work its for obvious reasons: hands wet or sticky or scanned very edge of finger.

 

The feature is so awesome.  I also have an iPadAir and I wish it had the fingerprint scanner everytime i need to swipe and enter my password.

 

Not questioning the feature, it's awesome when it works. 

 

I tried rescanning my fingers 5 times now and scanning my thumb in two slots. Has nothing to do with wet, sticky, hot, cold, position of finger, pressure used or position of the moon. I can scan in, lock the phone, then not be able to scan back in. 

post #52 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I wish them luck but there are several parts to this that I don't think are easily tackled. Are they going to create their own SoC or at least create their own secure chip to store the encrypted hashes? Will they use sapphire crystal? Are they acquiring any companies to make this happen? And where is Samsung in all of this? I would have thought they would be first out of the gate with SSecure or something.

PS: I wonder if TouchID requires the increased security features of AArch64.
I haven't had any issues. I wonder if people are scanning in their prints in the manner that is shown on the graphic. Meaning, vertical and straight down in an unnatural position. I did mine on an angle in the position I would most likely try to do a scan when holding it with one hand.

 

Tried several different ways. The process actually has you scan vertical several times and then reposition as you might use it. Nothing. I think a trip to the Apple store is, well, in store. 

post #53 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClemyNX View Post



I'm not blaming you, some people are having issues. Might be due to the shape of your prints or the way your skin changes during the day, or something else. I have no problem myself. I have scanned 4 fingers, and haven't changed the prints for more than a month. It works almost all the time, I'd say more than 90% and close to 95% of the time. And if it doesn't work on the first try, it always does on the second.

 

Gave me an idea. I'll have someone else print one of their fingers in the slot and then test it over the next week to determine if its me or the phone. Thanks! 

post #54 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post

Tried several different ways. The process actually has you scan vertical several times and then reposition as you might use it. Nothing. I think a trip to the Apple store is, well, in store. 

That would be my next suggestion. I would request they replace it under the premise that it's faulty

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #55 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


If my wife can do it anyone can. 1biggrin.gif. She has not had any problems whatsoever. My guess is your initial set up wasn't done quite right.

 

Yeah, it is NOT a user issue, but thanks! :grumble: lol

 

I tried scanning 5 times now. Scans in some time, then not others, but mostly not. 

post #56 of 114

Does Apple own a patent of placing fingerprint sensor with the home button?

post #57 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

very ignorant post

No not really.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

Don’t post about 64-bit again until you’ve educated yourself.

 

Already have thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post



This is, of course, ludicrous. A 64 bit architecture offers 64 bit address buses, data buses and registers which provide independently verifiable, significant performance improvements.

Yes and no, it is entirely dependent on what software is being run.

 

64 bit address buses only real benefit is that it can address more than 4 GB of system ram, if the system has less than 4 GB or software being run is using less than 2 GB in a single thread than there is really not any possibility that a 64 bit address bus will improve performance.

 

The real performance increase in 64 bit is for applications that handle large data arrays; so things like CAD/CAE-like programs, data managers, programs to work with digital media and applied scientific applications, so yes iphone 5s with it current specs would see quite an increase in performance when executing such software.  

 

I don't think the every day user/owner of an iphone 5s or ipad executes such 3rd party software or even 1st party software or even desires too, until they do the 64 bit advantage is the address bus and until Apple releases an iphone or ipad that has more than 4 GB it is all but really a gimmick.


Edited by Noliving - 12/27/13 at 6:49pm
post #58 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Getz View Post
 

How is everyone doing with Touch ID? Mine is quite flaky, working about 20% of the time. 

Retrain it. Mine is rock solid and works every time.


Edited by Mechanic - 12/27/13 at 8:17pm
post #59 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post
 

No not really.

 

 

Already have thank you.

Yes and no, it is entirely dependent on what software is being run.

 

64 bit address buses only real benefit is that it can address more than 4 GB of system ram, if the system has less than 4 GB or software being run is using less than 2 GB in a single thread than there is really not any possibility that a 64 bit address bus will improve performance.

 

The real performance increase in 64 bit is for applications that handle large data arrays; so things like CAD/CAE-like programs, data managers, programs to work with digital media and applied scientific applications, so yes iphone 5s with it current specs would see quite an increase in performance when executing such software.  

 

I don't think the every day user/owner of an iphone 5s or ipad executes such 3rd party software or even 1st party software or even desires too, until they do the 64 bit advantage is the address bus and until Apple releases an iphone or ipad that has more than 4 GB it is all but really a gimmick.

Oh another one of you 4 Gig people.  This theory has already been discussed ad nauseum, there are huge benefits of a 64 bit processor the least of which is addressing more that 4 Gig of memory.  Anand La Shimpi says so as do others more knowledgeable than you.  You should stop reading the android blogs because this is there favorite line.   Heck even Qualcomm retracted there Senior VP idiots statement as being false for claiming the same thing and demoted him.  There a chip maker they know more about it than you or I.  And for your info all 1st party apps on iOS are full 64 bit.


Edited by Mechanic - 12/27/13 at 8:18pm
post #60 of 114

They failed right there when they said "swipe sensor".  I had one on a motorola atrix and they sucked.  It was a phone for work..  Good luck with that LG.

post #61 of 114
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

Already have thank you.

 

If you had, you wouldn’t be repeating this worthless nonsense.

 
64 bit address buses only real benefit is that it can address more than 4 GB of system ram …until Apple releases an iPhone or ipad that has more than 4 GB it is all but really a gimmick.

 

Completely and utterly incorrect. Educate yourself. I’ll repeat it until you do.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

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post #62 of 114

You guys do realize that Motorola had a fingerprint scanner on their smartphone made by the same copmany that Apple bought right?

Only difference is that Apple implemented a better location (Atrix was on the back top of the phone...wtf?) and obviously already has a huge loyal consumer base.

post #63 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post
 

Oh another one of you 4 Gig people.  This theory has already been discussed ad nauseum, there are huge benefits of a 64 bit processor the least of which is addressing more that 4 Gig of memory.  Anand La Shimpi says so as do others more knowledgeable than you.  You should stop reading the android blogs because this is there favorite line.   Heck even Qualcomm retracted there Senior VP idiots statement as being false for claiming the same thing and demoted him.  There a chip maker they know more about it than you or I.  And for your info all 1st party apps on iOS are full 64 bit.

 

Sigh....

 

The real performance increase in 64 bit is for applications that handle large data arrays; so things like CAD/CAE-like programs, data managers, programs to work with digital media and applied scientific applications, so yes iphone 5s with it current specs would see quite an increase in performance when executing such software.  

 

So yes I agree with you there are other huge benefits of a 64 bit processor besides addressing 4 gigs of memory, but those benefits really only apply to large data array software.  Show me that the average user of an iphone 5s or an ipad primarily or at the very least plan on using such software for a good portion of their time when using those devices.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

If you had, you wouldn’t be repeating this worthless nonsense.

 

Completely and utterly incorrect. Educate yourself. I’ll repeat it until you do.

Huh?  Address bus is used solely for addressing memory and only memory. So the only benefit of a 64 bit address bus is when you have more than 4 GB of memory.   If you are not running software that uses more than 2 GB in a single thread or the entire system is not using more than 4 GB of memory there is no performance benefit to using a 64 bit address bus.  What else is the address bus used for Tallest Skil?

 

The only time a 64 bit cpu provides any meaningful performance increase when you don't have more than 4 GB or at the very least 2 GB to run a single thread is when you are executing or running large data array software that takes advantage of the additional registers.  Show me that the average user  or even significant portion of iphone or ipad users is using such software or plans to use it.


Edited by Noliving - 12/27/13 at 10:05pm
post #64 of 114
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

Address bus is used solely for addressing memory and only memory. So the only benefit of a 64 bit address bus is when you have more than 4 GB of memory.   If you are not running software that uses more than 2 GB in a single thread or the entire system is not using more than 4 GB of memory there is no performance benefit to using a 64 bit address bus. The only time a 64 bit cpu provides any meaningful performance increase when you dont have more than 4 GB

 

So why does the iPhone 5S show up to a 25% speed improvement on itself between otherwise identical 32-bit and 64-bit compiled apps?

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #65 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So why does the iPhone 5S show up to a 25% speed improvement on itself between otherwise identical 32-bit and 64-bit compiled apps?

Perhaps his IQ only goes up to 32? More likely to have a single-digit IQ though.
I’d rather have a better product than a better price.
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post #66 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post

Does Apple own a patent of placing fingerprint sensor with the home button?

This link may answer your question...

http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2013/09/apples-fingerprint-sensor-patent-claims-more-patent-graphics.html#more
post #67 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So why does the iPhone 5S show up to a 25% speed improvement on itself between otherwise identical 32-bit and 64-bit compiled apps?

Even though it's been mentioned he has completely ignored the new AArch64 ISA.

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post #68 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

So why does the iPhone 5S show up to a 25% speed improvement on itself between otherwise identical 32-bit and 64-bit compiled apps?

Key word is up to, what is the Mode?  Or most common speed improvement?  Large data array software such as encryption, encoding, decoding, video editing software will give you those types of speed improvements if not higher speed improvements. Also is it comparing or are you comparing it to the 32 bit version of A7 processor? Lets take for example the most commonly used software, the Internet browser.  

 

Internet Explorer 10 and 11 64 bit is only around 1-2% faster on benchmarks such as sunspider, kraken, v8 benchmarks compared to its 32 bit version.  That is hardly a meaningful improvement.

 

So which software or apps is giving you those 25% speed improvements?

 

Keep this in mind:  higher core clock speeds, faster LPDDR3 memory and quad-core PowerVR graphics chip — all independent improvements that the A7 makes, how much of those 25% speed improvements are attributed to that and not the 64 bit.
 

 

What is the most commonly used software that an iphone or ipad user uses?  I have a feeling that it is not large data array software.

 

If you look at ST88 post you will see that according to Futuremark Benchmark the 64 bit version on average is only 7% faster, not enough to move it around on the rankings for fastest mobile phone.

 

Here is what Futuremark said:

 

64-bit is not the answer

We started our investigation by compiling a 64-bit version of 3DMark, since the version available in the App Store is 32-bit in order to be compatible with older Apple devices. 

Once we had a 64-bit build we tested an iPhone 5s under controlled conditions in our Test Lab. As expected, we found that the results from the 64-bit version were similar to the 32-bit version, with only a 7 percent improvement. 

http://www.futuremark.com/pressreleases/understanding-3dmark-results-from-the-apple-iphone-5s-and-ipad-air

So as I have said before large data array software such as encoding, encryption will give you those types of large speed improvements but if you are talking about the day to day software that the average owner of an iphone or ipad user uses than chances are no it doe not make any real meaningful performance increase.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


Perhaps his IQ only goes up to 32? More likely to have a single-digit IQ though.

 

Brilliant response!  Did you know that Tallest Skil literally thought address bus did more than address memory.  

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Even though it's been mentioned he has completely ignored the new AArch64 ISA.

No I haven't. 


Edited by Noliving - 12/28/13 at 8:41am
post #69 of 114
You know, a 7% improvement is really about what I'd expect to see on average for a 64 bit transition when memory wasn't a constraint. In private speculation in the runup to the 5s device introduction, I didn't think 64 bit was even on the table, assuming there wouldn't be any benefit until more RAM was built into the package.
post #70 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

No I haven't. 

Where did you address the ISA?

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post #71 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Where did you address the ISA?

You can't be serious with that question.  Talking about the A7 processor is addressing the ISA.

post #72 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

You can't be serious with that question.  Talking about the A7 processor is addressing the ISA.

Yes, I'm serious. Where did you address AArch64? Where did you discredit the new ISA by saying it offers no benefits to the OS or SW?


PS: In your previous post you're compressing a bunch of different types of 64-bit items into one poorly contrived argument. You can't use IE 11 as being 1% faster as proof that the new ISA in AArch64 offers no benefit.

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post #73 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Yes, I'm serious. Where did you address AArch64? Where did you discredit the new ISA by saying it offers no benefits to the OS or SW?


PS: In your previous post you're compressing a bunch of different types of 64-bit items into one poorly contrived argument. You can't use IE 11 as being 1% faster as proof that the new ISA in AArch64 offers no benefit.

No you can't be serious.

post #74 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

No you can't be serious.

So you're still not going to answer why you think the new ISA is just marketing hype invented by Apple?

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #75 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


So you're still not going to answer why you think the new ISA is just marketing hype invented by Apple?

Already answered that question go back and read and the answer is not that simple.

post #76 of 114
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post
Brilliant response!  Did you know that Tallest Skil literally thought address bus did more than address memory.

 

No, I made no comment as to that. Try again without putting words in others’ mouths.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
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post #77 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

Already answered that question go back and read and the answer is not that simple.

No, no you didn't. You discredited everything that comes with AArch64 and made sweeping ignorant generalizations and even made foolish comments about RAM capacity and CPU bitness.


PS: I checked your posts. You didn't use ISA, AArch64, or the colloquial ARM64 once in your comments.
Edited by SolipsismX - 12/28/13 at 10:03am

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post #78 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noliving View Post

Did you know that Tallest Skil literally thought address bus did more than address memory.

Did you know you're incorrectly equating the number of bits with the address bus with number of bits used in other parts of the system.

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #79 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Even though it's been mentioned he has completely ignored the new AArch64 ISA.

yes he has.  He overlooks that AArch64 doubled the number of registers over 32bit ARM. 32-bit ARM provides 16 integer registers, of which one is a dedicated program counter, two more are give over to a stack pointer and link register, and the other 13 are available for general use.  With AArch 64 there are 32 integer registers, with a dedicated zero register, dedicated link register and dedicated frame pointer register. One further register is dedicated to the platform leaving 28 general purpose registers. 

AArch 64 also increases the number of floating point registers as well.  AArch 32 has 32 32 bit floating point registers. Which can overlap into various sized of floating points as needed.  AArch 64 simplifies this and has 32 128 bit floating point registers that can be used for smaller amounts of data, but are dedicated and do not overlap which is a big performance win. With AArch 64 Physical RAM address size is decouple from CPU fitness.Data Bus size the amount of data fetched from RAM is likewise decoupled.  A CPU instruction may request a certain size of data but the amount can be independentlycontrolled by either fetching in smaller amounts or fetching more than is necessary.Also a  revised and streamlined the instruction set for a big performance gain.  Also apple took advantage of AArch64 in a big way with an inline retain count, which eliminates the need to perform costly hash table lookup for retain and release operations in the common case.  Those operations  are very common in most Objective-C code and is a big performance win. Per-object resource cleanup flags make object deallocation a lot faster.  The cost of creating and destroying an object is now roughly cut in half by AArch64.  Tagged pointers also make for a nice performance win as well as reducing memory usage.

These are just some of the performance increases that have made huge differences in the A7.   But hey think what you want.   The proof is in the testing and the A7 is clearly the fastest mobile processor on the market.  


Edited by Mechanic - 12/28/13 at 11:03am
post #80 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post

Oh another one of you 4 Gig people.  This theory has already been discussed ad nauseum, there are huge benefits of a 64 bit processor the least of which is addressing more that 4 Gig of memory.  Anand La Shimpi says so as do others more knowledgeable than you.  You should stop reading the android blogs because this is there favorite line.   Heck even Qualcomm retracted there Senior VP idiots statement as being false for claiming the same thing and demoted him.  There a chip maker they know more about it than you or I.  And for your info all 1st party apps on iOS are full 64 bit.


To requote what has been quoted for months now since someone in this thread can't be bothered to do any research before posting...

"Apple isn’t very focused on delivering a larger memory address space today however. As A64 is a brand new ISA, there are other benefits that come along with the move. Similar to the x86-64 transition, the move to A64 comes with an increase in the number of general purpose registers. ARMv7 had 15 general purpose registers (and 1 register for the program counter), while ARMv8/A64 now has 31 that are each 64-bits wide. All 31 registers are accessible at all times. Increasing the number of architectural registers decreases register pressure and can directly impact performance. The doubling of the register space with x86-64 was responsible for up to a 10% increase in performance.

The original ARM architecture made all instructions conditional, which had a huge impact on the instruction space. The number of conditional instructions is far more limited in ARMv8/A64.

The move to ARMv8 also doubles the number of FP/NEON registers (from 16 to 32) as well as widens all of them registers to 128-bits (up from 64-bits). Support for 128-bit registers can go a long way in improving SIMD performance. Whereas simply doubling register count can provide moderate increases in performance, doubling the size of each register can be far more significant given the right workload. There are also new advanced SIMD instructions that are a part of ARMv8. Double precision SIMD FP math is now supported among other things.

ARMv8 also adds some new cryptographic instructions for hardware acceleration of AES and SHA1/SHA256 algorithms. These hardware AES/SHA instructions have the potential for huge increases in performance, just like we saw with the introduction of AES-NI on Intel CPUs a few years back. Both the new advanced SIMD instructions and AES/SHA instructions are really designed to enable a new wave of iOS apps."


and…

"It's also important to point out the things that "64-bit" does not refer to, as there's a lot of confusion in this area as well. In particular, "64-bit" does not include:

Physical RAM address size. The number of bits used to actually talk to RAM (and therefore the amount of RAM the hardware can support) is decoupled from the question of CPU bitness. ARM CPUs have ranged from 26 bits to 40 bits, and this can be changed independently from the rest.
Data bus size. The amount of data fetched from RAM or cache is likewise decoupled. Individual CPU instructions may request a certain amount of data, but the amount of data actually fetched can be independent, either by splitting the fetch into smaller parts, or fetching more than is necessary. The iPhone 5 already fetches data from memory in 64-bit chunks, and chunk sizes of up to 192 bits exist in the PC world.
Anything related to floating-point. FPU register size and internal design is independent, and ARM CPUs have had 64-bit FPU registers since well before ARM64.

[…]

Adding it all together, it's a pretty big win. My casual benchmarking indicates that basic object creation and destruction takes about 380ns on a 5S running in 32-bit mode, while it's only about 200ns when running in 64-bit mode. If any instance of the class has ever had a weak reference and an associated object set, the 32-bit time rises to about 480ns, while the 64-bit time remains around 200ns for any instances that were not themselves the target.

In short, the improvements to Apple's runtime make it so that object allocation in 64-bit mode costs only 40-50% of what it does in 32-bit mode. If your app creates and destroys a lot of objects, that's a big deal.

[…]

Apple took advantage of the transition to make some changes of their own. The biggest change is an inline retain count, which eliminates the need to perform a costly hash table lookup for retain and release operations in the common case. Since those operations are so common in most Objective-C code, this is a big win. Per-object resource cleanup flags make object deallocation quite a bit faster in certain cases. All in all, the cost of creating and destroying an object is roughly cut in half. Tagged pointers also make for a nice performance win as well as reduced memory use.

ARM64 is a welcome addition to Apple's hardware. We all knew it would happen eventually, but few expected it this soon. It's here now, and it's great."


Note that AnandTech shows an improvement in AES by 825% (must access link to see results) simply by running as 64-bit. How exactly not a benefit? As I've stated before I think it's worth considering that Touch ID wouldn't be possible without A64's improved crypto and phenomenal AES and SHA speed performance.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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